Has Wizards Learned From Their Past Mistakes?
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- Опубликовано: 7 ноя 2024
- After endless missteps over the past few years, WoTC has slowly (and painfully) been trying to turn things around with the TTRPG community. Is it too little, too late, or are they actually making inroads and turning things around?
Join Stephen and Mark from Roll For Combat and Derik Malenda from @KnightsofLastCall as we discuss this topic in depth!
About Roll For Combat:
Hosted by Stephen Glicker and Mark Seifter, Roll For Combat delivers news and commentary from a business point of view. We host a weekly live show every Wednesday at 3:00 pm EDT and host a wide variety of guests from the gaming industry. We talk about role-playing games, movies, TV, video games, and more.
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#dnd #dungeonsanddragons #wotc #hasbro 
Развлечения
18:20 What Derik is, I think, intentionally forgetting is that there was a level of trust between WotC and the creators based around the OGL, and attempting to remove the OGL purely for the purpose of grabbing cash, even from the big players like Netflix and Critical Role, convinced the rest of us that we were wrong to trust them.
Sure, they've given us a new OGL. But now we know how they feel about their promises. And we no longer trust them.
Paizo stepped up and became the hero here with the ORC, and I'm never looking back... my Pathfinder / Starfinder shelf is growing, and all my WotC stuff is relegated to a box in the corner.
A common experience. Many went to Paizo after abandoning WOTC and will never, ever go back.
Every time I hear about these types of issues, all I think is that it could all be solved by better communication.
If WOTC had internally communicated better with their PR/Marketing/Lawyers, the RUclipsrs wouldn't have gotten copy striked.
If WOTC had correctly communicated the limitations on what people were allowed to show, no copy strikes.
If WOTC had sent out updated communications around the NDA after they started selling the books at Gen Con, there would be even more buzz about the books.
Communication is the most important thing in a company and in life, and prevents so many misunderstandings, assumptions, and confusion. I know that they're a big company, but the marketing department needs to take ownership of these debacles and the communication missteps they've been making.
I just came here to say: No. No WOTC hasn't.
@@lore_shards Indeed. I’m surprised this will be a 2-hour discussion. The answer is no. They haven’t listened to DMs. They’ve accidentally made more broken combos and wilfully inserted power creep. They’re going full steam ahead with digital and AI and will keep lying about that fact.
Here’s what they’ve learnt: the Magic Arena app made them money. That’s it.
@@monodescarado yep. Down with WoTC all hail DC20 and Shadowdark
I'm glad of all the WotC controversy and the OGL scandal, I might be stuck playing 5E only, and now I have explored other RPGs and different systems from 10 Candles to Chronicles of Darkness to Pathfinder 2E to Avatar Legends, OSR Titles like Shadowdark and Mausritter, and even smaller indie RPG systems like Xeno. And now I can be excited about stuff to come like DC20, Cosmere, or other systems.
You have too much time on your hands
I wonder how much OGL controversy affected the opening of the D&D movie. That may have cost millions. Unfortunately the ones responsible are typically in the position to fail upwards.
Derek: "WotC didn't make a mistake! They did this intentionally!"
also Derek: "No matter what WotC's mistakes, they'll be fine."
Derek, Jeremy will be sending you your check soon. Enjoy it!
It’s sad to see the decline of WOTC in real time. My group has been playing D&D for over 40 years and we switched to PF2 last year. We are never going back. The best TTRPGs are from other publishers not 5E.
Love hearing Derik talk about 4e :)
50:20 the analogy here isn't quite equivalent. It falls apart at the fact that Hasbro/WotC sent out the complete copy to reviewers. Studios don't send reviewers full copies of the movie or an entire streaming series with the only clear restriction seeming to be to not make content about it before a given date. In fact all most studios do is send clips to be talking points. If they didn't want their book shown and talked about in its entirety they shouldn't have sent it out en masse to content creators.
Oh no, did I just agree with Derik on something?
Mr. Stark? I don't feel so good.
