I find it fascinating to listen to the amount of mental gymnastics that a theist will perform to try to rationalize their belief in a supernatural entity.
Gary Caissie ...and I'll bet, in some cases at least, them "prepping their argument" for the call is more thinking than they usually do about basis for their faith. And, to the minimal extent they listen and even (I can hope) comprehend and consider the host's replies...
Bible Bill You didnt address that to either if the people in this thread. Not a shocker. Cuz your comment is pretty well the generic assertion, both in the bible and used by religious leaders to control the "flock". That we should be ashamed of ourselves. I, for one, am not. But I think you should be.
+Bible Bill You must be kidding! Sure, deep down everybody believes in magical sky daddy's who shapeshifts into people and have themselves tortured to death to get over their own anger issues. Oh yeah, deep down we all believe in talking snakes and donkeys, unicorns and 4 headed cherubins. WRONG!! Some of us grow up!
Bible Bill Is that what they tell you in your church? That the only people that don't buy the bullshit they feed you are evil sinners? You must really need to swallow this nonsense. Here's a newsflash. There is no god, no devil, no demons, no angels, no souls, no heaven, no hell, no dragons, no serafins, no unicorns, and no jesus. There is just ancient fairy tales and gullible people who believe it.
Bible Bill Again, a generic post. From your copy paste pile of religious cliches. You can use your phone to make a post. But you, dude, are "just phoning it in". ie not even trying anymore.
The Creator is "outside" and unbounded by our space time laws and rules, which has endings and beginnings. It is The Creator. So why does an Advanced being have to obey his own laws he set up for your ass? Please do explain. They grafted YOU, our Universe was being programed and seeded with Life Forms, billions of years prior to your existence. So why would the programmers of our Universe be limited to it's creation's limitations. Your argument falls flat. Obviously, You atheists aren't as smart as you think you are. Lol Those Universal limitations or Laws and Rules are for y'all creations. You humans are trying to disprove of a highly advanced Supreme being based on your VERY limited consciousness and primitive understanding. Please stop! Lol Human beings had a creational point and you humans WILL HAVE YOUR ENDING point. You think your creator have to obey same rules and have the same limitations as you. This Goes for you Christians too. You're even worse. You Religitards create this watered down man made, jealous, vengeful over emotional God based on your lack of Ultrastanding and then wonder why we have Atheists. Dumbest shit I've heard in my life. Anyway, You "Earthbound limited Creations" are bound by movement of "time", and its very brief. That's why you age, you are designed to be utilized serve a purpose then like the dinosaurs, you will have your destruction and be base in order for something new to be brought upon this Space-Time. In other words, you will decay. The Creator God Non existent? What are you dumb? The Supreme Architect, the Divine Programmer would pre-exist before the creation began, which is outside of space-time, therefore he is ageless and ETERNAL. Again, God is unbounded by its own rules of which it created. The Big Bang "Explosion" had a Big Beginning, it will implode and collapse in on itself and that will be the Big ending. Lol No way the precise logical order of the Universe is out of random. Nothing is randomly placed. Even at the level of the microcosm of reality. All creations and projections have a purposeful order and intent, a structure set forth in motion, through space and time by an Advance Intelligence to serve a grand purpose. The cells in your Biological make up have pre programmed encoded messages for duties which is based on purpose and intent. So you can't tell me the physical human body was randomly engineered. Then that would mean you are insanely stupid. The Geometrical blue print of many life forms proves of a timeless creator with divine intent and logical purpose. An equation can't randomly appear out of thin air, you slow minded atheists!!! An equation has to be written in existence. Even the Celestial bodies are all utilized for practical purpose. Since there is no time, prior to the big bang, the Supreme Being would have to be "Eternal". If you are in existence, outside the realm of time, then duh you're ageless. There is no created or gestational period nor decay outside the fabric of time. You are complete. We are like antennaes are one of many of The Supreme God's focal point for sending messages, moving through space & time. Still you are limited creations, have a fetish for thoughts and limitations which bound you by rules it's no wonder you believe God doesn't exist. You are ignorantly disproving of the Supreme Architect, the Programmer but only because the Grand Architect "God" isn't bound by the limitations you were created to be bound ans limited to? So mankind's limited existent would mean it's creator is also limited? Reaaaalllllyyy? "Created beings" attempt to theorize disproof of your creator's existence, while using mankind bounded theories and concepts within a limited human conscious. Your existence is only a couple thousand years old , you are still class mental baby. Shut up! You think Advanced Intelligence has to be constrained by the same LAWS you are encoded to obey? How Advance beings create and then be limited to it the creation? Supreme Creator Beings don't obide by the laws of physics which is it many creations, which were set in time & space to follow. The Creator, can rewrite the blue print and reprogram your Laws of Physics that will change the fabric of the Universe. The precise mathematical structure of nature (For example, the mathematical positions of the Sun and Moon to the Earth, is in perfect mathematic measurement to sustain and grow life. It is too precise to be random. That was purposefully arranged by a Logical living Intelligence. The Sun is in direct position to the Earth to grow life through time. Proof right there of an Intelligent Creator with purposeful intent. In summary, The Creator do exist. No the Supreme Architect which you call "God" isn't confined to the expansion/decay process of these multiple space time dimensional time frames. The Super Advanced Programmers are Eternal beings without beginning nor end because the programmer exists outside of our Space Time constructs. Therefore, The Ultra Advanced, Supreme Mental God is ageless, timeless etc.
