I Learned My Lesson The Hard Way...
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- Опубликовано: 20 сен 2023
- In my packing for a recent backpacking trip in the Uinta Mountains, I wanted to carry the lightest pack possible for the trip. In my gear selection I focused my choices more heavily on weight than any other considerations. A couple less than ideal things happened because of that, but it wasn't all bad...
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Развлечения
This video is important. As a new hiker, I often feel like I’m doing things “wrong” because there’s so much emphasis placed on saving every ounce possible. I’ve spent an absurd amount of time wondering if my Nemo dagger 2p is too much tent to be carrying, even though I love it. The reality is, the vast majority of the people out there, and who watch these videos for the most part, are casuals who are out there to get away for a little while. They aren’t doing double digit miles per day over multiple days. Someone needs to be the voice of reason for those of us trying to find a good balance.
Pack light freeze at night, something I was thought during my time in the military. With that said, packing too heavy makes for a terrible hike as well, finding that middle ground takes time. Always enjoying your content and well received advice. Have a great week…
Thank you!
Good one - "Pack light, freeze at night"
Comfort for sure! We discussed this on the podcast I did with you on risk. I almost went to the same place you did last weekend, until I saw the forecast where the overnight was going to go hard freeze. For me, the forecast totally determines what pad is going in there with me. 3-4 oz is not worth freezing your tail off. The breaking the Peak Refuels in half is something I have been doing since the Uinta Highline Trail last year. The breakfast skillet is way too much for one person. But makes a great breakfast for two mornings. That, with caloric density as the guide for what to pack, I dropped weight and volume down in my pack substantially. I think the need to be considered "ultralight" on trail is really overblown. I am usually at 22-25 lbs pack weight on trail. I have a grand time out there! Sleep and maintaining core temperature are really important. For that alone comfort over UL takes it for me. Glad those temps didn't cut your trip short. Looked chilly! 🥶
Thanks dude! Yeah, my whole back side was not happy! The splitting of the meals made seriously such a difference in my comfort in feeling happy with the amount of food I needed. I was still in the 600+ calories for dinner and breakfast, which for a trip like that is more than enough. I am still able to get 2500-3000 calories a day which is just right for me on weekend trips like that. :)
I totally agree about "the need to be considered ultralight" is totally overblown. I've hiked enough miles to know and learned about my body, what I need to be comfortable with in the backcountry, and that my body can carry a little more weight. I don't even care to weigh my pack before heading out because I know the importance each gear/equipment that I decided to pack in my bag.
A few extra ounces from a slightly better thermal pad or a warmer jacket, or just an additional layer, is not that much of a burden in the grand scheme. Cold weather dictates a whole different approach! I think you can still be very light compared to "traditional" backpacking but if there's any place you don't want to skimp, it's in insulation since that's a direct safety issue.
Agreed! Finding that balance. What’s funny is I had an extra mid layer in the car, had it in my hand and then tossed it back in the car.
@@BackcountryExposure bummer. You'll never make that mistake again.
Agreed. Easy to be light, when conditions allow. Freezing to death simply in order to save weight...is not terribly smart. It kinda gets in the way of having a successful trip, too...
I definitely test out my gear in the back yard. I can test out in the cold the wind the snow and rain,safely. So when I am out there I have a good idea of what I can expect out of my gear. I can always bail if something goes wrong or doesn’t work. How cold can I take my pad and quilt,how does my shelter work in bad conditions.(wind, rain and snow). Preparation is key. I don’t want to find this out on trail. My core gear stays the same,the only changes made are for temperature. A warmer mid layer or jacket,warmer socks for sleeping etc.All my gear is pretty lightweight but I am definitely not ultra light. I am confident when I go out with the gear I am bringing,that is important to me.
I had a trip where temps were predicted around 35° only to wake up to 20 in the area we camped. A thermal liner and or clothes were key in making it through that for me as my bag was on the edge rating wise. Spend the money on light gear to save any ounces and cary the weight when it comes to truly important gear for safety.
