Obi wan used the same fighting style as qui gon until the end of episode 1. He changed it after precisely because ataru isnt suited to indoor combat, as shown by both qui gon and obi wan getting rekt.
@@666Kaca It's a shame not as many people know about lightsaber forms. Knowing that Maul consciously and deliberately trained in Juyo, which specialized in aggressive offense, and that Obi-Wan switched to Soresu for its defense, really adds something more to their characters when you watch them. But other than just noting the form he's using, the fact that the animators put in that little call back of him shifting into the stance that his master used when fighting with Form IV instead of the stance we saw him take when using that form was just a nice little detail and a bit nostalgic.
@@Close.Quarters.Ramen. I agree completely. You can even see mauls eyes widen when obi wan takes that stance iirc, he was probably thinking to himself "this is gonna be quick and easy", which it was, just not for maul :D I think the reason qui gon and yoda have a slightly different stance than obi wan(during ep 1) is because they are masters of the form and he is still a padawan.
It's crazy to me because that catch was such a deep dive into Star wars lore and then he talks about lightsabers being light. when George Lucas specifically intended and was vocal about them to be like you were wielding something incredibly heavy... is funny to me
It was a bit of a Hollywood death though. One reasonably small stab in the gut and ugghg dead. Nothing is more deadly in hollywood than the stab in the gut. INSTANTLY fatal, especially if it's done by a 2 inch blade. Meanwhile, someone can get shot in the chest area by assault rifle, grimace a little, and move on. Hollywood "logic".
Love how he actually puts what he sees in context of the story. yes, Aragorn was fully prepared to die on that hill, as long as Frodo gets away. other times you will see an amateur in a film behave like an amateur and the judge will say "well, he is behaving like an amateur, 1/10"
I just watched a castle warfare expert trash monty python and the holy grail for the scene where Lancelot rescues ,what he thinks is a damsel being forced to marry, but turns out to be a guy. The scene starts with Lancelot running up to the two gurads at the door and killing one. The expert says that would never happen. A man cant attack a castle alone. When he is killing the wedding party at the reception, why is a market inside the castle? And why kill everyone? The scene where he finds the "damsel" and drops to one knee , a knight would never expect praise for this . I was hoping they would show him the French castle in England scene. Your mother was a hamster. Hamsters cant give birth to humans. They really should watch the whole movie.
Shadiversiry can be like that sometimes. He's great and all but when this guy said "if you're going to try and find an equivalent weapon to the double ended saber I dont want it to be a sword equivalent" I was thinking LOOKING AT YOU SHAD 😑
@@MrYfrank14 I mean, "your mother is a hamster" means "your mother gives birth a lot". Not that he thinks Arthur's mother is an actual hamster. Bonus: "your father smell of elderberries" means "your father is a drunkard"
@@nahadoth2087 well, within the scope of the story, he did use his surroundings quite well, and didn't just stand there laying into them. but yeah, IRL no one would ever charge a superior force like that if they had sanity left
I feel like we can give Will Turner a pass on his bad sword grip. He's a self-trained blacksmith's apprentice. Even if he trained vigorously for three hours every day, if he doesn't know what he's doing, all that training will do is imprint bad habits
I always thought that was sort of the point of that scene, Captain Sparrow was schooling the self-taught blacksmith who practiced his swordplay alone without books or a teacher to guide him. He was testing him and taunting him and teaching him his flaws all the way through the fight.
@@captaindred342 Was there anything in the movie that said he had no books or anything of the like on the subject? I know he says that bit about training every day, but I can't remember any dialogue that stated he had no guidance at all. Sure you are correct in saying that Sparrow was someone who had actual experience, schooling someone with no practical experience (and likely little to no guidance). But this says more about Sparrow's skills & experience than it does Turners lack thereof. (Saying that you do something does not automatically mean you do not do something at the same time in many instance, just look at approval/disapproval ratings, one is not the inverse of the other)
Cause its amazing. The moment obi wan assumed his ataru stance instead of soresu i knew something was up. Turned out he was just baiting maul into repeating the thing that killed qui gon. It was extremely quick and satisfying to watch, showed how obi wan evolved during the years.
@@666Kaca at first he did his soresu stance because maul angered him by talking about Luke so the young obi wan came out but then he realized he can’t let his emotions influence his actions and thought logically which is not something maul did which is why maul lost
If you're legitimately interested, there are definitely places you can learn to use a sword (once the pandemic is over, anyway). You can use the HEMA Alliance Club Finder to find places that teach Historical European Martial Arts, which is Dave Rawlings' expertise. There are also other traditions that do swords, such as Japanese kenjutsu and Filipino Martial Arts. Even sword sports like Olympic Fencing teach a lot of the same fundamentals as the martial arts.
@@InSanic13 lmao wouldn't fencing be an appropriate social distancing activity? you both wear pretty solid masks, and you maintain distance because you don't want to get stabbed.
Kenobi getting a 10 made my day. That scene blew me away the first time, then I realized just how rich it was and watched it ten more times. Was amazing that the writers didn’t explain it, they let us figure it out.
I was really disappointed in the fight the first time I watched it because it wasn't very flashy, but after thinking about it, it shows how much Obi-Wan learned and how little Maul matured.
It was a 15! The screen just maxed out at 10. The scene over all works so well because of the subtleties. The duel starts with words, goes into the stand off, then climaxes with the blades. There is an edit where someone mildly superimposes young Obi-Wan and Qui-Gon over Obi-Wan’s stance changes. Then Santine and Qui-Gon being held as Kenobi holds Maul
I love that he actually takes into account what the story is trying to say in these fight scenes rather than just outright dismissing scenes that don’t have perfectly realistic/professional swordplay. Context sometimes turns a scene that would appear unrealistic or amateur into something really brilliant
I really like how he not only just evaluates it as a martial artist but takes into account what the fights scenes are conveying in terms of filmmaking it's a really fair and balanced criticism
I really appreciate how Rawlings critiques the technique in the context of storytelling, that is a fantastically important -- but often ignored -- aspect of films that I see more often than I would like. Having that fundamental understanding that characters are not fighting by the books, but to show who they are as characters makes it much more enjoyable to discuss.
The fight between obiwan and darth maul was so brilliant. The idea that obiwan tempted maul and taunted him by using Quigons stance. Knowing maul would use the same move which killed Obiwans master and countering it with two moves was brilliant and poetic
It also says that Obi Wan has spent a lifetime mulling that moment over in his mind. Thinking about what could have gone differently, about how to respond to every attack - and how Maul might have reacted in kind. For Obi Wan, that was one of the darkest days of his life, and he's still - decades later - fixated on exactly how to fight this opponent. Even better, it shows the weakness of the Sith. That hatred can cloud your judgment - that seeing that taunting stance, Maul doesn't stop to think if it's bait - he recognizes the taunt and attacks just as he did before, confident, arrogant, mistaken. The fight is like 5 seconds long, but it's got mountains of subtext.
I honestly completely missed all of that. Now that I have seen this scene broken down and analyzed however, I am completely reevaluating my perception of it.
Yeah, it really shows and contrasts the character development of the two. Obi Wan has learned from his experiences and developed wisdom, whereas Maul has really learned little to nothing, still full of rage and revenge. Even though Maul may be the stronger fighter, Obi Wan easily defeats him with a wise strategy. Wonderful storytelling.
saddly especially for the rapier (maybe other swords is vaiable) if u try to grab it lets say when its locked somehow and not moveing, u give your opoment the easy way of removing your fingers so easily, with just a rapid pullback of the sword... rapiers are made to pierce and then get easily retracted from the wound. u would require a massive energy packed on your arm to even slow it down from retracting it back.. so ye bs imo
It's not realistic at all. Imagine that you grab a sharp kitchen knife when someone is stabbing you with it. Will you be able to hold it off? No. It just cuts through your flesh. The reason why this technique is mentioned in manuals it's because you always fight with your hands protected. Otherwise, you are at a huge disadvantage. Your bare hands would be the first thing your opponent will try to hit. So as your last resort - sure, you could try to hold the blade with your gloves, but most likely you'll be dead anyway. And with bare hands, it doesn't even matter. Speaking from a HEMA experience as well.
@@KorsarNik I don't think you have HEMA experience. Holding a blade isn't as dangerous as it seems. Holding by the flat is totally feasible. You just need a fraction of a second to get your own blow in, not giving enough time for the opponent to yank it off. Grabbing the opponent's blade is a common technique in smallsword (shown in The Duelists) and present in almost every manual for most types of swords. Halfswording and mordhau are other examples of blade-holding. In a deadly fight it's also valid to sacrifice your hand in other to deliver your own deadly blow. Armored fighting with swords is all about holding blades (yours and your opponent's).
