Why You Should (Or Should Not) Learn Music Theory
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- Опубликовано: 18 окт 2024
- Spoiler: the music theory teacher thinks you should learn music theory. But there really are good arguments against it, and it's important to understand the nature of music theory to avoid some of those pitfalls.
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The most interesting thing about this is that you actually recorded it in one take, without any cuts) or maybe i just blinked at the moments the cuts occurred) it proves that you've got a very clear understanding of what you are talking about what makes your points even more pure , precise and legit. I really envy (in a good way) people, who can express themselves in such a clear manner and you are getting better and better every time)) been into playing music for 25 years now and even studied at a musical college, but i wish i had your level of understanding how things work when it comes to theory) all the best from russia!
Sometimes someone has a hard time talking well if they are into music, that reason is most likely that you are a far much better communicator through music instead of words. Which could be exactly why you are here doing what you are doing..
Since I happened to have a 4yr old handy I had to test out your theory. I put him in front a keyboard and sure enough he pushed keys until he found f# and then said, "This is the sound of a shark".
That's super cool.
Yeah. F-shark
My 4 year old said "I'm not touching that key! It will cut me".
I asked him what he meant. He answered "because mommy said its F'n Sharp".
I was so shocked by his comment that I spanked his B Flat.
My wife had a go at me and said "go easy on him, he's only A Minor".
Adam Goodword I cannot decide whether to thumbs-up or thumbs-down this.
@@adamgoodword7888 Did you invent that joke? That's hilarious
I haven't felt music theory making me less creative. It's just another tool for my toolbox to refer to if i'm stuck. It's kinda like when people don't want to learn things like basics of drawing cause it'll "break" their creativity. They're just guidelines to help you out. It's not set in stone.
@J Thorsson There are 3 trillion trees on Earth. One of these trees is providing you with life, and what I want you to do is to look for this one tree and apologize to it since you are such a waste of oxygen.
I've learnt by ear for about 15 years before I started getting really into Jazz and started teaching myself theory. You can get very far just by listening to yourself and others but there are limitations. So far, I have found that theory is a way to mechanise and verbalise things you "winged" before. When I started learning modal theory, I found out that I already knew a lot of it already. I just didn't know the names or explicitly defined the rules. The rules were more fuzzy and more of a 'gut' thing.
There were holes, though. Things I didn't know and ways of getting myself out of corners that were previously uncomfortable. I now have procedures to get out of those. Also songwriting can be more layered because you can actually compose, as opposed to quickly winging it and choosing what's naughty or nice.
I commented mid video, I now see my comment could have just been "yeah, I totally agree" hahah I'm also posting this while still listening to you, so it may change haha.
EDIT- Nope, I still agree.
Your username is so perfect for this.
***** why, thank you!. [bearded man blushing]
Wow, these are almost exactly my thoughts as well. Looks like I don't have to write anything myself lol
Ninjastripy I'm your alter ego!.
I think the issue here is that most people don't understand the meaning of the word "theory". Theory does not mean rules or guides. Theory or a theory on something is just our effort to understand and explain how things work. And to do that we use "language" and "sketches" and "diagrams". That's it basically.
In order to play music you have to find out how music works (but also how the instrument you are going to play with works), which means that eventually you have to find out a theory behind it. It could be the known theory or your theory. You could use the known language or invent a new one. You could develop your theory through your instincts or through observation. But nonetheless you will be playing music because you are going to find out how it works, which means you will know A theory or part of it. The sure thing is that we are not able to surpass the collective human knowledge of how a thing works just by ourselves. That's why studying theory always helps. In particular it helps to understand that something in a much more structured and a less less time spending way. That applies also to music.
It's the same with science. We have OUR theories on how nature works. We use these theories on how nature works, which have been developed by humanity ever since and we make things that do not exist in the natural world for example a Cell Phone. The invention of something needs creativity (and a bit of madness) but it also needs a good theory background (which many times you have to develop alone using the existing theory). Same applies to music. Only a lot of it is already there. No need to invent again the wheel.
So, I think, instead of spending time and energy in order to find out on my own how music works it is much better to learn a known music theory (there is not only one btw), or part of its basics, and use my time to be creative while doing so.
PS (to Michael): I have just discovered your videos and you do an amazing job.
Let me also add that the knowledge of Theory is not killing Creativity, but most of the times the people who teach theory kill creativity (does not apply to you, Michael). There is a lot of analysis behind that particular belief of mine. Nevertheless I won't dive into that. Just food for thought.
Its all about intention. Those creativety-killing-teachers probably act with the intention of learning to read and memorize fast by recognizing patterns or trying to fit in a system they don't understand, just because it is convenient for them to do so.
That may be how it is intended.. however that is not how it’s perceived. And perception is reality my friend.
@@christosgiannakoulas7935 σωστός μπράβο!
I'm an artist and I think a good way to explain it would be to compare music theory to something like anatomy. It doesn't matter if you draw cartoons or if you draw realistic portraits, knowing how anatomy works will benefit your art. Similarly it doesn't matter if you write simple pop/rock songs, knowing music theory can really give you a better understanding of what you're doing. It doesn't mean you'll have to use dorian modes or seventh chords or have constant key changes, it just means you have more options.
I come from the world of writing stories (although I had a music background as a player), and composing music started to make a lot more sense to me when I started to think in terms of story and characters. You have to put your characters in different situations, and see how they do, if you want to get a story. If you understand your characters well enough, writing a story is easy, it just flows naturally, and you don't have to sit and wonder what your character would do in a particular situation, they just react, and feel, and grow. In music, your melodies are your characters, the harmony is the situations those characters end up in. There's a structure to storytelling, and there's a structure to music. Writing and music both have genres, and understanding the rules of those genres is a big help too. Knowing how to break those rules breaks you out of the cliche, but cliches aren't a bad thing, just require appropriate use, and to be entertaining, you need to subvert those expectations at the right times and places.
Period
My thoughts exactly i was looko g to comment something like this but you bewt me to it lol
@@fakecubed thank you i needed that. thats just gave me a start point on how i should approache my story that i want to tell :)
nice way of saying it. anyone can draw a human without knowing anatomy or drawing, some may draw a very good and some just draw very simple, but learning anatomy and drawing can help you to draw even better and more detail/realistic human.
