Well keep in mind that bulwark are the absolute best in anything that is not flying enemies, I just get off a Lethal Vox with a bulwark, sniper and me as heavy, that mf carry the shit of the two of us hahaha super tank, a "healer" and so a shit ton of DMG he did the half of my dmg only on meele and i run melta....
@@Miguel211216😂 you can instant kill Lictors as a bulwark why is it an issue with less ammo? Also use the perks right I maxed out at 144 shots with the plasma pistol.
Imagine the lvl 1 guy playing his first ever operation as bulwark on minimal difficulty and he gets 6 zoanthropes, 3 raveners, 2 lictors, and a neurothrope.
@@scorpiowarrior7841 whats funny is i woild love that if they did pne simple thing. GIVE XP BASED ON ENEMIES KILLED. Part of why the higher difficulties are so hard is teammates who suck are forced to play the higher difficulties to level up in a reasonable amount of time. And the armory data kf course.
@@damanOts Yeah the XP for performing well is genuinely awful and needs to be buffed. Like seriously holy shit. I'd even say the gene seed bonus needs a buff
It's not just substantial and ruthless. My brother and I were lvling up new classes. On average difficulty the game sent 4 zoenthrops, 2 raveners, 2 lictors and a carnifex. We went down to minimal and we still saw everything minus the carnifex
I got exactly the same mob distribution, but I was on substantial. I was playing with bots in the new op, it was rough! Not fun at all! Also, Zoanthrope pairs are attacking soooo fast!
@@rah2823 No word of a lie, last night me and one other guy faced off against 2 Zoenthropes, a dozen warriors and I don't even know how many of the little guys. Our npc was utterly useless and suffice to say we failed. I was on my lvl 6 assault and the other guy was on a sniper.
Had this happen to me last night. I joined my friend on the new operation last night and then he proceeded to crash out and then it wouldn't let him come back in so his game became my game somehow. And then after I joined, I fought 4 sets of double zoanthropes, 3 lictors, 2 raveners, and a carnifex. And this was on average. The only reason I won was because I was playing my Vanguard with bonus parry timing and a relic fencing chainsword. I also had about 8 waves happen that I had to fight.
I'm a dad and have a time consuming job but in my free time after my family goes to bed i like to get my game on. Even minimum difficulty has become too sweaty!!! I'm just trying to chill out and have some Bourbon and kill some bugs. I had to quit a game the other day because it was just too much of a pain in the butt. I don't want to get stressed out before I go to bed.
It’s funny how the devs don’t care about mods that break balance while also saying they can’t buff the player too much as to break the balance… they are catering to the sweats way to much, if the try hards want a super hard difficulty that is cheesy and unfair to play then the devs can make a mess out of lethal but they should then in turn make a fun and rewarding PVE experience for the rest of us.
Amen to Bourbon and bug slaying! I'd argue it's not even sweaty. It's just boring. The enemies are such sponges, and with ammo now being really rationed further, you're not actually slaying bugs. You're just dumping ammo and going melee, or not shooting and just straight to melee. And melee on Term level enemies just has a ton of down time, since they don't actually do a ton of parry attacks.
I am glad to see this video and data. I played Substantial yesterday ( first time since the patch ) with “purple” weapons and was shocked at how difficult the missions were ). No wonder my two random teammates were level 25. Thankfully they were, as I was getting my level 15 ass kicked 😂. There were Zoans everywhere. On the mission Inferno we even had Zoans spawn AFTER we had completed the mission, whilst waiting for the Thunderhawk to arrive. Brutal for casual players like myself.
Finally, someone who's good at the game but doesn't have their head stuck up their ass. Ruthless was the peak of my ability, now I can only do it with a good team mate. The jump from Average to Substantial is complete BS for middle ground players.
Yeah that’s me. I don’t play much so I have a L2 tactical and a L14 heavy lol. My first substantial game was yesterday and I kept getting my ceramite enclosed ass kicked!
If it ain't a boss. Run to Assemble. Players feel like they have to kill everything when getting swarmed by 4 different mobs. "GET TO THE CHOPPER" RUN Straight for OBJ
unfortunately i could only get too all purple minus the helmet you unlock for the black templars and shoulder pad you get for linking the game to the pro account before it dropped (I do mainly play by myself by choice) i could run substantial by myself before patch i believe they are listening and will fix it all we can do is hope
Having just recently unlocked a swath of relic weapons, I think a lot of the, 'git good, lol' crowd is forgetting how much of a wet noodle some of the purple or especially green gear can feel like. Power sword is a prime example. I feel like my damage is practically doubled between purple and gold. And the speed difference is unreal re:survivability.
@@davesscrims5079 I’ve noticed that with other weapons. I’m not sure exactly what’s up. I think some of it has to do with enemy health levels, too. For instance if an enemy has 100 health and your old gun does 90 but the new gun does 100, it’s not a huge difference in stats but you’re now one-shotting them instead of two shots which feels immensely more powerful.
Yep, I notice the "git good" crowd always come from the perspective of playing powerful classes with certain overpowered weapons that trivialised the game calling it too "easy". Then the game devs react to it by nerfing the major mechanics of the game to fit around these weapons (which is the wrong thing to do). lol
I’m a high level player that plays ruthless exclusively, I played with my friend who has barely touched the game the other day, he’s level 3 and so I said we’ll just do average and I’ll carry you and man…it legit felt like I was playing ruthless, I even went down at one point and he was going down time and time again We had extremis enemies spawning in left right and centre, multiple terminus enemies spawning in and just massive wave after massive wave, it was the least fun I’ve ever had in the game and I even apologised to him and said it wasn’t like this before Edit: the game also just seems to have way more majoris enemies now and much less minoris
It’s actually been really fun playing Average with a maxed out character with non-stop Extremis and squishy enemies. Was surprisingly hard, but not in an annoying way. I can’t imagine it on harder difficulties though.
@@wannaBaGM Right, but needing to do that basically renders all other builds unusable. I just don't get the thought process behind "Lets give them cool weapons, and then take away their ammo so that can't use them. That sounds like fun!" Another one that's just plain dumb is a 300 second down timer on Lethal. "Hey, here's a cool and fun game. But we really don't want you to be able to play it, instead, just sit there and watch others."
Prior to this patch I'd never had a feeling of "this doesnt feel fair" in SM2, even back when every minoris attack took away an entire bar of armor. My second match after the patch, on Reliquary, in the middle of the final boss fight the AI director started spamming lesser sorcerers, and they seemed to gravitate to the upper balcony areas, (opposite direction of the heldrake), which was an absolute shitshow to deal with. Splitting attention between the heldrake itself, the lesser sorcerer(s), the regular wave spawns, and then the smaller spawns the sorcerers can call in was just untenable. It seemed like any time I started to focus down the sorcerers a terminator would spawn in, or that whenever I'd be trying to hit the necessary rune sequence to get the heldrake to drop its wings, a sorcerer would be blasting me from an area that can't be reached by players, making a quick dispatch or at least an interrupt all but impossible on them. Why are we spawning extremis level threats in the middle of a boss fight, let alone multiple of them? Isn't the point of a boss fight to fight, well, the boss? This was all only on substantial, mind you. I was trying to level my vanguard and ended up just quitting for the night.
Yeah the spawns got totally fckd up with the last patch. This needs to be fixed asap, if i want overwhelming challenge i go play Lethal. If i want to level up i play according to my gear and character level, but this is impossible now, or rather very tedious. I want to enjoy playing the game and have fun, not sweat my ass thoroughly playing "easier" difficulties. To note, i regard myself being pretty good at video games (finished most of Fromsoft games alone with no player summons or Op builds) and SM2 is torture atm. Plus all the disconnection issues eating up my limited free time. Saber is on really thin ice now and they have next to 0 chances to redeem themselves.
yeah well that fight is already not fighting the boss, so they failed on it to begin with, but i agree using a "swarm" engine to swarm you with elite+ is the opposite of intent in my opinion
@@brian-8814 it’s actually perfect for me. It feels like a challenge but not impossible, and it’s still fun without sweating too much. Now my only issue is that XP and coins are coming REALLY slowly.
I thought I was just having really bad luck since I didn’t see anything about a change to Extremis spawns on lower difficulties in the patch notes, but when running Average on solo I’ve been seeing back-to-back-to-back Extremis spawns, and at one point had two Zoanthropes, a wave, and a Carnifex spawn at the same time. It was honestly a lot of fun, but if I were a new player I’d probably have gotten smoked and been super frustrated.
@@NeuroticLobster Yeah, "average" now is quite fun, it's frantic but you feel like a beast because you can smash your way through. Problem is "average" only unlocks up to mastercrafted weapons, players NEED to be able to win substantial and ruthless in random pubs because that's what they need to unlock weapons!
Me and my friend had to go back to Darktide for a while after that ludicrous majoris spawn that they throw at us on Substansial difficulty. Like 10+ majoris in the field and one of them is gonna call for reinforcements behind cover and you can't even reach them because your squad is getting roadblocked by a pile of venom barb that were scattered by the other Tyranid Warriors.
My screen is just drowning in Tyranid Warriors at any given time. There's so many. Barbed strangler tangles as far as the eye can see, and ten billion rabid alien monkeys screaming at me. All the while zoanthropes just can't seem to stop spawning. I did an Inferno where FOUR separate goddamn spawns came up during the final fight... including one that hung back in the background over the massive horde and just kept hurling shit at us.
I was fighting a sea of warriors. 2 zoanthropes appeared, then a boss health bar for a neurothrope. Needless to say we failed that mission due to literally impossible to dodge amounts of stuff being shot at us.
Fucking morons will say skill issue. It's just complete bullshit. Even before the update, Zoanthrope and Neurothropes were my most hated enemy because they're an ammo/DPS check and if you don't have the best guns you're gonna die.
You're right. I just came from fighting 5 Zoans in minimal. It wasn't a problem for me because I was a level 25 sniper, but if I wasn't there, my two level 1 teammates would have died. It was ridiculous.
@@savagegtalks5912yeah that frickin laser beam needs to be nerfed big time. It’s nearly impossible to dodge if you manage to get stuck right beneath them
11:54 If you open the main "pause" menu while in that state you will see a string in the bottom left corner that says in the end "in match" This means that the game thinks you are in an active session and it's not actually searching for players regardless of what it says outside of the menu. To clear that status and begin actually searching you only have to change to eternal war or campaign and it will change back to "ready to search"
Another solution I found is to queue up a private match, cancel it, and queue up a regular match. It takes a lot less time than quitting to the main menu.
There's a faster way of checking if you are stuck on the searching, on the bottom right corner it should say either "waiting for Battle Brothers" or "searching for Battle Brothers", if it says "Waiting for Battle Brothers" then it's what you said before, just changed game moded
I had a funny experience with Spore Mines before the 4.0 patch. I was playing the Hive Tyrant level solo on ruthless to farm armory points, and every enemy reinforcement or random horde spawn was all spore mines. No terminus, no extremis, no large groups of majoris. It was actually fun running in terror from them and checking corners like it was a cover shooter. As far as difficulty, I went from soloing ruthless to being unable to solo substanial
Sometimes it's even spicy on average. I'm just chilling, trying to level up a weapon and I'm like, 'wtf? Am I on the right difficulty?' The broken AI director just makes you feel like you're not progressing or accomplishing much, it just makes things even more difficult so you're hanging by a thread every match. It makes the game not the power fantasy I wanted it to be. The Lethal difficulty also just magnifies the problems already present. Previously tolerable bugs become extremely frustrating.
I was playing with some competitive friends where we compete on damage and enemies killed. I hit 28k in ranged damage alone. They hit about 15k each. We have never had such a high amount of damage pre patch.
@@dreamingabyss yeah, the number of enemies has increased significantly even on lower difficulties but the amount of ammo laying around to find is still the same. I’m leveling up a Heavy and I constantly run out of ammo.
