Sorry for part of the audio not being top-quality, I had an issue on my Micro (Now fixed) which I didn't notice. I decided anyway to not postpone the video to shoot it again as the quality is still okish. Cheers! Fede
@@theredfox22 well I actually don’t remind a medieval image showing an umbrella!! And if I remember well, they were imported either from Persia or China in the next couple of centuries after Fiore lived
CONTROVERSIAL MODE ON I always thought the name of this posta was somehow related to the german "wrath guard" since they look so similar. Maybe italian masters thought "Well, we aren't gonna name this guard WRATH... why not something equally terrifying?" CONTROVERSIAL MODE OFF
I only practice Japanese Kenjutsu, but your channel is my favourite HEMA channel and I watch this to learn various ways of swordfighting. European longsword style is probably the most similar to Japanese Kenjutsu style because it is double handed technique, unlike Saber or Rapier.
It's ironic that I've been wearing the HEMAnimal t-shirts for a while, but I only found this channel today. A wonderful look at the Posta Di Donna, thank you!
Some folks think "guardia" means a waiting, guarding yourself type position rather than a position to launch an attack from, so they used the over the shoulder version to launch an attack and to lean the weight on the back foot at the same time for the accressere with the front foot ( like how Fiore showed in the dagger section ). I think it's a pretty neat interpretation, by doing that you can launch a powerful fendente without stepping since the power is generated by the weight transfer from the back leg to the front leg, which you can maintain distance for Largo plays instead of crashing into Stretto with a passing step.
13:00, You are correct with your interpretation of “moving sideways”. In Japanese Kenjutsu, we have the exact same move, and we also move sideways in that sequence. This naturally opens up the opponent and you can strike him from his side. In fact, we also have the same move in boxing. When you parry a jab you can move to the side and counter.
From what I've heard at my sword school, the lady's guard name came from depictions of women in art, specifically the biblical Mary who would beat Devils with a big stick in that exact pose.
Posta di Donna the dab of sword fighting. You can literally put the sword behind your back like Anakin Skywalker in episode III. The usefulness of this position is irrelevant because you automatically win on style points alone. Coolness rating: 11/10
If the thrust of the sword is directed from the back to the front with a good throw, the sword strike can become stronger. If the thrust of the sword comes from a shorter movement stance, in that case the sword strike will also be weaker. Moving the sword from the back to the front can create a deeper cut if applied correctly. I would never compare this guard to the ridiculous choreography from the Star Wars series⭐⚔⭐ se o impulso da espada se dirige das costas até a frente com um bom arremesso, o golpe de espada pode se tornar mais forte. Se o impulso da espada vem de uma postura de movimento mais curto, nesse caso o golpe de espada também será mais fraco. Mover a espada das costas até a frente pode sim criar um corte mais profundo se bem aplicado. Eu jamais compararia essa guarda as coreografias ridículas da serie Star Wars⭐⚔⭐ This posture also demonstrates relevance for defense on certain occasions, such as in sparring in the video.
Thank you for these videos; they are slowly adding up to a pretty comprehensive compendium of Fiore techniques, something which is sorely lacking on RUclips. I just wish each martial art in the world would have such nice and understandable video compendia.
The roverso fendente may or may not be a feint (depending on the definition), but is a provocation. While that specific word isn't AFAIK used in this context (i.e. baiting opponent's action by doing a non-attacking movement at the edge of his measure) until the Bolognese tradition, Fiore definitely has them in his systems, he just says 'such and such guard is deceitful' instead. Finestra that changes the side of the thrust to the other side by passing under the opponent's blade comes to mind as another example. If you consider provocations to be a subset of feints, then the roverso fendente from donna is a feint, if not then not. While this isn't pure Fiore terminology, it is pretty useful for talking about how his guards work. On an unrelated note, there is an additional secret feature in posta di donna with the point down - you can use your forearm to shield your eyes from the sun. This will come up almost never, but when it does it is pretty good way to stay in some useful position while you scoot over to the side to not have your retinas seared out.
