Could you imagine being a marine on the receiving end of those orders? "WALK FORW-BACK BACK!!! BACK!! OK GOOOOOOO BACK BACK BACK!!! GOO GOOOO SHOOT SHOOT WALK SHOOT BACK SHOOT... DRUGS!!! SHOOTRUNRUNBACKSHOOTRUNRUNSHOOTBACKBACKSHOOTSHOOT!!!"
The idea behind the APM spam at the beginning of the game is to be constantly on a very high speed. This way you do not have to increase your APM during big fights but you keep a constant level. So what you basically do during intense situations is to swap out the "useless" APM spam for useful actions
KillExcl sometimes you want to make defensive units for a specific base thats getting attacked. so instead of spawining in main when ur 3rd gets attacked..
Gotta hand it to him. When those Protoss units roll into his main...that was the fastest "GG" and game exit I've ever seen. Takes more than mad APM and a rad perm to win at Starcraft.
***** In dota everybody right clicks on the same location multiple times even though they know their character will move there after the 1st right click. If you occupying your brain with something repetitive like right clicks and map awareness makes you more focused.
***** Naa, it is just to check the production on his buildings. While it seems unnecicary it is better to permanently be checking the production on all of your buildings and running on muscle memory auto pilot than it is to try to precisely remember all of the timings.
Once you reach the competitive level, games are not about fun anymore. Sort of like when you become a professional athlete. You no longer play that sport to have fun, you play it to win your games and be the best.
I like to believe that they still enjoy playing the game in some way and that the competition brings the fun. Winning is fun afterall and knowing that your hard training paid of in the moment when you win a championship against the best players, or win a tense 50 min macro game by outplaying your opponent. Call me a fool, but i think that's fun, even if practicing may be not.
***** thank god that is not really true. while it definitely becomes alot about just winning and being successful, i dont think any professional athlete or gamer could actually do what they do if there was no fun left in it at all. i just cant see anyone putting in the sheer grind (be it physical or mental) that is required to be at the top of the game otherwise. or do you honestly think that people like jordan, or federer, or messi, etc couldve ever gotten to their level of play if they ever lost the fun in what they were doing? i believe that a big part of what made them legends of their respective sport is that they love the game so much, and you can definitely see that whenever they are on the court/field. i believe this holds true for esports as well.
erbgorre I never said that the fun fades away, it just loses its place as a main focus. Of course all those players you mentioned enjoyed what they did and had fun, but you realize that that wasn't their main focal point as time went on? The goal when you're in high school basketball is to play college ball. The goal when you play college ball is to win titles and get drafted. When you're a professional, your goal for the forsee able future is to hone your skills and make and living from it. You can still have fun, but it doesn't remain center stage forever
Rumford Chimpenstein It's not really for APM, its to help them warm up. For example, the other guy could just as easily do an early game push, so he has to be prepared at all times. By warming up and getting his APM up, he can be ready at all times whenever an important battle happens.
Rumford Chimpenstein Think of it like any other physical activity. Take Basketball. Lebron James doesn't go out on the court after a day of lounging at his house. He stretches. He does a shootaround. He gets his body warmed up. The beginning game apm spams for this level of player is so they are warmed up and ready. Your hands won't naturally start at ridiculously high APM if they are going from 0
Interesting that he tilts his keyboard like that; is that an individual quirk of Losira or a common trend? (The upper left hand side of the keyboard closer to the monitor)
+Zachary Rose (Der Fuhrer's Werwolf) Lots of pros do this, especially in the csgo scene where almost every pro does. I think the logic is simply more ergonomically friendly, and allows for more natural key presses and hand movement.
Some of the dude might just be hating but I think some of them are actual grandmasters just criticising his gameplay. But I think the majority is the hater
@@carlotiu1308 hmm I'm not that good but I've been playing the game for a long time,im a Terran player. My advice for now since sc2 requires alot of experience. I advice for you to search up tips and tricks of the game and watch proffesional and normal sc2 replays. Try out their strategies and don't be afraid to lose. if you wanna get better, experience is the only way around. The more you'll play the better you will be. Sc2 is of course an RTS so don't be afraid to lose and study why you lost, keep trying to perfect your build order and try new things. It it will take time and dedication.. I've been playing this game since I was 7 starting from brood wars. And I'm still shit, but anyhow just get experience copy strategies and make your own.
Jealousy and ignorance. It's commonplace for ppl in woodleague to say "I could beat platinum if I wanted even with 5 apm". The same way some idiots think they could play an instrument like a pro after a day or two.
Watching these videos is really interesting to see what people do to keep themselves occupied to maintain a maximum speed. I'm a top typist personally, having exceeded minutely 160 wpm (or, in this case, 800 apm), this is still very impressive. I imagine that at that level of play it's very similar to typing for them, just using memorized or a few made-up key combos.
This is different than typing text. Every click or button push is a command and there's thought behind every single one of those clicks, if you're typing words you know exactly what you're going to do so it's a lot faster.
You really didn't read past the first sentence. I was speculating on what it's like in their heads, because combinations are no different than words. They are both simply manifestations of keypresses, and while I'm certain that in-game actions are more complex, he has already thought out a list of commands and obviously knows exactly what he wants to press, just as I have.
Albert Chang theres a list of commands but he still has to react based on what he sees. therefore its still highly different. it would be like you have to type a certain word when something randomly shows up. so imagine if you're typing and everytime you see say a cat you must type "blue". I don't see why you brought up the whole "800 apm" thing as theres really no reason to even trying to compare typing to playing sc2.
Mh wehen you see it like that Albert... but I see it like you are typing a "code" with two hands but he is typing a "code" with one hand while playing a intense Game of Chess with with Timelimits with the other. Starcraft is on this level of play all about Strategy and Mind-Games with typing in the Back what they do automaticly they dont think about the typing. But still 160 wpm is insane very well done.
+aleph null It's sorta a fallback mechanism... when you make a mistake on your regular setup. You can always use the upper keys to select your main base...
@@damontan4749 it's like dribbling, but he still needs to score. I think it's because sc2 is overcomplicated to a fault. Brood war is practically manageable. That's what I've gathered thus far anyway.
4 года назад+1
@@chateauluouxmont SC2 is not fucking complicated, what the fuck are you talking about? I'm a high plat or sometimes a low diamond player as a terran, I'm pretty shitty I know but I would never say that SC2 is complicated.