They should reduced all foes health pool instead by a huge margin . And perhaps add even more of them. A single bolt should reduce a gaunt to mince meat. Maybe 3/4 bolts to a tyranid warrior chest should blast it and cut it in half . Boltguns , while having limited mag size, and ammo pool , because those are realy big ,are realy realy powerfull in counterpart. Large rounds, realy high power. Kinda mix between 30mm auto grenade launcher round using rpg propulsion system. Should os humanoid size targets, blowing them in pieces. Should blow large holes cavity in bigger targets . In game , you need 3/4 of your bolt riffle mag to the head of a nid warrior to make it open to finisher. And then you'll need to deal with it's 8/12 cousins waiting to rip you apart ! More ammo is not the solution. Make Each count ! Make them more lore accurate !
it's annoying because when I'm leveling tacti I notice I've used 20 rounds and get really really concious of it and start to just use the chainsword to try and keep myself in the fight. heavy is awful with an ammo shortage.
I used to feel the same but I've adapted to conserve ammo and melee more. What I feel they should definitely change, is either the enemy health or buff the player weapons. Enemies take a bit too much damage. I like the highest difficulties, I always play on them in games and in SM2 as well but in this it just needs some tweaking.
Glad to see someone talking about the lower level difficulty spike, I’ve played average matches that end up being harder than pre patch ruthless. It’s way out of control
Im glad this is being talked about. I finally talked my coworker into getting SM2 the day before the patch. I feel so bad now because he is just constantly dead. It was a difficult game to get started before the patch because your weapons aren't great now it is 10 times worse. Im max level with max weapons and even the easiest difficulty can be a slog if he is dead and a bot is just standing there brainlessly lol i really hope they fix this
I tried to run the new mission on AVERAGE last night, on level 22 tactical. game didn’t matchmake anyone for me to play with, which normally would be fine but the ai director spawned 6 zoanthropes, plus a carnifex, and then during the boss fight my game crashed. as far as I’m concerned this patch made the game unplayable for many, this is a major issue. I won’t be touching the game until these issues are fixed and I’ve heard the same from many.
For me when I play solo I get a massive wave every section, so on inferno for example just before or after every door/ elevator/ rock barricade a wave is spawned. While I can get through it with max level class it is annoying and wouldn’t be possible for me to beat on a lower level class or weapon
Just did a substantial inferno, with masterwork heavy bolter rifle, relic bolter pistol, and relic chainsword as tactical. Twin zoans spawned in the FIRST area followed by a carnifex at the first tank wreckage immediately after. Then the area right after woth the bridge walkway ANOTHER pair of zoans spawned on me. To be clear, the twins spawned in EVERY section of the map that they technically can spawn for me. Nevermind the other extremis. At this point extremis are just more fodder for me. I can at least work them in to the swarms. But the most egregious things i noticed that whole match, that i failed after detonating the promethean at the end bc of the twin zoan that spawned there immediately, is that EVERY TIME THEY SPAWNED i saw NOT a SINGLE shot for at them from my heavy or sniper AI battle brothers. I'm the generator room i actually cleared ALL other nids so that only the zoans remained and watched the AI REFUSE to engage them AT ALL. As context, they'll at least fire at LITERALLY EVERY OTHER ENEMY TYPE.
I've watched the AI during extremis/terminus encounters and they literally do nothing. Watched the heavy unload his heavy bolter into the neuro's back and the HP wasn't decreasing at all. The AI larps doing damage so if you are solo with AI, you are soloing the mini bosses. You also can't just run from the spawns either as the game will respawn them in the next loaded section of the game. Worst part is, none of these kills do anything for exp or rewards, only finishing the mission counts towards anything.
as soon as people leave comfort zone of coherent team and try to play with randos they quickly realize that game is broken beyond any sense. today i tried lethal several times and only one was successful. Game hard not in a fun way. AI director just endlessly throwing at you all sorts of bullet sponge shit without even giving a break to refill your ammo. and you quickly out of ammo because you shooting pee shooters. Fucking zoanthropes are annoying flying tanks with machine gun firerate cast. are they this tanky in table top? like wtf they made out of eldar dna. Not to mention non existent armor made out of tin foil. Devs better revert this L patch back before people start droping from the game
before the PREVIOUS patch, 3.0, my game ran so smoothly. but since the latest patches my PC begins to stutter and get bogged down in certain parts of levels. also agreed. I was getting absolutely overwhelmed on substantial and ruthless difficulties. I thought it was just me. After the latest patch, I'm hard pressed to even get through an operations mission successfully even with friends with level 25 characters Finally, I've been praying for them to fix their matchmaking issues since day one. I don't know what it is, whether it's their servers, optimization, or what, but getting into a match takes way too long and loading into a match takes way too long, and even when you're in a match you might just drop out or bug out. When I start the game, it takes 15-20 minutes just to get into a match.
I also have pc issues, getting 50 fps often on 1080p with a 4080, yet my cpu or gpu utilization is not even 50%. The game is now just not using my hardware 😅
The other issue you didn't mention is that each one of those Extremis spawns now comes with 3-4 Majoris as well and possibly minoris too, with no "Wave Imminent" warning. I some cases they don't even come from a spawn point, they just appear out of thin air. This is just as much of a problem as the massive Extremis spawns because now in addition to 10 or so Extremis it's bombarding you with per match you have an extra 30-40 Majoris.
This exactly captures my experience and frustrations with Patch 4.0. Insane swarms and duplicate Extremis bosses on just Substantial difficulty. Hours lost to just being inundated with mobs only to die defeated with a Level 25 Bulwark soloing. Also 2 runs disconnected in the final phase which hadn't happened in the previous month of play.
I posted about this on Steam bur nobody noticed. It's not just Extremis spawns. The sheer amount of mobs on substantial is just ridiculous. A wave of enemies can spawn on top of an objective event, those enemies can all up reinfocements and I think those reinfocements can call up another reinforcements. On top of that Extremis spawns bring with them a small wave of enemies now that can start spawning more enemies and so on. As for Lethal I've noticed that vast majority of players simply don't know how to play it. They play it as any other difficult so they play not to win but for the score. They still egzecutions without looking around if someone could benefit from them. They grab stims or ammo when they see them shering only when they are full. They don't pay attencion to sound notifications ignoring Extremis spawns or starting objectives when enemy wave spawns.
Another note about the zoanthropes (specifically the twins). I dunno about everyone else, but my buddies and I feel as though their health pool has received a shadow buff, because they are MUCH harder to kill now. I've got 4 classes at 25 and the other 2 in the double digits. We were "speed running" ruthless inferno in under 25 minutes consistently, yet now we're stuck running substantials to level weapons and just holding our breath each round that we aren't going to get a zoanthrope/neurothrope combo run ender. It feels bad.
Something is going on but health buff isn't one for me. Still do the same thing as heavy "turn on shield and gun them down" A good trick for the Neuro is if everyone has charge melee attacks, charge them to full under the shield, breaks past the health gate they put on melee
I think the shield animations might be bugged. Sometimes I feel like I 3 shot them with a plasma pistol, other times I dump like 8 to 10 charge shots and nothing. I can only guess that the later case I'm shooting a shield that the game isn't showing me.
I thought I was crazy when I was trying to solo as a Bulwark and it seemed like I have to hit each one with 12 charged plasma pistol shots each. I never had this issue before but it's been a nightmare to deal with all of a sudden since 99% of the time now because I'm just running around scrounging for ammo boxes trying to deal with 2 flying enemies that now seem to have double the hp than lictors or raveners.
My problem with Zoanthropes is them staggering in pairs or spamming their orb attack. Miss a dodge by one and you will get hit by the rest. Not to mention their line/scream still penetrates most obstacles.
I know its anecdotal but I just started to level up my Bulwark today so starting from level 1. Though my weapons were relic tier due to being used on other classes so I had an advantage and decided to play some Average threat (difficulty 2/5 for those who don't know the naming). While yes the waves/hoards were bigger most of the match than pre patch 4.0 it wasn't too bad until the final stretch... It was on Inferno and the last segment after coming up the elevator to make it to the final set piece you go down the ramps to the gun pod and then out to the final section. There was no fewer than 12 warriors, enough gaunts that I literally couldn't move on those narrow platforms, a pair of zoanthroaps, and a carnifex.... That would have been excessive for ruthless difficulty. I feel really bad for players who are supposed to learn on this difficulty as I'm having to sweat on it sometimes when RNJesus decides to use his pimp hand like that.
I had that too…tho replace the Carnifex with the Neurothrope. Then got 5 more Extremis at the end including 2 Zoanthropes and a Ravenor at the same time. I had 15 total Extremis that run. Heck, I’m getting 11+ on minimal. Last minimal run had 14.
The review bombs say it all. Ultimately, a game needs to cater to the casual gamers, not the elites. The vast majority of gamers are casual and not meta chasing competitive gamers. If the game caters to the minority over the majority, it'll stagnate and ultimately fail. The addition of lethal was a great move to add a level for the elites without hiding weapons behind the new difficulty. But making ruthless more inaccessible to the average gamer, restricting access to relic weapons for the majority of gamers, is a silly idea and the player base will revolt.
It's not even about casuals, it's about ruining the previously game design. You can amp up difficulty by 10x and have it still be fun (continuous massive waves to the face on lethal with no other difficulty changes), or you can do what the devs did and it is not fun at all.
Welcome to the 40k fandom. For the last two or three decades the game has catered to min/max power elite gamers and the casual gamer has always suffered. They're just making the video game reflect the original game they licensed from
There is a place for both the casual gamers and elite gamers. The "elite gamers" find many...not all...but many of the bugs and issues because they put so much time in the game and try out all weapons, builds, game modes, etc...but the majority of gamers are "casual gamers" so the game needs to be fun and accessible for them as well. The elite gamers have good idea but also come up with bad ideas and nonsense like "nerfing" the melta gun...makes no sense...if you don't like it then don't use it. If the game is too easy for you then run ruthless by yourself...or lethal...and challenge yourself by only using the bolt pistol...or challenge yourself by not taking advantage of the executions...if it's still too easy for you shut up, find another game to play, and let everyone else enjoy the game.
As a casual I like playing "Minimal" difficulty, but this patch has even ruined IT. I wanted to play the new op, but it was a pain and didn't feel right. I thought maybe it was me, so I brought out old faithful "Inferno". The spawns are ruined on it too. My poor newbie random teammates were getting swamped by 5-10 Majoris. At one point, I was standing at the edge of a ledge and the enemies were jumping up from a lower level, and 5-10 more majoris jumped up in the span of 5 seconds. It was an awesome sight, but boring. If the battle has no ebb and flow, it gets sickeningly repetitive. I WANT A HORDE SHOOTER. I want to see the horde engine at work.
Ran into a Neorothrope, no adds around... But we didn't have enough ammo to bring it down. Just everyone out of bullets. I was on Tac we had a shield bro and a heavy.
Yeah, we ran into one in Inferno in the room where the data slate is, before the elevator. The game wouldn't let us leave with the elevator. We got a massive wave and then the Neurotrope. Had a few pistol shots left. Needed to pay time, because both my team members went down (one after mortal wound). Crazy stuff.
I think coherency ruins the fundamental playstyle of half of the classes.There's no way to balance it. It just ruins the way you play Vanguard or sniper.
They looked at Darktide and thought their coherency system was actually good when it just punishes you for not being so close you can huff each others farts.
If you have issues connecting to a game you dont need to reboot the game or go to the title screen. It is faster to swap to the PVP mode and back to operations and it fixes it to me
The bug that occurs after somebody leaves the party where you can’t queue up with others can be fixed by switching from Operations mode to PvP and back. It resets whatever gobbledygook happened within the server/partt status.
Yes, thank you. There is so much angst on this patch. While I do think the proximity issue in Lethal is silly (feels like a random affix on mythic dungeons in WoW and completely arbitrary), the primary issue is the AI Director. All difficulty levels have been impacted dramatically. It’s not just more terminus and extremis, the number of Majoris have increased 2-3X. Dealing with multiple zoanthropes while dueling 10-12 majoris is rough for when you’re only on Average or Substantial. I have a few friends that play this for fun and they’ve lost all interest in this game as they’re getting trash canned even in lower difficulties.
