It Never Snows in September | Military History Book Review
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- Опубликовано: 30 июн 2024
- The German view of Operation Market Garden and the Battle of Arnhem September 1944 by Robert J. Kershaw.
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i visit one of the last remaining paratroopers from operation market garden, Dennis collier harrogate, what an interesting man he is indeed, he gave me this book saying. it is the most accurate account of the event, a fantastic read and a brilliant man. i believe he is 94 and recalls the experience with such clarity
That's awesome. Have you shown him my documentary on Market Garden? I wonder what he'd think of that ruclips.net/video/vTUC79o4Kmc/видео.html
The German ability to mash random units together into a coherent fighting force is one of the factors that caused the war to drag on as long as it did
Hi your channel is excellent! Great idea with a book review I have really been thinking about which books I should read about market garden. So thanks a lot, great videos!
Excellent as always. Many thanks TIK.
Glad you liked it Barry!
Thanks for the book review TIK! I picked it up earlier this week and look forward to reading the experience from the other side.
+Gary Thomas Great! Let me know how you find it :) I've just gone on a spending spree and bought several new history books... Think I'm addicted to buying new ones - I'm never going to have time to read them all lol
Another great video by our glorious commander happy holidays TIK hope your delivery job isn't stressing u out to much also good to see everyone again it's good to have this small little community of ours and I look forward to a new year of it
Happy holidays to you too Gamer! Hope you didn't drink too much vodka ;) It is stressful... love having days off so I can work on videos like this though. I definitely appreciate everyone who watches and comments on my videos, especially you. I didn't want to make the standard "new year update video" so thought I'd do something new to show my gratitude and prove that I'm still here, despite real-life getting in the way a lot of the time
Yeah much vodka was drank it was great one of the wishes I made(in my family w always make 3 wishes for next year) that we could all meet up and just talk about the one thing we all share a common interest in world war 2 and Learn more about each other it would be nice
It is a superb book. I have read it on several occasions and it remains a remarkable analysis of the German response to Operation Market-Garden. It's detail and layout is first-class, and the reader is allowed to see events from the 'other side of the hill'. Wonderful!
interesting with review of historical books. I would love to see this along with your lets plays :)
ps. the kindel version is the same as the "bad" version at least if you buy it on amazone.
pss. he has also written the book "A Street in Arnhem" its not from the british view only but follows the battle seen from the dutch cvilians and resistance, the germans and the english paras.
EVERYBODY LIKE REX'S COMMENT SO PEOPLE CAN SEE - the Kindle version is the same as the bad version
Not read A Street in Arnhem! I'll have to invest in it. Also just noticed he's written books on the Western Desert Campaign... think I might treat myself to some more books of his :)
I'm trying to balance Panzer Corps, Documentaries, these new book reviews, and possible do some Close Combat videos again. It's hard finding time though
hey TIK i wishing this book thanks to your review, for my birthday in 7 days - i hope i get it so i can read it over the summer :-)
Rex1987 the "A Street in Arnhem" one or It Never Snows in September? And happy birthday for 7 days time, mate :)
***** lol i just remembered my birthday is on the 16th not the 14th :P i am REALLY getting old :D
the "Never Snows in September" one :-)
Thank you for the information!
@TIK
Thanks for this excellent review on a book I myself have read and can highly recommend for anybody seriously interested in the subject of Operation Market - Garden. One does get the impression from this book that we should not neglect the fact that the battle was not only an Allied defeat, but a resounding German victory.
The Germans had over run de supply dropping zone and were probably using captured British (smoke and other visual) signal equiptment. But whatever they were signalling they would not receive any request like water. The supplies were prepacked before the operation and the RAF dropped what was planned. In the supplies that fell within the British lines there were also boxes with capbadges, pegasus sleeve badges, office supplies,and just like the wellknown scene from the movie A bridge too far, red berets. All this stuff would be needed if the operation would have been a succes.
Kershaws book is one of the few English written books. There are quite a few German languish books and articles to be found. Several he included in his book.
I have the old copy, and it is one of my top 10 WW2 books.
Thanks mate for shedding light on this book to others, it really is a unique perspective on the tactical response to the enormous allied force.
Yeah, it makes you look at the battle in a different way.
Have you seen my documentary on Market Garden? I referred to this book quite a lot to get the position of the German units on the map
I am spending the weekend watching them. My father gave me the book, he would have enjoyed your videos.
I'm about half way through this at the minute and combined with the battlestorm video you made it's making a lot more sense. Great book so far though.
I read this book around 6 months ago and cannot recommend it enough. As said in the video, it is a rare insight into the battle from the German's perspective and it is extremely well researched and written. I loved it.
I'm always amazed at what the Germans were able to accomplish in WWII, particularly in 1944-45. They put up a dang good fight against impossible odds.
