This Level Literally Requires a Computer Science Degree. -Mario Maker Uncleared
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- Опубликовано: 4 окт 2024
- Helgefan Video: • Divide & Conquer: How ...
Nick's Video: • Divide & Conquer! by G...
Additional Resource from Ceave: • Why this Two Pixel Gap...
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Maybe I'm stupid, but I'm almost done with my cs degree and this is beyond me
Thanks for the pin! 😅
This is what will be on the final exam!
@NastadonGaming I'm quitting and doing graphic design then 🤣
Pin of fame (and relatable pin)
this sort of thing (get it?) is pretty standard in algorithms & data structures classes?
The whole level is a reference to team 0%. A long, complex journey to algorithmically clear all gaps (in the list)...and it basically will take all the time Nintendo gives to the players.
Man is a poet
This is the equivalent of an English teacher looking too deep into "the door was blue."
It's an allegory.
@@catster9489and he doesn’t know it
Helgefan is absolutely insane. He came up with the idea of clear condition levels back in Mario Maker 1 before clear conditions were a thing.
Collect every 1-up mushroom without collecting any normal mushrooms? He did it by abusing sprite limits.
Collect every power up in the level? Did you know that you can position a pow on the edge of global ground and it gets nudged 1 pixel if small Mario collects a power up? Helgefan knew.
Build a contraption that forces a player to play a slider puzzle? He can do that too.
Build a contraption that randomly generates addition problems that the player has to solve with binary numbers? He has a level for that too.
Helgefan's game knowledge can only be described as out of this world and it was always a treat to play his levels when he submitted them to me as viewer levels.
Him and pannenkoek should collab they'd probably cure cancer in the Mushroom kingdom.
if MM1 and regular mushrooms were things
@@helgefan8994 Ceave didn’t? Well see my note on your dumbness then.
Wait there’s a slider puzzle level? I gotta see this
all of those sound insane to do in SMM1 (or 2, for that matter), and I would love to see those levels in action if RileyC hasn't covered them already.
didn't expect to see an n log n sorting algorithm in Mario Maker
What is the factorial’s inverse?
@@alysdexia I'm not sure I understand the question. Are we talking about the discrete factorial function or about computational complexity in i.e. an O(1/n!) algorithm?
@@tubebrocoli both but you mean e.g. and a reciprocal isn’t a function’s inverse. A logarithm is used to bound the exponential’s inverse but a factorial is smaller than exponential. Maybe I should google this instead as you didn’t get my intent.
@@alysdexia I'm not sure I understand fully but, if you want a function f such that f(x!) = x, then it doesn't exist. This is because 0!=1! and you can't cancel those with an inverse function to get 1=0. If you relax the definition of "function" a bit you can sorta make one or if you restrict the inputs to x>≈1.46 because after 1.46 all factorials are different. I don't believe that this should be any nice function. There isn't any name for it. Using this approximation: x!≈sqrt(2 π) e^(-x) x^(x + 1/2) you could find an approximate inverse or you could get an inverse in terms of weird integrals and the incomplete gamma function.
@@siddanthvenkatesh2744 not supposed to be nice < niais < nescius := not-skilled like you nor weird := fateful -> uncanny := bizarre; would → should.
POV: you're in a Google job interview, and instead of the "fastest horse" question you get asked to sort the POWs.
This is the only level I know of that requires you to literally take notes to beat it. Insanely creative level.
There's plenty of escape room levels that require users to make notes to beat them though.
@@thenonexistinghero Usually players have the brain power to remember those
@@IDK3679. You couldn't be more wrong. These levels are often specifically made with players taking notes in mind and also using screenshots. Outside of some geniuses no one would be able to clear them without taking notes.
@@thenonexistingherothey still don't require it because you can just memorize the path/ solution, unlike in this one where the order is random each time
@@MrTheStephReal That's a garbage argument. The POW spawns might be random, but the solution is still the same every time. Stack POWs to figure out their 'weight' and then basically follow a formula/flowchart until you're done. It's essentially a rubix cube. Might require more effort than escape rooms since you'll need to take notes on every run, but outside of people trying to get a world record on those stages... people are only going to beat through those levels once at most and they'll have to use extensive notes for both this level and complex escape room levels.
Wow thank you very much for praising my tedious stage!
But you got one thing wrong: That clear video you used here for your purposes was not played, uploaded and edited by Nick. It was all me, the level creator. :-P
EDIT: My bad, I didn't realize there's also a clear video by Nick.
Hey Helgefan! Nick also has a clear video where he edited out all the pauses. Maybe I misspoke at some point. I’ll review and see if I can make a correction
WHAT
@@TheRileyC Oh I had not seen Nick's clear video and just assumed it was all footage from my clear. My bad.
