What's The Best Color In Commander?
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- Опубликовано: 13 сен 2024
- I came up with an interesting method for trying to objectively decide which color is best in the Commander Format. Who came out on top?
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You did touch on this, but a fundamental issue with your list is category prioritisation. 5 points in "Protection" is in no-way equivalent to 5 points in "Card Draw"
I think Recursion as a category might be worth exploring. It explains some of the deficits in other categories (ie. Why should black be good at protection when it will just be recurred? )
Still not sure I’m convinced that counters are totally separate from Removal/Protection. It’s that variety that leads to apprehension and misuse of counterspells, imo.
Overall seems fair in terms of ranking their versatility as you seemed to state in the end.
Mill decks are far less intimidating when you’ve got loads of recursion
Black has some pretty good single target protection too, which makes sense when you only really need to protect your commander most of the time with black. The rest is recursion or wanting your stuff to die anyway.
That is a tricky one....white is hast the most variety in recursion of all kind of nonland permanents. Black does recur creatures the best. Blue does recur instant and sorceries the best. Green is similar to white, has a more limited cardpool but also returns lands. Red is doing not so good at recurring. So...how do we measure this?
I feel like "Velocity" (playing multiple spells, accelerating your gameplan beyond just lands, playing threats quickly, etc) and "Closing Out the Game" (which would include combos, combat, direct damage, "i win" cards, etc) are two categories that are hard to measure, but are very powerful and affect a color's strength quite a bit.
Red shines here. Green does. Blue and black even do. This is where white lacks compared to other colors tbh.
This is an excellent point.
"Blue and Black even do" I mean I wouldn't put it that way. Black is straight up just the best at closing games, but still go off.
I'm making a you lose I win deck and red and green. Have almost no cards that do this but white, blue and black have a bunch just food for though. I put every you lose or I win card in the deck that didn't rely on some sort of tribal combo
Curious to know if you considered adding combat as a category… might have bumped red a little.
And would put green on top, easily
Creatures in general should have been better represented
@@frionelhero you know, I thought the same thing, BUT if he did “creatures” then he would of had to do every other card type and it leaves so much grey area for multicolored spells. I think this was the best way to do it.
Commander became less of a combat heavy format and more.combo focused sadly
@@zchadowhd I think that depends on your edh enviroment. Around the 3-4 shops I play, almost anyone plays combo. The mayority of people win through combat. Another shop may change
Now make another video talking about mono-colorless ranks in these categories, and maybe how colorless aids each of these colors in their deficiencies! Loved this topic
White mana is my favorite in Commander. It goes so well with my love for creature-based decks!
Great Video! I share some of your opinions (draw, most of the ramp,white removal) and some dont (some categories).
If you are using functional categories like removal, draw. etc... all should be like that. Counters are a kind of card, that serves two functional purposes: removal and protection. So on blue it is really good at them. It is conditional because have a time restriction (when the spell is cast), but it is highly effective because targets anything, any permanent or spell. There for imo it should be the first in protection and maybe the first in removal, 'cause it is the main color which interacts with non-permanents. Followed by white second in removal. To remark that i dislike blue's play pattern, but recognize it is really good at that.
About ramp, i would consider treasures as some kind of ramp, even temporary, because you see it in games, that red explodes much faster that black and blue.
About draw, i'd consider impulse draw as kind of draw, the card pool is big enought to be consistent in red. Though you dont physically draw, if you use at least one of the exiled cards it is like you had drawed it. I conceptualize it as temporary draw, like the temporary ramp.
As another functional category i'd consider aggro/combat because it is one of the main ways to win the game, in which green/red on top, then white/black, then blue.
And Combo, that i dislike it so I have no opinion of the ranking, neither have enough knowledge of it.
About being byas (dont know if i write it right), i see you do a hard work with your patrons, thank you so much! moreover take care of not justifying any point because 1-2 cards and then argueing against another with just 1-2 cards, that happened sometimes along the video
Thank you for your work and great topics!
I agree very strongly with every point you have raised here.
@@mrpandabites Thank you ^^
I can agree with your point on counters to an extent, but I definitely don't think you can reasonably place blue above White. Maybe black, but definitely not white. For protection? Maybe. I play Azorius mostly, though, so I just get the best of both:3 Having access to the best counterspells and removal in the format always in very nice.