+gumbo yes they did. They conquered Europe in a couple years, and it took four years for everyone else to take it back.
I feel the same way about the Japanese. The sheer coordination of those early offensives - those early victories, with such massive distances. It's very impressive when you sit and think on it.
@@fuzzydunlop7928 The axis powers certainly took the world by suprise.
Holy hell... you reviewed this book? Why didn't I notice that until now?
I got it (the bad one) I think 15 years ago now. And I have loved it ever since. It is so filled with gripping and heartbreaking stories, superb details and unsurprisingly perspectives that I never knew I lacked.
It is interesting you mention the cutting of the road by the handful of, were it Jagdpanthers? Well, that attack stuck in my mind as well. It was something I had never heard about before. It was completely 'forgotten' in traditional write ups... Something of that magnitude, ignored! It's appalling, and no Historian worth his salt can claim to have done a good job and overlook such a thing. Ruining the supply lines and messing up the road with wreckage would slow even normal armies, but one confined to so few avenues of progress? Disastrous. And yet forgotten.
d'oh, got half way through your review and decided to order it based upon the praise you were giving. Opened up another browser window and quickly ordered the latest version (with black and white cover). Literally as i paid, i got to the bit of the review saying i ought to have ordered the previous edition. Oh well - i can live withou the maps i suppose - i'm sure it will still be a great read. Thanks for the recommendation! :)
TIK mate where can i buy that jumper?
I'm a big fan and have seen all your historical videos. Just wanted to say thanks for producing the great content and keep it up.
I will look for this book. Thank you
One vote for more book reviews. Newcomer to your channel, how the hell did I not see this before now??
I'm surprised that Martin Middlebrook's "Arnhem 1944" isn't included on your list. It covers the battle at Arnhem (from the British side, mostly) with an astounding amount of detail. It's typical of his work.
It is an excellent book.
Thanks for this. I'm purchasing this book now.
Great! Hope you enjoy it :)
Hi TIK! I hope you will be covering more stories from the vanquished.
+Gary Thomas I will, hopefully :) I like to visualize a battle from both sides, but it's difficulty relying on books from one language :(
The Market Garden video was the first one that I watched and it was brilliant. There is another book by Kershaw about this op called 'A Street in Arnhem', about the battle from the Dutch civilians point of view. I've not read it, but I found it on Kindle, which has got the new version of 'It never snows in September'. Good vid, cheers.
I appreciate the list of 3 books. If you could just do this kind of list for every battle in wwii, thanks!
: )
I read it back in the early 90s and found it to be a fascinating read.
Hey TIK i know this inst a close combat video but i have a quick question. Are you able to spectate 1v1 multiplayer battles? because i am going to start a tournament and was wondering if I was going to be able to spectate the battles.
A very good review. Coincidentally I'd been reading up on the whole campaign and came across your 'long' video, which I think brings out many of the points. I was going for my medical in Rochester and my doctor is an ex para whose father was a doctor in the paras at Arnhem. Colonel Kershaw was also an ex para who did a lot of the battlefield tours with Major Waddy. I think that sometimes having a soldiers perspective is the way to a better book. In the same way Major General Mike Reynolds book on Frundsberg and Hohenstaufen has some reference to the fighting around Arnhem. It's a shame that the film makers couldn't bring themselves to use the surviving SS officers as advisers (particularly I'm thinking of Brigadefuher Harmel). Mike Reynolds does say in his introduction to Leibstandarte that many of the real heroes of the battlefield wore black! So, yes... a knowledge of both sides is essential to forming an overall view. A good review of an excellent book.
Tik, love the way you walk us through the world war, would request you plz do series on korean war, 6 day war, vietnam war, i feel you could do justice to see new perspective. Thanks in advance
Have you read "The Devil's Birthday: The Bridges to Arnhem, 1944" by Geoffrey Powell. I found it very comprehensive.
Great book got it for my birthday this year!
Great book. I bought it a number of years ago. Really enjoyed it.
Do you plan to make Battlestorm on the pacific theater ?
Great review. Kershaw has actually written a book that tells the story from the german, the british and the dutch civilians side. A STREET IN ARNHEM. Great read!
Remember that the general in command of the German forces at and around Arnhem was Walter Model. Hitler's "Fireman." Undoubtedly Model was the best commander the Germans could have had at this battle.
Oh yes. Surprisingly though, he's not really mentioned much in many of the texts, beyond making the decision where to place units on the first day.
in my opinion the troop quality didn't matter much because the Germans were defending and trying to prevent the British paratroopers from reaching the Arnhem bridge. For a general commander there's not much to do after the pieces are put in place. Of course he has to send reinforcements and order withdrawals where neccessary but on the whole he just has to sit back and await reports. A relative comparison would be the "Battle of the Bulge" where in the Northern sector a handful of engineers succesfully delayed and stalled Peiper's armoured assault. The choice of terrain in this part of the battle was as strange as it was for the British at Arnhem.