If the Steam Achievements for SM2 are to be believed. Only 7% of the players did 100 gun strikes as a Vanguard. 2.2% of players killed 41k enemies. and the most mindboggling of them all, only 1.3% of the players got 25 kills on the Tactical with every Primary weapon.... 8% of players have leveled 1 single melee weapon to max.
Steam chevvo arguments are the most disingenuous garbage in the world. Only 35% of players have completed the 6th co-op mission AT ALL. Sounds like half the people that have really started playing co-op have already beaten ruthless.
I fear the devs are giving a little too much credit to the feedback from players without day jobs, who had early access and endless hours to devote to grinding. this is NOT THE AVERAGE gamer. those percentage stats say it all.
The rate in which units call for reinforcements these days are absolutely ridiculous. Stg in firefights, an elite tries to call for reinforcements once every 10 seconds. And they’re always the ones at the back rank that you can’t get to in time.
Yeah, every difficulty has been insanely up’d and barely anyone is in servers compared to prepatch… but it does feel like the more that you learn about lethal the easier it gets. I lost my first 6 rounds on lethal and everything even on “average”, then beat mission 1 and 3 on lethal, and started trouncing the non-lethal difficulties again once I figured out the new dynamic
After this patch, the other day I was playing the Hierophant mission with randos on substancial difficulty, in the final boss battle the pair of zoantropes spawned, one lictor and one ravener also spawned, ofcourse we failed the mission with one shot left to kill the Hierophant because we had our atention divided between the zoantropes, the boss atacks and the ravener that killed us one by one.
I played a ruthless mission last night w/ my lvl 18 Vanguard. I use to get through Ruthless no issue. It was noticeably harder. The frustrating part about it was my two bot allies did literally ZERO damage to the Neurothrope that spawned, is this a bug? What a pain in the !#@ it was trying to fight that thing w/ a Melta and two bots that do ZERO damage.
I noticed this too. I normally play assault and vanguard, so when I get neurothropes I have to rely on the bots more, and it's Health does not seem to move unless I'm the one shooting it
I’m pretty sure bots can’t damage bosses. Not only have I watched my bots shoot at a Neurothrope and not do damage (at least nothing I could visibly see on the health bar), but I’ve also seen a couple videos about soloing bosses that touch on this as well. It makes it really hard as an Assault trying to take out a Neurothrope with just a pea shooter.
Exactly what I've been saying. Even the lowest difficulty got wild compared to how it was. Sometimes waves are so big that the game can glitch out for a moment (or crash). Substantial can get crazy very quickly.
The gameplay primarily doesnt support what the balance currently is which is the main issue, armor regen takes to long by itself being 25 seconds and hp doesnt regen and contested health mechanic has issues, honestly removing the cap on restoring health from contested wouldn't even be bad at this point.
Space Marine Armor getting nerfed is the biggest concern for me you're suppose to play a walking tank not a glorified gardsmen ! Seriously 10% reduction for substential and 20% for ruthless ?!! Come on ! I can work with more ennemis but if my armor is paper macher and the mob is bullet sponge it's not gonna work !
Really appreciate you actually trying out the lower difficulties with pubs right now, It's been really wild trying to level stuff. Especially when it's pretty rare for me at least to get a lobby where the guys in there are willing to change classes.
absolutely zero point even attempting to balance the game by simply adjusting ammo, armour, weapon power until the A.I. Director is fixed, it's like trying to build a brick house on water. That needs to be number one priority before anything else is even touched, THEN start making adjustments and balancing.
My only gripe about zoes on lethal is that they require ammo to take down but ammo is so scarce that a high number of zoes is almost impossible to manage
Just did a quick solo on Inferno average difficulty because I needed just 1k xp to hit an unlock. TEN EXTREMIS ONE CARNIFEX What the actual fuck are we doing, it was harder than most ruthless solos I do.
Zoanthropes and Neurothropes trigger me. I'll dodge when I'm like 100m away, and those freakin psyker balls weave around obstacles better than a X-wing inside the Death Star plus the huge stun lock after getting hit by its massive AOE
@@knightsljx oh yeah for sure. For me, I think it's re-learning the timing and having to do deal with more shooty mobs. Regardless, I'm just going to play sub/ruth for the time being and just weapons leveling
Both Zoan and Nuero are just straight up Nopethropes to me currently. I just nope nope nope and move on. Unless I am sniper/tactical then I will destroy them. But as heavy, bulwark, assault, I just move on and nope out of there.
Honestly, I was getting the end of match crashes a lot before the patch and that’s the real reason I haven’t played the new patch. Going 20 minutes just to have my progress disappear into the void was bad enough. If I had to deal with 5-7 thropes a mission and then lost my progress, I’d probably uninstall and never look back.
So, over the weekend, I finally had time to get on my heavy and I wanted to level my plasma incinerator. Hadn't touched the weapon at all. I decided to go minimal and get the first level of it built up. Level 16. Minimal. 6 dual zoanthropes. Couple of lictors, 3 or 4 ravaners. Changed from game to game where I would get 4 dual zoanthropes and 2 solo's or the full 6 dual. I work 80 hours a week. What a waste of time with the sitting around waiting to connect. Or having to go out of the game, come back in, or just can't connect. I mean, I've seen myself get disconnected from my own SOLO game.
As I stated over on the Discord, I’ll repeat here; Saber essentially moved the Tzanngors shield issue from Patch 3 to Tyranid Warrior spawns in Patch 4. An annoyance factor in large numbers was changed from one enemy to another.
difficulties 1-4 should not have been touched. they were fine and casuals like me and my friends feel pushed out. the devs listened to a small portion of the player base and all the sweats wanted ruthless to be harder while casuals were barely surviving!!! like how are we supposed to get relic armory data? we cant. the new difficulty should have been the new sweat-lord mode. and even on difficulty 2 now the amount of extremis are absolutely broken. we decided to stop playing until this is fixed hopefully soon. like the easy fix? revert all changes to difficulty 1-4 aside from reducing the barb spores the majoris shoot out cause thats busted my screen is just green. make difficulty 5 how everything is now with all the extremis just remove the amor tethering mechanic. all problems solved.
I did an Average run just to see: 8 Zoenthropes 3 Raveners 4 Lictors 6 massive waves On top of the Neurothrope. This is the type of stuff I used to see on Substantial or Ruthless.
I've actually been playing on average with max level characters just to get armor pieces and its just as bad at the lower levels too. You've pretty much got this spot on. Patch 3.0 put the game in a really good place, yes there were still improvements to be made (bolt weapons, block weapons) but it was a lot of fun to play through. It wouldn't be so bad to have a few extra raveners or lictors running around but all the most annoying enemies seem to be prioritised by the AI director (spore mines, barbed strangler warriors, termigants with a fire rate increase, pairs of zoanthropes - I don't seem to encounter single ones anymore). These enemies were always the least fun to deal with but they were used sparingly. Now its just obnoxious. The other main issue I have is with the number of waves. As far as I can tell, average now has around the same or more enemies spawn than the old ruthless difficulty. Used to be that when a wave was done, it was done, the next corridor or room would have minimal enemies. Now its a room full of warriors, a lictor and 2 zoanthropes, then another wave, then a load of enemies in the next corridor, then an 'incoming wave' warning as you get to the elevator. Having a bit of space to breathe was always welcome in 3.0.
Thought I was the only one.. tried to level up my other classes on average Inferno and I was fighting an obscene number of majoris, extremis, and terminus level enemies before even leaving the swamp area.
One of the progression problems i have with operations is just how long your expected to use master crafted weapons, your supposed to go through three difficulty modes and about 15-20 levels before you can start getting purple armory data, you get it on difficulty 4 out of at first 5 which kinda sucks
Hate to do the ermmm actually here... But purple armory data has always been the substantial difficulty which is the 3rd difficulty not the fourth, and it's recommended to try at lvl 10... BEFORE this patch anyways lol
@@codycastresana7506 genuinely what are you talking about, i just played the game earlier and purple data wasnt until difficulty 4 of 6. And thats how it always was because i remember the only reason i even got two that i have was because i was playing with my buddy who absolutely grinds that game, like all classes maxed grinds, and we took on difficulty 4 and got a discoverable and a garnifex spawn so we got 2
@@sirkelendor5429 the difficulties go as follows 1. Minimal 2. Average 3. Substantial 4. Ruthless 5. Lethal (the new difficulty added with the 4.0 update) I have all my weapons relic tier, I have 200 hours in the game. Shhhh lol
Purple is substantial difficulty (3), but that has always been the toughest transition, because the weapons suck, perks are few and enemies are suddenly about twice as tanky. Yeah, don't try substantial at level 10 anymore after this patch, better be 17-20.
The game needs reverting back to previous patch but keep lethal as is. Lethal and all the changes are great, there are times I just wanted to run and gun, substantial and ruthless were good for that. Was great helping others get through those difficulties but now it's a struggle getting myself through. I completed all bar 2 lethal first try, so there are definitely problems with lower difficulties.
I feel like one big issue I have with space marine 2 is that all the weapons are locked behind the different classes. I can't but feel like I'm being held back with the proprietary weapons on each class... like, I want to utilise the while arsenal for all the classes, I personally believe that an unlocked arsenal can spice up the game play loop. I really hope it gets talked about. Brothers, what are your thoughts?
I was trying to just get some more purple weapon data last night and with max level and artifact gear and with other players of similar level we could not complete a single operation. I have played plenty of ruthless, so it felt pretty wild.
What about the guys who are losing their cosmetic colors and or cosmetic parts especially owners of dlc which have unlocked and then the game is like no I don't even own the dlc I'm like wtf all my progress gone after the patch updated
Yeah all of these issues and remove the tether mechanic in lethal. I don’t care if you double the majoris on the field or do 5 lictors at once. I can work with that. The tether punishes you for playing your class well if you aren’t heavy and tactical.
@martinputarnovoselec9623 I'm in the same situation, I got the helmet and sword so might as well go back down to Ruthless unless a buddy needs some help unlocking his Lethal cosmetics later on down the line and I feel like getting my heart rate up 😂
I had a terminus Zoanthrope last night with two extremis Zoans while doing the two capture consoles on the new termanid mission, we also had tons and tons of majoris enemies in there and it was grueling, snipers everywhere in that small room.
I wanted to try and level up vanguard and it was impossible even on minimal. At one point I had 10 warriors, 2 Zoanthropes, a ravener AND 2 Lictors. Zoanthropes have to have had a health buff as I had no ammo left in my bolt carbine. Add to that I couldn't actually finish the operations missions as they kept crashing so all progress was completely lost.
Exactly how I feel I was trying so it's not fun anymore unless I use my heavy then it's a little bit more tolerable but you can barely level up anything unless have a max player on your team
@@shorts26 Exactly it's just not fun anymore. I don't have the time to spend hours grinding levels and was really enjoying just jumping in and just playing a couple of missions. I was playing offline too and I swear the ai teammates have gotten worse. The worst part are the crashes, I was about to actually finish Inferno and it just cut to the PS5 home screen. I'm staying off it until they fix it.
Developers need to stop listening to the small minority of "elite gamers" who never shut up about how games are too easy. Stop listening to them. They are the loudest and most annoying but they do not represent the majority of people who bought the game.
@@truthseeker9400 Yep. I'm out. tired of this kind of shit. Helldivers did it, now this game is doing it. I have no patience for it anymore. None. I'm fucking out.
So it’s not just me. One of the main places I’ve wiped recently is on decapitation just after the last elevator. It spawns like 100 ankle biters, 15 majors and 2 zoanthropes. Some majors have the gun that spawns thorn bushes and you’re struck in a narrow hallway. I saw this and thought, “we’re supposed to be able to overcome this?” I think this happened on average when I played my level 2 sniper too.
YES the last elevator you drop down from before you go into the room to fight the Hive Tyrant, that elevator area kept spawning wave after wave, mine after mine in silly numbers. This is wrong when you’re about to fight the boss and your health just got whacked.