Even with impulse and finishing power I don't think red's spot changes. I think they could've added just "finishing power" in as the category for combat, combos, alt wins and it would've also brought white down.
@@malmasterson3890 Hi!
I see your point about white although I dont fully share it. Because the removal of non-permanents it's mostly blue.
About the "finishing power" category: we agree, it's the same as the aggro category I suggested.
At the end of the day it is kind of subjective this color evaluation ^^
Thanks for keep the dabate alive!
I would've renamed the Counterspell category and called it Stack- Interaction to include deflection and copying effects.
And split second
probably a better idea
Interesting topic for debate and a good stab at ranking the colors by category. Have to keep in mind the WAY colors are forced to execute the things in each category vs applying a broad look at which is best at doing this thing this way. The removal category for example is probably correct overall, but you still want to give consideration to how each color is forced to handle this. Red for example is typically thought of in terms of burn, but creature theft is another real form of removal and red does this probably better than any other color. That's not enough to move the needle on red's ranking but worth bringing up in the discussion. You're right as far as the top in each color not really being a debate, it's just ranks 4 and 5 that are questionable and if we're bickering over last place then we're just looking for something to bicker about lol.
Great topic for conversation!
After the first two categories, it's funny that my only mono-red deck is Magda, Brazen Outlaw, because that commander creates a ton of treasures and uses them to tutor.
Great video. I love this topic. It's very thought-provoking.
I would like to see the removal category switched to interaction. I consider spell removal to be removal. I would axe the counterspells category and move blue up a bit in the "interaction" category.
With the counterspell category removed, blue should also get a bump in the protection category. You do make a valid point that you also protect everyone elses board state, so you may not be gaining an advantage as much as some of the other color options, but if all I care about is protecting my stuff, I would argue there is nothing more absolute than stopping the spell out right on the stack.
My final thoughts. Anyway, you spin it, I agree the best color in the format is either green or white. I would move blue to third and black to fourth. Red is for sure the worst color, and that's ok with me lol.
Omitting combat is an odd, but not unexpected, oversight. Were you assuming it was a draw across the board? Certain colors do a fair amount of their removal via forcing bad blocks, and combat is the victory condition in most games.
Thoughts from a somewhat grumpy long-term monowhite player. There are good white draw synergies for certain decks. Overall, cards like Welcoming Vampire are a glorified phyrexian arena's. They both come down on turn 3. One draws you a card for simply existing the other requires you to play a card to draw a card->two cards to draw one card (also after you spent mana on the second spell). I would like to see white get access to burst draw to allow for more options in your hand (not ones that give cards to your opponent) at the 3-5 cmc slot.
A minor thing you forgot with tutors is that white also has a fair number of tutors for planeswalkers and lands and at least one for legendary cards. That said variety is definitively whites strenght in most things.
White is the second best tutor for sure especially for lands
@@kenaisparkman1099 specifically for lands yes, but the "allround" tutors of black are probably more numberous and for lands specific green is heads above the rest so 3rd best is still where i would put white
White also can tutor for ANY LEGENDARY cards with Search for Glory. Without a doubt I’d be confident with your placement of white being a good tutor colour, Demo.
😂 I appreciate the detail, but…if you’re going to bump red’s protection because of redirects, you HAVE to pump blue because of its counterspells. There’s more of them, and they protect against board wipes. I know you made it its own category, but you have to think of what counterspells get used for-essentially ALWAYS to protect your board or prevent a problem from hitting the table.
As always, love the video. (Bias and all 😂) It’s why I keep coming back.
P.S. you absolutely should award more points when a color is the best at something. Maybe 6 instead of 5 points for the top spot. I don’t know.
Also, you have to take into consideration that blue has a few ways to redirect a spell. IF we’re going to value that sort of effect so highly.
Also, also, (and I’ll stop here 😅) having a whole section dedicated to counterspells is a bit silly when a color is going to get points for essentially having no way at all to counter a spell.
Yeah counterspell for me is protection even if you use it as removal to counter a problematic creature or cards it kind make more sense as protection
so i literally covered this in the video, countering a boardwipe saves everyones board, so it's not nearly as good as a heroic intervention.
