this sort of applies more when you play with random people or first time in a pod. I understand flying under the radar is influential in a commander game. Having said that, personally anyway, I don't really feel it's winning due to gotcha mechanics or play style. Like playing an unknown commander just to effectively catch opponents off guard in that manner to me isn't a fulfilling win. For example I will explain to a table, new or old, what my commander is doing and what the deck intends to do. To me that's like winning a boardgame against a table of players playing for their first time.
I honestly have the opposite problem. When people see my commander is some creature they've never seen before, it's dog pile time. I don't know what they think Axelrod Gunnarson is going to combo off with, but they assume it's something big. I actually have started playing more common commanders to avoid people ganging up to avoid some imaginary combo they think is coming.
Are you sure it's not the PTSD-Argument? If people go for your stuff, because they think you're comboing off, it might be because you're playing combos way to much and people hate on you for this. I have a guy in my play group who is like this. "Oh, why do you target this". Well, because you always play sh*t down. You always do degenerate stuff. And the only time you're not complaining is, when we let you play solitair. This sounds like a massive you-problem.
I've had this happen to me as well. I play unpopular commanders and people are like 'I have no idea what that commander is I'm just going to kill it and target you because I don't know what to expect'.
A relatively new player at my LGS just sent sooo much money making an Ur-Dragon deck and he hasn't won once because everyone just attacks him first. He gets so salty like "you don't even let me do my thing." Yeah, because if you do your thing you win, buddy.
There was a dude at my old LGS that was the same way. He would buy decks that were just outside the realm of CEDH, strong enough that they pubstomp normal tables but can't hang at CEDH tables. And so he would get focused down and would always get SO angry. and it's like dude, you had to know what would happen here.
someone else commented "i'm not going to play an obscure commander just to increase my win percentage". your example is actually the main reason to do it. being the arch enemy isn't fun.
Seems like a toxic LGS. Imagine being a veteran player scared that an UR dragon deck is so powerful that you need to bully the newbie. There’s other ways to interact with many decks and players but ganging up on someone just because they have a “strong” commander seems little man energy.
I tend to play commanders on the more popular side of things because I find them more interesting to play with, but my strategy is to throw in a certain small percentage of rarely-seen jank along with the very synergistic pieces. It tends to dilute threat assessment just enough that I'm consistently not archenemy. But the decks still consistently win because they have such a high level of synergy.
I start with art. Whether the commander has 6000 or 600 decks on EDHRec, if I don't like the art, I don't bother. That's why I have a Tergrid deck and a Nihiloor deck, just for examples. Nihiloor has 8000. I also have a Thalia deck, she has 500 decks or so, and I have a Snapdax deck, who has 850 decks on EDHrec.
That's what got me playing Tibor and Lumia. They reminded me of Gol and Maia from Jak & Daxter, and I loved the art. It took a really long time to nail the build but it's one of my favorite decks now.
I dont play Korvold as a Commander anymore. I just put him in the 99 of my Slimefoot and Squee deck and play him and then play him again and again and again 😆
ive got a thallid smokestacks deck with atraxa. when i take her out i specify that the deck has no +1/+1 counters, no infect or poison and no planeswalkers
@@simonchi5372 descent into madness, tanglewire, possessed portal... and i have atraxas name renamed as "mike tython, the one who makeths you eat your thallid"
As said, it “starts” with your Commander. Unless your Commander is noted for combos however, what you play matters as well. You can have a Blue commander I have never heard of but if you play a Rhystic study early game, you may be the archenemy. So your strategy would have to be consistent to stay under the radar. It is a multiplayer game as well. So, if you show up with a Muldrotha deck, it may be popular but if the other two players are Korvold and Edgar Markov, you will not be archenemy. It’s like the joke about how you don’t have to run faster than the bear chasing you, you just have to run faster than your slowest friend. Lastly, EDHREC reflects only the last two years of decks posted. Your Commander could be one that a lot of decks were built for and are out there but does not draw as much attention in new deck building. If you are playing a Commander from 2+ years ago, chances are there are a lot more of it out there than EDHREC shows, that may just not be constantly updating the decklist to be current.
I feel like PTSD point you made is more prevalent for me, it doesn't matter what commander I play, if the deck has been scary to anyone in recent memory I will be a target. I have 2 regular play groups and the Igs I go to has under 20 people attending commander nights, so I can see the first point being more relevant if you play with different people all the time. I don't go out of my way to not play the top 100, I looked and one of my commanders is #83, but if I'm playing a commander that's not the absolutely most popular or powerful and I have a game plan that people might not be familiar with I get away with more for a longer amount of time. I think different things stand out to different people though, like one person in my playgroup is very much an aggro player and being powerful in an aggressive way or doing something that is good against an aggressive deck its very threatening to him, but if you draw a billion cards he doesn't notice. Another is a control player at heart who notices when you are leaving up mana every turn and will try to interact with everything you have to draw out your counterspells, so I think looking scary and being a target can vary a lot.
I've got the Ur Dragon and Gishath sleeved. Both of those decks have an overwhelmingly (for commander) high win rate. The trick for decks like that is to go in knowingly good and well you're gonna be the arch enemy.
I've gotten like this in recent months. I love finding obscure cards for the 99 especially older cards nobody has heard of. When it comes to commanders I love value guys who may not be the strongest but give me something when they are on the field. The result has led to my commanders being less targeted and people actually being interested in seeing what my cards do instead of instantly focusing on me because I pulled out a top 50 pub stomper.
As disadvantageous as it may be I will build without looking at edh rank, if I like what a commander does or it fits the theme gameplay or flavor I will play that commander. I agree with lower ranked commanders having less of a target on their back but to go out of one's way and set an absolute to not build those with more than 1000 decks seems excessive even to suggest. if the druid commander drops seedborn or doubling I'm throwing everything at them regardless of the commander. I build budgety(ish) 150 let's say, I much rather see a popular commander built originally than an unpopular one running staples to make up for hardly having a strategy to build around, which is often the case with fringe commanders
I agree with the part about not making your commander a huge target, but I think there is a problem with hiding your deck's strategy that you didn't bring up in the video, which is that it won't work against the same table twice. Once you've played your hand, then those players will either know you're a threat and focus you or know which key combo pieces to remove. Not that you should reveal everything you have, of course, but if my self is considered a threat, then I dont take that as a failure, but as a sign that my deck is functioning as intended.
Yeah. This is a good point. I’ve played Gluntch the Bestower with my pod and now they know to just kill me if possible. I usually win by turn 7 with him and my friends got ptsd.
The easiest way for me to "win" a game, used to be just pulling out my Krenko deck. Everyone would see it, groan, and not even want to play.😢 That's not winning.
I have a favorite creature type (angels) so I just build and play around my favorite angel from each possible color combo. So far I have all 6 of the 3-color combinations that include white and 2 out of 4 of the 2 color combos. Not in any hurry to build a 4-color Atraxa deck.
This is some real dedication, props for that, and also now I want to have every color combination of angel deck since I’ve been complaining that maelstrom angel isn’t legendary
I really enjoy the strategy topics. I recently watched the Prof’s video @TolarianCommunityCollege about threat assessment and 100% agree the game is better when people use better threat assessment including the commander being played
Another reason is when you play a popular commander and build it differently from the most popular builds, you start getting everyone coming up and going "why aren't you just building it this way?" "Why aren't you playing X card(s)?"