Listening to religious believers talk about the qualities of their God is like listening to people talking about their favorite super heroes and their super powers.
it's not that he is not allowed, I know it sounds stupid but God is the creator and we and the entire universe are the created. no one can fully begin to wrap their mind around the history and creation of the universe but we can look to evidence in every day life to make a judgement for ourselves to either have faith and be ridiculed for it or we can go along with the flow like robots and just do what society wants us to.
@@davidhatcher7016 - it's a Dungeon and Dragons reference. They are magic items in the game, that if you put one in the other, they cause a rift in the plane that sucks you in. God, I just realized how much of a nerd I am.
"They'd never have the time to do anything" A statement of finite thought. This is understandable for it is hard to wrap one's mind around the thought of infinity. Is time infinite and eternal? A God who is infinite, eternal and transcends the natural, is not bound by the things natural...time. Scientists say the universe is winding down. Does time continue when the universe ends? If time began with the universe (a factor scientists use to try to figure out the origin of the universe...as time approaches zero), is it logical to think time ends with the end of the universe? I'm not all knowing and I know you aren't all knowing so why couldn't God...an infinite, eternal transendent being live outside of time? What time is it for a being that has no beginning?
joyrailroad If you are just a human, then your thoughts on this subject are as finite as mine. Time is chronology. All actions take place within a chronological order of events. Hence, a being outside of chronology does nothing. This apologist idea that yhwh lives outside of chronological events conflicts with the bible since in the bible, yhwh was creating even before he created this universe.
joyrailroad Where the Hell do Christians get fed all of this nonsensical bullshit about God's immunity to our logic and the physics of our universe? You speak as if you've studied God's nature somehow and that you've made conclusions based on observation of him in his realm. It's so funny to hear Christians say, "We are weak minded humans, so we will never be able to comprehend it...except for me, I can comprehend it". So often you guys negate your own argument because you attempt to explain God and his separate realm right after you just finished saying, "it is unknowable". Come on people! You really want us to take you seriously?
Hearts0fSpace "Where the Hell do Christians get fed all of this nonsensical bullshit about God's immunity to our logic and the physics of our universe?" You answered your question. Christ. Jesus of Nazareth calmed the sea, fed 5000+ people, raised the dead, etc. You seem to have a problem because the only god you can conceive of must be physical only. God's nature isn't just natural...meaning the physical only. You really aren't upset with me, you are upset with the claims of Jesus Christ. "You speak as if you've studied God's nature somehow and that you've made conclusions based on observation of him in his realm." Again a statement limited in scope. I've studied God's nature not somehow, but by reading His word (the Bible). Again, because you can conceive of only the physical, you think of only the physical sciences as being able to observe and test. Science is the "study of." May you should study the person of Jesus Christ and His claims if you dare. His claims changed his brothers, changed his followers, changed Paul, etc. You problem with Christians is in short your problem with Jesus Christ. "So often you guys negate your own argument because you attempt to explain God and his separate realm right after you just finished saying, "it is unknowable"." Again such limited thinking. You are thinking same sense when we are talking about two different senses. You see a contradiction where there is none. I can be a father and a son at the same time, but not in the same sense...not in the same relationship.