1:46 Stephen's desk is a Big L
But the bookshelf is several Big Ws
Blizzard having add-ons for WoW for people actually making the game for them sounds a lot like Foundry Modules
6e is a nightmare for DM's, given the ridiculously OP PC's, that are an order of magnitude more powerful than 5e PC's. And of course, the 6e MM is not out for 6 months. The leaders at micro-wotc are morons.
Let's go Mets!
I was already looking forward to the art in the Player's Handbook, but listening to some of your praises on how good the artwork is makes me look forward to it all the more!
WOTC hasn't learned anything, but they're hoping that we forget EVERYTHING. Never giving them another dollar.
Not to mention the continual gaslighting as they push towards with digital and AI.
If there's one thing that's true, it's that there will always be some controversy or screw up to talk about when it comes to Hasbro and WotC.
no matter how har dWOTC creators fight for good will ther eis a 3rd party lawyer throwing a wrench in the machine
You guys are fun to watch. Thanks. Very insightful.
I think I am going to enjoy the new starter chapter. The example play with the side bars talking about what you just read will really help make the connections, at least it will be that way for me.
i agree, its veyr helpful, but almost too little to lat,e how many poeple now jsut pull up RUclips live plays, Acq Inc, Critical Role and tons of youtube advice how to videos?
@@badmojo0777 I have been lost in these videos myself. So much so that I have found that I don't play because there is no way I could do what these professionals can do. Its intimidating and not really the point of the game. I feel like this will provide something that these videos don't to. Don't get me wrong, I have seen a few videos that helped "teach" the game. But then I am stuck in the learning loop because one person says do it this way, another says do it that way. Where the books show an example, explains what happens and you make your own decision on what to do.
I always appreciate the inside information/insight Stephen brings. Also I want a bookcase like that.
love the topic!!! and would love to make the book travel to the other end of the continent to get me XD
That bookcase looks so good! I keep thinking I want to do something like that, but that is super extensive!
Derik is my spirit animal. Always love hearing his takes on things. Also I've had the best memories running 4E Dnd
Looking forward to the new elemental beastiary!
Mark's pretty wild with the single dragon poster. Too wild for my tastes. :) White walls only! Maybe a cream-coloured Postcard taped to the wall, ivory if you want to really let your hair down. That's it! (just kidding - I'm a fan of Mark's work and appreciate how a cluttered shelf is exhausting to look at. I keep them out of sight and off my mental camera as well.) (and that is a pretty cool poster)
Stephen Glicker as a sub for Gump totally makes sense hahaha. I always enjoy your streams!
Those dice mimics are very cool.
Stephen shows common sense when it comes to posting stuff online. If you are in doubt, always contact the owner before posting it. Being cautious should always come first when it comes to legal matters. Sure you may win in court, but it may bankrupt you too.
Great video and analysis on the state of the TTRPG hobby.
Great talk! Based takes from Mark as usual. Question for Stephen: If they come out with a D&D musical, would you go see it? If you had a say in what goes in it, what would it be about?
I really like the RFC shows. I get so much info
I've found myself having to take a step back, breathe a bit, and sort of find my zen before addressing questions such as "has Wizards learned from their past mistakes?".
Mostly because I really don't need or desire one more thing in my life/society that becomes extremely divisive where there is no middle ground nor space to have balanced conversations where understanding is more important than converting others.
I think most of these decisions come from on high; the C-suite who is not used to providing services/products that TTRPG's demand. It's not like a video game where you release it, and its up to the community to like/dislike; before moving onto the next shot in the dark game. TTRPG's are living systems upon which all future content is built upon; so a bit more understanding and care is required when dealing with the community.
Never before have WoTC found itself in such a robust symbiotic ecosystem. Before they could set the narrative, with the community being disjointed and only communicating in small groups in person and online. But now, conversations are being held globally and including more community members than they ever have in the past.
And yes, content creators make money off WoTC products; let's be honest here. This channel, among all the others makes money by creating and producing "bolt on" additions to WoTC's products. Absolutely NOTHING wrong with that. But WoTC got a new President who felt their products were being under-monetized. And surely some moves were put into motion in the background to take back some of that revenue (OGL etc). But those creators make content that WoTC fails to make time and time again. Those creators also create hype for WoTC products; paid or not. That's not a broken relationship that WoTC wants to experience (and we shouldn't want that either).
