Thanks for the interesting update. Seems those forks may be the solution. My guess is that the forks that failed are made from a low grade, non forged cast magnesium or aluminum. Where the RST forks could be aircraft grade alloy and are forged and annealed, so the strength could be several times the other forks. Stronger alloys can however be more brittle, and develop discontinuities and micro fractures, and fail unexpectedly, and why aircraft often have replacement intervals for structural magnesium parts. As structural failure of a front fork on an bicycle will most likely result in injury or even death, perhaps torque arms might be a wise precaution. I've been running a 1000w front hub motor boosted to about 1400 watts power and 2000w regen on a 2WD Frankenbike for about a year with Suntour XCT forks with slotted mounts and no torque arms for a yea, with modified toque washers and jam nuts with no issues, but after seeing your failure and how the hose clamps were shredded, I may have some custom long (8"/200mm) torque arms laser cut in my next Send-Cut-Send order. I'm thinking that the longer lever-arm should reduce the shearing force on the clamps to a reasonable level and allow for use of more than just one hose clamp. That's something I could and should run a simulation stress study in Solidworks to confirm. If you might be interested in custom long torque arms, I could sketch up something in Solidworks and have them cut. I found images of RST Gide forks online and the inner fork mount races appear to be in line with the inside of the fork tube, so could possibly use the images to get close enough to have something cut that would fit. Just let me know if you might be interested.
I put a front motor on my rover5, 2 years ago...not faster but oh boy, so much torque and so much power..can know climb any hills without any deceleration
The bike is coming out great. The look of the bike is already better visually, and the motor in front being similar does help too. I bet the work in bettering the bike is tougher than you thought it would be, but good on you for sticking it out.
Bike looks great!! Can't wait to see it out on the road! Also hoping you get your hands on the new Lectric mid-drive soon and put it to your tests, which in my opinion, are the best out there.
No one can ever accuse you of giving up on something easily. LOL The tab washers look just like the ones on my radrover wheel. But I could be wrong on that. One thing I noticed is on one side of that motor axle the threads are at 6 and 12 and on the other side they are at 3 and 9 as I look at the picture. I believe the threads should be at 6 and 12 on both sides when it's dropped In. And I believe the tab washers should go on the outside and just standard washers on the inside if you need them as spacers. But I could be wrong on all of this but if it was me I wouldn't put it together till I was sure. Sure looks like you're having some fun though. LOL
I'm soooo glad I watched this video. Just realized I had my washers installed wrong on the front hub wheel . Thanks dude. And IDK if I would go without the torque arm. Better safe than sorry, that's alot torque on the front hub.
I know they are out there because, ecells have controllers like this. I have a 2020 RadRover and it is awesome I wish it had pulling power and could go faster.
I wonder if you could have a controller that sends commands to two motors at the same time so that you would only be using one throttle...to send commands to two motors?
Been looking forward to this video - it’s shaping up nicely. And super cool of Fabulous Ebikes to work with you on the forks, good on them. Dig their bikes. Now let’s see this thing in action!
I know where you got the torque washers. They come with the EBW "true 750 motor". I know this because you're the reason I upgraded my Rover over a year ago. I took your advice and got the EBW controller and motor and the motor came with those torque washers. Maybe you can contact Electro Bike World for some. Thanks for the videos! Now I want AWD!
Hey cycle.. I had a accident on my Archon.. had to get 12 stitches.. I'm hanging in there like a ebike Champ.. to be honest.. I was being way to fancy on a left turn.. ran in to the back of a pickup truck.. happy Trails to all my Riderz
Yes, the spare torque washers I would use on the inside of the fork. I don't think you need the torque arm's. I don't have any on my all wheel drive bike.
No suggestion on torque washers but I can suggest you get a set of Handlebar Jacks to work on your bike upside down without damaging anything mounted to the bars. You can find them on Area 13's site.
are you using torque arms when in fell out of the drop outs as anything above 500w i would use them as Safety Reguardless if the forks are for a ebike or not
I want to do something similar but a diy 21 or 24 speed. Dual motors, dual batteries, and keep the gears. Trying to find a console and wiring harness to do it. Do you know of any? Would like to add a 3rd motor, mid drive if I find one that allows me to keep the gears.