Black is also better than white in ramp and I will die on that hill. Land tax and smothering tithe are basically the only great things white has for ramp. Black while is later game ramp is much more explosive. If he's going to bump black for life as a metric for draw he has to bump black as a metric for ramp with life in exchange, sacrifice in exchange or discard in exchange. You have krrik, you have bolas Citadel, you have bog witch, you have skirge familiar, cull of the weak, lake of the dead rain of filth . These would also count as ramp and these aren't even the obvious rituals cabal coffers and strongholds as well as other mana doublers ect. Black has hidden gems for ramp and I strongly disagree that "ramp matters most early game. If I cast a torment on turn 5 or 6 for the win what does it matter if that mana stays or not? It doesn't, a win is a win is a win. In fact I'd even argue red is better than white.
In the ramp section you should have mentioned seething song and professional face breaker in red and high tide for blue. That being said, I've never seen energy tap before so that's something I'm going to have to consider for my mono blue decks.
absolutely loved the video and explanations!! you're one of my favourite commander channels by far!! love you and keep it up :3
Great stuff as always!
For the tutors, black also allows for secrecy as an inherent limitation to the restricted tutors is the table check.
For destruction, I'd rank red a bit higher. Sure, it takes setup with liquid metal and artifact destruction for targetted removal, But many players dont play red board wipes. I personally love apocalypse and jokulhaups which are great examples.
Another category one could add, which might also help boost red a bit is: Finishers.
maybe. but green and black are both way better.
Feel like Keeper of the Accord is one of the most underappreciated cards in the format. Can keep you afloat by himself.
I'm also happy that White won :') always played W+X decks, love playing my little dudes and beat people who spam dragons, gods and broken combos.
Before anyone mentions cedh, this is for casual commander, yes obviously counterspells are really good in cedh
I’m not sure why you think counter spells are not powerful in EDH (THE “free” counter spells are just broken in Simic with graveyard recursion). Anything your opponents want to do that is of any consequence just gets denied.
Interesting results for sure. White is the most represented color in my 14 completed decks, and there's a lot of overlap in the card choice, particularly in the "protection" category. I like the "dramatic reversal" that those cards can create. Blue is the second most represented color in my case, then black and green (tied), and red is last. At least for now: I would like to build more decks that strongly feature red and its "power cards."
Something along the lines of 'Closing Power' or 'Finishers' would have been a decent addition.
I think Red is a pretty good color when it comes to finding methods of closing out the game, as it does have very explosive closing power, which colors like White or Blue don't have in the same way. The big struggle with this addition to the metric would almost definitely be whether or not you're including combos.
Loved this video! I have my own opinion on some of this stuff as well, but who cares, you categorized everything, gave us a bunch of great info, and was a super interactive video. Thanks for the content! But for the record Green is the best color in the format 😂
Honestly rating aside. I learned alot about staples in each color that i should be considering in my decks! Thanks alot.
For red in the counterspell spot, I also like to count the effects that allow you to copy other instants like Dualcaster Mage. Those effects are really good into counterspells because you can copy their counter to use against them, so they are essentially counters for counterspells.
The ramp section was a mess. He craps on Dockside on one hand for just making treasures while praising Tithe. White was so bad at ramping, because white ramp required your opponents to have more lands than you, that WOTC made both Smothering Tithe and Monologue Tax.
Glad you picked up on that too, he praises blacks card draw for just needing life when black has fantastic ramp with life or discard ike Krrik, or bog witch, skirge familiar. Suggesting white is better than black at ramp is laughable
I agree with basically everything said in the video: since I reprised the game a few years ago I noticed how Red lacked variety in comparison to other colors, it seriously need some more spice. Combat yeah, should have been a category imo. Also, what I think is missing from the value grid used here - this I'm about to write about might deserve a new video entirely - is a in-depth analysis on what colors are expected to do, both in terms of flavour and mechanics; therefore delving into what 'role' each color represents when combined to another, withib the deckbuilding process. For example, red misses a lot if compared to white, but its effects tends to be more explosive (maybe more suitable for combo based strategies, I dunno?) while white relies more on static abilities; on the orher hand, both color are good for stax strategies, but in different flavours. I think those aspects would be worth mentioning, since they define each colors' playstyle and, definitely, they're the basic idea which determines how each card is designed within its colours.
