Can't be mentioned to often: The Banner does NOT increase each models Objective control Characteristic by 1, but you add up all models characteristic that is contesting the objective and *then* you add whatever modifiers to determine the units Objective control *score*. So the 5 Vindictors with OCC of 1 can add up to a total with 6 including the +1 of their banner.
Just look at the wording. There is Objective controll characteristics on the warscroll. There is unit control score. And there is army control score. Unit control score is all models characteristic (only counting the modls *on* the objective) + bonuses. That includes the +1 fto the UNITS controll SCORE from the banner. And finally there is the army control score, which adds up each players eligible unit scores for one objective after the other, the higher one gaining or retaining control of the objective in question.
Thanks for the great summary. I noticed the wording of the command Forwars to Victory has changed. I believe you need to spend the CP before you make the first roll.. in such case it is a lot worse compared to 3.0. Cheers!
Was this list based off anything? Also I’m a little confused why the wolves were aux? Is the command model bonus for each musician and banner or only get the bonus a single time if you have any?
the ONE mechanic universally despised by literally ANYONE.. and they still kept it in 4th edition. The double turn mechanic is ass cancer and should have been done away with years ago. Nobody in my area will even touch the game as long as that mechanic exists. Its like getting the blue shell in Mario kart.. game is fucking over soon as someone gets it. Oh i cant get .. 4 VP's that turn? Who cares, your whole fuckin army is gone in 1 round. You still lose. Its still not a "choice" like they're trying to hype that it is.
Sorry to hear you've having the experience Nazgull. It's certainly not my shared experience that my whole army is being removed in Turn 1. The priority roll is there to create a dynamic experience where it's not a predictable you go, I go, you go, I go rhythm. I know it's devisive but you'll find a lot of AoS players enjoy the priority roll and the punishment of the double turn is significant unless, as you pointed out, you can heavily damage them. My question back to you is to consider how you can perhaps build or play to lose the double turn so that should it happen, you're not being tabled.
@@AoSCoach Well when you figure out this awesome strategy to prevent an opponent from tabling you with 2 free turns of completely uninterrupted attacks from models that deal out massive amounts of Mortal Wound spam per turn... you let us non-AoS players know. Cause there's no game on the planet that im aware of where your opponent going twice in a row doesnt result in a massive crippling advantage over the other player. As far as AoS goes, its on its last legs as it is. I fully expect the game to get Squatted within the next few years. They're banking everything on this 4th edition selling like gangbusters.. and its not. Ive got 3 major shops in my area, plus a GW store.. you couldnt fill my wife's kia with AoS 4th ed preorders.. Same story from every one I talk too "No interest in double turn mechanics, no interest in $200+ models and 7 model "armies" MW spamming the entire table. They addressed NONE of the concerns of the community and just plowed ahead insisting they knew better. I remember them having this attitude once before.. was right around 8th Edition of Warhammer Fantasy. Cept in this case, Fantasy sales were better.
Looking forward to the new edition. It's nice to have a refresh and change things up a bit. I'm hoping the Danhold Troggoth warscroll is good, since it seems we can no longer reinforce them. Also, with allies gone, do you think there's a possibility that we may return to being able to field Grand Alliance armies. I do miss that. We are getting Grand Alliance Battle Tatics which gave me hope, but it's probably just wishful thinking. Thank you for these breakdown videos, they are very helpful and clear.
Thanks for detailed video. I think the answer is no on Grand Alliance armies. I think part of the reason we see allies removed is to stop units being broken in factions they arent intended to be in. Its hard to balance so keeping them contained within faction or appropriately appointing the Regiment of Renown seems to be the play
@@AoSCoach Thanks, that makes good sense. Maybe one day they will return - I will live in hope. On the plus side, I may have more incentive to field my Sloggoth in Kruleboyz at last.
Hi, I'm new to AoS and picked up the Kruleboyz Spearhead. In 3rd I noticed some Warcry Warbands that are also Kruleboyz including Underworld units are the Beast Killaz and da Kunnin Krew. Will this still be an option considering Kruleboyz could usea wider rangr of models
Hey Chris... when the faction pack comes out (this week) you'll see which units are/aren't included in Kruleboyz. A general warning is that many of these Underworlds or Warcry units get phased out over the years if they aren't incorporated into the faction. Not all, some...