Great eye opener for people watching this. I had the same experience last weekend. It was cold in the nights and I only brought by summer Klymit pad. Wow, did I feel the cold from the ground even being layered up with all my clothes and puffer. Miserable night. Plus I forgot to repack my food bag. Only 1 meal and snacks for a 3 day trip. Good thing I caught a fish to eat. Cool video. Mistakes are how we learn and progress. Have a great day.
This dilemma is probably my 2nd favorite reason for why I prefer winter camping above all. The ability to just drag +100 lbs of crap with you on a sled does wonders for comfort
I like the fact that you can admit making mistakes so that others do not and potentially put themselves at risk. I made the same mistake with shoulder seasons years ago. Now I make sure to pack a very very small light weight down bag to use as a liner when I’m not sure what to expect in shoulder seasons.
When it came time to invest in a sleeping pad (and only had the budget for 1), I went with the Xtherm. I carry it all year long. Overkill for summer, but mighty glad to have it in spring and fall!! Being a cold sleeper, I chose not to freeze over a few ounces.
My choice of sleeping pad, year round & for the same reasons. That 70D ground side material is almost bullet proof. I KNOW, my XTherm will insulate lil ole MEeee from the ground, frozen/cold/or otherwise.& will stay inflated all night long.
Warm Regards from Reno, Nevada
I'm surprised a R4.3 pad was cold in those temps. I have no experience with R4-5 pads in the cold. I also use my Xtherm all year round except for summer in the "low lands".
I'm pretty much packing Winter gear now. It's starting to get cold quick. Great video. It's easy to get caught up in going lightweight and sacrifice your safety. Especially when it comes to nutrition. Like not bringing ready to eat food.
40 degrees in the fall for some reason feels a lot colder than 40 degrees on a summer morning in the woods. ha ha
Thanks for being honest about your thought process and observations. I appreciate the candor.
Thank you! :)
Such a great video, shows how lighter is not always the right decision
😊
Thanks for sharing brother, and being transparent. Even with all the experience in the world, we can still sometimes make sketchy calls. And I got to say, being cold in the back country is no fun! I’ve hiked out before because of it. Hopefully a good reminder for the future. Of course, I don’t backpack nearly as much as you, but I’ve learned that I just can’t second-guess the cold and comfort thing. I get cold easy as I get older.
As an ultralight backpacker that has been backpacking for 25 years i make decisions based on weather and location safety first and foremost. If you’re not dressed for the weather it becomes a hazard and location can dictate how much danger you put yourself in when stuff goes sideways. I have also found that a lighter pack gets me further and happier without pain. I take only what I use and do not pack my fears and that comes with experience. Pack what fits your skill level, do trips that match your skill level and watch these videos as they are informative on what can happen to even the best of us with lots of experience. Stay humble and always keep learning, Great video!!!
Yes, sir. Same situation here but 46 years backpacking experience and ultralight the past 26. Pack accordingly to weather, skill, and never pack fears. Humbleness is a key word. Never sacrifice on any of that, that can be deadly.
Always good to have those lessons learned, and test your gear under adverse conditions to learn how it performs for you individually. I recently tried out a Six Moon Designs Lunar Solo tent and had tested it in the backyard, but when I took it out backpacking I ended up getting to the campsite late, in the dark and in the rain, and tired. This resulted in me not setting up exactly correctly; I fiddled with the stake configuration for over 30 minutes before giving up and sleeping in the tent without it the walls being taught. I slept poorly and got damp. In the morning light I figured out that it was simply the angle of the center pole needed to be straighter. So next time I can either get a different tent that is easy for me to setup when I'm tired, or just take that practice and lesson learned to use the equipment better next time.
Thanks for continuing to share your learnings, good and bad. That’s what pushing boundaries and experimenting is all about!
When I’m considering static insulation, I usually skimp a little knowing that my sleeping bag/quilt is always there to wrap around me if I’m too cold. Lay it over your neck like a scarf and tuck the foot and head ends under your armpits. That keeps it out of the way while cooking and chores.