Hi Michael,
I studied music for years in both ways that you addressed in this video, there was a certain magic to music for me prior to gaining a formal understanding of the structures underpinning it all.
Once I started learning about cadences and voice leading suddenly everything I listened to was built of these smaller structures and the magic was ruined. It really had a major effect on my enjoyment of music.
Since I've started watching your channel and the way you explain everything, I've started to appreciate the genius in music I listen to, it's almost like there's a new magic within the structure.
I only wish I'd had the same awakening while I was at school
I love music as how it is. Theory, practical, technical, creativity, all of those are supporting each other. i start playing and making music by self-taught. no theory and etc. i keep getting better and better and one day i realize without music theory, it's so raw. and by learning music theory, help me so much. overall, all u need is a passion. when u love doing what u love to do, u can elaborate and create things. keep ur self positive, then nothing can hold u back. just do it. take time, make something, even if it sounds or looks stupid at first, just be urself. it'll be better if u keep in progress. that's what i love from art. there's no rules, there's no right or wrong. its about how u express urself. all music have their own listener. just respect all of them and appreciate any artwork. keep making music, keep teaching music, gbu all.
As far as breaking the rules,
It usually goes in art that you have to learn and understand the rules BEFORE you can break them.
The rules are rules because they work, and understanding why they work is a huge step towards knowing how to make your art work, with or without them. There are exceptions, of course, and I don't think music takes all that many rules to "work", but it would be foolish in your education to ignore the several thousands of years of knowledge that mankind as a whole has collected from experience. Basically the depth of knowledge one person can accrue by himself in his lifetime will never equal that of hundreds of dead europeans, but it might be enough regardless.
***** Actually that makes way more sense.
Forget what I said, that's great!
James Scott you and i think a like
sethraptor
what rules? art is not a game, there are no rules. there is only philosophy. philosophy is arbitrary, no one has the best philosophy. the entirely of western harmony is arbitrary. the absolute best performances i have ever seen were indian classical musicians, who play by very few guidelines without any concept of harmony whatsoever. theory makes you a technician, not an artist. you can definietly learn from it, but it can also be a hindrance to creativity.
Yeah, "rules" really isn't a good way to think about it. I was repeating what I had been taught about art principles, but music is by nature abstract, so there's no need to reach for a minimum level of comprehensibility.
as long as you know your instrument, it's strengths and weaknesses, limitations. But it depends on what you want to do. I see musicians who just do studio/gigging, and they are content to just play other people's music. Those guys are the real musical technicians, as well as classical sight readers.
I need to make my own music, and thus most traditional western theoretical structures I have abandoned in favor of complex rhythm, timbre, and ornamentation. There are only so many hours in the day, and if you get too deep into theory, you just don't have time to think of new ways to make music unique and interesting, which is all that matters. I don't care about being a musician's musician anymore, I want to make new exciting music for people who don't even know what a scale is, which is most people.
In fact, I heard a lecture by Gary Burton one time, and he was talking about how even high level jazz guys can't even tell you in real time what the changes are in a jazz chart (other than common progressions). They can play over the changes, but they would have a hell of a time trying to tell you what chord is where without looking at the chart. That tells me it doesn't really mean anything, it's just an arbitrary way to organize music.
I somtimes use music theory to deliberately make "bad" sounding music, and sometimes i unintentionally find something that sounds good. I think it's really entertaining to hear something that's so far away from what i know.
The first time i heard the chord progression Ab -> Bb -> C, I was amazed by how awesome it sounded. I really think it's fun to discover these new things within music.
In a sense it's kindof like riding a roller coaster. The first time, it's feels really amazing, with adrenaline pumping through my body. After a couple of times, though, it gets less and less exciting, and you try out something else, maybe getting back to it later.
"this sounds just like when Bambys mom died" hahahahhaha. I laugh way more than i should :D
Alan Watts summed it up quite well: you can learn all about Music and it's theory, like a language. So if you have something to say, great! You can write it now.
However, if you learn this new language, but have nothing to say; then your education was futile.
soooo yeah^^
The trick is that learning any language change/fucks up the way you Thought before you learned it. It performs you in a certain way from then on. That's the toujours unknown risk to take and fear. Nothing will be the same, the thing that you fell in love with will evolve into something you don't know yet. And so some may loose it as they can't relate to the shape it has taken thus it differs immensely from the one they fell in love with. If there's something we have trouble dealing with that is modulating the intangible structures we use to modulate in the first place. Language and Symbols define us.
Mostly every college graduate 🎓 are an example of that.
Well said. I was a metal singer for years, then went off and started a modern rock solo project. After that I got Logic and started with some EDMish stuff and now I'm where I want to be, writing symphonic music. When I started with the symphonic music it became clear that I needed to learn music theory. If I only knew then what I know now! Lol. For anyone on the fence about theory, learn it and learn it now. It is the tool that will bring the music in your head to fruition. This channel is excellent! You rock, Michael!
Very happy to find this channel. I am 45 years old, and finally able to play piano with 2 hands without beating the sheet music into my brain. The first song I am able to add chords to the left hand semi-improvised is the Dvorak New World folk tune. I can not believe what comes out of my fingers. 80% is alternating C-chord and G7 chord, 20% from trial and error that I don't know what chords they are. I am not going to play by other people's sheet music any more. My music expresses who I am, how my ethnic background relates to the folk tune, and how my life leads to how I play the chords. The music is me. No one else in the world plays it the same way.
Hello Michael, I watched this video and your first video on chords. Really, really helpful and I am looking forward to watching and learning from more of them. I will be retiring soon and want to devote much of my time with learning the accordion. I consider myself and advanced beginner and think what I learn from your videos will enhance my playing tremendously. Keep up the good work!
I didn't have an idea how to play music until I started watching you videos. Now I'm composing a piece for me and my two other friends to play. Learning theory and listening to different kinds of music (+ skooma), IS the source of my creativity. For me, I've always loved music, and wanted to figure these things out, but it didn't come naturally to me. Getting to know theory was the step forward in really expressing myself. It gave me a kind of system that I can work with. A sort of reference frame where I can start liking stuff together, sort of like maths.