I think recursion should also be a category, as some others have stated. Being able to get things back from the graveyard is a strong indicator of the resiliency of a color, which is something I think really sets some colors apart from others. I know that in all my decks, I always include at least a couple targeted recursion effects and one mass-recursion effect, if able. They’ve won me so many games too. So, definitely a category that should be considered.
I would agree with the final rankings. White has probably the best resiliency of all the colors due to the fact that it has fantastic recursion and protection, solid draw options particularly if you’re in the right strategy, premium removal, etc. I honestly feel like white’s starting to become a little too good in some ways.
You know, I don't have any real breaking arguments, but I think what this video REALLY showcases is how the colors can work together to compliment one another.
Thanks for yet another great video, Demo!
Except the card draw where i put Black first, Green second then Blue white red. I agree on everything.
You should have made a creature category in my opinion.
And i would have end up with green first then black, red, white and blue.
So with or without creature category, the ranking is still the same, green first no surprises, then white i expected to come after black. Then yeah black ofc, then far away blue and red.
Blue and red were the last imo before the video, i wasn't wrong.
Thx it was great
IMO ramp is
Green
Black
Red
White
Blue
Id love to see a like card advantage category that is for stuff that isnt card draw/tutors. Stuff like mill, reanimate, scry, etc.
Or a maybe like best colors for rebuilding, but I think that it'd be super skewed by reanimate effects and stuff.
man there's a guy in my playgroup where every time he casts gamble it works like an entomb lol. at least 3/4 the time i've seen him cast it he discards the card he tutors for, and it's become an ongoing meme that he's the only one who can play red entomb
I think that a tier list would make the problem of scoring a little easier… blue is obviously S tier for counter spells so 5 points there but white/red possibly at C-tier for 2 points and green/black at D for 1 point
50:20 I don't even play a lot of red, but I think there should have been another tally for something like efficiency of cards or damage output or aggressiveness or something which red excels at, Lightning bolt is great removal for planes walkers and creatures, and efficient damage but none of these could be appreciated with the tallys you made
There should have been a creature category as that’s the primary way of winning for most casual players. I feel like creatures are under appreciated in this video and the format overall
For the ratings over all, I think you could have gone with a Tier ranking and then give each tier points. That way you can still have ties *and* you can give the color that is way better than everything else those extra points you kept mentioning.
Decent methodology but the steelmanning of white and strawmanning of blue made some biases quite clear. Including cards for white in some categories, where for other colors the same types of inclusions didnt count. Hrm...
Nice ranking! Maybe I would have added a category about closing the game/wincon, but I get that will be very deck-dependant...
Green is the most rounded, followed closely by white in 2024
I think deflection and counterspells fit very neatly into protection. All need you to have the spell in hand and mana open at the time a spell is being cast. There's no real difference (to you) between giving your creature hexproof vs a counterspell vs a deflection when you get targeted with a vindicate.
Now, counterspells are more versatile in that they can do more than protect, but it's still much closer to protection than removal. Removal you can draw into and is not timing dependent.
By separating out counterspells from removal and protection you strongly bias the points against blue. Blue should have a 5 for both protection and removal.
I'm a fairly new MTG player (have played tons of other card games before) and I never understood how people call white the worst colour in the format. I fully agree with you, white can do everything and does almost everything at least decently well. I very quickly noticed that red is by far the worst colour (even though it's my favourite), it just has so many flaws and its strenghts really don't get rewarded in the commander format. When I started out I was so surprised what my friends' black or green cards were allowed to do and red felt so underwhelming, though I do think it's very fun trying to make red work and it has some very interesting options which is what makes it my favourite colour.
My ranking would be:
Tutoring: Black, Green, White, Blue, Red
Ramp: Green, White, Red, Black, Blue
Removal: White, Black, Green, Red, Blue (I think red being able to remove lands is underrated)
Protection: White, Green, Blue, Red, Black
Counters: Blue, White, Green, Red, Black
Card Draw: Black, Green, Blue, White, Red
Which results in: Red 11, Blue 15, Black 19, Green 23, White 23
Everyone saw the title then came to the comments to explain how their favorite color or their most hated color is the best. I think the best color just depends on what you value. Like you said, someone can think ramp is worth more than tutoring, or that counterspells are more important than board wipes and that moves the point values around. I think every color but red has something that people would say is the most important value.