The sleeping pad is always a tricky one. I probably would have laid my pack on top of the pad, then the jacket and any other extra clothes inside the sleeping bag under me. A thin CCF on top of the pad can have an outsized insulating effect as well.
Just some ideas that have worked for me.
I just did a 2 night (in and out) overnight and made the wise choice to bring my NeoAir XTherm and did not regret it. It got down to the low 30's/high 20's. While I tend to look at weight, I also consider comfort. I carry a Ti Pot and the Ti BRS stove vs. a Jet Boil. However, I just learned that I've been carrying too many stakes, so that will be fixed for next time.
I recently returned from a 5 day trip in the Eastern Sierra, near Rae Lakes. I had the same issues as you for the most part… I wanted to go ultralight, and decided on an emergency bivy system with the REI Magmus quilt and the thermarest neoair. The quilt did okay for the most part and the inflatable worked great, but as the Sierra’s do it dumped rain on us for nearly all of day one and into the night.
Additionally, I under packed my layers for enjoyment at camp. I was wearing shorts, and packed a super thin pair of dance pants as a wind layer, and could not get my core temperature at a good level at camp simply due to this. My upper half was plenty warm, but I neglected to understand how cold my legs would get
Great video Devin. Great information.
Ive been splitting my meals like that for years... in fact, if you put them in quart freezer bags, you can drop them in a toaks 750 ml pot, roll the bag edges over the lip of the cup and bam, no dirty dish and or burned hands.
That Zolio looks huge. The new Garmin Messenger puck is awesome with great battery life.
It’s really not that big.
I had the zoom down to 20 with foam pad and down jacket with no problem:-)
I always struggle with finding the perfect balance of weight and proper gear in the winter. One addition I add to my winter kit is the Gossamer Gear Thinlight ccf pad which goes on TOP of my Tensor insulated pad. There is some data on various backpacking websites showing a ccf pad on top of an inflatable pad provides more warmth than the other way around. The thinlight pad also doubles as my sit pad and relaxing pad during breaks. Great video Devin!
I’ve just added a Thinlight to my pack. Used it under my Zoom and was comfy at 30F using the Featherstone Moondance 25 quilt. My quilt is the long/wide and I don’t use straps, but let it drape over the sides of my 20” pad. I wonder is not having the sides of the pad exposed to the cold night air is the key?
Insightful video as always! 🎉
I thought I had too many tents lol I think you have me beat
Light over ultralight every time. I like to geek out over UL gear but when it comes to actually hitting the trail, the extra weight doesn't really affect me.
Having hiked for 2 weeks in Scotland recently, I was glad with my modest decathlon down jacket. Especially during chilly mornings.
Comfort trumps ultra light weight imo.
I plan to make the next hike lighter by 'gaining weight': mainly extra leg muscles and a bit of core/back muscle.
Alsof, when I'm cold/shivering going into my sleeping bag, I'll stay cold for quite a while. Whatever level of 'knackered' you're at, try to warm up before going to sleep.
My latest 'I knew better' experience, was buying an unknown 'Indian kitchen' freeze-dried meal. And trying it after an exhausting hot long, long day and then being baffled by an explosion of unknown spices, couldn't bring myself to eat it at all.
(Note to self); bring only food that you'll like guaranteed.
Just think. If you had a weather experience that I lived through in 1976 when on a hunting/hiking trip and weather forecast similar to yours, we went to sleep just on plan and woke up with a freak weather event having dumped over 8 inches of snow and tempos over 10 degrees colder than forecast. If we had planned on saving weight instead of going for comfort, we could have ended up like some of the others in our area. Being carried out. I will NEVER opt on the side of saving weight.
THANKS for the lessons from this "experiment". I go through the same self-examination EVERY trip but I use the word 'risk' instead of comfort. Because of the risks that you described, I will not compromise the performance of my pad or sleeping bag.