Hi Mr C.C, great to see you diving back into the dual motor experiment and bouncing back from that learning experience. It's great these rst dropouts are much chunkier. May I suggest you look into correct torque arm orientation before installation? As an incorrectly installed torque arm WILL cause more damage then not having one. It will actually produce a reactionary force pulling straight down upon the axle therefore causing it to fall free from the dropouts. Best of luck, looking forward to a completed, functioning, dual motor rad tearing it up that hill test in record record time.
Isnt that an aluminum fork drop out still I wonder. Maybe its strong, idk. It's fun to see all the challenges with this bike because many just post up a complete project and say bam done it was easy.
This is my concern. I was going to put this on a mountain. Bike with suspension forks. I am wondering how safe it would be though. The bike obviously wasn’t designed for it.
Them forks look awesome on that bike way better and tougher too , I'm hoping they actually work as good and smooth out the ride . And keep you from killing yourself in the process too. Geese that was crazy thank God that you weren't going full speed when the Amazon forks gave out .
I have a spare himiway cobra rear wheel w/motor, I want to see if I can make it work for my front wheel and make it AWD. I believe they are 750 watt each
take washer out put it in a vice put it up near the bend then hammer the washer over it wont work bending it over on the bike take it off and the vice thing
Enjoy watching your videos, especially your Citizen Bike videos, they're awesome. I have a Rad Step Thur 1 and have ordered the 2nd controller from Area 13. I want to create a dual hub too. I agree with you, just having that individual option of just using one or the other wheel or both at the same time is total control. Plus it was great that Fabulous Ebikes sold you that front fork. I'm hoping they would sell me a fork too. Just one question, which is that Bafang hub motor you have on your front wheel? Is it a 175 mm 750 watt? Can you link where you got the motor? I would like to order it too. I have a spear rear wheel but I don't think it will work on the front. Thanks! Keep the videos coming.
great video i want this same thing but I need 52v,1000w front hub motor kit. 48s every were are inter changeable ? i see 48,60,72 but not 52. I have 52v1000w(1850)1040wh in rear. i REALLY APPRICATE if you no were to get that front hub. thx keep up videos. my bike will look similar I have the new AR KEPLER> it REALLY NEEDS 2WD
Hey citizen, I have 1000 W folding E bike I just want the front motor to assist the rear motor give me a little bit more speed if I need it help me climb a hill or get me out of mud or sand. I just want a maxed out throttle response do I have to splic in the brake inhibitor’s, even though I see a lot of E bikes, not a lot of people work on them bike shops, either overcharge or do not bother
You could splice the motor inhibitors but I did not on mine. Instead I plugged at the front motor into the front brake and the rear motor in the rear brake so I can cut both motors by pulling both brakes.
I love these videos you have been putting out lately and the bike looks awesome but I have a small suggestion. It would probably help out the folks/companies that helped provide the parts for this project, as well as us that want to duplicate the finished working bike if you would so kindly provide links to the websites or storefronts of the companies. Thanks.
yes, i am compiling a parts list and will include that in the description of future videos, on my website, and will also go back and add to these past videos too :)
Hi CC,,,I was wondering,,due to the pricing of buying all the individual parts for a front hub install,,,is it possible to just buy a cheap fat ebike whether 500 or 750w and just use the motor,,controller,,battery,,,etc. on the front wheel,,?
Hello. I love your videos, they have been very helpful, since i'm looking at the cyrusher's. It's going to be my first e-bike, however i've seen another that i'm interested in. I wanted to ask if you have any knowledge about it as i'm struggling to find any video's anywhere of reviews etc. It's called the Splach patriot pro, If you do have any info at all, i'd be extremely grateful. If not i totally understand. Thank you for the videos that you do.
Hi O'Shea, unfortunately I don't have any information on the splach Patriot pro. I just looked it up and it looks like a fun design, and specs look decent for the money. Kind of heavy though at 88 lb.. sorry I don't have any experience with the bike, best of luck in your first ebike purchase, just get whatever one speaks to you the most.
