You can also plug a cable in one of the outputs of the mixer to a laptop or IPad to record the performance. This will help you improve your next performance.
Hey thanks so much for putting this together. It dispelled some of the major misconceptions that I had about the back tracking. Before, I was deadset on doing stereo to give audience "the best live experience". After watching your video, I was like "that was STUPID" and I went on a google spree. Turns out that you are absolutely right. I found out that a lot of sound engineers at venues actually found stereo backing tracks to be problematic, not only from a technical stand point but also from an audience stand point. Super invaluable 👍🏻
I used all my life just a split cable, laptop and an adapter for the drum, an extension for the front of house. And i got the invisible keyboard player in MY DECEPTION. Done. I was considering laptop -> mixer -> drummer and front of house .
Hi, just watched this and you’ve made it so well - thank you for considering the detail and need for simplicity - I noticed that you answer the question only 10 days ago so I to I’m gonna pose you a question which I think you have already answered to be fair but I just want to clarify - and we are a three piece of guitar drums and bass and I have created a load of keyboards and backing vocals backing tracks for us to play over - at the moment I am going to use a MacBook and logic to do this - I understand I need to create the two tracks, one with the music and one with the click and cues - I have bought and not yet used a wireless IEM system with three packs - if I follow this method and buy two DIY boxes and one small mixer, where do I plug the transmitter for the IEM system into? Is it in an aux? To clarify, what is the easiest way for all of us to use the wireless IEM packs so we can hear the music and the click? Sorry if you have already made this clear but I’m looking for ultimate ease and clarification and so I know exactly what I need to buy to make this all work, thanks very much
Ok So there's a way you can do this without having to use an extra small mixer. Take the stereo output from Logic and get both left and right channel to your main FOH mixer. Make sure to give them individual channels. Then get your IEM transmitter and connect it to AUX 1 output. You can now dial in using the Aux1 volume knob the selected channels you want, in this case you'll want to add some click and backing track to the Aux1 audio feed. You should receive the signal to your body packs. You may need to play around with volume levels because you'll have volume level control from multiple sources such as your Macbook, the FOH Mixer, the transmitter signal and the body packs. It can be a pain but finding the sweet spot for all takes a bit of practice. Rule of Thumb, Always start with the source. Hope that helps. Lett me know if you have any more questions. There of course multiple variations of this kind of setup.
@@BandOnABudgetNZ thank you for getting back to me - almost went down that road of mixer but after speaking to a couple of music shops, we have bought an Audient interface with 4 ins and 4 outs - we can now send 2 stereo lines to the FOH and a third (click track) and hopefully (haven’t tried it yet) plug the IEM transmitter in there - hopefully should work
@@BandOnABudgetNZ thank you for getting back to me - almost went down that road of mixer but after speaking to a couple of music shops, we have bought an Audient interface with 4 ins and 4 outs - we can now send 2 stereo lines to the FOH and a third (click track) and hopefully (haven’t tried it yet) plug the IEM transmitter in there - hopefully should work
You'll need to playback the audio using a DAW and use an audio interface with at least 4 outputs. Main output 1 and 2 for the FOH and output 3 and 4 for the monitor mixes
@@chronicironic1358 You'll need to playback the audio using a DAW and use an audio interface with at least 4 outputs. Main output 1 and 2 for the FOH and output 3 and 4 for the monitor mixes
Awesome information. Thank you. One question. On the second option with the small mixer, why send click to main mixer? I understand sending backing there but I don't understand why you send click there when the band can get click from the mini mixer. Thanks in advance.
Just incase other people in the band want to hear the click or if recording and need to sync post production. the click will help line up the waveforms
What would you send click from DI box to house mixer? The band could hear the click from the drummer's mixer (after splitting phones output for each band member, no?) I dont get it, pls explain 🤔
Yes i think it is a better solution, this way you can control the IEM or headphones outputs on your own without the help of the sound guy. In general i think there can be many other ways to do it...
Hi. Just set this up and all working. Can you tell me as an electronic drummer I'm currently sending the kit straight to mixer that only leaves control of FH volume with the brain that i can reach. It might be obvious but could you clarify how i get more control on the kit going to FH using the above set. Thanks
On my drum pad, I usually set the on board drum pad volume about 1 o'clock on the dial. I use jack to jack from the drum pad to a DI box, then XLR out of the DI box straight to the FOH mixer. From here you may need a bit of help. You'll have to play the drums at your usual velocity and style and have someone else adjust the gain on the FOH mixer so there's a strong signal but not peaking, and maybe add a compressor for those loud moments. Then you can move the fader up to how loud you need it and also on the master fader for your FOH.
@@MrLines22 Its not necessary but one of the benefits of using a DI is having a Grounding switch to cancel out hums as well as a Thru output to send another copy of the signal to a personal monitoring system, pre amp etc. I always carry one with me just in case as well as an XLR to extend the length needed to the FOH, or snake box
Thank you Really helpful gone from accustic to electric and backing tracks with a keyboard /singer... One thing having a bit of an issue with is levals of backing tracks and without an engineer on gigs I thinks gonna bit a issue, songs coming from different sources isnt helping. Any Advice welcome. Once again Thanks for your time.
@@MrLines22 setting levels would be best done starting with your DAW. For example in logic you need a reference track and then adjust levels, EQ and compression of you backing track. You want to make sure the overall volume of your track is as loud as you need. You should also play around with the LUFS integrated levels. This is basically your overall "loudness" of the track. Find a suitable LUFS level and then try to mix all your other backing tracks to the same output level and LUFS level. This is so all your backing tracks are at a relatively consistent playback level in terms of Volume and output signal. Once that's done you'll have to play a bit of a guessing game at a live performance to get your guitar and vocals balanced in the mix. Ideally ask a bar tender, or friend to help adjust these levels in the first 2-3 songs. Hope that helps =)
great video! just a question abt the second setup: wouldn't the aux send from the FOH to our little mixer also have the backing track along with the live musicians in it? wondering if it is necessary, can't the soundie control its volume once the aux send is given to us?
Yes the soundie can control it but lets say you need a bit more, its hard to get soundie's attention immediately when its as simple as just turning a dial yourself. The 2nd setup would work best for a stationary musician like keyboard and drums. You don't have to use the little mixer but it does give you the option to EQ the click or backing track. e.g when I play drums I tweak the click so that i hear a certain frequency of the click better while drumming. Same goes for backing track if I want bass boosted for my mix without affecting everyone else's EQ. In short, you don't need the 2nd little mixer. Its personal preference. And if you have multiple AUX sends then some will receive the click and backing track and other monitor feed direct from FOH while others using a small mixer will have a different send with more control over their mixes. My advice, try out both methods to see which you prefer. Hope that helps
Hi Thanks for the video, Im new to live performance. So if I wanted to have a separate aux output (with a click track etc) sent to in-ear monitors and then the master output sent to the FOH, id have to use a computer with a DAW for this to work for stereo? Is there any disadvantages of having the output in Mono over stereo?
Yes you'd need a DAW and an audio interface with at least 4 outputs for a stereo setup. Some people prefer stereo because they like to hear click in one ear and the track in the other while others prefer stereo to create a sense of balance and separation. Downside is more cables, more gear, and using up 2 AUX channels for a stereo mix. With Mono it means you dont need a laptop or DAW, just an mp3 player with a stereo send which will have one for the track and the other for click/cues. Plus you only need to use one AUX channel. Another thing to note is if you've used a foldback monitor or wedges on stage, those are always giving you a mono signal. I'd recommend trying out both to see which you prefer as each person will have a difference preference. For me personally, Im happy with mono. However stereo is a "nice to have" if you have the gear to support that. I would only use Stereo if i have a production and sound crew working for me. If I'm doing most of the sound stuff then I stick with mono.
yo quick question, I have a pro-48 DI box on me, was just wondering how I'd get phantom power to it in method 1 since the MA400 doesn't generate any, the only connection to FOH is from the monitor input and afaik you can't really give phantom power from a 6.35 inch jack
I'm a newbie, this was a very good explanation! One question how does the band get piped through this? Are all instruments plugged into the large mixer?
Hey fella - I've got an 802 and found this really useful. Do I really need the DI box(es) in that if the stereo output from the iPad was track-left, click-right, then once plugged into the 802 in two different channels, (click 3 & track 5) then I could take the track channel 5 to FOH from the Main out Left; it then becomes a mono track input onto the front desk, whatever channel Or are the DIs needed to boost/compress/enhance the signal coming from the iPad? Love your work and many thanks!
Thank you, this is exactly what I have been looking for. We have P16s set up for personal monitoring, so in this scenario what is that Behringer micro thing for?