@ its a gamble that requires luck after your skill levels plateau. michael jordan may be the best basketball player ever because of his skill since basketball is designed to where luck doesn't screw you over.
why do ppl complain about the video when the titel clearly states what the video is about xP ah gawd... any way love you Khaldor! keep up the good work :)
Looks like a lot of work to lose a game. I can just imagine the Protoss player on the other end with a cup of coffee and a newspaper at 60APM. ZvP. ;-)
They pay attention to other things, like building placement, scouting ,pylon coverage etc. Protoss is easier to just play but more difficult conceptually. You have to make the best out of your units, if your units are cost inefficient, you loose. Making it very important to babysit your armies and bases.
nah... a lot of instruments have way faster fingerwork than this. metal shredding on guitar for example. Nicole is very right. Look up Valentina Lisitsa. That is freaky fingers my friend.
Besides the point that others have bring up about keeping the APM high for focus and warm up. I think the most important aspect of those spams as the beginning is to keep a complete repetitive cycles that lower league player don't notice. Since at the beginning of the games that cycle is not complete so it appears to be useless spam but it really is not, professional player have to complete each cycle very fast so they can multi tasking beyond the casual level. And they have to stablize that cycles even from the beginning of the game even if the step is missing. 1. produce enough drones for gas and mineral; and later remake drones if destroyed. 2. Check unit production facility and upgrade; and later base defense 3. Produce units according to the opponents army and his own economies (mineral/gas); and later rally accordingly to the flow of battles. 3. Scouts for opponent buildings and units; and later map control to be aware of the position of the opponent bases and armies 4. Micro for small skirmish and big battles; and later high-tech units ability. You see those useless clicks, to them it's part of the CYCLE
hey man is this cycle concept a real thing or something you made up / noticed for yourself ? I'm an AOE2/AOM player and have started to realize I should think these games as awareness cycles, same thing in league to keep an eye on junglers. Haven't heard much talk about cycling awareness in video games, my dad's an airplan pilot and they do use this technique at different stages of flight Btw I'd inverse your Production facility and Scout in your checklist, so that you always produce in consequence of what you see. Being picky but your list is actually very close to what i should use for AOE2 1- Make villagers, Make houses / Eco buildings, Optimise Gatherpoints, Get upgrades, later Build Town Centers 2- Scout for opponent buildings and units, later map control to be aware of position of opponent base and armies 3- Make walls, military buildings and upgrades, later base defense (castles / Bombard Towers) 4- Produce units according to Civilisation Strengh and opponnent army & eco, later rally accordingly to the flow of battles 5- Micro for raids, small skirmish and big batlles, later micro siege A nice fractal we got here From this checklist difference we can see the most fundamental aspects that differ from SC2 to AOE2 : Aoe has more base building macro content, SC2 has more micro and ability content Tho when i watch his game It feels like he spends 80% of his time doing Macro anyway ^^
You know how in America they obsess over NFL, NBA or MLB? Or in other countries like the UK or Brazil they obsess over football soccer? This is the Korean equivalent
Hey Khaldor, will you upload games from wcg korean qualifiers MarineKing vs some zerg(roro I think) in ro16? Thanks a lot man, greetings from Czech Republic!
jack blades Tell that to Hero, PartinG, Rain, and Classic. Oh weird, 5/10 of top ranked players on the WCS rankings play toss ;) I guess they should have consulted with you :)
Isn't that more of a tick that he does? Because at the beginning of the video, he continues to do the same movements with his left hand, but with his right hand he arranges his hair without even looking at the screen... Not only that, but he's moving back and forth between menus. It looks cool, but he's not using it at full efficiency, as the uploader makes it seem from the title.
Is this his first game of the day or like the third? I'm a 250~ APM Zerg player and I can only play as fast as I can after a warmup game, then for the first hour I play at my highest, then I slow down to around 180~ APM. Playing StarCraft 2 is just so taxing on both the mind and fingers, plus the added mental stress when you spend 20 minutes on a game, averaging 250 APM just to lose.
So basically "APM" for a "PRO" is the same as Putting 20 bucks in a vehicle that will take you 20 miles / gallon. And driving 2 miles on that 20 bucks then burning the car afterwards? Or, Going to the Grocery store and buying a box of Magnum condoms knowing it'll just be thrown away when they get home, merely to let the cashier see that they indeed bought that box of Magnum condoms? The problem with "PRO'S" these days is: It's all about appearance. I was a SC 1 Pro, and APM Never crossed my mind. Using Tactical and Pre-Emptive planning (And winning 95% of my battles) to out play the other person was more important to me, and most other players I saw at the time. NOT Clicking a drone on a mineral stack 85 times just to raise the amount of clicks per minute they are getting, which SOMEHOW gives them material to show off... Quit destroying games with your ignorance people! Click what and when you need to freaking click, and quit making games a Leader Board for clicking, instead aim for the Leader Board of TOP PLAYER in Wins/Losses. (I understand if you are clicking at the beginning to "Warm Up" your hands BUT, once you are warmed up clicking SO FUCKING MUCH throughout the entire game makes watching you play via: RUclips, Twitch, Etc.. is a Frustrating Feat! It's nearly unbearable! Instead of hovering over your command center, Hatcheries, and Gateways. Mindlessly clicking for NO REASON other than gaining "Click Cred". Go out and out click your opponent in a battle. Funny how when you're done clicking, 90% of the time you get stomped in battles.)
Thats because in SC1 they didnt encourage high speed gameplay, in SC2 they added a hotkey bar and camera points, which makes it easier to do things faster.
Yea you totally know me, dumbass. You don't gotta click fast to win games idiot. It's an ignorant trend of notoriety and popularity. I bet you were some N*Sync Scrub.