Hey Citizen, I really like your eBike videos. I’m confused what you mean about Geared Hub drive and something else on your front wheel, maybe Direct drive? Thanks.
just google geared hub vs direct drive and you will see the difference between these types of motors. i had a direct drive motor on the front but i wanted something smaller and more powerful so i decided to change it to a geared hub motor, now it has more torque, but its a lot louder too
What the Fork! ok the 3.0 Expert hahahaha YES! own it, I try to watch all content. Dang with a Patreon membership, I would see stuff categorically then this RANDO utube algo. Again hondo last year, 2 hondo pledge this year. Or just get out here to So. Cal with the family extra rooms, golf course( add maniacal laughter here) low tide rides hard pack rides on the Ventura beaches, kiteboard, 2 Himis, 2 Canadian Jolts, 1 Ariel Grizz dual ALL. Cathy cooks up a mean and lean anything we want, Barbeque is a gnarly thing in these parts, Pool/Jacuzzi, pickle Ball and basketball. Ok here is the final Huckleberry, world class shopping at the outlet centers. One zoom meeting with our wives it's a LOCK! Do it now before you have more excuses . Cathy just walked by and said that is personal. Change that to E-mail. I said ok.........................ENTER! Ride ON BRY!
Hi Tom!! Probably wont be creating a patreon, i barely have enough time to create this content around my actual job :) not sure i could produce exclusive content for a separate audience. i am thinking about possibly doing a live stream though and then people could superchat if they wanted. thanks for the invite, sounds like you have an abundance of activities out there to keep you busy. how are you liking the Grizz? i would love to match one up against the mistress bike, would be a great head to head race. once she is finalized i may do some comparisons to store-bought AWD bikes, we'll see. Thanks for taking the time to keep up with my channel!! appreciated!!
Brain my Rad Rover ST has those torque washers you want to use on the outside on the inside and then they have bolt on torque tabs on the outside. How is your back wheel installed? I would try and do the same on the front tire. Torque washers on the inside and torque arms like the ones that came with the Ebikling wheel on the outside. Just a thought to ponder!
Unless you baby it, it's probably just a matter of time before this fork breaks, too. A better solution would be to fabricate two torque arms that transfer the torque out of the dropout to higher up the fork leg (one can be bolted into the brake tabs, the other with one of those hose clamps, preferably rubberized. The ultimate but expensive solution would be the All-Axle motor from Grin with a 20mm or 15mm through axle fork.
Hey man, just installed that ebikeling kit on my step thru rad been wanting to do this whole thing right when you installed the bolton upgrade, that's how I found your channel, how were you able to get the stock rad tires on?
![ARGENTINA vs. CHILE [3-0] | RESUMEN | ELIMINATORIAS SUDAMERICANAS | FECHA 7](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/De3AWmXzhuA/mqdefault.jpg)
Thanks for the interesting update. Seems those forks may be the solution. My guess is that the forks that failed are made from a low grade, non forged cast magnesium or aluminum. Where the RST forks could be aircraft grade alloy and are forged and annealed, so the strength could be several times the other forks. Stronger alloys can however be more brittle, and develop discontinuities and micro fractures, and fail unexpectedly, and why aircraft often have replacement intervals for structural magnesium parts.
As structural failure of a front fork on an bicycle will most likely result in injury or even death, perhaps torque arms might be a wise precaution.
I've been running a 1000w front hub motor boosted to about 1400 watts power and 2000w regen on a 2WD Frankenbike for about a year with Suntour XCT forks with slotted mounts and no torque arms for a yea, with modified toque washers and jam nuts with no issues, but after seeing your failure and how the hose clamps were shredded, I may have some custom long (8"/200mm) torque arms laser cut in my next Send-Cut-Send order. I'm thinking that the longer lever-arm should reduce the shearing force on the clamps to a reasonable level and allow for use of more than just one hose clamp. That's something I could and should run a simulation stress study in Solidworks to confirm.
If you might be interested in custom long torque arms, I could sketch up something in Solidworks and have them cut. I found images of RST Gide forks online and the inner fork mount races appear to be in line with the inside of the fork tube, so could possibly use the images to get close enough to have something cut that would fit. Just let me know if you might be interested.
I put a front motor on my rover5, 2 years ago...not faster but oh boy, so much torque and so much power..can know climb any hills without any deceleration
grin technologies has torque washers
I c a nt wait for the final outcome - keep doing what you do man, I'm enjoying it all.
