The one consistent thing about all the Star Trek iterations - they got Pike RIGHT. Do a show with Anson Mount as Pike and keep him like this with his support crew like Spock and Number One, and you'll have a winner.
And this is why Pike embodies the best of Starfleet's ideals. I like how the bridge crew suddenly looks at Pike in a new light: with much more respect.
Fuck values if you're dead. Sacrificing your entire race to protect 'values' isn't noble. It's downright stupidity. Lost the battle before you begin? What kind of moron actually thinks this way in war? Winning by any means necessary is the only option.
Interesting how he completely backed down from expressing those values after being "put in his place" by an argument that did not refute the point he was making.
Shoving Pike’s (wholly legitimate) virtue back in his own face is a wonderfully Trek-ish moment. Let’s hope that the very character of Christopher Pike-and how good he is-can continue to inspire the writers of Strange New Worlds.
Admiral Cornwell points out an awful fact of War, that sometimes you have to do terrible things just to survive, let alone win. Then, at Pikes challenge, she supplies another explanation that leaves him speechless except for the words "Thank you". This is leadership and responsibility done right.
I'm tearing up just seeing this piece... Captain Pike is like Star Trek's Answer to Captain America... with the Enterprise being Starfleet's mantle and shield... just saying. ;)
@@rawyld --- They started filming Startrek: Strange New Worlds series in Canada about 2 months ago. Anson Mount & the other actors announced it. You can see the official Announcement on Ansons Instagram account & his Twitter also. I'm very excited. Love Anson Mount so much. I've been following him since 2011 when he was on Hell On Wheels for 5 years. He is a Awesome Actor.
Giving up our values in the name of security is to lose the battle in advance if we had leaders like Captain Pike here in the real world the world would be a very different place one i wish i could live in.
If you Want to win a Battle, Some times you need to abandon your values. And restore those after you won. Especialy if you know that it Will not be the case if you loose. The admiral knew that.
"Giving up our values in the name of security is to lose the battle in advance". Nailed today in a nutshell. BEAUTIFUL. Come one guys, you can write Pike this good, you can continue it. Skip "Below decks" - give us Pike instead !
I think the character has to be explored. This scene alone gives you an inkling of moral compass in this captain. Super captain to add to the lore of the USS Enterprise.
So far from this RUclips clips pike is becoming my favorite captain and a reason to care about or watch Star Trek stuff. Really love the clip here on RUclips with Riker finally a captain rescuing Picard. So far from clips I’ve seen strange new worlds might replace next generation as my favorite version of Star Trek so far Hope they can convince Lavar Burton to guest appear on one of these new shows and also can get Worf back. Worf and Riker together in a new series would be great someday.
"The Federation does not permit the use of mines."... Where was this sentiment when Rom came up with cloaked self-replicating mines to fend off the Dominion?
Love the argument from Pike ... Give up our values in the name of security is to lose the battle in advance ... other than history has shown that argument almost always fails. I think it was Golda in Israel that made some comment which I cannot exactly state, about sometimes to defeat the enemy you have to be like the enemy. And you can see that some of the actions she and others took (which has come to light in modern times) helped ensure that nation still exists and did not get crushed. Even in Trek verse, when you get to DS9, they created a self replicating cloaked minefield around the wormhole. They took that lesson to heart, abandoned those values, and saved the quadrant from a massive invasion they would have lost giving them time to prepare and ready for a long war. Perhaps it would be better to say failing to sideline our values in order to protect them long term is the surest way to defeat.
Mines…tell that to Captain Sisko… He even added a twist with a cloak and self replicating… It can get out of had if someone hacked it and it continued to replicate endlessly…grey goo😂
@@mngentry If someones trying to rape you in an alley in middle of the night... do you defend yourself with a gun You have in pocket/purse or a broken bottle you may find on the ground? “You go to war with the army you have, not the army you might want or wish to have at a later time.” - Donald Rumsfeld
@@mngentry The supreme art of war is to subdue the enemy without fighting. -Sun Tzu If fleet of ships can be destroyed by mines instead of another fleet of ships...Im all for it.