Marth Only You get a pass because German is your native language, but it would be spelled "lose" not "loose" and the only reason Americans are generally fatter than Germans is because we are a wealthier country, but that will soon be false, thanks Obama....
this is goood love seeing variety of differnt peoples actions + how they see the map and where there most concentrating :D but wheres her0 apm video? and i cant remember what other videos you said you was gonna be uploading soon? :( :D i dont make sense i know ¬¬ but please try and understand what i mean :D
You don't need APM like this play SC2, or any other RTS to that matter. Games like Sup Com takes hours to complete since it's pretty slow paced. You don't "learn" APM so you can play SC2. It's something that you naturally develop while playing
the reason why there are so many unnecessary clicks at the beginning is he is warming up his fingers. and they don't let hands take rest so keep that pace all the way through the end of the game. They are not just doing that for APM score.
to me, this isnt playing anymore, this is hard working, you are not concentrating on the game itself, you are concentrating on your finger movement and on your planned progresses, this is like keep looking for trees to find the Forest and not noticing the Forest itself
with enough practice, all those finger movements just become second nature. The hard part is to keep your awareness for hours at a time as that is what pro gamers are paid to do
I mean, as long as you know your keyboard and what the hotkeys are, you pretty much can do it without focusing on the typing S S Ctrl+2 B S 2 S S S B R 2 S B B I just made 2 SCVs, built a Supply Depot, three more SCVs, A Refinery, another SCV and a Barracks in that order. Assuming I did this in a click/type efficient way, I only did: 16 key strokes and roughly 10 mouse clicks. I only play Co-op and vs AI with an APM of ~60. It becomes second nature, and if anything, you naturally want to get faster and faster to maximize your control in battles. Only thing that's stopping you is your physical body not being fast enough to catch up
Make no mistake. They are concentrating on the game. The finger movement is just muscle memory/second nature. At this level any mistake on either end can cause you a loss. Nevermind the stress of such a high level of competitiveness.
Posing. Pure posing. He just doesn't have anything to do left, so he switches between buildings, checking the progress bars about 10 times a second. Impressing people isn't the way you win. Gah I just hate to see this APM bullshit.
+Marexio U call it useless, but it is actcually a warmup.. If u play sc2 u know game masuers effective apm as well as apm. The effective apm at start is very low but very important if he wants to keep that high of an apm when it counts. Dont watch start just skip to 14/15 min and u will see his apm is same as at start only this time every action is precise calculated and not just spam to warm up fingers and prepear for later fights.
+Marexio Yeah fuck checking progress because making units 20 seconds late in competitive environment , OBVIOUSLY wins you games... LOGIC>>>> Zerg especially has inject larva mechanics which can cost one a game if you miss it, but hey what do I know... I better listen to this woodlegue player instead. Additionally your eye isn't obviously trained enough to see that he's constantly producing from those buildings.
pro gamers never use ctrl shift or alt what are they use instead I wounder Game mechanics of contrl groups cannot be changed. I appreciate if you answer on ths question
Pro players don't worry about their APM and don't have to think about clikcs and mouse movements or cycling through hotkeys, that's actions they have done... I have no idea how many times, millions of times? Billions? That's all muscle memory. It doesn't take away any focus on the game and it can actually help focusing. And he's playing someone probably as fast as he is.
Hey SC community, Im a competetive Smash Bros Melee player, and the APM of the players of our games gets compared a lot, and I just wanted to ask what makes SC2 a technically demanding game? Its not like melee how its a fighting game with a bunch of mechanical exploits, so what is it? Also, why is the apm of players so important? Is there a benefit to pressing lots of keys aside from them doing soomething specifically in game? Thanks.
Megatwilightwarrior I'm not a SC player, but I think high apm matters in RTS when you kite enemy units in lategame fights and to avoid enemy damage. In MOBA games it's hard to control your ranged character to keep the distance while attacking the enemy, in RTS you do the same thing with 20 units, while sending your own meele units after the enemy rangeds. Plus you are constantly sending backup.
Megatwilightwarrior The greater your APM the more control you have over your army. Each unit is controlled individually, or in a group. If you have 100 soldiers, it takes less effort to move them all in one group, but it is less effective. If you control them all at once you can't control them very well tactically. As you get better you may split them into two groups, which is far more difficult to control. With two groups you can have one group circle around the enemy group while the other focuses primary targets, or somesuch strategy. As you get better and better at the game you can control your army near flawlessly allowing for extreme strategic depth. Couple that with the fact that RTS games have multiple unit types all with their own strengths, weaknesses, and abilities that must be catered to, and you can see why the skills required can be demanding to say the least.
IRonIcScopez No actually, my average APM is about 60 most games and most of the people I beat actually have a higher APM than I do. It's the same as possession in football games, you can have 60% possession and still lose 3-1. APM don't mean shit unless you can do anything with it.
TheBlisterer Why is nobody with below 200 APM in GM at any division? Maybe you should stop being garbage and stop making the epic le useless apm :^) maymay
napukapu Oh please, those type of comments are literally the worst kind of comebacks. It makes you look like a Grade A Bellend. By your logic, anybody with a lower APM than what's seen in the video is garbage, which simply isn't true. The APM in this video looks well above 200, more like 350-400. If somebody can play in Masters/Grandmasters with 200 APM then anything above maybe 250 is definitely pointless in 99.99% of games. Let's not be forgetting that the Koreans are just machines, I seriously doubt there would be more than a small handful of players outside of Korea with this kind of APM. I don't need his APM to enjoy the game or beat people.
+Tempest and a Computer I don't know where exactly he's playing at, but in Korea there are places called PC Bangs (bang=meaning room) and if you have ever heard of Internet Cafes, they are basically the same thing. You rent a computer for a number of hours and you're free to use it for that period, for things such as gaming, general internet surfing, work, etc. Hope that helps :)
+Tempest and a Computer Hah, it probably would be if that was the case, but I'm guessing it's not. Since it says in the description this is for qualifiers, he's probably just there to do that and not for general practicing. He'd probably train in a teamhouse. Also in case you were curious about the rates for renting a computer in a PC bang, the places that I go to charge about 1000 korean won/hour which is roughly a US dollar or so. They have discounts though for certain periods (5 hours= 4k won, 10 hours= 8k won, and so on.) and you get a free drink for renting above 10 hours.
SamudroEntertainment Oh well i guess thats nice in any case, they gotta have quite a lot of computer though if they are so cheap to rent, i know i would frequent going there even though i have a pc but for socializing purposes :D
+Tempest and a Computer very late reply, but in south korea, pc bang rental rates tend to be our equivalent of $2 USD per hour, maybe $5 for a "really nice" pc bang. They all are around the same though.