@@varagianafro9755 it will be hard to completely lock it in place, but it's viable to grab it to deflect the thrust or parry the cut for just enough time for you to thrust your own sword. In smallsword you really don't want to leave your sword hanging to closely to the opponent because grabbing the blade is a very common move
@@HiopX you know, you can critique a SW scene without having to bring the sequel trilogy into it. I remember, not too long ago, when the prequels were derided, far far worse than the sequels. Now they're praised to the point I wonder who they sucked off to get said praise. So I'm predicting in ten or twenty years the sequels will be looked upon just as fondly.
It should not surprise anyone that the scene starting around 3:48 looks so real. Basil Rathbone was the British Army's fencing champion twice, and he took the time to teach Errol Flynn (and Tyrone Power) how to fence properly. For those who do not know these actors, the scene depicted shows Errol Flynn and Basil Rathbone. Rathbone is probably best known to us older Americans from a series of very entertaining Sherlock Holmes movies.
I really liked his assessment of the fights. A lot of these the experts can come across a bit arrogant but he is one that really loves what he does and even in scenes he thought were bad would still point out something he liked or understood was done well. Even with cartoon and fictional weapons he responded like watching a real life fight.
You can tell he's watched a lot of it already as a fan, because he can make connections like the one between Obi-wan's stance and Qui-gon's. Between this and the last video, you can tell he appreciates the value of story-telling in a fight, and doesn't just nitpick the techniques.
"What are you doing?" "The video is over, your Grace" "What do you mean it's over?" "There's no more fights that the Sword Master with the magnificent moustache has rated" "Is that what over means! So. Get. More."
Finally someone realizes that a double-bladed lightsaber is basically a lightsaber staff!!!!! And props for catching the mind games Obi-Wan was playing with stances. Thumbs up!!!!
Cunnigham v Rob Roy is one of the best depictions of sword fencing in movie history. It needs to be said that Rob Roy was the worse swordsman which was established in the movie and Cunnigham was toying with him but at the same time showing how to fence properly. Sacrificing your hand was also a viable move. There were instances where a swordsman deliberately let his hand to be pierced just to deflect the blow and open up his opponent for a mortal strike.
Basil Rathbone was a champion fencer. He was the entire reason why swordfights were such a common trope back in the day. He clearly taught Errol Flynn, and many others, how to handle a sword in both an effective and theatrical way.
And choreographer/stuntman Bob Anderson, who was involved in many movies, from 'Robin Hood' through 'Empire Strikes Back' and 'Return of the Jedi,' and 'The Princess Bride'..
One of the things I appreciated in the Robin Hood fight is that it looks like they are actually aiming to hit each other, you can see real aggression in their movements - there's not much fancy mucking about, these guys are really laying into each other and the parries are genuinely necessary
THIS. That was always what struck me about the fights in that movie. They'r not toying around, they really hate each other guts and are trying to kill each other. There's skill and mastery in their fencing, but both are means to an end, and not an end in itself like in other swashbuckler movies.
For me, the funny thing after seeing that scene get 10/10 is something I've seen more than a couple of times in written stories - older fantasy, at least - where some modern people end up using swords. Because one fairly well-liked comparison to use when describing somebody doing it badly seems to be those old swashbucklers movies, and often enough the best-known ones. Like that particular Robin Hood. Some hero from our world goes through a gate to an alternate world, or time-travels, then is being taught the sword, and learns that it's best not to do it like Errol Flynn did it in that old Robin Hood movie. :D
Great duel, but Basil Rathbone was the superior fencer. He was a former British Army Fencing Champion. If I recall correctly, he took lessons from Aldo Nadi, an Olympic gold medalist and world-class fencer.
I giggled like a school girl at the guy’s analysis of Obi Wan and Maul’s fight. He hit the nail on the head. Obi Wan knew Maul would do the same thing he did in the prequels when he shifted to Qui Gon’s stance and used that to Maul’s detriment. He learned while Maul didn’t. Freaking love that scene. So glad it got 10 out of 10. Also the thing you have to understand about the dark saber is it takes the right state of mind to wield it. It was probably super heavy for Mof Gideon. This was covered in Book of Boba Fet and Rebels.
The duel between Obi-Wan and Maul on Tatooine is one of my favorite duels in Star Wars.... It doesn't need to be long or over the top.... Everybody knows the history behind Maul and Obi-Wan and how much Maul hates him.... Its simple, elegant and like the dude says, shows evolution
I love it when the guests have an understanding and appreciation for both their area of expertise as well as cinematic storytelling conventions like this guy does.
@@irrelevant_noob He fell off the horse because the Count cut the strap of the saddle. If you watch, the guy falls off sideways with his legs still splayed. And having skills as a duelist does not necessarily mean you will be proficient while also on horseback. But I think the big issue is that the Count trained almost non-stop for years in different forms of combat, while the other guy (can't remember his name) trained for years in only fencing. I wonder if he'd watched the whole movie before grading the thirty seconds of this scene that even preceded an actual sword fight.
Basil Rathbone, the gentleman opposing Errol Flynn actually won fencing championship of British Army twice whilst he was in army so he was pretty professional about it. I think they both practiced it. Also as they did their own fencing there are stories that the cut on Errols cheek is a real one, an accident during filming of the Robin Hood. Don't know how much Basil and Errol had to do with the choreography of that movie or any other but smart director would've listened to them. 😉
Yeah, I noticed that when actors usually 'fence' they go out of their way of risking an actual hit, injuring their co-worker. In this, on a few slashes it looks like they really intend to hit each other. Btw, as you may know, during the shooting of one of the Aragaron sword fight scenes, a stuntman actually hit Viggo Mortensen's teeth, cutting it in half. Fortunately for the actor, 21th century dentistry was at rather higher level than in olden times I guess.
The person who was choreographing the fight scenes for Errol Flynn movies, Bob Anderson, actually did so for Lord of the Rings and Pirates of the Caribbean too. Which is crazy to me.
@@JainaSoloB312 @Sara Samaletdin Little mistake here. Bob anderson didn't make fights for Errol Flynn's in Robin Hood, because he was 16 years old at the time. Fred Cavens is the the guy who did thoses fights, and many more. But yeah, Bob anderson did some awesome fights too !
Loved the commentary on the fight from Robin Hood. Basil Rathbone was the actor who played Guy of Gisbourne in the scene from Robin Hood in this video and it reminded me of something I saw on TV as a kid. If I remember correctly years ago when he appeared as a guest on The Tonight Show (back when Johnny Carson was host) he gave a little fencing exhibition. He and Johnny faced off with swords and then he did a quick little twist with his sword and simply disarmed Johnny Carson! (I'd always heard that Basil Rathbone tended to play the villain and "lose the fight" in the movies but in actuality he was just about the best fencer among the actors in Hollywood at the time.) This was a heck of a long time ago, so if I'm misremembering somebody please correct me! 😊 Again, great video commentary!
Yes - Rathbone did a lot of Hollywood "historical" stuff, including a great fight with Tyrone Power in The Mark of Zorro, and you can see he really did know how to use a sword.
Yes I'd heard the same thing! Rathbone was often cast as a hero's opponent bc he was so highly skilled at fencing that he could make the hero's actor look good with whatever moves he exhibited and still keep the duel exciting.
The duel with Obi Wan is a great way to see his character growth when fighting. Now the duel from Vikings is also a great way to see two characters who are at an old age but both are still capable of fighting.
@Adrien Lasbleiz "Blocking" means very different things in martial arts and filmmaking. Just one example of why being a martial artist doesn't make you an automatic good movie fight choreographer.
@Adrien Lasbleiz But bruh he's not a writer and a martial artist... Your general idea is good though, creators should pay more attention to the "reality", many creators think "reality" stuff is boring, and that's usually because their lack of understanding of the reality. Pure fantasies are impossible, you always need some "stuff" from the real world to be the fantasy's building material.
@Adrien Lasbleiz Well who knows, I think if he wants to he can definitely do it, I'd be stoked if there's a movie that has John Wick and The Raid vibe but set in the medieval times.
@@CanalTremocos check out Knight Fight by History! seriously knowing martial arts is enough to make a great blocking as long as you have the right camera angle XD
Fun fact about the Robin Hood movie. The duel shown is part of a much larger battle scene in the castle with probably at least 100 extras. When the extras are fighting, you can hear the swords "clicking" because they're using plastic props. Errol Flynn and Basil Rathbone were experienced swordfighters and already well-trained for this, and they used real metal swords for their one-on-one duel. However, when they fight someone other than each other they obviously had to use the plastic props as well. With sound editing nowhere near what it is today (this movie is from 1938) there was no editing to the sword sounds so if you listen carefully you can tell when they're switching back and forth between the metal and plastic swords. Though you can also just go by the fact that when they're fighting each other they use metal, when they're fighting someone else they use plastic. Another fun fact from the same movie: all the people that Robin shoots with arrows actually are being shot. Howard Hill, the world famous archer, did all the archery shots for the movie. They basically dressed up extras with padded armor and had Hill shoot them. Their pained reactions are largely real because while the arrow would be stopped by the armor, the impact itself still hurt. Can't imagine that would be allowed in productions today lol.
