I Survived the Worlds Most NOTORIOUS Airline: LION AIR
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- Опубликовано: 27 сен 2024
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I took a flight on Indonesia's most infamous airline, Lion Air, to find out what they're really like.
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Noel I want to ask you a personal question!
Send your email so it will be personal
I remember the crash!
north of Jakarta (north west)... not north of Indonesia... you are welcome 😉
Noel the type of guy to point out all the safety issues with an airline, and then take the exact same flight from the last fatal crash lol. Love it
Thats actually pretty clever, what are the odds that the same airline chrashes on the same route twice 😉
Jakarta beautiful.? Not if you know it.
But did he die?, 👀👀
he was not honest about his review, it was not the airline that was at fault but the manufacturer boeing who became famous for betraying this airline, the 737 - the newest Max that we know
@@hollythx Sure maybe the last crash wasn't their fault... but what about the other crashes
I remember a story about an ex-Lion Air pilot refuses to fly with Lion Air itself except if it was him that flown the plane lol
Noel mentioned that Lion had an average of one crash every two years but when he took this flight it was three years since the last one. That's a good sign, it suggests that they've improved their safety procedures. Their subsidiary Batik Air which flies to Australia seems to be OK.
@@rais1953It’s sad when your argument is, “See? It’s been 3 years since the last accident. That’s better than the 1 every 2 years they averaged before”. 😂😂
@@Jmotwa87 they should put that on their terminal billboards: "It has been two years since our last crash."
@@Jmotwa87 Yes. But it's a hopeful sign.
@@fitzyman4552 "2 days accident free!"
All those hours you logged on Russian carriers a year or so ago and now Lion Air! You're a far, far braver man than most, Noel.
Facts
I had the same experience with Lion Air when I traveled around Indonesia years back. Every single flight, they asked me if I wanted to move to the emergency exit and to assist with evacuation if needed. I had a feeling they needed to have at least one or two foreigners manning one of the exits lol
I think if an airline is doing manual check-in they will always be looking for some reasonably able bodied people to go in the exit rows. Even if you check in very early they might ask you. On another occasion I was called up just before boarding if I'd swap to an exit row. I said 'Yes please!)😀
Lmao I can't talk about Lion AIr because I'm never flown them but I think some airlines are probably a bit wack like that.
I know if there's no one who's assigned to the emergency exit rows they'll look for some fit able-bodied people to move there, my sister and I were once asked while checking in if we wanted to upgrade to emergency exit (Jetstar) but we declined. I reckon if they asked Noel before the flight though maybe no one had booked those seats or the people who were sitting there weren't happy to help?
Is it because foreigners are mostly taller than locals, so they need more leg room, and easier to open the emergency exit window?
@@Si_nengatcha more leg room and they know white people don't screw stuff up.
Jokes
not foreigner necessarily, probably just taller or fitter looking people
As a pilot and plane owner I just Love your travels. Just think all the wonderful places you can go throughout this wonderful world. Just wish all of us could get a long and cherish our life here. Nice that all the seats were orange so they can see you floating in the water.....
If the body not scattered on impact..
Pangkal Pinang (pronounced it nicely there Noel, locals would immediately know, Bangka island) is one of culinary havens in Indonesia. They are nowhere north of Indonesia, it settles right in the middle. The northern most point of that Sumatra region (Banda Aceh) is like 2 hours flight away.
As ex Ezy crew I can say that we had a similar PA when going to Ibiza. We use to have load of seat belts and life jackets taken for people to then wear to the clubs. It used to be quite frequent that 2 or 3 used to go each flight. Every turnaround our checks included lifejackets to then replace missing ones!
That answers my question about why anyone would want an aircraft life-jacket. I would not impress anyone if I showed up at my local wearing an aircraft life-jacket. 🤣
3:15 Indonesia is definitely on my list of countries to visit and I was well on my way before COVID shut everything down as I had just visited Thailand, Laos, Cambodia, and Vietnam with plans to visit Malaysia and Indonesia next. Glad to hear you love it there which makes me want to visit even more now since I know that you know what you’re talking about.
Another interesting thing about this airline is even the CEO said "my airlines is the worst in the world, but you (indonesian) have no choice"
Oh shit 😂
Wow, that is.... incredible!