The other deciding factor is cost. I have an HMG Southwest. I could replace it with a little lighter pack, but I won't compromise the water resistance plus I don't want to invest another $300-plus when my pack still has a lot of life left in it.
I also carry a little heavier rain jacket in order to have better performance as a shell even though I may sweat a little more during a mid-day rain storm. Recently, this was a good decision because I had two days of constant drizzle from hurricane Hillary while on the JMT. The jacket did well in those conditions.
I do use the Vario and Ventus. I thought that together, these would be decent at the moderately cold temps that you experienced so I am very glad you cleared up my incorrect assumption. I am only a summer season backpacker so these may still be sufficient but you provided some very helpful info.
Great video Devin_indoors!
Try heating up some water bottles to keep in your sleeping bag it will help
Leave the chair at home and take a sit pad and take a better sleeping pad and coat alot less weight ...Just a thought ...
Your comment about stuff sacks is interesting because I was thinking of how I use them today and realized it depends on the pack I am carrying. On my SMD Swift X I really don't use them. I just have a trash compactor bag as a liner and just pack items in the order of what I need most during the day and what I will need first once at camp.
On my Mystery Ranch Bridger 35 I do use them though. I bought this pack, in part, because of it's modified clam shell design so I use dyneema stuff sacks to compartmentalize things for easy access. While it weighs a little more it is convenient to be able to stop and pull out the spare clothes bag to get a dry pair of socks, without having to unload 3/4 of the pack.
I've never regretted carrying more static insulation than less. My jacket that keeps me warm down to the 20s only weighs a few more ounces than your standard UL puffy (ghost whisperer). Also the ventus/vario i'm sure are great active pieces, they breathe so much they don't trap much heat while static.
Sleep is primary for me. My weight tradeoff is always to carry lighter or less other stuff so I can carry more comfortable sleep gear.
The mistake I often make is after summer packing, I forget just how cold lower temps are. For instance, it's only going to be in the mid forties, that's not that cold. Then, I underpack my sleep system and layering. Why I keep making this mistake is unknown to me. The worst mistake was grabbing my 45 degree bag by mistake when I thought I had grabbed my 20 degree bag. I was miserable for 3 nights!
That's essentially what happened here. Looking at the forecast I did fail to consider sleeping next to water and at 10,000'... I didn't mention that really in the video, but had I just thought a little longer/deeper I wouldn't have taken the Zoom.
Ouch
Decides to go ultralight, freezes, but brings chair.
So, this 10 minute video is: “one time I brought a sleeping pad that wasn’t warm enough for the conditions”.
Yay RUclips!
I hiked the Timberline Trail in Oregon a few weeks ago. First night was in Elk Meadows on the east side of the mountain and temps dropped to the mid 30’s and I got pretty chilly on the Zoom UL paired with a 25° ZenBivy (which is comfort rated to 30°). The following two nights only got into the mid 40’s and I was cozy so I think 45° is going to be the hard stop for me for the Zoom. The extra few ounces to bring the Rapide SL instead would have been worth it.
I also think that the balance depends on the length and milelage. I try to stay light but if I am doing 3-4 days I will carry a few extras. When I thru hike the AT I will keep the weight to the absolute minimum.
Yeah, I think you're spot on.
I just say one thing - DOWN VEST.
When it's down to freezing.. a down vest of 100g (3oz) will give you SO much comfort (day and night).
Another thing - Great work on the EVLV Ultra. I've been rockin that backpack all summer long!
Thanks for sharing this video. We don't get much humility on RUclips. Also appreciate your comments on what's important. I generally carry 20-22lbs total. That includes a REI Flexlite chair. Any time the low temp is below 40F, my Decathlon puffer goes. I've found that the Nemo Tensor reg/wide gets inadequate at low 30's. So I would carry a reflective pad to put under my bag. It's recycled box liner from Hello Fresh. They no longer use it but it's the same as what some auto sun shades are made of. My aux pad is 20" x 36"; torso length. For the coldest nights I take my DIY bag with a well insulated hood. Another "comfort"item that adds warmth is a small feather and down pillow that straps to the top of my inflated pillow. I really hate being cold. So I definitely agree that an extra pound is good insurance. TomLovesDIY
When I was carrying a frameless pack regularly, I had an 1/8" foam pad in the pack for structure, but when we redesigned the larger packs at Waymark to have a frame, I stopped using that pad. I really should add it back to my gear for shoulder season settings for that added insulation value.