Awesome. I hoped he'd do Rob Roy and here it is, with a 10/10 to boot. A duel is proper when it furthers a story - but its even better when it tells a little story on its own.
@@nightshade7240 And to piggyback, someone without proper instruction (such as Will Turner) might very well have trained a lot in technique with the sword, but could have also neglected footwork. There are boxers and MMA fighters with some good striking form with their hands, but make blunders with their footwork.
Ironically, it is stated that Jack Sparrow's swordsmanship is morse than many of the characters including William Turner... Perhaps he already realized that out, and simply wanted to slip away using his wits.
The reason these old movie fights look so good is that studios employed these actors & had them training for their roles (Acting, Speaking, Fighting, Horse-Riding, …).
Dave, showing us all that not only is a he a master of the sword, but also a master of the nuances of storytelling & fine acting. Just look at what he gave 10's to - when you know, you know. And Dave shows us that he knows too! Lovely!
@@Taylor_Costa This is something I only realized when I started paying blade and sorcery in VR. It takes one mistake and it's over. It's like a chess match where the king is threatened on every single move.
The fight is supposed to be a vessel for the characters more than it is an epic incredible duel. Lots of Star Wars fans just like cool explosions and pew pew and bad guy fighting good guy for 10 minutes.
The one thing I’ve found with martial arts is that the more advanced one becomes the less effort is expended. Obi-Wan has elevated himself to where the absolute minimum effort to get the job done is used, and to goad Maul into trying the same moves Obi-Wan has no doubt played over and over in his head for decades is just fricken genius. It’s a samurai duel where the first one to commit has already lost the moment he begins. Absolute perfection
@@IUsedToBeAnAdventurerLikeYou he did. And he was actually taught (partially, anyway), by Mr Rathbone himself, who was a fencing champion of the British Army.
The thing that always bothered me something fierce with the fightscenes in the Mandalorian with that spear/staff is when the person with the lightsaber binds on it and then it's just a shoving contest. Meanwhile you just see the other guy holding on the spear with naked hands or in their bracers (which pointedly don't have full beskar hand protection like a full gauntlet) and there's literally zero kind of crossguard to stop the blade just travelling down the length of the shaft and slicing those fingers holding on to the weapon off. Like, what's the other guy going to do about it? You're in a bind, you just let your lightsaver slide down the shaft and violá you just Skywalkered the other person's hand and they can't hold on to their precious weapon anymore because their fingers are gone. Meanwhile the worst that can happen to you is the guy shoves the upper part of their spear into you for a smack but you're standing so close to another they can't actually pierce you with their point, plus you could just duck out of the way as you slice down the shaft. Just take their damn fingers off. It's already in the finest tradition of Star Wars fencing anyhow. Goddamnit!
I mean, here's a great part about that. The Darksaber is actually REALLY bad at being a lightsaber. It still is one of course, and anyone who get confused and thinks it's this totally different thing is still wrong, but it's actually really bad at it in a few ways. One of them is important to this very concept... The Darksaber seems to want to get stuck against your opponent's weapon, which may be a reason Gideon was unable to slide it down as you suggest.
In canon light and dark sabers work better (more swiftly etc) the more you have the power of the force so I get in this situation,because Gideon has no force knowledge so he slugs it around like it weighs 150lbs. However, why Mando uses his spear like it’s a very heavy sword instead of an actual spear I cannot tell you.
@@D3monB4dger8 lack of training with it, remember: he only just got it so has zero experience with it and is only using it because it’s the only thing that can battle the sabre
Somebody might have mentioned it already, but the question of 'Why a man fell off the horse' for The Count of Monte Cristo, is is because he slid his sword under the horse and clipped through enough of the saddle strap that the whole saddle fell off with the guy. If a man could stay mounted while his saddle slides off, cudos to him for his skill.
Yeah I wish they would have shown more of that fight scene. He just trashed it in a few seconds unlike the more comprehensive examinations of some of the other scenes.
Yeah, it's a thing that a lot of reviews seem to gloss over; there's an assumption that either characters have the same knowledge base as the reviewer, or simply that, having shown competency with more than one weapon, they're probably good with anything else. It's why I rejoiced at his overview of Rob Roy; where a tutored swordsman dominates the untutored, but is undone by underestimating Rob's will to endure pain and to survive.
I feel like that wouldn’t be a disadvantage to Mando. He’s been training with a huge variety of weapons since he was a small boy, even living in his armor since he was a child. A staff is a really good weapon for cross training on other weapons, and I’d have to imagine Mando was used to stick or staff fighting. Gideon on the other hand is at a huge disadvantage.
Nah that doesn't hold up, some of the moves Mando pulled? Pedro Pascal also did pretty well with a spear as the Red Viper so I assume it's a case of Giancarlo Esposito being unable to keep up forcing all the coreography to work around his handicap.
For the Count of Montecristo, he cut the girth/cinch strap on the saddle, causing it to roll off. Kind of surprised you didn't cover the rest of the fight.
Seriously, why not just break down the actual duel? One of my favorite duels and I wanted to know how technically accurate it is and he only focuses on the first 5 secs. I was so into this video until that moment.
@@bronwynreijnders7205 It seems pretty implausible to me too, since first of all girths aren't really made of flimsy stuff. Granted, there's a lot of tension on it, which might make an initial cut enough to cause the rest to break as well, but if you want to create a cut that instantly breaks the entire girth, the horse is going to be seriously injured as well and can't be ridden for a long while because the wound has to heal before you can put another girth on. But that's not what makes it most implausible for me, because not everyone respects horses as much in a fight. What makes it most implausible is that you could only really hit the girth if the horse's front leg is extended forwards. Since horses make huge strides in a gallop, the probability of the horse being in that position right where the guy was standing is incredibly small, let alone how he could've known that at the moment he raised his sword. If a horse is standing still, it's already really hard to hit the girth in a clean sweep because the leg sticks out further to the side. I reckon it would just glance off the leg and then hit the horse's belly behind the girth. It's like standing in the corner of a room, making this giant sweep with your sword, and then expecting the paint in the corner to be damaged.
@@MerelvandenHurk And even IF we allow it for the girdle to be cut by a sword which really doesn't look like it has the cutting power to do so, and for the horse to still walk away uninjured, there's still really no reason for him to fall of it. I've had girdles snap (usually because they were old) and unless you change direction, you will usually still stay on top. You'll get loose, but why would the rider go sideways unless he himself makes that motion.
I think if you look at the Count of Monte Cristo scene again, the man on the ground cut the bindings on the saddle, which caused the horseman to fall off. Not sure if that is realistic, but that's what they went with. Very enjoyable video. Thank you.
@@preacherjohn I think they tried, but there is a balance between what you can show and limits to how much you can do without showing how it's acting and they're not actually cutting at the flank of a horse or at the human.
@@christopherfassett9973 one thing it was an English saddle so only one strap however as you say a standard girth strap is quite thick in order to prevent this
The last scene, the implied maneuver (as crappily edited and executed as it was) was that the character on the ground slashes the saddle strap from underneath the horses belly. That's why the rider falls off and as he does you see the saddle slip off with him. It's still really bad, but there was at least some thought put into what is causing the rider to come off.
Magnificent and interesting! Rob Roy is so interesting to me because the villain's swordplay won but the villain's arrogance lost. Our boy Roy only had to hit once.
The darth maul kenobi was one of my fav scenes of the show which I loved and arguably my favorite sword fight. From an educated and experienced perspective its perfect
I use to hate the maul kenobi because I wanted more of a action something a kin to the battle on mustafar but I watched a video the voice of maul going into the meaning behind the fight and now its part of top 10 fights.
Not justifying how effective or based in reality Edmond's tactics are but I think what he's trying to do is cut Mondego's saddle girth strap. Then the force of the moving horse knocks the sword from his hand during the cut and Mondego falls off with the saddle (if you look closely you can see it) because nothing is holding it to the horse anymore. That's what I got from the scene, not sure if that clears anything up.
Count of monte Cristo horseback scene at the end-Edmond cut the strap for the saddle on the horse. Mondego didn't fall off the horse so much as the whole saddle slide off the horse and took him with it.
Glad he knew about Obi-Wan's stances. There were a lot of good fights in this video and he explained them very well and understandably, great work. 🔥💯💖
Glad to see the Robin Hood fight in there getting such praise as always considered it to be one of the best movie sword fights but would have liked to have seen his comments on the Princess Bride which has some great sword fighting scenes. Especially the cliff top one between the Dread Pirate Roberts/Westley and Montoya.
I remember reading that Basil Rathbone knew how to sword-fight, but he kept playing the villain in the movies, so he had to lose, but he was able to make it look good. I'm glad that fight got a 10.
@@tenacioustubbs8358 Precisely. It is also clearly why Edmond Dontes' sword goes flying across the field. I'm honestly surprised he missed all that, whether it is realistic or not.