It's a Qsenn DT-35, a standard rubber dome keyboard that can be purchased for around $10 in Korea that was very popular with SC1 pro gamers. He is just one of the few players who has decided to stick with his tried and true formula rather than use mechanical keyboards.
so in SC when you click the place that your unit wants to go many times that'll make it move faster ? i'm a DotA2 player, and in DotA2 my hero wont get even 0.5mspd even if i right click the place i want him to go 10000000000000000 times
![Seungmin "그렇게, 천천히, 우리(As we are)" | [Stray Kids : SKZ-PLAYER]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/kAzmhLHePqU/mqdefault.jpg)
I like how the windows keys are removed so he can't accidentally tab out
You can just disable it in the options menu as well. It's under they keyboard & mouse tab.
@@RoseGold-Playa you couldn’t back then. Now you can, yes.
@@RoseGold-Playa There wasn't a disabled option before and he probably has had that keyboard since the broodwar days.
You always could in SC2 iirc
I bet that this guy could take over the world with just 50 armies if only he could control them with a keyboard.
only if he had stimmed marines stutter-stepping with medivacs
You mean 50 soldiers? 'cause... With 50 armies, you could take over anything.
@@minimalgrammar1276 I don't think you understand what an army is... An army only has about 100000 to 150000 people in it and is made up of 2 corps.
@@MarkJohnson-pg2oy Still, 50 armies is larger than any armed force in the world.
Noel are you dumb? Starcraft its totally different to modern warfare
Could you imagine being a marine on the receiving end of those orders?
"WALK FORW-BACK BACK!!! BACK!! OK GOOOOOOO BACK BACK BACK!!! GOO GOOOO SHOOT SHOOT WALK SHOOT BACK SHOOT...
DRUGS!!!
SHOOTRUNRUNBACKSHOOTRUNRUNSHOOTBACKBACKSHOOTSHOOT!!!"
hey i'll take some drugs
Yes sir! Yes SIR! Move it! erm Proceeding. uhh Move it!
drugs
DELIGHTEDTOSIRMOVEITYESSIRABSOLUTELY
hahaha
🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣 UNDERRATED COMMENT 🤣🤣🤣
@@alimoorad5998 😂😂😂 UNDERRATED REPLY OMFG!!!!!!!!😱😱😱🤪🤪🤪🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
The idea behind the APM spam at the beginning of the game is to be constantly on a very high speed. This way you do not have to increase your APM during big fights but you keep a constant level. So what you basically do during intense situations is to swap out the "useless" APM spam for useful actions
what's the point of losira putting all his hatches and brushing the hotkeys over?
KillExcl Hey can look at each one individually and see the spawn larve timer, and if he quickly wants to go to each base he can double hit that key
iamcool565 but its all in one hatch... right?
iamcool565 and why couldnt use something like camera hot keys to do the same thing? for me there isnt much use of hotkeys (for zerg) past 7th
KillExcl sometimes you want to make defensive units for a specific base thats getting attacked. so instead of spawining in main when ur 3rd gets attacked..
0:18
FIXES HIS FUCKING HAIR
SUAVE AS FUCK
Gotta hand it to him. When those Protoss units roll into his main...that was the fastest "GG" and game exit I've ever seen. Takes more than mad APM and a rad perm to win at Starcraft.
1:56 WOMBO COMBO :O :O!
hahahah, i was like wtf , what did he bind to 6-9 numbers?
The funny thing is: he does this every game. You see it if you pay close attention in televised matches with player cameras.
he is binding camera to his hatchery, its an operation which only occure 3 to 4 times per game, so you can use some keys which are hard to reach
@@GhostStyle007 Thank you for clarifying
He just runs out of things to do and spams between two buildings to check progress bars every .2 seconds
He is doing it to stay focused and keep the apm high so he don't need to suddenty increase his apm when it matters.
***** In dota everybody right clicks on the same location multiple times even though they know their character will move there after the 1st right click.
If you occupying your brain with something repetitive like right clicks and map awareness makes you more focused.
***** In fps games people switch weapons back and forth by spamming the q button. That also helps you stay focused.
muh click speed xd
***** Naa, it is just to check the production on his buildings. While it seems unnecicary it is better to permanently be checking the production on all of your buildings and running on muscle memory auto pilot than it is to try to precisely remember all of the timings.
I wonder if he's having fun..
Once you reach the competitive level, games are not about fun anymore. Sort of like when you become a professional athlete. You no longer play that sport to have fun, you play it to win your games and be the best.
***** Which is almost sad.
I like to believe that they still enjoy playing the game in some way and that the competition brings the fun. Winning is fun afterall and knowing that your hard training paid of in the moment when you win a championship against the best players, or win a tense 50 min macro game by outplaying your opponent. Call me a fool, but i think that's fun, even if practicing may be not.
***** thank god that is not really true. while it definitely becomes alot about just winning and being successful, i dont think any professional athlete or gamer could actually do what they do if there was no fun left in it at all. i just cant see anyone putting in the sheer grind (be it physical or mental) that is required to be at the top of the game otherwise.
or do you honestly think that people like jordan, or federer, or messi, etc couldve ever gotten to their level of play if they ever lost the fun in what they were doing? i believe that a big part of what made them legends of their respective sport is that they love the game so much, and you can definitely see that whenever they are on the court/field. i believe this holds true for esports as well.
erbgorre I never said that the fun fades away, it just loses its place as a main focus. Of course all those players you mentioned enjoyed what they did and had fun, but you realize that that wasn't their main focal point as time went on? The goal when you're in high school basketball is to play college ball. The goal when you play college ball is to win titles and get drafted. When you're a professional, your goal for the forsee able future is to hone your skills and make and living from it. You can still have fun, but it doesn't remain center stage forever
Notice how even when nothing is really happening on the screen, he keeps it up not to lose the pace.
Amazing.
Where is the cocaine and where can I get it
Drink asian blood
rofl
I’m half Korean, half Russian. Dare to try?
@@Scorpionwacom half russian? You can play quake like Cooller?
I wonder if he can file his taxes this fast
This video gave me carpal tunnel syndrome
It gave me scurvy
Thanks for spending time making those videos, its fun to see the hotkey layout of pros and their side of the game.
Wherever you are, whatever you play, there's always an Asian who will play better than you
iDartmoors z
Unless they went extinct with their birth rate
Dominic Bunn now we know that an european can be the number 1 cF Serral
Serral!