The bike is coming out great. The look of the bike is already better visually, and the motor in front being similar does help too. I bet the work in bettering the bike is tougher than you thought it would be, but good on you for sticking it out.
I have the bike U are talkin about . Road Warrior X 2. I went with the Silver Bullet !!! AWESOME bike !!
Bike looks great!! Can't wait to see it out on the road! Also hoping you get your hands on the new Lectric mid-drive soon and put it to your tests, which in my opinion, are the best out there.
No one can ever accuse you of giving up on something easily. LOL The tab washers look just like the ones on my radrover wheel. But I could be wrong on that. One thing I noticed is on one side of that motor axle the threads are at 6 and 12 and on the other side they are at 3 and 9 as I look at the picture. I believe the threads should be at 6 and 12 on both sides when it's dropped In. And I believe the tab washers should go on the outside and just standard washers on the inside if you need them as spacers. But I could be wrong on all of this but if it was me I wouldn't put it together till I was sure. Sure looks like you're having some fun though. LOL
Very nice looking rebuild
thanks!
I'm soooo glad I watched this video. Just realized I had my washers installed wrong on the front hub wheel . Thanks dude. And IDK if I would go without the torque arm. Better safe than sorry, that's alot torque on the front hub.
I know they are out there because, ecells have controllers like this. I have a 2020 RadRover and it is awesome I wish it had pulling power and could go faster.
I wonder if you could have a controller that sends commands to two motors at the same time so that you would only be using one throttle...to send commands to two motors?
Yes, they exist. I have the eunorau defender s. It has dual motors. And they work on the same trottle. I just have a selector...
Found those torque washers on ebay. Just ordered several.
Also available on the e-bikeling website I got some from there
Eahora uses those torque washers you are looking for. You might reach out to them for a source.
Been looking forward to this video - it’s shaping up nicely. And super cool of Fabulous Ebikes to work with you on the forks, good on them. Dig their bikes. Now let’s see this thing in action!
Anything for our buddy Citizen, might have to send him a Road Warrior X2 to challenge the 3.0 Rover!
@@fabulousebikes1110 YES! Please, that would be awesome to see!
I know where you got the torque washers. They come with the EBW "true 750 motor". I know this because you're the reason I upgraded my Rover over a year ago. I took your advice and got the EBW controller and motor and the motor came with those torque washers. Maybe you can contact Electro Bike World for some. Thanks for the videos! Now I want AWD!
actually someone emailed me about it. you can by the washers from ebikeling
OK, Cool. Thanks for the video man. I always look forward to the Rad Mods. Take care and keep up the great work.
Hey cycle.. I had a accident on my Archon.. had to get 12 stitches.. I'm hanging in there like a ebike Champ.. to be honest.. I was being way to fancy on a left turn.. ran in to the back of a pickup truck.. happy Trails to all my Riderz
Yes, the spare torque washers I would use on the inside of the fork. I don't think you need the torque arm's. I don't have any on my all wheel drive bike.
No suggestion on torque washers but I can suggest you get a set of Handlebar Jacks to work on your bike upside down without damaging anything mounted to the bars. You can find them on Area 13's site.
are you using torque arms when in fell out of the drop outs as anything above 500w i would use them as Safety Reguardless if the forks are for a ebike or not
You never showed how you control the motor, how it was hooked up, separate throttle, etc.
Wow! This is great! I'm really enjoying this!
Love your content
I want to do something similar but a diy 21 or 24 speed. Dual motors, dual batteries, and keep the gears. Trying to find a console and wiring harness to do it. Do you know of any? Would like to add a 3rd motor, mid drive if I find one that allows me to keep the gears.
Hi Mr C.C, great to see you diving back into the dual motor experiment and bouncing back from that learning experience. It's great these rst dropouts are much chunkier. May I suggest you look into correct torque arm orientation before installation? As an incorrectly installed torque arm WILL cause more damage then not having one. It will actually produce a reactionary force pulling straight down upon the axle therefore causing it to fall free from the dropouts. Best of luck, looking forward to a completed, functioning, dual motor rad tearing it up that hill test in record record time.