@@spikedpsycho2383 Perhaps but it also depends on where one's values rest. But its hard to argue that the idea of subduing an enemy without pulling a trigger or needing a mine would be am appealing one for all.
In reality we have not evolve enough for all of us to think selflessly, some of us are there or almost there, but we still need people that can cross the line between right and wrong, we need that kind of people to protect the righteous ones even from themselves.
Strange new worlds has such a ripe opportunity to get it right. If they screw this up I will literally dissown nu-trek. No Burnham fists full of ham. No more forced pontification of new age cause-celebre. Just down and dirty 5 year mission. And the intro better have Ansoun Mount delivering that message in bombast and excellence.
This might be too much to ask but I've imagined of having Matthew McConaughey as a capt of his own ship with a toned down version of his, "alright alright..." (Without sounding like a StarCraft/Avatar pilot
Funny you should say that, SNW gave us a glimpse and he started a war by being too much the trek kenobi, the negotiator and the romulans having none of it.
yeah but pike and the rest of the crew also learned some hard lessons in this episode didn't they blinded by pride and arrogance which resulted in ariems death and almost the death of all life reflecting one truth that nobody is always right or perfect
"The Federation does not permit the use of mines" somebody want to explain why mines, out of all types of weaponry, are considered immoral to the point of being outlawed by the Federation?
Probably because of how mines work here on our world, there are many locations across Europe during World War 2 where mines have been scattered for the enemy, yet never been set off, and are still there today, which cause a hazard for civilians. Edit: they are indiscriminate in who they kill, essentially
Kind of a funny moment... I suppose if the Federation had not resorted to extremes the Enterprise and her crew would have been all that remained. What would Pike think of that?
That makes no sense. Wouldn't they want to throw their best at the Klingons to defeat them? If they lost the war there wouldn't be anything left for the "best" of Starfleet to do except hide.
MattJohno2 --- You mean when she said "now can you get off my ASS so I can go back to work?" If you say yes then I agree. She took it a step to far by being sarcastic & showing disrespect towards Captain Pike. That part wasn't necessary That doesn't look good in front of everyone else. I bet Anson Mount is not really happy with her last reply back. He probably would have liked the writers to have left her sarcastic comeback out of the script with the part her saying to him to get off her ASS. Wasn't necessary at all.
"the federation does not use mines" lol yes they do..... literally all the time. They need to hire actual star trek writers, not party approved propagandists
The biggest use of mines was during DS9, which happens more than 100 years later. It is not a stretch to believe that at the time, the Federation has banned the use of mines, especially since the fact that they were in a peaceful era before the Klingon war.
Adding "...Get off my ass" was a cheap tack-on. On the heels of Pike's politeness to deescalate, she makes an ass of herself. The crown of authority don't fit her head. A tiara would suit her best, then she can make all the unprofessional potty mouth addendums she wants, eh? Even higher rank is no license to be rude--Roddenberry would hate the lack of decorum. It's uncanon-like to have this swearing.
@@stevenfrasier5718 And, in the context of the episode, was being used as an insult to Mudd, and besides, if we’re decanonizing Trek episodes for having swearing, might as well throw in all the episodes Jean-Luc Picard has said “merde” in the Next Generation.
The one consistent thing about all the Star Trek iterations - they got Pike RIGHT. Do a show with Anson Mount as Pike and keep him like this with his support crew like Spock and Number One, and you'll have a winner.
And now it is real
@Salmon "The cage", 2009 Trek , Into Darkness, Discovery season 2. All Pikes rocked it.
Yep I'd definitely watch that. Pike was the best and one of the very few good parts of this show in S2.
And not it's coming out in a few days
Ayo buddy just watched it IT WAS SO GOOD
"Giving up our values in the name of security is to lose the battle in advance." - Scary how relevant that has become to modern times.
