Create And Sharpen A Scandi-Vex Edge.
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- Опубликовано: 13 сен 2024
- Bark River Knives are notorious for their scandi-vex grind? If you do not know what that is, I'll explain. It is a style of sharpening that takes the basic principle of a traditional scandi grind and makes it even stronger and longer-lasting. Most manufacturers use a platten, which is a flat surface behind a belt on a belt grinder, to create the edge, or a very large round wheel, that actually makes the scandi part of the grind, ever so slightly hollow ground. ESEE is one that definitely does that and so does many others. That actually makes for a very sharp knife, but a fragile edge. So, by taking the time to really concentrate and change that inferior grind into a scandi-vex, you will have the best of both worlds. A scandi grind that is supreme in the task of cutting and holding an edge, and a convex grind that is also extremely sharp, yet supremely tough.
I of course really edited this down for time so you did not have to see every sweep of the blade on my contraption. You do get the overall picture and idea as to what is going on and hopefully, and rather inexpensively, start converting your own scandi grinds into Scandi-Vex!!
If you need clarification or further explanation on any part of this video, please feel free to leave a comment. I answer them all.
@DutchBushcraftKnives
(everyday carry minimalist,everyday carry,everyday carry gear,bushcraft,camping gear,edc,hiking gear,knife modders,knife modifications,knife mods,knife sharpening,knifetalk,outdoor,sharpening a knife,survival,knife collecting,enzo,brisa,enzo trapper,bark river knives,bark river,bark river gunny,gunny,scandi,Scandinavian knife)
I second the 50 DBK videos and no clue how to do it. Just found your channel. Love it! Few observations, and I mean this respectfully, as I am a fan. Your older videos: kinda sometime come off as a random older guy complaining. your New videos with your new facial hair/look/library behind you, you come off as a lovable, collected witty Wise Sage. I glossed over your videos In the past and got vibe A, but vibe B was in full force the sec I saw your videos and when I went back and watched/subscribed to your channel I legit asked, "no way, it's the same guy!?" lol
Praise the Lord! 🙏 Thank you!!! Finally… somebody leaves me constructive criticism like I’ve been asking for. Thank you oh so very much for taking the time to leave me such a thoughtful, useful comment. You have no idea how much that means to me! I am just trying to produce the best content about my favorite hobby for others to enjoy watching and maybe learn something. It has been a work in progress trying to find my “Voice“. I believe I am beginning to settle in a little bit into a “style“. I would really love to be able to go out and do more hands on videos, and that sort of thing, but they are just so involved, and take darn near a week to edit. I much prefer being up in the library in a controlled environment and having a nice little chat about a particular knife topic. So I think that is the direction things will be headed in the foreseeable future. I certainly hope to continue to project vibe “B“ from here on out.
I see that your comment was edited. I hope you didn’t leave out any additional useful tidbits for me. I don’t want anybody to be shy or intimidated when leaving comments. They are all welcome and none get deleted as I say in my short video, RUclips likes to call my “trailer“, nobody could possibly offend me or hurt my feelings!
Again… Thank you very much for stepping up and writing what you wrote. When I am near a computer, and I have more functionality, I am going to pin your comment to the top.
I've turned a Mora 511 into a Scandivex starting out with diamond plates and finishing with Spyderco ceramic stones. Of course I stropped it for a hairsplitting edge and also for looks. I was rather satisfied for the first time.
Thank you for showing us your approach. I still have a few Woodjewel knives in my queue and I might try your method.
I am glad you had a system that worked for you. Thank you for watching my video and I look forward to hearing from you as to how my method worked for you.
DBK is also one of my favorite knife channels! I really love how you explain exactly what we're gonna see, then demo everything! REALLY GREAT DEMO! Only question I had was how much time did it take to go through the full task? Thanks very much again for actually teaching what we all want to know after watching about 50 DBK videos!
Wow. Thank you. That is such a great complimentary comment. I appreciate it. Glad the demo was understandable. I often wonder if I gloss over too many things because of doing it for so many years, so much of it is just reflex and engrained in my head. I forget that there are people out there who may be learning something for the first time.
In answer to your question. The entire process can take 1-2 hours. But you can take breaks and do other stuff so you don't go nuts just standing there. The beauty of doing it this way, as opposed to the way I did the TOPS B.o.B knife, is that you are in such control of how much material is being removed and at what angle and all those things.