I’ve personally build over 200+ different commanders in a span of 5 years. I like casual edh; no stax, no extra turns, limited fast mana, maybe 1 infinite max, limited to no tutors, and even precon games. From experience; most ppl power creep edh and have too competitive of a mindset. You either have to find a group that allows janky commanders, OR what I’ve recently done is brew a more popular/powerful commander but my 99 is bulk cards, budget staples, and pet cards that fit theme. Green ramp is strong enough to also carry most jank or budget brews.
@Theanthill216 i have at least a smokestack in every one of my edh decks. its the theme i enjoy. if my deck has more synergy ill run, winter orb, tanglewire, descent into madness, and possessed portal etc
@@62chipo then you have to realize that 90%+ of players would consider that either not casual, or will groan in misery and not want to pod with you. If you have a playgroup that doesn’t care that’s fine, but at an edh day at an lgs with that bs and ppl would not be happy. Imagine having limited time to play mtg in general, and you sit down to a stax pod where you have a “non game” and your time was wasted……
Holding up mana to bluff something doesn’t work against me because I was taught that it’s better to make them have it. If you go to do something and they kill your creature or counter your spell, you’ve forced the interaction and now they’re down a piece. So are you, but I can probably find a way to adapt to what happened to still threaten a win. And who knows, I could be casting something just kind of powerful to bait out counterspell just to play something even more powerful behind it
Best example of this for me is The First Sliver. That is objectively a very powerful commander, and a fairly popular one as well. But it's not strong enough to make up for the reputation disadvantage. I am not someone who likes targeting people on the basis of their commander, but if you're playing The First Sliver, I have NO CHOICE but to join the entire table in dogpiling you, because we all know that if your commander resolves we're all just gonna drown in slivers. This contributes to a larger issue of people playing cards because they're "optimal." Sure your Rhystic Study may be the optimal draw option in your Azorius deck, but the sheer amount of vitriol you earn just by playing that card isn't worth it. And it's a removal magnet anyway so there's no guarantee you'll get any value off of it at all. I'd much rather play something like Trouble in Pairs. It's a strong draw option that will almost certainly earn you a card on most players turns, but it's unintrusive enough that most people won't think to remove it. Like, if there's a Rhystic Study and a Trouble in Pairs on the field and you have a Nature's Claim in hand, which are you gonna target? Just because a card is "optimal" doesn't mean it's the best option.
While i agree for the most part, it can be really fun to be the arch enemy. And as basic and straight forward as gisath suns avatar is i will never not be excited to hit with that big stompy dino. Its reached a point now where the whole fun of that deck is baiting out counters so i can get one attack in, which is still fun, just different.
playing Khalitas Traitor of Ghet and Olivia Mobilized for war. And they are suprised at how I beat them, Olivia is a reanimator deck and Kalitas is a voltron style. My decks sneaks up on them. It was satisfying.
I looove playing commanders nobody plays! They are more fun to build around or with. Currently my favorite deck to play is my white blue Jem Lightefoot deck! She seems awful to everyone, but she goes crazy paired with dungeons, foretell, plot, and a little flash sprinkled in. By the time I got what I need I almost don't need my hand anymore haha! I fully believe any commander can work, and you'll have the most fun building with bizarre or unpopular commanders. ^_^
New players (seasoned, just new to the pod I’m in) ALWAYS underestimate Plargg and Nassari. They’ve usually never heard of it and are just like, “lol ok sure bud.” Originally built with bulk rares and mythics as a joke, it has since become my most powerful and competitive deck.
Only 3 out of my 9 decks were in the top 100 Commanders and two were played completely different to the common EDHRec build, like my Animar is all artifacts (I did it before the RecCast guys did it), 5C Omnath was all Mutate and my Myrkul is elf tribal.
I remember falling victim to EDH PTSD at LGS commander night, I was playing Zirilan the Claw mono red dragon deck and the Atraxa player at my table made it a point to target me just because he lost to a player who had a Zirilan deck.
I think this is a great point about the format. I play Atraxa, Grand Unifier - not an unpopular commander by any means. I was playing in a league and my commander got countered four or five times IN ONE GAME. When I asked the pod why they felt the need to focus me down, one said, "I know what Atraxa is capable of. I've seen that deck." Then it turned out he thought it was the OG Atraxa... despite me doing nothing with Planeswalkers or Infect... so, your commander matters. Still love my Atraxa deck, though.
I feel like once people understand how powerful particular lines of text are and how it can work in connunction with other cards the creature doesnt really matter. Also in a world where "exchange of words" is somehow a legal magic card, 11/12 times imma make some random creature my commanders text box, then imprisoned in the moon my own bad boy.
Similar reasoning as to why my current decks are mairsil toolbox, 8 1/2 Tails mono white manual Storm, and aeve mono green manual storm (no slime against humanity), endrek sahr black storm/burn, zirilan aggro-toolbox, pharika as a group slug/graveyard deck. And atogatog (not good stuff) focused around atog sax combos at instant speed to pump atog atog during combat or barren glory flashed in with kaerveks spite to shoot for a win in someone's end step. I have a mono color storm deck in the works for each color because pushing the limits of each color is my favorite part of deck building. Synergy always rules over optimization for me. For example Id rather my blue decks have synergistic value in its conterspells rather than just run the standard big 5ish that don't have any synergy but do their job really well. Most of my decks fly under the radar due to looking "bad" but while I don't always win I always kill at least one player at my tables.
My LGS have very much figured out, ypu dont let me untap with Ovika or Imodane. Henzie works because they feel like if they kill Henzie it slows me down but makes Henzie more powerful. That said im always interested in playing lesser known cards, i got really excited to have a The Master, Multiplied deck as a doctor sho fan, but bevauae everyone had thought about the deck it was killed on sight.
I've heard that uncnventional commanders make people nervous and your opponents will attack you out of caution. O guess that the only way you can avoid being the target is not playing
Funny thing: there was a time where you played Snow-covered lands in Pauper just to keep your opponent guessing. You didnt have to benefit from them, you just wanted the misinformation to give them
Rather than restricting myself to less popular commanders, i subscribe to "i'm gonna build the commanders that i want to build". Popularity (or lack of) be damned. My only caveat is that i try not to do a deck that one of my regular opponents already has on the go. There's no reason for carbon copies of decks within the same regular playgroup. I've got decks for commanders in the top 100, i've got decks for commanders with less than 500 on edhrec, and a pretty good spread inbetween. And you know what? My enjoyment of said decks, the power level or even the win rate of the decks:.... there's no correlation between any of that & the commander popularity. (Not that win rate in commander is something you should ever care overly about. Care about everyone having fun. If you wanna care about win rate, play Cedh or better yet one of the 60 card 1v1 competitive formats.) Now obviously your mileage may vary. But locking myself out of building certain commanders based on their popularity just feels nonsensical. Now i'm commenting from pretty early in the video, i assume there's going to be a section on how popular commanders may draw unwanted attention from unfamiliar players. You can fix that with a decent rule zero convo, or build your deck to cope with it. The other end of the scale is the unknown commander that flies under the radar & then steals the game out of nowhere... great fun for the player doing it, maybe less so for the other 3 players. There's plenty of considerations about when/where/how to play your commander deck. Those considerations do change slightly based on the popularity of your deck & the company you are playing with. The importance of these considerations doesn't change, nor the upset that can be caused by ignoring them.