Posta di donna is definitely one that has confused me on how to use, the second one where you are with your back turned. But recently i saw an english instructor using posta di donna mid fight as an evasive and counter attack maneuver. He'd enter the posta as the enemy attacks the head, the attack misses, and immediately counters. I tried this a couple of times and it does work
Ah, of course, but that’s shifting the weight actually, it can be done with every posta! I personally consider posta di donna a key position, it’s main feature is being able to strike every blow, and it’s ability to parry backward while entering under measure! ;-)
Also, a problem of this poste is that they tend to be seen as with the weight backward, compared to the opponent, while instead the weight is sideways, or at 45% sideways compared to the opponent. This makes them part of a movement pattern and not a one trick pony. As they can both exercise strength on the side direction while unfolding their rotation, or simply move sideways under cover.
Excellent video as always, thank you Federico! I really appreciate how your thorough explanations are always accompanied by video, makes the material so much easier to understand. Can’t wait to put those theories to practice!
U have become my favourite yt teacher in the ways of the sword,I aply what I lern here in swordplay here in Brasil,and tanks to the info and the trainig I got a Lot better
Great stuff as usual! I'm not that great at using it as a parry and then still getting some kind of repost after. Maybe something I'll make a longsword goal over the next couple of months...
Hello! Thank you for the video! Looking at your reading of the glossa made me curious about one point: how readily can a speaker of Modern Italian understand the original text of Fiore's manuscripts? As a student-philologist who knows Russian, English and J.R.R. Tolkien's Quenya and Sindarin, I would like to say that Italian is probably (for my personal lámatyávë) the most beautiful natural language I ever heard, so I feel desire to learn it sometimes. It would be great if that might even prove useful for reading Fiore's glosses.
It’s easier to read Fiore than Marozzo by my point of view. The words choice is simpler. He writes the “sounds” of his dialect though, being a natural Italian it’s quite intuitive anyway, by learning Italian you may probably find the problem of the “weird letters” of some words… But if you focus on how the words sounds rather than it’s letter construction, then it’s clear most of the times!
Good work, thank you. But there's one item in the manual you didn't go over and I'm curious to know your interpretation of it, and that is the label to this posta of it being 'pulsativa'. What are your thoughts?
Do you mean Pulsativa. Well, I decided to add this ultra-speculative things to my Patreon full interpretation of Fiore. Their existence can’t help understanding more, because there are no hints of what they mean, so I left this info for patrons only as it is, by my perspective, a curiosity over which it is possible to discuss for decades without finding a real answer.
@FedericoMalagutti Yeah, my bad. I thought I had typed the word, but it didn't post for some reason. Weird. I edited the question so it's in there again. Anyway... so, you're saying you don't know? I get that. There's a lot of speculation been going around for a long time now, with no one finding a solid conclusion. And I agree it's a difficult term to connect to. However, it's very possible it's a significant hint to something we're all missing and may affect how we interpret the function and application of the guards. The closest thing I've come to for solid lead is in Medieval music; the terms pulsativa, stabile and instabile were, apparently, used as annotations to stress changes in tempo.
Well, actually it’s part of the play itself. Plays and guards do not have to be considering equally, like as it is a book of tricks and every image is a trick. Poste and Blows (cuts, thrusts) are there to define the way in which the sword moves around. By connecting the poste together you have all the possible movements patterns of the sword. Plays instead are example of fighting situations. But to do the play, you have to start from a guard, move through various guard during the action, and end in a guard.
@@FedericoMalagutti Ah, the fault would lie with me then, as I've always thought of the guard in the Peasant's strike as being "horizontal" as a rolling up from Full Iron Gate, while I've always thought of Posta di Donna as being more "vertical" (this is all from a top-down point of view)
@@imstupid880 to do the villano play 101, namely as it’s wrote: You start for porta di ferro (or other guards, but PF is more comfortable) you parry in finestra, you move through Donna while stepping aside and rotating, and you end in longa or cosa longa while striking. Depending from how you land the blow.
@@imstupid880 so you were not wrong, my advice is to look more at the poste as progressive steps of a movement, whatever movement you are going to do or read on the manual is. Search for my video “The Medieval Method”, I can’t link it right now, there I explain this concept more clearly.