And this is why Pike embodies the best of Starfleet's ideals. I like how the bridge crew suddenly looks at Pike in a new light: with much more respect.
What? lol
Fuck values if you're dead. Sacrificing your entire race to protect 'values' isn't noble. It's downright stupidity. Lost the battle before you begin? What kind of moron actually thinks this way in war? Winning by any means necessary is the only option.
They are in the future so they know.
Interesting how he completely backed down from expressing those values after being "put in his place" by an argument that did not refute the point he was making.
I'd call that a distinction without a difference!!!! Love it!!
I think this scene is where the Discovery crew realizes just who Pike really is, what makes him tick, and how lucky they are that he's their captain.
@Naes Galaxy right!
Shoving Pike’s (wholly legitimate) virtue back in his own face is a wonderfully Trek-ish moment. Let’s hope that the very character of Christopher Pike-and how good he is-can continue to inspire the writers of Strange New Worlds.
wonderful?! ... it was disgraceful
How did you like Strange New Worlds?
So far so good.
Admiral Cornwell points out an awful fact of War, that sometimes you have to do terrible things just to survive, let alone win. Then, at Pikes challenge, she supplies another explanation that leaves him speechless except for the words "Thank you". This is leadership and responsibility done right.
His indignation is endearing, Her reason is sound when heard in its entirety. Him accepting the compliment is adorable.
charming
I'm tearing up just seeing this piece... Captain Pike is like Star Trek's Answer to Captain America... with the Enterprise being Starfleet's mantle and shield... just saying. ;)
Cannot wait for Strange New Worlds to begin filming.
Good analogy, sir.
Enterprise is a great lady...and we love her.
@@rawyld --- They started filming Startrek: Strange New Worlds series in Canada about 2 months ago. Anson Mount & the other actors announced it. You can see the official Announcement on Ansons Instagram account & his Twitter also. I'm very excited. Love Anson Mount so much. I've been following him since 2011 when he was on Hell On Wheels for 5 years. He is a Awesome Actor.
Hes 100 years older than both of them. @@NaesGalaxy
I love the dynamic between Captains and Admirals.
They are really the only ones who can get away with push back on them.
Giving up our values in the name of security is to lose the battle in advance if we had leaders like Captain Pike here in the real world the world would be a very different place one i wish i could live in.
There is a lesson here for all of us in this.
We do have those leaders. The problem is that our values are subjective, so we only ever align on certain issues.
If you Want to win a Battle, Some times you need to abandon your values. And restore those after you won. Especialy if you know that it Will not be the case if you loose. The admiral knew that.
War, that sometimes you have to do terrible things just to survive, let alone win.
Losing values is what created wars in the first place.
Pike was the best part of Discovery
I dont know.
Emperor geogeo......
"Giving up our values in the name of security is to lose the battle in advance". Nailed today in a nutshell. BEAUTIFUL. Come one guys, you can write Pike this good, you can continue it. Skip "Below decks" - give us Pike instead !
Seems like that worked out.
I think the character has to be explored. This scene alone gives you an inkling of moral compass in this captain. Super captain to add to the lore of the USS Enterprise.
Lower Decks was actually a lot of fun!
Guy sounds like Captain America
I wish they’d kept her alive, she was awesome
he is am awesome capt pike I WANT MORE
It isn’t called The Christopher Pike Medal of Valor for nothing.
This! THIS was the moment (at around 0:50) that just solidified Pike for me.
Can’t wait for Star Trek Strange New Worlds. Anson Mount didn’t miss a beat as Pike!
So far from this RUclips clips pike is becoming my favorite captain and a reason to care about or watch Star Trek stuff. Really love the clip here on RUclips with Riker finally a captain rescuing Picard.
So far from clips I’ve seen strange new worlds might replace next generation as my favorite version of Star Trek so far
Hope they can convince Lavar Burton to guest appear on one of these new shows and also can get Worf back.