Thanks!
Can you give any info on the sleeping bag? How would this bag compare to the riff 15?
In spring when the Zoom came out i immediatly ordered it but returned it after one Test Night. Mainly because i didnt like the Valve System and the Comfort. I was looking for a Pad for my GF for Iceland. While i sleep warm and im fine on my S2S Etherlight XT even down to freezing, my Girl sleeps cold so i returned the Zoom and got her the BA Rapide SL with 4.5 R . Its heavier but wayyyyyy more comfortable and warmer Pad .
For my Scandinavia layering i use a FarpointeOG 90gsm Alpha as Baselayer, add a icelandic Wool Lettlopi Sweater and for puffy i have Torrid Apex . As back up or Change Baselayer i have an Appalachian Gear Alpaca Crew Neck .
With these Layers i can hike in the hot Sun or down below freezing . I dont try to be as light as possible , to many Times i had Gear fail me and left me miserable . Im still at a 12lbs baseweight. Tent Tarptent DoubleRainbow Li with Liner . Mainly hiking norway and iceland
lol I had the zoom to -9 Celsius no worries
Great video... what device did you use to inflate your pad? That looked very interesting.
Thanks! It’s the new Flextail Zero Pump. It’s just launched on their indiegogo. I’ll have a video out soon on it.
Just bring 2 mylar sheets with you when camping next time ... One for the sleeping pad and one for your body they are very very light and keep from getting cold ...
Its the same material in you cold winter pad ...
I had an experience a few years ago trying to go extra light to test the limits of my gear, and I was cold at night. Not in risk to my health, just not comfortable and I remember thinking for the first time I wanted to bail. I did not like that feeling.
I still struggle each time with the amount of clothes to bring to the layering system and feel I always have too much. I wish I knew the best way to figure that out besides going on a lot of trips.
Weight makes a huge difference when you are going longer distances. The issue with that is most people can't go out and buy the lightest or best gear to accomplish that. I try to invest in one item a year to drop weight, and I really can tell on multi day hikes.
Good video.
I like that approach. Thanks!
Could you do a video of winter hiking gear on a budget? It’s starting to get cold, and we still want to hike. But some of this gear is so expensive!
I never take chances when backpacking. Lighter is not always best.
V-e-r-y interesting & informative video on a topic a lot of others are reluctant to talk about - comfort vs weight.
Food - Splitting all Peak refuel meals into ttwo equal portions is what I've done from the get-go 1/2 of a Peak Refuel meal fills me up. I use ziplok baggies & write on 'em the meal & how how many ounces of water I need to add. I boil 24 oz of water in a 750ml Titanium cup & insert it into my own homemade Reflectix Koozie. Most of the boiled water gets poured into a 450ml Koozie covered cup for hot hot coffee to enjoy while the remaining water & meal is rehydrating in the 750ml Koozie covered cup. That meal is a HOT HOT meal right down to the last sporkful. Virtually no heat is lost during the 10 minute re-hydration time.
Getting 2 tasty, nutritious, & filling meals out of one Peak Refuel foil pouch is hands down, the least expensive freeze fried meals on the planet.
I often added several ounces of pre-cooked bacon to the meal for added calories & flavor.
DEVIN - I can always snack on my supply of pre-cooked bacon, my tasty anytime/anywhere snack or take a mouthful of my own homemade energy gel (50% Brown Rice Syrup, 30% Molasses & 20% honey)
My sleep system, year round is an XTherm inflatable air mattress & my Western Mountaineering Antelope (5ºF rated) sleeping bag with the Gore Windstopper outer fabric. You KNOW what is my one & only shelter. I'm looking forward to your review/experiences with it.