Adding to that: now if the Allies had had overwhelming air superiority and close air support over Arnhem, things may have gone very differently. Because then German defenses blocking the paratroopers' advance could be pin-pointed and blasted one after the other and German troop movement would have been next to impossible. I don't know for sure, but probably Arnhem was too far behind enemy lines to do this.
@@AudieHolland also a lot of planes were used for the drops of men and supplies, but yeah why not more fighter support?
@@markjamesrodgers Well, they never had enough transport planes. That was why they sent in the airbornes on seperate drops.
If the Allies had been correct in their assumptions that Germany could only field old men and boys, that would have been enough I guess.
A little out of date now (1990) but an essential foundation course together with Cornelius Ryan's A Bridge Too Far (1974). It's the first book on the German side of the operation. Possibly a publishing decision and not Rob Kershaw's, but he translates the German nomenclature into English instead of preserving the proper names and providing a glossary. This can make further research difficult, as many unit identifications are ambiguous, especially in the Reserve Army and because of the many temporary ad hoc kampfgruppen (battlegroups).
One correction on TIK's video - Division 406, aka Division zbv 406 (zbv = zur besonderen Verwendung = for special deployment) was a pre-existing administrative headquarters, just a small office basically, in the Wehrkreis VI (Military District 6) HQ based in Münster (Westphalia, bordering the Netherlands region around Nijmegen). It was mobilised in the first week of September 1944 under the 'Valkyrie' Plan (see the 2008 Tom Cruise film 'Valkyrie' for how the military districts are organised and the Valkyrie Plan was first used to stage a coup against Hitler back in July 1944) and deployed in the northern sector of the Westwall, where it terminated in the Reichswald forest near the Dutch city of Nijmegen. This is the reason it came into contact with the US 82nd Airborne division on 17 September, but it was not really equipped to be operational and even had to requisition civilian transport like cars and busses to move the division HQ to Geldern. After the airborne landings, they had to move again to Kleve, nearer the landings. It had a collection of training units and home guard type militia battalions under command, with none of the usual infantry division service units and logistics to support them - they were all 'depot' units in British terminology.
Perhaps the biggest error in Kershaw is that he's not a German armour expert and doesn't know his StuGs from his Jagdpanzer IVs, so unfortunately copied wholesale Wilhelm Tieke's mistake of placing SS-Sturmbannfürer Erwin Franz Rudolf Röstel's SS-Panzerjäger-Abteilung 10 in the southern sector of the MARKET GARDEN corridor near the town of VALKENSWAARD, when it was actually detached to 7.Armee at Aachen near the town of VALKENBURG just east of Maastricht, fighting the US 1st Army with all 21 Jagdpanzer IV/L48 vehicles. The four StuG IIIG assault guns Kershaw believes were detached from Röstel's unit and sent to Nijmegen were from SS-Obersturmführer Franz Riedel's 7./SS-Panzer-Regiment 10, so Wilhelm Tieke (In The Firestorm of the Last Years of the War - II.SS-Panzerkorps, 1975) made an error that has caught out Rob Kershaw and many others as well. The reason the II.Abteilung of the 9 and 10.SS-Panzer-Regiments were formed with StuGs in the 7 and 8.Kompanien was a legacy of being raised as panzergrenadier-divisions in 1943, and then Hitler ordered them converted to panzer-divisions. The StuG Abteilung was then rolled into the new Panzer-Regiment and made up for a lack of Mark IV tanks to make up the numbers in the II.Abteilung. The StuGs that were seen in the southern MARKET GARDEN corrider near Valkenswaard were from an army unit - Heeres schwere.Panzerjäger-Abteilung 559.
Despite the errors, I still rate this impressive body of work as a solid 80%, and for many readers it would be 80% of knowledge they didn't have before reading the book. The other 20% can be corrected by reading more recent works on specific German units, if the reader wants to dive even deeper.
I haven't read TIK's other recommended book by Robin Neillands, but another option is to jump ahead to something really up to date, and that is Swedish historian Christer Bergström's excellent update of Cornelius Ryan's research in Arnhem 1944: An Epic Battle Revisited vols 1 and 2 (2019, 2020). I didn't know that A Bridge Too Far (1974) was rushed to publication unfinished because of Ryan's terminal cancer, but I have since found that some of the interviews in his documentation in the online Cornelius Ryan Collection at Ohio State University is bibliographed in A Bridge Too Far, but the story the interviewee told doesn't appear anywhere in the text. Bergström also includes the untold story of the operation's compromise at Nijmegen on the first day, first exposed by RG Poulussen's Lost At Nijmegen (2011) and was completely missing in Ryan and (inexcusably) the recent 2018 Beevor book on Arnhem - both aimed at the lucrative American market no doubt.