Isnt that an aluminum fork drop out still I wonder. Maybe its strong, idk. It's fun to see all the challenges with this bike because many just post up a complete project and say bam done it was easy.
I would be using steel non suspension forks and torque arms if it was me.
This is my concern. I was going to put this on a mountain. Bike with suspension forks. I am wondering how safe it would be though. The bike obviously wasn’t designed for it.
If there's a hardware store near U that's where U can get some washers like that
Them forks look awesome on that bike way better and tougher too , I'm hoping they actually work as good and smooth out the ride . And keep you from killing yourself in the process too. Geese that was crazy thank God that you weren't going full speed when the Amazon forks gave out .
I have a spare himiway cobra rear wheel w/motor, I want to see if I can make it work for my front wheel and make it AWD. I believe they are 750 watt each
🐍My AR V2 Grizzly has those torque washers you're looking for.
At least it looks the same to me.🖖🤙
Also just do a search and click on the images option , should yield several sources
I would love to see you review the Fabulous dual motor fat tire bike CC. Your thoughts
So looking @ quick cat and rambo dual motor
And thinking maybe a rad ?
And conversion
take washer out put it in a vice put it up near the bend then hammer the washer over it wont work bending it over on the bike take it off and the vice thing
Have you done anything with the bikonit brand there forks are like a motorcycle
Enjoy watching your videos, especially your Citizen Bike videos, they're awesome. I have a Rad Step Thur 1 and have ordered the 2nd controller from Area 13. I want to create a dual hub too. I agree with you, just having that individual option of just using one or the other wheel or both at the same time is total control. Plus it was great that Fabulous Ebikes sold you that front fork. I'm hoping they would sell me a fork too. Just one question, which is that Bafang hub motor you have on your front wheel? Is it a 175 mm 750 watt? Can you link where you got the motor? I would like to order it too. I have a spear rear wheel but I don't think it will work on the front. Thanks! Keep the videos coming.
Had the same thing happen before, had to use steel fork, instead of aluminum...
Question … can I add a front motor to an stock rear wheel drive ebike
great video i want this same thing but I need 52v,1000w front hub motor kit. 48s every were are inter changeable ? i see 48,60,72 but not 52. I have 52v1000w(1850)1040wh in rear. i REALLY APPRICATE if you no were to get that front hub. thx keep up videos. my bike will look similar I have the new AR KEPLER> it REALLY NEEDS 2WD
Hey citizen, I have 1000 W folding E bike I just want the front motor to assist the rear motor give me a little bit more speed if I need it help me climb a hill or get me out of mud or sand. I just want a maxed out throttle response do I have to splic in the brake inhibitor’s, even though I see a lot of E bikes, not a lot of people work on them bike shops, either overcharge or do not bother
You could splice the motor inhibitors but I did not on mine. Instead I plugged at the front motor into the front brake and the rear motor in the rear brake so I can cut both motors by pulling both brakes.
@@CitizenCycle925 you always respond
I love these videos you have been putting out lately and the bike looks awesome but I have a small suggestion. It would probably help out the folks/companies that helped provide the parts for this project, as well as us that want to duplicate the finished working bike if you would so kindly provide links to the websites or storefronts of the companies. Thanks.
yes, i am compiling a parts list and will include that in the description of future videos, on my website, and will also go back and add to these past videos too :)
Hi CC,,,I was wondering,,due to the pricing of buying all the individual parts for a front hub install,,,is it possible to just buy a cheap fat ebike whether 500 or 750w and just use the motor,,controller,,battery,,,etc. on the front wheel,,?
How difficult would it be to grind down couple of washers ?
Think it would be a pretty easy job 🙂
There called lock washers
Hello. I love your videos, they have been very helpful, since i'm looking at the cyrusher's. It's going to be my first e-bike, however i've seen another that i'm interested in. I wanted to ask if you have any knowledge about it as i'm struggling to find any video's anywhere of reviews etc.
It's called the Splach patriot pro, If you do have any info at all, i'd be extremely grateful. If not i totally understand. Thank you for the videos that you do.
Hi O'Shea, unfortunately I don't have any information on the splach Patriot pro. I just looked it up and it looks like a fun design, and specs look decent for the money. Kind of heavy though at 88 lb.. sorry I don't have any experience with the bike, best of luck in your first ebike purchase, just get whatever one speaks to you the most.