Worf and Riker together in a new series would be great someday.
"Sir! Get off my ass SIR."
I adore this version of Pike. Can't wait for Strange New Worlds!
"The Federation does not permit the use of mines."... Where was this sentiment when Rom came up with cloaked self-replicating mines to fend off the Dominion?
war time rules
War has no rules. Or very few. and when you're fighting an enemy like the Dominion was the Dominion had no rules.
It is logical to assume that the law or treaty prohibiting the use of mines was no longer in effect during DS9.
I mean, haven't gotten to that point in ds9 but maybe they just classified it as a bajoran military action, since they kinda share the station.
Rom was *technically* a member of the Bajoran militia, they've probably got no such qualms about it.
Love the argument from Pike ... Give up our values in the name of security is to lose the battle in advance ... other than history has shown that argument almost always fails. I think it was Golda in Israel that made some comment which I cannot exactly state, about sometimes to defeat the enemy you have to be like the enemy. And you can see that some of the actions she and others took (which has come to light in modern times) helped ensure that nation still exists and did not get crushed. Even in Trek verse, when you get to DS9, they created a self replicating cloaked minefield around the wormhole. They took that lesson to heart, abandoned those values, and saved the quadrant from a massive invasion they would have lost giving them time to prepare and ready for a long war. Perhaps it would be better to say failing to sideline our values in order to protect them long term is the surest way to defeat.
I miss Cornwell. The best Admiral in Starfleet so far I would say. Why did they kill her?
That's when he should have said, "No. Now I have to be the person you expect me to be."
Mines…tell that to Captain Sisko…
He even added a twist with a cloak and self replicating…
It can get out of had if someone hacked it and it continued to replicate endlessly…grey goo😂
We aren't fighting for security, we're fighting for survival.
"I'd call that a distinction without a difference."
@@mngentry If someones trying to rape you in an alley in middle of the night... do you defend yourself with a gun You have in pocket/purse or a broken bottle you may find on the ground?
“You go to war with the army you have, not the army you might want or wish to have at a later time.”
- Donald Rumsfeld
@@spikedpsycho2383 I wouldn't be in an alley at night to begin with.
"The wise warrior avoids the battle."
-Sun Tzu
@@mngentry
The supreme art of war is to subdue the enemy without fighting.
-Sun Tzu
If fleet of ships can be destroyed by mines
instead of another fleet of ships...Im all for it.
@@spikedpsycho2383 Perhaps but it also depends on where one's values rest.
But its hard to argue that the idea of subduing an enemy without pulling a trigger or needing a mine would be am appealing one for all.
"Mines are against regulations"
Can't wait for season 2💝
In reality we have not evolve enough for all of us to think selflessly, some of us are there or almost there, but we still need people that can cross the line between right and wrong, we need that kind of people to protect the righteous ones even from themselves.
Admiral: "Pike, stop ass kissing and get back to work" 😅
Sloan: We have no headquarters
well to br fair its a different time.....and also if they did have a headquarters sloan would have been a crap agent to mention it
@@pearsegallagher9832 I'd be more inclined this is NOT section 31 but a front agency meant to masquerade as Section 31.
This scene makes me wonder if ALL Constitution class ships were ordered to stay away or if just the Enterprise.
So prolific if she would have just shut up before the last line...
You meant "profound", I'm sure.
Strange new worlds has such a ripe opportunity to get it right. If they screw this up I will literally dissown nu-trek. No Burnham fists full of ham. No more forced pontification of new age cause-celebre. Just down and dirty 5 year mission. And the intro better have Ansoun Mount delivering that message in bombast and excellence.
This might be too much to ask but I've imagined of having Matthew McConaughey as a capt of his own ship with a toned down version of his, "alright alright..." (Without sounding like a StarCraft/Avatar pilot
Image a federation and starfleet led by Pike. Would be an interesting alternate universe.