I use it for personal monitoring if I want to control the volume of my backing track myself rather than getting the soundie to do it. If Im on drums I usually use the micromon to monitor my own volume settings while the soundie focuses on controlling the volume of other musician's monitoring
cheers mate, great video... currently i'm using a more simpler (and less budget) route, using an iphone as my click & backing tracks (and to show lyrics). If I use a TRS to XLR split cable, there's no need for a DI right? I can just plug it in to the MA400, and I use a wireless IEM to share the cilcks. What about using two MA400 ? one for click and other for backing track so you can control each gain before going to your IEM and FOH? should be almost the same price as 1 xenyx mixer, but more compact. thank you
@@BandOnABudgetNZ oooh SHOOT!.. many thanks for the heads up about the phantom power.. will make sure about that, good thing our first run on rehearsal nothing wrong happen because I told the mixer operator that the line is for backing tracks. So will the DI box will secure the line for possible phantom power (just in case it was turned on) so nothing goes wrong to the source device.? If so, then I might change the TRS to TS splitter and add a DI currently all the clicks , backing and lyrics are from me (attached to the mic stand) using an app Stage Traxx 3 .. an awesome app. not operated from the drummer yet. since we are old school band mates but they are happy with the clicks throught the wireless IEM. thanks again
This is so clear, thank you so much for this breakdown! Just a quick question: Why, for option 2, do we also need to send the clicktrack to front of house if all they're going to do is turn it all the way down? I've seen multiple videos now describing this setup and they all seem to say to do this, but I'm confused why it's necessary. Wouldn't I just need to send it right to my mixer? Thanks!
Hey good question! You may not need to do this for every setup however lets say you're using a FOH mixer with multiple AUX sends and you also want to have separate monitor mixes for each musician. My video diagram would work best for a drummer so 2nd option will have the drummer sorted, but what about everyone else? If the click is send to the FOH mixer, yes you would keep the fader down for the click so that its not going thru the main speakers but you could dial it in to AUX 2, 3, 4 etc and have that signal sent to an In-Ear Monitor system and have that sent to the other musicians along with their own band and backing track mix. Hope that clears it up, thanks for the comment
Hello, Would you be able to help me set up my backing tracks on my Mac Book Pro computer and Ableton with my mixer. I used to play live years ago in a band as rhythm guitarist and lead singer. But, lately, I have found I play solo. I am very busy but I need to modernize my equipment to do live gigs. Would be able to help me. I am a one man band but I used backing tracks. Please let me know.
Hey there. Yes happy to help you but I need some more info. Feel free to send me more details and pics of your setup to help me understand. My email is under the channel details =)
Is there a way to do this without the di boxes? What if the foh mixer is a stage box with Wi-Fi that is controlled wirelessly with an iPad? Is this even possible or usable? Thanks
Hi! I am really really new at this kind of stuff and don't really get what I'm supposed to do, I play with a couple of guys and we want to cover a song that uses some sort of Synth or Keyboard in some parts, we've tried finding an actual keyboardist but failed and we really want to rehearse this song. Can you help me? I've found a backing track online, the thing is we just need the synth/keyboard parts since we already play everything else, the rehearsal room in which we play has some sort of cable that I can plug into my phone and then plug it in to the Console but I'm pretty much lost. Sorry for my bad English :p
The simpler way to do this is replace all the DI boxes, mixer and minimon with a Behringer XR18 mixer, connect your laptop via USB, load up Ableton Live with your backing tracks and cue the metronome to your monitor channel. You should always use balanced XLRs when possible rather than 1/4" unbalanced
Nice video and explanation. I was curious about why bother using a DI box but I'm a solo performer and appreciate for bands and more than one or two there could be some loss of fidelity. Now to look for a solution for wireless in-ear phones that don't use bluetooth! Bluetooth has an annoying latency
Hello mate, one question! Can I use just one Mixer for all of that, of course with DI Box. Im looking to start gigging with backing tracks. And have one mixer. So how to connect all of that only for Mic Guitar and backing track, with some kind of in ear system? Thank you
Plug everything into your mixer, and run your in-ear system out through an AUX. Send your click track to only the AUX so you hear it in your ears but not out of FOH
What I still do not understand is how the signal from the mixer reaches all musicians? Is there an output for each musician on the mixer? I use a Presonus mixer that I operate with a MacBook. There I have the control of all mixes from each musician.
Use the AUX sends. Note, some smaller and cheaper mixers do not have an aux send. If your mixer has an aux send then each channel will have a knob that says AUX. The mixer will also have an AUX output commonly a jack output and sometimes an XLR output on higher end mixers. Use the AUX output to send to your other musicians through a cable to your IEMs, headphone preamps/splitter or stage monitors. Hope that helps
Excellent video, thanks! Is it normal for there to be some crosstalk when the backing track is panned hard to the left and the click is panned hard to the right? I can hear a low volume of the backing track on the channel of the click.
No usually. This depends on the quality of the hardware you are using. For example in my Mackie DL16s i have true stereo when panned hard left and right. Whereas my Phenyx Pro PTM-10 IEM system is 93% stereo separation so I get a tiny bit of bleed from the opposite sides that are panned. If you are experiencing this issue always go back to the source to see if it is truly panned left and right. Its usually a hardware issue. Then work your way through the signal flow/chain one at a time to see where the issue lies.
No you dont need the micro mon or any mixer for this. That is, if you completely give all control to your sound engineer in which case they will control your backing track and click track for you. The micro mon or small mixer is for the musician/s if THEY want to be the ones in control of their own personal volume mix of the backing track and leave the front of house mix just for the Soundie. Hopefully that makes sense. Let me know and I can try and explain it differently with a real world scenario that I experienced both with and without a small mixer on the side =)
Hey BOAB. I don't suppose you know much about the backing track/automation feature on the Voicelice 3 Extreme? If so, any brief response as to how to get the click going for the drummer to stay in synch with the Voicelive?
Can’t say I know much on it. I don’t use it at all but if you are loading tracks to the unit then still make your tracks with click to the right and music to the left side. Then use the stereo outputs and send the click (right) to whoever needs it.
Great Video bros!! I have a question. If I want to here the the rest of the band instrumentals and play along with our backing track (from our Behringer mixer then output to wireless ear monitor). The question is, How can i connect the FOH mixer to our Behringer mixer and can hear every instrumentals and the backingtrack tho?
Hey! You would use the AUX send from the FOH mixer to your smaller Behringer mixer, most likely channel 1. On your FOH mixer use thee AUX dials to adjust the signal for each channel to be sent to the smaller mixer. Now, on your smaller mixer bring the channel 1 fader/knob up, and then plug in headphones or IEMs to the master out.. In other setups with more than 1 AUX output on the FOH mixer, you could use AUX 1 for the small mixer and give that to the drummer and then use AUX 2 output directly to your wireless IEM transmitter. Hope that helps. Let me know if you have any more questions.
I am considering doing some solo gigs, so it will only be myself doing vocals and also all of my own original songs in Studio One Pro DAW, and also use of three different Gtrs, not all at the same time----haha, with an AG, EG and a Classical Gtr depending on the song. And then thinking what Equipment I'd need, and how many inputs I'd need for everything. I'd also be my own "Soundie", with everything set up to my left on a table. Might need to contact my Super Duper Sales Rep from Sweetwater. I have an Allen & Heath ZED 60-10FX, and a Steinberg interface, 2 DI's, etc. Thanks, I thought the Video was very thorough based on what Equipment you used, and I liked the Color Coding of everything.
Hi, Our band used to play live but we are now starting to run backing tracks and click tracks with mono iem. May we know what's your advice on how can we wire it on stage? Here's what we have minus the cables: - Laptop with DAW software for backing and click tracks. - our own mixer - Xtuga IEM12000 How do we do it assuming that you don't have DI box in between the cables. We just want to know how to proceed with the gears we have referencing this video. Thank you!
You can still use the same instructional video as a guide without the DI boxes. Just plug the audio cable from your DAW/audio interface directly into your mixer. You may need to assign the left channel from your DAW to one of the mixer channels and the right channel with the click from your DAW to a separate channel on your mixer. This is so you can assign the backing track and click track to your AUX channels as well as the FOH. Make sure the click track does NOT go to the FOH but you can send the click to one of the AUX channels or multiple AUX channels so your band can hear them in the IEMs. Hope that helps =)
My Bro, please tell me. Could i just use the monitor mixer without the DI Box..? So the backtrack (left) go into the input monitor mixer number 1, the click (right) go into input monitor mixer number 2, and the band monitor from FOH mixer to the input monitor mixer number 3, and the backtrack from the aux of minitor mixer go into the input of FOH mixer..
Yes you can bypass the need for a DI box. I still like to use the DI box because of the GRND switch to remove unwanted electrical hums and interference from the laptop if its charging. I also get to use the THRU output of the DI box for sending copies of the signal (either click or backing track) to another source e.g. stage monitor or other IEM monitoring. If you dont need this then by all means skip the DI box and go straight to the mixer =)
Help please 🙏 I am panning my click to the left and backing to the right but i am still getting some click bleed in the left. How do i solve this? Thanks for the video
Check that your original audio track (i.e backing track source) is correctly mixed and has the tracks fully panned Left and Right. If its not the backing track then it could come down to cheap equipment. Some mixers or audio interfaces that are very cheap dont offer "True stereo" meaning there will be some bleed from the opposite sides. A good way to check this is start with the source (backing track), play it through some earphones and see if there's any bleed between the two sides. If not, then check your stereo cable from from your laptop that splits into the two TS jack cables (left and right). If this is a cheap cable it could be the problem. Or it could be a cheap mixer that is unable to offer true stereo. Try using a different and more expensive mixer/equipment and do a process of elimination.