Counters and ramp are a bit odd. The best (blue and green) are ahead by a huge margin but their points in the tally up do not take that into account. Additionally, while protection is powerful, it's too circumstantial to be weighted as heavily as card draw, tutoring, or ramp (which are good in almost any context). Most of what you said makes sense in a vacuum, but the tally up at the end should have been weighted differently imo.
The easiest metric for overall is to just look at what people play in CEDH and/or EDH. The most powerful colors will inevitably be the most played colors. I believe that currently it is Grixis. It has tutors, counterspells and some of the easiest and fastest infinite combo win-cons as well as plenty of card draw. Land ramp is probably the only weakness but fast mana offsets that for CEDH.
How could we forget about Deathgrip! My favorite black spell that counters green spells!
I weigh drawing cards over removal & counterspell. So I would have green on top. How the game has changed has also made creature so darn powerful with ETBs, statics etc. So tutoring a creature is almost always/most times stronger than tutoring an ench/artifact. Even though it "dies to removal easier". Creature strength is a rly hard one to "measure" so many factors. Evasion, survivability, mana efficiency, synergy, p/t, etb, statics, abilities and so so many factors. But I'd like you see your take on it! Great break down. Agree with 95% of what you say in this video, normally I'm around 50-75%ish. It's always good with challenging views/thoughts. Keep up the good work!
Still at the intro: What did i miss. My guess is gonna be black.
Edit: You forgot the watch the world burn boardwipes in red. Obliterate, Worldfire, etc.
Black Counter: Withering Boon, Nether Void.
Blacks' ability to pay life and draw cards, gets cards banned. Anyone who thinks black can be outdone on card draw is an idiot.
Finished the Video: White is technically good... My problem is this. White does a little bit of everything. Where as other colors just plain don't do something. This helps white in a ranking like this. But reality is White's jack of all trades approach won't beat the other colors 1v1. The likes of Giada, Lightpaws, Elesh Norn (Mom) do not beat Kriik, Tergrid, Marwyn, Savala, Urza, Orvar, Krenko.. as a result, White I think is the best SUPPORTING color. All decks are better for having white... Except mono white😂
I love this video. I am so tired of the old tropes that blue is so good and white is terrible. I also think white is the best all around color in EDH. If we are talking mono colored decks, white will be the only one that covers everything well.
Great discussion and examples.
Interesting.
Obviously green is the best color for commander. It does everything pretty well plus creates a board.
White does get underrated because its strength is mostly in stax, which many tables shy from.
55:25 when I started playing, I chose White as my main color because of its ability to remove almost everything if not everything but when I tried doing stax/hate strategies, it just made me a white player forever. Making it Selesnya just enhances that strategy. No ETBs, Creatures enter the battlefield tapped, One spell per turn, players can’t cast spells during your turn(which mostly eliminates the threat of the counter spell btw). If you’re worried about combos that can OTK you or strategies that just produce so much value and dominate, the answer for me is play or include white.
5 Black Counter Spells = Dash Hopes, Deathgrip, Stromgald Cabal, Brine Shaman, and Withering Boon (lot of old school cards). Where would artifacts fall on the point scale? Or multi-colored?
Don't forget Thrull Wizard!
came for this :)
also blue has ward pretty commonly which is a nice protection source or evasion source. also many blue creatures have ways of evading and bouncing thus preventing their death. just some more things to consider for protection
3 Categories i thought warranted consideration: Damage (Combat/Noncombat), Recursion, Stax. Unless your comboing you eventually have to do Damage somehow. Recursion is not quite protection, and explains why sometimes you dont want to protect stuff in the first place. Also, i feel theft should have been considered for removal. Most cards are only a threat because my opponent has them.
Your patrons super let you down on categories; here are just a few that might have been really important-
Creatures: probably worth splitting in to at least two categories Size (Presence) and Effects)
Lingering colored permanents: What color has the best enchantments and other such board changers
Cool lands: Are there Bajouka Bog lands that you can only play if you Bajouka Bog choose a certain color?