We have to accept that WoTC and all their properties are owned by Hasbro. It'll never be exactly what any of us want. They cannot learn from past mistakes because they aren't in the driver's seat most of the time. Just take a look at the recent "revision"... in two years they've accomplished what I could've accomplished on my own (as a non-developer) in about 6 months. Why? Because they are dealing with something internally that is moving goal posts and crapping on the pipeline.
learning from mistakes =/= changing your Modis Operandi for future decisions
If 5.24 (or whatever its being called) is considered anywhere near successful from their standpoint... then no mistake or lesson matters. Why? They have no less than another decade to make another edition; and a lot can be forgotten in a decade.
The issue at this point is all the common things that any big company does is now taken as if only WotC is doing.
All companies have skeletons of their own in different ways everywhere.
We just came to know about WotC skeletons cause of OGL thing.
But the issue with the community is they are seeing everything WotC does with the same lens now.
Creators and employees of WotC are being hackled as well by everywhere online.
The people who doesn't know about WotC controversy and just love D&D are being cursed at for playing D&D.
People need to understand D&D is a small part of WotC/Hasbro. By hurting D&D sales or D&D beyond subscriptions you don't hurt WotC/Hasbro at all
I did learn from WotC's mistakes : I won't buy anything from them in the foreseeable future.
new CEO is from Blizzard... any more questions?
Derik nicely stating to not bite the hand that feeds you.
Until they give up the d&d IP or make it a situation where the the NAME d&d is more of a creative commons where they own the basic system & IP(Ravenloft , greyhawk, toril and all that), but you can make "Roll For Combat's Dungeons & Dragons " and I can make "Anarchic Archnid's dungeon and dragons" much like you can make your own Sherlock or now Mickey Mouse , using the 1.0a OGL as a basis , I'd be down to reexamine where I believe WotC is as a franchise.
Stephen for President! :D
You guys make some amazing content. The books. These videos. Thanks for being great stewards of the games we love!
The nice thing about EDH is that it's so tunable to play group. WOTC can power creep the cards all they want, but it doesn't stop me from making my 5th deck around Armageddon Clock
Definitely interested in this topic
Whether or not they've learned, I have. I won't be buying anything from them. I might buy the new books from the secondary market though.
Even without the giveaway this is a strictly better episode than usual
Like the book shelves
Lmao, “Derek Doesn’t Have One!” That Was Great xD
Kraken dice set with a Kraken rum, Kraken open a new phb. Mistakes to check and learn from
I can't believe people are surprised someone stitched the new PHB together from a youtube video, the same thing happened to Shadowrun and that game is way less popular than D&D
Do you think the new 2024 books would be a good update for an after school program or better to stay with the 2014 for now?
Great info ❤you’re u guys
I look forward to winning a PHB!
Let's see if they can at least go a few months without stepping in it to see if they have learned anything. Really enjoy your content and insight
WotC won't learn before they go bankrupt. And I can't wait until they do.
Even if they learn from their mistakes, it will take a long time to gain back the trust of the community after everything they've done.
As a retired educator I learned very early on in my career that the best way to teach the apparent “unreachable” is to ignore them.
Yes and no. They've learned, buttttt they keep finishing new ways to screw up
Are the copies you're giving away signed by Jeremy Crawford?
I believe Jeremy only signed his copy
As a Shadowrun fan says "No Corp is the best Corp!"
How much did BG3 make compared to made from the D&D books?
Larry Elmore is such a great talkative person, an art streamer i watch has talked with him for like 8 hours on 1 stream, and like 4 hours in another stream!
The Epic game store should be dead and buried, according to what people said when it was announce but it is still going!
Even many creators know that Piracy will happen, but ask people that get their game to pay for it, if they love it!
I swear it's like they don't even play-test anything.
i recall AD&D had a section on how to run scifi in D&D. Is that going to be a thing in 2024 D&D?
There is plenty of material found in 'Expedition to Barrier Peaks.' There is even flow charts for characters making an attempt with unfamiliar technology.