Hey man, thank you for sharing this. I do have a question. If I were playing duo, could it be just 1 DI box and headphone amp with extended channel like 4?
@Band On A Budget thanks for the quick and informative reply ! This is going to be for a drummer , a guitarist , bass and vocalist , we picked up the cad audio gxliem4 so we each have a wireless pack ,
@jasonstlouis9871 Same principles apply, but since you're already using P16's it should be a simpler one. Since it's already connected via USB, then from the DAW, have the metronome send outputs to your preferred output (ours is 17-18), then from the I/O or Routing page on your M32R, have it routed to empty channels, link both to make it a stereo input, and name it appropriately (i.e. Click L, Click R). Then from the Routing page again, route the stereo channel and send to an empty ultranet send channel. Should be good to go. If you prefer using the headphone jack of your laptop, then get the output by using the same stereo splitter cable mentioned in the video and plug it in to two DI boxes that will transform both signals to a mic-level signal. Then plug both inputs to the stage box/mixer and link those two together in the M32R as stereo inputs, name them appropriately (i.e. Click 1, Click 2). Finally route the signal in your ultranet sends in whatever channel you prefer it to be in (e.g. Channel 16) and it should be good to go. Finally, you just need to tell your musicians that you have the click track on channel ## on their P16's. Hope this helps :>
with the second method, can't i just add the backing track + click to the red cable so i plug it directly into the small mixer and the black one with just the track to the house mixer or is the di fully needed? i used to play with a dude that had everything set up so i'm kinda lost
Yea you can go directly to the desk. The DI just allows you to add a a secondary output using the THRU output and it also lets you use the GRND/LIFT switch to remove buzzing or humming coming from the laptop if it’s charging.
Your breakdown is amazing,Thank you! We’re on an analogue mixer but I wanna be able to control each Individual band mix coming from the Aux send to my P2 then IEM. Is there a way to do this other than bothering FOH soundie?
Yes you could send the Aux channels to a secondary mixer or several headphone Pre amps (like the MA400 in the video) and have it placed on stage. For example: lets say you have a main FOH mixer with 3 Aux sends. You would need to connect 3 XLR/Jack cables from the main FOH Aux sends and run them to the stage. From there plug each end of the cables into your secondary mixer that also supports 3 Aux sends. You then route those new Aux sends to your band. Alternatively run the Aux sends from the FOH to 3 separate Headphone pre amps on stage and assign those to the band. Only downside is that you will be using a lot of cables and can get messy during setup and pack down. A simpler approach that requires more investment from your wallet is to use a digital wireless mixer that supports Android/iOS tables and phones such as the Mackie DL16s which I have a video on here: PART 1 ruclips.net/video/vG7KyzVZBtc/видео.html PART 2 ruclips.net/video/36oLD8vMETU/видео.html
Is click track containing only click sound. Or mix of click + backing track itself? Is it possible not to sacrifice stereo to in backing track for audience ?
For my setup I have made it for CLICK ONLY. Reason for this is so that I can blend my audio as needed as the click frequencies may overlap into other frequencies in backing track and adjusting volume would also affect the volume of the click track. There is definitely a way to use stereo for the audience but this would require using an audio interface with 3 or 4 outputs. You'd also have to playback the backing track from a DAW like Pro Tools or Logic and assign the stereo output to your front of house (usually outputs 1 and 2) and then use and AUX send for your click and additional backing tracks (usually outputs 3 for mono or 3 and 4 for stereo)
Silly question perhaps, but would first method mean that you hear the backing track in one ear and click in the other? It does sending it to mixer/DI box respectively send it to both ears
Yes that will work too. The DI are optional if you want to ground the signal using the GRND/LIFT switch and if you also want to use the THRU output to send the signal elsewhere like another musician or audio interface
I tried this setup but why do I also hear the click track (low volume but can be heared when back track is quiet) through the FOH? I have already pan click track to left 100% and backtrack 100% to the right.. I'm confused.
are both the click and backing track being sent to FOH? You should only send the backing track to the FOH and the click track to the In-ear monitors. if its still happening you may need to double check if the backing track is actually panned hard left and right AND another thing if using very cheap mixing desk it may also not be "True stereo"
@@n1cK666 See my comment above, but also start with your "Source" in this case the DAW backing track. make sure the audio is panned hard to the left or right. Next would be checking the quality of you cables to make sure there are no wires internally that may be broken or touching between the left and right. Lastly what mixer are you using? Try a different mixer, check to see if you're using a cheap one which usually doesnt have true stereo vs a better quality mixer.
Especially bad audio interfaces have left and right channels “leak” into each other at like -30 or -40 dB, which is not notable in consumer applications. You probably using a built in audio of PC laptop which is complete garbage. Get a $100 audio interface and it will solve the problems.
yes you can, you'll have to run outputs from your mixer either main FOH L/R (or with a stereo splitter), or from a mono/stereo AUX send back into an audio interface going to your laptop. Note, there could be some latency in the recording process but you can always shift the waveforms to sync up to the click/beat
@@BandOnABudgetNZ I am looking for answers and I think I'm close here. I do want to have a stereo backing track output sent to the FOH, whilst having a separate click track sent to my monitors (soon in ears haha). Next to that I need 2 inputs for my stereo v-drums, 1 input for my guitar and 1 input for the vocal mic. I see you're saying I should look for an audio interface. Could I do it with a Scarlett 8i6? How? Or what should I look for? Thanks alot, great video!
@@BandOnABudgetNZ Thank you! That's very helpful! I was wondering if this is a reliable way to do it or if it could cause a latency? Because if it it doesnt, this could really be the solution! (i want to use daw reverb plugins and eq's for vocals)
Yes it would be and everything in this video is mono. But ask yourself these questions if considering stereo... - Does the audience care? - Does stereo improve the performance or sound? - Does the bar/club mixer or your own mixer support enough channels to run stereo? - running stereo will only one side of the club/bar hear some of the backing track? Check out Nick DeLaCruz where he interviews sound engineers for MASSIVE shows like Rammstein, Fallout boy, Disturbed etc. Almost every engineer says they pan mostly up to 10 and 2 o'clock because they don't want audience on one side unable to hear the other. youtube.com/@thisisdelacruz?si=gBkmEanjx0uVfxhN But then again stereo is pretty cool and if you can do it and you feel its more your thing then go for it. You'll have to use an audio interface with 4 outputs (2x for FOH and 2x for IEMs) in order to get the stereo effect and you'll have to run your tracks through a DAW
So if you have 5 people in the band using IEMs, do they all have to share the same mix? Typically we want to hear our own instruments a little louder in our ears, and we always want our vocals louder in our own ears so we can pick our vocals out of the group. We have 5 IEM boxes we need this to go to.
This will depend on your main mixing desk and how many aux channels it supports. If your desk only has 1 Aux send then you'll have to use one transmitter and 5 receivers linked to that frequency. If the mixing desk has 3 Aux sends you can use 3 transmitters each with their own mix. So 3 body packs will have their own mix but 2 will have to be shared with the others. For example my Mackie DL16s has 6 Aux Sends. I can have 6 individual IEM mixes in mono. Hope that helps
presonus studiolive series 3 16 mono 8 stereo linked as options the x32 rack mixer is another common iem rig piece would also give ability to do stereo mix i would love to see more into that method since i use it but ive never once played with a click track live. so would be funt o have that setup ready to roll if needed for future reference @@BandOnABudgetNZ
Yep you can do that but if you run into humming and buzzing from grounding issues that’s where the DI comes in. Or maybe you need a secondary output using the THRU output to a stream or record or individual monitoring from the musician. Bring a spare DI to gigs but you don’t always need to use them.
Isnt the EW 300 for wireless mics? I dont think they work for IEMS as the body pack/mic is the transmitter and the box is the receiver. If you happen to have a EW IEM G4, which is an In-Ear monitor system, you can do this a couple ways: 1.) if your main mixer has multiple AUX sends, use one of the spare ones and create a separate mix just for you instead of using the drummer monitor channel. or... 2.) Use the mic output from the Behringer MA400 and share the same signal / mix as our drummer and connect to your IEM transmitter. Hope that helps
Just feedback with my setup, may or may not be useful information: Right now I'm using a small mixer at arms reach as a splitter which takes in kick from my own mic, and any other signals that only get monitored + backing track. Backing is sent to house on a separate output on the mixer, while everything else just goes to "main," which is just headphones in my case. Best scenario for me, would be if my guitarists all had emulated outputs that I can just plug into my mixer, that way house doesn't need to be involved, otherwise it could be worth looking into micing your own cabs, split the signals for house, and also create your own monitor mixes, or record separate tracks if needed. In that case, it probably just depends on how much gear everyone feels like dealing with during setup.