Don't bother changing anything, it's great! :)
that's an actual interview puzzle btw
is it? its just sorting more or less.
@@zwishking6032the hard part is that the values are hidden - there was an actual Google interview question that was basically the same but with 25 horses that you couldn't time, and just had to compare how fast each was by running races 5 at a time and thus knowing the horse that came 1st out of the 5 you just raced but not knowing where in the 25 they'd be.
In the Google question though, it was just finding the minimum number of races to find the fastest horse, not sorting all 25 (though by excluding the fastest and repeating the process, that becomes a sorting algorithm)
@zwishking6032 also its easy to say that it's simple when you're not in a limited time interview without being allowed to consult any resources lol. People practice a lot to make sure they can pass leet code and other such coding problems in interviews
@@jblen but all the basic sorting algorithms don't use values either. they rely on comparisons. ig the tricky thing is doing things in parralel...
but the question you said seems flawed or messy. are the times random variables? otherwise, how can you distinguish between the slowest horse and second slowest horse?
ok googling it, you get to see the relative order within each race you run. this is not too bad imo. but I'm a discrete mathematician, so maybe such problems are just too familiar to me.
@@zwishking6032 I'm a computer scientist, I'm no stranger to sorting either. You're right most sorting does just use comparisons over their numeric values, but I'd still say changing out a numeric value for a more complex comparison complicates it a bit.
For this level, comparing two pow blocks means putting one on top of the other which adds the issues of needing to climb the towers you make, being only able to add to the top of an existing tower, and needing to keep track of identical looking pows.
For the horse race question, it's about efficiency since as you said, the tricky part is doing things in parallel - if you just compare every pair of horses by brute force then it's not hard but considering how you would race multiple each time and then figure out how to slot two groups together requires a bit of lateral thinking.
1:19 I was fully prepared to listen to you talk about parallel universes.
LMAO
I love this so much. Taking advantage of RNG spawning and the level timer so that you HAVE to apply the proper algorithm to win, is such a genius idea.
And it's just plain cool that a puzzle level was able to last this long, when almost everything else remaining is Kaizo.
Next puzzle level: 10 Gauss-Jordan iterations in SMB3! 😃👍
name of the level: 'If you can't solve this I will personally Gaussian Eliminate you'
Fun fact, the name "Divide and Conquer" is a reference to a general category of algorithms which aim to recursively break down a problem.... aka divide big problem into small easy problems and then do them over and over until big problem is solved
so here our big difficult problem is sort without knowing values, which we really break down into 2 problems: "roughly figure out the order" and "sort", this allows us to divide out the one big pile of unsorted pows into 5, more manageable stacks, from there we can sort each of these individual stacks just enough for us to figure out the smallest, then we put the smallest from each stack and sort those to find the real smallest, then rinse and repeat the full process until everything is done.
Note: we cant just assume the "sorted" stack of the smallest from each stack is in order because what if one of the stacks has all 5 of the smallest of the whole set of pows which is why we have to run the full process each time, but we can guarantee that the smallest in that stack IS the smallest one remaining
GIANT GAP STRIKES AGAIN! CEAVE GAMING BLESS US.
I legit squealed when I saw he linked Ceave too lol
This is such a cool idea for a level; I recall watching a bunch of more complicated multiplier / divider setups from a Japanese creator after the Cluttered-Chaos Calculator, but making the player perform an efficient sort as a game mechanic is next-level, lol.
Why I'm not meant to do computer science:
1. Coding
2. This video, apparently
I’m somewhat good on the coding part buuut.
This video apparently
is this what videogames look like to game journalists???
So someone put a merge sort into SMM lmao. As someone with a degree in "almost CS" (SE), this makes me pretty happy.
Feels more like a heapsort IMO, where each node has capacity for 5-6 children. The trickiest part is the need to physically reorder the first generation to find the minimal element, scrambling the pointers to the next generation (so those pointers need to be externally tracked in separate memory, i.e. pen and paper). But unlike an array based heap, voids in the structure are self-collapsing (gravity), so you can sift elements up instead of down during removal.
Though, you could run it more like a merge sort by first fully-sorting each sublist - maybe that's faster?
“But I can actually see the fun in it.”
You are hallucinating.
Man, I did not expect Mario Maker to be a way that brilliant people express their intelligence without speaking.
I know nothing about SMM. I was very confused by your explanation. I looked at Helgefan's video. Your explanation of the critical mechanic at 0:47 - 1:00 *is **_exactly backward._*
The situation where there is *_no gap_* is *_precisely_* when the POWs "sit as they spawned" (i.e. they are stacked *_in the order they spawned in,_* if you count from the top of the stack), while "changing the order" (i.e. any adjacent pair *_not_* being in the correct order) is what *_causes_* the gap.