I'm curious: How strange/archaic does Fiore's text feel to a modern Italian speaker? I don't have any trouble reading the Ledall but it does require me to first get into the right mindset.
Ciao Federico, come siamo? I have 3 questions: - you practice Hema, your name starts by Feder but you do Italian instead of German style. How do you feel? (anyway, Fiore dei Liberi is da boss) - your valley is beautiful, can you tell us where is it? - do you play warhammer 40k? Thanks for your fantastic job
Ciao! I can’t withstand the weight of having Feder at the beginning of my name instead of Spadarico. It’s Valsesia, northern Piedmont. Yes, even if I’m more into te lore of it. I used to play more Warhammer fantas back in the days. But in short, yes.
Sorry for part of the audio not being top-quality, I had an issue on my Micro (Now fixed) which I didn't notice. I decided anyway to not postpone the video to shoot it again as the quality is still okish. Cheers!
Fede
Sounds pretty good here in Springfield...thanks for all the content Federico!
@@417hemaspringfieldmo you are welcome!!
I always thought it was called the lady because noble women had umbrellas 🌂 that go over the shoulder
@@theredfox22 well I actually don’t remind a medieval image showing an umbrella!! And if I remember well, they were imported either from Persia or China in the next couple of centuries after Fiore lived
CONTROVERSIAL MODE ON
I always thought the name of this posta was somehow related to the german "wrath guard" since they look so similar. Maybe italian masters thought "Well, we aren't gonna name this guard WRATH... why not something equally terrifying?"
CONTROVERSIAL MODE OFF
Ahahahahahah!!
@@FedericoMalagutti
Hell hath no fury like a Donna Zorned
😉👌
I only practice Japanese Kenjutsu, but your channel is my favourite HEMA channel and I watch this to learn various ways of swordfighting. European longsword style is probably the most similar to Japanese Kenjutsu style because it is double handed technique, unlike Saber or Rapier.
It's ironic that I've been wearing the HEMAnimal t-shirts for a while, but I only found this channel today. A wonderful look at the Posta Di Donna, thank you!
Oh cool! Elisa will be happy to know
@@FedericoMalagutti "Who's that on your T-shirt?" "Sir Meowrozzo"
Some folks think "guardia" means a waiting, guarding yourself type position rather than a position to launch an attack from, so they used the over the shoulder version to launch an attack and to lean the weight on the back foot at the same time for the accressere with the front foot ( like how Fiore showed in the dagger section ). I think it's a pretty neat interpretation, by doing that you can launch a powerful fendente without stepping since the power is generated by the weight transfer from the back leg to the front leg, which you can maintain distance for Largo plays instead of crashing into Stretto with a passing step.
Definitely. Of course you need to reach that measure in some way.
13:00, You are correct with your interpretation of “moving sideways”. In Japanese Kenjutsu, we have the exact same move, and we also move sideways in that sequence. This naturally opens up the opponent and you can strike him from his side. In fact, we also have the same move in boxing. When you parry a jab you can move to the side and counter.
From what I've heard at my sword school, the lady's guard name came from depictions of women in art, specifically the biblical Mary who would beat Devils with a big stick in that exact pose.
It’s another speculation, as it is my one.
Posta di Donna the dab of sword fighting. You can literally put the sword behind your back like Anakin Skywalker in episode III. The usefulness of this position is irrelevant because you automatically win on style points alone. Coolness rating: 11/10
Ahahahahahah! Never watched it by this perspective but it definitely makes sense lol
Overall you are doing a great job with these videos on Fiore’s system!
@@thescholar-general5975 thanks!