So in this example, where are the band members if there are any, plugging their instruments in. I am guessing one of the remaining channels of the larger mixer. Is this correct?
i think, he used the method of Left right Stereo.. for example Left - Backing Track Right - Backing Track w/ click track Left - go to mixer Right is go to In Ear monitor, so you can hear both click track and backing track.m
@@BandOnABudgetNZ I hate any sound called "mono". I must change my audio interface. Maybe it is possible to get more output from my Babyface if I use digital connections (ADAT-SPDIF).
Surely the backing track should be in stereo? We use a mono click and a stereo backing track. No need for DI boxes? 🤔 I send both signals to my drummer he has a small mixer to adjust volumes. This is much simpler than this imho
DI not needed, unless you want to have the option to route a copy signal using the THRU output AND to use the GROUND switch to clean up the signal. Mono use for less cables and small clubs. Crowd will never know the difference let alone care if its mono or stereo. I have nothing against Stereo but for beginners and clubs with few channels on the desk, a mono option is a nice compromise.
Good question. It's more for "what if..." for example let's say you don't have enough small mixers or pre amps but want to send the click signal elsewhere on stage. Having the click sent to the main FOH mixer doesnt mean you have to use it but it could be re-routed elsewhere. One example could be if you were recording live performance into a multichannel interface. You then have a click track to help sync up any post mixing and production in your DAW. In short, you don't need to if you have enough equipment on stage for everyone to hear the click. The FOH mixer is just an additional source of audio if needed.
This stuff makes no sense... why DI box and why all those cables for 2 channels?? you just need an audio interface... if you want to do things cool you can buy a 4 output audio interface so you can also use stereo backing tracks and send the click only in the headphones without using all that cables and bad mixers...
@@calvary8075 there are a lot of audio interface with 4 outputs under 200€/$. The quality Is much better, the audio Is balanced, you can play stereo and you can also use the inputs as a monitor
@@AlessandroLesignoli I use a Behringer UMC404HD with a Behringer Xenyx X1222 USB mixer, that! is budget friendly, not what was described above. I've been doing the "backing track" thing since the late 80's, programming my own tracks and patterns using MIDI and adding live musicians as they became available.
@@BandOnABudgetNZ Agreed with you. If you play on a stage, audio interface are the last thing you would use to run the backing track. I use Behringer UMC202. It really sucks. Better to use a simple splitter cable and a DI
It won't sound horrible by default, it depends on the track. Hundreds of bands that don't have money for a multi-output interface just render the backing tracks out as mono so that they can pan it to the opposite side of the click. If these bands had multiple outputs (as the expensive acts do) then they could use stereo tracks, but if they don't then it's best to run them mono *if* you're wanting to use a click as well. If not you don't plan on using a click, then stereo is fine. But if you do, you need to make sure that the click and backing tracks *aren't* both stereo otherwise everyone in the audience will hear the click. In a live setting, with a live band (drums, keys, guitar, bass, vocal etc) the audience won't even generally notice whether the track is mono or not. If the track has a proper mono mix, it can sound fantastic
Running stereo in a live setting is grossly overrated (in my opinion). I want my audience to hear the same thing no matter where they are in relation to the FOH speakers. I understand stereo can be cool, ping-pong delays, etc…, but that is mostly lost on the listener.
It will only sound "horrible" (depends on what one means by horrible), if the mix is bad. One check I make before mixing down, is to listen to it in Mono. It will reveal relative levels between the instruments and vocals and let you know if they are balanced, or if something is really weak (which could be too low a level or phasing issues). In fact, I was mixing a bit on a song last night and when I flipped to mono, the left/right panned heavy guitars disappeared. Whoops, adjusted the submix for the heavy guitars up until they reappeared then flipped back to stereo: "ah yes, this IS a guitar based song..." If the mix is good, relative levels are set, etc, it should sound good in mono. You may not get all the neat left to right delay ping pongs going on but most people listening to an act *live* are not going to be like "You know, these guys suck because the music isn't in stereo."
@@michaelwill7811 Honestly, I was speaking more from the bands perspective. We don't split the click into one side, instead the click is on a separate channel as are the cues. We use a four-output audio-interface. Everyone gets a stereo mix in their ears + click + cue. Each person can then mix however they wish. More click, less click, no click, but the music sounds so much fuller in stereo, especially the big, orchestral backgrounds, harmonies, etc. FOH gets the two channel stereo feed. I suppose these can be combined to a mono channel if needed/wanted.
It may not sound horrible, but it can definitely be missing some elements, mainly anything that is panned to the opposite side. If you're going to go this route, you'd be better off summing and bouncing your original track to a mono file.
This connection does not make sense at all.Why all those DI boxes and all those cables?Using too much unnecessary items for only 2 channels?Make things easy by using an Audio Interface.4 Audio output Interface will do.
If you gonna buy and bring so many DI boxes and a mixer… just get a proper tool. Get a 4-channel audio interface, and that’s it. Same cost as couple of DI boxes, less crap to carry around and set up Or if you insist on using built-in audio, get a Rolls PM351, just a single box that will do all of it - split, headphone amp, DI, external monitor feed input..
That would be totally fine too... but what happens when your laptop or PM351 dies, breaks, crashes, or loses power/broken power supply? You need a backup. Load your tracks on a portable device and plug into your DI box. Or... dont use DI box at all just go straight into the FOH mixer. The DI box has a ground lift switch to clean up the audio from electrical grounding interference.
I know a drummer who does this and have seen some drummers on You tube say they have done this before because its easier to differentiate the sound when everything is playing. Me personally I wouldn't pan hard left or right, that's not my preference, but maybe a slight left or right to make it easier to pick out or distinguish if I'm having a hard time hearing the click
I would. I run click/spd backing tracks in one ear, and my vocals/lead vox/ guitar/band in the other. This helps me stay in time but also make sure our three part harmonies are on point. I can control mixes at the drums, while the sound man controls mix to the audience…
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You can also plug a cable in one of the outputs of the mixer to a laptop or IPad to record the performance. This will help you improve your next performance.
In the first example can you plug the click track cable from the laptop directly in to the behringer micro mon?
Yes you can. Sorry for late reply lol
Great video and tutorial!!thanks for sharing im in NZ at the moment..love your country mate!!
Thank u for this video! I just bought all the gear to test the second method for my band!
I'll see on Saturday if I can make it work 💪💪💪
How did it go with the band? Did you manage to get it all working?
@BandOnABudgetNZ it works good!
This was cool! Good job explaining. It reminded me of the show “How It’s Made.”
Hey thanks so much for putting this together. It dispelled some of the major misconceptions that I had about the back tracking. Before, I was deadset on doing stereo to give audience "the best live experience". After watching your video, I was like "that was STUPID" and I went on a google spree. Turns out that you are absolutely right. I found out that a lot of sound engineers at venues actually found stereo backing tracks to be problematic, not only from a technical stand point but also from an audience stand point. Super invaluable 👍🏻
So thankful for your video ... incredible content and presentation!!
I used all my life just a split cable, laptop and an adapter for the drum, an extension for the front of house.
And i got the invisible keyboard player in MY DECEPTION. Done. I was considering laptop -> mixer -> drummer and front of house .
That was such a EASY and CLEAR video, maaan you're awesome
Thank you for your feedback, I really appreciate that 😁
Hey awesome video.
Thanks for posting it is a great way to learn about backing tracks. Very helpful video
Hi, just watched this and you’ve made it so well - thank you for considering the detail and need for simplicity - I noticed that you answer the question only 10 days ago so I to I’m gonna pose you a question which I think you have already answered to be fair but I just want to clarify - and we are a three piece of guitar drums and bass and I have created a load of keyboards and backing vocals backing tracks for us to play over - at the moment I am going to use a MacBook and logic to do this - I understand I need to create the two tracks, one with the music and one with the click and cues - I have bought and not yet used a wireless IEM system with three packs - if I follow this method and buy two DIY boxes and one small mixer, where do I plug the transmitter for the IEM system into? Is it in an aux?
To clarify, what is the easiest way for all of us to use the wireless IEM packs so we can hear the music and the click?
Sorry if you have already made this clear but I’m looking for ultimate ease and clarification and so I know exactly what I need to buy to make this all work, thanks very much
Ok So there's a way you can do this without having to use an extra small mixer.
Take the stereo output from Logic and get both left and right channel to your main FOH mixer. Make sure to give them individual channels.
Then get your IEM transmitter and connect it to AUX 1 output. You can now dial in using the Aux1 volume knob the selected channels you want, in this case you'll want to add some click and backing track to the Aux1 audio feed.
You should receive the signal to your body packs. You may need to play around with volume levels because you'll have volume level control from multiple sources such as your Macbook, the FOH Mixer, the transmitter signal and the body packs. It can be a pain but finding the sweet spot for all takes a bit of practice. Rule of Thumb, Always start with the source.
Hope that helps. Lett me know if you have any more questions. There of course multiple variations of this kind of setup.