If you plan on doing this, be sure to buy the rubber backed no slip paper, in a multitude of grits so you can keep making progress all the way to completion.
That's a clever idea. Looks like an actual convex grind. Came out lookin really pretty too! ✌️
Thank you for your kind words. I’m glad that you like the end result. I appreciate you watching and leaving a nice comment!
magic word: gratifying ... bingo. Maybe its and age thing, maybe were the same age but yes, doing stuff like that is gratifying. A different level of satisfaction, thx for sharing.
I think you do have to be of a certain age to understand that level of gratification. Glad you get it! Thank you very much for watching and for a great comment!
I built a 2x72 grinder from a treadmill with a 2 1/2 hp DC motor. I can run it down as slow as a Trump and have slack belted some scary convex appleseed edges. Just found your channel today and have to subscribe. I'm staring at my small Sebenza with suspicion now. Good stuff here brother! 👍 😃
Holy crap! Absolutely brilliant idea with the treadmill motor. May have to do that myself. I slack belt using the grinder that I built, but it has a one speed motor and I can’t connect it to a rheostat.
Sorry I’ve got you looking suspiciously at your Semenza now. That was very funny.
Thanks so much for watching and I’m glad you enjoy the content. Thank you for subscribing.
Excellent video bud, thanks very much for sharing. 😊
Glad you liked it. Thank you for taking the time to watch and leaving me such a positive comment.
Nice video, thanks.
I have had similar results with a mouse pad, but you have to be more gentle as the foam is softer
I’m glad you liked it. I hope it gave you some good ideas. Mouse pads have a tendency to creep around too. The little apparatus that I came up with stays put and is much more predictable and reliable.
@@knifetimestory I agree, it seems more predictable as you have it
Very much appreciated. Always had a idea how to do it ! That gives me the confidence to give it a shot.
Fantastic. Thanks for letting me know. I hope it turns out great for you! Just take your time. It might take a couple hours.
@@knifetimestory thanks for the head's up.
Great video I used to do it like you did. Then I went to harbor freight and bought a 1x30 belt grinder$50 now every knife I have if it gets dull. It becomes convexed. Lol really can't tell how much better the edge is it will take a cheap knife and make it preform way above its pay grade. 😉
That is what I used to do as well. Most people don't want to spend too much for something like that. And, most would probably overheat or screw up the blade.
Thanks for watching. I appreciate it.
@@knifetimestory first I want to say I enjoy your videos and I really appreciate your taking the time to reply. That really means a lot to me.
Now my question, have you found one paper work better then another. I know I used to use Emory cloth in the mechanic field. But that stuff is very expensive. I personally don't have any fixed blades in super steels. I have tool steel 1060-1095 and the 440s. I'm not a fan of stainless in fixed blades most aren't tough enough for my abuse. I just wondering if you use a certain sand paper for the super steel stuff. I like your idea for maintaining my blades after I use my 1x30. I also saw a guy use a belt and a string to field sharpen. I'll try and link it for you.
Thank you for your kind words. That means a lot to Me.
As for the paper, I'd buy exactly what I showed on the video. It is purple and made by 3M. It's called Pro Grade Precision No-Slip. The backing has a rubbery texture. That works well in a couple ways. It is tough and somewhat more rigid than emery cloth. Also, the rubbery surface likes to cling to the rubber pad you attach it to. It's the best stuff I've found for this application.
I've used the edge of a car window to touch up a blade. Also used a tree branch as a strop. You stick your finger in some soil and rub it on the branch. It gives you just a little bit of grit to act as an abrasive. Only works if go in the proper direction though.
This was a fantastic video. Game changer for me. Sure I've watched Virtuovoice and the DBK boys go to town on the stones, effortlessly using some subtle wrist action to manifest an ungodly sharp edge convex edge, which I now know is the holy grail of all knife edges. Trying to replicate their technique, all I ended up doing is removing metal and creating a butter knife. BUUUUUUT with the foam, oh ho! All the convexing subtlety is built in! I'm using a combination of the 3M sheets from Lee Valley that give me a superb step down of grit, starting with 100 micron for "hogging" off metal all the way down to a .3micron, which I like to do on particular blades, when I'm avoiding housework and to want brag to friends...unsuprisingly, none of whom seem to care. Sigh. Perhaps you've been there. Anyway, I'm convexing everything in sight. Thought you should know. Thank-you so much for sharing your passion and insight.