Cool Commanders: Are there good commanders for this monocolor?
Is it part of a well supported guild/triome? Does it get along with other colors well?
Snowballing, comeback mechanics and both.
Something you talk about a lot; Does the color have a lot of multifunction cards you can use in a lot of different ways?
Tiptoeing around stax: Can the color work around obstacles that can not be removed?
Flying and other important keyword abilities: which color has the most access to the most important ones?
Win conditions/Locks/Alternate Win Cons: Does your color give you control of how the game ends?
Idk man, I am sure your Patrons are great people, but if you skip creatures, lands, and static permanents as categories entirely, you might as well retitle the video "Which color has the best support?"
I really like your stuff, btw. Very interesting videos, and a very honest perspective.
Red does have some good tribe specific Tutoring like Goblin Matron, Imperial Recruiter, Godo and Sarkhan's Triumph.
55:14 white ramp has been appreciated, its such a common argument that white sucks at ramp for some reason but there is such good ramp.
I agree counterspells are not removal, but I do think they fit better in the category of protection.
Best singular color of commander is green and thats only because land destruction is frowned on. Best color combination in commander is esper (fight me) removal and tutors of black, couterspells and card draw of blue, and white is the weird swiss army knife of magic. It has all your lil screw drivers, wedges, tiny knives and other various tools allowing you to do everything a little bit, but for some reason there's this big ass crocodile Dundee knife on the other end that makes tokens.
Red is weakest color imo but generally has best keywords in haste and double strike.
Green also has a bunch of the Kenriths transformation type cards for creatures
Generous gift, Stroke of midnight, Excise the imperfect, and Get lost are my auto includes for any deck that has white. It takes black and green to get close to mono white for removal.
Combined totals of the top 4 decks for each color: Red 34,657, Black 32,183, White 29171, Blue 26560, Green 21720. Krenko does a lot of heavy lifting for Red. Light Paws is number two for white decks. That seemed kinda strange to me.
Definitely would swap a few things around. If you don't ignore MLD cards. Several have very good additional effects that imo make certain colors much better, mostly red
I wouldn't consider relying on opponent's draw step or other game phases "reliant on your opponents". Draw step is guaranteed, so that effect is guaranteed (unless on the off chance they have a skip draw phase effect). For consecrated sphinx, per turn cycle, you get 7 cards, all of your opponents get one. I'd say that's pretty good card advantage.
We gotta see color pairings. Could be interesting since some colors compensate other color weaknesses pretty effectively.
I missed maybe a wincon category: for example blue is not very good at winning the game but green tends to do it very well with overrun or red with damage doublers and additional combats.
And a category that I would have added is recursion maybe 🤔 or that's at least something in my evaluation... Stil red the worst in that... But I think red is actually good aswell and impulse draw can be very powerful.... So for me all colour's are pretty good.
I think maybe adding a category for commander options would be good. I'm on board with white being pretty good. I think it's commanders are where it lacks. It's getting better, and in a few years it will be pretty good.
IMO
1 Green: best at ramp, creatures, and 2nd at card draw
2 Blue. Best card draw, spell synergy, and 2nd for artifacts
3 White. Best protection, removal, artifacts, staxx, and decent enough at creature and ramp.
4 Black. Tutors are strong, and black is a very good control and combo color.
5 Red. It's best skill is agro, which is weakened a lot in commander. It's good at "impulse draw" and rituals but is still weaker than blue and black at combo.
Each color is better at one thing than the others
White- lifegain
Black-sacrifice mill
Green-ramp and smash creatures
Blue- draw and counters
Red- burn
There are a lot of categories that could’ve been added but they would’ve been more specific categories like creatures, combat, artifact synergy and theft. The categories here are very self explanatory and vague which makes this much easier to determine
yeah to be honest i wasn't writing a thesis here. i just wanted a simple comparison of the colors.
Some other categories you could do for another video and add to the outcomes:
Cheating spells into play
Going Wide
Going Tall
Anthems
Dealing Damage
Withering Boon. B1
As an additional cost to cast this spell, pay 3 life.