@@BandOnABudgetNZ thank you for getting back to me - almost went down that road of mixer but after speaking to a couple of music shops, we have bought an Audient interface with 4 ins and 4 outs - we can now send 2 stereo lines to the FOH and a third (click track) and hopefully (haven’t tried it yet) plug the IEM transmitter in there - hopefully should work
@@BandOnABudgetNZ thank you for getting back to me - almost went down that road of mixer but after speaking to a couple of music shops, we have bought an Audient interface with 4 ins and 4 outs - we can now send 2 stereo lines to the FOH and a third (click track) and hopefully (haven’t tried it yet) plug the IEM transmitter in there - hopefully should work
Great video and explanations! Thanks a lot for sharing 🙏
what if I want my backing track to be stereo on the house speaker output?
I'm trying to figure that out too
You'll need to playback the audio using a DAW and use an audio interface with at least 4 outputs. Main output 1 and 2 for the FOH and output 3 and 4 for the monitor mixes
@@chronicironic1358 You'll need to playback the audio using a DAW and use an audio interface with at least 4 outputs. Main output 1 and 2 for the FOH and output 3 and 4 for the monitor mixes
Awesome video, answered many questions including some I didn't know I had 🙂...thanks for this.
You're welcome😁
Awesome! Thank you! Can you do this without DI boxes? And are the DI passive?
The DI's are passive and you could also plug directly to the mixer if its close enough
Very well done!
Awesome information. Thank you. One question. On the second option with the small mixer, why send click to main mixer? I understand sending backing there but I don't understand why you send click there when the band can get click from the mini mixer. Thanks in advance.
Just incase other people in the band want to hear the click or if recording and need to sync post production. the click will help line up the waveforms
What would you send click from DI box to house mixer? The band could hear the click from the drummer's mixer (after splitting phones output for each band member, no?) I dont get it, pls explain 🤔
Yes i think it is a better solution, this way you can control the IEM or headphones outputs on your own without the help of the sound guy.
In general i think there can be many other ways to do it...
Hi. Just set this up and all working. Can you tell me as an electronic drummer I'm currently sending the kit straight to mixer that only leaves control of FH volume with the brain that i can reach.
It might be obvious but could you clarify how i get more control on the kit going to FH using the above set.
Thanks
On my drum pad, I usually set the on board drum pad volume about 1 o'clock on the dial.
I use jack to jack from the drum pad to a DI box, then XLR out of the DI box straight to the FOH mixer.
From here you may need a bit of help. You'll have to play the drums at your usual velocity and style and have someone else adjust the gain on the FOH mixer so there's a strong signal but not peaking, and maybe add a compressor for those loud moments.
Then you can move the fader up to how loud you need it and also on the master fader for your FOH.
Thanks.
I'm not using a di box between kit and mixer, do think i should
@@MrLines22 Its not necessary but one of the benefits of using a DI is having a Grounding switch to cancel out hums as well as a Thru output to send another copy of the signal to a personal monitoring system, pre amp etc.
I always carry one with me just in case as well as an XLR to extend the length needed to the FOH, or snake box
Thank you
Really helpful gone from accustic to electric and backing tracks with a keyboard /singer... One thing having a bit of an issue with is levals of backing tracks and without an engineer on gigs I thinks gonna bit a issue, songs coming from different sources isnt helping.
Any Advice welcome.
Once again
Thanks for your time.
@@MrLines22 setting levels would be best done starting with your DAW. For example in logic you need a reference track and then adjust levels, EQ and compression of you backing track. You want to make sure the overall volume of your track is as loud as you need. You should also play around with the LUFS integrated levels. This is basically your overall "loudness" of the track. Find a suitable LUFS level and then try to mix all your other backing tracks to the same output level and LUFS level. This is so all your backing tracks are at a relatively consistent playback level in terms of Volume and output signal.
Once that's done you'll have to play a bit of a guessing game at a live performance to get your guitar and vocals balanced in the mix. Ideally ask a bar tender, or friend to help adjust these levels in the first 2-3 songs. Hope that helps =)
great video! just a question abt the second setup: wouldn't the aux send from the FOH to our little mixer also have the backing track along with the live musicians in it? wondering if it is necessary, can't the soundie control its volume once the aux send is given to us?
Yes the soundie can control it but lets say you need a bit more, its hard to get soundie's attention immediately when its as simple as just turning a dial yourself. The 2nd setup would work best for a stationary musician like keyboard and drums.
You don't have to use the little mixer but it does give you the option to EQ the click or backing track. e.g when I play drums I tweak the click so that i hear a certain frequency of the click better while drumming. Same goes for backing track if I want bass boosted for my mix without affecting everyone else's EQ.
In short, you don't need the 2nd little mixer. Its personal preference. And if you have multiple AUX sends then some will receive the click and backing track and other monitor feed direct from FOH while others using a small mixer will have a different send with more control over their mixes.
My advice, try out both methods to see which you prefer. Hope that helps
Question: Do you need to use another DI box to send the click track to FOH? Or could you use a 1/4in and just send it straight to your personal mixer?
You can make do without the extra DI. I always use it to keep things clean by using the ground/lift switch
Hi Thanks for the video, Im new to live performance.
So if I wanted to have a separate aux output (with a click track etc) sent to in-ear monitors and then the master output sent to the FOH, id have to use a computer with a DAW for this to work for stereo? Is there any disadvantages of having the output in Mono over stereo?
Yes you'd need a DAW and an audio interface with at least 4 outputs for a stereo setup.
Some people prefer stereo because they like to hear click in one ear and the track in the other while others prefer stereo to create a sense of balance and separation. Downside is more cables, more gear, and using up 2 AUX channels for a stereo mix.
With Mono it means you dont need a laptop or DAW, just an mp3 player with a stereo send which will have one for the track and the other for click/cues. Plus you only need to use one AUX channel.
Another thing to note is if you've used a foldback monitor or wedges on stage, those are always giving you a mono signal. I'd recommend trying out both to see which you prefer as each person will have a difference preference.
For me personally, Im happy with mono. However stereo is a "nice to have" if you have the gear to support that. I would only use Stereo if i have a production and sound crew working for me. If I'm doing most of the sound stuff then I stick with mono.
yo quick question, I have a pro-48 DI box on me, was just wondering how I'd get phantom power to it in method 1 since the MA400 doesn't generate any, the only connection to FOH is from the monitor input and afaik you can't really give phantom power from a 6.35 inch jack
You'll have to get a passive DI because I think from memory the Radial pro48 doesnt even have a 9v battery compartment like some other DI boxes
@BandOnABudgetNZ cheers 👌🏻👌🏻 and yeah ur right! No battery slot
I'm a newbie, this was a very good explanation! One question how does the band get piped through this? Are all instruments plugged into the large mixer?
Yes all band instruments go into the main Mixer
Hey fella - I've got an 802 and found this really useful. Do I really need the DI box(es) in that if the stereo output from the iPad was track-left, click-right, then once plugged into the 802 in two different channels, (click 3 & track 5) then I could take the track channel 5 to FOH from the Main out Left; it then becomes a mono track input onto the front desk, whatever channel
Or are the DIs needed to boost/compress/enhance the signal coming from the iPad?
Love your work and many thanks!
Thank you, this is exactly what I have been looking for.
We have P16s set up for personal monitoring, so in this scenario what is that Behringer micro thing for?
I use it for personal monitoring if I want to control the volume of my backing track myself rather than getting the soundie to do it.
If Im on drums I usually use the micromon to monitor my own volume settings while the soundie focuses on controlling the volume of other musician's monitoring
Great info here!
cheers mate, great video... currently i'm using a more simpler (and less budget) route, using an iphone as my click & backing tracks (and to show lyrics). If I use a TRS to XLR split cable, there's no need for a DI right? I can just plug it in to the MA400, and I use a wireless IEM to share the cilcks.
What about using two MA400 ? one for click and other for backing track so you can control each gain before going to your IEM and FOH? should be almost the same price as 1 xenyx mixer, but more compact.
thank you
@@BandOnABudgetNZ oooh SHOOT!.. many thanks for the heads up about the phantom power.. will make sure about that, good thing our first run on rehearsal nothing wrong happen because I told the mixer operator that the line is for backing tracks.
So will the DI box will secure the line for possible phantom power (just in case it was turned on) so nothing goes wrong to the source device.? If so, then I might change the TRS to TS splitter and add a DI
currently all the clicks , backing and lyrics are from me (attached to the mic stand) using an app Stage Traxx 3 .. an awesome app. not operated from the drummer yet. since we are old school band mates but they are happy with the clicks throught the wireless IEM. thanks again
This is so clear, thank you so much for this breakdown! Just a quick question: Why, for option 2, do we also need to send the clicktrack to front of house if all they're going to do is turn it all the way down? I've seen multiple videos now describing this setup and they all seem to say to do this, but I'm confused why it's necessary. Wouldn't I just need to send it right to my mixer? Thanks!
Hey good question! You may not need to do this for every setup however lets say you're using a FOH mixer with multiple AUX sends and you also want to have separate monitor mixes for each musician. My video diagram would work best for a drummer so 2nd option will have the drummer sorted, but what about everyone else?
If the click is send to the FOH mixer, yes you would keep the fader down for the click so that its not going thru the main speakers but you could dial it in to AUX 2, 3, 4 etc and have that signal sent to an In-Ear Monitor system and have that sent to the other musicians along with their own band and backing track mix.