Had to look the card up, but how is it so few?? I guess people just have better options for reanimator and don’t want to exile their stuff? Idk tho I like the feel of this commander in particular
@@micahhonig1575 This is true for just pure reanimator, but the fact that Sauron turns the reanimated creatures into wraiths is super synergistic with nazgul and ring tempting, allowing you to get a huge board super quickly with the +1/+1 counters the nazgul give your board. I made a cycle themed deck with Sauron because this iteration of the deck cares less about reanimating big targets (they come back as 3/3s anyway) and more about drawing our way into as many nazgul as possible and just reanimating literally anything. We have a couple ETBs and bombs to give us the edge but there's not the focus of the deck by any means.
i tried adeliz, the cinder wind as some spellslinger aggro deck and it's kinda wonky but it can pop off quite well (no infinite combos tho) yet people ganged up on me cause they were so frightened of her for god knows what reason. is she that scary? like i just felt in love with the idea of buff grandpas with pointy hats that smash peoples faces
One of my first commander deck was a classic krenko deck, it was way too powerful and ended up taking it apart to make a ib halfheart one and it's so much more fun
I have always loved doing things that cause a bit of confusion One of my favorites is Omnath, Locus of All - it's a buyback deck with an emphasis on manipulating color and land keywords I had an idea for Ivy, Gleeful Spelltheif that I thought was clever Checked to see if other people were doing mutate with her and was soundly disappointed that they it was half - that kind of put a damper on that deck idea
I have a friend that swapped Zacama to Gishath. If he plays his dinosaur deck, we now need to choose between letting him do the thing and not losing because the thing is too powerful. If I’m in Esper, I’m probably gonna be running Deny The Witch. I recently had to save that for the Gishath that I knew was coming up and have faith that the token player who cast a Craterhoof would get fogged. Edit: On mobile, didn’t notice a word got merced.
It’s always interesting to see casual players try to make their decks worse in order to win more . I thought casual “ wasn’t just about winning “ - that’s what the EDH rules committee says
I use a couple of commanders that are on the more popular end of the spectrum, but I try to use it in a way that isn't the usual way, although still not entirely unique. For example, my Animar, Soul of Elements deck is still heavy into creatures for the +1/+1 ability, but I don't care about the cost reduction aspect of the commander at all. I'm going for commander damage kills by using Lure and Nemesis Mask effects to make my opponents use all their creatures to block one of my other creatures so my commander walks in unblocked. I have zero X spells in the deck because I'm going for creatures with good ETBs that then become fodder or creatures that must be blocked by all creatures.
My whole idea of playing a powerful commander like Krenko is that people will know what I'm doing, and it presents a challenge. The challenge is the fun part. That's why we play powerful commanders and decks. I would fully expect someone to try and keep a powerful commander off the battlefield. That's why you build your deck with protection. Most colors have at least a few versions of their own counter spells. And there are plenty of artifacts. I think trying to keep low and sneak in a win isn't very fun.
well a do agree mostly with this. probably not at that point yet but i was playing Ulalek and i wasn't archenemy immediately in that game. probably because my lgs is going by strategy with the best moves based on the board states. it wasn't till i casted roaming throne while having echos of eternity out till i became more of a archenemy and for a fun fact im just starting to use my horde of notions deck again nobody ever sees it coming of being a back breaking commander
Im having this problem building my ertai resurrected. Everyone knows i play control style decks. Im trying to build him in a les controlling way so ertai is the major counter spell/removal of the deck.
Honestly at this point i just refuse to play against overly oppressive commanders. I dont have a playgroup or lgs (central european, small village) so my only realustic option is playing online. Wirh that in mind i just dont trust strangers enough to not be pupstompers.
Learned the lesson when I started playing EDH after 20+ years out of the game. I got the zombies precon and the simic tokens precon and made some upgrades plus cards from my old collection......I was surprised that I was targetted so much but now I know why. Just avoid those commanders.
8:27 i have 2 decks with popular commanders: korvold and narset. However…. The strategies im using have less than 25 and 8 decks respectively on edhrec for these commanders, and thus they play super differently than all the other korvold and narset decks. And while there is the negative that yeah players may assume the worst about your deck, the upside in running these powerful commanders is there is a lot more room for fun and janky cards since the commander is such a big help to the strategy
I think you could get away with that to some extent but with Commanders like Korvold or Narset, the threat is inherently built into the deck by the Commander. Does your Korvold deck sacrifice ? If so, it’s a threat, even on a budget. Does your Narset not have extra turn spells ? Great… but, it still casts spells for free. If your Commander is classified as a kill-on-sight Commander, I don’t think it is going to do much good arguing that “It’s not THAT Nadu, Winged Wisdom deck”.
@@Dragon_Fyre narset is sagas trible, no extra combat spells or extra turns. Korvold has sac stuff, but no sac outlets, as its eldrazi trible. Korvold is for sure stronger, but korvold isnt really the focal point of the deck. Narset is kinda just a janky way to put more sagas into play
I feel so seen in this video lol i actively play obscure commanders or run obscure strategies just so my opponents dont know what to save their removal for
I don't know how I didn't know you have a Rayne deck, she's one of my favorite commanders in concept that I've just never been able to cobble together a finished decklist for. Any tips on how to make her run well? I think i tend to get bogged down in adding auras and start turning her into a voltron deck, which just never works out by the time i'm 30-40 nonlands in.
i have an Atraxa deck built around the incubate mechanic (bc i love that mechanic so much) and it isn't particularly good, but it has incredibly high potential, so i feel bad saying it's usually bad bc it is usually bad, but sometimes it just shows how op Atraxa is. it's kinda annoying how good she is bc she does rightfully get me targeted whenever i cast her, and it's just not fun playing my favorite deck just bc the commander sucks to play against. so I've been considering swapping to a partner combo that I don't really like, but it should cause less salt
My playgroup is pretty chill. I have one side of my friends that play high-powered omnath, $5k slivers, foiled out eldrazi, etc. One or two cedh decks, but those only come out if we are all playing them. If we are all playing powerful commanders, it's just a normal game LOL😂. The other side play the average 7s or 8s. It's no fun to steam roll a new playgroup when they're playing 5s... Rule zero always!
My philosophy has shifted the same way over the years. I avoid the new obvious commanders. If i can expect multiple players in my group to show up with a commander after it's released, then i'm not going to build it. I've used powerful commanders like Atraxa before but i try to build them different. My last Atraxa was a Saga deck not superfriends, or infect or +1+1's.
I made a Nekusar deck not knowing how popular he was, I just liked the idea of card draw hate. Brought it to my playgroup and immediately got demolished by everyone who had faced a super powerful Nekusar before thinking mine was going to be as powerful.
I think its more enjoyable to just not play precon-legends in the command zone, including the alternate commanders. I miss when commander was essentially just your clunky draft chaff, not cards specifically catering to commander. Same for sets like Commander Legends and any card that mentions your "Commander" really... even generic stuff like Command Tower, just why? :^)
I play Rograhk & yoshimaru. To subvert expectations. All of the red and white counter spells, with a bunch of stacks and land destruction. I.e. Teferi’s pro/Worldfire combo to beat people with the puppy. Approach of the second sun to win out of no where. Choosing to subvert expectations is far funnier. And produces the most salt.
For my Urza, Lord High Artificer deck, I built it with the theme of cranking out as much Karnstructs as I can by way of blinking Urza, among other Karnstruct creators. The Polymorph variant of Urza, Lord High Artificer is the most optimal, but I found it to be real boring.
I swear the flavor of the month right now is eldrazi. Someone asked why I like trying commanders that you really have to work for to make good. I like the puzzle of figuring them out.