Lethal on its own is fine right now. Termination mission needs to get toned down a little bit since it is spawning 50% more mobs than other tyranid missions, and requires double the damage done to clean through it, but otherwise I don't think Lethal should be touched anymore. We'll get more power later with prestige and whatever, so people will catch up eventually. But the changes to the low difficulties are absolutely insane. I did a few runs to level my last weapon, switched between average and substantial, and people truly are struggling. There's just so many warriors coming at you, with extremis around every corner and even spore mines alongside the waves. ON MINIMAL. That's not a great first encounter for a new player to face. They don't have parries ingrained in their soul, they don't know how to avoid spore mines, they don't know how to counter extremis. Things like that needs to be introduced incrementally and not dumped on the player all at once. I hope the devs realize this and doesn't just hammer everything down. Top end is good. Low end is not.
Yeah for the most part I like lethal but it could use some tweaking just a bit, but this is more on the player/ class/ perks side of things I suppose they should fix that first then see how it goes.
My question is whether this insanity was purposeful (aka what the devs intended) or was an accidental bug (devs didnt intend for lower level difficulties to be so difficult).
Kudos to you for accepting the challenge. As you've said in other videos, the community can't necessarily go with the small cadre of loud voices. But often the loud voices, and the content providers, too, forget that without the casuals there would either be no games, the games would be $100+ or the games would be really short. We live in the casual, 2-hours a week, randos only world. And for us, the game is **** right now.
1) Mobs are way too strong 2) Matchmaking SUCKS 3) you have Nerf guns + no ammo I don’t wanna play I use to win on ruthless 5-6 times a night, now I might win once. It’s just a waste of time
Need more ammo and equipment pick ups for this. On substantial got smacked by 2 zoanthrops a Ravenor a swarm of 5 warriors and there friends. We win just for next area to immediately have a carnifex. No ammo no health no grenades. Just felt bad man.
Played last night with my buddy and we both wanted to level up stuff we had not used before, so we did a minimal difficulty inferno, I am not joking when i say at one point there was more than 10 warriors attacking us at the same time on top of dozens of gaunts. I have played easier substantial difficulty missions before.
Good points as usual. Some contribution of my own (as a 422 hr player with something like 410 of those being in ops): * From all those ops, I'm almost certain that below lethal extremis spawn in a rotation - that is to say, if you've seen a Zoanthrope in the mission you won't see another until you see a Ravaner and Lictor. If you've seen a Zoan and a Ravaner, the next spawn will be a Lictor. It's possible that it's always the same rotation, but I haven't paid quite enough attention to figure that out - only that it is cyclical. So for Chaos you might see Sorceror - ranged Termy - melee Termy, after which it'll repeat (Sorc => range => melee => sorc etc). I haven't noticed it being different in 4.0, but I could be wrong - between doing lethal and actually starting the PvP I have less time in there, but it does seem to be the same. Spartacus' data almost backs this up when it comes to Lictors and Ravaners, with the difference potentially being misrecorded data. However, the number of Zoans seems way off unless they now sometimes spawn three at a time. * Similar to what IS mentioned with the beta patch rollout, if nothing else I hope this patch has taught them that they likely need a public test server. This patch has had a very "New World" feel to it, in that New World pushed out big changes to the live servers without much fanfare or warning at all, to great disapproval.
Substantial Ballistic mission. 10 zoanthropes paired, 3 Lictors, 3 Raveners, and a Neurothrope. It was just a short while ago that six extremis and a terminus was heavy for that difficulty. That few now would be a blessing, on average dealing with a little more than double the number of extremis and almost always a gauranteed terminus.
As much as i loved the campaign and the operations, i couldnt even bother with the patch, and now seein the shitstorm coming, its even worse. i just didnt have the time to play since the patch, but even before, my only wish for SM2 was " fuck it, hopefully they fix their connection issues!" to the point i will never ever again want to play a game which just came out. i only grinded one char up to lvl 8, but im already at around 20 hours (!) of operations time. reason is : you only get rewards in the END of a mission. means : if you disconnect, all is lost. i have engine error-crashes, disconects or random " NOPE!"- return to menu moments around 80% of the time. let that sink in. Also, i have a well-equipped System, just newly assembled, with a 4000 rtx and the x3d cpu + enough ram to consider donating it to nasa as a workstation, but nope, this game still drops down to sometimes 15-20 fps, funnily not in hordes of enemies, but on certain enemies like zoan or carni. i already wrote like 15 different bug/ system error reports to them, everytime something different. the fun thing is : i even had " connection issues" in the campaing, playing solo. man, do i LOVE life service games forcing online connectivity even in singleplayer. but thankfully, in the campaign, its only a popup annyoing you and with that, disabling throphy-gain.
I did a substantial inferno last night just trying out the powerfist, holy shit I never sweat so hard outside of lethal. Every other mob had like 5 ranged majoris, hordes of termigaunts gunning me down fromnacross the map, like 3 zoey spawns and 2 raveners, and a carnifex. And then while in the last room the game crashed while I had the gene seed. It was a whirlwind of emotion, on the one hand, I had a blast parrying all the melee mobs, on the other getting firing squaded across the rooms sucks, and crashing at the end was lame. And the heavy on my team decided that it was the bulwarks job (me) to take out the zoeys and just ran away .......😂.then after reconnecting to my buddy and heloing him finish out, infinite load screen while laoding out of the mission.
My game crashed right after my first PvP game then again on co-op. I really hope the Devs address this because the game has been borderline unplayable for the last 2 updates.
I took my time beating the campaign and then starting the operations. I shouldn't be getting the floor wiped with me with a team at/above recommended level. And I'm double borked because I like the melee classes, and solo bots won't prioritize targets or shoot flyers most of the time. So it's me, my peashooter, 2 zoanthropes, and 2 bumps on logs. I also only have green-level weapons because I haven't maxed a class yet. Right now, to get purple-level weapons, I need tokens from difficulty 3, but to clear difficulty 3, I need purple-level weapons. Or I could try hell-grinding an extra 15 levels on a too-low difficulty to max a class and hope the perks are good enough to carry me. Maybe lower difficulties are easy when you have max-level weapons, but they're nigh impassable for anyone leveling their first class right now.
When people said more enemies that was also bundled with the fact that many weapons needed buffs which never happened. Now we have bigger hordes with the same spongy enemies
Before the patch, I could clear ruthless with artificer weapons at level 15-20 easily. After patch, I have been skunked at the end about 6 times in a row. I was so disgruntled and angry, I left and played Helldivers and I dont think I want to go back for a while. Wasted all that time to get to the end with two relic tokens and a gene seed only to walk away with a couple hundred XP to show for it
After hearing all of this and how apparently difficult it is now to get Relic Tokens for Weapon Upgrades, it looks like blitzing through Vox Liberatis on Ruthless is no longer just a cheese strategy to get quick levels, but outright mandatory to get into the endgame for Space Marine 2's Operations
I was playing last night with a friend on substantial and we had one mission where it was literally massive wave followed by extremis into another wave into another extremis. It was a slog.
Might just be a case of bad luck on my end, but I also noticed how the game director seemingly takes squad composition into account. No Sniper or Tactical? That's a guaranteed Neurothrope spawn + Zoanthrope pair spam.
Now that I think about it, they can give us custom difficulty. Choose lethal spawn rates but have minimal difficulty health for example. Exp and codex reward would be tied to lowest difficulty setting picked but would be fun to mess around.
Congratulations Spartacus you have become so popular now you get Bot comments. Personally im gonna give Space Marine 2 a vacation until everything gets sorted out. I do wonder how and why did the devs fumble this patch so hard, its almost rookie mistakes. Makes no sense.
As someone with 300+ hours myself, all I've noticed is that there's a few additional issues with general game stability. Difficulty across the board was increased. there's way more activity and variety of dangers now much earlier on. Personally I think that was great because before the patch Ruthless was the only difficulty that didn't get boring as waves and timing were way to static and predictable. The devs themselves made mention of this as they're looking at the data. I also think that might by the other reason we have the long load times. The software is recording what we do so that the dev team can look at it for future improvements, and it might be making adjustments on the fly depending on how well the run is going. I think the major thing devs need to do is buff bolter weapons as they're really popular with people but do very little damage in comparision to melta/plasma/las weapons. The Bolter sniper is like the one main exception.
All I know is that me and my friends were breezing through missions on substantial before the patch and getting ready to try ruthless for the relic gear and then the patch dropped and we can barely struggle through average matches because of the sheer amount to enemies we have to face and how little ammo we get
This is one of the BEST videos addressing everything I have mentioned aswell. Loading into loading screens when ppl leave like they always do. THANKS for this, I hope Sabre listens.
I’m so glad someone finally mentioned the broken queuing in this game and having to return to the title screen. This is the absolute bane of my existence
I love being a bulwark and having to fight zoanthropes with like the 20 shots they give you
Well keep in mind that bulwark are the absolute best in anything that is not flying enemies, I just get off a Lethal Vox with a bulwark, sniper and me as heavy, that mf carry the shit of the two of us hahaha super tank, a "healer" and so a shit ton of DMG he did the half of my dmg only on meele and i run melta....
I feel you, zoah + 2 Neuro and 5 warriors spamming vines after a massive wave with no ammo create until the next sector.
@@Miguel211216😂 you can instant kill Lictors as a bulwark why is it an issue with less ammo? Also use the perks right I maxed out at 144 shots with the plasma pistol.
As a bulwark, Krack Grenades are now your friend for taking out the shrimp!
@@stevegee218 IF the map spawns that damn krak grenade on lethal
Imagine the lvl 1 guy playing his first ever operation as bulwark on minimal difficulty and he gets 6 zoanthropes, 3 raveners, 2 lictors, and a neurothrope.
Hell let's throw in a fuckin Carnifax ontop of that for the same mission! (I know two bosses can't spawn in the same mission but god damn, imagine)
@@scorpiowarrior7841 whats funny is i woild love that if they did pne simple thing. GIVE XP BASED ON ENEMIES KILLED. Part of why the higher difficulties are so hard is teammates who suck are forced to play the higher difficulties to level up in a reasonable amount of time. And the armory data kf course.
@@damanOts Yeah the XP for performing well is genuinely awful and needs to be buffed. Like seriously holy shit. I'd even say the gene seed bonus needs a buff
I welcome the challenge I actually beat it on lethal difficulty as a level 1😭
@@GermanNunez-l2n what class and did u have a relic from another class
It's not just substantial and ruthless. My brother and I were lvling up new classes. On average difficulty the game sent 4 zoenthrops, 2 raveners, 2 lictors and a carnifex. We went down to minimal and we still saw everything minus the carnifex
Same with me.
Zoenthrops are the worst
I got exactly the same mob distribution, but I was on substantial. I was playing with bots in the new op, it was rough! Not fun at all! Also, Zoanthrope pairs are attacking soooo fast!
@@rah2823 No word of a lie, last night me and one other guy faced off against 2 Zoenthropes, a dozen warriors and I don't even know how many of the little guys. Our npc was utterly useless and suffice to say we failed.
I was on my lvl 6 assault and the other guy was on a sniper.
Had this happen to me last night. I joined my friend on the new operation last night and then he proceeded to crash out and then it wouldn't let him come back in so his game became my game somehow. And then after I joined, I fought 4 sets of double zoanthropes, 3 lictors, 2 raveners, and a carnifex. And this was on average. The only reason I won was because I was playing my Vanguard with bonus parry timing and a relic fencing chainsword. I also had about 8 waves happen that I had to fight.
I'm a dad and have a time consuming job but in my free time after my family goes to bed i like to get my game on. Even minimum difficulty has become too sweaty!!! I'm just trying to chill out and have some Bourbon and kill some bugs. I had to quit a game the other day because it was just too much of a pain in the butt. I don't want to get stressed out before I go to bed.