As TIK recommends, get the large format paperback (or even hardback if you can find it) with the photo montage and German eagle on the cover, and not the more recent pulp paperback version without the maps and photographs.
Robert Kershaw got his info from his father-in-law a german officer who fought the Airborne div in and around Arnhem on Op market garden ... Irony is that Robert Kershaw is former Para Reg ... nice guy
Just wondering since obviously you read many books on WW2 if you've ever read The Forgotten Soldier,and what are your thoughts??
I've read it and it is one of my favorite WWII books ... although I have the newer version ... it has maps but they are sometimes hard to read ...
I might have a look at this book. this review has made me curious
+tigerhunter77 I do honestly think it's required reading on Operation Market Garden. I wish more history books were like this
***** the way you described the book it seems like its one of the foundation stones you need to understand market garden. I agree with you.
@@TheImperatorKnight It's an excellent read.
Happy new year TIK! :-)
Just ordered "It Never Snows in September", should be a good read. Thanks for the video!
Happy New Year to you too Gripen! And I really hope you enjoy it as much as I did :)
Just for future reference, I'll be leaving links in the video descriptions to Amazon. If you buy the books through the links I get a little bit of commission (and doesn't cost you any more). Didn't mention it in video because I don't want people thinking I'm doing this purely to sell stuff, and I certainly don't want you buying books unless you genuinely want them. My reasoning is if I can get a little bit of money towards more history books, it'll help bring the cost of making the documentary videos down slightly since they're not cheap
Man, I love your views and interpretations of WW2 era documents and books and games. You seriously need to be a historian...are you? I consider you one! I do have a question though, how is the kindle version?
I have a degree in history, but I don't have a job as a historian, if that's what you mean? This is just a hobby for me, but I do take it seriously. I guess I could become a historian if someone's willing to hire me :)
And I don't have the kindle version of this book, so I'm not sure. I just know that the newer paperback version has bad/missing maps and images so avoid getting that one. Sadly, I think the version I showed in the video is now out of print
I was meaning as a paying career lol which you kind of are with ads from RUclips and stuff though. Do you have a patreon? Also, I was just messing around on the Kindle version lol you said don't ask...which naturally meant I have to ask.
Oh I see! I told you not to ask!!! And RUclips adrevenue? I think I got more pocket money as a kid lol.
I don't have a patreon - but you and a few others have asked if I have one, so I think I'll set one up in the next couple days. I've already spent a small fortune on history books and need a lot lot lot more going forward.
In fact, a new one has just arrived today - "With Paulus at Stalingrad" by Adam and Rühle :)
A bridge too far is my favorite movie of all time!
It's a good movie but it's incredibly biased! This was partly why I made my Market Garden documentary - to show the other half of the story
I love your documentary. And since I’ve seen it. It’s really opened my eyes to my favorite battle from ww2. I love it, keep it up!
Oh don't worry, I'll be revisiting Market Garden when Antony Breevor's new book on Arnhem comes out in a few days (got it pre-ordered). I don't know why, but I suspect he'll either not mention Nijmegen much and thus come to the wrong conclusions like a lot of others have, or mention it and be the first if the big popular historians to do so. Either way, I'll be talking about it.
Great!!!!! 😁
Nijmegan is where the British tankers showed up late @ *1900 on sept 20* that's over 3days then sat while the GIs fought across a river and lost 48 KIA and 138 injured and some simpletons can't blamed Monty.If TIK actually read the book he's critiqueing he'd know that
Buen canal saludos desde Mexico
Do you prefer Close Combat to Combat Mission?? I prefer Combat Mission but would like to hear your thoughts.
Update: my copy of the book arrived the other week, - It is excellent. I highly recommend it. The first-hand accounts written down at the time they were happening really gives the reader something.
Have you read R.G. Poulusses ‘Lost at Nijmegen’? I believe it pre dates Robert Kershaws book, and focuses on Gavin.
Reading another of the authors books - War without Garlands. It's about Barbarossa. A fascinating incite in to the minds of German soldiers during that campaign.
Did you ever read "a forgotten soldier" ? this is a french book, wrote by an alsacian that joined wehrmacht in 42 at 17 year, and you follow what he says about his story, and he don't search to fix names on battles he fought, or big dates. He just says like it came to his mind. Le soldat oublié in french.
Is that the book by Guy Sajer, he joined the Gross Deutschland division?
That's it.
tHERE IS MUCH DEBATE ON aUTHETICITY OF THE aUTHOR
I first read Guy Sajer's book in 1985. Excellent. (I was a young soldier myself at the time)
There was initially Harald, but after Sajer came out and actually spoke to one of his main critics, said critic (an ex German officer) admitted publicly that Sajer had indeed been writing the truth about his wartime experiences.