Hope that clears it up, thanks for the comment
Hello, Would you be able to help me set up my backing tracks on my Mac Book Pro computer and Ableton with my mixer. I used to play live years ago in a band as rhythm guitarist and lead singer. But, lately, I have found I play solo. I am very busy but I need to modernize my equipment to do live gigs. Would be able to help me. I am a one man band but I used backing tracks. Please let me know.
Hey there. Yes happy to help you but I need some more info. Feel free to send me more details and pics of your setup to help me understand. My email is under the channel details =)
Is there a way to do this without the di boxes? What if the foh mixer is a stage box with Wi-Fi that is controlled wirelessly with an iPad? Is this even possible or usable?
Thanks
Really well explained, thank you. You have shown me the way :)
thank you for this man !!
You're welcome 😁
Hi! I am really really new at this kind of stuff and don't really get what I'm supposed to do, I play with a couple of guys and we want to cover a song that uses some sort of Synth or Keyboard in some parts, we've tried finding an actual keyboardist but failed and we really want to rehearse this song. Can you help me? I've found a backing track online, the thing is we just need the synth/keyboard parts since we already play everything else, the rehearsal room in which we play has some sort of cable that I can plug into my phone and then plug it in to the Console but I'm pretty much lost. Sorry for my bad English :p
The simpler way to do this is replace all the DI boxes, mixer and minimon with a Behringer XR18 mixer, connect your laptop via USB, load up Ableton Live with your backing tracks and cue the metronome to your monitor channel. You should always use balanced XLRs when possible rather than 1/4" unbalanced
Nice video and explanation. I was curious about why bother using a DI box but I'm a solo performer and appreciate for bands and more than one or two there could be some loss of fidelity.
Now to look for a solution for wireless in-ear phones that don't use bluetooth! Bluetooth has an annoying latency
Hello mate, one question! Can I use just one Mixer for all of that, of course with DI Box. Im looking to start gigging with backing tracks. And have one mixer. So how to connect all of that only for Mic Guitar and backing track, with some kind of in ear system? Thank you
Plug everything into your mixer, and run your in-ear system out through an AUX. Send your click track to only the AUX so you hear it in your ears but not out of FOH
What I still do not understand is how the signal from the mixer reaches all musicians? Is there an output for each musician on the mixer? I use a Presonus mixer that I operate with a MacBook. There I have the control of all mixes from each musician.
Use the AUX sends. Note, some smaller and cheaper mixers do not have an aux send. If your mixer has an aux send then each channel will have a knob that says AUX. The mixer will also have an AUX output commonly a jack output and sometimes an XLR output on higher end mixers. Use the AUX output to send to your other musicians through a cable to your IEMs, headphone preamps/splitter or stage monitors. Hope that helps
@@BandOnABudgetNZ still confused. do you have an email where we can request consulting?
@@Laura_auer just replied to you in email 😁
Excellent video, thanks! Is it normal for there to be some crosstalk when the backing track is panned hard to the left and the click is panned hard to the right? I can hear a low volume of the backing track on the channel of the click.
No usually. This depends on the quality of the hardware you are using. For example in my Mackie DL16s i have true stereo when panned hard left and right.
Whereas my Phenyx Pro PTM-10 IEM system is 93% stereo separation so I get a tiny bit of bleed from the opposite sides that are panned.
If you are experiencing this issue always go back to the source to see if it is truly panned left and right. Its usually a hardware issue. Then work your way through the signal flow/chain one at a time to see where the issue lies.
Couldn't you also use a dual channel DI box instead of using two separate DI boxes?
Yes you can. I only used 2 separate DI boxes in the video to illustrate 2 audio signals more clearly.
Quick question. What if everyone has an IEM (2 channel) and not just the drummer? Where does that get plugged into? The Xtuga RW2080 specifically
@@BandOnABudgetNZ aweosme. This answered every question I had. Thank you!
Thanks for the video!
You're welcome =)
Hi do you need one of those Micro mons to play backing tracks on a mixer via a comp? I thought you could just connect directly?
No you dont need the micro mon or any mixer for this. That is, if you completely give all control to your sound engineer in which case they will control your backing track and click track for you.
The micro mon or small mixer is for the musician/s if THEY want to be the ones in control of their own personal volume mix of the backing track and leave the front of house mix just for the Soundie.
Hopefully that makes sense. Let me know and I can try and explain it differently with a real world scenario that I experienced both with and without a small mixer on the side =)
Yeh we would just be using the mixer ourselves on stage and choosing the tracks live to play ongoing@@BandOnABudgetNZ
Hey BOAB. I don't suppose you know much about the backing track/automation feature on the Voicelice 3 Extreme? If so, any brief response as to how to get the click going for the drummer to stay in synch with the Voicelive?
Can’t say I know much on it. I don’t use it at all but if you are loading tracks to the unit then still make your tracks with click to the right and music to the left side.
Then use the stereo outputs and send the click (right) to whoever needs it.
@BandOnABudgetNZ Roger that. Thanks man.
Does the 2nd example work well with Xenyx 502?
Why use the DI boxes and not plug directly to the consoles ??
In case you get some ground/earth issues creating a hum, you can use the ground/lift switch to clean it up
Great Video bros!! I have a question. If I want to here the the rest of the band instrumentals and play along with our backing track (from our Behringer mixer then output to wireless ear monitor).
The question is, How can i connect the FOH mixer to our Behringer mixer and can hear every instrumentals and the backingtrack tho?
Hey! You would use the AUX send from the FOH mixer to your smaller Behringer mixer, most likely channel 1. On your FOH mixer use thee AUX dials to adjust the signal for each channel to be sent to the smaller mixer. Now, on your smaller mixer bring the channel 1 fader/knob up, and then plug in headphones or IEMs to the master out..
In other setups with more than 1 AUX output on the FOH mixer, you could use AUX 1 for the small mixer and give that to the drummer and then use AUX 2 output directly to your wireless IEM transmitter. Hope that helps. Let me know if you have any more questions.
Why use DI box if the mixer has preamps ..?
I am considering doing some solo gigs, so it will only be myself doing vocals and also all of my own original songs in Studio One Pro DAW, and also use of three different Gtrs, not all at the same time----haha, with an AG, EG and a Classical Gtr depending on the song. And then thinking what Equipment I'd need, and how many inputs I'd need for everything. I'd also be my own "Soundie", with everything set up to my left on a table. Might need to contact my Super Duper Sales Rep from Sweetwater. I have an Allen & Heath ZED 60-10FX, and a Steinberg interface, 2 DI's, etc. Thanks, I thought the Video was very thorough based on what Equipment you used, and I liked the Color Coding of everything.
Hi, Our band used to play live but we are now starting to run backing tracks and click tracks with mono iem. May we know what's your advice on how can we wire it on stage? Here's what we have minus the cables:
- Laptop with DAW software for backing and click tracks.
- our own mixer
- Xtuga IEM12000
How do we do it assuming that you don't have DI box in between the cables. We just want to know how to proceed with the gears we have referencing this video.
Thank you!
You can still use the same instructional video as a guide without the DI boxes. Just plug the audio cable from your DAW/audio interface directly into your mixer.
You may need to assign the left channel from your DAW to one of the mixer channels and the right channel with the click from your DAW to a separate channel on your mixer.
This is so you can assign the backing track and click track to your AUX channels as well as the FOH. Make sure the click track does NOT go to the FOH but you can send the click to one of the AUX channels or multiple AUX channels so your band can hear them in the IEMs.
Hope that helps =)
@@BandOnABudgetNZ This is a lot. Thank you so much for the help!
My Bro, please tell me. Could i just use the monitor mixer without the DI Box..? So the backtrack (left) go into the input monitor mixer number 1, the click (right) go into input monitor mixer number 2, and the band monitor from FOH mixer to the input monitor mixer number 3, and the backtrack from the aux of minitor mixer go into the input of FOH mixer..
My mixer has aux volume knob, so the click and the entire band will be mute on the aux knob.
Yes you can bypass the need for a DI box. I still like to use the DI box because of the GRND switch to remove unwanted electrical hums and interference from the laptop if its charging.
I also get to use the THRU output of the DI box for sending copies of the signal (either click or backing track) to another source e.g. stage monitor or other IEM monitoring.
If you dont need this then by all means skip the DI box and go straight to the mixer =)
Help please 🙏 I am panning my click to the left and backing to the right but i am still getting some click bleed in the left. How do i solve this? Thanks for the video
Check that your original audio track (i.e backing track source) is correctly mixed and has the tracks fully panned Left and Right. If its not the backing track then it could come down to cheap equipment. Some mixers or audio interfaces that are very cheap dont offer "True stereo" meaning there will be some bleed from the opposite sides.
A good way to check this is start with the source (backing track), play it through some earphones and see if there's any bleed between the two sides. If not, then check your stereo cable from from your laptop that splits into the two TS jack cables (left and right). If this is a cheap cable it could be the problem.