Another comment I shared with my wife! Anytime I talk to her about a knife, her eyes gloss over. I love the fact that you learned something and thought that it was presented in such a way that you could replicate the result. I particularly love the part that you’re sharpening anything that you can find! Bravo! Keep at it! Then someday you’ll be like me and you can put a Scandivex edge on anything… In the pitch dark, after a couple of martinis and not have to go to the hospital!
@@knifetimestory Tremendous! Thank-you for the follow up reply. You're but one man, building an empire....how do you find the time!? I assume that what you take as your wife's eyes glossing over is simply her giving you her undivided attention. She might have to sell those Randalls one day....She's probably picked up more than she might be letting on. ;) Will find you in the comment sections of one of your videos again soon.
Just found your channel while researching convex grinds. I appreciate your attention to detail. Will sub. Also, i noticed you got light headed at one point, dont play around with blood pressure issues, could be a symptom of something serious. Stay well, stay sharp.
Glad you found my channel and find some value in it. I appreciate you saying so. As far as the light headedness, it's all good. Happens now and then if I let myself get dehydrated a little. I have very normal to lowish blood pressure. A few tall glasses of water and I'm back to normal...blood pressure that is. Thank you very much for your concern. I mean that in the greatest of sincerity!!
I have the Ken Onion with the Belt Grinder attachment but I would rather do my Bark River's by hand. Have been thinking of the best way to make a system cheap and this gave me some good ideas. Good Vid!!!
I really contemplated buying one of those after I saw it on Dutch Bushcraft. But I really feel I can do a better job even though it takes longer with my system. Plus I have that much more control.
Awesome video and demonstration. I only have stones never tried concexing a scandi. Might get a mora and give it a shot
Thank you so much for the kind comment. I really appreciate it. I wish you luck in your trying out my system.
I did this to a 511 Mora with some silicon carbide bench stones and then buffing with sandpaper and it came out pretty well. I have some nice convexes but I wanted a beater to experiment with. I'd suggest trying this to anyone interested in the grind, because you don't find many convex beaters out there, it's a high-end grind because you can't really bang 'em out. I wasn't sure about any of this at first, but once you get used to how it's maintained differently from other grinds you can appreciate its good qualities all the more. All zero-grinds are sharp, boy, and convex just gives it a bit more staying power.
Great thoughtful comment. I really appreciate it. So sorry for the delayed reply. It seems RUclips doesn’t always send notification when I come it was left. Even though they’re supposed to. Regardless… I am glad that you also have a nice way of creating a convex edge! I think they’re awesome!
@@knifetimestory No worries, I'm pleased just to get a response. I probably don't need to tell you that Mike Stewart at Bark River thinks convexes are awesome too, and really you don't find them much outside of the high-end producers. Axes and hatchets are mostly convexed too, and that tells you something about the physics and strength of the grind. You also find them in hard-use Japanese kitchen knives like the honesuki, which is meant for breaking down chickens.
@@mfreeman313 That’s interesting about the Japanese knives used for breaking down chickens. Thank you for that. As far as bark river knives goes, they really put convex edges on the map for the general hunting knife buying population. I really enjoy their knives!
Thank you , I will try this on my hultafors
Good luck! I sincerely hope it goes well!!
“We’re all still here.” 😂😂😂
Great video!
After sharpening knives with traditional edges for over 50 yrs I found it frustrating to get the knack of sharpening a knife with a convex edge. I’ve got some knives from ML Knives & he uses a convex edge. Also others from other makers.
Your demonstration & instructions work for me! 👍🏻. Thanks! Have a great day!! 👍🏻😀☘️☘️🇺🇸
Hey John. Thanks for letting me know it was helpful. I've been doing this stuff for so long that some of it just seems instinctual. So, I may leave a step out of not be clear. I hope I was and people can start getting some really nice convex edges on things.
Oh, and that was a whopper of a headrush. Thought I was headed for the ground on that one. For whatever reason, I decided to keep that in the video. Glad you liked it.
I have a S30 BHK, little scared but think I'll give it a try!
That is why I suggest doing it by hand with varying degrees of coarseness on the sandpaper. It keeps the project from “getting away from you“. It can be a little intimidating at first. But then you start to get the feel of it and the flow as you begin to see progress. Even now, when I start a new knife, those first half a dozen to a dozen slides across the paper are a little nerve-racking.
