I agree. Interesting module and great vid from loopop- though I imagine it will exponentially add to to the amount of Muzak out there. Perhaps it should be shipped with a health/good taste warning 😂
In some ways, this channel is the definitive ode to the different kinds of sequencer available and how each one is as unique of an instrument as any synth.
@@G8tr1522 if you’re of a certain age, Eventide is actually known for its high end, rack-mount studio effects. Their rack gear was the studio standard for time based effects in the 1970’s. They even made their own RAM. They didn’t make their first stomp box pedal until the 2000’s.
That's really fun! I find myself wishing there were a second set of 9 or so keys for-I'll just call them modifiers-so you can set chord structures, pitch ornaments, timing offsets-and if there were three more outputs, additional CV modulations-and so on as macros while you're in direct play mode. So you can build chord/ornament state machines, as it were, as well as tone rows. Or, a similar idea on the keyboard controlled side, it would be nice if you could map the left hand to transposable chord structure (and again, perhaps other modulations) while the right hand does this intra-tone-row craziness. If you see what I mean. Or maybe (in this hypothetical world) you need to go mad and have two modules chained together, one of them a modulation-oriented alternate firmware (albeit with the same logical structure), deviously chained together so they work this out jointly. Anyway, certainly made me think, in a very nice way :).
Thanks for the review. I did purchase Misha and I LOVE it!!! As a pianist, this opens up a whole new world of creative possibilities for me, especially as I trigger the intervals freely as a live musician via my midi keyboard. Could there be cheaper VSTs options as some have mentioned? Maybe. However, I am a fan FIRST of tactile and hands-on musicianship and performance, not just “clicking” with a mouse. I can “program” after the fact. This approach is musical for musicians who play. I am a supporter of this product.
To be honest, my only complaint is the amount of HP it takes up for the very little "true" modular integration. It almost feels like this could have been a standalone unit with the CV in/out in the back. Yes, I know that I can probably do that with my own little 4ms Pod, but you get what I'm saying...
@@rozzgrey801 My question too. Some of it's features has things I've always wanted but have zero Eurorack gear and wasn't intending going down that route. Imagine this combined with a Polyend Play
@@rozzgrey801 Yes, you do need the Eurorack AND power. I almost didn’t buy it because of this fact, but I am glad that I did. They are working on a standalone unit. Don’t know when that is coming. However, I do recommend this product.
I'm on the fence with this one. It fills the Midi gap I want to create with my Sinfonion, and has "OK" playability, which the Sinfonion doesn't really have. But I haven't seen anyone demo the CV capabilities of this yet? Alarming. 600 bones is pretty damn steep too
I had a trick, back in the 90s, using a custom-tuned piano patch (with only, say, Cm notes) & a boss MPD-1 drum-pad, which you would finger-drum on whilst twirling the note-select knob. we got a lot of mileage out of that! wondering how this stacks up against the NDLR...
As an avid NDLR user (with expansion via Voltage 2 soft eurorack modules) i am intrigued by this kit. I can see them as being very complementary. Great video! Thank you for the clear explanation and demo.
everyone seems to be super excited with this. i've learned through the years that if you don't have nothing nice to say about something people love, then don't say it. so with that in regard, i wont :)
re: 8:10 --> Can someone please correct my spelling. I can't find anything on the originator of this idea, as stated, probably because it is spelled wrong by me... a product called "sem chileon" developed by a guy named "Leon" and there is a picture of an unusual keyboard. Thanks!
The biggest difference would be the interval based concept at the core of Misha. There are many other differences, but NDLR has a completely different approach to harmony/melody.
You said in the Pros & Cons section that Misha is "the only Interval Sequencer in town" but what comes first in my mind is Conductive Labs The NDLR, a Four-track MIDI Interval Sequencer
I think it goes to how you define an interval sequencer - NDLR is great, but does not travel up and down scales in intervals like Misha does; it quantizes sequences to scales and chords as well as a whole bunch of other things, just different
What gear you used for creating the melody of the very first part of this video?? Note: I saw the semi-huge list on the description section. Can you be specific for: Beginning to 1:20
Funformative, as usual, Z! - a pleasure to watch/listen/learn I kept expecting that you'd compare it to NDLR in your conclusion, and was kinda surprised you didn't. But then again, I suppose they really have little in common. (i haven't used and can't claim to understand either, beyond having watched your NDLR vids.) Maybe you can do a jam where you combine and set them in opposition, and in the process compare/contrast them. Weirder idea than I even understand, I suspect. thanks again!
I initially thought "Meh, another module. Am I bored enough to watch when I'm not into modular?" But after seeing what it does, it immediately became #1 on the list of things I need to implement in my midi processor daemon. It has some fantastic ideas.
Some of the sounds are fantastic in this demo. But I think like a few others was disappointed to not see use of the CV inputs. For me the whole point of a high end sequencer would be for generative results using multiple clock inputs and other modulation. I see there are inputs so I'm sure it's possible. I'm sure there are other people who are hoping Misha is like Rene but with added flexibility and playability. But ya, piano samples and midi at that point could just be a standalone unit or controller.
Where does the Midi Map at 20:23 come from? There is no manual so far, and it is not in the Quick Ref doc. Posting a pdf would be very helpful. Thank you, and for the great video as usual!
Interesting concept perhaps applied to ear training. However, this makes you appreciate a great jazz musicians instant playing access to all scales and arpeggios of all types in all keys! While a cool short cut, it might be faster to stick to the traditional keyboard and human brain in executing chromatic western music instantly in all of the keys! Where soloing becomes particularly interesting and good is learning to play the non melodic based pitches while soloing, meaning the non scale tones between the scales notes.
Excellent comment. I wonder if the real magic isn't in the possibilities of externally controlling this device with sequencers or other devices modulating algorithmic manipulations. My experience with scalar controllers is that for those of us lacking the training of a skilled musician, devices like the Kordbot or the NDLR can actually be tools to visually learn theory via pattern recognition and I suspect that is also true for developing a sensitivity to tonal color, but indeed they create significant limitations on the degree of creativity possible with a full, unmodified instrument. One of the things mature electronic artists seem to like to point out though is that the limitations of the device are often exactly what is needed to stimulate creativity.