Or it could be a cheap mixer that is unable to offer true stereo. Try using a different and more expensive mixer/equipment and do a process of elimination.
Very helpful Thanks!!
Hey man, thank you for sharing this. I do have a question. If I were playing duo, could it be just 1 DI box and headphone amp with extended channel like 4?
Hey brother, so do I run my transmitter for my wireless in ears to the same spot as the headphones
@Band On A Budget thanks for the quick and informative reply ! This is going to be for a drummer , a guitarist , bass and vocalist , we picked up the cad audio gxliem4 so we each have a wireless pack ,
I have an M32R digital mixer with P16 monitor mixers. How can I set this up using the Ultranet workflow? I also have a DAW connected via USB.
@jasonstlouis9871 Same principles apply, but since you're already using P16's it should be a simpler one. Since it's already connected via USB, then from the DAW, have the metronome send outputs to your preferred output (ours is 17-18), then from the I/O or Routing page on your M32R, have it routed to empty channels, link both to make it a stereo input, and name it appropriately (i.e. Click L, Click R). Then from the Routing page again, route the stereo channel and send to an empty ultranet send channel. Should be good to go.
If you prefer using the headphone jack of your laptop, then get the output by using the same stereo splitter cable mentioned in the video and plug it in to two DI boxes that will transform both signals to a mic-level signal. Then plug both inputs to the stage box/mixer and link those two together in the M32R as stereo inputs, name them appropriately (i.e. Click 1, Click 2). Finally route the signal in your ultranet sends in whatever channel you prefer it to be in (e.g. Channel 16) and it should be good to go.
Finally, you just need to tell your musicians that you have the click track on channel ## on their P16's. Hope this helps :>
with the second method, can't i just add the backing track + click to the red cable so i plug it directly into the small mixer and the black one with just the track to the house mixer or is the di fully needed? i used to play with a dude that had everything set up so i'm kinda lost
Yea you can go directly to the desk. The DI just allows you to add a a secondary output using the THRU output and it also lets you use the GRND/LIFT switch to remove buzzing or humming coming from the laptop if it’s charging.
Your breakdown is amazing,Thank you!
We’re on an analogue mixer but I wanna be able to control each Individual band mix coming from the Aux send to my P2 then IEM. Is there a way to do this other than bothering FOH soundie?
Yes you could send the Aux channels to a secondary mixer or several headphone Pre amps (like the MA400 in the video) and have it placed on stage. For example:
lets say you have a main FOH mixer with 3 Aux sends. You would need to connect 3 XLR/Jack cables from the main FOH Aux sends and run them to the stage. From there plug each end of the cables into your secondary mixer that also supports 3 Aux sends. You then route those new Aux sends to your band.
Alternatively run the Aux sends from the FOH to 3 separate Headphone pre amps on stage and assign those to the band. Only downside is that you will be using a lot of cables and can get messy during setup and pack down.
A simpler approach that requires more investment from your wallet is to use a digital wireless mixer that supports Android/iOS tables and phones such as the Mackie DL16s which I have a video on here:
PART 1
ruclips.net/video/vG7KyzVZBtc/видео.html
PART 2
ruclips.net/video/36oLD8vMETU/видео.html
Is click track containing only click sound. Or mix of click + backing track itself? Is it possible not to sacrifice stereo to in backing track for audience ?
For my setup I have made it for CLICK ONLY. Reason for this is so that I can blend my audio as needed as the click frequencies may overlap into other frequencies in backing track and adjusting volume would also affect the volume of the click track.
There is definitely a way to use stereo for the audience but this would require using an audio interface with 3 or 4 outputs. You'd also have to playback the backing track from a DAW like Pro Tools or Logic and assign the stereo output to your front of house (usually outputs 1 and 2) and then use and AUX send for your click and additional backing tracks (usually outputs 3 for mono or 3 and 4 for stereo)
Silly question perhaps, but would first method mean that you hear the backing track in one ear and click in the other? It does sending it to mixer/DI box respectively send it to both ears
only if you set the MA on stereo
Only if the stereo switch is toggled on the MA400.
if your signal path and channels are mono, it will come through both Left and Right
Is it works if I use (in the 2nd example) one multi-line DI box, and not two separated?
Yes that will work too. The DI are optional if you want to ground the signal using the GRND/LIFT switch and if you also want to use the THRU output to send the signal elsewhere like another musician or audio interface
I tried this setup but why do I also hear the click track (low volume but can be heared when back track is quiet) through the FOH? I have already pan click track to left 100% and backtrack 100% to the right.. I'm confused.
are both the click and backing track being sent to FOH? You should only send the backing track to the FOH and the click track to the In-ear monitors.
if its still happening you may need to double check if the backing track is actually panned hard left and right AND another thing if using very cheap mixing desk it may also not be "True stereo"
This is happening to me also, do u fix it?
@@n1cK666 See my comment above, but also start with your "Source" in this case the DAW backing track. make sure the audio is panned hard to the left or right. Next would be checking the quality of you cables to make sure there are no wires internally that may be broken or touching between the left and right.
Lastly what mixer are you using? Try a different mixer, check to see if you're using a cheap one which usually doesnt have true stereo vs a better quality mixer.
Especially bad audio interfaces have left and right channels “leak” into each other at like -30 or -40 dB, which is not notable in consumer applications.
You probably using a built in audio of PC laptop which is complete garbage.
Get a $100 audio interface and it will solve the problems.
Can I use the same laptop to record audio while using it for backing tracks?
yes you can, you'll have to run outputs from your mixer either main FOH L/R (or with a stereo splitter), or from a mono/stereo AUX send back into an audio interface going to your laptop.
Note, there could be some latency in the recording process but you can always shift the waveforms to sync up to the click/beat
The backing track out sound stereo or mono?
@@BandOnABudgetNZ I am looking for answers and I think I'm close here. I do want to have a stereo backing track output sent to the FOH, whilst having a separate click track sent to my monitors (soon in ears haha). Next to that I need 2 inputs for my stereo v-drums, 1 input for my guitar and 1 input for the vocal mic. I see you're saying I should look for an audio interface. Could I do it with a Scarlett 8i6? How? Or what should I look for? Thanks alot, great video!
@@BandOnABudgetNZ Thank you! That's very helpful! I was wondering if this is a reliable way to do it or if it could cause a latency? Because if it it doesnt, this could really be the solution! (i want to use daw reverb plugins and eq's for vocals)
In the first exemple, Isnt the backing track in the front house gonna be mono?
Yes it would be and everything in this video is mono. But ask yourself these questions if considering stereo...
- Does the audience care?
- Does stereo improve the performance or sound?
- Does the bar/club mixer or your own mixer support enough channels to run stereo?
- running stereo will only one side of the club/bar hear some of the backing track?
Check out Nick DeLaCruz where he interviews sound engineers for MASSIVE shows like Rammstein, Fallout boy, Disturbed etc. Almost every engineer says they pan mostly up to 10 and 2 o'clock because they don't want audience on one side unable to hear the other.
youtube.com/@thisisdelacruz?si=gBkmEanjx0uVfxhN
But then again stereo is pretty cool and if you can do it and you feel its more your thing then go for it. You'll have to use an audio interface with 4 outputs (2x for FOH and 2x for IEMs) in order to get the stereo effect and you'll have to run your tracks through a DAW
So if you have 5 people in the band using IEMs, do they all have to share the same mix? Typically we want to hear our own instruments a little louder in our ears, and we always want our vocals louder in our own ears so we can pick our vocals out of the group. We have 5 IEM boxes we need this to go to.
This will depend on your main mixing desk and how many aux channels it supports. If your desk only has 1 Aux send then you'll have to use one transmitter and 5 receivers linked to that frequency.
If the mixing desk has 3 Aux sends you can use 3 transmitters each with their own mix. So 3 body packs will have their own mix but 2 will have to be shared with the others.
For example my Mackie DL16s has 6 Aux Sends. I can have 6 individual IEM mixes in mono.
Hope that helps
presonus studiolive series 3 16 mono 8 stereo linked as options the x32 rack mixer is another common iem rig piece would also give ability to do stereo mix i would love to see more into that method since i use it but ive never once played with a click track live. so would be funt o have that setup ready to roll if needed for future reference @@BandOnABudgetNZ
I think can just one audio interface for the backing track and use your laptop oem output for click track. No need complicated
Yep you can do that but if you run into humming and buzzing from grounding issues that’s where the DI comes in. Or maybe you need a secondary output using the THRU output to a stream or record or individual monitoring from the musician. Bring a spare DI to gigs but you don’t always need to use them.
Thank for the information ❤
Which is actually better to use; active or passive DI boxes in this case????
Neither will matter. you can use either or
I love the diagram and wish I could find more like it!
Finally! Ignore the idiots who say this isn’t good. Thanks! But is there anything I can use instead of the DI box
you can plug direct into the mixer if its close enough or have a long enough cable
I play guitar. If my drummer is going to plug into the behringer, where would I plug in my Synheiser EW 300 wirless for my ear ins?
Isnt the EW 300 for wireless mics? I dont think they work for IEMS as the body pack/mic is the transmitter and the box is the receiver.