I noticed that, too. Of course, if anything, the saddle and the rider should have slipped to the left, as all of a sudden all of the weight of both stirrups is on the left side, but whatevs
@@mikeharner3977 Especially as there are quite a lot other spots he could have hit or moves he could have made... and tbh, the rider is already off-balance to one side in the saddle when he's charging in - it probably would have sufficed to spook the horse into rearing to make him fall off.
The Darth Maul vs Obi Wan fight in Rebels is the best fight ever in Star Wars. So much story, feelings, character displayed in so few moves. It's perfection
About the fight scene in Mandalorian; Neither of them is trying to kill each other. Mando is trying to capture Gideon and Gideon is trying to purposefully lose to throw off the balance of the planet Mandalore due to their tradition of "only the strongest shall rule" which means that his purpose is to break down the crew which is taking over his vessel while the platoon of Dark Troopers are incoming. The other thing that Dave mentions is the weight of a lightsaber which according to Lucas was initially meant to be heavy. Since either of them are force sensitive individuals, they cannot harness the force to amplify their strength and dexterity to properly use Lightsaber and thus Gideon's style comes out as bit clumsy whereas Mando is using Beskar spear which is light to use. At the end of the episode where Luke comes aboard and just steamrolls those Dark troopers you can see that even though his lightsaber is much longer and thus heavier weapon the person using it is an force sensitive and has no problems of using it lightning fast.
I never saw that Robin Hood film, but everything this guy said about the scene stuck with me for the past year, especially the close quarter action and the finishing stab and recovery.
any scene Basil Rathbone was involved with should be an automatic 10/10, dude was a legitimate world class fencer and he elevated every fencing scene he was in, even when the opponent really wasn't that good themselves he knew how to work around it. I'd love to see him do the scene from the 1935 Zorro movie with Rathbone and Tyrone Power
I NEED MORE! These are so damn watchable, Dave I want to see you review and detail every single popularised fight scene from the last 25 years please. I am pretty new to HEMA but it seems like you know how to describe things in a way that's useful to me, trying to learn it all from scratch. I'm not sure it is healthy but each time I watch these videos of yours, I want to go out and challenge random highwaymen to judicial duels / duels of shivalry :D
Feeling pretty stoked. He said the same thing I did about the Obi-Wan/Maul fight when I first saw it. How Obi-Wan had learned but Maul was still trying the same moves.
i know nothing about fencing but i friggin' love this guy. his cadence, his charisma, and his general tone when critiquing scenes, i wanna go to the pub with this lad
IRW the lightsaber movements you described in The Mandalorian are true. However, we true Star Wars fans understand the canonical protection of Force (Plot) Armour. Great Video! Thanks!
Rob Roy's fight scene is one of my favorites. Like all martial arts movies it's trying to tell a story using the fight. You can see Tim Roth's character's arrogance. You can see so much heart in Liam Neeson's character.
![I.N "HALLUCINATION" | [Stray Kids : SKZ-PLAYER]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/n5B5q1Hwt_U/mqdefault.jpg)
Him pointing out Obi-Wan changing into Qui-Gon's stance is so satisfying for me.
Obi wan used the same fighting style as qui gon until the end of episode 1. He changed it after precisely because ataru isnt suited to indoor combat, as shown by both qui gon and obi wan getting rekt.
@@666Kaca It's a shame not as many people know about lightsaber forms. Knowing that Maul consciously and deliberately trained in Juyo, which specialized in aggressive offense, and that Obi-Wan switched to Soresu for its defense, really adds something more to their characters when you watch them. But other than just noting the form he's using, the fact that the animators put in that little call back of him shifting into the stance that his master used when fighting with Form IV instead of the stance we saw him take when using that form was just a nice little detail and a bit nostalgic.
@@Close.Quarters.Ramen. I agree completely. You can even see mauls eyes widen when obi wan takes that stance iirc, he was probably thinking to himself "this is gonna be quick and easy", which it was, just not for maul :D
I think the reason qui gon and yoda have a slightly different stance than obi wan(during ep 1) is because they are masters of the form and he is still a padawan.
More satisfying than me being your 69th like?
It's crazy to me because that catch was such a deep dive into Star wars lore and then he talks about lightsabers being light. when George Lucas specifically intended and was vocal about them to be like you were wielding something incredibly heavy... is funny to me
"Run away a lot, when someone gets close to you, cut them."
Kiting explained.
Running away bravely
@@Raz0rking Sir Robin?
@@timsickler5125 *Brave* Sir Robin
Advancing to a more advantageous position
@@EternalVirgin Tactical retreat.
Camping aint camping. It is tactical waiting
"You alright mate?" "Oh no you're dead" That was too perfect.
It was a bit of a Hollywood death though. One reasonably small stab in the gut and ugghg dead. Nothing is more deadly in hollywood than the stab in the gut. INSTANTLY fatal, especially if it's done by a 2 inch blade. Meanwhile, someone can get shot in the chest area by assault rifle, grimace a little, and move on. Hollywood "logic".
@@nickllama5296 they Acting was pretty shitty as well but this was about the fighting
Love how he actually puts what he sees in context of the story.
yes, Aragorn was fully prepared to die on that hill, as long as Frodo gets away.
other times you will see an amateur in a film behave like an amateur and the judge will say "well, he is behaving like an amateur, 1/10"
I just watched a castle warfare expert trash monty python and the holy grail for the scene where Lancelot rescues ,what he thinks is a damsel being forced to marry, but turns out to be a guy. The scene starts with Lancelot running up to the two gurads at the door and killing one.
The expert says that would never happen. A man cant attack a castle alone.
When he is killing the wedding party at the reception, why is a market inside the castle? And why kill everyone?
The scene where he finds the "damsel" and drops to one knee , a knight would never expect praise for this .
I was hoping they would show him the French castle in England scene.
Your mother was a hamster.
Hamsters cant give birth to humans.
They really should watch the whole movie.
Shadiversiry can be like that sometimes. He's great and all but when this guy said "if you're going to try and find an equivalent weapon to the double ended saber I dont want it to be a sword equivalent" I was thinking LOOKING AT YOU SHAD 😑
@@MrYfrank14 I mean, "your mother is a hamster" means "your mother gives birth a lot". Not that he thinks Arthur's mother is an actual hamster.
Bonus: "your father smell of elderberries" means "your father is a drunkard"
@@justguy-4630 - ok, smart guy, what is the air-speed Velocity of an unladen swallow?
European.
African swallows are non migratory.
@@nahadoth2087 well, within the scope of the story, he did use his surroundings quite well, and didn't just stand there laying into them.
but yeah, IRL no one would ever charge a superior force like that if they had sanity left
I feel like we can give Will Turner a pass on his bad sword grip. He's a self-trained blacksmith's apprentice. Even if he trained vigorously for three hours every day, if he doesn't know what he's doing, all that training will do is imprint bad habits
I always thought that was sort of the point of that scene, Captain Sparrow was schooling the self-taught blacksmith who practiced his swordplay alone without books or a teacher to guide him. He was testing him and taunting him and teaching him his flaws all the way through the fight.
Good point.
@@captaindred342 Was there anything in the movie that said he had no books or anything of the like on the subject? I know he says that bit about training every day, but I can't remember any dialogue that stated he had no guidance at all.
Sure you are correct in saying that Sparrow was someone who had actual experience, schooling someone with no practical experience (and likely little to no guidance). But this says more about Sparrow's skills & experience than it does Turners lack thereof.
(Saying that you do something does not automatically mean you do not do something at the same time in many instance, just look at approval/disapproval ratings, one is not the inverse of the other)
@@whyjnot420 Nobody even knew that Will was doing the actual blacksmithing, if he had gotten proper sword training, it would have been mentioned
@@MrGBH Fair point.
If a dude's got a moustache like that he knows what he's talking about
Facts 😂
Kaiser Wilhelm II. says yes
They actually make you grow it before you receive his title.
Hitler
@@RTArts1 no. Just, no
can't believe they actually did the ben vs maul rebels fight
Because it's basically a perfect scene, both in-universe and in reality.
His rating makes it even better
Cause its amazing. The moment obi wan assumed his ataru stance instead of soresu i knew something was up. Turned out he was just baiting maul into repeating the thing that killed qui gon. It was extremely quick and satisfying to watch, showed how obi wan evolved during the years.
The game version too!😆
@@666Kaca at first he did his soresu stance because maul angered him by talking about Luke so the young obi wan came out but then he realized he can’t let his emotions influence his actions and thought logically which is not something maul did which is why maul lost
i barely know this dude but one of my solid goals in life now is hold a sword in a manner that makes him proud and not upset
If you're legitimately interested, there are definitely places you can learn to use a sword (once the pandemic is over, anyway). You can use the HEMA Alliance Club Finder to find places that teach Historical European Martial Arts, which is Dave Rawlings' expertise. There are also other traditions that do swords, such as Japanese kenjutsu and Filipino Martial Arts. Even sword sports like Olympic Fencing teach a lot of the same fundamentals as the martial arts.
same lol
@@InSanic13 lmao wouldn't fencing be an appropriate social distancing activity? you both wear pretty solid masks, and you maintain distance because you don't want to get stabbed.