I think people take the, "don't make yourself a target" thing too far. Mind you, my perspective comes mostly from high power and cEDH, but I still think this applies to lower power decks too. I think it's a good idea to not be too threatening if it isn't setting you behind the pace of the game and if you are pretty sure you becoming the target is game winning. I've asked people about card choices before and they will say well if I play this good card people might try to kill me - ignoring the fact that the good card will stop them from losing or win the game outright. My whole point here is don't be the target if you're not ready for the heat yet.
the best way to not make yourself a target is by bringing your commander out later and just play a ton of interaction to target opponents or prevent from targetting you.
@@InTecknicolour On playing your commander early: I think, again, that depends kind of a lot on what advantage you're getting out of the situation. If your commander generates you a ton of value and you see a window early on to play it and gain all that advantage, it might be worth it to be the arch enemy. For example, my Malcolm Tymna pirate deck generates me lots of mana and cards early. The deck is highly interactive but if I don't get more cards, I'll just run out of steam. Normally that's fine because I'm planning during a window that people are still setting up in. On running interaction: I think running a lot of interaction is a really good idea the higher you go in power levels. That being said, every time you spend interaction, you are normally going negative on card advantage with the table as a whole. If you are the only one running interaction and everyone else is playing parasitic stuff, you might be losing even though you were being responsible. This happened to me yesterday actually. I ended up using a bunch of interaction on the green stompy deck that was taking off, but I was the only one playing interaction. I ended up having to spend all my resources just to keep the table alive. I still almost ended up winning that game but it was because I had a lot of card advantage. The point is sometimes you being the interactive one loses you the game - still run interaction though.
I built sentinel wyrm when it first released and that deck has only gone up in value since because of it popularity. I never played it because it was a strong deck, i built it because it seemed cool to build. Dragons are a strong tribe in general they should know what to expect from it even before sentinel wyrm was released honestly.
Seton looks like the type of commander people would take a crack at making a list but not actually build irl. There's no doubt in my mind that the vast majority of lists never become irl decks. Commanders with memetic build-around hooks (which includes pretty much any typal commander) are going to appear to be much more popular than they really are.
I don't think this way. That would be another point on the list you shoudnt do in commander. People come out with; dont play this archetype, dont play this commander, dont this, dont that. Build what you want to play not what you imagine other players might not see as a treat etc. Sure you can follow all the advice but its casual format and if i want atraxa i will build atraxa because its edh not modern or any other competitive format.
My playgroup has a bunch of late game decks like Ur-Dragon and Gishath, and seeing them all be worried about a really rogue aggro deck like Karlach in my case has been very funny to see.
I think it’s more of them worried about extra combats, a commander which has the potential to give you an extra combat every turn if not removed, that’s pretty powerful
The only "popular" Commander I play is Feather. Loved her chemistry with Agrus Kos in the old stories, but she had no card. Then, ten years later, she got one. I would have built her even if she were vanilla. And I can prove that; I also have a Yargle deck.
@@user-bh9fb2kf5m nobody cares how big atraxa is. it's the proliferate that makes her powerful. of course, you already know this, you're just trying to be argumentative.
So, don't play Sarulf? I know I'll never win with it, but the reaction I get from my opponents before the game even starts is hilarious to me, and fills me with a strange energy that keeps the deck in my collection despite the losing streak.
But demo, what do we do when our play group is obsessed with being as high power without "being cedh" as possible and when you try to build unknown commanders they get stomped because of fear of the unknown? When youre in a room full of shit do you just keep throwing shit at the wall or lie down and become one with the shit? Idk conundrum
i just play weak commanders that have some type of offbeat play pattern so that every game has a different experience. unfortunaly probably 85% of my lgs opponents are all just giant piles of good stuff but it is very satisfying when you eradicate them
Try to and still get focused 😔 don't even feel like I'm playing scary/ strong decks, I love izzet but any time I play an izzet deck I'm the focus and it's more than disheartening.
I think I'd like to play with the players you play with. If I leave a white mana open in my pods. Nobody bats an eye, they will still continue playing their solitary game and live with the consequences. Even if it means they're not going to play for the reminder of the game because they all-in 1 turn.
Guy pods with other people playing “unpopular” commanders. Spider-Man meme. You might as well not play staples and use the most mana intense version of cards. No more 2cmc ramp but >4cmc. 1cmc removal as if 😂
I have a omnath locus of creation deck, and oh boy, i built it to make land creature deck, so the 4 free mana = one land creature. And its honestly not that powerful. Very limited wincons as im trying to avoid cliche landfall tropes. But does anyone ever believe me before i start a game. Nope. And thus i spend the game dying fast and doing not alot beside having lands.
Hipster take. Lots of hipster players want to play the obscure decks. That’s fine. Most other players goal is to win, have fun, or do something interesting. All of those goals are possible with popular commanders.
I feel this comes from a competitors mind. I play both popular and obscure commanders but i play to have fun. I win,ok. I lose, ok. I rather have fun at the table than play an obscure deck so as to gain an advantage for wins. Jmho.
@@edhdeckbuilding doesn't happen all the time, even in random pods. Thanks for the reply. I'm unsubing now. If you dont want people like me subbing and watching it's cool. Thanks again for responding.
@@bobusan_duuuugnut-oh i once had a guy tell me he's unsubbing from my channel because i pronounced a word wrong. that was the most snowflake reason i've ever seen. this is the second.
@@edhdeckbuilding na it's cool. He unsubbed for his own reason. I, because having a different opinion from you, means you get to insult and snub your viewers. Snowflake or not, I wish you success in your channel. I really do.
Miirym is a deck that scales in power the lower the power of your opponents decks. Your opponents know it is coming. They should have removal and it should never even see play. To be repeatedly casting it would require you to play other spells that make you archenemy like dockside extortionist or ancient copper dragon. I would have to agree with demo that its threat level does not match its popularity.
It's not about what you are doing with your commander as much as what your opponent's think you are doing with your commander
This right here
this sort of applies more when you play with random people or first time in a pod. I understand flying under the radar is influential in a commander game.
Having said that, personally anyway, I don't really feel it's winning due to gotcha mechanics or play style. Like playing an unknown commander just to effectively catch opponents off guard in that manner to me isn't a fulfilling win. For example I will explain to a table, new or old, what my commander is doing and what the deck intends to do.
To me that's like winning a boardgame against a table of players playing for their first time.
I honestly have the opposite problem. When people see my commander is some creature they've never seen before, it's dog pile time. I don't know what they think Axelrod Gunnarson is going to combo off with, but they assume it's something big. I actually have started playing more common commanders to avoid people ganging up to avoid some imaginary combo they think is coming.
Lol that's cut throat
I never experienced this problem because I talk with the playgroup if there any combos, i dont mind explaining the combos.
I have the same with Adun Oakenshield. Like, I'm doing cycling nonsense. The guy is extra value, doesn't even put stuff on the battlefield.
Are you sure it's not the PTSD-Argument? If people go for your stuff, because they think you're comboing off, it might be because you're playing combos way to much and people hate on you for this. I have a guy in my play group who is like this. "Oh, why do you target this". Well, because you always play sh*t down. You always do degenerate stuff. And the only time you're not complaining is, when we let you play solitair. This sounds like a massive you-problem.
I've had this happen to me as well. I play unpopular commanders and people are like 'I have no idea what that commander is I'm just going to kill it and target you because I don't know what to expect'.
A relatively new player at my LGS just sent sooo much money making an Ur-Dragon deck and he hasn't won once because everyone just attacks him first. He gets so salty like "you don't even let me do my thing." Yeah, because if you do your thing you win, buddy.