MarinLord 5-0 Korean in NationWars 3 ;)
Really amazing the speed and precision with which strikes the keys.
why does it appear as if nothing is going on and he is just reselecting groups for the sake of apm
because it's losira and it's to keep up the speed in the early stages of them game when not much is going on i find it really distracting personally
so it is somewhat for the sake of apm?
Rumford Chimpenstein It's not really for APM, its to help them warm up. For example, the other guy could just as easily do an early game push, so he has to be prepared at all times. By warming up and getting his APM up, he can be ready at all times whenever an important battle happens.
Rumford Chimpenstein Think of it like any other physical activity. Take Basketball. Lebron James doesn't go out on the court after a day of lounging at his house. He stretches. He does a shootaround. He gets his body warmed up. The beginning game apm spams for this level of player is so they are warmed up and ready. Your hands won't naturally start at ridiculously high APM if they are going from 0
It's similar to staying on your toes in other sports. It keeps you mind in the game so you don't get caught off guard
Love these over-the-shoulder vids Khaldor, keep them coming please! XD
"Hey guuuise APM is useless!" - said the noob silver with 30 apm.
imagine playing starcraft
This man lost though lmao
Interesting that he tilts his keyboard like that; is that an individual quirk of Losira or a common trend? (The upper left hand side of the keyboard closer to the monitor)
+Zachary Rose (Der Fuhrer's Werwolf) Lots of pros do this, especially in the csgo scene where almost every pro does. I think the logic is simply more ergonomically friendly, and allows for more natural key presses and hand movement.
+John Cui because starcraft requires ctrl+a number. this slant makes it easier.
I tilt mine because of my F1,F2.F3 keys they're little bit off to the side
I have no idea who these peoples are, I'm only here for the button mashing :)
Are we going to forget the fact that at 11:17 there are a bunch of tangled wires?
why are people talking bad about his APM. Just bow down and appreciate.
Some of the dude might just be hating but I think some of them are actual grandmasters just criticising his gameplay. But I think the majority is the hater
@@st.lopikongiii151 yo I just started playing this game can I ask some tips for good gameplay. I want to play with Zerg so please tell me about it.thx
@@carlotiu1308 hmm I'm not that good but I've been playing the game for a long time,im a Terran player. My advice for now since sc2 requires alot of experience. I advice for you to search up tips and tricks of the game and watch proffesional and normal sc2 replays. Try out their strategies and don't be afraid to lose. if you wanna get better, experience is the only way around. The more you'll play the better you will be. Sc2 is of course an RTS so don't be afraid to lose and study why you lost, keep trying to perfect your build order and try new things. It it will take time and dedication.. I've been playing this game since I was 7 starting from brood wars. And I'm still shit, but anyhow just get experience copy strategies and make your own.
You think if he lowered his apm a bit then he would've caught the moment that lost him the game.
Khaldor i haven't seen a single first person APM video where the player wins.... is that why we don't see anymore?
I don't know why you are all so cold about APM. People play differently, some spam APM and some don't. WHY THE HELL DO YOU CARE?
Jealousy and ignorance. It's commonplace for ppl in woodleague to say "I could beat platinum if I wanted even with 5 apm".
The same way some idiots think they could play an instrument like a pro after a day or two.
Amazing Khaldor, thanks for the upload, losira is just out of this world.
Watching these videos is really interesting to see what people do to keep themselves occupied to maintain a maximum speed. I'm a top typist personally, having exceeded minutely 160 wpm (or, in this case, 800 apm), this is still very impressive. I imagine that at that level of play it's very similar to typing for them, just using memorized or a few made-up key combos.
This is different than typing text. Every click or button push is a command and there's thought behind every single one of those clicks, if you're typing words you know exactly what you're going to do so it's a lot faster.
You really didn't read past the first sentence. I was speculating on what it's like in their heads, because combinations are no different than words. They are both simply manifestations of keypresses, and while I'm certain that in-game actions are more complex, he has already thought out a list of commands and obviously knows exactly what he wants to press, just as I have.
Hacking Pentagon is also just pressing keys. And most people who tru know what each key does......
Albert Chang theres a list of commands but he still has to react based on what he sees. therefore its still highly different. it would be like you have to type a certain word when something randomly shows up. so imagine if you're typing and everytime you see say a cat you must type "blue". I don't see why you brought up the whole "800 apm" thing as theres really no reason to even trying to compare typing to playing sc2.
Mh wehen you see it like that Albert... but I see it like you are typing a "code" with two hands but he is typing a "code" with one hand while playing a intense Game of Chess with with Timelimits with the other. Starcraft is on this level of play all about Strategy and Mind-Games with typing in the Back what they do automaticly they dont think about the typing. But still 160 wpm is insane very well done.
Hey Khaldor!!! Why don't you film the entire area where they are playing the games?? plzzzz!!!
His fingers need liquad cooling
What did he do @ 1:56 when he ran his finger across the keyboard?
setting up control groups i think
+aleph null It's sorta a fallback mechanism... when you make a mistake on your regular setup. You can always use the upper keys to select your main base...
I can type 103wpm will that be my apm?
AGUYNAMED278 No. If you can type 103 on a Qwerty keyboard, would that immediately apply onto a DVORAK. No.
what is the dvorak keyboard for wtf
a more typer oriented layout, useless for gaming
Is he using the core as hotkey setup? Since his keyboard is tilted and he is using his thumb too.
Nice APM, still lost.
yes it's a strategy game, wouldn't be any fun if the mechanical aspect was the only thing that matters but it's still very important
But he would thrash you though, fuckface
@@damontan4749 it's like dribbling, but he still needs to score. I think it's because sc2 is overcomplicated to a fault. Brood war is practically manageable. That's what I've gathered thus far anyway.
@@chateauluouxmont SC2 is not fucking complicated, what the fuck are you talking about? I'm a high plat or sometimes a low diamond player as a terran, I'm pretty shitty I know but I would never say that SC2 is complicated.