Have not read this one, but will. I have read several well done books from the German (not Nazi) viewpoint that are well done....that said as a side note I highly recommend Atkinson's trilogy on the war-very good page turners. Thanks Lewis.
Hi, - I just checked Kindle UK (Amazon UK) and their version is the Ian Allan Publishing version. However looking at the reviews, the Kindle version is being criticised for lack of maps and pictures.
I've read the "poor version" of this and I found it very enlightening.
when researching history or even the news it is always handy if you can look at sources from different perspectives.
Poor version?
Agreed it is an outstanding book...and I have the old version, hardbound.
Me too, and I agree, cracking book.
Just got myself a copy- Ian Allen- $17.00 U.S. can’t wait to dive in . Thanks and cheers.
Now I got to watch the Market Garden video. Didn't do so until now because I was thinking "meh, heard about the Allie's errors at Market Garden so many times before."
nice review.
+dsscott82 thanks!
What is the best book to get to see the Soviet soldiers perspective? Any chance it could be in English. I’m learning Russian but I’m not good enough to read ww2 novel, at least not yet! Any suggestions for me? Please and спасибо!
More book reviews, please
This was the first book I ever read on Market Garden, and probably the first book I ever read on a WW2 campaign in general. Unfortunately I lent it to a friend back in the 90s, and never got it back.
Clearly we can all learn the lesson here: don't have friends.
Right!? It’s ok, I will shame it out of him like a true friend.
I think you got a bit confused with the signals. The Germans where not radioing GB, they where using Signal Panels. The problem was that the British didn't know where the front line was, and the DZ was supposed to be in friendly hands because it was going to be an easy OP, but it was in German hands.
I remember a German Veteran saying they deployed some of those panels but didn't know what was going to be dropped. It was some kind of supply, sadly I don't remember where I read the story.
For another German perspective, there is "Retake Arnhem Bridge" and "A few vital hours", and some booklets, but those are only about Arnhem.
From the Allied perspective, probably the best one is Midelbrook's book, but, once again, that's only about Arnhem, that's what I am interested in.
+Ivan Zaitzev yes that's it, signals! Sorry for getting that muddled up. Not read those! Middlebrook's book is good, but again only on Arnhem area. I used that for this though
Excellent book
I have read the 'good' version from my local library.
Interesting. And a new CC game on Market Garden would be so great to have.
+Tornike Khomeriki absolutely! I didn't like Last Stand Arnhem though if I'm honest
+Tornike Khomeriki Newer than Last Stand Arnhem? :)
+iwantagoodnameplease Yes. Hopefully as a future release based on the upcoming CC title engine.
+Tornike Khomeriki Not sure I agree. We've already done Normandy 4 times (cc1, cc5, cc:LTD, cc:PITF, cc:GTC) and Market Garden twice. They need something that isn't north west europe! They're already milked the CC engine and the French countryside dry. Something new, please!
+iwantagoodnameplease Well the whole point in my comment was that the same scenario in an entirely new game engine is not the same experience.
Christer Bergstrom two volume Arnhem 1944 books correct a lot of errors and is at the moment the most accurate portrait of Market Garden.
Interesting story about the water. I find it ironic though that they needed water in Holland lol.
Totally agree with your review of INSIS - I understand that Kershaw was a BAOR officer in the 70s and 80s, and the book arose from studying improvised defence of key objectives such as bridges by substantial airborne assault - the airborne forces here being Soviet. I don't know Neilland's book so have ordered it on your recommendation. I found Middlebrook strong on air transport and enjoyed it, but it's only a partial view, as he's the first to admit. I have to give a shout to Karel Margry's two volumes Operation Market Garden: Then and Now (amzn.to/2Isawv5) which reinvented my view of the campaign along with Kershaw. Absolutely scrupulous research and stunning images, together with serious insights into the campaign. The images of the fighting in Nijmegen and reels of a German propaganda photographer's pictures sequenced to give a flavour of the fighting against 1 Airborne. Stiff price but worth every penny. Strongly recommended. Delighted to have discovered the videos and am working my way them with great pleasure!
I've read this book. yes a good book. Although given the military pedigree of the author, the book surprisingly has various technical errors - if I recall correctly stating a Panther tank had a 105mm gun. Not sure if its just poor proof reading, but it doesn't take much checking to discover a Panther had a 75mm gun. So if the book makes such basic errors, are they any more errors about the Arnhem battles?
I got the bad version but still worth it.
I payed a good amount for this book glad I got the older one. It really shocked me how brutal the 82nd airborne acted throwing German wounded of a bridge based on a German account.
Sir, "war is HELL!" The 82nd in crossing the Waal River in SHIT boats under fire, performed unparalleled in this battle.
Antiochus III the Great just one of the many of such events performed by the allied soldiers during these battles
and where the close combat game stand? as learning material
They're our most accurate source on the battle, obviously!