I don't dislike the design team, but the Hasbro C-suite are the worst.
I am happy Jordan got the strike taken off.
No.
Can WotC really change while they are part of Hasbro? I would be surprised.
Is time the WoTC monolopy ends. Crossing fingers.
I wish Derek could at least name Pirate software if he is going to use his quotes of "a designer"
Not certain that WOTC can ever really change while being a part of HASBRO
Crawford signed edition go ahead and keep that, but send me your other books!
They continue to make them and look even more foolish each time
"The only thing we learn from history is that we learn nothing from history."
I am really looking forward to being disappointed as I was the 5e - I was expecting the new version to be rubbish, and was pleasantly surprised at how good it was - I hope the same will happen with 5.5...
Here is my comment. I hope to see a day when WotC isn't making mistakes that they then have to learn from.
No. Saved you 2 hours.
No. They have not. Just look at all of the woke artwork in the new PHB
So depressing that D&D is pushing THIS hard to make people go digital. It should never be the be-all-and-end-all.
I'll save you two hours, the answer is "No".
3rd party rpgs die of obscurity, not undercut by piracy. It is a whole different kettle of fish to talk about Shadow Dark and WotC. Heck, some content creators are paid to share it because no one outside of a very select sub group even know what Shadow Dark is. Not throwing stones; it is just a sub group of a sub group. The cashier at the post office is likely to not know what the Dungeons & Dragons stamps is referencing, so they stand no chance of knowing what Shadow Dark is. Showing every page does not cost them money because there is no one willing to squint through a screen capped game that they never heard of.
does not sound like it
We can only see Mark's wall now. Hehe.
There are streamers who do that
Just subscribed before this live And was not able to comment during the video. Hopefully I can have some good JuJu and win the PHB2024.
It's important to remember WotC doesn't actually exist. What actually does exist are a bunch of people, legal code, and the drive of people to consume and survive. WotC can't learn, but people in the network of interactions we call WotC can.
Don't send out complete PDFs; send out literally only what you WANT to be shared. Why is this so difficult? You had all the time in the world to curate what would be shared in said PDF 🤷♀
They haven't lol
Tales of the valiant is much better actualitation
I don't thinkbWOTC has learned. Their all about the VTT and are trying to make as much money off all fans of D&D. They will continue use the community to their means on making money.
A guy like Stephen Glicker or Professor Dungeon Master would be 2 good people that WOTC should use as a consultant on communicating with fans from who are into TTRP as oppose to the VTT. Personally I am.not into VTT, I started playing D&D in the 80s and got back into it 5 years ago. The You Tube community was a huge boost in helping me to understand the rules and recommendations on DMing games. Bottom line WOTC doesn't understand the TTRP Community.
No, The end.
Microtransactions are a dopamine response like gambling
Do we need to comment to win again? 😉
before the slime tutorials the play cams were on porn hub.
RUclipsrs who do that
TLDR. ....
No no they haven't learned sh!t😅
🐙📉
Is Derik being deliberately obtuse?
The whole OGL thing was stupid on the part of the community...it was wrong to give in to the pressure from some cry babies. The material is owned by the company and it they were nice to open it up. They had the right to change stance on it, and it was a bad business move, fine. But the fact is people today seem to think they are entitled to what doesnt belong to them...that bothers me.
Um.... WOTC hasn't, won't, etc.,
I think Derik should have done some homework before he showed up. He seems like a dismissive apologist.
This Derik guy clearly wants to argue semantics rather than having an honest discussion. It's SUCH an annoying character trait. "All's well that ends well?" absolutely not. If someone tries to murder you and your family, and just so happen to miss, doesn't mean you give them a high five and go your separate ways. That is the dumbest thing I ever heard. That saying only applies to something done ON ACCIDENT... not corporate scheming and maneuvering or intentional behavior/decisions. Its not a blanket moral stance on life. (not a wise one at least)
Mark, I respect you but the slogan is janky.
The slogan is definitely kind of weird, but Stephen told me I'm supposed to say it so I do. 🤣
No.