I personally combine the two things you were talking about. Because the way I do it is I learn the concepts then I start experimenting with them. If it doesn't seem to work yet, I give it some time, listen to some music where I immediately start to recognize things, which I can later implement as ideas perhaps. I think listening to music is an underrated but fantastic tool to learn. That may only be me though.
music theory is the soil, and music is the flower
What about all the music that was written before western music theory?
amaxamon That’s the seed I guess
I'm a singer/songwriter who actually created a decent body of work in my first (and only) album (if you Google Vittoria Conn, you may find some online somewhere, like in an old podcast), and was complimented on the quality of my songs by several trained musicians. Then I started to hit the wall. I ran out of ideas. Not only did I not know enough theory, I didn't know what I didn't know. The impulse to make music was still so strong, but it had nowhere to go. Solid theory might have laid down tracks (so to speak) for that impulse to follow. It's been thirteen years of no output at all. I could have used that time to actually learn theory and been writing like crazy by now. Now I'm 60 years old. I guess I'd better get cracking! I'll take a look at all your lessons. Thanks for helping people like me.
I learned scales and chords and played guitar for years. Then I decided to learn theory. I got a modern method for guitar work book and found a teacher. After 1.5 years of weekly 1 hour lessons and some serious study, I don't feel like I'm better, but it is very easy for me to learn songs now. I find making music is easier as I now have many new colors in my palette I can choose from.
This guy deserves way more views and subscribes then he has.
Reason is, I've played guitar for eight years and have struggled with writing my own music because I could never develop a foundation I found suitable for myself to complete a song. Beyond that, his circle of fifths is the best explanation of ever heard for explaining how the wheel works in its entirety and I've had music classes that have tried to teach me that in highschool.
I absolutely agree. Just discovered those videos and it's exactly what I needed.
Trueeee.
I can only speak from personal experience but the more I know and learn the better music I create. I see it as a way of growing. :)
agreed mike. music theory is descriptive, not prescriptive.
that's something to discuss
@@federico7367 Adam Neely discusses this with "descriptive vs prescriptive" as the focus. Check out his video "Why you should learn music theory"
I like how you don't go much into technical stuff, and instead go straight into concrete and practical reasons and examples. Straight to the point, good video!
this is one of the most natural and beautiful videos in youtube ive ever come across. i am a person who uses youtube a lot for learning stuff -n now when i wanted to learn music theory i accidentally clicked on it....its gone way beyond just music alone Michael💙.am a fan!
Great, video. I have to admit I started at a young age didn't care to learn theory or reading music. What happened, predictably, is that my growth as a musician stopped and became frustrated and eventually quit playing for 25 years. When I picked it up again, I told myself I would get formally trained in theory, reading, etc. Not only has my playing progressed but I feel like I have opened a completely new world with unlimited boundaries! Isn't theory really just a way of cataloging what people have experimented with and found to have worked/not worked over the ages?
This is, by far, the most helpful RUclips chanel I could ever find. For a musician willing to learn this is sort of a treasure. Thank you very much for the biggest gift of humankind which, for me, is calles knowledge.
Music theory is just a weapon in your arsenal to help get your creativity out of faster. It should be thought of no more or less then then that.
Great video. I think one way to consider this which builds on what you have said is that the amount of theory you need depends on the _scale_ of what you are trying to construct. Consider architecture, for example. If you're building a doghouse, any reasonably skilled amateur carpenter could grab some wood, eyeball the length of things and start cutting, etc. and would be able to build a reasonably good doghouse without formal training, or any ability to read a blueprint (or even a measuring tape!). Similarly if you're composing a riff or a short melody or chord progression, there is no need for "rules". However, trying to build a modern house without a more formal approach (blueprints, engineering studies, etc.) and you will very quickly run into trouble! The same is true if you want to write a sonata or an orchestral suite. It's the same with every discipline: Writing a good paragraph requires more understanding of theory than writing a sentence, and writing a book takes more planning than a 2-page short story. If you're a computer programmer, you can probably write a short script by starting with your text editor and just writing the program out directly. However, if you're writing a half-million line program, it's probably a good idea to do some object modelling, maybe a formal spec, etc. before you begin coding!
In music especially, the need for a more formal approach arises primarily because of the way the "problem space" grows exponentially as the length of a piece increases. Consider a composition of only four sequential white-key notes from a single octave, with no consideration of rhythm: even in this tiny "composition", there are already 7^4 = 2401 possible melodies! Exploring even these possibilities, which might represent only a single measure of music would take a long time to do randomly. Therefore, anyone composing music needs some way to reduce the problem space by ruling out countless dead-ends which are likely to "sound bad". The only choice a composer has is whether or not to "stand on the shoulders of giants" by relying on the formal musical theory that has gradually developed over the centuries in western art music (or in some other tradition), or find their own path by developing their own "theory" by trial-and-error. There are a couple of problems with this latter approach:
1) As you clearly explained, the underlying theory (whether conscious or not) that guides composition is probably rudimentary, and excludes a great many worthwhile possibilities (such as your student composing only in C# minor, for example), eventually leaving the composer in a creative cul-de-sac, and
2) An inability to *describe* how your composition works, or what you are trying to achieve to other musicians! A vocabulary is needed to communicate with others about your music, and unless you are working solely by yourself on your compositions, you will need this vocabulary. Again, I suppose you could invent your own words to describe your musical ideas, but then you would have to teach your custom language to everyone else before they would understand what you're talking about. That's a lot less efficient than using the same language everyone else uses, which is much of what we call "music theory" -- the language (or discipline-specific "jargon") used to describe musical ideas. You NEED this language to collaborate with others, just as a surgical team needs a shared jargon to work together effectively when operating on a patient.
I once heard a musician say "when you learn the rules then you can break them." So maybe having a foundation and understanding of the structure of music can help you then twist and warp it to make the sounds that move your soul. I'm about to start learning music theory for keys in school and I'm excited!
I'm mostly of this mindset.