(Interestingly - the maps in Close Combat A Bridge Too Far are pretty accurate since they were based off real aerial photographs. Obviously people in the Netherlands didn't paint large numbers on their roof to indicate how many storeys their houses had, but they are pretty good if you compare them to the real photos)
+TIK Do you know if the CC:LSA maps are as accurate? I remember back in the day reading about how accurate the CC2 maps were... then I play LSA and they look different. Not only on a different scale but in terms of the position of terrain features and houses etc.
I read this book when it first got published . As an ex-Para and student of Arnhem I could not believe how wonderful it was , (and I am not just saying that because its written by an officer from the Regiment .) The excellent narrative and supporting maps made the book an absolute delight to read . Nothing worse than reading a battle book without insufficient or poor maps. Have you read his new one , A street in Arnhem . This is another corker ! :)
The paratroopers "supplying" the Germans LOL.
I have a copy to been To Arnhem to lovely city check it out one day haven't read all of the book but a good read so far
This book was definitely an eye-opener. I thought I knew much about Market Garden, but this was the icing on the cake. It is available as a PDF file overhere: ebooks.bharathuniv.ac.in/gdlc1/gdlc4/Arts_and_Science_Books/arts/history/World%20War%202/Great%20World%20War%202/Books/It%20Never%20Snows%20in%20September.pdf
I thought it was an excellent book! one of the better books on WW2 ive read in the last 20 years
*checks bookshelf* Yup, I got all three, and some more besides. *checks Kershaw* Damn I have the bad version :(
Good Review of an excellent book. As I mentioned elsewhere I think that battle accounts are often best written by military personnel with enough experience and knowledge to have a decent perspective. Michael Reynolds on the NW Europe campaign and Robert Kershaw on MG. If it's not obvious Kershaw was a Para officer, so has a very good insight into the details of the battle, which is evident from his book. I totally agree - a new version of the allied side written by him would be good news.
Never trust single source material!
Agreed
Just a few weeks ago I got my copy from Amazon. It was a great read, but the pocket book version that I got was really shitty.
Brilliant book! It's a real eye-opener. everywhere else it's all about the SS Panzer divisions that somebody/nobody knew about. In reality the Germans threw in everything they had - a panzer III, King tigers, stomach and ear battalions, untrained troops, coastal defence troops etc. He says the Germans thought the British could have made it through.
Where was the Luftwaffe in Market Garden Operation?
I would think Luftwaffe had been decimated by that point of war.
I just got the good version. :)
The kindle version is the "shit" version.
Arnhem 1944 by Martin Middlebrook is the best book in my opinion
Love your videos, but your camera has worst focus I have seen on such a good channel. Please, please invest in a better one.
The good news is that I'm planning to :)
@@TheImperatorKnight Wow. that is good news indeed. You have such a good channel, good videos, good content, everything is to love. Even the audio is awesome, but that out of focus camera is ruining it. Anyway, thanks for your hard work!!!! Keep it going! Thank you!
But the good version costs 35€ and the cheap second hand one is only 8,50€....
Simply put it was poor leadership by the Allies that botched this operation. Also remember the Germans were had the advantage, knew the lay of the land, had tanks remember that isn't brought out which the Allies had no counter for. Light arms are no match against tanks and artillery regardless of the fact the German's had low supplies of ammo and food, water and fuel.
0:32 that is kinda poor statement.
I am sure there are many german books about the german "perspective" of that battle.
But they weren't translated into english, or they only relate to the actions of a single commander or regiment (as the germans can't boast on a complete victory or even a strategy on the whole battlefield..so there is no incentive to publish such a "Markt Gärtnerei" book).
Your statement and the "surprise" statement on the book by amazon and the likes only proves the ignorance of anglo publishers and readers about other points of view. Not only on WW2 but anything related to antagonists (Vietnamese in 70s ? Russians during cold war and under todays Putin ? the french under napoleon ? etc..etc..).
"Shattered Sword: The Untold Story of the Battle of Midway" did a similar thing to this. Mitsio Fuchida's account of the Battle has been disproven in Japan since the late 70s/early 80s as an outright lie in many places, but it's still held as gospel in the US for some reason--the sources have never been translated in the same way you mention the German ones for Market Garden. Shattered Sword showed just how the whole battle was the IJN's to lose...and how in reality, they'd lost it before Kido Butai ever weighed anchor in Hiroshima Bay. I don't mean to make this about something other than Market Garden, but the idea is sort of the same
Theres no incentive for historians from countries that lost wars to study that subject. Thats why you see few german, italian or japanese historians analizing the victories of said countries. Its not "allies propaganda" as naive people and conspiracy theorists think. Its just convenience and reluctance.