It’s funny how the devs don’t care about mods that break balance while also saying they can’t buff the player too much as to break the balance…
they are catering to the sweats way to much, if the try hards want a super hard difficulty that is cheesy and unfair to play then the devs can make a mess out of lethal but they should then in turn make a fun and rewarding PVE experience for the rest of us.
Amen to Bourbon and bug slaying! I'd argue it's not even sweaty. It's just boring. The enemies are such sponges, and with ammo now being really rationed further, you're not actually slaying bugs. You're just dumping ammo and going melee, or not shooting and just straight to melee. And melee on Term level enemies just has a ton of down time, since they don't actually do a ton of parry attacks.
Democracy needs you, join the Helldivers today. Terminids and Automatons need to learn what liberty means.
I am glad to see this video and data. I played Substantial yesterday ( first time since the patch ) with “purple” weapons and was shocked at how difficult the missions were ). No wonder my two random teammates were level 25. Thankfully they were, as I was getting my level 15 ass kicked 😂. There were Zoans everywhere. On the mission Inferno we even had Zoans spawn AFTER we had completed the mission, whilst waiting for the Thunderhawk to arrive. Brutal for casual players like myself.
@@Archmagos_Faberit’s almost like they’re falling into the same trap that hell divers did. They should learn from their story.
Finally, someone who's good at the game but doesn't have their head stuck up their ass.
Ruthless was the peak of my ability, now I can only do it with a good team mate. The jump from Average to Substantial is complete BS for middle ground players.
@@dallasromero8094 ☝🏻 see, head up their ass.
Have been having a blast on ruthless these past few days. Was playing substantial pre patch. Level 17 here. 👌🏼
Ruthless is a walk in the park compared to lethal. Holy shit
@@dallasromero8094 Alaskan room temp IQ take
this comment needs to be pinned. Ruthless I agree I can do with good teammates I have not tried SOLO as I dont have a max tier player.
I feel bad for anyone who wasn't maxed out on all classes with Relic tier weapons before this dropped
I maxed sniper,assault and heavy
All 3 of them got r*ped after patch
And tight formation isnt doing them good either😂😂
Yeah that’s me. I don’t play much so I have a L2 tactical and a L14 heavy lol. My first substantial game was yesterday and I kept getting my ceramite enclosed ass kicked!
I maxed Tactical, Heavy and Sniper before the patch now can only play tac lol
If it ain't a boss. Run to Assemble. Players feel like they have to kill everything when getting swarmed by 4 different mobs. "GET TO THE CHOPPER" RUN Straight for OBJ
unfortunately i could only get too all purple minus the helmet you unlock for the black templars and shoulder pad you get for linking the game to the pro account before it dropped (I do mainly play by myself by choice) i could run substantial by myself before patch i believe they are listening and will fix it all we can do is hope
Having just recently unlocked a swath of relic weapons, I think a lot of the, 'git good, lol' crowd is forgetting how much of a wet noodle some of the purple or especially green gear can feel like.
Power sword is a prime example. I feel like my damage is practically doubled between purple and gold. And the speed difference is unreal re:survivability.
The numbers say yes. It is actually double the damage lmak
It feels like the stat numbers aren't always 1:1 but I guess in this case it's true.
@@davesscrims5079 I’ve noticed that with other weapons. I’m not sure exactly what’s up. I think some of it has to do with enemy health levels, too. For instance if an enemy has 100 health and your old gun does 90 but the new gun does 100, it’s not a huge difference in stats but you’re now one-shotting them instead of two shots which feels immensely more powerful.
Yep, I notice the "git good" crowd always come from the perspective of playing powerful classes with certain overpowered weapons that trivialised the game calling it too "easy". Then the game devs react to it by nerfing the major mechanics of the game to fit around these weapons (which is the wrong thing to do). lol
Heavy bolter relic is like a whole diff weapon from artificer
I’m a high level player that plays ruthless exclusively, I played with my friend who has barely touched the game the other day, he’s level 3 and so I said we’ll just do average and I’ll carry you and man…it legit felt like I was playing ruthless, I even went down at one point and he was going down time and time again
We had extremis enemies spawning in left right and centre, multiple terminus enemies spawning in and just massive wave after massive wave, it was the least fun I’ve ever had in the game and I even apologised to him and said it wasn’t like this before
Edit: the game also just seems to have way more majoris enemies now and much less minoris
This happened on lethality me but not ruthless I barely get any elites lol
You owe your friend money. He bought the game because you said it was awesome and amazing, and you both suck at it. Refund him.
@@cathode6252 Lmao?
@pats3071 Sorry, I had to. 🤣
Same boat here
Tbf it could be fun if the enemies weren’t so spongy, if the players didn’t get nerfed, and if ammo wasn’t scarce.
most def
It’s actually been really fun playing Average with a maxed out character with non-stop Extremis and squishy enemies. Was surprisingly hard, but not in an annoying way. I can’t imagine it on harder difficulties though.
I always run the ammo restock on major is executes for Tactical now. Gives me and my team some breathing room as far as ammo goes.
@@wannaBaGM Right, but needing to do that basically renders all other builds unusable. I just don't get the thought process behind "Lets give them cool weapons, and then take away their ammo so that can't use them. That sounds like fun!" Another one that's just plain dumb is a 300 second down timer on Lethal. "Hey, here's a cool and fun game. But we really don't want you to be able to play it, instead, just sit there and watch others."
a thousand times this
Prior to this patch I'd never had a feeling of "this doesnt feel fair" in SM2, even back when every minoris attack took away an entire bar of armor. My second match after the patch, on Reliquary, in the middle of the final boss fight the AI director started spamming lesser sorcerers, and they seemed to gravitate to the upper balcony areas, (opposite direction of the heldrake), which was an absolute shitshow to deal with. Splitting attention between the heldrake itself, the lesser sorcerer(s), the regular wave spawns, and then the smaller spawns the sorcerers can call in was just untenable. It seemed like any time I started to focus down the sorcerers a terminator would spawn in, or that whenever I'd be trying to hit the necessary rune sequence to get the heldrake to drop its wings, a sorcerer would be blasting me from an area that can't be reached by players, making a quick dispatch or at least an interrupt all but impossible on them. Why are we spawning extremis level threats in the middle of a boss fight, let alone multiple of them? Isn't the point of a boss fight to fight, well, the boss? This was all only on substantial, mind you. I was trying to level my vanguard and ended up just quitting for the night.
Yeah the spawns got totally fckd up with the last patch. This needs to be fixed asap, if i want overwhelming challenge i go play Lethal. If i want to level up i play according to my gear and character level, but this is impossible now, or rather very tedious. I want to enjoy playing the game and have fun, not sweat my ass thoroughly playing "easier" difficulties.
To note, i regard myself being pretty good at video games (finished most of Fromsoft games alone with no player summons or Op builds) and SM2 is torture atm.
Plus all the disconnection issues eating up my limited free time. Saber is on really thin ice now and they have next to 0 chances to redeem themselves.
yeah well that fight is already not fighting the boss, so they failed on it to begin with, but i agree using a "swarm" engine to swarm you with elite+ is the opposite of intent in my opinion
Just did an average inferno. 14 special kills and 1,329 total kills between the group…😂
A true Tyranid swarm
@@brian-8814 it’s actually perfect for me. It feels like a challenge but not impossible, and it’s still fun without sweating too much. Now my only issue is that XP and coins are coming REALLY slowly.
I thought I was just having really bad luck since I didn’t see anything about a change to Extremis spawns on lower difficulties in the patch notes, but when running Average on solo I’ve been seeing back-to-back-to-back Extremis spawns, and at one point had two Zoanthropes, a wave, and a Carnifex spawn at the same time. It was honestly a lot of fun, but if I were a new player I’d probably have gotten smoked and been super frustrated.
@@NeuroticLobster Yeah, "average" now is quite fun, it's frantic but you feel like a beast because you can smash your way through. Problem is "average" only unlocks up to mastercrafted weapons, players NEED to be able to win substantial and ruthless in random pubs because that's what they need to unlock weapons!
Me and my friend had to go back to Darktide for a while after that ludicrous majoris spawn that they throw at us on Substansial difficulty. Like 10+ majoris in the field and one of them is gonna call for reinforcements behind cover and you can't even reach them because your squad is getting roadblocked by a pile of venom barb that were scattered by the other Tyranid Warriors.
My screen is just drowning in Tyranid Warriors at any given time. There's so many. Barbed strangler tangles as far as the eye can see, and ten billion rabid alien monkeys screaming at me.
All the while zoanthropes just can't seem to stop spawning. I did an Inferno where FOUR separate goddamn spawns came up during the final fight... including one that hung back in the background over the massive horde and just kept hurling shit at us.
I was fighting a sea of warriors. 2 zoanthropes appeared, then a boss health bar for a neurothrope. Needless to say we failed that mission due to literally impossible to dodge amounts of stuff being shot at us.
Fucking morons will say skill issue. It's just complete bullshit. Even before the update, Zoanthrope and Neurothropes were my most hated enemy because they're an ammo/DPS check and if you don't have the best guns you're gonna die.
@@demonintellect9834 same was in a cave so arching the plasma shots (heavy) was impossible
@goblinrat6119 I have started mailing heavy again just for thst perk that clears stranglers for you.
You're right. I just came from fighting 5 Zoans in minimal. It wasn't a problem for me because I was a level 25 sniper, but if I wasn't there, my two level 1 teammates would have died. It was ridiculous.
Zoanthtopes sometimes spam attacks too like multiple attacks at the same time the duo pair
@@em5635 sometimes their attacks goes through walls or objects that shouldn't be possible.
@@savagegtalks5912yeah that frickin laser beam needs to be nerfed big time. It’s nearly impossible to dodge if you manage to get stuck right beneath them
@@savagegtalks5912yeah I got hit through the floor once. So annoying.
maybe they spawned because of you
11:54
If you open the main "pause" menu while in that state you will see a string in the bottom left corner that says in the end "in match"
This means that the game thinks you are in an active session and it's not actually searching for players regardless of what it says outside of the menu.
To clear that status and begin actually searching you only have to change to eternal war or campaign and it will change back to "ready to search"
Another solution I found is to queue up a private match, cancel it, and queue up a regular match. It takes a lot less time than quitting to the main menu.
@@cobaltstellite6 or start a mission and fhem go back to the barge
Great solution thank you!
There's a faster way of checking if you are stuck on the searching, on the bottom right corner it should say either "waiting for Battle Brothers" or "searching for Battle Brothers", if it says "Waiting for Battle Brothers" then it's what you said before, just changed game moded
Average difficulty isn’t any better. Had a very similar run to what you described, which is kinda insane, especially if you’re new to the game.
I had a funny experience with Spore Mines before the 4.0 patch.
I was playing the Hive Tyrant level solo on ruthless to farm armory points, and every enemy reinforcement or random horde spawn was all spore mines. No terminus, no extremis, no large groups of majoris. It was actually fun running in terror from them and checking corners like it was a cover shooter.
As far as difficulty, I went from soloing ruthless to being unable to solo substanial
Sometimes it's even spicy on average. I'm just chilling, trying to level up a weapon and I'm like, 'wtf? Am I on the right difficulty?'
The broken AI director just makes you feel like you're not progressing or accomplishing much, it just makes things even more difficult so you're hanging by a thread every match. It makes the game not the power fantasy I wanted it to be.
The Lethal difficulty also just magnifies the problems already present. Previously tolerable bugs become extremely frustrating.
Lord accurate warhammer universe haha
Yeah, sounds like y'all are getting the Real Tyranid experience now lmao
I was playing with some competitive friends where we compete on damage and enemies killed. I hit 28k in ranged damage alone. They hit about 15k each. We have never had such a high amount of damage pre patch.
Not only do bots suck the flying extremis constantly target the player it's fucking annoying
allmost all if not all of boss mobs target you all the time
We really need more ammo. The insanely small amount of ammo we can carry really messes with the flow of the game
@@dreamingabyss yeah, the number of enemies has increased significantly even on lower difficulties but the amount of ammo laying around to find is still the same. I’m leveling up a Heavy and I constantly run out of ammo.