Noel, you survived SCAT. You can do Lion Air.
Twice!
Ive lived in Jakarta for nye on 30 years and flown Lionair many times. They are getting better. I remember getting rained on in the back seats of their md80's. Once you've risked your life on a motorbike in peak hour Jakarta traffic you won't be as worried when flying Lionair. You'll just be happy to have survived another day.
😂😂😂😂😂 tough luck mate.. cheers from yahukimo
happened to me once too, on their MD flight, i was like tf is this water from aircond? but no it was water leaking from outside 🤣
Wow Noel, you’re so brave!! I am such a nervous flyer I actually refuse to get on a plane. But seeing you do something like this gives me a bit more confidence 😅 Thank you for your videos!
He must have nerves of steel.
think about it like this, ppl have a way higher chance to die on a car crash than a place crash. One more thing, pick an airline that have good safety records
Safer than driving just remember
@@Thefallenpea I'd still rather be in a car crash than plane crash. At least I won't be falling thousands of feet out of the sky
@@Thefallenpea Trust me I know all the statistics but my anxiety says No 😅
As an Indonesian myself, i would rather spend more money to fly within the country with Garuda Indonesia than with Lion Air group...
From 1970 to 1999, Korean Air (aka KAL) wrote off nearly 20 aircraft in serious incidences and crashes, resulting in about 700 fatalities in the process. Since then, management has turned the ship around with better training and safety procedures. Hopefully, Lion Air makes similar changes.
Frankly, I'm amazed people still want to fly with the Indonesian carrier, given its dodgy safety record. Management shouldn't take this for granted because even loyal customers will only give you so many opportunities to fix things before they walk away for good.
If you think Lion Air is bad, you should have flown Sempati Air, I did in the mid 90s from Yogaykarta to Denpasar, never have I been scared on flight other than this one, thank goodness it was only an hour. One of the stewardesses was literally holding the door release down the whole way.
Sempati was horrible. I wonder how bad Bouraq was?
@Springbok295 pretty bad. I did them once and it was enough. I have also flown Adam and Batavia. Still alive
I survived multiple Merpati, Indonesian Aerospace C-212 Aviocar flights to and from Jakarta Halim and Cilacap in the late 1980s.
Wasn’t brave enough to try Bouraq or Mandala.
how do you get him to get on a plane that has long been bankrupt 😆
Damn you're old af dude, nobody even remember about that particular airline.
A few years ago we had same thing with the life vests on the Airberlin-Shuttle down to Palma de Mallorca and when I talked to the crew later, they said it's pretty common on flights to "Party-Islands" that people try to take those vests with them so that they had always a few extra vests on their flights for the return flight.
Got to say stunning scenery on approach. You are a brave guy Noel flying these airlines like Lion Air
Many thanks!
They have another branch called Thai Lion Air that operates in Thailand, they are always full.
737-900 seem quite rare. I think in Europe your best bet to fly on one of those is with KLM. As for Lion air, I suppose statistically speaking it is still about as safe as an domestic long distance bus in the same country which most people would board without much concern. Lionair might be safer now that they have the world's eyes on them.
United flies 737-900s frequently out of IAH (Noel’s home airport)
TSA would be having a heart attack with that security protocol
That’s why they’ve failed many times to get FAA approval to fly into the US. Most Indonesian carriers are category 2 meaning the country either lacked laws or regulations necessary to oversee air carriers in accordance with minimum international standards, or its civil aviation authority - a body equivalent to the FAA for aviation safety matters - was deficient in one or more areas, such as technical expertise, trained personnel, record-keeping, or inspection procedures.
Garuda, Indonesia the flag carrier has a Category 1 rating but has chosen not to fly to the US due to their geographical focus on Asia.
@@JeanClaudeCOCO Garuda hasn’t flown to US since late 1997. I believe they’ve just cut the flight to London in 2021 due to financial reasons. So far only Amsterdam is the surviving long route this carrier has to offer.
My wife and I were due to fly Lion Air during our honeymoon last year from Bali to Ambon to visit her great grandfather's grave in the war cemetery over there. It was a 2 leg flight taking us through Makassar however Lion kept changing the flight times for each of the legs of the journey making the trip impossible over one day. Luckily they offered a free transfer onto their more premium sister airline Batik (although we did have to take a longer route through jakarta) which was nice. Overall not the worst experience with Lion (at least their customer service).