Personally, I've always kept "Comfort" at night while sleeping my priority over "saving weight".
Warm Regards from Reno, Nevada.
May I ask what the repackaging bag that is you brought? I really want to try this, especially considering that I have to bring a bear cannister most of the times that I backpack here in Alaska
I assume you mean the square bag I held up? That was actually just a quick DIY sewing job I did with some dyneema fabric, webbing and some closed cell foam (1/8" foam that was left over from a Gossamer thinlite pad). It's what I had on hand, but you can easily make a coozy out of relfectics material and duct tape. Lots of videos here that show that. :)
Ive only been on 2 backpacking trips and the weather was an absolute disaster that kicked our asses like they have never been kicked. Even though that happened though, i consider it the best 2 trips i have ever taken and I cant wait to go suffer again lmfao
I like my EE Torid Pullover for my puffy layer at 9.1 oz , 258 grams Size medium.
That Torrid is a slick jacket!
It is impossible to have little or nothing in camping or hiking if you don’t carry the right gear you will suffer having a comfortable gear will make the difference
Skipping a chair or similar luxury item its drastically different than trying to save potentially dangerous ounces on life or death gear. Type 2 fun is part of backpacking but finding a balance between luxury and just enduring a hike comes with experience.
Hey Devin. I also have the Zoom UL and am wandering what temperature you think it's acceptable to take it down too. I've only had it out in the summer so far.
I think a lot of that depends on what you're sleeping in. In a sleeping bag I think you can take it down a little more cause you do have the back of the bag for a small amount of insulation, even though it's compressed. I think the realistic temperature for comfort is no lower than 40ºF. Justin Outdoors has said to me he thinks the r-value of that pad is closer to 2 than the claimed 4. But r-value isn't the full story on whether a pad will be warm or not. A lot of other factors.
@@BackcountryExposure Thanks Devin. It's such a shame because it's the most comfy pad I've used. I normally use a quilt, so I'm wishing now I'd gone for something a little warmer. I wouldn't take it down to freezing, but I'm hoping it keeps me warm at around 5-10 degrees Celsius.
Keep up the good work matie. 👍
I'm sorry you were cold but I have to question if it was your pad or not. The ground shouldn't be that cold yet and days are still warm. It could have been 0 but that wouldn't have been what the ground temp. was. I live in Colorado and it was cold last weekend but I still used my thermorest NeoAir with no issue.
I am confident it was my pad. The ground was wet from some good rain the day before, and the high for the day was about 52ºF. When laying on my back I could certainly feel the cold.
Nice take on UL packing. Obviously nearly every decision is subjective based on the gear you choose, how warm you run etc. I always prioritize comfort on my trips even if it means taking a warmer and heavier pad. However, you may have considered a thermarest neoair for around the same weight as the zoom or lighter but it may not be as comfortable of a pad for you while a back sleeper could be totally fine on it. You could go with a lighter backpack. You could've ditched the OV shell in favor of a puffy, etc etc etc. A mistake for you could be totally fine for someone else but I think the take away here is don't risk comfort for the sake of saving a few ounces.
Subjectivity could make all backpacking discussions go in circles, ha ha! Personal preferences goes a long way in the gear choices made, and I've noticed as I've gotten older, my preferences have changed too. Thanks, Dave!
So I am wondering if you would have been better off with a Tensor Insulated. You could have maybe had the same weight as the pad. But man I have made mistakes like this over and over LOL. Eventually, I will learn. Now that I have seen your video, I am going to reassess my next packing trip
Yeah the better pad would have been the Rapide SL or Tensor. I don’t have the current Tensor insulated. So it would have been the new All-Season.
Not everyone has the luxury of 3-5 different pads to choose from. Sometimes it’s just one pad to make work over a wider range of temperatures.
Thanks dude!
Being comfortable for as little weight possible.