Hi Mr New. Very impressed with your insight. I'm a 66 yo female. Was a pro entertainer from age 13 to 40 then I became a Speech-Language Pathologist. I taught myself guitar well enough to play for a living (kind of) and started at the age of 5 making my own guitars....bla, bla...bla. Your guided vs self taught is a fascinating approach and I would love to hear what you would do by adding "formal" to a method of learning. As a SLP we learn that each person has an optimum pitch to their voice. This, I believe, would become their 'favorite' 'KEY' to play in and would shape their learning. (Mine happens to be "G" which also happens to be my favorite key to play even though "A" would be more simple for guitar. So, for beginners, (would like to hear your thoughts) it may be a middle of the road approach to teach in their optimum pitch. This may allow them to feel "more comfortable" with the music, as they would be able to hum more easlily and would attend to guidance more readily. For clarification, I am in the middle of another career change and becoming a certified music practioner for which I am learning music theory. Your lessons have been, by far, the most help I have found and I am going to suggest your lessons to my grand daughters who are learning guitar and, hopefully, piano. ( I believe that everyone would benefit from learning music via keyboard as it is so much more easily stransitioned to sheet music. (With which I struggle severely.)
Fantastic Video...
What I appreciate is how you lay out information.
I believe that (agreeing with what you said):
- Theory can channel your focus just into theory itself, and distract you from just experimenting.
- The camp that is against theory are probably in reality just having a reaction to rigid personalities in general. In other words, the problem is not as much with theory itself but that there are certain types of people that don't like to walk out of a structured path and are terrified with walking on uncharted territory, however if you observe them more carefully they probably never drive around a new place without a map or GPS.
- A theory can suck your focus into just theory, distracting you from experimenting. (But that's by no means a rule)
- You are don't have the collective experience gathered by centuries of theorists by choosing to distance from theory. It would be like trying to discover a continent and deciding to map it out on your own or relying on the already mapped out territory. (of course you could always discover something that hasn't been charted, but that could very well happen regardless of knowing theory or not)
- theory just gives you a map, it is a different thing to surrender all of your critical and creative thinking. You should still think for your self and nurture your curiosity. Above all not be afraid to sound bad on your way to discovering something.
like Mark Twain said: Never let schooling interfere with your education.
The most honest video about music theory I have ever seen. You seem like a really humble guy man. You have lots of knowledge but you still respect other opinions. That is great ! We need more people like you.
music is like maths
you can either learn everything from scratch which may take a long time( by ear)
or you can learn the knowledge that has already been discovered and add more to it in future (music theory.
I really like the analogy. In math, there's usually more than one method, however sometimes one method might be more effective to achieve a certain result, but doesn't the same go for music? In fact, if you delve into music, really what you'll find is math. Whether you play music by ear, or mechanise and calculate what you play - the underlying theory is essentially just math and logic.
Well, both are 'languages' so to speak, (no pun intended), so yeah, you can start where others have already beaten a path, or you can 'Speak in Toungues' lol
+DeadPistolsBrainGerms Aslong is it's designed and arranged it's music. It doesn't necessarily have to conform to the rules of theory but it can't be completely random keyboard smacking.
SuperShreyansh13 By ear, if you don't learn note by note, it makes the song that you are learning "your's". Music theory, you can learn everything note by note, but you can't have the feel if you don't change anything. Most people who learn music theory don't add more creativity. Most people who learn by ear, are forced to use more creativity and they develop better song making skills overtime. Learning by ear has more room for innovation, while music theory restricts most people with innovation.
J Guy i agree. Ive been taking music production seriously and my ear is hugely better. I got my keyboard out for the first proper jam and went on a big 20 min solo. Most was in key thanks to our michael but just didnt think to much about which keys i was playing and played what was in my head and my ears. I was so proud i had to show my wife who was actualy suprised. But the key scales is the best place to start. I see them as guides and also keeping all the parts to the key of the song which means u cant really sound bad yeah hit a few wrong notes which i did lots hahaha but it just sounded more tense and cooler (sometimes) Im next looking into polyrythms and see what i can jam with. I want to learn at least 4-5 scales just so i can swap around to j
keep gigs fresh. Yes learning by ear is good but thoery will make it faster.
Good insight! This totally makes sense because I've never really caught on to the theory stuff; I'm interested in it, but never really stuck with it. When I'm creative, I really like experimenting to find what I like, so it makes a lot of sense to me just "why" that is.
Good video. The way I see it is that knowledge is power. Learning a bunch of theory and concepts can only really broaden your understanding and perspective of music, and make composing/playing/studying music exponentially easier and faster. However, like you said, it can be easy to lose your childlike open-mindedness and creativity in the process if you don't actively experiment. If you are interested in becoming a great musician, though, I believe that purposefully neglecting theory puts you at a tremendous disadvantage.
Music is like a machine that makes songs. It's sitting in the dark, with a bunch of levers and buttons. You can grope around in the dark and try pulling different levers and pressing different buttons, or you can read the manual and learn what all the buttons and levers do, or at least what somebody else says they do, from their own time spent groping around in the dark. If you grope around in the dark enough, you'll eventually find most of the levers and most of the buttons, but if you read the manual you might learn about some levers and buttons you wouldn't be able to find yourself. Not everyone thinks to reach under the machine and finds those extra switches and knobs.
Actually making good songs with those levers and buttons is pretty much a whole different exercise. Learning grammar and the basic structure of storytelling doesn't make you a bestselling author, and neither does every bestselling book use perfect grammar, but most good books use pretty good grammar most of the time and have a pretty recognizable structure.
this presentation is just a continual flow with no edits total respect ~
Music theory is like reading and writing. It's not essentially needed to speak a language, but it's really suggested you learn how to do so (for obvious reasons).
English grammar is actually considered brand spanking new ( relatively speaking )
Not that people didn't have prejudices of correct use before then. But it can be argued that grammar today ruined what was an evolving language that grew and came out of relevant popular usage and that organic nature gave some beauty to it's uniqueness depending on the zeitgeist of the times. ( English was/could be the folk music of language )
Where grammar policing usually has ugly origins in it's intentions in many cases where class distinction has more to do with it's insistence than any thing of positive value. Grammar in English is not natural. Change is.
Thanks fer yer considratin' y'all!
We have a Pink Floyd fan.
It was actually Shakespeare that stopped the English language from evolving and this is why we are communicating in Elizabethan English. Because of Dante Italians communicate in his medieval Tuscan dialect.