There was a dude at my old LGS that was the same way. He would buy decks that were just outside the realm of CEDH, strong enough that they pubstomp normal tables but can't hang at CEDH tables. And so he would get focused down and would always get SO angry. and it's like dude, you had to know what would happen here.
Only thing I definitely disagreed with is miirym not being powerful that’s a wild take so me after seeing it so many times lol
@@cody98533 yeah it’s hard to build miirym in a way that isn’t oppressive
someone else commented "i'm not going to play an obscure commander just to increase my win percentage". your example is actually the main reason to do it. being the arch enemy isn't fun.
Seems like a toxic LGS. Imagine being a veteran player scared that an UR dragon deck is so powerful that you need to bully the newbie. There’s other ways to interact with many decks and players but ganging up on someone just because they have a “strong” commander seems little man energy.
I tend to play commanders on the more popular side of things because I find them more interesting to play with, but my strategy is to throw in a certain small percentage of rarely-seen jank along with the very synergistic pieces. It tends to dilute threat assessment just enough that I'm consistently not archenemy. But the decks still consistently win because they have such a high level of synergy.
I start with art. Whether the commander has 6000 or 600 decks on EDHRec, if I don't like the art, I don't bother. That's why I have a Tergrid deck and a Nihiloor deck, just for examples. Nihiloor has 8000. I also have a Thalia deck, she has 500 decks or so, and I have a Snapdax deck, who has 850 decks on EDHrec.
Art is an excellent reason to run (or not run) certain cards or commanders.
That's what got me playing Tibor and Lumia. They reminded me of Gol and Maia from Jak & Daxter, and I loved the art. It took a really long time to nail the build but it's one of my favorite decks now.
I dont play Korvold as a Commander anymore. I just put him in the 99 of my Slimefoot and Squee deck and play him and then play him again and again and again 😆
Demo, what are the chances of us getting an updated Deck Tech on your Iname deck?
Now you made me think Atraxa divinity/finality counters and move them around might be a fun build.
Sounds amazing. Power conduit is good. Omo is fun. Goldberry, agents toolkit, the blue dominus, lots of fun tools
ive got a thallid smokestacks deck with atraxa. when i take her out i specify that the deck has no +1/+1 counters, no infect or poison and no planeswalkers
@@JonReid01 Ooh nice suggestion!! That which was taken and nesting grounds.
@@62chipo lol nice, that's almost mean
@@simonchi5372 descent into madness, tanglewire, possessed portal... and i have atraxas name renamed as "mike tython, the one who makeths you eat your thallid"
As said, it “starts” with your Commander. Unless your Commander is noted for combos however, what you play matters as well. You can have a Blue commander I have never heard of but if you play a Rhystic study early game, you may be the archenemy. So your strategy would have to be consistent to stay under the radar.
It is a multiplayer game as well. So, if you show up with a Muldrotha deck, it may be popular but if the other two players are Korvold and Edgar Markov, you will not be archenemy. It’s like the joke about how you don’t have to run faster than the bear chasing you, you just have to run faster than your slowest friend.
Lastly, EDHREC reflects only the last two years of decks posted. Your Commander could be one that a lot of decks were built for and are out there but does not draw as much attention in new deck building. If you are playing a Commander from 2+ years ago, chances are there are a lot more of it out there than EDHREC shows, that may just not be constantly updating the decklist to be current.
I feel like PTSD point you made is more prevalent for me, it doesn't matter what commander I play, if the deck has been scary to anyone in recent memory I will be a target. I have 2 regular play groups and the Igs I go to has under 20 people attending commander nights, so I can see the first point being more relevant if you play with different people all the time. I don't go out of my way to not play the top 100, I looked and one of my commanders is #83, but if I'm playing a commander that's not the absolutely most popular or powerful and I have a game plan that people might not be familiar with I get away with more for a longer amount of time.
I think different things stand out to different people though, like one person in my playgroup is very much an aggro player and being powerful in an aggressive way or doing something that is good against an aggressive deck its very threatening to him, but if you draw a billion cards he doesn't notice. Another is a control player at heart who notices when you are leaving up mana every turn and will try to interact with everything you have to draw out your counterspells, so I think looking scary and being a target can vary a lot.
I've got the Ur Dragon and Gishath sleeved. Both of those decks have an overwhelmingly (for commander) high win rate. The trick for decks like that is to go in knowingly good and well you're gonna be the arch enemy.
I always keep a land in hand and hold it like its a removal spell just to avoid getting hit
I've gotten like this in recent months. I love finding obscure cards for the 99 especially older cards nobody has heard of. When it comes to commanders I love value guys who may not be the strongest but give me something when they are on the field. The result has led to my commanders being less targeted and people actually being interested in seeing what my cards do instead of instantly focusing on me because I pulled out a top 50 pub stomper.
As disadvantageous as it may be I will build without looking at edh rank, if I like what a commander does or it fits the theme gameplay or flavor I will play that commander. I agree with lower ranked commanders having less of a target on their back but to go out of one's way and set an absolute to not build those with more than 1000 decks seems excessive even to suggest. if the druid commander drops seedborn or doubling I'm throwing everything at them regardless of the commander. I build budgety(ish) 150 let's say, I much rather see a popular commander built originally than an unpopular one running staples to make up for hardly having a strategy to build around, which is often the case with fringe commanders
I agree with the part about not making your commander a huge target, but I think there is a problem with hiding your deck's strategy that you didn't bring up in the video, which is that it won't work against the same table twice. Once you've played your hand, then those players will either know you're a threat and focus you or know which key combo pieces to remove. Not that you should reveal everything you have, of course, but if my self is considered a threat, then I dont take that as a failure, but as a sign that my deck is functioning as intended.
Yeah. This is a good point. I’ve played Gluntch the Bestower with my pod and now they know to just kill me if possible. I usually win by turn 7 with him and my friends got ptsd.
The easiest way for me to "win" a game, used to be just pulling out my Krenko deck. Everyone would see it, groan, and not even want to play.😢 That's not winning.
I have a favorite creature type (angels) so I just build and play around my favorite angel from each possible color combo. So far I have all 6 of the 3-color combinations that include white and 2 out of 4 of the 2 color combos. Not in any hurry to build a 4-color Atraxa deck.
This is some real dedication, props for that, and also now I want to have every color combination of angel deck since I’ve been complaining that maelstrom angel isn’t legendary
I really enjoy the strategy topics. I recently watched the Prof’s video @TolarianCommunityCollege about threat assessment and 100% agree the game is better when people use better threat assessment including the commander being played
Another reason is when you play a popular commander and build it differently from the most popular builds, you start getting everyone coming up and going "why aren't you just building it this way?" "Why aren't you playing X card(s)?"
I’ve personally build over 200+ different commanders in a span of 5 years.
I like casual edh; no stax, no extra turns, limited fast mana, maybe 1 infinite max, limited to no tutors, and even precon games.
From experience; most ppl power creep edh and have too competitive of a mindset. You either have to find a group that allows janky commanders, OR what I’ve recently done is brew a more popular/powerful commander but my 99 is bulk cards, budget staples, and pet cards that fit theme.
Green ramp is strong enough to also carry most jank or budget brews.
@Theanthill216 i have at least a smokestack in every one of my edh decks. its the theme i enjoy. if my deck has more synergy ill run, winter orb, tanglewire, descent into madness, and possessed portal etc
@@62chipo then you have to realize that 90%+ of players would consider that either not casual, or will groan in misery and not want to pod with you.
If you have a playgroup that doesn’t care that’s fine, but at an edh day at an lgs with that bs and ppl would not be happy.