Just in Time as I received my module over the weekend. The Quick Reference guide is a bit lacking so hopefully they are coming out with a more detailed manual soon. No worries as I use @loopop reviews as ad hoc manuals any way :)
I've been thinking about this a bit and it occurs to me that it's not possible to build an intervallic instrument in the physical world. Humans have built and used tools forever; including tools to make music. I'm not a historian but I imagine that the earliest pitched instruments were hollowed out bones with carved holes to change pitch or cat gut strings whose length determined pitch. In either case, the note is always fixed based on the combination of holes open/stopped or the length of 'string.' I simply can't think of a way to make an instrument that would work like Misha in the real world - it's abstract; software, and Leon Gruenbaum's insight, made it possible. Funny but I wonder if we've been stuck for millennia using traditional instruments and only now have opened the door to creating melodies in a simpler way. No training required.
It's totally possible! if you add some electricity and motors like a -5 +5 keyboard connected to a relay system which activates, for example, hammers on a piano, no software nor abstract. Also, it could be purely mechanical without electricity, considerably more complex though. Think that early calculators/computers are basically some levers and gears. If you can make something as complex as a calculator, you sure can do an interval instrument.
Yep you are right. It could be done with gears and levers and such. I was thinking about long history of humans making musical instruments. Totally possible from the time of Babbage.
@@anthonyagnello3733 Oh god but the effort required when you can just program a setting to accomplish the same thing with Ableton and a Linnstrument or Push-type thing. Even with the ability to create such an instrument with ease or considerable effort, it's still the decisions of nested logic by the operator that makes it sound interesting, when done well... even dare I say, musical.
This is a fantastic sequencer and exactly what I've been looking for. This seems aimed at performers and composers with a classical music background and will allow for some in-depth improvisations that you can't really do at a keyboard. Also, I think this is intended to play well with other sequencers! You could sequence a tone row and then use another sequencer to move through the row in different ways. That's how composers use tone rows generally.
This is completely true (in-depth impros) and the reason why I think this format is missing its true potential. The engine really shines with both an expressive MIDI controller and an expressive sound engine. Misha lacks velocity (on board) or any expressive cv out, and eurorack lacks expressive sound engines that takes MIDI (EaganMatrix as only exception). I made a patch on TouchDesigner based on the Samchillian with 4 voices and it's really fun though, I can see it on a little standalone box as MIDI FX, with a computer it's totally replicable. Also, the sequencer is very limited for a module at that cost IMHO.
Great idea. Perhaps if I didn't have Korg SQ-1 & SQ-64 already. $$$ 🙁 But hey, I think I'll wait for the software version. I have purchased a few other EvenTide pedals as software already. 🙂
@@loopop can u pass the section or time stamp? I watched the lil sequence section but not seeing it there. Sorry to trouble u hehe. thanks for the lovely review!
I bought one and it just arrived. I'm using Misha with a percussion controller for chords and solos. So far, its going very well. Thanks for another great video. AMI TrapKat, PanKat, DrumKat, DrumTech custom fsr Pads. Kat KT-M1, Sonic Cell, 1010Music Nanobox, EMU Proteus2000.
Thanks, but did you consider that my equipment list was for someone else, not you? Why would you bother to take the time to comment? Are you a member of the Comment Police? 😆
I’m back after spending time with the Misha and dissecting your review. Two questions: 1) Will you explain your midi flow out of Misha into that specific Eurorack setup, and 2) what is the name of the Black Eurorack unit to the right of the Misha that has the four red characters on the digital display? I am interested in possibly making purchases and setting up my Misha in a similar manner. Thanks.
👁J👁 Hi. I was checking out the VECTORWAVE with plans of buying it and i found out that is recommended for experieced builders. So i am not. ..... can you please name other stuff similar to the Vectorwave?
Such a cool sequencer! Makes it feel like I might just bounce around to different sequencers in the end or maybe have something like a misha and then have something else to just hot swap out if the melodies ever get stale. Thanks for the vid, the thoughtful perspectives and also the teaser for that new RYK module. Loooove the design of that one. It would pair rather nicely with my rample!
Thanks! It wasn't intentional, but I forgot to address the audio output because it doesn't do much as of the current firmware at the time of the review. It outputs a sine wave at the frequency of the main melody. It doesn't play the additional notes if you play chords, and the only waveform is a sine wave. Hopefully, they add more functionality there in a future firmware update!
I’m not sure how to say it but I feel that I must 😊 Love your channel, I’ve watched so many of your videos, they’re incredibly well-presented and informative. You helped me decide to go for Keystep 37 and Novation Launchpad (the comparison between Pro and X was a godsend). But - I am not a hardware guy. I use Bitwig. And the common experience I have when I watch your channel is wanting to scream out loud: Bitwig can do this! I can do that in Bitwig already! And it’s easy! It’s almost become a sport for me: you show something cool Digitakt can do, say, and that same night I have that same thing running in Bitwig. No, seriously. I saw this video a few days ago and my first thought was: can I implement the core concept of Samchillian/Misha in Bitwig’s grid? And of course I could. Middle C is the home key, then five white keys on either side select intervals up and down. It’s an insane way to play, I can’t really do it, lol, but the patch works, and it was easier than I thought it would be. You occasionally mention Ableton Live, but I came here to say that I feel Bitwig could perhaps make an appearance here occasionally, as an alternative for those who can’t or won’t spend 600 euro on something like Misha. Or 850 on Digitakt; the sampler in the grid does those generative out-of-phase loops beautifully, and you can have as many tracks as you want. Or the MidiHub you reviewed elsewhere - Bitwig is all that and more. Hardware is okay too, I didn’t come here to start a war or anything 😊 But if there’s someone out there who loves to do this sort of thing but can’t go the hardware way, why not give them a hint that there’s a much more accessible equivalent in software? (I am not affiliated with Bitwig or anyone at all).