Being comfortable on trail, for me. I'm not comfortable enough in my skills to go with the bare minimums, plus I'm old and falling apart, so! I like my comforts, and I know my limits. To some extent, I pack my fears, but I try not to. I'd like more practice.
Hello Devin, Great video!! I really like the Waymark hat that you are wearing in this video, are they available for purchase?
Thank you! That hat was a custom hat I made for myself with a patch that was around the Waymark shop. I don't think Mark has plans for hats currently.
@@BackcountryExposure thank you, hopefully Mark considers making the hats available for his customers.
Devin, do you think Big Agnes's Rapide SL would have been any better for this trip, or do you think it suffers from a slightly off (or True) R-value... like the Zoom UL??? You know I have the Q-core deluxe, and have been debating upgrading to the Rapide for a few months now. The Q-core Deluxe was rated for something like 3.7-ish back in the day. Justin did a video on it a while ago and he said he did not think the R-value was true, not off a lot, but not accurate.
Makes me really want to test out the Rapide, or the Boundary, then if the Zoom and the older Q-Core deluxe (and prolly SLX too) don't feel quite... right...
The baffle design of the Rapide is different from the Zoom, and it definitely is a warmer pad than the Zoom.
Oh, yeah that’s right. I forgot that point. That’s good to hear you think the Rapide is a warmer BA pad.
Oh wow, I would never have thought in temps around mid 20s the vario, ventus, and altitude would not be enough. I was almost for sure the ventus and the vario combined would darn near sweat you out. However... Brigham has repeatedly said that both are for more active movement, and not static... so maybe. Still surprised though. I've been thinking about layering both in the next few weeks as the temps in the Midwest drop.
How was the layering while you were hiking and moving around? Was it better, or no still kinda chilly?
Yes, active would be a key there for those jackets. My Vario also has A LOT of use, and there's a possibility the insulation over a year of heavy use could be making it less effective in its insulating. I can't confirm that though without discussing with Brigham.
When I am moving around and active, I was doing pretty good, especially once the sun came up. :)
Comfort
Devin, I saw you used the Helinox highback Chair instead of your tried and true Big Agnes Skyline. Again, you are the only person who shows off the tough and sturdy BA chair and I love that! So... what did you think of Helinox's higher backed chair? was it comfy leaned back? Did you feel the seat felt a little smaller due to the way the fabric is repositioned to accommodate the higher back poles? Also is the Highback taller than the chair zero. I think you said once that the skyline was a bit taller than the chair zero, so curious of the high back version might be aswell.
All the comments and questions, lol.
It was actually just the standard Chair Zero, not the high back. I only brought the Helinox because I was focused on weight. Sitting in that compared to the Skyline, just confirmed how much better the Skyline is.
Lol!!! Because of you I’ve telling folks that they should really weigh their choices between the chair zero and the skyline.
Justin has done a small review of the new Nemo chair which is weight wise between helinox’s and big agne’s. So I’m intrigued to learn more about.
I bought the smaller BA woodchuck table. Their ingenuity in the pile design and structure (along with zero plastic) that little table is so well made.
@@JarradShaw I’ve had the woodchuck for 5 years or so and it’s a staple in our camping gear.
I compromise on a lot of things but I never mess with my sleep system
:)
This just doesn’t compute for me. I frequently carry 50 lbs for an overnight. I couldn’t care less.
It’s a shame the zoom ul didn’t perform. Thermarest and Nemo equipment need some serious competition to enhance innovation!
Agreed. In the past I’ve been down to freezing with it and been decently okay with it. But I also had been in my Western Mountaineering bag which I believe has more down on the bottom side, which I do think helped insulate even a little more. Even if it’s compressed. The Coda must have less on the back.
I’d like to see the Ether Light get an update that’s warmer and closer to the Zoom weight.
I hate tent which has condensation. I cannot stand the feeling getting wet inside the tent. That's why my choice is hilleberg anaris.
Condensation isn't a super common issue here in Utah. It's so dry that it's not really ever a huge concern. But in humid places im sure it gets annoying. I just got myself a Enan that I am excited to try the next few months.