Imagine having limited time to play mtg in general, and you sit down to a stax pod where you have a “non game” and your time was wasted……
Holding up mana to bluff something doesn’t work against me because I was taught that it’s better to make them have it. If you go to do something and they kill your creature or counter your spell, you’ve forced the interaction and now they’re down a piece. So are you, but I can probably find a way to adapt to what happened to still threaten a win. And who knows, I could be casting something just kind of powerful to bait out counterspell just to play something even more powerful behind it
Best example of this for me is The First Sliver. That is objectively a very powerful commander, and a fairly popular one as well. But it's not strong enough to make up for the reputation disadvantage. I am not someone who likes targeting people on the basis of their commander, but if you're playing The First Sliver, I have NO CHOICE but to join the entire table in dogpiling you, because we all know that if your commander resolves we're all just gonna drown in slivers.
This contributes to a larger issue of people playing cards because they're "optimal." Sure your Rhystic Study may be the optimal draw option in your Azorius deck, but the sheer amount of vitriol you earn just by playing that card isn't worth it. And it's a removal magnet anyway so there's no guarantee you'll get any value off of it at all. I'd much rather play something like Trouble in Pairs. It's a strong draw option that will almost certainly earn you a card on most players turns, but it's unintrusive enough that most people won't think to remove it. Like, if there's a Rhystic Study and a Trouble in Pairs on the field and you have a Nature's Claim in hand, which are you gonna target?
Just because a card is "optimal" doesn't mean it's the best option.
While i agree for the most part, it can be really fun to be the arch enemy. And as basic and straight forward as gisath suns avatar is i will never not be excited to hit with that big stompy dino. Its reached a point now where the whole fun of that deck is baiting out counters so i can get one attack in, which is still fun, just different.
playing Khalitas Traitor of Ghet and Olivia Mobilized for war. And they are suprised at how I beat them, Olivia is a reanimator deck and Kalitas is a voltron style. My decks sneaks up on them. It was satisfying.
I either play an unpopular commander, or a popular commander with an unpopular deck tech.
Lathril was the first precon I ever bought before it blew up. I think it was 15$ for the whole deck at the time. I'm sticking with it lol
I looove playing commanders nobody plays! They are more fun to build around or with. Currently my favorite deck to play is my white blue Jem Lightefoot deck! She seems awful to everyone, but she goes crazy paired with dungeons, foretell, plot, and a little flash sprinkled in. By the time I got what I need I almost don't need my hand anymore haha! I fully believe any commander can work, and you'll have the most fun building with bizarre or unpopular commanders. ^_^
New players (seasoned, just new to the pod I’m in) ALWAYS underestimate Plargg and Nassari. They’ve usually never heard of it and are just like, “lol ok sure bud.” Originally built with bulk rares and mythics as a joke, it has since become my most powerful and competitive deck.
literally just talked about that commander in a video. super underrated.
Only 3 out of my 9 decks were in the top 100 Commanders and two were played completely different to the common EDHRec build, like my Animar is all artifacts (I did it before the RecCast guys did it), 5C Omnath was all Mutate and my Myrkul is elf tribal.
#19, #48, #100, #121, #133, #234, #253, #637 and #720.
Honestly it depends. If some is running Krenko Mob Boss, theyll still have decent chance of winning even if people gang up on them
One of the
I remember falling victim to EDH PTSD at LGS commander night, I was playing Zirilan the Claw mono red dragon deck and the Atraxa player at my table made it a point to target me just because he lost to a player who had a Zirilan deck.
If you build a deck with more defense and interaction you can overcome the challenges of being targeted .
I think this is a great point about the format. I play Atraxa, Grand Unifier - not an unpopular commander by any means. I was playing in a league and my commander got countered four or five times IN ONE GAME. When I asked the pod why they felt the need to focus me down, one said, "I know what Atraxa is capable of. I've seen that deck."
Then it turned out he thought it was the OG Atraxa... despite me doing nothing with Planeswalkers or Infect... so, your commander matters.
Still love my Atraxa deck, though.
I feel like once people understand how powerful particular lines of text are and how it can work in connunction with other cards the creature doesnt really matter. Also in a world where "exchange of words" is somehow a legal magic card, 11/12 times imma make some random creature my commanders text box, then imprisoned in the moon my own bad boy.
Similar reasoning as to why my current decks are mairsil toolbox, 8 1/2 Tails mono white manual Storm, and aeve mono green manual storm (no slime against humanity), endrek sahr black storm/burn, zirilan aggro-toolbox, pharika as a group slug/graveyard deck. And atogatog (not good stuff) focused around atog sax combos at instant speed to pump atog atog during combat or barren glory flashed in with kaerveks spite to shoot for a win in someone's end step.
I have a mono color storm deck in the works for each color because pushing the limits of each color is my favorite part of deck building. Synergy always rules over optimization for me. For example Id rather my blue decks have synergistic value in its conterspells rather than just run the standard big 5ish that don't have any synergy but do their job really well. Most of my decks fly under the radar due to looking "bad" but while I don't always win I always kill at least one player at my tables.
This doesn’t work if you have friends btw
If i play blue they think i got a hullbreaker horror combo built in.... and they're usually right.
My LGS have very much figured out, ypu dont let me untap with Ovika or Imodane. Henzie works because they feel like if they kill Henzie it slows me down but makes Henzie more powerful.
That said im always interested in playing lesser known cards, i got really excited to have a The Master, Multiplied deck as a doctor sho fan, but bevauae everyone had thought about the deck it was killed on sight.
I've heard that uncnventional commanders make people nervous and your opponents will attack you out of caution. O guess that the only way you can avoid being the target is not playing
Funny thing: there was a time where you played Snow-covered lands in Pauper just to keep your opponent guessing. You didnt have to benefit from them, you just wanted the misinformation to give them
Rather than restricting myself to less popular commanders, i subscribe to "i'm gonna build the commanders that i want to build". Popularity (or lack of) be damned.
My only caveat is that i try not to do a deck that one of my regular opponents already has on the go. There's no reason for carbon copies of decks within the same regular playgroup.
I've got decks for commanders in the top 100, i've got decks for commanders with less than 500 on edhrec, and a pretty good spread inbetween.
And you know what? My enjoyment of said decks, the power level or even the win rate of the decks:.... there's no correlation between any of that & the commander popularity.
(Not that win rate in commander is something you should ever care overly about. Care about everyone having fun. If you wanna care about win rate, play Cedh or better yet one of the 60 card 1v1 competitive formats.)
Now obviously your mileage may vary. But locking myself out of building certain commanders based on their popularity just feels nonsensical.
Now i'm commenting from pretty early in the video, i assume there's going to be a section on how popular commanders may draw unwanted attention from unfamiliar players. You can fix that with a decent rule zero convo, or build your deck to cope with it. The other end of the scale is the unknown commander that flies under the radar & then steals the game out of nowhere... great fun for the player doing it, maybe less so for the other 3 players.
There's plenty of considerations about when/where/how to play your commander deck. Those considerations do change slightly based on the popularity of your deck & the company you are playing with. The importance of these considerations doesn't change, nor the upset that can be caused by ignoring them.
I just built a Sauron The Necromancer deck. It has 28 decks on EDHREC.