Thanks for the kind words in the beginning and shots fired in the rest!! It depends on what I'm reviewing, but generally speaking you're absolutely right that most of the instruments I show have a similar counterpart in software, bitwig isn't special in that respect. I review mainly hardware because I prefer to interact with physical knobs and faders and avoid DAW arrangements if possible, and I guess most viewers of the channel feel the same way otherwise they'd be watching plugin review channels. And if you're willing to patch stuff yourself, the sky's the limit with grid/max for live/vcv/puredata, the problem is most people aren't. So, not a war at all! Just different preferences. BTW specifically as far as this goes, after I made this video I learned about a plugin from WA Productions that does a very similar thing on the interval side, not the sequencing side (Instascale). I would have mentioned it had I known about it.
Is that piano from pianoteq or is it sampled? It sounds nice. I think I need to go and build a performance tool for this in Bram Bos Mozaic and add blackjack and some more stuff.
Ok as a modifier to previous comment, shouldn't write off this device yet. Loo I have loved your demos for a long time. I think I just need to see another demo with some friggin cv inputs and controlling of an actual oscillator
yeah I don't disagree that it would have been nice to have a few CV based examples, but the video was getting long as is, so in this case I'm relying on the intelligence of my viewers to fill in some blanks...
@@loopop very good point and it obviously is a very powerful unit if it requires all that time to demonstrate features without even involving CV. Certainly can exercise some patience and wait to see how it works more in the context of a patch. Thanks for your content as always!
Hey - thanks! Indeed I didn't mention it in the video because it doesn't do much currently - it generates a sine wave but only for the first note of the chord, so, not much for write home about in the current firmware
I saw the NAMM video on this and it was one of the only things I wanted. I didn't realise it was quite as expensive as what it is. I still want one though.... what to sell, what to sell 🤔
Ziv, perhaps you can clarify the signal chain. Is the Misha playing piano samples on your computer or on the Vectorwav? I don't see a midi in on the vector, unless its through the bus or a jumper in the back.
Hey yes I actually explained that in the first draft of the video but cut it out because it was getting long and didn’t seem material to the module… Misha isn’t connected to Vector Wave for the bulk of the video. For the intro/outro jam, I ran midi out from Misha to my computer so I could render the notes, and then sent Misha’s midi to an arp plugin on my computer and then to Vector Wave via midi in the front panel.
Not blown away by it mostly because it still has way too many limitations for my taste (compared to a computer) but the idea is great, maybe I'll write a script like that for my midi keyboard
@@verbosemusicAny GitLab/GitHub links you care to share? I am working on something somewhat similar using MATLAB whereby I am wanting to sonify numerical sequences. Here, the numbers in the sequence would correspond to the intervals in a given scale. For an example of this, search for Per Nørgård and Infinity Series.
@@parristaylor I have a fairly large modular synthesizer, including plenty of digital modules and I don‘t use VCV rack at all. My problem with Misha is that you’re paying for a lot of extra hardware that adds so little to the core concept, which is a pretty simple MIDI instrument. There’s just not that much here! If the module offered a really compelling playing surface, that would be something, but those nine crummy buttons clearly aren’t compelling. Flipping the proposition around, if this was instead a $30 DAW plugin*, and you own any old MIDI-to-CV interface, you’d lose… basically nothing! You could use whatever MIDI controller you wanted. If you really want to modulate a plug-in from a modular synthesizer, there are various ways to do that, now, too, but right now the value of that remains quite unclear. (*and I’m sure it soon will be)
@@parristaylor I usually agree but in this case is different. IMHO this engine would be best as a cheap standalone MIDI I/O box or as a plugin, because the engine shines with an expressive MIDI controller and an expressive sound engine (I programmed and tested it myself). The best use IMO is enabling deep improvisations only possible knowing how to play keys REALLY well or an acoustic instrument, in which expression is key. Misha itself doesn't have it (velocity only with an external MIDI controller) neither any expressive cv out, and eurorack lacks expressive sound engines that take MIDI (EaganMatrix as only exception). Also, as a sequencer is very limited for a module at that cost IMHO, even with the novelties introduced. Thus, I can understand why Loopop: - Didn't bother to plug any cv/gate in a module (no expressiveness) - Doubled down on using velocity with an external controller (the only way to add it, and MIDI exclusive on a module? weird) - Used a grand piano sound engine (expressive engine based on a classical instrument, rare on modular) - Suggested using another sequencer for Misha (limited sequencer) So as a module, it's ok as it is, specially not having any other format available, but it would be much better: - Adding velocity sensitive pads - Adding AD envelope cv outputs, in which the velocity would translate to the amplitude of the envelope
@@MartinDoudoroffLLC Same. I agree with you; this is certainly not a module I'd consider purchasing given how little it would add to my approach (for the $).
@@stephanrewind I don’t even want or need the module but this is clealy not a gimmick… it’s a powerful and unique sequencer. The only way I could imagine calling this a gimmick is if you thought all sequencers were gimmicks.
Question about using MIDI notes/CC to change the scale: can you just use that to change the scale, or can you use it to change the scale and root note at the same time? So, hypothetically, an external sequencer could cause misha to go to B flat whole tone, then a bar later go to G blues, then another bar later go to C Phrygian, etc?
Yes, you can use CV or MIDI to change both the key and scale but this requires sending 2 messages (loading a specific key is under a different action Type: Key Sig). And yes, your idea could be accomplished very easily with Misha.
Re. "Are there videos..." Yes, sort of. RUclips: Ableton Max, then go to work learning "how to". It's an extremely powerful set of Legos for musicians, but like most things powerful, there is a learning curve. This would not be an extremely complex set of functions individually, but making as good a UI, like the one on Misha, depends on your own needs and conceptualisation skills. It would be a great learning experience tho, and i wouldn't be surprised if someoneS undertake cloning this functionality, if they haven't already begun. Engineering is after all just the merger of conceptualisation and evolution. This is a great concept and execution, IMO. And as always Loopop presents us with a superb demo and overview of what it brings to the party. My only sadness about this device is its $599 price, making it rather inaccessible to the masses and a boutique device, but also motivation to learn Max or other plugin scripting tools. Maybe that was also part of their intent, so kudos to the designers!