I love the advice of this Worship Leader speaker I heard speak once, she advised to learn your instrument and theory so you know how to bend or sometimes "break" so to say, the rules. I quite like that approach. I've been playing guitar for over ten years by ear and piano for about 3 by ear and learning theory has actually given me so much confidence in "knowing" what I'm doing and how I'm doing it. For me it's given me a lot more freedom in my playing as well as improvising :)
I started creating electronic "music" in 1992. I was 18 back then, 43 now. Never studied music theory. This video along with a book convinced me to start studying. If you are just starting out don't make the same mistake that I did. At least learn some theory and then do what you want AFTER you have learned it, this will save you frustration and confusion. Even if you create some experimental ambient/acid/glitch/trance or WHATEVER, it will still help you! Otherwise it's just noise and even someone that is not musically inclined will feel there is something not right about your sound.
Thank you for that. It's worth a lot.
"They've just gained consciousness. They've got nothing to go on." I don't know why but that cracked me up.
Hello, I have recently discovered your Channel and I absolutely love your videos. Although I've played music and last 20+ years I've always been afraid of learning theory, afraid all the rules can stifle creativity. Lately I have become very aware of my limitations, and least a need for some Theory.
Personally, the beauty of music is it's structure. Chaos has no appeal to me. To make music without understanding the structure is possible but the beauty is in the structure. The truth of music is in it's consistency. The range of possible arrangements holds the key to what we call music. I always enjoyed music but I knew nothing of why it worked until I started studying structure. Now, it's the most beautiful thing in the world to me!
LOL @ 4:36 Saying that kids are RNGs. So funny. Had a good laugh.
That's basically how the brain works, frankly. There's some basic structure it starts out with, genetically, but then it fires random neurons and sees what works and what doesn't. That's why babies can't start dancing right out of the womb, their eyes don't know how to focus, and they aren't born speaking any language. They try things and get feedback, and being very good at learning they figure stuff out quick.
well most the 4 yearolds i've seen just slam all the keys and dance around
Hahaha😂.. Agreed!
Lmao
Lmao agreed
Lmfao
Michael, I just wanted to say that after watching your performance video, I was so relaxed that I went to the local hospital downtown where the piano is in the lobby and I sat down and played one of my best concerts ever. It was Chopin’s Étude Op. 10 number three. I always get so flustered and lose my place in feel embarrassed, but the receptionist had to disturb me in the middle of the peace because she couldn’t hear The telephone calls coming in. I was having such a good time and was so deep in it that I was playing pretty loudly. When she disturbed me she spent most of the one minute or so apologizing for stopping me in such the middle of such a beautiful piece of music. Normally I would’ve been done right there, but as soon as she turned around I brought the volume way down and finish the piece which was a real breakthrough for me. So now, I review that performance video of yours from time to time just to get myself relax before I go out in public and play. Thank you for that! Hopefully I won’t forget to share my stimulus check with you.
This video really helped me. I am at the exact point you are describing, where I have just spent a lot of time tinkering, but now I want to know what I am doing when I accidentally do something that sounds great, that way I can remember it so I can do it again sometime. Well, that led me here. Before this video I was not sure how I felt about theory. I really appreciate the way you laid this out, because now I see there is definitely some value to knowing at least a little more music theory, because I think it will make me progress faster, as long as I don't become obsessed with it and stop playing around and discovering.
Appreciate the effort and passion to talk 20 mintues about benefits of music theory. The beauty is - you can learn the amount you are interested in or need to achieve your goals and music pieces. I wrote songs for 30 yeats (since high school) and they got more and more sophisticated gradually just because I hate being bored of what I do. I can tell you that when my older son was 4yo, we visited my fathers house where there is an old furniture electronic organ with 2 keyboards, and he started to explore and was like giving a concert to himself trying to find all the things that make this organ sound tick, hammering, arpegios, soloing, full keyboard usage, and played through almost 20 minutes (last 6 I was lucky enough to get on video). Usually children just hammer a few sounds and try the other buttons, so it made me think, its in his genes. Same happened with a ukulele and a hand drum, exploring and enjoying sounds and harmony and connecting to the music in his head. Funny enough, his younger brother did very similar in our home at the same age, with a small Casio organ after finding a sound he liked, and started to play with finger rolls, combination of sounds like harmony building, rhythms (he loves to play my electronic drums now) and nothing resembled the normal one finger strokes and sometimes fist or elbow playing I see with other kids which gets close to a keyboard and decide to try.
You don't have a disipline without music theory, so you can only go as far as your enthusiasm takes you, but that would fade and without feeling successful, you will lose the hunger for more and path in your music. You still need to listen to many songs and styles to develop your versatile music mind, but music theory means taking lessons or self educating yourself with tools which makes you fit to play music WHICH IS NOT YOURS in a familiar and convenient way, play with others, and eventualy give your music to the world in a way OTHERS CAN PLAY as you composed it. You feel the success of combating a difficult piece of music better with some theory in mind. You have less trial and error when trying to put into realization the composition in your head, and have alternative ways of expressing it when it does not yet sound as perfect as you hoped it to be. I know because I battled so many songs of mine to sound a little bit better and moving and needed that theory in my mind.
So there is no do or don't, always a do, but as much as it is good to you and your kind of music, learning is not difficult as long as it is interesting and rewarding you with knowledge and practice, and being knowledgable doesn't make you less creative, even if you know many patterns and rules and habbits - its the sound in your brain which is burning to get out and forever live in a song or melody - without music theory, you can only try to seize the moments of muze by recording yourself over and over with little different playing each time, hoping for someone to interepret your recording some day and make it count for others. With music theory, you have a better chance of expressing your music better and keeping it in shape in its original form, unless, you wish to improve it when you know even more. Thanks Michael, enjoy your musical journey!
Great points Michael. There's certainly a difference between a musician who knows how to play an Instrument v.s. a musician who can actually do something with their instrument. My take on Music Theory is that it's really, really important and extremely powerful stuff and I'm a big believer in it because it gives you the ability to do/understand things that others can't do--if you go about learning/using it properly, it can help you be even more creative and sound even better than you would sound without knowing any theory. But the problem with people who are stuck on nothing but Music theory is that it can also work against someone if they are so wrapped up in the theory that it becomes the main focal point of your playing. I know of some folks who are really die-hard on their music theory and all's they wanna do is play notes from the page, but don't have the ability to take what they've learned and put it to use in the way of Improvising and expressing themselves. I look at Music Theory as a tool, I keep it in it's place but I don't make it the main focal point of the music I love playing.