THink about it: you start working as an historian in Japan, what do you do? YOu risk your career and reputation by studying a DELICATE subject as, let's say the invasion of China in the second Sino-Japanese war OR you focus on more "cool" and quiet subjects?
History is liek this: you need to wait a couple generations or more before having real objective analisis in most cases.
ryans book is more fantasy than fact
The word in your background graphic is spelled "ignore" not "igore".
It's a very important book, not brilliant because Kershaw isn't a great writer, but there are rewards for patience. Ryan was a very good story teller and didn't let too much truth get in the way of a Hollywood pitch. Neilands is good honest historical narrative, Kershaws is dense and for those who love detail. I would agree with TIK read Kershaw after at least one of the other two. It will make far more sense. That said TIK is absolutely right you have not engaged with the story fully until you have read all three at least.
I collect individual accounts like By Tank into Normandy, they can bring you down to earth from the big authors as they spend a chapter on a single days advance across a small wood, and cover market garden in two pages. It reminds us that for many it was just another op, just another day, we forget it was a long war and there was plenty going on.
I think there is another book to be written about the late summer of 44. It should start with the Falaise Gap and follow, in detail, the extraordinary surge across NW Europe until it impales itself on the Rhine Frontier with market garden. If you do not understand the shocking losses and confusion of the Germans and the startling success of the Allies you won't grasp the rush of instinct and hope behind such an ambitious op.
I would like to hear a comparison study between Montys and Ikes memoirs. So much of Market Garden is wrapped up in their big row after Normandy. We obsess about numbers and types of Panzers in whichever scratch unit, but tend to ignore the vastly different philosophical and political battles between the two top Allied leaders involved.
The best book never written about this period was Admiral Ramsay's wartime memoirs. Tedder's takes a swipe at Monty but I feel Ramsay would have gone for his throat if he had lived to retire. If he had lived I think Monty's diaries might have been a bit more circumspect and deferential to colleagues. Tedder has Ramsay almost in mutiny about securing ALL the appraoches to Antwerp. Monty gives them two dozen words. They are such an obvious feature, so vital to any allied plans Monty's cavalier assessment tugs you away from his reasoning that year.
Good Post though 2 yrs old I had read his memoirs also.Ramsay was as good as they came.Just a few gleanings.He had planned much of the D-Day landings and had great insight into tactical and logistical manners understanding what was needed moving forward. Much of SHAEF evidently was against OMG
*The Year of D-Day:The 1944 Diary of Admiral Sir Bertram Ramsay,p.152* - On the eve of the Arnhem Operation Montgomery had made the following entry into the 21st Army Group log: *from a purely British point of view Antwerp had never been a vital necessity.*
*The Year of D-Day:The 1944 Diary of Admiral Sir Bertram Ramsay, p. 151* - Montgomery:"1st Army have withdrawn 6th Division - ready to launch attack to the Rhine with British 2nd Army on October 12th."(Author's Footnote p.152 - This indicates that even after the failure,Montgomery still intended to move toward the Ruhr before opening the Scheldt)
Ramsay: this afforded me the que I needed to lambaste him for not having made the capture of Antwerp the immediate objective at highest priority & I let fly with all my guns at the faulty strategy we had allowed .Our large forces were now grounded for lack of supply .Had we got Antwerp instead of the corridor we should be in a far better position for launching a knock out blow
*The Year of D-Day:The 1944 Diary of Admiral Sir Bertram Ramsay p. 159* "the Army was far behind organising as I knew they would be as they entirely under estimated their task and Monty had not given the Canadians sufficient support for the work (Author's Footnote In fact ,Montgomery had finally committed himself without reservation to the Scheldt campaign in a directive issued on 16 October, after receiving 3 "hurry up" messages from Eisenhower during the previous week)
The war was a forgone conclusion by the time the allies landed...the focus on german resilience is fine but it has to be realized that the U.S tried to fight the cheapest war possible while keeping up morale at home. The American government was terrified of the debt caused by such a huge war and the possibility of having tax payers rebuild europe while the russians took huge chunks of land. The Americans were using weapons that were 2-3 tiers below their experimental time appropriate weaponry. Their main weapon to balance the mg42 was an m1919 that was nearly 30 years old. Their main tank was chosen because it was the cheapest to produce while there were more powerful better engineered tanks, including tank destroyers that were vastly superior but just not needed. When tank destroyers came in contact with panthers and tigers, the k/d was nearly 1/1...it just didn't happen very often. When american troops were well trained they were equal to elite german troops, but the american doctrine called for basic training to cut down on time in the field and costs. The American army went from the size of Yugoslavia's to 15 million...the germans had 9 years of combat or preparation by the time the americans landed...the americans started designing weapons in 1942, and two years of development. So comparing american training to nazi training would be fair if you compared 1938 germany to 1944 american as both armies had two year preparation.