@ its a gamble that requires luck after your skill levels plateau. michael jordan may be the best basketball player ever because of his skill since basketball is designed to where luck doesn't screw you over.
why do ppl complain about the video when the titel clearly states what the video is about xP ah gawd... any way love you Khaldor! keep up the good work :)
Looks like a lot of work to lose a game. I can just imagine the Protoss player on the other end with a cup of coffee and a newspaper at 60APM. ZvP. ;-)
They pay attention to other things, like building placement, scouting ,pylon coverage etc.
Protoss is easier to just play but more difficult conceptually.
You have to make the best out of your units, if your units are cost inefficient, you loose. Making it very important to babysit your armies and bases.
OMG! 17 minutes of Losira awesomeness!!! thank you SOO much for the upload!!
Those professional piano players are nothing compared to Starcraft players
Piano playing is about rhythm not speed.
nah... a lot of instruments have way faster fingerwork than this. metal shredding on guitar for example. Nicole is very right. Look up Valentina Lisitsa. That is freaky fingers my friend.
Art Tatum. RUclips him now.
"Starcraft requires the stamina of a pianist and a mind of a chess player"
And eyes.
how big is the screen when pro players play in tournaments? and type of keyboard ???and mouse? plz!
All that APM and he still lost
Lol
He plays opponents that are as fast as him.
Sheip maybe because he went for ultralisk infestors lol
+Seriovsky or protoss...
+Seriovsky APM isnt everything if your choices and decisions in game are worse
sirjezzumz Yeah, totally agree with that. If you have no idea what to do with your actions you only make mistakes faster than your opponent.
so all those actions per min are really doing something or is it just to elevate the numbers? are all of his actions actually new ones?
Keyboard-Killer!
What exactly does slapping his fingers on the hotkeys like that actually accomplish?? I can't tell
I wonder if he IS THE keyboard warrior.
lol
Besides the point that others have bring up about keeping the APM high for focus and warm up.
I think the most important aspect of those spams as the beginning is to keep a complete repetitive cycles that lower league player don't notice. Since at the beginning of the games that cycle is not complete so it appears to be useless spam but it really is not, professional player have to complete each cycle very fast so they can multi tasking beyond the casual level. And they have to stablize that cycles even from the beginning of the game even if the step is missing.
1. produce enough drones for gas and mineral; and later remake drones if destroyed.
2. Check unit production facility and upgrade; and later base defense
3. Produce units according to the opponents army and his own economies (mineral/gas); and later rally accordingly to the flow of battles.
3. Scouts for opponent buildings and units; and later map control to be aware of the position of the opponent bases and armies
4. Micro for small skirmish and big battles; and later high-tech units ability.
You see those useless clicks, to them it's part of the CYCLE
hey man is this cycle concept a real thing or something you made up / noticed for yourself ? I'm an AOE2/AOM player and have started to realize I should think these games as awareness cycles, same thing in league to keep an eye on junglers. Haven't heard much talk about cycling awareness in video games, my dad's an airplan pilot and they do use this technique at different stages of flight
Btw I'd inverse your Production facility and Scout in your checklist, so that you always produce in consequence of what you see. Being picky but your list is actually very close to what i should use for AOE2
1- Make villagers, Make houses / Eco buildings, Optimise Gatherpoints, Get upgrades, later Build Town Centers
2- Scout for opponent buildings and units, later map control to be aware of position of opponent base and armies
3- Make walls, military buildings and upgrades, later base defense (castles / Bombard Towers)
4- Produce units according to Civilisation Strengh and opponnent army & eco, later rally accordingly to the flow of battles
5- Micro for raids, small skirmish and big batlles, later micro siege
A nice fractal we got here
From this checklist difference we can see the most fundamental aspects that differ from SC2 to AOE2 : Aoe has more base building macro content, SC2 has more micro and ability content
Tho when i watch his game It feels like he spends 80% of his time doing Macro anyway ^^
Someone call an EXORCIST!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
HAHAHAHAHA
lmao, made me laugh
Keyboards Havel a 10milions click guaranted life right? I think je need new keyboard every game
That is a membrane keyboard?
Dat apm on a MEMBRANE KEYBOARD!?!?
Someone get this kid a mechanical keyboard ASAP!!
just korean
Something is wrong with the interface if you need to click that much for something to happen
why are they always korean????
in particular with SC2 they take it extremely series and most pro teams come from there or have Koreans on there team
TheMicroGamer You mean serious..
yes i meant serious ovbs i meant serious
You know how in America they obsess over NFL, NBA or MLB? Or in other countries like the UK or Brazil they obsess over football soccer?
This is the Korean equivalent
Something sound wrong with that keyboard...Like he seem to need extreme force to press the keys
Wtf is up with his head movement? it bops down like every 2 seconds....
he just look at the minimap....
tell me again what micro the toss had to do in this game? other than pressing the panic button
fucking insane
thanks for this khaldor. really appreciate all the extra work you do and content you bring us.
did he win or did he lose cuz its not clear to me. and what did he press to automatically gg and leave ?
Carpal tunnel syndrome incoming
Hey Khaldor, will you upload games from wcg korean qualifiers MarineKing vs some zerg(roro I think) in ro16?
Thanks a lot man, greetings from Czech Republic!
King of APM - Loses game.....
enemy - God of APM
APM isn't everything
Why does it take him 47193957 key presses to build a drone?
apm is overrated in sc2. you can play protoss with 60apm and still win worldcups
Definitely not ^^
There's something wrong with you.
KhaldorTV you can with 150 though, look at stardust :D
ChriseCxD Yes, that is why good sc2 players don;t play protoss. Protoss is noob race. Sorry man.
jack blades Tell that to Hero, PartinG, Rain, and Classic. Oh weird, 5/10 of top ranked players on the WCS rankings play toss ;) I guess they should have consulted with you :)
Someone should do a ASMR video of this....I really love the sound of the fast keyboard, with the background noise edited out.
hipstersound website, typing sound is an option
dat Ryze main :D
HAHAHA DEEEAM SON
its like compare barney with dragon ball!.
I made 269 MEDIUM APM Garen in 30 minute game League Of Legends. If anyone wants Screen?
Isn't that more of a tick that he does? Because at the beginning of the video, he continues to do the same movements with his left hand, but with his right hand he arranges his hair without even looking at the screen... Not only that, but he's moving back and forth between menus.