I’m going to start scandivexing. I love a flat scandi, but I’m so tired of getting the chips out.
Go for it. Hope it works out for you. I know for a fact that my Scandivexed blades hold up longer than my pure Scandi blade.
Wow, those hairs jumped of your hand at the end. Did you actually shave them off or were they just that scared of that scandi vex edge?!? 😲
Excellent video.
Ha ha ha! Yep, scared!! A good Scandivex edge is quite the thing to be reckoned with!
I tried your method and it's amazing! But I am not getting scratches in one direction, because when putting the knife on the paper or lifting it, it ruins the scratch pattern. Do you have any tips on how to deal with that? I am a very keen knife sharpener, have been sharpening for years and I have no problems sharpening convex on stones to hair splitting sharpness, so I am used to the sharpening motion.
Using a very worn out piece of 400 grit is where I would start. And then you have to go back and forth and then lift the knife while you were still moving in one direction so that there’s no opportunity for the knife to go sideways or any other direction. Like a airplane lifting off of the runway.
@@knifetimestory thanks I will give it a try!! Have you used other types of sandpaper? It is hard to get the good 3m abrasives where I live and I only have some cheap metal sandpaper at the moment. Do you think it makes a difference?
And another question: are there other videos of you using this sharpening method? I am very interested:)
1. Yes, the rubber backed paper is the only way to go. Really keeps it in place.
2. Hmmm. I don't think so. I usually don't do "tutorial" type stuff as it is very time consuming and I am impatient and like to just get at a project and sharpen something or fix something without the bother of having to move a camera around.
Hello, loved the video! Was wondering if you do the “rocking” motion on all steps, or just the 400 grit and toward the end? For example, do you just pull the knife (like a stropping motion) with coarse grinds and then push and pull with higher grit? Also, are there any extra points to consider for the belly and tip of the knife? Seems like I always see people raising the knife a little for that angle, but not sure if that’s an acquired skill or something you instruct on per se. Anyway - thanks again, really liked this video!
Thank you for the very kind words. I truly appreciate it.
I do a subtle rocking motion the entire time. How much you rock and how hard you push down, dictate how much of a curvature there will be to the scandivex edge. I will advise that I over exaggerated the rocking motion for purposes of demonstration. So keep that in mind.
Secondly, using this method, you really should never at any point create much of a wire edge. If you find that is happening, then you are rocking too far. Most of my scandivex edge is created with pressure. Remember, the pad is semi soft and will give in and the fixture is flexible and will also give. So that does the majority of the work for you. If you were using a solid stone, you would have to rock a lot.
The beauty of doing it this way is you can after a pass or two, see exactly where you are touching the blade and should you need to make an adjustment, it is easy to do and then continue on. you will know how far to angle the knife at all points on the blade because you will be getting instant feedback as to where you are on the blade when you look at your progress ever few passes. That is the best way to describe it.
The bottom line is that this is a very controlled way to produce a very keen and even scandivex edge. It takes time, but the end result is amazing and VERY gratifying.
Because I've been doing it for so long, I may just take certain finer points for granted and forget to pass them along. Please let me know if I sufficiently answered your question. If not, don't hesitate to ask more questions.
Awesome Video! How would you compare this technique to wetstone sharpening? Would it work just as well on wetstone?
A Whetstone is much too hard to accomplish what I demonstrated in the video. First of all you can’t get that many different grit of whetstone. And second of all you don’t get the benefit of the soft surface to help convex the edge. So I would not recommend it.
Thinking about turning a mora garberg stainless into a scandivex
I'd definitely do it to the Stainless version because I feel the stainless could use the extra thickness right behind the edge. I never did it to mine, but I am slowly doing it to my Carbon version. Every time it needs an edge touch up, I use my soft flexible pad to do the sharpening. The knife is already tough enough that it did not need me to take it to the grinder extreme or even the pad and start with 60 grit and work my way down to 400. If I was going to do the stainless one, personally I'd start with the grinder, but if you don't have that, the other way will work just fine. Just be patient.
I just stumbled across this video, great job 👍 so what kind of knife grinder do you have?
I actually made both of mine. One is a small 1 inch belt grinder, the second is a 2 x 72“. Both give me the opportunity to work right off of the wheel, or slack belt.