If the thrust of the sword is directed from the back to the front with a good throw, the sword strike can become stronger. If the thrust of the sword comes from a shorter movement stance, in that case the sword strike will also be weaker. Moving the sword from the back to the front can create a deeper cut if applied correctly. I would never compare this guard to the ridiculous choreography from the Star Wars series⭐⚔⭐
se o impulso da espada se dirige das costas até a frente com um bom arremesso, o golpe de espada pode se tornar mais forte. Se o impulso da espada vem de uma postura de movimento mais curto, nesse caso o golpe de espada também será mais fraco. Mover a espada das costas até a frente pode sim criar um corte mais profundo se bem aplicado. Eu jamais compararia essa guarda as coreografias ridículas da serie Star Wars⭐⚔⭐
This posture also demonstrates relevance for defense on certain occasions, such as in sparring in the video.
This posture also demonstrates relevance for defense on certain occasions, such as in sparring in the video.
Your video creation skills, as well as your understanding and teaching has grown to an exemplary level.
Thank you for the clear concise explanation
Thank you for the kind words
Great explanations. Thank you, Fede!
You are welcome!!
Thank you for these videos; they are slowly adding up to a pretty comprehensive compendium of Fiore techniques, something which is sorely lacking on RUclips. I just wish each martial art in the world would have such nice and understandable video compendia.
Thank you for the kind words!
The roverso fendente may or may not be a feint (depending on the definition), but is a provocation. While that specific word isn't AFAIK used in this context (i.e. baiting opponent's action by doing a non-attacking movement at the edge of his measure) until the Bolognese tradition, Fiore definitely has them in his systems, he just says 'such and such guard is deceitful' instead. Finestra that changes the side of the thrust to the other side by passing under the opponent's blade comes to mind as another example. If you consider provocations to be a subset of feints, then the roverso fendente from donna is a feint, if not then not.
While this isn't pure Fiore terminology, it is pretty useful for talking about how his guards work.
On an unrelated note, there is an additional secret feature in posta di donna with the point down - you can use your forearm to shield your eyes from the sun. This will come up almost never, but when it does it is pretty good way to stay in some useful position while you scoot over to the side to not have your retinas seared out.
Posta di donna is definitely one that has confused me on how to use, the second one where you are with your back turned. But recently i saw an english instructor using posta di donna mid fight as an evasive and counter attack maneuver. He'd enter the posta as the enemy attacks the head, the attack misses, and immediately counters. I tried this a couple of times and it does work
Ah, of course, but that’s shifting the weight actually, it can be done with every posta! I personally consider posta di donna a key position, it’s main feature is being able to strike every blow, and it’s ability to parry backward while entering under measure! ;-)
Also, a problem of this poste is that they tend to be seen as with the weight backward, compared to the opponent, while instead the weight is sideways, or at 45% sideways compared to the opponent. This makes them part of a movement pattern and not a one trick pony. As they can both exercise strength on the side direction while unfolding their rotation, or simply move sideways under cover.
Beautiful deep-dive!
Wow, thank you for this video. I really love your idea regarding the name of this posta/guardia.
A speculation, but it makes some sense!
Excellent video as always, thank you Federico! I really appreciate how your thorough explanations are always accompanied by video, makes the material so much easier to understand. Can’t wait to put those theories to practice!
You are always welcome;-)
U have become my favourite yt teacher in the ways of the sword,I aply what I lern here in swordplay here in Brasil,and tanks to the info and the trainig I got a Lot better
I’m always happy to be of any help for other Swordfighters
Beautiful video! Super informative and I absolutely adore the format❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤
Happy to read this ;-)
Very well made, Fede, thank you!
You are welcome!
Great stuff as usual! I'm not that great at using it as a parry and then still getting some kind of repost after. Maybe something I'll make a longsword goal over the next couple of months...
It gets some conditioning ;-) ;-)
Thanks!!
Great channel
Hello! Thank you for the video!
Looking at your reading of the glossa made me curious about one point: how readily can a speaker of Modern Italian understand the original text of Fiore's manuscripts?
As a student-philologist who knows Russian, English and J.R.R. Tolkien's Quenya and Sindarin, I would like to say that Italian is probably (for my personal lámatyávë) the most beautiful natural language I ever heard, so I feel desire to learn it sometimes. It would be great if that might even prove useful for reading Fiore's glosses.