@@BenjiQ575 swords with out wrestling is no art for war.
@@InSanic13 Wow!! Thank you so much for mentioning this! I never knew there was a club so close to me!
Kenobi getting a 10 made my day. That scene blew me away the first time, then I realized just how rich it was and watched it ten more times. Was amazing that the writers didn’t explain it, they let us figure it out.
Was glad to see this as well, happy how he broke it down with the changing of forms and maul doing the same move. This guy Filoni's.
I was really disappointed in the fight the first time I watched it because it wasn't very flashy, but after thinking about it, it shows how much Obi-Wan learned and how little Maul matured.
i love it even how Obi Wan holds Maul as he passes even after all the BS a true perspective change for Maul
@@yig_501 ĺ no
It was a 15! The screen just maxed out at 10. The scene over all works so well because of the subtleties. The duel starts with words, goes into the stand off, then climaxes with the blades. There is an edit where someone mildly superimposes young Obi-Wan and Qui-Gon over Obi-Wan’s stance changes. Then Santine and Qui-Gon being held as Kenobi holds Maul
I love that he actually takes into account what the story is trying to say in these fight scenes rather than just outright dismissing scenes that don’t have perfectly realistic/professional swordplay. Context sometimes turns a scene that would appear unrealistic or amateur into something really brilliant
Me: Hey I like that fight. It seems nice
Dave: It upsets me
Me: It upsets me
🤣🤣🤣 same
Me: that looks deliciouse
Gordon: disgusting
Me: disgusting
You don't argue with a moustache like that
Stole it from a comment on the first videoo
@@Lsssb1704 This video is 5 months older than the other.
Dave Rawlings: "This. This is a 10."
Dave Rawlings: "I hate this. I hate this so much."
Loved this breakdown.
@@davidgresty8545 I met and had the opportunity to do some training with him at Swordsquatch a couple years back. He is such a delightful person.
Do you like popcorn with honey?
Surprisingly, quite a lot of 10s in there... :)
90% of the comments: ben vs maul.
9.99% of the comments: dat audio.
Me: this guy's collection is Grievous's wet dream.
You forget the comments about his moustache!
FINE ADDITION TO MY COLLECTION
Dude, that's my wet dream too. Look at that stuff man
He's got the full melee armory in that room
He could arm the bri’sh a’my
I really like how he not only just evaluates it as a martial artist but takes into account what the fights scenes are conveying in terms of filmmaking it's a really fair and balanced criticism
I really appreciate how Rawlings critiques the technique in the context of storytelling, that is a fantastically important -- but often ignored -- aspect of films that I see more often than I would like. Having that fundamental understanding that characters are not fighting by the books, but to show who they are as characters makes it much more enjoyable to discuss.
Obi Wan v Maul getting the respect it deserves makes me happy
Excellent standoff.
Guy who played Maul is already a legend. Ooh, they're doing Rob Roy gtg.
It is classic samurai dueling. Seriously. And it's over quickly, as it would be.
This guy's Moustache looks like it self has won 12 duels with a rapier
12? That moustache has a career record 54-0.
Looking at his channel (
London Longsword Academy) probably not only with a rapier
By far, best comment I've seen today :D
When he tries to shave, the moustache keeps parrying
The fight between obiwan and darth maul was so brilliant. The idea that obiwan tempted maul and taunted him by using Quigons stance. Knowing maul would use the same move which killed Obiwans master and countering it with two moves was brilliant and poetic
the fight was over before it even began. brilliant.
It also says that Obi Wan has spent a lifetime mulling that moment over in his mind. Thinking about what could have gone differently, about how to respond to every attack - and how Maul might have reacted in kind. For Obi Wan, that was one of the darkest days of his life, and he's still - decades later - fixated on exactly how to fight this opponent. Even better, it shows the weakness of the Sith. That hatred can cloud your judgment - that seeing that taunting stance, Maul doesn't stop to think if it's bait - he recognizes the taunt and attacks just as he did before, confident, arrogant, mistaken. The fight is like 5 seconds long, but it's got mountains of subtext.
I honestly completely missed all of that. Now that I have seen this scene broken down and analyzed however, I am completely reevaluating my perception of it.
Yeah, it really shows and contrasts the character development of the two. Obi Wan has learned from his experiences and developed wisdom, whereas Maul has really learned little to nothing, still full of rage and revenge. Even though Maul may be the stronger fighter, Obi Wan easily defeats him with a wise strategy. Wonderful storytelling.
"We are learning when we are not dying" more wiser words will never be said!
more wise/wiser. "wiser" is a word so that would be more appropriate but "more wise" is technically not incorrect
“You never grab a sword..”
“Yes, you would, IF YOU DON’T WANT TO DIE!”
Always the realist. 😂
I love it!
saddly especially for the rapier (maybe other swords is vaiable) if u try to grab it lets say when its locked somehow and not moveing, u give your opoment the easy way of removing your fingers so easily, with just a rapid pullback of the sword... rapiers are made to pierce and then get easily retracted from the wound. u would require a massive energy packed on your arm to even slow it down from retracting it back.. so ye bs imo
It's not realistic at all. Imagine that you grab a sharp kitchen knife when someone is stabbing you with it. Will you be able to hold it off? No. It just cuts through your flesh.
The reason why this technique is mentioned in manuals it's because you always fight with your hands protected. Otherwise, you are at a huge disadvantage. Your bare hands would be the first thing your opponent will try to hit.
So as your last resort - sure, you could try to hold the blade with your gloves, but most likely you'll be dead anyway. And with bare hands, it doesn't even matter.
Speaking from a HEMA experience as well.
@@KorsarNik I don't think you have HEMA experience. Holding a blade isn't as dangerous as it seems. Holding by the flat is totally feasible. You just need a fraction of a second to get your own blow in, not giving enough time for the opponent to yank it off. Grabbing the opponent's blade is a common technique in smallsword (shown in The Duelists) and present in almost every manual for most types of swords. Halfswording and mordhau are other examples of blade-holding. In a deadly fight it's also valid to sacrifice your hand in other to deliver your own deadly blow. Armored fighting with swords is all about holding blades (yours and your opponent's).
@@varagianafro9755 it will be hard to completely lock it in place, but it's viable to grab it to deflect the thrust or parry the cut for just enough time for you to thrust your own sword. In smallsword you really don't want to leave your sword hanging to closely to the opponent because grabbing the blade is a very common move
Dave rating the legendary rebels fight a 15/10 is pure gold.
That fight is one of the most beautiful moments of the entire franchise.
If you include the conversation before the fight (“look what I’ve risen above”), then that scene is genuinely my favorite in all of Star Wars.
This is true
every single frame in this is better than the sequel triology
@@HiopX you know, you can critique a SW scene without having to bring the sequel trilogy into it.
I remember, not too long ago, when the prequels were derided, far far worse than the sequels. Now they're praised to the point I wonder who they sucked off to get said praise.
So I'm predicting in ten or twenty years the sequels will be looked upon just as fondly.
@@WalkerRileyMC (x) doubt
Aragorn literally said, "if by life or death, I can help you, I will" so you got that correct about sacrifice.
Wrong. He figuratively said.
@@davidnichol4735 wrong again, he actually said "If by my life or death I can protect you, I will"
Mad respect for reviewing the Star Wars rebels fight and recognizing the genius of it!
It should not surprise anyone that the scene starting around 3:48 looks so real. Basil Rathbone was the British Army's fencing champion twice, and he took the time to teach Errol Flynn (and Tyrone Power) how to fence properly. For those who do not know these actors, the scene depicted shows Errol Flynn and Basil Rathbone. Rathbone is probably best known to us older Americans from a series of very entertaining Sherlock Holmes movies.
I'm a big fan of the trio too.
I really liked his assessment of the fights. A lot of these the experts can come across a bit arrogant but he is one that really loves what he does and even in scenes he thought were bad would still point out something he liked or understood was done well. Even with cartoon and fictional weapons he responded like watching a real life fight.
You can tell he's watched a lot of it already as a fan, because he can make connections like the one between Obi-wan's stance and Qui-gon's. Between this and the last video, you can tell he appreciates the value of story-telling in a fight, and doesn't just nitpick the techniques.
"What are you doing?"
"The video is over, your Grace"
"What do you mean it's over?"
"There's no more fights that the Sword Master with the magnificent moustache has rated"
"Is that what over means! So. Get. More."
I understood that reference.
i wish I knew the reference XD
@@matt.p.6022 GOT King Robert
This fight scene has to be seen in the context of "F*ck it!" 😅
Yep i absolutely saw Aragorn feel that the first time i saw that scene!
I mean, if your gonna sacrifice yourself like that you might as well take as many of them with you as possible
Finally someone realizes that a double-bladed lightsaber is basically a lightsaber staff!!!!! And props for catching the mind games Obi-Wan was playing with stances. Thumbs up!!!!