I'm guessing that this happened because you attempted to simplify the explanation for the listener, but the entire rest of the explanation hinges on understanding this.
The effort to complete all of the levels, and the insane amount of game knowledge required to pull off some of these levels is nuts.
Surely treating Prisoners of War like this is against the Geneva Convention
O-oooooooooo AAAAE-A-A-I-A-U- JO-oooooooooooo AAE-O-A-A-U-U-A- E-eee-ee-eee AAAAE-A-E-I-E-A- JO-ooo-oo-oo-oo EEEEO-A-AAA-AAAA
A fellow man of culture, I see.
THERE'S NO FATE
TAKE CONTROL
BRAIN POWER
me when the brain powers
I taught myself 8086 assembly off of university pdfs
and I only half understood this
It's just merge sort with a hat on
Someone needs to get a WR on that course using bogosort before the servers shut down. I know there's nowhere near enough time for that to be feasible, but it would be so funny.
Given you only get one try, you probably mean miracle sort, but yeah - wonder if there's enough randomness to make that technically possible.
Ceave Gaming flashbacks on this one.
Wow, I remember that calculator level from forever ago. I remember being so impressed on how that was even possible
Just like you can make a calculator in geometry dash, although geometry dash is basically just a programming platform like scratch at this point.
Thank you for documenting team 0% and their progress. I may not be able to help with the levels but I’ll be cheering you guys on!
Ah okay, after rewatching a few times I get it now though. That's genuis to use the game's programming as a mechanic for a level. Props to the creator
This is so interesting. Even as a computer science student I wouldn't have considered that solution. I would've tried to use merge sort and probably run out of space and/or made towers impossible to climb up
>sprite limit
>tfw no scuttlebug jamboree
Imagine you accidentally throw the last one
This game is rated "I" for Insane
I love this so much, brutal yet amazing!
I love this whole team effort to accomplish 0%. This level is just nuts.
The guy that made this level is an absolute turbo nerd, and I mean that in the most positive way possible.
Someone managed to turn being a computer into fun.
Imagine going on a final exam of a computer science masters degree and then they give you a gamepad
This reminds me of the first major iron farms in minecraft
Very reminiscent of the Median of Medians algorithms in some aspects - breaking up into 5 discrete arrays that are individually sorted, then putting an element of each in a “merged” stack. Of course, that’s a pivot selection algorithm for finding the single median of a list, not a sorting algorithm for continuously finding the smallest, but it’s a cool in its similarities until that point.
I just did my CS algorithms class last semester. Thought I wouldn't run into divide and conquer much outside of it, but I guess it's in Mario now lol
the only level where you literally have to take intense notes like you're in school to complete it
Now someone has to complete a bubble sort in 8 minutes.
I've only just done Sorting Algorithms such as Merge and Bubble Sort. This feels like how the search (I believe it may be bubble sort but idk) would work in a simple to understand way.
So from what i can take away from this is that the game makes you become one of those sorting algorithms, even down to being able to compare only two things at a time. Thats actually pretty sick!
I've been following this since your first videos and haven't been this early! Keep up the good work!
I have a computer science degree and what this reminds me of is database page sorting lol. You have a set number of pages and you have to merge them together in a way. And yet it isn't quite the same, because this level requires that you have to definitively always know the smallest one. Wild. I wonder if there are other viable ways to beat it. I honestly think there are. Any algorithm which satisfies the ability to check conditions available in the level should be valid.
its insane to see how much work people are willing to put into these games
This kind of knowledge is too POWerfull
2:30 *hmm, seems a lot like merge sort*
3:33 "the merge stack"
What a great clear video!
Insane level, really creative!
All levels are creative.
@@alysdexiaEven Timmy levels?
@@Brixsterthey used to not exist but later exist so they must be created/creative.
it just takes an understanding of sorting algorithms and an in-depth understanding of Mario maker mechanics it can also be descibed as you have 30 boxs each has a unique number you don't know said number however the box lights red if the box below has a lower number and its on a comparator you can make as many stacks as you want and make as many comparisons as you want at the same time however you must sort these by physically moving the boxes and you have limited time to do so
Wow I finally understand completely
Finally a chance for mathematicians to say git gud
I somewhat understood this, but it's because I love competitive programming. I don't play mario though. Nice level!
Question, could you sort the pow using a bubble sort algorithm (so the pile of pow goes from biggest to smallest) then put the smallest pow in a pile of it's own.
This way you don't have to sort the other pile each time you want to find the smallest pow, but am I missing something and this is actually slower?
You probably could, and in fact that way was more intuitive to me, but it's not very efficient. O(n^2) vs O(n log n). Though, that's in terms of computer performance- maybe bubble sorting and less pausing for notes is easier for a human to perform.