Hey Citizen, I really like your eBike videos. I’m confused what you mean about Geared Hub drive and something else on your front wheel, maybe Direct drive? Thanks.
just google geared hub vs direct drive and you will see the difference between these types of motors. i had a direct drive motor on the front but i wanted something smaller and more powerful so i decided to change it to a geared hub motor, now it has more torque, but its a lot louder too
What the Fork! ok the 3.0 Expert hahahaha YES! own it, I try to watch all content.
Dang with a Patreon membership, I would see stuff categorically then this RANDO
utube algo. Again hondo last year, 2 hondo pledge this year. Or just get out here to So. Cal
with the family extra rooms, golf course( add maniacal laughter here) low tide rides hard pack rides on the Ventura beaches, kiteboard, 2 Himis, 2 Canadian Jolts, 1 Ariel Grizz dual ALL. Cathy cooks up a mean and lean anything we want, Barbeque is a gnarly thing in these parts, Pool/Jacuzzi, pickle Ball and basketball. Ok here is the final Huckleberry, world class shopping at the outlet centers. One zoom meeting with our wives it's a LOCK! Do it now before you have more excuses . Cathy just walked by and said that is personal. Change that to E-mail. I said ok.........................ENTER! Ride ON BRY!
Hi Tom!! Probably wont be creating a patreon, i barely have enough time to create this content around my actual job :) not sure i could produce exclusive content for a separate audience. i am thinking about possibly doing a live stream though and then people could superchat if they wanted. thanks for the invite, sounds like you have an abundance of activities out there to keep you busy. how are you liking the Grizz? i would love to match one up against the mistress bike, would be a great head to head race. once she is finalized i may do some comparisons to store-bought AWD bikes, we'll see. Thanks for taking the time to keep up with my channel!! appreciated!!
Brain my Rad Rover ST has those torque washers you want to use on the outside on the inside and then they have bolt on torque tabs on the outside. How is your back wheel installed? I would try and do the same on the front tire. Torque washers on the inside and torque arms like the ones that came with the Ebikling wheel on the outside. Just a thought to ponder!
If you could find some more of those torque washers you could 2 on each side. One on the inside and one on the outside of each side. Good Luck
Can u make washers from high density plastic
Unless you baby it, it's probably just a matter of time before this fork breaks, too. A better solution would be to fabricate two torque arms that transfer the torque out of the dropout to higher up the fork leg (one can be bolted into the brake tabs, the other with one of those hose clamps, preferably rubberized. The ultimate but expensive solution would be the All-Axle motor from Grin with a 20mm or 15mm through axle fork.
contact the motor manufacturer for those torq arm washers
If you take the wheel out, is there a slot for the tab washer to go into on the fork itself?
Hey man, just installed that ebikeling kit on my step thru rad been wanting to do this whole thing right when you installed the bolton upgrade, that's how I found your channel, how were you able to get the stock rad tires on?
I'm not using the stock rad tires, not a fan of the Kenda juggernaut tire. Welcome, Hope you are finding some videos helpful 🙂
How big are these rays?
when are you going to brand your own ebike?
The issue i have come across is the number of spokes on the dd motor never seems to match the number of spokes on the stock rims
this one matched up perfect :)
What bike would you use if you had a choice for converting to all wheel
Reason for the second motor? Speed? Power for climbing? What does the second motor do?
Acceleration and Hill climb power
@@CitizenCycle925 Thank you!
Will it increase your top speed?
@@jkarasik9931 probably not but that's one thing I'm going to test
I’m interested in what you find.
Also *bay has them
👍
Tacoma Screw
2 tail lights, you might be able to make them manual turn signals also
You read my mind!!
Leedsbikes and greenbikekits
And Ouch on the $200+ In simply lacing the front wheel. Yikes!
Yt keeps deleting my posts but do a search and click on images option , you should find several sources
i see a lot of comments from you, i think they are getting thru... :)
which cyrusher bike, and what is most important to you?
Eba* has them also *liexpress
Found them on the ebikeling site too :)
Gmac geared hubs are better cause they are round with no flat spots. They will fit in your forks better, Theres YT videos on them \m/
Wrong washer