You love me, even though you are not my dad? That is so nice. 😊 I like that I no longer have to select individual spells for individual wizards during list building. But most lores only having three spells feels quite restrictive. Especially considering that many minor wizards no longer have a warscroll spell and the two "automatic" spells (Arcane Bolt and Mystic Shield) are gone. Are the unlimited spells and the manifestations enough to counteract that? Or did you often found yourself running out of spells to cast if you take a couple wizards?
With the endless spells and unlimited spells, i haven’t found this situation yet. Actually, i’ve been trying a lot of lists without wizards which has been interesting.
I appreciate all the effort you put into this video, I am looking forward to playing more games this edition for sure! So sad to lose allies....I think our "House Rules" will allow some version of games with two factions working together....it is fun and creates diversity.
Is it just me or does making universal core game mechanics "abilities" like run,move,shoot with "counterabilities" seem unnecessarily extra? Its like a lawyer wrote these rules for other lawyers rather than the layman.
@@AoSCoach Yeah once I did a second read thru and got a few games in, it does seem to tighten things up better. I guess it was just an issue with how they formatted and laid them out.
A unit can’t receive 2 commands in the same phase. You can issue them both to 2 different units if they’re eligible (usually can’t charge in the enemies charge phase without counter charge)
Hi Coach, great work, thank you. Is forward to victory really the same? Some people say you have to use the command before you know that you failed the first time
Unless i’m missing something, Forward to Victory is a reaction Command Ability to a unit that used the Charge ability… so you use the charge ability, and then react to it (assuming you failed or didn’t get the result you wanted) then reroll.
I'm sad that battleshock is gone. I think it was a really elegant system for leadership that they just heavily underutilized because most of the armies either weren't susceptible to it or could negate it's effects easily. At least I got to play around with it for a little bit with my BoK denying inspiring presence.
Good stuff as usual, Coach
Thanks mate. Looking forward to more of your coverage
@@AoSCoach Learned from the best ;-)
The GOAT returns! So excited for 4th and more vids about it!
☺️ too kind Dillon. We’ll be knee deep in the 4e videos in no time
Great synopsis! We’ll have to unlearn some stuff from 3rd! At least no more forgetting Monstrous Rampages…
I still capture myself a few times wanting to declare Unleash Hell 🤣. Its a slow process
Can't be mentioned to often:
The Banner does NOT increase each models Objective control Characteristic by 1, but you add up all models characteristic that is contesting the objective and *then* you add whatever modifiers to determine the units Objective control *score*.
So the 5 Vindictors with OCC of 1 can add up to a total with 6 including the +1 of their banner.
Are you sure about that? The ability in the core rules doesn't seem to be worded clearly at all
Just look at the wording.
There is Objective controll characteristics on the warscroll.
There is unit control score.
And there is army control score.
Unit control score is all models characteristic (only counting the modls *on* the objective) + bonuses.
That includes the +1 fto the UNITS controll SCORE from the banner.
And finally there is the army control score, which adds up each players eligible unit scores for one objective after the other, the higher one gaining or retaining control of the objective in question.
Beautiful and clear, cheers Coach
Cheers Dale!
Thank you, this is what I was looking for!
Glad i could help Greg. Enjoy 4e
Thanks for the great summary.
I noticed the wording of the command Forwars to Victory has changed. I believe you need to spend the CP before you make the first roll.. in such case it is a lot worse compared to 3.0.
Cheers!
Forward to Victory is a reaction, so you get to react to your dice roll. Its unlike some of the other CA where you declare before taking the action.
Thanks for the info, love your take oon the game
Was this list based off anything? Also I’m a little confused why the wolves were aux?
Is the command model bonus for each musician and banner or only get the bonus a single time if you have any?
Got my first 4th edition game in a couple hours, this video is really helpful!
hey there, new to the game. if weapon range is 3". I thought the kind of weapon e.g. sword or spear mattes somehow. It has no effect?
the ONE mechanic universally despised by literally ANYONE.. and they still kept it in 4th edition.
