@ragsash kislevs problem is that it's three factions in a trench coat. It's steppe riders, the settled kislevites, and spooky forest magic all rolled into one non homogeneous blob
It's hard to overstate how valuable these guys are in the early to mid game; they're stupid fast so you can get them pretty much wherever you want them, they can shoot and they're not utterly helpless in melee (especially not against enemy artillery and/or archers. But the real value I find, is there ability to play "catch me if you can" with enemy forces; by getting them close (but not too close) to enemy infantry that are advancing, you can lure away a unit or two and thus give your kossar's a bit of an edge in the early stages of the clash; during my Chaos campaign I was consistently able to lure away demonic infantry and leave them trudging around trying to catch up. even works against enemy cavalry since they rarely have the ability to match their speed, let alone actually catch them and the relatively tiny few who can are frequently too poorly armored to survive for very long as they're peppered by arrows. Frankly they're like a bunch of Cyrillic Chameleon skinks.
@ the only ranged cav that differs, in my opinion, to that are outriders. I find the pistoleers specifically to better handle higher quality, low entity count units.
I rarely mention lord specific skills outside of a lord video because then it stops applying as a general thing for.. generals. It's not an oversight. Although, to be honest, I'm still new enough with Kislev I didn't actually know that. I just mean I usually want to shower love on lord buffs with lord videos. Thanks for mentioning it though! Just explaining my methodology.
first I tought they werent good but after some time they grew on me and now i always have 2-4 of these in my army early to mid campaign altough I think Kislev could use a slightly higher tier horse archer unit in their roster also. In kostaltyns army they get buffed so much that they can fight in melee with low to medium infantry for a time
I am trying to use more cavalry in my builds, they're not great in a straight fight, but if you can win the initial engagement then cavalry chasing down routing enemies is valuable.
Yeah, winning those first clashes is important yet pure shock cavalry will have a hard time since that's its weakest scenario. I'll try and offer more help for this when I cover units that seem designed to aid that problem.
Kislev! Preety good crapstack to troll enemy army. I wouldn't recomend spam them but like 4 or 5 units can give your army spice to break from kossar spam
This is a good multipurpose unit- decent at ranged combat and cycle charging/Ranged disruption/chasing units off the battlefield, while not excelling at any of them in particular. I think that CA should increase Horse Archers Calibration Distance to 110-120, to allow them to benefit more from their long range. They should also reduce HAs reload time by 10-15%- Horse Archers damage output is pretty low, making them far less effective ranged combatants than they should be. I feel that CA overloaded on some concepts and did not anticipate that adherence to these concepts would actually make units unusable. They did not want to make the ranged units overpowered, and as a result made reload times ridiculously long. As a result, ranged units are grossly underpowered and are not worth taking, other than in very specific situations.
Not nearly as powerful as i want, skirmish cav is my bread and butter in other total war games. But like most all in this game they still have uses. I like chasing around archers in skirmish stance with them, shoothing them as i keep them from shooting. They basically win against most archer units youre ever going to fight as kislev, but you also arent gonna fight many. Skaven and maybe wood elves but a lot of your fighting is going to be against Chaos and Norsca. Because of that i tend to only use a significant number of them against Norsca since the moment WoC or Nurgle armies start showing on your door, theyll have the armor to ignore your arrows. A specialist unit, but a good one for its race.
Even against them they can have value; they can effectively kite sections of their line all over the place which means your forces aren't dealing with at least a couple of higher tier units.
@guitarhausdoesntknowwhatac3285 true, but there are units that do that job just as well but also perform better against armored targets. Maybe not as skirmish cav, but just generally in terms of the cav role. It isn't useless by any stretch of the imagination, there's always at least some marauders in chaos armies for you to pepper, but it's not quite as decisive when it's just 2 or 3 units of squishy marauders and a horde of high armor chaos warriors and knights.
@@TheGreatDanish Those same units are also more expensive and typically slower; by comparison the Horse archers can outrange pretty much anything that can potentially catch them (IE warhounds, marauder cavalry) and also kite high value units (IE Large monsters, chaos knights, mammoths) pretty much forever and by doing so you are effectively nullifying their value and even if they get caught... they're a pretty cheap tier two cavalry that you can replace at the drop of a hat. Like even late game their simple ability to que up the benny hill chase sequence is great; I was able to do something like this duing a quest battle with Imrik and some elyrian reavers (which are basically the same unit); I was taking on one of the legendary dragons and a Dread saurian had spawned in as part of the event and had it made it to my infantry or proper cavalry it would have wreaked havoc, but with a unit of horse archers I was able to keep it doddering after them until army losses rendered it irrelevent.
I prefer Wood elf glade riders because more damage (expecially the hagbane version, more armor percing, i meant, it’s 3 more armor percing than base glade rider
Kislev being the horse skirmish faction and having only 1 tier cavalry skirmish unit is insane
I'm not sure if the tabletop has anything else out there for mounted skirmishers.
@ragsash kislevs problem is that it's three factions in a trench coat. It's steppe riders, the settled kislevites, and spooky forest magic all rolled into one non homogeneous blob
The horse skirmirsh faction doesnt exist in tww3. The mongols = chaos wastes hobgoblins in warhammer
Kislev Horse Archers are my favorite Kislev unit, because they embody the idea of Kislev, along with the Winged Hussars Expy.
I do like their cultural heft.
It's hard to overstate how valuable these guys are in the early to mid game; they're stupid fast so you can get them pretty much wherever you want them, they can shoot and they're not utterly helpless in melee (especially not against enemy artillery and/or archers.