I have made a 4 note engine on TouchDesigner (4 mono stacks selected depending on timing, so stack 3 is affected only with previous 2 keys pressed) based on Samchillian too. In my experience it’s really fun but it's a one trick pony. The most interesting was actually playing chords pressing several keys, Loopop only shows that briefly pressing two keys at once, and the chord mode showed extensively in the video are preset chords so it’s not the same. IMO it’s best with very expressive sound engines and for that you really need velocity at least. Knowing most expressive engines are standalone synths or plugins (EaganMatrix the big exception), the lack of on board velocity and the lack of cv outputs (for expression, not jus pitch and gate), I don’t think Misha is the best format to resurrect the Samchillian. Not even talking about the sequencer, which in my opinion is too limited for a module at this price. I can see a little (and affordable) standalone box with proper I/O and a few buttons for settings and direct preset selection, just converting MIDI and hooking up your fav controller. A little bit on the engine, it’s based to work on Sensel Morph Buchla layout which is a match made in heaven. Also, I was lazy and quantization to scale is done afterwards so there are a few intervals not being 1:1
@@Leviathan-mj8gi Regarding Max devices being buggy, I guess you had bad luck overall. I actively use a few that are very reliable, and know other people using max for extensive live use for both audio and video.
Bruh you didnt mention the big flashy light RYK Vector Wave. This looks cool, but damn the pricing is pretty prohibitative with hapax coming back soon.
Hopefully Eventide won't run out of chips after being 'Loopop'd'. This what happened to Plinky which I think is now unobtainable, and currently selling (if you can find one) on eBay for Megabucks. That said, beautiful 'sequencer' here. Something refreshingly different from the usual glut of 'let's make even more techno' modules, which are frankly getting rather boring now.
this is what babylon instascale is doing. assign to your eurorack and thats it! sorry. 1010 music's gears are better to improvisation on audio wave form.
![Blox Fruits Dragon Rework Update [Full Stream]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/EqDAp8udhm0/mqdefault.jpg)
Interesting addition to the world of generative sequencers! Great video as always dude.
I agree. Interesting module and great vid from loopop- though I imagine it will exponentially add to to the amount of Muzak out there.
Perhaps it should be shipped with a health/good taste warning 😂
This thing is so cool. Really impressive new idea. Great review and demonstration as always, loopop!
In some ways, this channel is the definitive ode to the different kinds of sequencer available and how each one is as unique of an instrument as any synth.
Cool to see a really classic company, Eventide, release something like this.
I was thinking the same thing. A company known for it's reverb pedals at that.
@@G8tr1522 if you’re of a certain age, Eventide is actually known for its high end, rack-mount studio effects. Their rack gear was the studio standard for time based effects in the 1970’s. They even made their own RAM. They didn’t make their first stomp box pedal until the 2000’s.
They needed you at the trade shows this year, the demos of this product were head scratchingly bad. Thanks loopop!
Agreed about the sub-standard demos to date, especially for an established company.
Agreed! Other than Steve De Furia’s demo, your video is the best, hands down!
Right, in the first 60 seconds it made so much sense that none of the superbooth vids
thanks for your relentless pursuit of innovative new synth knowledge
Major Silent Shout vibes in that final demo, good stuff!!
So glad I got my NDLR, Ipad with Drambo (& 20 other incredible music apps), Norns, Zoia & MidiHub - Thanks to you !
Very interesting module. I really like the sound of the RYK Vector Synth as well.
Amazing concept - and greatly informative video as always. On my ever expanding wishlist.
That's really fun!
I find myself wishing there were a second set of 9 or so keys for-I'll just call them modifiers-so you can set chord structures, pitch ornaments, timing offsets-and if there were three more outputs, additional CV modulations-and so on as macros while you're in direct play mode. So you can build chord/ornament state machines, as it were, as well as tone rows. Or, a similar idea on the keyboard controlled side, it would be nice if you could map the left hand to transposable chord structure (and again, perhaps other modulations) while the right hand does this intra-tone-row craziness. If you see what I mean. Or maybe (in this hypothetical world) you need to go mad and have two modules chained together, one of them a modulation-oriented alternate firmware (albeit with the same logical structure), deviously chained together so they work this out jointly.
Anyway, certainly made me think, in a very nice way :).
Thanks for the review. I did purchase Misha and I LOVE it!!! As a pianist, this opens up a whole new world of creative possibilities for me, especially as I trigger the intervals freely as a live musician via my midi keyboard. Could there be cheaper VSTs options as some have mentioned? Maybe. However, I am a fan FIRST of tactile and hands-on musicianship and performance, not just “clicking” with a mouse. I can “program” after the fact. This approach is musical for musicians who play. I am a supporter of this product.
To be honest, my only complaint is the amount of HP it takes up for the very little "true" modular integration. It almost feels like this could have been a standalone unit with the CV in/out in the back. Yes, I know that I can probably do that with my own little 4ms Pod, but you get what I'm saying...
Interesting one, glad it can run standalone too. Thanks as ever Loopop
But do you need a Eurorack rack with the power supply to run it? It would be great if they made a fully stand alone version.
@@rozzgrey801 My question too. Some of it's features has things I've always wanted but have zero Eurorack gear and wasn't intending going down that route. Imagine this combined with a Polyend Play
@@rozzgrey801 Yes, you do need the Eurorack AND power. I almost didn’t buy it because of this fact, but I am glad that I did. They are working on a standalone unit. Don’t know when that is coming. However, I do recommend this product.
Gives me a NDLR vibe and as that one is never for sale because of shortages this Misha looks interesting (but expensive!). Great video Sir!
Thanks for an amazing review of a potentially useful new tool.