If you happen to have a EW IEM G4, which is an In-Ear monitor system, you can do this a couple ways:
1.) if your main mixer has multiple AUX sends, use one of the spare ones and create a separate mix just for you instead of using the drummer monitor channel. or...
2.) Use the mic output from the Behringer MA400 and share the same signal / mix as our drummer and connect to your IEM transmitter.
Hope that helps
@@BandOnABudgetNZ Thanks! Very helpful indeed
How to integrate in ear monitors with this set up?
Just feedback with my setup, may or may not be useful information:
Right now I'm using a small mixer at arms reach as a splitter which takes in kick from my own mic, and any other signals that only get monitored + backing track. Backing is sent to house on a separate output on the mixer, while everything else just goes to "main," which is just headphones in my case.
Best scenario for me, would be if my guitarists all had emulated outputs that I can just plug into my mixer, that way house doesn't need to be involved, otherwise it could be worth looking into micing your own cabs, split the signals for house, and also create your own monitor mixes, or record separate tracks if needed. In that case, it probably just depends on how much gear everyone feels like dealing with during setup.
So in this example, where are the band members if there are any, plugging their instruments in. I am guessing one of the remaining channels of the larger mixer. Is this correct?
Thank you. That is what I figured. Whatever is available, depending of course on the size of the FOH mixer. @@BandOnABudgetNZ
I thought you sent your backing track to the front of house through the DI box?
yes you can. I only use a DI box to clean up the singla using the Ground lift switch in the DI box. You can bypass this if you need to
I don't see the need to run the click track to the main front of house mixer though,
Just in case you want to send the click to the rest of the band.
i didnt get why the sound engi needs the click track on his mixer?
i think, he used the method of Left right Stereo.. for example
Left - Backing Track
Right - Backing Track w/ click track
Left - go to mixer
Right is go to In Ear monitor, so you can hear both click track and backing track.m
I want it STEREO?
Active or passive DI box? Or does it matter?
Doesnt matter if its Passive or Active. Will still work the same
Great video for us umm... frugal people.
It's ridiculous! I need my backing track to sound "stereo". Then what should I do?
@@BandOnABudgetNZ The songs actually are in my Cubase, but I have only two output from my "RME Babyface" audio interface.
@@BandOnABudgetNZ I hate any sound called "mono".
I must change my audio interface.
Maybe it is possible to get more output from my Babyface if I use digital connections (ADAT-SPDIF).
Thanks for the video! This is super helpful :)
Surely the backing track should be in stereo? We use a mono click and a stereo backing track. No need for DI boxes? 🤔 I send both signals to my drummer he has a small mixer to adjust volumes. This is much simpler than this imho
DI not needed, unless you want to have the option to route a copy signal using the THRU output AND to use the GROUND switch to clean up the signal.
Mono use for less cables and small clubs. Crowd will never know the difference let alone care if its mono or stereo. I have nothing against Stereo but for beginners and clubs with few channels on the desk, a mono option is a nice compromise.
Also forgot to ask you this, since it was not mentioned. What MIXER did you use in the lower LEFT corner?
question, in the 2nd example, why send the click track to the main mixer at all?
Good question. It's more for "what if..." for example let's say you don't have enough small mixers or pre amps but want to send the click signal elsewhere on stage. Having the click sent to the main FOH mixer doesnt mean you have to use it but it could be re-routed elsewhere.
One example could be if you were recording live performance into a multichannel interface. You then have a click track to help sync up any post mixing and production in your DAW.
In short, you don't need to if you have enough equipment on stage for everyone to hear the click. The FOH mixer is just an additional source of audio if needed.
I can imagine how good a mono mp3 will sound in a gig …sigh…
why use di why not just plug into board. whats the benefit ?
Grounding switch, or adding an additional THRU output to send a second signal elsewhere for separate monitoring, or converting Jack to XLR.
Thank you !!
You're welcome =)
Excellent vid! Thanks for this. 🎶💻👌
You're welcome
Thank you ❤
thanks
This stuff makes no sense... why DI box and why all those cables for 2 channels?? you just need an audio interface... if you want to do things cool you can buy a 4 output audio interface so you can also use stereo backing tracks and send the click only in the headphones without using all that cables and bad mixers...
I was watching this and saying the exact same thing.
@@calvary8075 there are a lot of audio interface with 4 outputs under 200€/$. The quality Is much better, the audio Is balanced, you can play stereo and you can also use the inputs as a monitor
Funny it say under budget .. but I don't do not see where this is budget friendly
@@AlessandroLesignoli I use a Behringer UMC404HD with a Behringer Xenyx X1222 USB mixer, that! is budget friendly, not what was described above. I've been doing the "backing track" thing since the late 80's, programming my own tracks and patterns using MIDI and adding live musicians as they became available.
@@BandOnABudgetNZ Agreed with you. If you play on a stage, audio interface are the last thing you would use to run the backing track. I use Behringer UMC202. It really sucks. Better to use a simple splitter cable and a DI
has anyone every seen a drummer/vocalist doing a solo gig using only backing tracks with no guitarist etc....
Yes I saw a guy on the fisherman's wharf in San Fransisco doing that
Why would you run backing tracks in mono? It will sound horrible.
It won't sound horrible by default, it depends on the track. Hundreds of bands that don't have money for a multi-output interface just render the backing tracks out as mono so that they can pan it to the opposite side of the click. If these bands had multiple outputs (as the expensive acts do) then they could use stereo tracks, but if they don't then it's best to run them mono *if* you're wanting to use a click as well. If not you don't plan on using a click, then stereo is fine. But if you do, you need to make sure that the click and backing tracks *aren't* both stereo otherwise everyone in the audience will hear the click.
In a live setting, with a live band (drums, keys, guitar, bass, vocal etc) the audience won't even generally notice whether the track is mono or not. If the track has a proper mono mix, it can sound fantastic
Running stereo in a live setting is grossly overrated (in my opinion). I want my audience to hear the same thing no matter where they are in relation to the FOH speakers. I understand stereo can be cool, ping-pong delays, etc…, but that is mostly lost on the listener.
It will only sound "horrible" (depends on what one means by horrible), if the mix is bad. One check I make before mixing down, is to listen to it in Mono. It will reveal relative levels between the instruments and vocals and let you know if they are balanced, or if something is really weak (which could be too low a level or phasing issues).
In fact, I was mixing a bit on a song last night and when I flipped to mono, the left/right panned heavy guitars disappeared. Whoops, adjusted the submix for the heavy guitars up until they reappeared then flipped back to stereo: "ah yes, this IS a guitar based song..."
If the mix is good, relative levels are set, etc, it should sound good in mono. You may not get all the neat left to right delay ping pongs going on but most people listening to an act *live* are not going to be like "You know, these guys suck because the music isn't in stereo."
@@michaelwill7811 Honestly, I was speaking more from the bands perspective. We don't split the click into one side, instead the click is on a separate channel as are the cues. We use a four-output audio-interface. Everyone gets a stereo mix in their ears + click + cue. Each person can then mix however they wish. More click, less click, no click, but the music sounds so much fuller in stereo, especially the big, orchestral backgrounds, harmonies, etc. FOH gets the two channel stereo feed. I suppose these can be combined to a mono channel if needed/wanted.
It may not sound horrible, but it can definitely be missing some elements, mainly anything that is panned to the opposite side. If you're going to go this route, you'd be better off summing and bouncing your original track to a mono file.
This connection does not make sense at all.Why all those DI boxes and all those cables?Using too much unnecessary items for only 2 channels?Make things easy by using an Audio Interface.4 Audio output Interface will do.
If you gonna buy and bring so many DI boxes and a mixer… just get a proper tool.
Get a 4-channel audio interface, and that’s it. Same cost as couple of DI boxes, less crap to carry around and set up
Or if you insist on using built-in audio, get a Rolls PM351, just a single box that will do all of it - split, headphone amp, DI, external monitor feed input..
That would be totally fine too... but what happens when your laptop or PM351 dies, breaks, crashes, or loses power/broken power supply? You need a backup. Load your tracks on a portable device and plug into your DI box. Or... dont use DI box at all just go straight into the FOH mixer. The DI box has a ground lift switch to clean up the audio from electrical grounding interference.
12:14 who would want to have clicks only on one side? it would literally hurt my ears xd
I know a drummer who does this and have seen some drummers on You tube say they have done this before because its easier to differentiate the sound when everything is playing. Me personally I wouldn't pan hard left or right, that's not my preference, but maybe a slight left or right to make it easier to pick out or distinguish if I'm having a hard time hearing the click
I would. I run click/spd backing tracks in one ear, and my vocals/lead vox/ guitar/band in the other. This helps me stay in time but also make sure our three part harmonies are on point. I can control mixes at the drums, while the sound man controls mix to the audience…
EASY
as 1234!
Infact,all this is an old way of Audio Technics.Use Dante controller and Q-sys.Not this
Don't need Dante nor Q-Sys to run backing tracks correctly.
I am used to Dante and Q-Sys and I do all my projects with Q-sys.
Or just buy an digital mixer for the same money.