Funny you should say that, SNW gave us a glimpse and he started a war by being too much the trek kenobi, the negotiator and the romulans having none of it.
Id take Pike over picard any day ;-;
@Salmon well I like Pike, Picard is okay but Captain Christopher Pike is the embodiment of Starfleet beliefs
I really hate the excessive lights on the new Star Trek shows.
Saru's click... hahaha
yeah but pike and the rest of the crew also learned some hard lessons in this episode didn't they blinded by pride and arrogance which resulted in ariems death and almost the death of all life reflecting one truth that nobody is always right or perfect
I have to say it's weird seeing discovery in warp ^^
didnt we use mines at the holy worm hole at ds9?
That was over a 100 years later
"The Federation does not permit the use of mines"
somebody want to explain why mines, out of all types of weaponry, are considered immoral to the point of being outlawed by the Federation?
Probably because of how mines work here on our world, there are many locations across Europe during World War 2 where mines have been scattered for the enemy, yet never been set off, and are still there today, which cause a hazard for civilians.
Edit: they are indiscriminate in who they kill, essentially
Kind of a funny moment... I suppose if the Federation had not resorted to extremes the Enterprise and her crew would have been all that remained. What would Pike think of that?
That makes no sense. Wouldn't they want to throw their best at the Klingons to defeat them? If they lost the war there wouldn't be anything left for the "best" of Starfleet to do except hide.
They mined the bajoran wormhole
So she just has to flatter him about why he was spared the war for the greater good and he is Ok with their unethical decisions ? So deep
So much lensflares
So
You can turn it off in graphic settings along with bloom.
I like Squid Head
Then they ruined it with that last line.
MattJohno2 --- You mean when she said "now can you get off my ASS so I can go back to work?" If you say yes then I agree. She took it a step to far by being sarcastic & showing disrespect towards Captain Pike. That part wasn't necessary That doesn't look good in front of everyone else. I bet Anson Mount is not really happy with her last reply back. He probably would have liked the writers to have left her sarcastic comeback out of the script with the part her saying to him to get off her ASS. Wasn't necessary at all.
@@paulacurtis1874 They were trying to inject humor when it wasn't needed.
@@blogginsriverbymnl48isabop86 --- Oh right. . . .
Another bullshit display of female empowerment that came straight from the ass.
@@stevenfrasier5718 Oooo, somebody's got a chip on his shoulder! Lol
thats one sexy admiral!
I really liked Captain pike he's got swagger way better then lorka
80 years ago we ended a world war with a nuke....
I forgot how hideous the Discovery uniforms were. Glad Pike and crew got to wear normal uniforms on SNW not this glimmering gold suit.
The STD Klingon war was done horribly what were the stakes how did it end anybody !!!!!
"the federation does not use mines" lol yes they do..... literally all the time. They need to hire actual star trek writers, not party approved propagandists
The biggest use of mines was during DS9, which happens more than 100 years later. It is not a stretch to believe that at the time, the Federation has banned the use of mines, especially since the fact that they were in a peaceful era before the Klingon war.
Adding "...Get off my ass" was a cheap tack-on.
On the heels of Pike's politeness to deescalate, she makes an ass of herself. The crown of authority don't fit her head. A tiara would suit her best, then she can make all the unprofessional potty mouth addendums she wants, eh? Even higher rank is no license to be rude--Roddenberry would hate the lack of decorum. It's uncanon-like to have this swearing.
Is that why he allowed Kirk to say “Jackass” on TOS? If so, by all means, decanonize Mudd’s women
@@L1z43vr
A Jackass is an actual animal.
@@stevenfrasier5718 And, in the context of the episode, was being used as an insult to Mudd, and besides, if we’re decanonizing Trek episodes for having swearing, might as well throw in all the episodes Jean-Luc Picard has said “merde” in the Next Generation.
@@L1z43vr
decanonizing -- lolz...
LOL. This was another 'shut the fuck up' Feminist scene... 😬 Hope Kirk never appears on STD