@@Chubby_Bub okay, thank you.
Also bubble sort is kind of the poster child for awful efficiency but being human intuitive so this is a pretty spot on thread lol
that's just the Merge sort method used in the video, no? You find the smallest of each set, and then sort those again to find the next item in the sorted sequence.
but also, remember that this is a physical pile of objects stacked in a column, and not numbers in an array. doing this method allows you to just look at each stack and only remove POW blocks out of it. Bubble sort requires you to switch POWs block around, which means tearing down the stack, switching the two blocks, and building it back up so you can make the next comparison, which is both inefficient and error-prone.
Lol its like if the tower of hanoi had abfuscated information. Legendary.
that's as amazing as it is completely insane :O but less than 2k? hell yes!
Video took me so long to edit that we’re now under 1.5k
@@TheRileyCtada emoji!
Plumber jumps on turtle.
Is the algorithm that hard, no. Is it absurdly long yes it is. Point being this is puzzle security through shear labor vs complexity. I actually have a puzzle toy I refuse to solve just because it requires an absurd amount of time to solve.
had no idea how that level worked when i first saw Nick's video so thanks for making this riley 🙌
and a huge gg to nick for clearing it
I actually tried this level, I knew the algorithm, but I always ended up accidentally throwing a pow, or running out of time. Good someone actually finished it
0:15 Ooh! It does!
(From a Ceave video lol)
but what even is an uncleared level
And then there's me who can barely see the gaps...
This is just ridiculous at this point
Has the last SMB3 level been cleared yet?
Yes
This is BEYOND obsession. O.o
Bro’s explaining better than teachers 🧌
This sucks! Not the level! The level is awesome! Nintendo not seeing the technical artistry on display and not making any effort to preserve the art created on this game is what really sucks.
I CSNT FUCKING ESCAPE LEET CODE ITS EVERYWHERE HELPPPP
Of course it's a german who made this
Could you instead use a quicksort instead of a merge sort?
I don't think something like quicksort works here, because there are some major limitations in this - you can't reorder the blocks in the final list once you've added to it, and you can't create any list that's large enough to contain all of the blocks anywhere other than the final list. With the quicksort algorithm I believe you'll sometimes end up with lists that are too large to fit in the level and things will get really messy really fast - if you tried hard enough it might be possible to make it work, but it would be very convoluted in those kinds of cases.
Additionally, there are some mechanical limitations that make it not as clear what the efficiency of various sorting algorithms are anymore (normally sorting algorithms assume for instance that moving an element somewhere else in the list takes a constant amount of time, but in this level it is not a constant amount of time because it depends on how far you have to move).
as an occasional smc streamer watcher at best, this just fucking blew my mind
Dont use bubble sort
Wait isn't that the bitonic sort rather than the merge sort that I see people talking about in the comments ?
This is awesome
Geek power or Geek on powder?
Lets not exclude a potentially powderful Geek D:
/Geekage overlord.
Honestly I find it a little (lame? sad? disappointing?) that the creator gave tips about how to beat the level.
Ceave Gamers Unite
I got dumber watching this. Its not bad. Just...
Beyond me.
Holy crap Lois
yeah
I mever played mario maker but i think this project is awesome, im so rooting for you all!
I'm gonna be honest g, I'm a sophomore in computer science and i hardly understood any of this
Think heapsort, but each node has 5-6 children instead of the typical 2 and you sift elements up the heap (take minimum from each layer) instead of down, because you can only run comparisons between siblings and you're fine with voids in the structure (it doesn't need to be a contiguous array).
So i Will not use the computer
Bro thinks he's the Riddler 💀
1:16 Huh!
What is the time complexity of this level?
My brain hurty
But WHY do you have to sort them in the order they spawn? You said that POWs have gaps when they are in order, but sit flush when you change the order.... then you said you NEED them to sit flush so you can progress... so it should be any order except the order of spawn, right??
no, you misunderstood the objective of the level and what the gaps means. The POWs leave a gap if the upper block spawned after the lower one (i.e. upper < lower), and NO gap if the upper block spawned before the lower one (i.e. upper > lower). It doesn't tell you if the blocks are "in order" or not, it just tells you which one spawned after.
So, you need a stack of POWs that has the earliest spawned block up top, and the latest one at the bottom, so that none of them ever get a chance to be airbourne and despawn.
why the f does a pow have a value
i wish i could help out, but i have no wii u or 3ds
Beast needle
my brain hurts
how......... does one make this. brilliant.
Couldn't you selectively despawn pows to manipulate the order?
The pows spawn from pipes meaning they have to be on screen to spawn more. There’s no way to get back up to see the pipes because there are invisible blocks
This was surprisingly simple
It was not