It’s easier to read Fiore than Marozzo by my point of view. The words choice is simpler. He writes the “sounds” of his dialect though, being a natural Italian it’s quite intuitive anyway, by learning Italian you may probably find the problem of the “weird letters” of some words… But if you focus on how the words sounds rather than it’s letter construction, then it’s clear most of the times!
Great !
bravo
Thanks!!
dimmi di grazia, se a tuo dire, di queste poste puotesi usare anco con uno bastone overo una verga meno longa?
Good work, thank you. But there's one item in the manual you didn't go over and I'm curious to know your interpretation of it, and that is the label to this posta of it being 'pulsativa'. What are your thoughts?
Do you mean Pulsativa. Well, I decided to add this ultra-speculative things to my Patreon full interpretation of Fiore. Their existence can’t help understanding more, because there are no hints of what they mean, so I left this info for patrons only as it is, by my perspective, a curiosity over which it is possible to discuss for decades without finding a real answer.
@FedericoMalagutti Yeah, my bad. I thought I had typed the word, but it didn't post for some reason. Weird. I edited the question so it's in there again.
Anyway... so, you're saying you don't know? I get that. There's a lot of speculation been going around for a long time now, with no one finding a solid conclusion. And I agree it's a difficult term to connect to. However, it's very possible it's a significant hint to something we're all missing and may affect how we interpret the function and application of the guards. The closest thing I've come to for solid lead is in Medieval music; the terms pulsativa, stabile and instabile were, apparently, used as annotations to stress changes in tempo.
@@krdietiker really interesting. ;-)
🙏🏾grazie
I've often wondered if Posta di Donna could be used as an advancing passing guard, similar to the hanging guard used in the Peasant's Strike.
Well, actually it’s part of the play itself. Plays and guards do not have to be considering equally, like as it is a book of tricks and every image is a trick.
Poste and Blows (cuts, thrusts) are there to define the way in which the sword moves around. By connecting the poste together you have all the possible movements patterns of the sword.
Plays instead are example of fighting situations. But to do the play, you have to start from a guard, move through various guard during the action, and end in a guard.
@@FedericoMalagutti Ah, the fault would lie with me then, as I've always thought of the guard in the Peasant's strike as being "horizontal" as a rolling up from Full Iron Gate, while I've always thought of Posta di Donna as being more "vertical" (this is all from a top-down point of view)
@@imstupid880 to do the villano play 101, namely as it’s wrote: You start for porta di ferro (or other guards, but PF is more comfortable) you parry in finestra, you move through Donna while stepping aside and rotating, and you end in longa or cosa longa while striking. Depending from how you land the blow.
@@imstupid880 so you were not wrong, my advice is to look more at the poste as progressive steps of a movement, whatever movement you are going to do or read on the manual is.
Search for my video “The Medieval Method”, I can’t link it right now, there I explain this concept more clearly.
I'm curious: How strange/archaic does Fiore's text feel to a modern Italian speaker?
I don't have any trouble reading the Ledall but it does require me to first get into the right mindset.
I answered the same question below if you want a more extensive answer but in short: Same as you
Hello. I would love to know what camera was used in this video. Thank you.
We use a Nikon Reflex photo-camera! Probably D3300 if I remember well, but I should ask!
@@FedericoMalagutti Thank you. The footage is really visually stunning.
Ciao Federico, come siamo? I have 3 questions:
- you practice Hema, your name starts by Feder but you do Italian instead of German style. How do you feel? (anyway, Fiore dei Liberi is da boss)
- your valley is beautiful, can you tell us where is it?
- do you play warhammer 40k?
Thanks for your fantastic job
Ciao!
I can’t withstand the weight of having Feder at the beginning of my name instead of Spadarico.
It’s Valsesia, northern Piedmont.
Yes, even if I’m more into te lore of it. I used to play more Warhammer fantas back in the days. But in short, yes.
Well, when I look at this, I always imagine a late middle ages lady with an white umbrella looking back at me
Eh! In theory umbrella weren’t still (at least a common) thing at the time in the region. In theory
I've heard the version that posta di donna is called that because you stand like a woman giving you a seductive look over her shoulder.