It looks cool, but he's not using it at full efficiency, as the uploader makes it seem from the title.
membrane keyboard
Is this his first game of the day or like the third? I'm a 250~ APM Zerg player and I can only play as fast as I can after a warmup game, then for the first hour I play at my highest, then I slow down to around 180~ APM. Playing StarCraft 2 is just so taxing on both the mind and fingers, plus the added mental stress when you spend 20 minutes on a game, averaging 250 APM just to lose.
TakeTV brought me here.
me too xd
my too xD
an odd figure, 50 (apm), how did you stumble upon that conclusion? very curious
Butthurt non-/bad SC2 player in a nutshell: Oh look he's just mashing pointless buttons
will u learn the difference between 1st and 3rd Person? I don't think so :/
So basically "APM" for a "PRO" is the same as Putting 20 bucks in a vehicle that will take you 20 miles / gallon. And driving 2 miles on that 20 bucks then burning the car afterwards? Or, Going to the Grocery store and buying a box of Magnum condoms knowing it'll just be thrown away when they get home, merely to let the cashier see that they indeed bought that box of Magnum condoms?
The problem with "PRO'S" these days is: It's all about appearance. I was a SC 1 Pro, and APM Never crossed my mind. Using Tactical and Pre-Emptive planning (And winning 95% of my battles) to out play the other person was more important to me, and most other players I saw at the time. NOT Clicking a drone on a mineral stack 85 times just to raise the amount of clicks per minute they are getting, which SOMEHOW gives them material to show off... Quit destroying games with your ignorance people! Click what and when you need to freaking click, and quit making games a Leader Board for clicking, instead aim for the Leader Board of TOP PLAYER in Wins/Losses.
(I understand if you are clicking at the beginning to "Warm Up" your hands BUT, once you are warmed up clicking SO FUCKING MUCH throughout the entire game makes watching you play via: RUclips, Twitch, Etc.. is a Frustrating Feat! It's nearly unbearable! Instead of hovering over your command center, Hatcheries, and Gateways. Mindlessly clicking for NO REASON other than gaining "Click Cred". Go out and out click your opponent in a battle. Funny how when you're done clicking, 90% of the time you get stomped in battles.)
Thats because in SC1 they didnt encourage high speed gameplay, in SC2 they added a hotkey bar and camera points, which makes it easier to do things faster.
There is no way you won 95% percent of your games. You would be the best sc1 player in the world. yet you were probably some d- scrub
Yea you totally know me, dumbass. You don't gotta click fast to win games idiot. It's an ignorant trend of notoriety and popularity. I bet you were some N*Sync Scrub.
I never said anything about apm? I was calling you out on you bold faced lie bro. You gotta do better than that lol
You dumb fuck
ok but what was his apm
America REALLY needs these types of places....
IRonIcScopez America would need to loose weight for that
Marth Only English is hard for you isn't it?
IRonIcScopez Im german and its not my native language,but i dont see anything wrong with it.
Marth Only You get a pass because German is your native language, but it would be spelled "lose" not "loose" and the only reason Americans are generally fatter than Germans is because we are a wealthier country, but that will soon be false, thanks Obama....
IRonIcScopez Thanks for telling me,and i was actually just trying to post a lame joke,not to offend anyone.
this is goood love seeing variety of differnt peoples actions + how they see the map and where there most concentrating :D but wheres her0 apm video? and i cant remember what other videos you said you was gonna be uploading soon? :( :D
i dont make sense i know ¬¬ but please try and understand what i mean :D
They arent playing it for fun, theyre playing it for a living...
Don't worry guys! Those are one-time-use mouse and keyboard
This is why I don't play RTSs
lel you dont need this spam yeah you need to keep your apm at a constant rate but his spam is just unnecessary
You don't need APM like this play SC2, or any other RTS to that matter. Games like Sup Com takes hours to complete since it's pretty slow paced.
You don't "learn" APM so you can play SC2. It's something that you naturally develop while playing
+Callsign-YukiMizuki I played Age of Empires 2 with my friends , very much the apm is needed, any real time strategy needs apm.
I couldn't exactly catch but can someone tell me what keys is he using with his thumb ?
who the fuck cares if he has 100000 apm , he didnt win lol
who the fuck cares if he lost, he had 100000 apm :D
Mouse dpi above 1k maybe? 1500 ~ 1600 aprox?
lost?? hahhaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa
did Losira lose a lot of weight? he appears to be alot thinner then he used to be
On dirait un épileptique xD
the reason why there are so many unnecessary clicks at the beginning is he is warming up his fingers. and they don't let hands take rest so keep that pace all the way through the end of the game. They are not just doing that for APM score.
to me, this isnt playing anymore, this is hard working, you are not concentrating on the game itself, you are concentrating on your finger movement and on your planned progresses, this is like keep looking for trees to find the Forest and not noticing the Forest itself
with enough practice, all those finger movements just become second nature. The hard part is to keep your awareness for hours at a time as that is what pro gamers are paid to do
yea you need to know to do wat action you do at a certain time lernign apm is the first struggle but using it right is the real thing
Not true at all, high apm is result of muscle memory, the hard part is to get up to speed.
I mean, as long as you know your keyboard and what the hotkeys are, you pretty much can do it without focusing on the typing
S
S
Ctrl+2
B
S
2
S
S
S
B
R
2
S
B
B
I just made 2 SCVs, built a Supply Depot, three more SCVs, A Refinery, another SCV and a Barracks in that order. Assuming I did this in a click/type efficient way, I only did: 16 key strokes and roughly 10 mouse clicks. I only play Co-op and vs AI with an APM of ~60. It becomes second nature, and if anything, you naturally want to get faster and faster to maximize your control in battles. Only thing that's stopping you is your physical body not being fast enough to catch up
Make no mistake. They are concentrating on the game. The finger movement is just muscle memory/second nature. At this level any mistake on either end can cause you a loss. Nevermind the stress of such a high level of competitiveness.
But zerg has won more stuff than protoss in HotS? how do you explain that?
nice spam losira. nice spam. now win a gsl.... lol
lol, and the funny thing is that you have a point
are you going to do one for flash too? =D
Posing. Pure posing. He just doesn't have anything to do left, so he switches between buildings, checking the progress bars about 10 times a second. Impressing people isn't the way you win. Gah I just hate to see this APM bullshit.