The double turn mechanic is ass cancer and should have been done away with years ago. Nobody in my area will even touch the game as long as that mechanic exists. Its like getting the blue shell in Mario kart.. game is fucking over soon as someone gets it. Oh i cant get .. 4 VP's that turn? Who cares, your whole fuckin army is gone in 1 round. You still lose. Its still not a "choice" like they're trying to hype that it is.
Sorry to hear you've having the experience Nazgull. It's certainly not my shared experience that my whole army is being removed in Turn 1. The priority roll is there to create a dynamic experience where it's not a predictable you go, I go, you go, I go rhythm. I know it's devisive but you'll find a lot of AoS players enjoy the priority roll and the punishment of the double turn is significant unless, as you pointed out, you can heavily damage them. My question back to you is to consider how you can perhaps build or play to lose the double turn so that should it happen, you're not being tabled.
@@AoSCoach Well when you figure out this awesome strategy to prevent an opponent from tabling you with 2 free turns of completely uninterrupted attacks from models that deal out massive amounts of Mortal Wound spam per turn... you let us non-AoS players know. Cause there's no game on the planet that im aware of where your opponent going twice in a row doesnt result in a massive crippling advantage over the other player.
As far as AoS goes, its on its last legs as it is. I fully expect the game to get Squatted within the next few years. They're banking everything on this 4th edition selling like gangbusters.. and its not. Ive got 3 major shops in my area, plus a GW store.. you couldnt fill my wife's kia with AoS 4th ed preorders..
Same story from every one I talk too "No interest in double turn mechanics, no interest in $200+ models and 7 model "armies" MW spamming the entire table. They addressed NONE of the concerns of the community and just plowed ahead insisting they knew better.
I remember them having this attitude once before.. was right around 8th Edition of Warhammer Fantasy. Cept in this case, Fantasy sales were better.
Looking forward to the new edition. It's nice to have a refresh and change things up a bit. I'm hoping the Danhold Troggoth warscroll is good, since it seems we can no longer reinforce them. Also, with allies gone, do you think there's a possibility that we may return to being able to field Grand Alliance armies. I do miss that. We are getting Grand Alliance Battle Tatics which gave me hope, but it's probably just wishful thinking. Thank you for these breakdown videos, they are very helpful and clear.
Thanks for detailed video. I think the answer is no on Grand Alliance armies. I think part of the reason we see allies removed is to stop units being broken in factions they arent intended to be in. Its hard to balance so keeping them contained within faction or appropriately appointing the Regiment of Renown seems to be the play
@@AoSCoach Thanks, that makes good sense. Maybe one day they will return - I will live in hope. On the plus side, I may have more incentive to field my Sloggoth in Kruleboyz at last.
Likes for the like throne, Comments for the comment God.
The bonuses for the command models are a bit bland. Imho.
Thanks Coach! Put Morathu on a place of power. Can do 😅
While i will miss my BoC. Khorne will take the charge into 4th
You’ve got BoC for another 12 months. Take them for glory in one final spin
Might be worth proxying your Beasts of Chaos as Blades of Khorne in casual/non GW games
Doing sigmars work as always, thanks coach!
Very useful info for moving onto 4th edition!
Hi, I'm new to AoS and picked up the Kruleboyz Spearhead. In 3rd I noticed some Warcry Warbands that are also Kruleboyz including Underworld units are the Beast Killaz and da Kunnin Krew. Will this still be an option considering Kruleboyz could usea wider rangr of models
Hey Chris... when the faction pack comes out (this week) you'll see which units are/aren't included in Kruleboyz. A general warning is that many of these Underworlds or Warcry units get phased out over the years if they aren't incorporated into the faction. Not all, some...
You love me, even though you are not my dad? That is so nice. 😊
I like that I no longer have to select individual spells for individual wizards during list building. But most lores only having three spells feels quite restrictive. Especially considering that many minor wizards no longer have a warscroll spell and the two "automatic" spells (Arcane Bolt and Mystic Shield) are gone. Are the unlimited spells and the manifestations enough to counteract that? Or did you often found yourself running out of spells to cast if you take a couple wizards?
With the endless spells and unlimited spells, i haven’t found this situation yet. Actually, i’ve been trying a lot of lists without wizards which has been interesting.