I'm on the fence with this one. It fills the Midi gap I want to create with my Sinfonion, and has "OK" playability, which the Sinfonion doesn't really have. But I haven't seen anyone demo the CV capabilities of this yet? Alarming. 600 bones is pretty damn steep too
600 is surprisingly cheap
I had a trick, back in the 90s, using a custom-tuned piano patch (with only, say, Cm notes) & a boss MPD-1 drum-pad, which you would finger-drum on whilst twirling the note-select knob.
we got a lot of mileage out of that!
wondering how this stacks up against the NDLR...
As an avid NDLR user (with expansion via Voltage 2 soft eurorack modules) i am intrigued by this kit. I can see them as being very complementary. Great video! Thank you for the clear explanation and demo.
everyone seems to be super excited with this. i've learned through the years that if you don't have nothing nice to say about something people love, then don't say it. so with that in regard, i wont :)
Highly interesting module. Thanks for the review!
“…because on this channel, even Unicorns can be sparklier.”
LOVE THIS
re: 8:10 --> Can someone please correct my spelling. I can't find anything on the originator of this idea, as stated, probably because it is spelled wrong by me... a product called "sem chileon" developed by a guy named "Leon" and there is a picture of an unusual keyboard. Thanks!
What are the biggest differences with an NDLR?
The biggest difference would be the interval based concept at the core of Misha. There are many other differences, but NDLR has a completely different approach to harmony/melody.
@@EventideAudio I understand, thank you very much for the reply
very interesting bit of kit
Thanks for the demo!
You are like the human encyclopedia of electric hardware
28:00 Sequence-ception! I love this so much! 💙 Amazing video thank you for all you do!
is its presence in this video a sign we’re getting a review of the Vector Waves by RYK?
You said in the Pros & Cons section that Misha is "the only Interval Sequencer in town" but what comes first in my mind is Conductive Labs The NDLR, a Four-track MIDI Interval Sequencer
I think it goes to how you define an interval sequencer - NDLR is great, but does not travel up and down scales in intervals like Misha does; it quantizes sequences to scales and chords as well as a whole bunch of other things, just different
Interresting concept. Thank you.
What gear you used for creating the melody of the very first part of this video?? Note: I saw the semi-huge list on the description section.
Can you be specific for: Beginning to 1:20
Funformative, as usual, Z! - a pleasure to watch/listen/learn
I kept expecting that you'd compare it to NDLR in your conclusion, and was kinda surprised you didn't. But then again, I suppose they really have little in common. (i haven't used and can't claim to understand either, beyond having watched your NDLR vids.)
Maybe you can do a jam where you combine and set them in opposition, and in the process compare/contrast them. Weirder idea than I even understand, I suspect.
thanks again!
Thanks! Yes I think people are comparing it to NDLR because of the vertical screen, but they're two quite different things
I initially thought "Meh, another module. Am I bored enough to watch when I'm not into modular?" But after seeing what it does, it immediately became #1 on the list of things I need to implement in my midi processor daemon. It has some fantastic ideas.
Does someone know if a max for live device who does thing like this exist ?
With the piano it sounds like a Zelda BOTW soundtrack generator :D
For the price tag, I do indeed believe this particular unicorn could be a little sparklier.
Some of the sounds are fantastic in this demo. But I think like a few others was disappointed to not see use of the CV inputs. For me the whole point of a high end sequencer would be for generative results using multiple clock inputs and other modulation. I see there are inputs so I'm sure it's possible. I'm sure there are other people who are hoping Misha is like Rene but with added flexibility and playability. But ya, piano samples and midi at that point could just be a standalone unit or controller.
23:23 where is that clip available online?
I don’t know
@@loopop Did Steve send you that privately?
@@zmix yes
This module is awesome 💥💥💥🔥🔥🔥
Where does the Midi Map at 20:23 come from? There is no manual so far, and it is not in the Quick Ref doc. Posting a pdf would be very helpful. Thank you, and for the great video as usual!
You can find the default MIDI map on page 34 of the user manual here: downloads.eventide.com/audio/manuals/misha/MishaUserGuide.pdf
Interesting concept perhaps applied to ear training. However, this makes you appreciate a great jazz musicians instant playing access to all scales and arpeggios of all types in all keys! While a cool short cut, it might be faster to stick to the traditional keyboard and human brain in executing chromatic western music instantly in all of the keys! Where soloing becomes particularly interesting and good is learning to play the non melodic based pitches while soloing, meaning the non scale tones between the scales notes.
Excellent comment. I wonder if the real magic isn't in the possibilities of externally controlling this device with sequencers or other devices modulating algorithmic manipulations.
My experience with scalar controllers is that for those of us lacking the training of a skilled musician, devices like the Kordbot or the NDLR can actually be tools to visually learn theory via pattern recognition and I suspect that is also true for developing a sensitivity to tonal color, but indeed they create significant limitations on the degree of creativity possible with a full, unmodified instrument.
One of the things mature electronic artists seem to like to point out though is that the limitations of the device are often exactly what is needed to stimulate creativity.
Just in Time as I received my module over the weekend. The Quick Reference guide is a bit lacking so hopefully they are coming out with a more detailed manual soon. No worries as I use @loopop reviews as ad hoc manuals any way :)
Sorry for the delay! You can find the full user manual here -downloads.eventide.com/audio/manuals/misha/MishaUserGuide.pdf
I've been thinking about this a bit and it occurs to me that it's not possible to build an intervallic instrument in the physical world. Humans have built and used tools forever; including tools to make music. I'm not a historian but I imagine that the earliest pitched instruments were hollowed out bones with carved holes to change pitch or cat gut strings whose length determined pitch. In either case, the note is always fixed based on the combination of holes open/stopped or the length of 'string.' I simply can't think of a way to make an instrument that would work like Misha in the real world - it's abstract; software, and Leon Gruenbaum's insight, made it possible. Funny but I wonder if we've been stuck for millennia using traditional instruments and only now have opened the door to creating melodies in a simpler way. No training required.