@@BackcountryExposure I understand. I was just backpacking in Lapland 10 days. Anaris worked really well. Two nights was total rain and wind all the night. None of condensation at any night. But I had to improve wind resistance by adding couple of ropes for the corners. Earlier I had lanshan 2 pro and everything was wet inside. I sold that tent immediately. But of course humidity varies and depends on weather and place.
There is lighter gear that is also warmer...so your choice was doubly wrong...
Some people have to learn the hard way, some just use common sense. Anything up to 30lbs should be considered normal, why pretend that humans cannot carry a decent pack weight. People have been carrying packs that weigh 50lbs and more for longer than anyone on the planet has been alive. I guess, for some, it's just them trying to look cool or to show off how expensive their setup is. Though, once people see how unprepared and/or uncomfortable they are, they just end up looking silly in the end.
I agree with you there! When I first started backpacking in the early 1970's, 40 lbs was the magic number. It's what Real Backpackers (Capital Letters denote Importance here!!) carried. Now it's 10. In 50 years of mucking around with a pack on my back, I just took what I needed f or the conditions. yes, I would choose the lightest items I could find, IF they fit the purpose. Nothing wrong with preparing for colder temps, or more rain than expected (it gets very wet here in the Mid Atlantic region). I've been a solo hiker for more than 50 years - Safety, Comfort, Convenience, Then weight have ruled my style. I never worry about how I'm viewed on the trail.
It’s a mistake we’ve all made, me? A few times
I just don’t understand. You knew the gear you were taking was good down to about 30, and the weather report was predicting temps around 30. I won’t even comment on the meager 4 oz you saved. Even if the difference was significantly more weight, why would you choose a high probability of being cold? First weather reporting of temps is not exact, especially if elevation is involved. And second it is just plain common sense to err on the warm side. And why take the extra weight of a 20 degree sleeping bag if you have a 30 degree pad?
Everyone always says to use a sleeping pad that is rated below the temps you are expecting. E.g. take a -20C pad if you are expecting -10C, etc. Surprised you tried to skimp out there. You could have used a better base layer, like the Brynje Super Thermo mesh shirts, which might have been enough to keep you warmer, without a heavier jacket. I do not understand this fashion trend / obsession with baseball caps that all American outdoor RUclipsrs and "thru-hikers" seem to have - Take a beanie FFS - it will actually keep you much, much warmer. We lose a huge amount of heat through our heads, and a pointless trucker cap will provide zero warmth. Also none of the Durston tents have adequate ventilation vs competitors such as the StratoSpire. I hope he changes that for future designs. So, many poor choices kept you cold.
Hey Devin, it's just a small request from your metric-mind subscriber, would you please add kg equivalent to your videos? It would make watching experience much more pleasant.
Yes, I really need to be better about that. Thanks!
It's hard for non-metric people to think in metric =P
Hey Devin!!! Why on earth don't you take an emergency blanket??? I mean my god isn't that BASICS 101 EMERGENCY NECESSITIES in backpacking???
I don't understand why so many veteran backpackers (like dan Becker, you and others) *LIKE* *NEEEEVVER* talk about bringing an emergency blanket!!
It is absolutely crucial!!!
Emergency blanket emergency blanket emergency blanket!!!
And I'm a newbie and I wouldn't even go out to the back country without one!! It's fking maddening crazy to me!!
Ha ha ha! I hear you. However, in my 20+ years of regular outdoor adventuring, it's never been something I carry with me. I've sometimes carried an emergency Bivy on long day hikes for peak bagging. But the classic mylar blanket has never been part of my gear. That doesn't mean I shouldn't start carrying one or that it's not a bad idea. It's just not something I've ever carried.
@@BackcountryExposure However - A reflective mylar blanket, even a very light weight one can make juuuuuuuuust enough difference when used under your sleeping pad (reflective side up of course) in marginal conditions. Packing for my fears?? Nah- common sense and thinking ahead.