You're lucky 😂
That's because you're foreigner. If you're locals and complain about it...they probably will told you to swim to ambon.
you should go to koh samui airport, really cool airport where everythings outside. Theres no inside terminal😍
You get what you pay for at Lion Air. You’re statistically much safer on one of their planes than you are on the motorway
thank you for sharing man, i have been living in Indonesia for almost a decade now, using lion airlines maybe 4 of 5 times, most of my traveling i use Citilink airlines, its good . again thanx for sharing and hope ur having a good time in Indonesia.
My job has me taking Lion air (usually) every few weeks to travel around Indonesia, I've never had a "scary" moment with them. The leg room is an issue like you stated but I have often been asked if I want to move to the emergency exit, just like in your scenario.
Even for the worst airlines in the worst countries, flying is pretty safe and the probability of a crash is low. It's just when compared to Europe, North America etc that it looks very bad in places like Indonesia. You'll be fine!
Jakarta is the most underrated city in Asia. Cannot wait to get back there
Noel! Very very brave individual 😂 taking a trip that most wouldn’t…
Thanks for watching.
Noel - do you have a video where you talk about what essentials you take on your flights? Interesting to see if anything useful I should have on a flight
The key to flying Lion air is, don’t expect timely arrival, don’t expect great service, basically don’t expect too much, and you’ll feel “well that wasn’t too bad” 😆
And probably don't expect to arrive at all.
If you live to tell the tale
some local passengers had already opened the emergency exit before the plane took off
In Indonesia, Lion Air Group and Garuda Indonesia Group is the 2 airlines that monopolies the market. Sometimes people have no choice to fly with lion because Garuda ticket price is almost 3 times lion.
Not always about the price.
Garuda does not cover all of Indonesia, some route in Kalimantan is only flew by Lion or Wings, which is subsidiaries of Lion. Last week I just flew using Wings, 2 properlers, 4 seats wide ATR72 from Balikpapan to Tanjung Selor, very small airport and short runway it is an experience.
city link are famous to
OMG! Air crash investigation full of Lion Air crash incidents. You are no doubt very courageous and special thanks to Lion Air management after so many incidents, till they are operating their normal business. Good to watch. Good luck both of you. Sending care from 🇮🇳
You have some nerve flying Lion air on the same route as the one that crashed,balls of steel Noel,
Pangkal pinang is still considered on the south part of Indonesia actually. Indonesia is quite bigger than what even most Indonesians think. The northern big cities is actually even more north in latitude than Kuala Lumpur in Malaysia.
I'm quite Interested to know what brings you to PGK.
I think he's flying two different airlines to and from the island as it's just a 90 minute flight and will return to Jakarta on another one in an hour or two. Maybe Batik Air?
@@ninettemurk7492 Batik Air is just another name for Lion Air!
@@tiadaid Seriously? They have different livery on their planes.
@@tiadaid No. It's just that Batik is a "child company" of Lion group. They have different management team and crews than Lion, all newer fleets, and finer services and punctuality according to most frequenters.
Happy to see that you liked the terminal. It was designed by Paul Andreu, the same guy who designed the CDG airport and one of its ill-fated section of a terminal there
3:50 As Indonesia is Muslim-majority country, a Musholla is required in every place as to provide the Muslims with a place for them to pray but yeah the placement is a bit odd. Never understand why if there is a Musholla, it will always be built next to or near the toilet. Kinda makes it unsanitary and unholy for me
I've done a search for Lion Air crashes and compared the actual death toll versus the potential and while some of the data is incomplete, out of a potential 1057 they've only killed 214 people. I was only able to find 7 crashes and obviously one of those was the infamous Lion Air 610. I'm willing to cut them a bit of slack on that one. Dangerous? Sure but if you've always wanted to experience a plane crash, Lion Air sounds like a good bet.
Honestly, Lion's been very safe these past couple of years, especially since their 2018 MAX incident, aside from the occasional annoying delays, broken/missing seatbelts on some of their planes, they've been the only airline making a profit in the pandemic, so big up to them.