Counter target creature spell.
The approach to this question highly affects the outcome. The way you asked it, there could basically be only one winner and that would be indeed white. There are many other ways to approach it but ultimatly I think the best way is to is select a team of crack commander players to build the four best monocolored commander decks possible on EDH rec, print them out and see which color comes out on top after say, 100 games. You could even set limitations like no artifacts or colorless spells. I think Black or Red might be 1 and 2 in that case because I always feel those colors get to close out the game the fastest, or at least decks with those colors. Or maybe it would still be white, who knows? White is great.
A teir:
Green: Only color Land ramp, mana dork, decent card draws, removes artifacts and enchantment. Big creature
Black: Decent card draw, best tutor, great at creature animation, fast mana ritural, creature removebale.
B teir:
White: conditional card draw and once per turn , alot of catch up ramp so useless if youre first or someone dont play green. Best protection spell, decent reanimation for creature artifact and enchantment, alot of option for board wipe, decent removable option.
C teir:
Red: mostly impulsive draw, not the best removeable nor boardwipe, some good ritrual, best at remvoe artifact
Blue: best card draw, best instant and soccery, some of cheesy one card finisher card.
Its highly subjective while also being objective in a sense, but I have to say that I think green while not being the best at everything is the best at the most important thing, ramp. Ramp isnt just burst, its consistently building a mana base turn after turn and obviously green is king in practice. So many other colors want to hold up mana after their turn but struggle with having enough mana to just do everything they'd like on their own turn. If you don't have mana, you cant do anything at all. While this isnt the topic at hand exactly, think of which color you'd most suggest a brand new player to start playing in. I promise you its mono green or dual green, because you know that its going to almost guarantee that that player gets to actually play the game.
Combat, damage and finishers would be three categories to add.
Torment of hellfire, Akromas will, craterhoof etc as finishers,
impact tremors, blood artist etc as dmg,
combat speaks for itself i suppose, but xtra combat and combat wincons might be good to look at in that category.
It also is something to consider if all categories are equal, ramp for instance is not as important arguably as every colour have mana rocks as options, so that might not warrant as many points as removal.
There is one thing red is better than the other colors, by far: manipulating combat damage and ramp through artifacts (treasures). While the second might be debatable for some, regarding the manipulation of combat damage, Goad is almost exclusively a red thing it does make up for its lack of speed in other categories, forcing opponents to go at each other.
Instead of ranking each color, give each color a score from 1 to 10 in each category and then add them up. Then your “card draw” section would show all colors in the high range of numbers and in other categories there would be more of a gap between the 1st and the rest.
Including another category that takes into account the various combat-related stats and abilities could be helpful.
For cedh blue imo; for commander in general green no questions asked. Land ramp is most powerful and can allow you to cast and play underwhelming cards and still be in the game….hence i love green. Cheap ramp into jank cards no one else plays; the heart of green casual edh
This is the only correct take.
I feel like, while very limited to Blue, “Extra Turns” is a potent enough ability to be a category by itself.
Not every deck can or will play extra turns.
@@distranthegloriouslydeform9259 yes, I’m aware. It’s simply a very strong mechanic that shouldn’t be left out I believe
Personally in a casual game i woud say: green > white > black/blue > red
Blue and black are equal in my opinion, red is probably the worst at the moment in generell and green and white at the top because of ramp in green and flexible removal in white, while they are also the only colors with reliable enchantmentremoval
Black does have deathgrip and stromgald cabal for countering green and white, respectively.
I would argue bouncing permanents isn't exactly a temporary solution it sets your opponent way back taking away their mana rocks and dork and opening up an entire turn were you generaly won't be attacked because of summoning sickness. and then on that players subsequent turn you know their options and can simply counter them thus removing the major threats permanently blue fundamentally plays differently from every other color in the game and so should be judged a bit different I think. and one last thing to point out blue steals permanents from other players better then anyone else which is one of the best form of removal its a positive trade in your favor.
I think Rebuff the Wicked and Avoid Fate definitely belong with Imp's Mischief in the protection category, not Counter category.