They should reduced all foes health pool instead by a huge margin . And perhaps add even more of them.
A single bolt should reduce a gaunt to mince meat.
Maybe 3/4 bolts to a tyranid warrior chest should blast it and cut it in half .
Boltguns , while having limited mag size, and ammo pool , because those are realy big ,are realy realy powerfull in counterpart.
Large rounds, realy high power.
Kinda mix between 30mm auto grenade launcher round using rpg propulsion system.
Should os humanoid size targets, blowing them in pieces.
Should blow large holes cavity in bigger targets .
In game , you need 3/4 of your bolt riffle mag to the head of a nid warrior to make it open to finisher.
And then you'll need to deal with it's 8/12 cousins waiting to rip you apart !
More ammo is not the solution.
Make Each count !
Make them more lore accurate !
@@echo-ip3mv Amen, brother!
it's annoying because when I'm leveling tacti I notice I've used 20 rounds and get really really concious of it and start to just use the chainsword to try and keep myself in the fight. heavy is awful with an ammo shortage.
I used to feel the same but I've adapted to conserve ammo and melee more. What I feel they should definitely change, is either the enemy health or buff the player weapons. Enemies take a bit too much damage. I like the highest difficulties, I always play on them in games and in SM2 as well but in this it just needs some tweaking.
Glad to see someone talking about the lower level difficulty spike, I’ve played average matches that end up being harder than pre patch ruthless. It’s way out of control
Im glad this is being talked about. I finally talked my coworker into getting SM2 the day before the patch. I feel so bad now because he is just constantly dead. It was a difficult game to get started before the patch because your weapons aren't great now it is 10 times worse. Im max level with max weapons and even the easiest difficulty can be a slog if he is dead and a bot is just standing there brainlessly lol i really hope they fix this
Misread this as "broken detector" and it made sense with Chaplain Leandros on the thumbnail
I tried to run the new mission on AVERAGE last night, on level 22 tactical. game didn’t matchmake anyone for me to play with, which normally would be fine but the ai director spawned 6 zoanthropes, plus a carnifex, and then during the boss fight my game crashed. as far as I’m concerned this patch made the game unplayable for many, this is a major issue. I won’t be touching the game until these issues are fixed and I’ve heard the same from many.
For me when I play solo I get a massive wave every section, so on inferno for example just before or after every door/ elevator/ rock barricade a wave is spawned.
While I can get through it with max level class it is annoying and wouldn’t be possible for me to beat on a lower level class or weapon
Just did a substantial inferno, with masterwork heavy bolter rifle, relic bolter pistol, and relic chainsword as tactical. Twin zoans spawned in the FIRST area followed by a carnifex at the first tank wreckage immediately after. Then the area right after woth the bridge walkway ANOTHER pair of zoans spawned on me. To be clear, the twins spawned in EVERY section of the map that they technically can spawn for me. Nevermind the other extremis. At this point extremis are just more fodder for me. I can at least work them in to the swarms. But the most egregious things i noticed that whole match, that i failed after detonating the promethean at the end bc of the twin zoan that spawned there immediately, is that EVERY TIME THEY SPAWNED i saw NOT a SINGLE shot for at them from my heavy or sniper AI battle brothers. I'm the generator room i actually cleared ALL other nids so that only the zoans remained and watched the AI REFUSE to engage them AT ALL. As context, they'll at least fire at LITERALLY EVERY OTHER ENEMY TYPE.
I've watched the AI during extremis/terminus encounters and they literally do nothing. Watched the heavy unload his heavy bolter into the neuro's back and the HP wasn't decreasing at all. The AI larps doing damage so if you are solo with AI, you are soloing the mini bosses. You also can't just run from the spawns either as the game will respawn them in the next loaded section of the game. Worst part is, none of these kills do anything for exp or rewards, only finishing the mission counts towards anything.
as soon as people leave comfort zone of coherent team and try to play with randos they quickly realize that game is broken beyond any sense.
today i tried lethal several times and only one was successful. Game hard not in a fun way. AI director just endlessly throwing at you all sorts of bullet sponge shit without even giving a break to refill your ammo. and you quickly out of ammo because you shooting pee shooters. Fucking zoanthropes are annoying flying tanks with machine gun firerate cast. are they this tanky in table top? like wtf they made out of eldar dna. Not to mention non existent armor made out of tin foil.
Devs better revert this L patch back before people start droping from the game
Game population is in free fall already
before the PREVIOUS patch, 3.0, my game ran so smoothly. but since the latest patches my PC begins to stutter and get bogged down in certain parts of levels.
also agreed. I was getting absolutely overwhelmed on substantial and ruthless difficulties. I thought it was just me. After the latest patch, I'm hard pressed to even get through an operations mission successfully even with friends with level 25 characters
Finally, I've been praying for them to fix their matchmaking issues since day one. I don't know what it is, whether it's their servers, optimization, or what, but getting into a match takes way too long and loading into a match takes way too long, and even when you're in a match you might just drop out or bug out. When I start the game, it takes 15-20 minutes just to get into a match.
I also have pc issues, getting 50 fps often on 1080p with a 4080, yet my cpu or gpu utilization is not even 50%. The game is now just not using my hardware 😅
The other issue you didn't mention is that each one of those Extremis spawns now comes with 3-4 Majoris as well and possibly minoris too, with no "Wave Imminent" warning. I some cases they don't even come from a spawn point, they just appear out of thin air. This is just as much of a problem as the massive Extremis spawns because now in addition to 10 or so Extremis it's bombarding you with per match you have an extra 30-40 Majoris.
The amount of times ive had a giant group of majoris enemies + a extremis pop up right infront of me is absolutely ridiculous
fought a massive wave with 5+ warriors, zoanthrope, neurothrope at the same time when low on ammo.
This exactly captures my experience and frustrations with Patch 4.0. Insane swarms and duplicate Extremis bosses on just Substantial difficulty. Hours lost to just being inundated with mobs only to die defeated with a Level 25 Bulwark soloing. Also 2 runs disconnected in the final phase which hadn't happened in the previous month of play.
on minimal as well, i just started and planned to burn through everything on every difficulty, lowest to hardest before going online.
same shit but may game crushed on solo runs
Sounds like fun
If I didn’t know the previous version of the game existed, and this patch was all I known I’d never believe people would solo as bulwark on ruthless.
@@SixXGaming Pistoling down a zoanthrope is f'ing miserable.
I posted about this on Steam bur nobody noticed. It's not just Extremis spawns. The sheer amount of mobs on substantial is just ridiculous. A wave of enemies can spawn on top of an objective event, those enemies can all up reinfocements and I think those reinfocements can call up another reinforcements. On top of that Extremis spawns bring with them a small wave of enemies now that can start spawning more enemies and so on.
As for Lethal I've noticed that vast majority of players simply don't know how to play it. They play it as any other difficult so they play not to win but for the score. They still egzecutions without looking around if someone could benefit from them. They grab stims or ammo when they see them shering only when they are full. They don't pay attencion to sound notifications ignoring Extremis spawns or starting objectives when enemy wave spawns.
Another note about the zoanthropes (specifically the twins). I dunno about everyone else, but my buddies and I feel as though their health pool has received a shadow buff, because they are MUCH harder to kill now. I've got 4 classes at 25 and the other 2 in the double digits. We were "speed running" ruthless inferno in under 25 minutes consistently, yet now we're stuck running substantials to level weapons and just holding our breath each round that we aren't going to get a zoanthrope/neurothrope combo run ender. It feels bad.
Something is going on but health buff isn't one for me. Still do the same thing as heavy "turn on shield and gun them down"
A good trick for the Neuro is if everyone has charge melee attacks, charge them to full under the shield, breaks past the health gate they put on melee
they are flying tanks now
I think the shield animations might be bugged. Sometimes I feel like I 3 shot them with a plasma pistol, other times I dump like 8 to 10 charge shots and nothing. I can only guess that the later case I'm shooting a shield that the game isn't showing me.
I thought I was crazy when I was trying to solo as a Bulwark and it seemed like I have to hit each one with 12 charged plasma pistol shots each. I never had this issue before but it's been a nightmare to deal with all of a sudden since 99% of the time now because I'm just running around scrounging for ammo boxes trying to deal with 2 flying enemies that now seem to have double the hp than lictors or raveners.
My problem with Zoanthropes is them staggering in pairs or spamming their orb attack. Miss a dodge by one and you will get hit by the rest. Not to mention their line/scream still penetrates most obstacles.
I know its anecdotal but I just started to level up my Bulwark today so starting from level 1. Though my weapons were relic tier due to being used on other classes so I had an advantage and decided to play some Average threat (difficulty 2/5 for those who don't know the naming). While yes the waves/hoards were bigger most of the match than pre patch 4.0 it wasn't too bad until the final stretch... It was on Inferno and the last segment after coming up the elevator to make it to the final set piece you go down the ramps to the gun pod and then out to the final section. There was no fewer than 12 warriors, enough gaunts that I literally couldn't move on those narrow platforms, a pair of zoanthroaps, and a carnifex.... That would have been excessive for ruthless difficulty. I feel really bad for players who are supposed to learn on this difficulty as I'm having to sweat on it sometimes when RNJesus decides to use his pimp hand like that.
I had that too…tho replace the Carnifex with the Neurothrope. Then got 5 more Extremis at the end including 2 Zoanthropes and a Ravenor at the same time.
I had 15 total Extremis that run.
Heck, I’m getting 11+ on minimal. Last minimal run had 14.
Yeah, Inferno was THE go-to mission on lower difficulty, but it got quite risky now.
The review bombs say it all. Ultimately, a game needs to cater to the casual gamers, not the elites. The vast majority of gamers are casual and not meta chasing competitive gamers. If the game caters to the minority over the majority, it'll stagnate and ultimately fail.
The addition of lethal was a great move to add a level for the elites without hiding weapons behind the new difficulty. But making ruthless more inaccessible to the average gamer, restricting access to relic weapons for the majority of gamers, is a silly idea and the player base will revolt.
It's not even about casuals, it's about ruining the previously game design. You can amp up difficulty by 10x and have it still be fun (continuous massive waves to the face on lethal with no other difficulty changes), or you can do what the devs did and it is not fun at all.
It needs to cater to both, which is not complicated at all.
Good luck, game devs never listen to anyone except the "pros" who bitch endlessly about how easy everything is.
Welcome to the 40k fandom.
For the last two or three decades the game has catered to min/max power elite gamers and the casual gamer has always suffered.
They're just making the video game reflect the original game they licensed from
There is a place for both the casual gamers and elite gamers. The "elite gamers" find many...not all...but many of the bugs and issues because they put so much time in the game and try out all weapons, builds, game modes, etc...but the majority of gamers are "casual gamers" so the game needs to be fun and accessible for them as well. The elite gamers have good idea but also come up with bad ideas and nonsense like "nerfing" the melta gun...makes no sense...if you don't like it then don't use it. If the game is too easy for you then run ruthless by yourself...or lethal...and challenge yourself by only using the bolt pistol...or challenge yourself by not taking advantage of the executions...if it's still too easy for you shut up, find another game to play, and let everyone else enjoy the game.
As a casual I like playing "Minimal" difficulty, but this patch has even ruined IT. I wanted to play the new op, but it was a pain and didn't feel right. I thought maybe it was me, so I brought out old faithful "Inferno". The spawns are ruined on it too. My poor newbie random teammates were getting swamped by 5-10 Majoris. At one point, I was standing at the edge of a ledge and the enemies were jumping up from a lower level, and 5-10 more majoris jumped up in the span of 5 seconds. It was an awesome sight, but boring. If the battle has no ebb and flow, it gets sickeningly repetitive. I WANT A HORDE SHOOTER. I want to see the horde engine at work.
Ran into a Neorothrope, no adds around... But we didn't have enough ammo to bring it down. Just everyone out of bullets. I was on Tac we had a shield bro and a heavy.