Yeah just missing seat belts. After all, they’re optional items
They used to have 747s which had ifes.Even on thai lion air a330 had ifes.But it is rare because they are a low cost airline
Jakarta and Bali are on my bucket list!
Go to Munduk in Bali. South Bali is too crowded these days
You gotta love the Indonesian plane etiquette, as soon as the wheels hit the tarmac all you hear is the seatbelts unclicking and half the passengers standing up trying to get off before the plane even stops😂😂🤦♂️
You're a brave man, Noel. You take your life in your hands flying Lion Air.
Unfortunately, people do take the life jackets. I spent 28 years at Monarch, and on occasion we had them sent back in the post.
Noel, thanks for this video.... I worked out this is close to a prototype location & I will probably take this same flight to visit Bangka Island next month
Fly Garuda and its subsidiary Citilink. That's what I'm doing. Problem is for most Indonesian, Lion Air Group is the most affordable ones. Certainly they are now has the widest networks available.
A few months ago I flew on a Batik Air Max-8, and I believe that they're a subsidiary of Lion Air. It was a weird flight because we flew from Kuala Lumpur to Singapore, circled Singapore for almost an hour, then flew back to Kuala Lumpur, basically a nearly 3 hour flight to nowhere. The same aircraft took us back to Singapore a few hours later.
It was all pretty bizarre.
No doubt it was a weather diversion. Kuala Lumpur is often the alternate for Singapore.
@@tiadaid It was.
They didn't tell you it was weather?
@@chrispekel5709 Eventually they did, but it caused some people to miss connecting flights.
Prayer rooms are quite common around the world actually. Lots of airports have chapels, multi faith rooms, prayer rooms etc.
I'm frequent on Lion's flight, have a completly different opinion from others, never had an issue with them, very seldom run into delay, always a pleasant flight, prefer their -800 over the -900ER tho, it seems the seat pitch is much better on the -800.
super airjet which another lion's subsidiary has better seat pitch that lion itself
@@cinevile technically speaking, on legal document, super air jet is not a subsidiary to lion group, but both owned by the same person, so... of course it's different and better
@@chris22capt its not under lion group?
@@cinevile it's not. It's registered as a independent, separate company from lion group. Lion group's pr confirmed this back when super air jet just start their operational. But because they both owned by the same person, sometimes they are kinda helping each other on operational aspect like maintanence, etc. Lion group's crews that need a ride back to their base after a scheduled flight would sometimes fly on super air jet as an extra crew. But, other than that, it's a separate company. That's why you won't find any lion group's logo painted on super's fleet
The only time I ever was scared on a plane was with Thai Lion air between Bangkok and Yangon ,the plane did a massive drop and I saw the face of the stewardess and she definitely was scared.
the life jacket warning is on every airplane that i ever take in indonesia apparently people like to steal the life jacket
its the same in Thailand too
Try Citilink please. Citilink is an airline from its parent Garuda Indonesia. In recent years, I only use either Garuda or Citilink in Indonesia.
About Lion Air, I never used this airline in the past 10 years because I felt uncomfortable and dissatisfied with the service in the past. Just look at the seats, my knees feel hurt just seeing how tight is your seat. For me, seat is the first important thing before the services.
great video as always, I'm glad you're enjoying your time here in Indonesia
Thanks! 😃
4:55 fyi that the 737 max was actually not lion's fault. they are some research about it. lion try to inform Boeing to train their pilot because of this new aircraft but Boeing refused they claimed that that plane was the same as the 737 900 and mocked lion staff as uncivilized
Noel, I think your most bizarre flight was across the Gulf of California, between mainland Mexico, and Baja California. As I recall, the pilot of that puddle jumper played with his phone, then fell asleep, and drifted off course. I was prepared to see you move into the right seat, and take control of the flight.
Lion Air seems like a typical budget airline. Low fares, regional destinations, crowded cabin. Sure, I'd risk a flight on that carrier -- occasionally. As a regular commuter? No, I don't think so. The odds don't add up.
The fact there was the first 737 900 er that lion air first ordered next to the plane that you are on is just crazy
Soekarno-Hatta is truly a beautiful terminal, however the boarding process is a total logistical mess.
Noel, you should fly out of HLP in Jakarta to experience true insanity. There are some amazing food outlets in the departure lounge, though.