Personally I'd put removal, protection and counterspells as one category as "interaction"
Rather than rank 1-5, I think a rating 1-10. e.g. counterspells: Blue 10 and rest under 3. Ramp: Green has land ramp, dorks, enchantment ramp =10, White has conditional land ramp, treasure so maybe only 8. Red has really good treasure and rituals - at least 3 etc
I would love to see other content creators react to this or do their own version.
Also, I don't agree with your stance on impulse draw. In my experience, I dig through my deck and have usually lots of card selection/advantage with impulse draeing
Gamble is great for tutoring for something you need in your graveyard.
Glad black took the cake for card draw. Feel like I’m yelling at clouds often lol. Ppl alway say blue blue blue.
I'm very late to the conversation but I think green is number 2 in card draw simply because it's the least reliant on opponents. It's almost all about your board. Cast, etb, power, number of, etc. Plus cards like Viridian Revel is incredibly strong in a world of treasures. Just my 2 cents though
Man white has come a long way. Love it!
Coming from a guy who loves White the most and disagreed with none of the assessments made, I think an error was made by not including damage as a category. In casual games, the most likely method a player will win is by dealing damage, which red and green excel at. I am really interested to know how you would compare black white and green in this category though and to see who would take the 3rd place position
White is a good color until you try to win. Like blue, it’s a great second color for decks but it really misses straight forward wincons.
Your categories are all supporting categories - ramp, card draw, and tutoring are great for setting up wins. Removal, counters, and protection are great for stopping opponents from winning or getting in your way. But there are big gaps in how these colors win. I think black, red, and green in particular see a big jump if you add categories for “wincons” I.e. combos, or “threats” I.e. big permanents and/or ways to cheat out big permanents.
Black being able to get Vilis, Broker of Blood out for 1 or 2 mana with minimal setup is a hilarious advantage over any other color at actually winning a game. Red has some ways to just win with giant spells and effects. Green has overruns, etc.
White definitely has the best supporting cards, but it has to play so fair on winning compared to every other color except blue. I think your chart sorely misses this spectrum of the game and it’s why your results don’t match “common knowledge” rankings.
Disagree. Akromas will or the new white craterhoof moonshaker calvalry are solid win cons for go wide decks, which is often what white wants to do.
“You need a huge board state then these two cards win the game” is a functioning wincon - I’m not saying white cannot win a game of commander. With that said, I think white is only better than blue at winning. Green does the combat thing a little better(albeit with slightly worse protection, but there is a category for that)
There are great go-wide wincons, but they usually happen over several turns. In the push and pull of a 4 player game where everyone is trying to win, limiting the white and green players’ big boards is a top priority. White has good protection but everyone knows your combat wincon attempt is coming. White also has some good “inevitable engines” with blinks, etc. where if someone else doesn’t win you are going to be unstoppable in a couple of turns. White is strong. But it does not go from zero to a win. The color is telegraphed and somewhat limited in how it wins.
Black and Red in particular can go from barely any board state to winning the game by themselves and doing that is pretty trivial. There are so many powerful cards big and small that just end games. There is a really big gap between the colors on how many different ways and how easily they can close a game. The mode of mana advantage (rituals) these two colors use also helps with the “my goal is to win” moments. Add to that black having reanimation packages that cheat giant game winning creatures for 1-3 mana and the color is just better at winning than the others by itself.
My biggest point here is that entirely ignoring how colors win gives an inaccurate representation of the spread. Black, even without winning being considered, is already pretty high. But if you take winning into account(one category for combo, one for finite wins) I think black ends up being the best color solidly.
@@sethmars7136
I play in a more casual group that frowns on infinite combos, so combat damage is a fairly typical wincon for the types of games I play. But white also has plenty of infinite combos if that’s what your in to. Heliod and Balista, rest in peace helm of obedience etc.
I would say that direct damage is completely viable in edh and black would probably be number 1 in that category.
Again I agree with you only issue is that I almost dont play mono color decks, and you can only put 60+ cards in a deck, without the colorless cards maybe 50 cards remaining, so the card that is extreemly good in a color that dont has to much option is way more important for me. Yes white is good in card draw but if im building a black white deck most carddraw cards would be black as lifegain is also easy in those colors. It is informative what you did but when deckbuilding multicolor decks I only look at the bestvoptions not which color has the most options