Yeah, we ran into one in Inferno in the room where the data slate is, before the elevator. The game wouldn't let us leave with the elevator. We got a massive wave and then the Neurotrope. Had a few pistol shots left. Needed to pay time, because both my team members went down (one after mortal wound). Crazy stuff.
Shit is fucked if even heavy runs out of ammo
I think coherency ruins the fundamental playstyle of half of the classes.There's no way to balance it. It just ruins the way you play Vanguard or sniper.
assault too. i can’t play it in lethal. you do one ground pound and you die instanlty because you are too far away
They looked at Darktide and thought their coherency system was actually good when it just punishes you for not being so close you can huff each others farts.
If you have issues connecting to a game you dont need to reboot the game or go to the title screen. It is faster to swap to the PVP mode and back to operations and it fixes it to me
Amazing advice! I'll try that next time. Thank you dude!
That worked for me, too
The bug that occurs after somebody leaves the party where you can’t queue up with others can be fixed by switching from Operations mode to PvP and back. It resets whatever gobbledygook happened within the server/partt status.
Yes, thank you. There is so much angst on this patch. While I do think the proximity issue in Lethal is silly (feels like a random affix on mythic dungeons in WoW and completely arbitrary), the primary issue is the AI Director. All difficulty levels have been impacted dramatically. It’s not just more terminus and extremis, the number of Majoris have increased 2-3X. Dealing with multiple zoanthropes while dueling 10-12 majoris is rough for when you’re only on Average or Substantial. I have a few friends that play this for fun and they’ve lost all interest in this game as they’re getting trash canned even in lower difficulties.
Casual gamers will not find this enjoyable at all.
The worst part is when you do a quick match for lethal and you join a level 10 game .
If something works don’t fix it.
Only 17% of players had beat ruthless and the devs thought
“Ohh hey our games too easy, less make it harder”
If the Steam Achievements for SM2 are to be believed. Only 7% of the players did 100 gun strikes as a Vanguard. 2.2% of players killed 41k enemies. and the most mindboggling of them all, only 1.3% of the players got 25 kills on the Tactical with every Primary weapon.... 8% of players have leveled 1 single melee weapon to max.
Steam chevvo arguments are the most disingenuous garbage in the world. Only 35% of players have completed the 6th co-op mission AT ALL. Sounds like half the people that have really started playing co-op have already beaten ruthless.
Ruthless feels way easier... way less enemies
I fear the devs are giving a little too much credit to the feedback from players without day jobs, who had early access and endless hours to devote to grinding. this is NOT THE AVERAGE gamer. those percentage stats say it all.
Ruthless was too easy
The rate in which units call for reinforcements these days are absolutely ridiculous. Stg in firefights, an elite tries to call for reinforcements once every 10 seconds. And they’re always the ones at the back rank that you can’t get to in time.
This explains my experience this past weekend for mobs/waves and lack of finding players
Yeah, every difficulty has been insanely up’d and barely anyone is in servers compared to prepatch… but it does feel like the more that you learn about lethal the easier it gets.
I lost my first 6 rounds on lethal and everything even on “average”, then beat mission 1 and 3 on lethal, and started trouncing the non-lethal difficulties again once I figured out the new dynamic
After this patch, the other day I was playing the Hierophant mission with randos on substancial difficulty, in the final boss battle the pair of zoantropes spawned, one lictor and one ravener also spawned, ofcourse we failed the mission with one shot left to kill the Hierophant because we had our atention divided between the zoantropes, the boss atacks and the ravener that killed us one by one.
I played a ruthless mission last night w/ my lvl 18 Vanguard. I use to get through Ruthless no issue. It was noticeably harder. The frustrating part about it was my two bot allies did literally ZERO damage to the Neurothrope that spawned, is this a bug? What a pain in the !#@ it was trying to fight that thing w/ a Melta and two bots that do ZERO damage.
I noticed this too. I normally play assault and vanguard, so when I get neurothropes I have to rely on the bots more, and it's Health does not seem to move unless I'm the one shooting it
I’m pretty sure bots can’t damage bosses. Not only have I watched my bots shoot at a Neurothrope and not do damage (at least nothing I could visibly see on the health bar), but I’ve also seen a couple videos about soloing bosses that touch on this as well. It makes it really hard as an Assault trying to take out a Neurothrope with just a pea shooter.
Exactly what I've been saying. Even the lowest difficulty got wild compared to how it was. Sometimes waves are so big that the game can glitch out for a moment (or crash). Substantial can get crazy very quickly.
The gameplay primarily doesnt support what the balance currently is which is the main issue, armor regen takes to long by itself being 25 seconds and hp doesnt regen and contested health mechanic has issues, honestly removing the cap on restoring health from contested wouldn't even be bad at this point.
Space Marine Armor getting nerfed is the biggest concern for me you're suppose to play a walking tank not a glorified gardsmen !
Seriously 10% reduction for substential and 20% for ruthless ?!! Come on !
I can work with more ennemis but if my armor is paper macher and the mob is bullet sponge it's not gonna work !
Really appreciate you actually trying out the lower difficulties with pubs right now, It's been really wild trying to level stuff. Especially when it's pretty rare for me at least to get a lobby where the guys in there are willing to change classes.
absolutely zero point even attempting to balance the game by simply adjusting ammo, armour, weapon power until the A.I. Director is fixed, it's like trying to build a brick house on water. That needs to be number one priority before anything else is even touched, THEN start making adjustments and balancing.
My only gripe about zoes on lethal is that they require ammo to take down but ammo is so scarce that a high number of zoes is almost impossible to manage
Just did a quick solo on Inferno average difficulty because I needed just 1k xp to hit an unlock.
TEN EXTREMIS
ONE CARNIFEX
What the actual fuck are we doing, it was harder than most ruthless solos I do.
Zoanthropes and Neurothropes trigger me.
I'll dodge when I'm like 100m away, and those freakin psyker balls weave around obstacles better than a X-wing inside the Death Star plus the huge stun lock after getting hit by its massive AOE
@@knightsljx oh yeah for sure. For me, I think it's re-learning the timing and having to do deal with more shooty mobs.
Regardless, I'm just going to play sub/ruth for the time being and just weapons leveling
Both Zoan and Nuero are just straight up Nopethropes to me currently. I just nope nope nope and move on. Unless I am sniper/tactical then I will destroy them. But as heavy, bulwark, assault, I just move on and nope out of there.
Honestly, I was getting the end of match crashes a lot before the patch and that’s the real reason I haven’t played the new patch. Going 20 minutes just to have my progress disappear into the void was bad enough. If I had to deal with 5-7 thropes a mission and then lost my progress, I’d probably uninstall and never look back.
So, over the weekend, I finally had time to get on my heavy and I wanted to level my plasma incinerator. Hadn't touched the weapon at all.
I decided to go minimal and get the first level of it built up. Level 16. Minimal. 6 dual zoanthropes. Couple of lictors, 3 or 4 ravaners. Changed from game to game where I would get 4 dual zoanthropes and 2 solo's or the full 6 dual.
I work 80 hours a week. What a waste of time with the sitting around waiting to connect. Or having to go out of the game, come back in, or just can't connect. I mean, I've seen myself get disconnected from my own SOLO game.
As I stated over on the Discord, I’ll repeat here;
Saber essentially moved the Tzanngors shield issue from Patch 3 to Tyranid Warrior spawns in Patch 4. An annoyance factor in large numbers was changed from one enemy to another.
difficulties 1-4 should not have been touched. they were fine and casuals like me and my friends feel pushed out. the devs listened to a small portion of the player base and all the sweats wanted ruthless to be harder while casuals were barely surviving!!! like how are we supposed to get relic armory data? we cant. the new difficulty should have been the new sweat-lord mode. and even on difficulty 2 now the amount of extremis are absolutely broken. we decided to stop playing until this is fixed hopefully soon. like the easy fix? revert all changes to difficulty 1-4 aside from reducing the barb spores the majoris shoot out cause thats busted my screen is just green. make difficulty 5 how everything is now with all the extremis just remove the amor tethering mechanic. all problems solved.
I did an Average run just to see:
8 Zoenthropes
3 Raveners
4 Lictors
6 massive waves
On top of the Neurothrope.
This is the type of stuff I used to see on Substantial or Ruthless.
I've actually been playing on average with max level characters just to get armor pieces and its just as bad at the lower levels too. You've pretty much got this spot on. Patch 3.0 put the game in a really good place, yes there were still improvements to be made (bolt weapons, block weapons) but it was a lot of fun to play through. It wouldn't be so bad to have a few extra raveners or lictors running around but all the most annoying enemies seem to be prioritised by the AI director (spore mines, barbed strangler warriors, termigants with a fire rate increase, pairs of zoanthropes - I don't seem to encounter single ones anymore). These enemies were always the least fun to deal with but they were used sparingly. Now its just obnoxious. The other main issue I have is with the number of waves. As far as I can tell, average now has around the same or more enemies spawn than the old ruthless difficulty. Used to be that when a wave was done, it was done, the next corridor or room would have minimal enemies. Now its a room full of warriors, a lictor and 2 zoanthropes, then another wave, then a load of enemies in the next corridor, then an 'incoming wave' warning as you get to the elevator. Having a bit of space to breathe was always welcome in 3.0.
Thought I was the only one.. tried to level up my other classes on average Inferno and I was fighting an obscene number of majoris, extremis, and terminus level enemies before even leaving the swamp area.
One of the progression problems i have with operations is just how long your expected to use master crafted weapons, your supposed to go through three difficulty modes and about 15-20 levels before you can start getting purple armory data, you get it on difficulty 4 out of at first 5 which kinda sucks
Hate to do the ermmm actually here... But purple armory data has always been the substantial difficulty which is the 3rd difficulty not the fourth, and it's recommended to try at lvl 10... BEFORE this patch anyways lol
@@codycastresana7506 genuinely what are you talking about, i just played the game earlier and purple data wasnt until difficulty 4 of 6. And thats how it always was because i remember the only reason i even got two that i have was because i was playing with my buddy who absolutely grinds that game, like all classes maxed grinds, and we took on difficulty 4 and got a discoverable and a garnifex spawn so we got 2
Purple tier has always been at Substantial level.
@@sirkelendor5429 the difficulties go as follows
1. Minimal
2. Average
3. Substantial
4. Ruthless
5. Lethal (the new difficulty added with the 4.0 update)
I have all my weapons relic tier, I have 200 hours in the game. Shhhh lol
Purple is substantial difficulty (3), but that has always been the toughest transition, because the weapons suck, perks are few and enemies are suddenly about twice as tanky. Yeah, don't try substantial at level 10 anymore after this patch, better be 17-20.
The game needs reverting back to previous patch but keep lethal as is. Lethal and all the changes are great, there are times I just wanted to run and gun, substantial and ruthless were good for that. Was great helping others get through those difficulties but now it's a struggle getting myself through. I completed all bar 2 lethal first try, so there are definitely problems with lower difficulties.
I feel like one big issue I have with space marine 2 is that all the weapons are locked behind the different classes. I can't but feel like I'm being held back with the proprietary weapons on each class... like, I want to utilise the while arsenal for all the classes, I personally believe that an unlocked arsenal can spice up the game play loop. I really hope it gets talked about.
Brothers, what are your thoughts?
I was trying to just get some more purple weapon data last night and with max level and artifact gear and with other players of similar level we could not complete a single operation. I have played plenty of ruthless, so it felt pretty wild.
What about the guys who are losing their cosmetic colors and or cosmetic parts especially owners of dlc which have unlocked and then the game is like no I don't even own the dlc I'm like wtf all my progress gone after the patch updated
It’s happened to me twice now have lost over a thousand requisition due to it
Yeah all of these issues and remove the tether mechanic in lethal. I don’t care if you double the majoris on the field or do 5 lictors at once. I can work with that. The tether punishes you for playing your class well if you aren’t heavy and tactical.