Loved the video Mac!! Hey so IDEA: playing "arpeggio" native to the way a person says something. your voice naturally has an "out of that key" sound that is complemented with a resolution. and maybe play those "transitional tones" in a different octave. maybe map a little of different "moods" or "enthusiasm's" ex. if I'm being sarcastic something would be minorly different but close enough, like a diminished chord, or maybe just the same pattern but the tone would be different. Really I'm just curious to see someone play note changes at the rate of natural voice tonal changes. Thanks in advance!! Awesome work my musical brutha.!! lol
P.S. some sang consonants are considered "noise" and negative.. but don't be biased😉
EXCELLENT explanation that will lead people to make their study of music theory USEFUL without limiting essential creativity. Thank you Michael.
Thank you Michael for this honest video. I guess I am one of those experimental guys then. But your video helped me to better understand how/why I actually managed not to run into the trap of sticking to the known patterns - and I am now much more careful and will keep an eye on this.
I learned the very basics of music, piano and reading music in school and I tought myself Bach‘s prelude in C maj. when I was 12 because I liked the song and the sheet was simple enough to read. I learned a couple of more songs and always memorized them because I hated reading music. Then I stopped playing piano when I was 14.
When I was 30 I bought my first (e)piano and could still play Bach‘s prelude and 1-2 other songs. But I had to learn more complex ones all over again. Now, 3 years later and after I managed to memorize and fluently play „Pavane“ from Ravel, I have started writing my own music and since I don’t like simple stuff, it takes me quite some time to finalize a song.
To your point: Today my „judgement“ is pretty well developed - as per your description I started simple and now I also understand how to combine and enrich melodies and (according to your tutorials - I skipped through some of your videos) obviously „complex“ accords. The trick for me seems to be that I keep on using the learned pieces to find out „what is possible“. This way I am encouraged to try out crazy and new things because they were done in the pieces I learned.
Sorry for not watching most of your videos - I feel too lazy to learn another new vocabulary. But again, thanks for pointing out my weakness which I have to keep an eye on. And I am sure your videos will help a lot of people out there being stuck in their learning process. I think I found my way. :-)
I started learning theory because I seemed to be getting "stuck" playing the same way in almost every song. It's helped me to vastly expand the tools I had available for writing and improvising. I can better understand and recognize most pieces of music and my creativity has only increased since I began down this path. Your videos are a wonderful resource for anyone looking to take an intellectual approach to their music. Thanks
GREAT VIDEO! I am a very new student learning acoustic guitar. I loved the way you described in plain language the relationship between learning theory (structured) and discovering music (spontaneous). This video was not real short while being long enough to actually make sense. Well done! I have subsribed. Cheers.
From my experience not knowing theory allows you to kickstart your songwriting faster (if you have a talent for that), but the arrangements will often be pretty flat and also you'll most likely start repeating yourself very soon.
Also about those "great musicians" that "don't know theory" - I think in majority of cases they did pick up a lot listening to their own favorite musicians and just figuring by ear what is going on, growing their own style based on the influences they had. And of course mostly people refer to musicians as being great when there is good songwriting, which doesn't essentially require top notch skills or wide range of knowledge.
"they did pick up a lot listening to their own favorite musicians and just figuring by ear what is going on" I think this is just another way of learning music theory, by actually interact with music.
god bless your informational soul. ive been playing like that 4 year old in the example and just learned about 4th notes and 7th notes all those shenanigans and i feel as if my musical limitations are limitless now. thankyou!!!!!!
Actually went to school for illustration/animation, but still pursued music on my own. I can tell you... this explanation is the single best advice for creativity and learning I've EVER heard!
I think you are absolutely right about this. Either way you go, you find patterns. You have to discover your own patterns without help, and you may reinvent the wheel in a way that takes forever. Whereas if you study "music theory" you learn prenamed patterns, but you may never discover your own patterns.
great little speech, man. I really enjoyed it. I guess, as with anything, even if you are looking for the center of spectrum, it's impossible to know what "center" is. I think it is good to strive for balance in anything you do, but even then, balance means different things to different people in every arena of life.
I've just been casually messing around with the keyboard for years, and most of the stuff I write tends to be flat and uninspired. I figure it couldn't hurt to learn some theory. I've developed this "sound" that's hard to break out of, especially since I realized it's quite far from the kind of music I really want to write, and I always thought it was just my "style" but you've helped me realize that learning some music theory might actually help me grow out of that "box". I know learning theory won't make up for my lack of talent, but I think it's interesting to learn about, and I'll try to take what I can get from it. Great vid! :)
Talent in the sense that most people think of it doesn't exist. What it really is, is dedicating yourself to something and developing your potential within it through learning.
Just by virtue of your interest in music and theory, and your willingness to learn, you are more talented than you think.
You are a very good teacher. Thank you for making these videos. I find them very helpful and encouraging. This one on theory was especially useful because I find myself trying to learn everything I can, but not to over-learn it all. I think you articulated perfectly why that's a good approach.
I've stared taking notes from a bunch of your music theory video's. And as a person who's planning to take this "guided path," the biggest thing I've learned from this video, and will be telling others is to use music theory as a guide instead of a rulebook. thank you for this video
Thank u bro I been in fucking LIMBO trying to figure out and peice together whether I NEED to learn music theory or just compose by ear and figure it out myself, it's like you unlocked the answer I was looking for but it was truly in front of me the whole time thank you
This is so true, just last week I saw my 4 year old nephew doing exactly this (and singing along). Fantastic channel!
thank you for just jumping right into it. you made some great points!
I TOTALLY agree with you, music theory can take your musical skills to the next level quicker than trial & error but it might constrain you if you're not careful, very well put. I know people you who write great music and know almost no music theory but just have been doing it for a long time.
You are incredible in explaining and offering a lot of access to aspects I wouldn't find anywhere else. You are funny without knowing it, I suppose, in a positive manner.