"Arcane, mystical and damned that nobody cared about." Oh my khorne would disagree :D sacrifice + damned a Riptooth for that sweet 2 tithe turn one
Amazing! Look... I liked all the rules but it felt like a lot of people didn't want to use them.
Where you been, Coach? Its been too long
Hiding away in my 4th edition cave til I can talk about all the goodness
awesome !thanks !
Comment for the comments god! This was great and gave a good overview of the changes. Cheers
Cheers Sander!
Nice one, Coach! One of the clearest videos showing the differences we've seen so far!
Thanks Mindy. I tried to cut the waffle and get straight to the good stuff, though waffles are delicious
Oouuf no allies rip belakor khorne....sad
My thoughts and prayers are with you in this tough moment
I appreciate all the effort you put into this video, I am looking forward to playing more games this edition for sure! So sad to lose allies....I think our "House Rules" will allow some version of games with two factions working together....it is fun and creates diversity.
Going through this again multiple times to get the changes stuck in my brain.
We’ll get a game in soon. It’ll make more sense in the moment
Very nice summary of the updates!! Best AOS Review channel on RUclips! Thx man for your awesome work!
Excellent review
Huzzah
This was a great watch. Thank you very much
Appreciate James! Thanks for the comment
Great vid. Can’t wait to see how it plays out!
Hope you enjoy the new edition, its been a lot of fun for me and its only scratching the surface
Is it just me or does making universal core game mechanics "abilities" like run,move,shoot with "counterabilities" seem unnecessarily extra? Its like a lawyer wrote these rules for other lawyers rather than the layman.
on the surface its a bit much but when you start looking into why you can't redeploy then counter charge... it cleans it all up and makes sense.
@@AoSCoach Yeah once I did a second read thru and got a few games in, it does seem to tighten things up better. I guess it was just an issue with how they formatted and laid them out.
Thanks for this video! It's a great video to share with new players and friends coming back to the game.
Thanks!
An invaluable summation resource- thanks, Coach!
how can we include Gotrek?
We’ll just need to wait til the battlescroll is released
Great Video man, succinct and helpful!
You are a gem Coach. Lovely content cant Thank You enough.
Why can't I use forward to vicory after counter charge?
A unit can’t receive 2 commands in the same phase. You can issue them both to 2 different units if they’re eligible (usually can’t charge in the enemies charge phase without counter charge)
@@AoSCoach thanks coach ❤️
Great video!
Thanks Jake
Great overview, please keep them coming
Great stuff as usual. Do we know yet if faction terrain is still free?
It is yeah.
Questioningbasics is correct, faction terrain is still included and free
Great video!
Thank you very much Duke 🙏
Hi Coach, great work, thank you. Is forward to victory really the same?
Some people say you have to use the command before you know that you failed the first time
Unless i’m missing something, Forward to Victory is a reaction Command Ability to a unit that used the Charge ability… so you use the charge ability, and then react to it (assuming you failed or didn’t get the result you wanted) then reroll.
Thanks Coach, exactly what I needed! you're a legend.
Pleasure mate… great video yourself
Clear!! Thank you🎉
LOL at the objective being a combination of metric and standard units of measure!!!
I see the hilarity… used the 40mm base size. At least we can stand on it
Loved it. 25 mins of important stuff!
Thanks mate
thanks coach...no allies huh that's interesting
Only your Regiments of Renown unless i’ve missed something
The experienced perspective is a nice touch.
Thanks mate… im lucky enough to have played it. Can’t wait for you all to try it
Great video!!
Thanks mate
Thanks Coach!
My pleasure Scott
Thanks coach
Absolutely my pleasure
Concise af❤
Thanks George 🥰
I'm sad that battleshock is gone. I think it was a really elegant system for leadership that they just heavily underutilized because most of the armies either weren't susceptible to it or could negate it's effects easily. At least I got to play around with it for a little bit with my BoK denying inspiring presence.
Best video I’ve seen so far on 4th ! Thanks coach
Thank you so much… that’s very kind of you
Great reference for those of us splitting our attention between 3rd and the trickle feed of 4th rules
I admire your commitment. Its been hard for me continuing to play 3e with all the 4e going on