It's totally possible! if you add some electricity and motors like a -5 +5 keyboard connected to a relay system which activates, for example, hammers on a piano, no software nor abstract. Also, it could be purely mechanical without electricity, considerably more complex though. Think that early calculators/computers are basically some levers and gears. If you can make something as complex as a calculator, you sure can do an interval instrument.
Yep you are right. It could be done with gears and levers and such. I was thinking about long history of humans making musical instruments. Totally possible from the time of Babbage.
@@anthonyagnello3733 Oh god but the effort required when you can just program a setting to accomplish the same thing with Ableton and a Linnstrument or Push-type thing.
Even with the ability to create such an instrument with ease or considerable effort, it's still the decisions of nested logic by the operator that makes it sound interesting, when done well... even dare I say, musical.
Misha Mansoor needs to get on this immediately.
Excellent review of an interesting product. May I ask you what case are you using in this video? Thank you
Thanks! It's by @2manysynths FYI you can always check the description for what's in my videos
This is a fantastic sequencer and exactly what I've been looking for. This seems aimed at performers and composers with a classical music background and will allow for some in-depth improvisations that you can't really do at a keyboard.
Also, I think this is intended to play well with other sequencers! You could sequence a tone row and then use another sequencer to move through the row in different ways. That's how composers use tone rows generally.
This is completely true (in-depth impros) and the reason why I think this format is missing its true potential. The engine really shines with both an expressive MIDI controller and an expressive sound engine. Misha lacks velocity (on board) or any expressive cv out, and eurorack lacks expressive sound engines that takes MIDI (EaganMatrix as only exception). I made a patch on TouchDesigner based on the Samchillian with 4 voices and it's really fun though, I can see it on a little standalone box as MIDI FX, with a computer it's totally replicable. Also, the sequencer is very limited for a module at that cost IMHO.
Three minutes in and I want one.
Great idea. Perhaps if I didn't have Korg SQ-1 & SQ-64 already. $$$ 🙁 But hey, I think I'll wait for the software version. I have purchased a few other EvenTide pedals as software already. 🙂
I don’t understand why it is eurorack ? It s for keyboard composers, not for modulare world
Is there any way to add rest steps where no note plays? I haven't seen or read this is possible anywhere.
yes I show it briefly in the video
@@loopop can u pass the section or time stamp? I watched the lil sequence section but not seeing it there. Sorry to trouble u hehe. thanks for the lovely review!
@@array_1337 sorry I don’t remember my videos by heart to the minute…
How good is that..
Would love to see a Behringer RD9 Loopop review...
One of those rare modules that makes me want to break my now Eurorack rule
Now* Eurorack? Freudian slip? 😊
Sell everything and go eurorack. It’s the “dawless” endgame
Great idea - seems like a bit of an overkill for a Eurorack modules. Know of any VSTs that do this? Any word of Eventide is planning on releasing one?
There are endless Max for Live devices - tonerow generators and tools like this
Instascale by WA Productions covers this ground.
@fisongb perfect! I can use that in Ableton and send the cv to my rack through my Bored Brain OPTX module! Thanks.
Man, I really think this, the Euroburo, and the EastBeast would make a super cool 3-module setup.
Your not wrong.
Intriguing! I'm still only halfway through the listen, but does it do advanced voice leading? Blocky chord movements are kinda... eh
I bought one and it just arrived. I'm using Misha with a percussion controller for chords and solos. So far, its going very well. Thanks for another great video.
AMI TrapKat, PanKat, DrumKat, DrumTech custom fsr Pads.
Kat KT-M1, Sonic Cell, 1010Music Nanobox, EMU Proteus2000.
Yo happy for you that you got one of these, but we're not on [insert name of synth forum] now... you don't have to list out your synths/gear XD
Thanks, but did you consider that my equipment list was for someone else, not you? Why would you bother to take the time to comment? Are you a member of the Comment Police? 😆
Does anyone know what Eurorack enclosure that is?
See description
I’m back after spending time with the Misha and dissecting your review. Two questions: 1) Will you explain your midi flow out of Misha into that specific Eurorack setup, and 2) what is the name of the Black Eurorack unit to the right of the Misha that has the four red characters on the digital display? I am interested in possibly making purchases and setting up my Misha in a similar manner.
Thanks.
everything is explained in the description
@@loopop I totally missed that since I didn’t click the description drop down. Thanks!😀
👁J👁 Hi. I was checking out the VECTORWAVE with plans of buying it and i found out that is recommended for experieced builders. So i am not. ..... can you please name other stuff similar to the Vectorwave?
The assembled version of the Vector Wave is very similar . . . 🙂
@@RYKModular i visit the web site again..... i do not have a clue how it happened that i did not saw it 🙃.... thank you
👍👍🏻👍🏼👍🏽👍🏾👍🏿
a new module!!!
exciting!:)
This module seems to provide a similar functionality to the sequencer part of the Moog Subharmonicon, if I'm not mistaken? Very interesting!
Such a cool sequencer! Makes it feel like I might just bounce around to different sequencers in the end or maybe have something like a misha and then have something else to just hot swap out if the melodies ever get stale. Thanks for the vid, the thoughtful perspectives and also the teaser for that new RYK module. Loooove the design of that one. It would pair rather nicely with my rample!
by the way, I got it but I can use it w my midi keyboard because Eventide did not include the midi cable adaptor.
Great review (and interesting module), but what is the Audio-out jack for?
Thanks! It wasn't intentional, but I forgot to address the audio output because it doesn't do much as of the current firmware at the time of the review. It outputs a sine wave at the frequency of the main melody. It doesn't play the additional notes if you play chords, and the only waveform is a sine wave. Hopefully, they add more functionality there in a future firmware update!
@@loopop thanks for clearing that out. I guess they'll update that functionality too 👌🏻
is there a max4live equivalent?
like it! what about VS Conductive Labs The NDLR?
That looks great.
Can you write and play a pop or blues song with Misha?