I'd love to see you fly into Medan in the future, too (KNO)
for the steps down from the jetbridge is used for maintence and sometimes for boarding from the tail
"Thankfully didn't go for a swimming lesson" 😂😂 killed me
Lion air is big not only in Indonesia, but also in Malaysia ( malindo and batek) and Thailand.
I must say, Noel is so British-unfailingly polite yet critical.
Frankly, with their safety record, I'm gobsmacked that Lionair is still operating.
They only had 2 fatal crashes, and one was entirely boeing's fault.
Not sure I'd fly with them (mainly due to the legroom), but for a short flight, it's probably not too bad
Hi Noel I used to live in Jakarta and regularly travelled home to Perth my choice if possible would be Garuda, but my last choice many times had to be Lion Air my answer to you is I'm still here but always a bit nervous flying them. Keep up the good work love your videos.
Heard the stories about Lion Air many a time & if ever I fly to that part of the world I’m not convinced they would be my first choice of operator! Glad to see you escaped unscathed!
I imagine their maintenance has improved with so many wrecked planes to scavenge parts off.
Noel, you have balls of solid steel! 😁 I would not fly in an airline with such a bad safety record, even if you pay me to! No airline is perfect and there will be accidents in time, but then those should be non-fatal and far between, but this airline... NOPE! I may be crazy, but I am not stupid! 🤪
Having lived in Jakarta for 9 years…. Indonesian people really appreciate Terima Kasih (for thank you) & Jakarta airport is Soekana Hatta named after previous President & his deputy….enjoy your vlogs…took Lion many times.
Living in Thailand have flown Lion air many times, no problems but like air Asia better 😂
I had the same announcement about leaving the lifejackets on the plane when I flew Hawaiian Airlines last year. Clearly this was a problem, but I didn’t think it should be
Nice video! The remedial flight after your flight was cancelled before 😁. Thumbs up from Indonesia!
Thanks! 😃
I'm surprised at all the negative and 'braver man than me' comments here. The Max is one of the newest and safest aircraft flying today. The software problems were ironed out after the accidents and the engineering on these aircraft is insane. The engine to fuselage ratio is reassuringly large l. Noel, it would be great to have more technical information about the aircraft you are on. To me, this would help dispel some of the fears and negativity around using certain airlines and aircraft. I love the Max and am just about to board a flight from Mexico city to Merida. I know I'm going to have a safe, quiet and and enjoyable flight with great views of CDMC on the way out.
Its even worse at Gibraltar with the way that police are only sat at each end of the runway crossing so anyone could just run onto the apron and walk up the stairs into a flight to the UK
There was a time when Garuda had a bad rap (yes I did fly them) but with time n investment they improved. Maybe Lion Air will do the same?
I have flown Lion all over Indonesia and find them a good airline, clean, pleasant, efficient, good value and enjoy flying with them.
Yeah, I have experience too with this airplane when for me this airplane have a predicate the most king of delayed because I ever been delayed 3 hours and I just accept a bottle of mineral water for their responsibility... In the cabin so very hot until we take-off to the air...
But for JT 610 I think we can't blame the airplane company because on that time Boeing 737 Max 8 were in trouble of the instrument on the cabin... Not only Lion Air JT 610 crash, also Ethiopia Airlines crash months later...
Oh My God... I'm excited and happy you try Indonesian Airline. Thank you.
the leg room is only fitted for Indonesian I guess. but its the like riding an interstate bus that can fly
I know it's routine for you...but I'd enjoy a little more of the footage of the takeoff in real time (with sound). It's nice to compare aircraft and plus it's the best part of any flight.
Didn't know they had some 10 crashes in the last 20 years. I mean I knew about the Max 8 crash but that was about it. So this does sort of shed some light on the whole Max 8 thing. While it was mostly Boeing's fault I guess, it does sound like perhaps Lion Air doesn't have the best pilots either (since you don't really technically need the MCAS system to operate the Max 8 or Max 9 apparently, since US pilots were turning off the system in the US until the grounding).
But at least they offered you a seat with more leg room. Most US carriers (or carriers in general) would just make you suffer or tell you that you chose that seat or you should have chosen a better seat (if given the option), so at least they were nice in that regard.
You beat the odds ! I never try stuff like that !
The inside of that airplane looks like my worst nightmare.