Shadiverity had a video about that
Wasn't it always obvious that double bladed works like a staff? That's how I thought of it as a kid
I mean in games it's sometimes called the saberstaff, I've always known it as that
I mean.....it’s called a saber staff in the lore so...yeah.
Which is why they should have given Rey one of them cos then at least the argument “she’s trained with a staff all her life” would have some credence
Cunnigham v Rob Roy is one of the best depictions of sword fencing in movie history. It needs to be said that Rob Roy was the worse swordsman which was established in the movie and Cunnigham was toying with him but at the same time showing how to fence properly. Sacrificing your hand was also a viable move. There were instances where a swordsman deliberately let his hand to be pierced just to deflect the blow and open up his opponent for a mortal strike.
Absolutely! A hand can heal. A lethal blow can't.
Think there's a movie called the duelist that has some great fencing
Well done for paraphrasing the expert
@@aaronforsythe8556 literally in the video
Basil Rathbone was a champion fencer. He was the entire reason why swordfights were such a common trope back in the day. He clearly taught Errol Flynn, and many others, how to handle a sword in both an effective and theatrical way.
And choreographer/stuntman Bob Anderson, who was involved in many movies, from 'Robin Hood' through 'Empire Strikes Back' and 'Return of the Jedi,' and 'The Princess Bride'..
Huh I never knew that! learned something today thank you sir! This version of Robin Hood was one of my favourite movies as a kid
Also, Nedo Nadi taught Errol Flynn...
I don't like the way he's holding his sword,the way Orlando Bloom is holding his sword upsets me lol.
Love it
Well, his character was self taught
@@BEZERKSTUDIOS718 yea, he trains everyday alone in his workshop
@@richi7494 3 hours a day to be precise so that when he meets a pirate he can kill him.
Know let's see a horse rider critique the way Orlando Bloom (as Legolas) mounts a running horse.
Well, he's a better archer than fencer, I think.
One of the things I appreciated in the Robin Hood fight is that it looks like they are actually aiming to hit each other, you can see real aggression in their movements - there's not much fancy mucking about, these guys are really laying into each other and the parries are genuinely necessary
THIS. That was always what struck me about the fights in that movie. They'r not toying around, they really hate each other guts and are trying to kill each other. There's skill and mastery in their fencing, but both are means to an end, and not an end in itself like in other swashbuckler movies.
Still the best Robin Hood.
For me, the funny thing after seeing that scene get 10/10 is something I've seen more than a couple of times in written stories - older fantasy, at least - where some modern people end up using swords. Because one fairly well-liked comparison to use when describing somebody doing it badly seems to be those old swashbucklers movies, and often enough the best-known ones. Like that particular Robin Hood. Some hero from our world goes through a gate to an alternate world, or time-travels, then is being taught the sword, and learns that it's best not to do it like Errol Flynn did it in that old Robin Hood movie. :D
Both of these actors were excellent swordsmen so there is real skill there.
Great duel, but Basil Rathbone was the superior fencer. He was a former British Army Fencing Champion. If I recall correctly, he took lessons from Aldo Nadi, an Olympic gold medalist and world-class fencer.
They did the Obi-Wan and Maul fight from Rebels! And David Rawlings GOT IT! That is amazing! Mad respect for you, David Rawlings.
I giggled like a school girl at the guy’s analysis of Obi Wan and Maul’s fight. He hit the nail on the head. Obi Wan knew Maul would do the same thing he did in the prequels when he shifted to Qui Gon’s stance and used that to Maul’s detriment. He learned while Maul didn’t. Freaking love that scene. So glad it got 10 out of 10. Also the thing you have to understand about the dark saber is it takes the right state of mind to wield it. It was probably super heavy for Mof Gideon. This was covered in Book of Boba Fet and Rebels.
So glad they put The Duelists in here. Always wanted an analysis of this movie's fight scenes
I guess this guy sword of knows what he’s talking about.
It’s almost like hes an expert
You sound like you're on the *fence*, but this is clearly his *forte*.
@@merdufer bravo! Good jab with those puns!
I see what you did there
@@Eralen00 😉
The duel between Obi-Wan and Maul on Tatooine is one of my favorite duels in Star Wars.... It doesn't need to be long or over the top.... Everybody knows the history behind Maul and Obi-Wan and how much Maul hates him.... Its simple, elegant and like the dude says, shows evolution
Maul only learned to become angrier but Kenobi has learned a lot more in the same timespan.
The most badass mustache in the world is back
There's a dude in the sword community called Peter Pataki. He is an Austrian with the finest moustache I know of.
The skijumper Robert Johannson may have a word there xD
There's this failed artist with a funny mustache.
I love it when the guests have an understanding and appreciation for both their area of expertise as well as cinematic storytelling conventions like this guy does.
Im so glad Rob Roy was in this, it was one of the best sword fights i have seen depicted on screen!
"Are you alright mate? Ah no, you're dead"
- Dave Rawlings 2021
William Hobbs was the guy that choreographed The Duellists, Count of Monte Cristo and Rob Roy fights. He was the GOAT.
Absolutely agree.
Well, then the Count didn't get represented by a good scene, did it?
Him and Bob Anderson👌
@@JainaSoloB312 I believe he said Viggo Mortensen was the best sword fighting student he ever taught.
@@irrelevant_noob He fell off the horse because the Count cut the strap of the saddle. If you watch, the guy falls off sideways with his legs still splayed. And having skills as a duelist does not necessarily mean you will be proficient while also on horseback. But I think the big issue is that the Count trained almost non-stop for years in different forms of combat, while the other guy (can't remember his name) trained for years in only fencing. I wonder if he'd watched the whole movie before grading the thirty seconds of this scene that even preceded an actual sword fight.
Basil Rathbone, the gentleman opposing Errol Flynn actually won fencing championship of British Army twice whilst he was in army so he was pretty professional about it. I think they both practiced it. Also as they did their own fencing there are stories that the cut on Errols cheek is a real one, an accident during filming of the Robin Hood. Don't know how much Basil and Errol had to do with the choreography of that movie or any other but smart director would've listened to them. 😉
Yeah, I noticed that when actors usually 'fence' they go out of their way of risking an actual hit, injuring their co-worker.
In this, on a few slashes it looks like they really intend to hit each other.
Btw, as you may know, during the shooting of one of the Aragaron sword fight scenes, a stuntman actually hit Viggo Mortensen's teeth, cutting it in half. Fortunately for the actor, 21th century dentistry was at rather higher level than in olden times I guess.
The person who was choreographing the fight scenes for Errol Flynn movies, Bob Anderson, actually did so for Lord of the Rings and Pirates of the Caribbean too. Which is crazy to me.
@@sarasamaletdin4574 And Star Wars and The Princess Bride and lots more! Truly one of the greatest of the age
@@JainaSoloB312 @Sara Samaletdin Little mistake here. Bob anderson didn't make fights for Errol Flynn's in Robin Hood, because he was 16 years old at the time. Fred Cavens is the the guy who did thoses fights, and many more. But yeah, Bob anderson did some awesome fights too !
Thanks for this! Well interesting
Loved the commentary on the fight from Robin Hood. Basil Rathbone was the actor who played Guy of Gisbourne in the scene from Robin Hood in this video and it reminded me of something I saw on TV as a kid. If I remember correctly years ago when he appeared as a guest on The Tonight Show (back when Johnny Carson was host) he gave a little fencing exhibition. He and Johnny faced off with swords and then he did a quick little twist with his sword and simply disarmed Johnny Carson! (I'd always heard that Basil Rathbone tended to play the villain and "lose the fight" in the movies but in actuality he was just about the best fencer among the actors in Hollywood at the time.)
This was a heck of a long time ago, so if I'm misremembering somebody please correct me! 😊
Again, great video commentary!
Yes - Rathbone did a lot of Hollywood "historical" stuff, including a great fight with Tyrone Power in The Mark of Zorro, and you can see he really did know how to use a sword.
Yes I'd heard the same thing! Rathbone was often cast as a hero's opponent bc he was so highly skilled at fencing that he could make the hero's actor look good with whatever moves he exhibited and still keep the duel exciting.
The duel with Obi Wan is a great way to see his character growth when fighting. Now the duel from Vikings is also a great way to see two characters who are at an old age but both are still capable of fighting.
An old fighter has one GIGANTIC advantage: Experience
Can we PLEASE get this man a gig as fight coordinator on Mandalorian S3?!
He's a martial artist, not a choreographer. For people that do very realistic sword choreography, check out the channel Adorea Olomouc.
@Adrien Lasbleiz "Blocking" means very different things in martial arts and filmmaking. Just one example of why being a martial artist doesn't make you an automatic good movie fight choreographer.
@Adrien Lasbleiz But bruh he's not a writer and a martial artist...
Your general idea is good though, creators should pay more attention to the "reality", many creators think "reality" stuff is boring, and that's usually because their lack of understanding of the reality. Pure fantasies are impossible, you always need some "stuff" from the real world to be the fantasy's building material.