I’m not sure how to say it but I feel that I must 😊 Love your channel, I’ve watched so many of your videos, they’re incredibly well-presented and informative. You helped me decide to go for Keystep 37 and Novation Launchpad (the comparison between Pro and X was a godsend).
But - I am not a hardware guy. I use Bitwig. And the common experience I have when I watch your channel is wanting to scream out loud: Bitwig can do this! I can do that in Bitwig already! And it’s easy! It’s almost become a sport for me: you show something cool Digitakt can do, say, and that same night I have that same thing running in Bitwig.
No, seriously. I saw this video a few days ago and my first thought was: can I implement the core concept of Samchillian/Misha in Bitwig’s grid? And of course I could. Middle C is the home key, then five white keys on either side select intervals up and down. It’s an insane way to play, I can’t really do it, lol, but the patch works, and it was easier than I thought it would be.
You occasionally mention Ableton Live, but I came here to say that I feel Bitwig could perhaps make an appearance here occasionally, as an alternative for those who can’t or won’t spend 600 euro on something like Misha. Or 850 on Digitakt; the sampler in the grid does those generative out-of-phase loops beautifully, and you can have as many tracks as you want. Or the MidiHub you reviewed elsewhere - Bitwig is all that and more.
Hardware is okay too, I didn’t come here to start a war or anything 😊 But if there’s someone out there who loves to do this sort of thing but can’t go the hardware way, why not give them a hint that there’s a much more accessible equivalent in software?
(I am not affiliated with Bitwig or anyone at all).
Thanks for the kind words in the beginning and shots fired in the rest!! It depends on what I'm reviewing, but generally speaking you're absolutely right that most of the instruments I show have a similar counterpart in software, bitwig isn't special in that respect. I review mainly hardware because I prefer to interact with physical knobs and faders and avoid DAW arrangements if possible, and I guess most viewers of the channel feel the same way otherwise they'd be watching plugin review channels. And if you're willing to patch stuff yourself, the sky's the limit with grid/max for live/vcv/puredata, the problem is most people aren't. So, not a war at all! Just different preferences. BTW specifically as far as this goes, after I made this video I learned about a plugin from WA Productions that does a very similar thing on the interval side, not the sequencing side (Instascale). I would have mentioned it had I known about it.
Is that piano from pianoteq or is it sampled? It sounds nice. I think I need to go and build a performance tool for this in Bram Bos Mozaic and add blackjack and some more stuff.
It's Piano V2 from Arturia
Ok as a modifier to previous comment, shouldn't write off this device yet. Loo I have loved your demos for a long time. I think I just need to see another demo with some friggin cv inputs and controlling of an actual oscillator
yeah I don't disagree that it would have been nice to have a few CV based examples, but the video was getting long as is, so in this case I'm relying on the intelligence of my viewers to fill in some blanks...
@@loopop very good point and it obviously is a very powerful unit if it requires all that time to demonstrate features without even involving CV. Certainly can exercise some patience and wait to see how it works more in the context of a patch. Thanks for your content as always!
I used the affiliate link to buy it, thanks! What's the purpose of the jack labeled "audio"?
Hey - thanks! Indeed I didn't mention it in the video because it doesn't do much currently - it generates a sine wave but only for the first note of the chord, so, not much for write home about in the current firmware
What’s that RYK? Module to the right with the long screen?
See description
I saw the NAMM video on this and it was one of the only things I wanted. I didn't realise it was quite as expensive as what it is. I still want one though.... what to sell, what to sell 🤔
Ziv, perhaps you can clarify the signal chain. Is the Misha playing piano samples on your computer or on the Vectorwav? I don't see a midi in on the vector, unless its through the bus or a jumper in the back.
Hey yes I actually explained that in the first draft of the video but cut it out because it was getting long and didn’t seem material to the module… Misha isn’t connected to Vector Wave for the bulk of the video. For the intro/outro jam, I ran midi out from Misha to my computer so I could render the notes, and then sent Misha’s midi to an arp plugin on my computer and then to Vector Wave via midi in the front panel.
Anyone know of a generative sequencer i can run off ipad ??
ruclips.net/video/yHdqZSZS8TY/видео.html might be helpful?
Not blown away by it mostly because it still has way too many limitations for my taste (compared to a computer) but the idea is great, maybe I'll write a script like that for my midi keyboard
I did it and it’s really fun, specially with several stacks of notes / poly. Not like the preset chords shown here.
@@verbosemusicAny GitLab/GitHub links you care to share? I am working on something somewhat similar using MATLAB whereby I am wanting to sonify numerical sequences. Here, the numbers in the sequence would correspond to the intervals in a given scale. For an example of this, search for Per Nørgård and Infinity Series.
I wish they’d just release all their existing pedals on Eurorack format.
Schoenberg is clawing at the walls of his coffin
Does it djent?
At the ~9:36 mark I swear I thought I was about to hear the Rugrats theme.
Wish they had a desktop /standalone version
Pop it in a 4MS pod.
This thing seems seriously cool, but it does seem to thrive using MIDI rather than just CV which it probably would use in my rig.
Much like Gattobus was hired by Roland, a lot of manufacturers would do well by employing you as a professional product demonstrator.
Thanks! I don’t accept money from companies, but if they make original or interesting gear I’m happy to cover it!
It’s fun, but seems like it could just be a cheap plugin instead of a $600 piece of hardware.
Isn't that true of all synths? Why don't we all just use VCV rack?
@@parristaylor I have a fairly large modular synthesizer, including plenty of digital modules and I don‘t use VCV rack at all. My problem with Misha is that you’re paying for a lot of extra hardware that adds so little to the core concept, which is a pretty simple MIDI instrument. There’s just not that much here! If the module offered a really compelling playing surface, that would be something, but those nine crummy buttons clearly aren’t compelling. Flipping the proposition around, if this was instead a $30 DAW plugin*, and you own any old MIDI-to-CV interface, you’d lose… basically nothing! You could use whatever MIDI controller you wanted. If you really want to modulate a plug-in from a modular synthesizer, there are various ways to do that, now, too, but right now the value of that remains quite unclear. (*and I’m sure it soon will be)
@@parristaylor I usually agree but in this case is different. IMHO this engine would be best as a cheap standalone MIDI I/O box or as a plugin, because the engine shines with an expressive MIDI controller and an expressive sound engine (I programmed and tested it myself). The best use IMO is enabling deep improvisations only possible knowing how to play keys REALLY well or an acoustic instrument, in which expression is key.