You don't have to defend the Americans so ardently, he's only talking about one battle - and one battle usually seen as being fought primarily by the British anyway. That said, the Sherman was an excellent tank. Go watch The Chieftain's "Myths of American Armor" talk and his other related lectures. One of the reasons a dedicated heavy tank took so long in development was the competing notion that the US didn't necessarily NEED it. By the time of the Normandy campaign Shermans had been doing JUST FINE fighting Panthers and Tigers in Italy, especially once the 76'er began deployment. People look at K/D ration when it's not a reliable figure for the utility and quality of a tank - (they are seldom accurate, anyway - with discrepancies looming and pertinent information missing - allowing them to be taken out of context). People forget that a tanks primary duty is not going to be fighting other tanks - they can and should - but they just aren't going to come up against them nearly as often as an entrenched or fortified position and if the Sherman IS going to come up against German armor, it's more likely to be a Panzer 4 or Stug-type rather than a Panther or Tiger. Not to mention that by this time the training of the German tanks crews began to slack, leading to lapses in mechanical hygiene, leading to breakages and openings in tactics which Allied tankers could then exploit.
The Allies WERE taken off guard by the amount of Panthers and other related heavy tanks in Normandy, and this worried its fair share of higher-ups, this is true - but people forget that it was not a Sherman Firefly that took out German tank ace Michael Wittmann (like was originally asserted) - it was a Canadian crew with a regular ole' Sherman with 75 gun. My point is - no need to be defensive, the US and the rest of the Allies performed just fine by and large and had the right tools for the job. It often comes down to individual commanders and individual units and plans rather than an over-all "army effectiveness score" or something like that. During Operation: AGREEMENT, between 650 - 700 Royal Marines, SAS, and many more related service personnel were repulsed in an attack which saw 800 dead and hundreds captured - they were up against a force consisting of around 300 or so Italians and and a few dozen Germans - these things are highly contextual is what I'm trying to say. It often comes down to individual units, and sometimes just individuals.
Just annoyed that people still propagate this myth of german superiority, and that their facism and nationalism allowed them to have superweapons manned by supermen. Many people would gladly bring back nazi germany today, as they think it represented strength and power, the reality was the germans were utterly overwhelmed by larger and more competent organizations, and these organizations saw no point in creating the illusion of having super-equipment or soldiers, the nazis did and it still persists today.
Orc Lover _____ The idea that either side had an advantage in terms of "competence" is questionable. The Allies had a bottomless well of men and materiel. Their Generals were, on the whole, average and the troops they commanded no better than adequate. In the end it was just a numbers game.
You are so wrong about Wittman's tank being destroyed by a Sherman with a 75mm gun. Wrong wrong wrong. It was a Sherman Firefly (British version with a 17 pounder) that destroyed his tank. Zaloga believes that Wittmann's fate reflected that new reality: after transfer to France, his crew only lasted two months, and was destroyed by a British medium tank, the up-gunned Sherman Firefly en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_Wittmann#CITEREFZaloga2015
You have to take into account that the nazis specifically focused on creating propaganda that gave the illusion that they were superior. There are endless examples of this propaganda working its way through time so that today people view the germans as a superior army that was overwhelmed by raw manpower. A couple examples of this propaganda: People think germans were a motorized and mechanized army with superior technology. Reality, they were the least mechanized of all the major powers in europe, they invaded France on the back of the captured P38 ,which was a czech model...their own panzer creations were inferior to these. THeir panzer 3 and panzer 4 was inferior to the T-34, and their later Tiger and Panthers were unreliable and made in too few numbers because of over engineering. They specifically created the Tiger II and V-1 and V-2 rockets to give the illusion of superiority, of superweapons, to push forward Goebbels total war philosophy. And it is still perpetrated today. If video games and such were real...most players would choose the germans, get in a panther, and 30% of them would break down. Then when they got out to fix it, it would be too complicated. Instead video games portray superweapons as super, every neo-nazi jumps in one and fantasizes about being an SS stormtrooper, even though in reality the SS "supertroops" had excessively high casualties and were not particularly useful in the grand scheme. That can pretty much sum up Germany...final solution, resettlement, massive slavery, superweapons, attacking the two superpowers, these things were not particularly useful in the grand scheme. Russia and America had a grand scheme. Stalin would spend his manpower to capture buffer-zones in eastern europe, this is every russian leaders dream. And America would provide resources to these russian troops so they would be the ones dying and not the americans. They did logically useful things to win the war...germany did not.
History told by a person that has looked into it,nuff said.........
Read the book long time ago ,this review is pretty boring, read the book ☺
I haven't read the book, and I don't know all the details of operation market-garden, but hearing that the Germans used captured British weapons, and using captured radio to ask the RAF for water, I conclude that the operation was a complete failure and a waste of time, resources, and men. Whoever came up with this operation should have been sacked.