@Adrien Lasbleiz Well who knows, I think if he wants to he can definitely do it, I'd be stoked if there's a movie that has John Wick and The Raid vibe but set in the medieval times.
@@CanalTremocos check out Knight Fight by History! seriously knowing martial arts is enough to make a great blocking as long as you have the right camera angle XD
"If your allowed 15 it's 15"
Celebrity Deathmatch Ref: 'I'll allow it'
Maul and Obi Wans final fight is perfection
Fun fact about the Robin Hood movie. The duel shown is part of a much larger battle scene in the castle with probably at least 100 extras. When the extras are fighting, you can hear the swords "clicking" because they're using plastic props. Errol Flynn and Basil Rathbone were experienced swordfighters and already well-trained for this, and they used real metal swords for their one-on-one duel. However, when they fight someone other than each other they obviously had to use the plastic props as well. With sound editing nowhere near what it is today (this movie is from 1938) there was no editing to the sword sounds so if you listen carefully you can tell when they're switching back and forth between the metal and plastic swords. Though you can also just go by the fact that when they're fighting each other they use metal, when they're fighting someone else they use plastic.
Another fun fact from the same movie: all the people that Robin shoots with arrows actually are being shot. Howard Hill, the world famous archer, did all the archery shots for the movie. They basically dressed up extras with padded armor and had Hill shoot them. Their pained reactions are largely real because while the arrow would be stopped by the armor, the impact itself still hurt. Can't imagine that would be allowed in productions today lol.
Awesome. I hoped he'd do Rob Roy and here it is, with a 10/10 to boot. A duel is proper when it furthers a story - but its even better when it tells a little story on its own.
Didn’t even have him review the part where Captain Jack tests Will Turner on his foot work during their duel in Pirates of the Caribbean.
Cos.. In real sword fighting, footwork isn't separate from bladework.
@@nightshade7240 And to piggyback, someone without proper instruction (such as Will Turner) might very well have trained a lot in technique with the sword, but could have also neglected footwork. There are boxers and MMA fighters with some good striking form with their hands, but make blunders with their footwork.
Ironically, it is stated that Jack Sparrow's swordsmanship is morse than many of the characters including William Turner... Perhaps he already realized that out, and simply wanted to slip away using his wits.
Basil Rathbone playing Guy of Gisborne in the old Robin Hood movie, was an experienced swordsman in real life.
The reason these old movie fights look so good is that studios employed these actors & had them training for their roles (Acting, Speaking, Fighting, Horse-Riding, …).
Fencing at their finest, right?
I'm so glad he looked at the Rebels fight (and gave it a 10), it's legit my favourite in Star Wars for many reasons.
Dave, showing us all that not only is a he a master of the sword, but also a master of the nuances of storytelling & fine acting.
Just look at what he gave 10's to - when you know, you know.
And Dave shows us that he knows too!
Lovely!
Amateurs: Rebels Obi One vs Maul is the WORST Lightsaber duel ever, its so boring, even worse than in ep4.
Fencing expert: It's beautiful, 15/10
the fight It's just not epic but it's very real because the majority of real fight ends quickly
@@Taylor_Costa This is something I only realized when I started paying blade and sorcery in VR. It takes one mistake and it's over. It's like a chess match where the king is threatened on every single move.
@@TresTrefusis that move was more beautiful than a queen sacrifice
The fight is supposed to be a vessel for the characters more than it is an epic incredible duel. Lots of Star Wars fans just like cool explosions and pew pew and bad guy fighting good guy for 10 minutes.
The one thing I’ve found with martial arts is that the more advanced one becomes the less effort is expended. Obi-Wan has elevated himself to where the absolute minimum effort to get the job done is used, and to goad Maul into trying the same moves Obi-Wan has no doubt played over and over in his head for decades is just fricken genius.
It’s a samurai duel where the first one to commit has already lost the moment he begins.
Absolute perfection
I love this man's explanation for Darth Maul vs Obi-wan and my god did he reveal stuff that I haven't thought about before.
Basil Rathbone was a trained fencer. He helped choreograph that fight scene.
I believe Errol Flynn also knew how to fence. Not 100% sure though
@@IUsedToBeAnAdventurerLikeYou he did. And he was actually taught (partially, anyway), by Mr Rathbone himself, who was a fencing champion of the British Army.
The movements of those two are like a dance.
Oh that’s so cool! Had no idea! Makes sense why it’s so good
The thing that always bothered me something fierce with the fightscenes in the Mandalorian with that spear/staff is when the person with the lightsaber binds on it and then it's just a shoving contest. Meanwhile you just see the other guy holding on the spear with naked hands or in their bracers (which pointedly don't have full beskar hand protection like a full gauntlet) and there's literally zero kind of crossguard to stop the blade just travelling down the length of the shaft and slicing those fingers holding on to the weapon off.
Like, what's the other guy going to do about it? You're in a bind, you just let your lightsaver slide down the shaft and violá you just Skywalkered the other person's hand and they can't hold on to their precious weapon anymore because their fingers are gone. Meanwhile the worst that can happen to you is the guy shoves the upper part of their spear into you for a smack but you're standing so close to another they can't actually pierce you with their point, plus you could just duck out of the way as you slice down the shaft.
Just take their damn fingers off. It's already in the finest tradition of Star Wars fencing anyhow. Goddamnit!
I mean, here's a great part about that. The Darksaber is actually REALLY bad at being a lightsaber. It still is one of course, and anyone who get confused and thinks it's this totally different thing is still wrong, but it's actually really bad at it in a few ways. One of them is important to this very concept... The Darksaber seems to want to get stuck against your opponent's weapon, which may be a reason Gideon was unable to slide it down as you suggest.
Did you just use Skywalker as a verb?
In canon light and dark sabers work better (more swiftly etc) the more you have the power of the force so I get in this situation,because Gideon has no force knowledge so he slugs it around like it weighs 150lbs. However, why Mando uses his spear like it’s a very heavy sword instead of an actual spear I cannot tell you.
@@D3monB4dger8 lack of training with it, remember: he only just got it so has zero experience with it and is only using it because it’s the only thing that can battle the sabre
Somebody might have mentioned it already, but the question of 'Why a man fell off the horse' for The Count of Monte Cristo, is is because he slid his sword under the horse and clipped through enough of the saddle strap that the whole saddle fell off with the guy. If a man could stay mounted while his saddle slides off, cudos to him for his skill.
Yeah I wish they would have shown more of that fight scene. He just trashed it in a few seconds unlike the more comprehensive examinations of some of the other scenes.
In the Mando vs Gideon fight, neither of them had any training with the weapon they used.
That is a very good point. Matt Easton (another English historical fighting/weapons chap) mentions this in his (much longer) review of that fight.
Yeah, it's a thing that a lot of reviews seem to gloss over; there's an assumption that either characters have the same knowledge base as the reviewer, or simply that, having shown competency with more than one weapon, they're probably good with anything else.
It's why I rejoiced at his overview of Rob Roy; where a tutored swordsman dominates the untutored, but is undone by underestimating Rob's will to endure pain and to survive.
I feel like that wouldn’t be a disadvantage to Mando. He’s been training with a huge variety of weapons since he was a small boy, even living in his armor since he was a child. A staff is a really good weapon for cross training on other weapons, and I’d have to imagine Mando was used to stick or staff fighting. Gideon on the other hand is at a huge disadvantage.
@@dallascrosby2574 Well, according to my CV I'm 'used to' coding in Java, but I haven't done any in 15 years.
Nah that doesn't hold up, some of the moves Mando pulled? Pedro Pascal also did pretty well with a spear as the Red Viper so I assume it's a case of Giancarlo Esposito being unable to keep up forcing all the coreography to work around his handicap.
''Orlando Bloom is holding his sword in a manner that upsets me'' LOL
But tbf to Will Turner, he was self-taught, wasn't he?
"In the context of F*ck it" - F*cking brilliant 👌😂
I like how he pointed out the context of each battle, that changes how some moves should be interpreted.
Yeah Tim Roth was magnificent in Rob Roy. That final sword fight - I lost count of how many times I watched it!
For the Count of Montecristo, he cut the girth/cinch strap on the saddle, causing it to roll off. Kind of surprised you didn't cover the rest of the fight.
Yeah, that was disappointing that he didn't see the saddle and rider simultaneously slide off the horseback.
This always annoyed me. If you cut deep enough to snap the girth, you would have severely injured the horse as well. Just a pet peeve of mine.
Seriously, why not just break down the actual duel? One of my favorite duels and I wanted to know how technically accurate it is and he only focuses on the first 5 secs. I was so into this video until that moment.
@@bronwynreijnders7205 It seems pretty implausible to me too, since first of all girths aren't really made of flimsy stuff. Granted, there's a lot of tension on it, which might make an initial cut enough to cause the rest to break as well, but if you want to create a cut that instantly breaks the entire girth, the horse is going to be seriously injured as well and can't be ridden for a long while because the wound has to heal before you can put another girth on. But that's not what makes it most implausible for me, because not everyone respects horses as much in a fight.