Yes, to become a better musician, that's why I study music theory.
I've been trying to teach myself how to play piano for the last couple of months with the goal of being able to write my own music to go with my lyrics. Learning theory has been frustrating so far, but this video was very helpful in relieving some of the pressure of getting everything perfect. Thanks!
I'm all for music theory. I can't think of any other field where people think it's a bad idea to learn more about their craft. I don't know a single musician that regrets learning music theory. Those people don't exist as far as I can tell. No one is out there saying "man I wish I hadn't learned theory. It's killed my creativity." My guess is just that music theory allows people who aren't creative to start with to become "functional" musicians. Without the theory, those people may have never become musicians at all. But that may be wrong, since creativity is also a skill that can be taught. So maybe the problem is that traditional music education settings don't teach creativity enough? Hal Galper said that we play what we audiate, i.e. what we hear in our minds, what we imagine. And if your playing is unimaginative and glib, it's because what you were hearing in your mind isn't vivid enough. In other words, music theory per se isn't the problem. It's only a problem if it is the only thing your musical education is focused on, at the expense of imagination and creativity. If you try to write a short-story, you're most likely going to emulate the writers you've enjoyed. If you know alot about grammar, style and effect, then it will help, for sure. But if you write trying to find inspiraton in your grammar book, it's probably not going to be very good. Basically, I think music theory is good as long as we understand what its role is, i.e. a tool that you can use to better understand music, nothing less nothing more. To use the language of linguistics, music theory should be descriptive, not prescriptive.
Everything is and forever will be found somewhere near the middle. Great video my friend, I am exactly in the place you've described. I've done music on my own for a long time and am very happy to have developed my own fingerprint but am more than ready to expand and get to know the scope of expression. Just got into a music school and am battling between this idea of being an "artist" or a "professional musician, pretty whether to go or not to study this stuff. Anyways, your insights put words to some premonitions of mine and for that, I thank you.
You helped me a lot. Thank you, sir. I watched the entire video and even took notes. This is so helpful!
Thanks great stuff!! Subscribed and am looking forward to more of your videos in the future! Peace
I totally agree, I found since I have gone into music theory I'm finding it harder to create music, and I keep playing the same scales and chords all the time. I then realise what I'm doing and I end up just playing other scales and really miss the creativity part... being a technician I rely on a set standard of rules everyday and I can see now how its 'good to know' but its setting up road block for the creativity part. Good video.
There's something quite important that you didn't consider about the experimental type. You would indeed likely be limited in your ability if you stuck to what you can come up with on your own. But people listen to music, they want to be able to play the music that they like, and transcribing, even informally to reproduce what they hear, is a great motivating factor; it is part of the learning process and pushes you forward. So the suff that you wouldn't discover on your own, a series of chords that produce a certain effect when put together for example, you would encounter them in the music that you like, then you start to identify patterns. At the end of the day, you may not have the formal music theory, but the more you have actively been exposed to music in your life, the more you develop SOME type of music theory, even if it is your own, which still serves the same purpose: getting the experience/knowledge that helps you come up with notes that are likely to work well together and be interesting.
you literally covered all the things that i realised ever since i was a little kid. I would choose the "guided path" but the truth is that you need to gain control over the knowledge to prevent it from being and obstacle in musical thinking in general.
Love the way you explain things. I really appreciate all that you have taught me.
I have given a similar talk to mathematics students about why they should or should not learn about the history of mathematics. Punchline: Abandon customary ways of doing things, by all means, but know what customs you are departing from! Thanks for the post!
This.
My school mathematics education (UK, 1987-94)never included the intellectual context of what we were learning (e.g. quadratic equations).
Nor do I remember learning any practical applications for the more complex things we had to learn.
Sad. I wonder if things have changed today.
Absolutely mind blown, you basically got in my head and described my experience as a beginner.
Great video. As an older person who started learning music later in life, you said a lot of things that made sense. I have friends who are pretty good musicians and they've been very encouraging. It's kind of like when a black belt forgets what it's like to be a white belt and is not polite to them. We all had/have to start some where and it's amazing how much a little encouragement helps. I love being a music white belt...:)
As an ear player and composer this is a very validating and refreshing video thank you!!!!
Very thought provoking sir. I'm somewhere in the middle trying to figure it out, so thank you for making this video. I'll check out your other videos and visit your Patreon as well!
You have to know the "rules" so you know how and when to break them. You look at a painter like Picasso who was doing all kinds of crazy experimental stuff, but if you go back to the very start of his career he clearly already mastered the fundamentals as they were understood by artists going back generations. His early art was all very realistic. He mastered painting, and then he started to get wild and break the rules.
The same is true of any art form. Knowing the "rules" just gives you a sort of language and structure so you know what you can actually start to play with. There's all these different levers, but if you don't know what their names are and what they do, it can be hard to decide which ones to pull, and when. Some people pick up on the "rules" by simply practicing their art, and figuring out what works through trial-and-error. Others do a formal study of what others have figured out, and learn from them. Every artist, in any medium, though, is working with (and breaking) the "rules" of that art, consciously or not, and those who understand them, consciously or not, find the best balance. Every "rule" can be broken, but figuring that out takes experience, and the time to gain that experience is greatly shortened if you first know what the rules even are. You get labels for all the levers, you discover levers you didn't know existed if you were just by groping the machine in the dark, and then you can start to get creative with them.
Very helpful my man :) keep up the quailty content
I can relate to the second example this guy puts forth regarding the experimental inclination. I've always been able to improvise on the piano pretty decently (although I was trained in VERY basic music theory long ago like scales) and I'm also limited by repetition of the same general motifs. I'm not so bad that I'm stuck in one key, but I'm usually naturally oriented towards a subset of chord progressions across all keys. I've noticed that it usually comes from trusting muscle-memory and the visual partitioning of keys over your own musicality. It's deeply satisfying to bang out a tune that makes sense without thinking too hard (it's like listening to a song you enjoy) but then you're simply using your eyes and not your ears. It may be a good approach if you need to "play it safe", but if you're trying to discover new music, it can be like an addictive habit. It takes more mental effort to listen to music in your mind first before playing the notes. And that's the first example. The one with the 4 year-old. Kids MUST do that because they have no choice. Same with adults I presume that are new to music. I suggest if you're struggling with this problem, to try and make music in your mind first. Use music theory as a tool to ease the imagined music onto the piano keys more efficiently (by choosing the right keys more consistently after imagining them in your mind), but don't become lazy and rely on your eyes and muscle-memory by using it as a crutch. I guess my point is that, the music is ALREADY in you. That's why you enjoy it when you hear it even for the first time. Music theory isn't there to provide access to that, but to help you get it out onto the keys faster. That way, your creative "flow" won't be interrupted by searching for keys etc. My two cents.