Had to look the card up, but how is it so few?? I guess people just have better options for reanimator and don’t want to exile their stuff? Idk tho I like the feel of this commander in particular
@@micahhonig1575 This is true for just pure reanimator, but the fact that Sauron turns the reanimated creatures into wraiths is super synergistic with nazgul and ring tempting, allowing you to get a huge board super quickly with the +1/+1 counters the nazgul give your board. I made a cycle themed deck with Sauron because this iteration of the deck cares less about reanimating big targets (they come back as 3/3s anyway) and more about drawing our way into as many nazgul as possible and just reanimating literally anything. We have a couple ETBs and bombs to give us the edge but there's not the focus of the deck by any means.
i tried adeliz, the cinder wind as some spellslinger aggro deck and it's kinda wonky but it can pop off quite well (no infinite combos tho) yet people ganged up on me cause they were so frightened of her for god knows what reason. is she that scary? like i just felt in love with the idea of buff grandpas with pointy hats that smash peoples faces
One of my first commander deck was a classic krenko deck, it was way too powerful and ended up taking it apart to make a ib halfheart one and it's so much more fun
i want to hug you
@@bigdawg6471 grouphug or regular hug?
I love Ib Halfheart. I've won multiple games by sacrificing all my mountains for goblins.
@@dislikebutton9571 this ability is so underated it is legitimately good as a game ender
I have always loved doing things that cause a bit of confusion
One of my favorites is Omnath, Locus of All - it's a buyback deck with an emphasis on manipulating color and land keywords
I had an idea for Ivy, Gleeful Spelltheif that I thought was clever
Checked to see if other people were doing mutate with her and was soundly disappointed that they it was half - that kind of put a damper on that deck idea
I have a friend that swapped Zacama to Gishath. If he plays his dinosaur deck, we now need to choose between letting him do the thing and not losing because the thing is too powerful.
If I’m in Esper, I’m probably gonna be running Deny The Witch. I recently had to save that for the Gishath that I knew was coming up and have faith that the token player who cast a Craterhoof would get fogged.
Edit: On mobile, didn’t notice a word got merced.
It’s always interesting to see casual players try to make their decks worse in order to win more . I thought casual “ wasn’t just about winning “ - that’s what the EDH rules committee says
I use a couple of commanders that are on the more popular end of the spectrum, but I try to use it in a way that isn't the usual way, although still not entirely unique.
For example, my Animar, Soul of Elements deck is still heavy into creatures for the +1/+1 ability, but I don't care about the cost reduction aspect of the commander at all. I'm going for commander damage kills by using Lure and Nemesis Mask effects to make my opponents use all their creatures to block one of my other creatures so my commander walks in unblocked. I have zero X spells in the deck because I'm going for creatures with good ETBs that then become fodder or creatures that must be blocked by all creatures.
My whole idea of playing a powerful commander like Krenko is that people will know what I'm doing, and it presents a challenge. The challenge is the fun part. That's why we play powerful commanders and decks. I would fully expect someone to try and keep a powerful commander off the battlefield. That's why you build your deck with protection. Most colors have at least a few versions of their own counter spells. And there are plenty of artifacts. I think trying to keep low and sneak in a win isn't very fun.
well a do agree mostly with this. probably not at that point yet but i was playing Ulalek and i wasn't archenemy immediately in that game. probably because my lgs is going by strategy with the best moves based on the board states. it wasn't till i casted roaming throne while having echos of eternity out till i became more of a archenemy
and for a fun fact im just starting to use my horde of notions deck again nobody ever sees it coming of being a back breaking commander
Im having this problem building my ertai resurrected. Everyone knows i play control style decks. Im trying to build him in a les controlling way so ertai is the major counter spell/removal of the deck.
Honestly at this point i just refuse to play against overly oppressive commanders. I dont have a playgroup or lgs (central european, small village) so my only realustic option is playing online. Wirh that in mind i just dont trust strangers enough to not be pupstompers.
Learned the lesson when I started playing EDH after 20+ years out of the game. I got the zombies precon and the simic tokens precon and made some upgrades plus cards from my old collection......I was surprised that I was targetted so much but now I know why. Just avoid those commanders.
8:27 i have 2 decks with popular commanders: korvold and narset. However…. The strategies im using have less than 25 and 8 decks respectively on edhrec for these commanders, and thus they play super differently than all the other korvold and narset decks. And while there is the negative that yeah players may assume the worst about your deck, the upside in running these powerful commanders is there is a lot more room for fun and janky cards since the commander is such a big help to the strategy
I think you could get away with that to some extent but with Commanders like Korvold or Narset, the threat is inherently built into the deck by the Commander.
Does your Korvold deck sacrifice ? If so, it’s a threat, even on a budget. Does your Narset not have extra turn spells ? Great… but, it still casts spells for free.
If your Commander is classified as a kill-on-sight Commander, I don’t think it is going to do much good arguing that “It’s not THAT Nadu, Winged Wisdom deck”.
@@Dragon_Fyre narset is sagas trible, no extra combat spells or extra turns. Korvold has sac stuff, but no sac outlets, as its eldrazi trible. Korvold is for sure stronger, but korvold isnt really the focal point of the deck. Narset is kinda just a janky way to put more sagas into play
I feel so seen in this video lol i actively play obscure commanders or run obscure strategies just so my opponents dont know what to save their removal for
I don't know how I didn't know you have a Rayne deck, she's one of my favorite commanders in concept that I've just never been able to cobble together a finished decklist for. Any tips on how to make her run well? I think i tend to get bogged down in adding auras and start turning her into a voltron deck, which just never works out by the time i'm 30-40 nonlands in.
i have an Atraxa deck built around the incubate mechanic (bc i love that mechanic so much) and it isn't particularly good, but it has incredibly high potential, so i feel bad saying it's usually bad bc it is usually bad, but sometimes it just shows how op Atraxa is. it's kinda annoying how good she is bc she does rightfully get me targeted whenever i cast her, and it's just not fun playing my favorite deck just bc the commander sucks to play against. so I've been considering swapping to a partner combo that I don't really like, but it should cause less salt
My playgroup is pretty chill. I have one side of my friends that play high-powered omnath, $5k slivers, foiled out eldrazi, etc. One or two cedh decks, but those only come out if we are all playing them. If we are all playing powerful commanders, it's just a normal game LOL😂.
The other side play the average 7s or 8s.
It's no fun to steam roll a new playgroup when they're playing 5s...
Rule zero always!
I agree that Myriim is not powerful on her own, but the deck is full of combos that are heinous.
My philosophy has shifted the same way over the years. I avoid the new obvious commanders. If i can expect multiple players in my group to show up with a commander after it's released, then i'm not going to build it. I've used powerful commanders like Atraxa before but i try to build them different. My last Atraxa was a Saga deck not superfriends, or infect or +1+1's.
I made a Nekusar deck not knowing how popular he was, I just liked the idea of card draw hate. Brought it to my playgroup and immediately got demolished by everyone who had faced a super powerful Nekusar before thinking mine was going to be as powerful.
I think its more enjoyable to just not play precon-legends in the command zone, including the alternate commanders. I miss when commander was essentially just your clunky draft chaff, not cards specifically catering to commander.
Same for sets like Commander Legends and any card that mentions your "Commander" really... even generic stuff like Command Tower, just why? :^)
I play Rograhk & yoshimaru.
To subvert expectations.
All of the red and white counter spells, with a bunch of stacks and land destruction.
I.e. Teferi’s pro/Worldfire combo to beat people with the puppy.
Approach of the second sun to win out of no where.
Choosing to subvert expectations is far funnier. And produces the most salt.
For my Urza, Lord High Artificer deck, I built it with the theme of cranking out as much Karnstructs as I can by way of blinking Urza, among other Karnstruct creators. The Polymorph variant of Urza, Lord High Artificer is the most optimal, but I found it to be real boring.