Yes man, it just feel wrong and out of place, even perks that give armor on gunn strike dont work if too far of team
I did all 7 missions, but wont play more on hardest, i see no point, u get nothing for that after u finish all
@martinputarnovoselec9623 I'm in the same situation, I got the helmet and sword so might as well go back down to Ruthless unless a buddy needs some help unlocking his Lethal cosmetics later on down the line and I feel like getting my heart rate up 😂
I had a terminus Zoanthrope last night with two extremis Zoans while doing the two capture consoles on the new termanid mission, we also had tons and tons of majoris enemies in there and it was grueling, snipers everywhere in that small room.
I wanted to try and level up vanguard and it was impossible even on minimal. At one point I had 10 warriors, 2 Zoanthropes, a ravener AND 2 Lictors. Zoanthropes have to have had a health buff as I had no ammo left in my bolt carbine. Add to that I couldn't actually finish the operations missions as they kept crashing so all progress was completely lost.
Exactly how I feel I was trying so it's not fun anymore unless I use my heavy then it's a little bit more tolerable but you can barely level up anything unless have a max player on your team
@@shorts26 Exactly it's just not fun anymore. I don't have the time to spend hours grinding levels and was really enjoying just jumping in and just playing a couple of missions. I was playing offline too and I swear the ai teammates have gotten worse. The worst part are the crashes, I was about to actually finish Inferno and it just cut to the PS5 home screen. I'm staying off it until they fix it.
Developers need to stop listening to the small minority of "elite gamers" who never shut up about how games are too easy. Stop listening to them. They are the loudest and most annoying but they do not represent the majority of people who bought the game.
@@truthseeker9400 Yep. I'm out. tired of this kind of shit. Helldivers did it, now this game is doing it. I have no patience for it anymore. None. I'm fucking out.
So it’s not just me. One of the main places I’ve wiped recently is on decapitation just after the last elevator. It spawns like 100 ankle biters, 15 majors and 2 zoanthropes. Some majors have the gun that spawns thorn bushes and you’re struck in a narrow hallway. I saw this and thought, “we’re supposed to be able to overcome this?” I think this happened on average when I played my level 2 sniper too.
YES the last elevator you drop down from before you go into the room to fight the Hive Tyrant, that elevator area kept spawning wave after wave, mine after mine in silly numbers. This is wrong when you’re about to fight the boss and your health just got whacked.
Lethal on its own is fine right now. Termination mission needs to get toned down a little bit since it is spawning 50% more mobs than other tyranid missions, and requires double the damage done to clean through it, but otherwise I don't think Lethal should be touched anymore. We'll get more power later with prestige and whatever, so people will catch up eventually.
But the changes to the low difficulties are absolutely insane. I did a few runs to level my last weapon, switched between average and substantial, and people truly are struggling. There's just so many warriors coming at you, with extremis around every corner and even spore mines alongside the waves. ON MINIMAL.
That's not a great first encounter for a new player to face. They don't have parries ingrained in their soul, they don't know how to avoid spore mines, they don't know how to counter extremis. Things like that needs to be introduced incrementally and not dumped on the player all at once.
I hope the devs realize this and doesn't just hammer everything down. Top end is good. Low end is not.
Yeah for the most part I like lethal but it could use some tweaking just a bit, but this is more on the player/ class/ perks side of things I suppose they should fix that first then see how it goes.
I completely agree with this. Ruthless and substantial should be somewhat harder, but minimal and average being this hard is not ok.
My question is whether this insanity was purposeful (aka what the devs intended) or was an accidental bug (devs didnt intend for lower level difficulties to be so difficult).
Kudos to you for accepting the challenge. As you've said in other videos, the community can't necessarily go with the small cadre of loud voices.
But often the loud voices, and the content providers, too, forget that without the casuals there would either be no games, the games would be $100+ or the games would be really short.
We live in the casual, 2-hours a week, randos only world. And for us, the game is **** right now.
1) Mobs are way too strong
2) Matchmaking SUCKS
3) you have Nerf guns + no ammo
I don’t wanna play I use to win on ruthless 5-6 times a night, now I might win once. It’s just a waste of time
Need more ammo and equipment pick ups for this. On substantial got smacked by 2 zoanthrops a Ravenor a swarm of 5 warriors and there friends. We win just for next area to immediately have a carnifex. No ammo no health no grenades. Just felt bad man.
This is a great video. I usually play on average. The number of waves I'm getting after the patch is 2-3 times higher then before the patch.
Played last night with my buddy and we both wanted to level up stuff we had not used before, so we did a minimal difficulty inferno, I am not joking when i say at one point there was more than 10 warriors attacking us at the same time on top of dozens of gaunts. I have played easier substantial difficulty missions before.
Good points as usual. Some contribution of my own (as a 422 hr player with something like 410 of those being in ops):
* From all those ops, I'm almost certain that below lethal extremis spawn in a rotation - that is to say, if you've seen a Zoanthrope in the mission you won't see another until you see a Ravaner and Lictor. If you've seen a Zoan and a Ravaner, the next spawn will be a Lictor. It's possible that it's always the same rotation, but I haven't paid quite enough attention to figure that out - only that it is cyclical. So for Chaos you might see Sorceror - ranged Termy - melee Termy, after which it'll repeat (Sorc => range => melee => sorc etc). I haven't noticed it being different in 4.0, but I could be wrong - between doing lethal and actually starting the PvP I have less time in there, but it does seem to be the same. Spartacus' data almost backs this up when it comes to Lictors and Ravaners, with the difference potentially being misrecorded data. However, the number of Zoans seems way off unless they now sometimes spawn three at a time.
* Similar to what IS mentioned with the beta patch rollout, if nothing else I hope this patch has taught them that they likely need a public test server. This patch has had a very "New World" feel to it, in that New World pushed out big changes to the live servers without much fanfare or warning at all, to great disapproval.
Yeah my last substantial run had 3 lictors, 4 zoanthropes and a carnifex. Felt real bad lol
I also thought the amount of reinforcements being called for has gone up a lot!
Substantial Ballistic mission. 10 zoanthropes paired, 3 Lictors, 3 Raveners, and a Neurothrope. It was just a short while ago that six extremis and a terminus was heavy for that difficulty. That few now would be a blessing, on average dealing with a little more than double the number of extremis and almost always a gauranteed terminus.
Edit: Ruthless not Substantial.
As much as i loved the campaign and the operations, i couldnt even bother with the patch, and now seein the shitstorm coming, its even worse.
i just didnt have the time to play since the patch, but even before, my only wish for SM2 was " fuck it, hopefully they fix their connection issues!" to the point i will never ever again want to play a game which just came out. i only grinded one char up to lvl 8, but im already at around 20 hours (!) of operations time. reason is : you only get rewards in the END of a mission. means : if you disconnect, all is lost.
i have engine error-crashes, disconects or random " NOPE!"- return to menu moments around 80% of the time. let that sink in.
Also, i have a well-equipped System, just newly assembled, with a 4000 rtx and the x3d cpu + enough ram to consider donating it to nasa as a workstation, but nope, this game still drops down to sometimes 15-20 fps, funnily not in hordes of enemies, but on certain enemies like zoan or carni.
i already wrote like 15 different bug/ system error reports to them, everytime something different.
the fun thing is : i even had " connection issues" in the campaing, playing solo. man, do i LOVE life service games forcing online connectivity even in singleplayer. but thankfully, in the campaign, its only a popup annyoing you and with that, disabling throphy-gain.
I did a substantial inferno last night just trying out the powerfist, holy shit I never sweat so hard outside of lethal. Every other mob had like 5 ranged majoris, hordes of termigaunts gunning me down fromnacross the map, like 3 zoey spawns and 2 raveners, and a carnifex. And then while in the last room the game crashed while I had the gene seed.
It was a whirlwind of emotion, on the one hand, I had a blast parrying all the melee mobs, on the other getting firing squaded across the rooms sucks, and crashing at the end was lame. And the heavy on my team decided that it was the bulwarks job (me) to take out the zoeys and just ran away .......😂.then after reconnecting to my buddy and heloing him finish out, infinite load screen while laoding out of the mission.
My game crashed right after my first PvP game then again on co-op. I really hope the Devs address this because the game has been borderline unplayable for the last 2 updates.
I took my time beating the campaign and then starting the operations. I shouldn't be getting the floor wiped with me with a team at/above recommended level. And I'm double borked because I like the melee classes, and solo bots won't prioritize targets or shoot flyers most of the time. So it's me, my peashooter, 2 zoanthropes, and 2 bumps on logs. I also only have green-level weapons because I haven't maxed a class yet. Right now, to get purple-level weapons, I need tokens from difficulty 3, but to clear difficulty 3, I need purple-level weapons. Or I could try hell-grinding an extra 15 levels on a too-low difficulty to max a class and hope the perks are good enough to carry me. Maybe lower difficulties are easy when you have max-level weapons, but they're nigh impassable for anyone leveling their first class right now.
Thanks for looking into this bro :)
My Thunder Hammer appreciates the Swarm update. However, he despises all the flying bastards he can’t hit.
The lower difficulties do seem a little broken. But i have enjoyed the increase in difficulty in ruthless on up.
Lower difficulty problems are a game killer. That's where the majority of people play
When people said more enemies that was also bundled with the fact that many weapons needed buffs which never happened. Now we have bigger hordes with the same spongy enemies
Before the patch, I could clear ruthless with artificer weapons at level 15-20 easily. After patch, I have been skunked at the end about 6 times in a row. I was so disgruntled and angry, I left and played Helldivers and I dont think I want to go back for a while. Wasted all that time to get to the end with two relic tokens and a gene seed only to walk away with a couple hundred XP to show for it
Don't worry a patch is on its way.
After hearing all of this and how apparently difficult it is now to get Relic Tokens for Weapon Upgrades, it looks like blitzing through Vox Liberatis on Ruthless is no longer just a cheese strategy to get quick levels, but outright mandatory to get into the endgame for Space Marine 2's Operations
11:56 changing gamemode also works and is faster.
I was playing last night with a friend on substantial and we had one mission where it was literally massive wave followed by extremis into another wave into another extremis. It was a slog.
Might just be a case of bad luck on my end, but I also noticed how the game director seemingly takes squad composition into account. No Sniper or Tactical? That's a guaranteed Neurothrope spawn + Zoanthrope pair spam.
Now that I think about it, they can give us custom difficulty. Choose lethal spawn rates but have minimal difficulty health for example. Exp and codex reward would be tied to lowest difficulty setting picked but would be fun to mess around.
Congratulations Spartacus you have become so popular now you get Bot comments.
Personally im gonna give Space Marine 2 a vacation until everything gets sorted out.
I do wonder how and why did the devs fumble this patch so hard, its almost rookie mistakes. Makes no sense.
Hahaha it's been happening the last few months. My mom would be so proud
@@italianspartacus Progress is progress brother, you are nearly there!.
As someone with 300+ hours myself, all I've noticed is that there's a few additional issues with general game stability. Difficulty across the board was increased. there's way more activity and variety of dangers now much earlier on. Personally I think that was great because before the patch Ruthless was the only difficulty that didn't get boring as waves and timing were way to static and predictable. The devs themselves made mention of this as they're looking at the data. I also think that might by the other reason we have the long load times. The software is recording what we do so that the dev team can look at it for future improvements, and it might be making adjustments on the fly depending on how well the run is going. I think the major thing devs need to do is buff bolter weapons as they're really popular with people but do very little damage in comparision to melta/plasma/las weapons. The Bolter sniper is like the one main exception.
All I know is that me and my friends were breezing through missions on substantial before the patch and getting ready to try ruthless for the relic gear and then the patch dropped and we can barely struggle through average matches because of the sheer amount to enemies we have to face and how little ammo we get
This is one of the BEST videos addressing everything I have mentioned aswell. Loading into loading screens when ppl leave like they always do. THANKS for this, I hope Sabre listens.
I’m so glad someone finally mentioned the broken queuing in this game and having to return to the title screen. This is the absolute bane of my existence
For the ammo crate refill:
You get 18 refills total as a team per box.