Theory is another language, the one that we use to discuss music in a meaningful way to others versed in theory. The more I learn the more I like, but I didn't feel that way as a young person when I was content to mimic others and make noise.
The second you name a note or chord--that's theory. They could all be called something different if theory did not define them as it does.
No one anywhere has to know any theory at all to make wonderful music, BUT he/she would not be able to discuss their music in the abstract. Theory is an abstraction of music, such that we can talk about it and share it with others who aren't able to hear us play.
Before recording was possible there was only live music and written music (a type of recording). Written music is theory.
I love it now. Still learning. It's a great subject and I'll never waste a breath arguing against learning all the theory one can stand. I can be immensely helpful.
I've taken bass lessons for two years. When I first started my teacher told me that I'm going to learn theory because if you have the notes or chords in your mind, your fingers will follow. He's always had me experiment with specific chords by making bass lines to them. He also has me just make a bass line with out paying attention to what key I'm in, and then we analyze what I make. It's super cool to look back on these bass lines I was just fumbling around with, and finding out I was playing a weird scale or mode of a chord! All in all, I think with the right teacher, music theory is a fantastic route
I know this video was posted 8 years ago but this is something I've should've watched when I began making music. I took the natural path which believe it or not, I never had an issue with taking, in fact I actually liked my music MORE when I would experiment with notes rather than using the rules. Then I met a bunch of classical composers, guitarists/singers, Japanese influenced EDM producers where all of them would tell me my music is terrible and would constantly tell me my music is off key (which it wasn't) and ever since this has been happening (which has been happening for over a year) I just haven't been able to make music, and music is the only thing I do as a hobby. Sometimes I just sit here for 4-5 hours straight crying that I just can't make anything since I learned so much music theory already, and I'm so glad I finally found someone, even though it's been almost a decade since you made this, who's trying to explain that it's not all black and white, because it's not!
You have the right idea, and there's so many people out there who don't, I don't want to make classical music, I don't want to make Jazz, I just want to sing and make pop music and so many people just don't get it. Thank you so much for this video, it really helped me get out of a rut, otherwise I would have probably quit. ❤
Also something I wanted to add is I actually DID learn some theory before I even wrote my first song, it's just when people were telling me take it further than necessary that's when it became miserable.
Been playing guitar since I was about 9. Im 27 and just started learning the modes and their applications last week. My mind is blown. I never knew how important it really is. Iv'e been creating amazing things I never would have thought possible. Its so easy now
incredible, you sir have earned a supporter, thank you for this.
great video. I've been thinking about expanding my musical horizons lately. It's been a long time since I've played and i am most definitely one of those experimental origin types. you've inspired me to study the traditional methods and "rules" as to better understand the music I have played (and will play). I have very little knowledge of music theory other than what i had learned in choir as a child. I wan't to thank you. I don't know how this video wound up on my playlist considering the thoughts i have had about the distance between myself and playing music as of late, but thank you none the less.
p.s. ... breathe my friend.
Very good appraisal. Well thought out and presented. And yes, theory does indeed expand the universe!
EXCELLENT INSIGHTS Michael! THANKS SO MUCH!
Very interesting subject. Thanks for bringing it up!
Thx for bringing up this subject.
Was really interesting to learn your opinion as you are very knowledgable about music theory.
I'm not that good at reading scores, I do know some simple scales and chords. But I will focus on the circle of fifths's chords as they are much likely to be in 90% of any popular songs.
Music Theory is in my opinion a great tool for musician to expand your improvisation or better feels melody writing (by discovering more complex chords).
It’s a good thing to know the roles you want to go against.
Speaking about the saying towards the end about good musicians learning the rules and great musicians breaking the rules...a middle-school teacher of mine worded it perfectly (I don't even think it was a music teacher, maybe it was about writing and sentence structure). They said that a professional follows all of the rules, but a master knows the rules well enough that they know when the rules can be broken and why.
Hey i like your vid and just subed. lets get you to 100 k :) i have a question, what would be your meta learning approach to learning music. Tim Ferriss break down this acclerated learning process into a acrynoym known as DSSS
D- Deconstruction
what are the minimal learning units? what to start with and what is most important?
S-selection
what 20% of the blocks should i focus on?
S-Sequencing
in what order should i learn the different units?
S-stakes
basically set up stakes to have discpline and motivation.
So i guess the main question I have is if you had 6 months to turn a amatuer musician into a world class music producer and there was 10 million dollars on the line what would your teaching process look like??
i look forward to hearing back from you! keep it up, your channel is great
Hello Mike!
You are amazing. the stuff im learning here is something that ive always wanted to know for but couldnt figure out how for a long time. Lately i am kind of lost in the life (not like a depression but just I dont know what to do in my life) and music helps me to express myself. i dont know since when i was that eager to learn something in my life (even though i am a student in college). thank you for that opportunity. I hope you will continue what you do and get what you want in your life!
Awesome video, great dissection of some of these concepts and discussions. I've been starting to realize (mostly through your way of teaching) that theory should be there to help guide you and help you recognize things, not completely dominate how you look at music. Can't take it too seriously I guess is a way of saying it. Like sometimes I try things that shouldn't work and it can have a really cool feel or emotion. keep em coming m8 :)
What you said struck a chord with me. I have musical ear and can play a lot from the top of my head, but because of lack of foundation I felt limited when trying to improvise or write a song. Learning basic concepts such as keys, circle of fifths, etc. already feels like a huge progress. People who are on the extreme sides of the spectrum (don't learn any theory vs. never experiment) are missing a lot in my opinion. What one needs is a good balance, as you said.
really informative video. I agree with you on the most parts