If you used to buy tickets using credit/debit card, I wonder how many of those airlines will try to steal its data. When I was in Indonesia - one of them (it seems you haven't tested that one) actually tried as I've used virtual card created just to buy tickets online over one specific website and then it was frozen, yet ~6 months after I got notification that some one tried to authorise it to use in some local Indonesian app.
Absolutely love your contents Noel
Thank you William!
Great video Noel! I still can’t wait to fly a MAX in Indonesia 🇮🇩 despite the safety conditions and sketchy practices! 😂 I’m crazy! 🧥
Thanks for watching.
My sis in law would always use Lion Air as the last resort if there's no Garuda available. Lion Air is fine most of the time and is cheaper, but as you say, not great safety track record, which makes things nerve wracking. Btw, you gotta try Yogyakarta International Airport if you ever have the chance, it's kinda new and is located by the sea and hills, supposedly has a nice view, too.
a very nice airport, although a long way from town
im surprised you didnt't get ur flight delayed coz they're known to always delay their flights very often.
@5:17 yep thats what we call security breach in airport terms. crazy to me nowadays that theres still airports that doesn't have a digital padlock system or anything to prevent pax to just walk in down the bridge
Plz do a comparision video about Ryan air ,Lion Air and Indigo all largest low cost airlines
I had just watched the documentary on the max crash last week. Mainly pilot error. Looking forward to your next hop.👍🏻
Not pilot error. Boeing error and lack of documentation
As James said, mainly Boeing error and their attempts to keep pace with Airbus.
Not excusing Lion Air, but if you watched the documentary, which covered the Ethiopian crash, you would have seen that Boeing admitted it was due to their new system and the lack of training provided by Boeing
Hi noel
I used lion air last year from Jakarta to jogja and survived
I was a bit worried though 😊
Always grateful to start my Sunday with a Noel Phillips new upload!
I know you are busy, but what is your favorite USA airport today? Come Fly Through Santa Barbara Soon!
You are lucky enough that they managed to get the jet bridge. Most of the time it will be a bus ride somewhere on the other side of the airport
for indonesians, we know that lion air had a lot of bad reputation. but mostly we dont have any choice because lion air often giving good offer for cheap flight and they have a lot of flight schedule from morning to midnight.
11:35 Who would nick off life jackets in their sane mind?? OMG!
A very good Monday morning to you all from Wellington Somerset in the UK
Actually looks like a good service by Lion Air. If they could figure out their safety culture, they could be a good low cost carrier.
Not defending Lion Air but the Max 8 crash is wholly and solely Boeing's issue, they deliberately didn't notify regulatory bodies about this new system in the Max 8 otherwise pilots would have had to retrain which would mean that airlines wouldn't purchase the plane.
The reason they did this... Because they were behind Airbus.
The Ethiopian Air Max crash had exactly the same issue, the pilot were powerless to stop the plane and computer once it took control. The crew were overwhelmed and it's probably not too far of a stretch to say that had Boeing told pilots about the new system and trained them on the new system, the crashes could have been avoided.
The crew of the penultimate Lion Air flight using the doomed aircraft proved that the system in itself wasn’t a problem if flown correctly. Having had the same problems as the doomed Lion Air flight, a third pilot ran a standard procedure for runaway trim that is a memory item on the Boeing 737NG, and that allowed the plane to fly on to Jakarta and land safely.
The “blame Boeing” argument is rather simplistic and not at all nuanced.
What a timely video.... a colleague of mine was complaining our travel department booked him on this airline to save 100 dols....
Hey Noel! I did BKK to YGN on MAI last weekend. Cheap, full beverage service but planes old. But no complaints. My regional favourite is Nok Air. I just love the livery of the planes with bird beaks "nok" meaning bird in Thai. Cheap, clean and good prices. The urban story, not sure it;s a myth, is that the flight attendants are made redundant when they reach age 24! A bit different to Qantas. They don't have a chance of working internationally until 45 plus and 25kg overweight!
I'm kiwi, live in Indonesia 18 years, lion air ya ,I only fly with them when I have too, start of the day plane on time, later the flight more delayed, before covid alway fly with Garuda Airline for work, but now many flight cancel, so I now fly with batik air, watch is own by loin air group, very good 👍