But the real value I find, is there ability to play "catch me if you can" with enemy forces; by getting them close (but not too close) to enemy infantry that are advancing, you can lure away a unit or two and thus give your kossar's a bit of an edge in the early stages of the clash; during my Chaos campaign I was consistently able to lure away demonic infantry and leave them trudging around trying to catch up. even works against enemy cavalry since they rarely have the ability to match their speed, let alone actually catch them and the relatively tiny few who can are frequently too poorly armored to survive for very long as they're peppered by arrows.
Frankly they're like a bunch of Cyrillic Chameleon skinks.
There are worse things to be than swifter Chameleon Skinks...
They are kinda goblin wolf rider archers. Not sure if there are big differences but basically a very similar unit
They are similar. I should mention that when I get to that part of the Greenskins roster. Savage Orcs and Arrer Boyz should be next...
@@OffToBattledo they share a similar role as hobgoblin wolf archer?
@@excursor4296 all ranged cav shares the same role in tww3. Ranged harassment against light infantry and direct charging against pure archer infantry.
@ the only ranged cav that differs, in my opinion, to that are outriders. I find the pistoleers specifically to better handle higher quality, low entity count units.
@excursor4296 if they aren't armored yes! Crypt horrors come to mind
You didn't mentioned Druzhina's general special skill, that grants them +8 bonus vs infantry in range attacks.
I rarely mention lord specific skills outside of a lord video because then it stops applying as a general thing for.. generals. It's not an oversight. Although, to be honest, I'm still new enough with Kislev I didn't actually know that. I just mean I usually want to shower love on lord buffs with lord videos. Thanks for mentioning it though! Just explaining my methodology.
@OffToBattle "Druzhina ready. "
first I tought they werent good but after some time they grew on me and now i always have 2-4 of these in my army early to mid campaign altough I think Kislev could use a slightly higher tier horse archer unit in their roster also. In kostaltyns army they get buffed so much that they can fight in melee with low to medium infantry for a time
Both are good points. Kislev would benefit from a stronger version.
I am trying to use more cavalry in my builds, they're not great in a straight fight, but if you can win the initial engagement then cavalry chasing down routing enemies is valuable.
Yeah, winning those first clashes is important yet pure shock cavalry will have a hard time since that's its weakest scenario. I'll try and offer more help for this when I cover units that seem designed to aid that problem.
Kislev!
Preety good crapstack to troll enemy army. I wouldn't recomend spam them but like 4 or 5 units can give your army spice to break from kossar spam
Well spamming skirmishers can get you in a lot of trouble in this game version generally.
This is a good multipurpose unit- decent at ranged combat and cycle charging/Ranged disruption/chasing units off the battlefield, while not excelling at any of them in particular. I think that CA should increase Horse Archers Calibration Distance to 110-120, to allow them to benefit more from their long range. They should also reduce HAs reload time by 10-15%- Horse Archers damage output is pretty low, making them far less effective ranged combatants than they should be. I feel that CA overloaded on some concepts and did not anticipate that adherence to these concepts would actually make units unusable. They did not want to make the ranged units overpowered, and as a result made reload times ridiculously long. As a result, ranged units are grossly underpowered and are not worth taking, other than in very specific situations.
Yeah, luring enemies is what Horse Archers do far better than actually killing them for the most part and that is a shame.
Not nearly as powerful as i want, skirmish cav is my bread and butter in other total war games. But like most all in this game they still have uses. I like chasing around archers in skirmish stance with them, shoothing them as i keep them from shooting. They basically win against most archer units youre ever going to fight as kislev, but you also arent gonna fight many. Skaven and maybe wood elves but a lot of your fighting is going to be against Chaos and Norsca.
Because of that i tend to only use a significant number of them against Norsca since the moment WoC or Nurgle armies start showing on your door, theyll have the armor to ignore your arrows.
A specialist unit, but a good one for its race.
Even against them they can have value; they can effectively kite sections of their line all over the place which means your forces aren't dealing with at least a couple of higher tier units.
I feel your take is fair, a good unit at its job but it's niche.
That's the hope certainly!
@guitarhausdoesntknowwhatac3285 true, but there are units that do that job just as well but also perform better against armored targets. Maybe not as skirmish cav, but just generally in terms of the cav role.
It isn't useless by any stretch of the imagination, there's always at least some marauders in chaos armies for you to pepper, but it's not quite as decisive when it's just 2 or 3 units of squishy marauders and a horde of high armor chaos warriors and knights.
@@TheGreatDanish Those same units are also more expensive and typically slower; by comparison the Horse archers can outrange pretty much anything that can potentially catch them (IE warhounds, marauder cavalry) and also kite high value units (IE Large monsters, chaos knights, mammoths) pretty much forever and by doing so you are effectively nullifying their value and even if they get caught... they're a pretty cheap tier two cavalry that you can replace at the drop of a hat.
Like even late game their simple ability to que up the benny hill chase sequence is great; I was able to do something like this duing a quest battle with Imrik and some elyrian reavers (which are basically the same unit); I was taking on one of the legendary dragons and a Dread saurian had spawned in as part of the event and had it made it to my infantry or proper cavalry it would have wreaked havoc, but with a unit of horse archers I was able to keep it doddering after them until army losses rendered it irrelevent.
Horse missile units have always been good.
They haven't always been good in the exact same ways, but I even abuse Skeleton Horse Archers. Of course I can abuse ones this lively and speedy.
I prefer Wood elf glade riders because more damage (expecially the hagbane version, more armor percing, i meant, it’s 3 more armor percing than base glade rider
No surprise Wood Elves are the world class in skirmishers, really.