I swear the flavor of the month right now is eldrazi. Someone asked why I like trying commanders that you really have to work for to make good. I like the puzzle of figuring them out.
129 decks(0.003%)
Rank #2073
And it stomps tables 🤘
It's generally a better idea to play popular commanders using more obscure cards, because they tend to go unnoticed until it's too late.
I think people take the, "don't make yourself a target" thing too far. Mind you, my perspective comes mostly from high power and cEDH, but I still think this applies to lower power decks too.
I think it's a good idea to not be too threatening if it isn't setting you behind the pace of the game and if you are pretty sure you becoming the target is game winning. I've asked people about card choices before and they will say well if I play this good card people might try to kill me - ignoring the fact that the good card will stop them from losing or win the game outright.
My whole point here is don't be the target if you're not ready for the heat yet.
the best way to not make yourself a target is by bringing your commander out later and just play a ton of interaction to target opponents or prevent from targetting you.
@@InTecknicolour On playing your commander early: I think, again, that depends kind of a lot on what advantage you're getting out of the situation. If your commander generates you a ton of value and you see a window early on to play it and gain all that advantage, it might be worth it to be the arch enemy. For example, my Malcolm Tymna pirate deck generates me lots of mana and cards early. The deck is highly interactive but if I don't get more cards, I'll just run out of steam. Normally that's fine because I'm planning during a window that people are still setting up in.
On running interaction: I think running a lot of interaction is a really good idea the higher you go in power levels. That being said, every time you spend interaction, you are normally going negative on card advantage with the table as a whole. If you are the only one running interaction and everyone else is playing parasitic stuff, you might be losing even though you were being responsible. This happened to me yesterday actually. I ended up using a bunch of interaction on the green stompy deck that was taking off, but I was the only one playing interaction. I ended up having to spend all my resources just to keep the table alive. I still almost ended up winning that game but it was because I had a lot of card advantage. The point is sometimes you being the interactive one loses you the game - still run interaction though.
I built sentinel wyrm when it first released and that deck has only gone up in value since because of it popularity. I never played it because it was a strong deck, i built it because it seemed cool to build. Dragons are a strong tribe in general they should know what to expect from it even before sentinel wyrm was released honestly.
Seton looks like the type of commander people would take a crack at making a list but not actually build irl. There's no doubt in my mind that the vast majority of lists never become irl decks. Commanders with memetic build-around hooks (which includes pretty much any typal commander) are going to appear to be much more popular than they really are.
I don't think this way. That would be another point on the list you shoudnt do in commander. People come out with; dont play this archetype, dont play this commander, dont this, dont that. Build what you want to play not what you imagine other players might not see as a treat etc. Sure you can follow all the advice but its casual format and if i want atraxa i will build atraxa because its edh not modern or any other competitive format.
My playgroup has a bunch of late game decks like Ur-Dragon and Gishath, and seeing them all be worried about a really rogue aggro deck like Karlach in my case has been very funny to see.
I think it’s more of them worried about extra combats, a commander which has the potential to give you an extra combat every turn if not removed, that’s pretty powerful
The only "popular" Commander I play is Feather. Loved her chemistry with Agrus Kos in the old stories, but she had no card. Then, ten years later, she got one. I would have built her even if she were vanilla. And I can prove that; I also have a Yargle deck.
I played against an Atraxa infect deck a few weeks back, and he was _pissed_ when I Disallowed his commander. 🤦
Called out as a Seton player apparently lol. Whenever someone asks, "it's elfball but worse"
i like being the archenemy, i like building popular commanders as much as i like less popular commanders.
I’ll play some but I also try to stick away. I play inferno of the star mounts. My most original deck.
You think that noone understands that you'll kill them with questing beast by attacking? Every commander demonstrates strategy, not only popular
a 4/4 isn't much of a threat in a commander game.
@@edhdeckbuilding so atraxa isn't threat?
@@user-bh9fb2kf5m nobody cares how big atraxa is. it's the proliferate that makes her powerful. of course, you already know this, you're just trying to be argumentative.
So, don't play Sarulf?
I know I'll never win with it, but the reaction I get from my opponents before the game even starts is hilarious to me, and fills me with a strange energy that keeps the deck in my collection despite the losing streak.
Enjoy the video 😁
I'm so glad there's a community for commander players who ✨Aren't like OTHER commander players.✨
😂 JK, but not really.
Great video and philosophy.
But demo, what do we do when our play group is obsessed with being as high power without "being cedh" as possible and when you try to build unknown commanders they get stomped because of fear of the unknown? When youre in a room full of shit do you just keep throwing shit at the wall or lie down and become one with the shit? Idk conundrum
i just play weak commanders that have some type of offbeat play pattern so that every game has a different experience. unfortunaly probably 85% of my lgs opponents are all just giant piles of good stuff but it is very satisfying when you eradicate them
Try to and still get focused 😔 don't even feel like I'm playing scary/ strong decks, I love izzet but any time I play an izzet deck I'm the focus and it's more than disheartening.
I think I'd like to play with the players you play with. If I leave a white mana open in my pods. Nobody bats an eye, they will still continue playing their solitary game and live with the consequences. Even if it means they're not going to play for the reminder of the game because they all-in 1 turn.
i love gisath and you shall not take my furry dino away from me
Great video!
i'm playing to 2k with my friends.
Guy pods with other people playing “unpopular” commanders. Spider-Man meme. You might as well not play staples and use the most mana intense version of cards. No more 2cmc ramp but >4cmc. 1cmc removal as if 😂
I have a omnath locus of creation deck, and oh boy, i built it to make land creature deck, so the 4 free mana = one land creature. And its honestly not that powerful. Very limited wincons as im trying to avoid cliche landfall tropes.
But does anyone ever believe me before i start a game. Nope. And thus i spend the game dying fast and doing not alot beside having lands.
Hipster take. Lots of hipster players want to play the obscure decks. That’s fine. Most other players goal is to win, have fun, or do something interesting. All of those goals are possible with popular commanders.
i would argue that having your commander removed every time it hits the table isn't very fun and certainly doesn't help you win.
I feel this comes from a competitors mind. I play both popular and obscure commanders but i play to have fun. I win,ok. I lose, ok. I rather have fun at the table than play an obscure deck so as to gain an advantage for wins. Jmho.
having your commander removed every time it hits the table is fun? getting triple teamed is fun? not for most commander players.
@@edhdeckbuilding doesn't happen all the time, even in random pods. Thanks for the reply. I'm unsubing now. If you dont want people like me subbing and watching it's cool. Thanks again for responding.
@@bobusan_duuuugnut-oh i once had a guy tell me he's unsubbing from my channel because i pronounced a word wrong. that was the most snowflake reason i've ever seen. this is the second.
@@edhdeckbuilding na it's cool. He unsubbed for his own reason. I, because having a different opinion from you, means you get to insult and snub your viewers. Snowflake or not, I wish you success in your channel. I really do.
I don’t know what miirym decks your playing against, I took that deck apart because it was too powerful
Miirym is a deck that scales in power the lower the power of your opponents decks. Your opponents know it is coming. They should have removal and it should never even see play. To be repeatedly casting it would require you to play other spells that make you archenemy like dockside extortionist or ancient copper dragon. I would have to agree with demo that its threat level does not match its popularity.
i play against the miirym decks that tap out to do big things on their turns (they all do that) and then i board wipe and they have nothing.
"then i board wipe and they have nothing." 🤣🤣🤣
No.
Miss yo face