Glad you stumbled upon me, thank you very much for watching and taking the time to comment. That was thoughtful!
@@knifetimestory very cool, I have both as well lol however I bought mine. Its very satisfying when a project comes out right lol check mine out ruclips.net/video/CY2uLIq1C9Q/видео.html
I have a Elmax Trapper that I’ve wanted to raise the grind height for so time... What’s kept me from it is imagining how long it would take with such a steel. Being it was just easier to go get another blade...I now have many...lol - Still, it would be nice to have an estimated time... Thanks
Give yourself a couple hours. Don't be shy keeping with the 60 grit paper to do a lot of initial removal. Then work your way down. It seems daunting at first, but once you start making a dent in it, it gets even more gratifying. You can really start to feel a difference in the way the blade bites into the paper. Have fun with it.
I've been trying to locate a Enzo trapper not a lot out there unfortunately
No there are not. You are right. But they are under a different name now. Try BRISA. Same exact knife, just they’re putting a different name on it now.
Do you think you can have the same results on a whetstone?
Hi,
Absolutely not. Whetstone is solid. The whole idea behind my rig is that the pad is flexible and the base of the pad is flexible thereby conforming naturally to make a convex or Scandivex edge.
Thanks for watching, and thank you for subscribing. I appreciate that!
@@knifetimestory ok I got it. Thanks
@@P.J.Thompson Cool. I hope you give it a try.
Best strop for cheap. Rub sides of nostrils for oil and rub on calf muscle. Flex ur calf and strop
That is amazing! 😂😂
Would this work with a garberg?
Absolutely. I've slowly begun the process on my Carbon version.
Wanna try this with my garberg... just for kicks.. I hate that knife
What about the Garberg do you not like? I have one in Carbon and actually like it. The one I have in Stainless I could do without. Too chippy and bendy at the edge. Love to hear more from you.
@@knifetimestory I have the carbon version as well... I like the ergos of it.. aesthetically speaking, it’s nice. I can’t say for sure what it is... it just doesn’t perform like a typical Mora. Perhaps the edge geometry isn’t the best? I think with the thicker blade, the scandi grind needs to be a little higher.. maybe a scandivex is the answer
@@csarebel8657 I would not give up on that knife. I have beat the absolute living crap out of mine and it is still an awesome knife. I would give it a try on the ScandiVex. You might become a believer!
@@knifetimestory I have a few moras, and I’ve been fond of their knives since I bought my first companion, several years ago.... my garberg just has not performed the way I expected it to. I can baton with it, sure.. but I’d like to be able to carve with it as well. It was not “Mora sharp” out of the box either. Not what I have come to expect from Morakniv. It would barely feather stick.... I’ve been tweaking it here and there the past 8 or 9 months.. so I still have hope for it!
@@csarebel8657 Don’t give up hope. Mine was not the usual MOR a sharp out of the box either. Especially towards the tip after the belly curve. Given it a good convex treatment will definitely help. I do prefer the handle comfort of the Companion. I know the steel they use is the same in both the carbon Companion and Garberg. I even have the robust version with an orange handle. But it seems to suffer from edge roll whereas the Garberg hasn’t budged. Maybe there’s been some fluctuation in heat treat. But I’ve had a couple orange ones just not perform up to snuff.
"Scandi-vex" is a made up term. Mike Stewart is not using it. In fact, he claims that "scandi grind" is also not a correct terminology for a shallow sabre grind.
ScandiVex is indeed a made up term. That is how some words actually start. Just like if I was to say the word SpydieHole you would know what I was talking about. Or…Spydiebenza.
So, thank you very much on the linguistics lesson.
I do appreciate you watching, and taking the time out of your very busy day and schedule to leave me a comment.
@@knifetimestory Wow man... you took this month's Grand Prix for Social Networks Passive Aggressiveness of the Month. And the month hasn't even started yet. Here is a like for you. Feel better now?
Thank you. I'm very pleased to win some sort of award. I am basically an knucklehead who makes videos for the fun of making videos. My entire working life was such that in order to do what I did, I needed a ZFG sort of attitude and just have never learned to turn that off.
Thank you for being a good sport and the "like". I actually sincerely appreciate it.
Take care,
Tom
@@knifetimestoryHere is another like for you.
@@airpaprika Thank you again! Take care!