What makes it most implausible is that you could only really hit the girth if the horse's front leg is extended forwards. Since horses make huge strides in a gallop, the probability of the horse being in that position right where the guy was standing is incredibly small, let alone how he could've known that at the moment he raised his sword.
If a horse is standing still, it's already really hard to hit the girth in a clean sweep because the leg sticks out further to the side. I reckon it would just glance off the leg and then hit the horse's belly behind the girth. It's like standing in the corner of a room, making this giant sweep with your sword, and then expecting the paint in the corner to be damaged.
@@MerelvandenHurk And even IF we allow it for the girdle to be cut by a sword which really doesn't look like it has the cutting power to do so, and for the horse to still walk away uninjured, there's still really no reason for him to fall of it. I've had girdles snap (usually because they were old) and unless you change direction, you will usually still stay on top. You'll get loose, but why would the rider go sideways unless he himself makes that motion.
This man is amazing and his fanboy side is hilarious and a treasure
Ain't a sword fighting video without some Errol Flynn swashbuckling it all up.
Rob Roy's final fight is probably the greatest sword fight in cinema.
Not at all. But Top 10, sure.
I think if you look at the Count of Monte Cristo scene again, the man on the ground cut the bindings on the saddle, which caused the horseman to fall off. Not sure if that is realistic, but that's what they went with. Very enjoyable video. Thank you.
The last one is supposed to be that he cut the saddle strap of the horse which is why he fell off but they didn’t capture it that well
Yeah, maaaybe. Like you said, they didn't show it well
@@Glabe87 We see the saddle leave the horse together with the rider, if you look closely.
Maybe if they'd tried to show that instead of cutting away at the crucial second.. XD
@@preacherjohn I think they tried, but there is a balance between what you can show and limits to how much you can do without showing how it's acting and they're not actually cutting at the flank of a horse or at the human.
@@christopherfassett9973 one thing it was an English saddle so only one strap however as you say a standard girth strap is quite thick in order to prevent this
The last scene, the implied maneuver (as crappily edited and executed as it was) was that the character on the ground slashes the saddle strap from underneath the horses belly. That's why the rider falls off and as he does you see the saddle slip off with him.
It's still really bad, but there was at least some thought put into what is causing the rider to come off.
Everyone should see "The Duelists." A beautiful film. A few different styles of dueling. The saber duel is intense.
i think is one of the most realistic saber duels movie ever made. I saw that movie several times , is a masterpiece
Same choreographer as 'Rob Roy,' William Hobbs. Wish they got him for the prequel Star Wars films, instead of the "lets twirl more" people..
Awesome movie. Incredible fencing. I also had the pleasure of meeting Keith Carradine once and he was a super generous, very approachable dude. 10/10
Rob Roy remains the best sword fight ever put to film... simply brilliant.
Magnificent and interesting! Rob Roy is so interesting to me because the villain's swordplay won but the villain's arrogance lost. Our boy Roy only had to hit once.
The darth maul kenobi was one of my fav scenes of the show which I loved and arguably my favorite sword fight. From an educated and experienced perspective its perfect
I use to hate the maul kenobi because I wanted more of a action something a kin to the battle on mustafar but I watched a video the voice of maul going into the meaning behind the fight and now its part of top 10 fights.
Not justifying how effective or based in reality Edmond's tactics are but I think what he's trying to do is cut Mondego's saddle girth strap. Then the force of the moving horse knocks the sword from his hand during the cut and Mondego falls off with the saddle (if you look closely you can see it) because nothing is holding it to the horse anymore.
That's what I got from the scene, not sure if that clears anything up.
We need more of this guy. Interesting stuff.
For more of this guy see link to his channel in the description at the top!
@@kevinneighbour3458 thanks
@@DreckbobBratpfanne always happy to help folk find out more about swords!!
Count of monte Cristo horseback scene at the end-Edmond cut the strap for the saddle on the horse. Mondego didn't fall off the horse so much as the whole saddle slide off the horse and took him with it.
"Orlando Bloom is holding the sword in a way that upsets me" has me losing it
Glad he knew about Obi-Wan's stances. There were a lot of good fights in this video and he explained them very well and understandably, great work. 🔥💯💖
Glad to see the Robin Hood fight in there getting such praise as always considered it to be one of the best movie sword fights but would have liked to have seen his comments on the Princess Bride which has some great sword fighting scenes. Especially the cliff top one between the Dread Pirate Roberts/Westley and Montoya.
There's another video where he does
It sucks they still didn't ask him to do a review of a lightsaber fight from the Prequels.
At least we have Shadiversity for the time being
He touched on Yodas in the last video. He seems to be a prequels fan
@@eldnahym As movies, the prequels are atrocious, but when it comes to fight choreography, they truely are a work of (martial) art.
@@MouldyCurtains
As movies, they are as good as any of the OT.
If he did Anakin vs Dooku in ROTS, he might have pointed out the part where Anakin grabbed Dooku's hilt right before cutting off Dooku's hands.
I remember reading that Basil Rathbone knew how to sword-fight, but he kept playing the villain in the movies, so he had to lose, but he was able to make it look good. I'm glad that fight got a 10.
The Duelists is one of my favourite films since i was young, Keitel is just superb in this.
Re:Monte Cristo he cut the saddle strap and thats why he fell off.
The girth, specifically... although, how he did that when the girth is covered by a leg, stirrup, and stirrup strapping is beyond me.
Yep, you can see that the saddle comes off of the horse as well.
Not realistic obviously, but that's the narrative.
@@tenacioustubbs8358 Precisely. It is also clearly why Edmond Dontes' sword goes flying across the field. I'm honestly surprised he missed all that, whether it is realistic or not.
I noticed that, too.
Of course, if anything, the saddle and the rider should have slipped to the left, as all of a sudden all of the weight of both stirrups is on the left side, but whatevs
@@mikeharner3977 Especially as there are quite a lot other spots he could have hit or moves he could have made... and tbh, the rider is already off-balance to one side in the saddle when he's charging in - it probably would have sufficed to spook the horse into rearing to make him fall off.
The Darth Maul vs Obi Wan fight in Rebels is the best fight ever in Star Wars. So much story, feelings, character displayed in so few moves. It's perfection
About the fight scene in Mandalorian; Neither of them is trying to kill each other. Mando is trying to capture Gideon and Gideon is trying to purposefully lose to throw off the balance of the planet Mandalore due to their tradition of "only the strongest shall rule" which means that his purpose is to break down the crew which is taking over his vessel while the platoon of Dark Troopers are incoming.
The other thing that Dave mentions is the weight of a lightsaber which according to Lucas was initially meant to be heavy. Since either of them are force sensitive individuals, they cannot harness the force to amplify their strength and dexterity to properly use Lightsaber and thus Gideon's style comes out as bit clumsy whereas Mando is using Beskar spear which is light to use.
At the end of the episode where Luke comes aboard and just steamrolls those Dark troopers you can see that even though his lightsaber is much longer and thus heavier weapon the person using it is an force sensitive and has no problems of using it lightning fast.
I never saw that Robin Hood film, but everything this guy said about the scene stuck with me for the past year, especially the close quarter action and the finishing stab and recovery.
6:37 I never realized until now how nicely the music syncs up with the strikes. *Chef’s kiss*
any scene Basil Rathbone was involved with should be an automatic 10/10, dude was a legitimate world class fencer and he elevated every fencing scene he was in, even when the opponent really wasn't that good themselves he knew how to work around it. I'd love to see him do the scene from the 1935 Zorro movie with Rathbone and Tyrone Power
That scene in The Mark of Zorro is considered to be the finest swordfight in classic movies.
I NEED MORE!
These are so damn watchable, Dave I want to see you review and detail every single popularised fight scene from the last 25 years please. I am pretty new to HEMA but it seems like you know how to describe things in a way that's useful to me, trying to learn it all from scratch.
I'm not sure it is healthy but each time I watch these videos of yours, I want to go out and challenge random highwaymen to judicial duels / duels of shivalry :D
Feeling pretty stoked. He said the same thing I did about the Obi-Wan/Maul fight when I first saw it. How Obi-Wan had learned but Maul was still trying the same moves.
i know nothing about fencing but i friggin' love this guy. his cadence, his charisma, and his general tone when critiquing scenes, i wanna go to the pub with this lad
Lovely to see you rating two William Hobbs choreographed fights. He was a master.
IRW the lightsaber movements you described in The Mandalorian are true.
However, we true Star Wars fans understand the canonical protection of Force (Plot) Armour. Great Video! Thanks!
I like how he takes in the context of the situation/show that the fight its in.
Rob Roy's fight scene is one of my favorites. Like all martial arts movies it's trying to tell a story using the fight. You can see Tim Roth's character's arrogance. You can see so much heart in Liam Neeson's character.
As someone who's never studied swordfighting I'm proud to say I liked the ones he liked and hated the ones he hated.
Dave Rawlings, who is always a treat, and "How Real Is It?" together? This is like a dream video for me.