Misha itself doesn't have it (velocity only with an external MIDI controller) neither any expressive cv out, and eurorack lacks expressive sound engines that take MIDI (EaganMatrix as only exception). Also, as a sequencer is very limited for a module at that cost IMHO, even with the novelties introduced.
Thus, I can understand why Loopop:
- Didn't bother to plug any cv/gate in a module (no expressiveness)
- Doubled down on using velocity with an external controller (the only way to add it, and MIDI exclusive on a module? weird)
- Used a grand piano sound engine (expressive engine based on a classical instrument, rare on modular)
- Suggested using another sequencer for Misha (limited sequencer)
So as a module, it's ok as it is, specially not having any other format available, but it would be much better:
- Adding velocity sensitive pads
- Adding AD envelope cv outputs, in which the velocity would translate to the amplitude of the envelope
@@MartinDoudoroffLLC Same. I agree with you; this is certainly not a module I'd consider purchasing given how little it would add to my approach (for the $).
@@stephanrewind I don’t even want or need the module but this is clealy not a gimmick… it’s a powerful and unique sequencer. The only way I could imagine calling this a gimmick is if you thought all sequencers were gimmicks.
Question about using MIDI notes/CC to change the scale: can you just use that to change the scale, or can you use it to change the scale and root note at the same time? So, hypothetically, an external sequencer could cause misha to go to B flat whole tone, then a bar later go to G blues, then another bar later go to C Phrygian, etc?
Yes, you can use CV or MIDI to change both the key and scale but this requires sending 2 messages (loading a specific key is under a different action Type: Key Sig). And yes, your idea could be accomplished very easily with Misha.
i just can't see a reason for purchasing this, when ableton is a much more flexible generative sequencer with follow actions in session view.
Just curious... How many hours did you invest in learning this module before making this video?
It probably took 2-3 days to get a good feel for it. If I had my video it would be much less!
The core functionality of this module is a max patch you could make in 20 mins
Are there videos about how to do so? Thanks
Re. "Are there videos..."
Yes, sort of. RUclips: Ableton Max, then go to work learning "how to".
It's an extremely powerful set of Legos for musicians, but like most things powerful, there is a learning curve. This would not be an extremely complex set of functions individually, but making as good a UI, like the one on Misha, depends on your own needs and conceptualisation skills. It would be a great learning experience tho, and i wouldn't be surprised if someoneS undertake cloning this functionality, if they haven't already begun. Engineering is after all just the merger of conceptualisation and evolution. This is a great concept and execution, IMO. And as always Loopop presents us with a superb demo and overview of what it brings to the party.
My only sadness about this device is its $599 price, making it rather inaccessible to the masses and a boutique device, but also motivation to learn Max or other plugin scripting tools. Maybe that was also part of their intent, so kudos to the designers!
I have made a 4 note engine on TouchDesigner (4 mono stacks selected depending on timing, so stack 3 is affected only with previous 2 keys pressed) based on Samchillian too.
In my experience it’s really fun but it's a one trick pony. The most interesting was actually playing chords pressing several keys, Loopop only shows that briefly pressing two keys at once, and the chord mode showed extensively in the video are preset chords so it’s not the same. IMO it’s best with very expressive sound engines and for that you really need velocity at least.
Knowing most expressive engines are standalone synths or plugins (EaganMatrix the big exception), the lack of on board velocity and the lack of cv outputs (for expression, not jus pitch and gate), I don’t think Misha is the best format to resurrect the Samchillian. Not even talking about the sequencer, which in my opinion is too limited for a module at this price.
I can see a little (and affordable) standalone box with proper I/O and a few buttons for settings and direct preset selection, just converting MIDI and hooking up your fav controller.
A little bit on the engine, it’s based to work on Sensel Morph Buchla layout which is a match made in heaven. Also, I was lazy and quantization to scale is done afterwards so there are a few intervals not being 1:1
Some people value time over money and don't have time to waste playing with obtuse tools
@@Leviathan-mj8gi Regarding Max devices being buggy, I guess you had bad luck overall. I actively use a few that are very reliable, and know other people using max for extensive live use for both audio and video.
Somehow I've lived 42 years without realizing the alphabet song is the same as twinkle twinkle little star. 🤦♂
Effff....
It is. Total ripoff.
Ah! vous dirais-je, Maman
34 years here lol
Lordy! 53 years for me! 😬
Superb
Bruh you didnt mention the big flashy light RYK Vector Wave. This looks cool, but damn the pricing is pretty prohibitative with hapax coming back soon.
Setup details are typically in the description but yes Vector Wave is cool
oh bollox, the GAS is real 😂
Hey cool, I've been designing something quite similar
inspired by Noodler i would say.
actually this is quite different (and based on Samchillian, which was created way before NDLR)
@@loopop there you go, my bad:) that’s why we have you to educate us:) Samchillian, thats long time ago!
Yes the Silmarillion was like the predecessor to the Lord of the Rings
@@jacklinks7554 it was and it is, but it was written after LOTR :).
Hopefully Eventide won't run out of chips after being 'Loopop'd'. This what happened to Plinky which I think is now unobtainable, and currently selling (if you can find one) on eBay for Megabucks. That said, beautiful 'sequencer' here. Something refreshingly different from the usual glut of 'let's make even more techno' modules, which are frankly getting rather boring now.
lovely ...
Bitwig does that with ease. 😊
max !
this is what babylon instascale is doing. assign to your eurorack and thats it! sorry. 1010 music's gears are better to improvisation on audio wave form.