+Marexio then you can get the fuck outta here
+Marexio U call it useless, but it is actcually a warmup.. If u play sc2 u know game masuers effective apm as well as apm. The effective apm at start is very low but very important if he wants to keep that high of an apm when it counts. Dont watch start just skip to 14/15 min and u will see his apm is same as at start only this time every action is precise calculated and not just spam to warm up fingers and prepear for later fights.
because obviously you dont need warm ups eh?you can wake up at 2am in the morning and go for a 400m sprint with optimal performance huh
+Marexio Yeah fuck checking progress because making units 20 seconds late in competitive environment , OBVIOUSLY wins you games... LOGIC>>>>
Zerg especially has inject larva mechanics which can cost one a game if you miss it, but hey what do I know... I better listen to this woodlegue player instead.
Additionally your eye isn't obviously trained enough to see that he's constantly producing from those buildings.
pro gamers never use ctrl shift or alt what are they use instead I wounder Game mechanics of contrl groups cannot be changed. I appreciate if you answer on ths question
+Bogdan Zhulanov lol check your facts again :)
+Bogdan Zhulanov They dont use a keyboard at all :O pro gamers get a license to mind controll units :)
maybe if he would have not worried about his apm so much he would have won
Pro players don't worry about their APM and don't have to think about clikcs and mouse movements or cycling through hotkeys, that's actions they have done... I have no idea how many times, millions of times? Billions? That's all muscle memory. It doesn't take away any focus on the game and it can actually help focusing. And he's playing someone probably as fast as he is.
+Tony Munoz I guess you are also a fan of lifting weights without any sort of warmup. I too like to live my life dangerously.
Hey SC community, Im a competetive Smash Bros Melee player, and the APM of the players of our games gets compared a lot, and I just wanted to ask what makes SC2 a technically demanding game? Its not like melee how its a fighting game with a bunch of mechanical exploits, so what is it? Also, why is the apm of players so important? Is there a benefit to pressing lots of keys aside from them doing soomething specifically in game? Thanks.
Megatwilightwarrior I'm not a SC player, but I think high apm matters in RTS when you kite enemy units in lategame fights and to avoid enemy damage. In MOBA games it's hard to control your ranged character to keep the distance while attacking the enemy, in RTS you do the same thing with 20 units, while sending your own meele units after the enemy rangeds. Plus you are constantly sending backup.
Megatwilightwarrior The greater your APM the more control you have over your army. Each unit is controlled individually, or in a group. If you have 100 soldiers, it takes less effort to move them all in one group, but it is less effective. If you control them all at once you can't control them very well tactically. As you get better you may split them into two groups, which is far more difficult to control. With two groups you can have one group circle around the enemy group while the other focuses primary targets, or somesuch strategy. As you get better and better at the game you can control your army near flawlessly allowing for extreme strategic depth. Couple that with the fact that RTS games have multiple unit types all with their own strengths, weaknesses, and abilities that must be catered to, and you can see why the skills required can be demanding to say the least.
90% of that APM was utterly pointless...
We all know you are trying to make yourself feel better with your 20 APM trying to make it seem like hes going at the same speed you do in your games.
IRonIcScopez No actually, my average APM is about 60 most games and most of the people I beat actually have a higher APM than I do. It's the same as possession in football games, you can have 60% possession and still lose 3-1. APM don't mean shit unless you can do anything with it.
TheBlisterer I average 110-130 just recently and win most of my games against people with less apm.
TheBlisterer
Why is nobody with below 200 APM in GM at any division? Maybe you should stop being garbage and stop making the epic le useless apm :^) maymay
napukapu Oh please, those type of comments are literally the worst kind of comebacks. It makes you look like a Grade A Bellend.
By your logic, anybody with a lower APM than what's seen in the video is garbage, which simply isn't true. The APM in this video looks well above 200, more like 350-400. If somebody can play in Masters/Grandmasters with 200 APM then anything above maybe 250 is definitely pointless in 99.99% of games. Let's not be forgetting that the Koreans are just machines, I seriously doubt there would be more than a small handful of players outside of Korea with this kind of APM. I don't need his APM to enjoy the game or beat people.
Cherry MX keyswitches are rated for 50 million clicks. Membrane/plunger keyswitches are typically rated for 10-20 million key clicks.
yeah the fastest.. and he still lost the game.
His opponent is also very fast
Then why this video is not about his opponent
is there any record of the APM he got at the end of the game?
where are you gonna upload the one of flash
Why does he need to click 10 time a second while he is just waiting for drones to be build in the beginning?
Unrelated to the game, where is he playing? Is there like places where you can rent a computer for a while or do it for free?
+Tempest and a Computer I don't know where exactly he's playing at, but in Korea there are places called PC Bangs (bang=meaning room) and if you have ever heard of Internet Cafes, they are basically the same thing.
You rent a computer for a number of hours and you're free to use it for that period, for things such as gaming, general internet surfing, work, etc. Hope that helps :)
+SamudroEntertainment must be an expensive habit if that's his only resort to practicing
+Tempest and a Computer Hah, it probably would be if that was the case, but I'm guessing it's not. Since it says in the description this is for qualifiers, he's probably just there to do that and not for general practicing. He'd probably train in a teamhouse.
Also in case you were curious about the rates for renting a computer in a PC bang, the places that I go to charge about 1000 korean won/hour which is roughly a US dollar or so. They have discounts though for certain periods (5 hours= 4k won, 10 hours= 8k won, and so on.) and you get a free drink for renting above 10 hours.
SamudroEntertainment Oh well i guess thats nice in any case, they gotta have quite a lot of computer though if they are so cheap to rent, i know i would frequent going there even though i have a pc but for socializing purposes :D
+Tempest and a Computer very late reply, but in south korea, pc bang rental rates tend to be our equivalent of $2 USD per hour, maybe $5 for a "really nice" pc bang. They all are around the same though.
what is monitor size 20 inch or 24 ?
It's a Qsenn DT-35, a standard rubber dome keyboard that can be purchased for around $10 in Korea that was very popular with SC1 pro gamers. He is just one of the few players who has decided to stick with his tried and true formula rather than use mechanical keyboards.
so in SC when you click the place that your unit wants to go many times that'll make it move faster ?
i'm a DotA2 player, and in DotA2 my hero wont get even 0.5mspd even if i right click the place i want him to go 10000000000000000 times