incomprehensible14 "If you are just a human, then your thoughts on this subject are as finite as mine." Not a totally true statement. Yes, our minds are finite, but my thoughts are not the same as yours. You can not think of something that is possible outside of the physical realm. "This apologist idea that yhwh lives outside of chronological events conflicts with the bible since in the bible, yhwh was creating even before he created this universe." I can be a father and a son at the same time, but not in the same sense...not in the same relationship. There is no contradiction in yhwh creating even before he created this universe. Creating in the spiritual realm and creating in the physical realm are two different senses...they are not in the same relationship. My thoughts aren't as finite and limited as yours and I am just as human as you. You see a conflict, because you have a conflict with the person of Jesus Christ and His claims.
'Napkin God' is the 1 true god because it says so right here on this napkin that the universe and life can't exist without Napkin God, therefore it's true.
"A lot of background in physics" "That object would actually stretch" I'm pulling the BS flag. As you approach the speed of light, time slows, mass increases, and you lose length. Nothing would appear stretched from either viewpoints. All light outside of the ship would appear behind the ship at a point. To observers you would appear squished in length. I assume this layman was saying that from within the ship, god would have a completely omnipresent view. However, if god didn't have mass and could reach c, god would also not have time or length. If a god transcended having mass and length and existed in some 2D form, god still wouldn't have time and would be unable to react with the outside world. If god transcends mass, length, and time, then there's no reason to bring up relativity. There's no rational argument to be made here.
You see, if the rules that govern the universe according to science doesn't support my imaginary beliefs I get the create my own imaginary rules to support them. If you find a flaw in those imaginary rules I can then change them or demand special rules that do support my imaginary beliefs to justify them as real.
Jeff Dees vs. O'Reilley might even be more fun. The way Jeff gets excited and starts raising his voice, and the way Bill always tries to shout down his opponent, it could turn into a regular brawl.
A "god" (not necessarily a creator) is probably defined as the being with the most technology (knowledge). To beings with less technology, that being would be making "miracles" and seem like a god. So, if there are billions of habitable planets in this universe, and thus thousands of sentient beings, all you need is to list all beings within this universe on a technological scale. Look at the top of the list... that's "god."
It's an interesting thought but as Matt and Tracy and others have said many times, it's all speculation until you can identify what the caller or person making the claim defines. Once there's a definition then you can assess the claim's evidence and logical viability.
I don't think so. I think there are exactly 2 relevant questions: (1) are there other being out there? (2) are some of them MUCH more advanced? Thats it... the rest is just a coincidence of them happening to pick a planet to visit with less intelligent life (say earth), and showing the earthlings a bit of their tech (intentionally or otherwise).
For one, I had a Muslim client in Dearborn, Mi who was convinced that he had seen the prophet during Ramadan (I think he fasted too long). Or for a more famous case check out Tony Blair's sister in law who claimed to have had a profound spiritual experience at the shrine of Fatima and immediately converted. "...felt this shot of spiritual morphine, just absolute bliss and joy." All religions report such experiences. It leads me to think they are artifacts of the mind.
here is a thought to chew on, if practicing religion is remotely as important as practicing science then suppose the world stopped entirely of one of the two. one effect would be people becoming more rational and less gullible, and the other would devastate the world and halt human progression of delving into the beautiful and ugly mysteries of the universe.
The problem is that many people suppose mystery when there isn't anything mysterious about thr subject. Lots of irrational people will see a scientific, rational explanation for a things and a mystical one thinking they are both fair calls and make an assessment without properly examining the evidence. Just look at all those supernatural top 5 lists about creepy things in the woods and aliens and the bullshit 'some theorise such and such' or 'perhaps it's this whacky thing'. Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.
paberry007 What exactly is scary about that? Do you occasionally wake up in a cold sweat when you think about how you didn't exist before your parents conceived you? Personally it didn't trouble me in the least, and thus the notion that we'll simply cease to be after death is hardly worrying either.
Katherine Daniel as an atheist myself I know a lot of people scratch their head at the prospect of being afraid of death, I'm not as afraid of it anymore now that I have come to grips with it, but just thinking about not existing really bothers me sometimes so I simply choose not to think about it as much as I can.
@FFreethinker I just wanted to say that I watch your show from France, and it's awesome!; Pretentiously enough, I give you my support in the name of the whole country. (only about 1/4 practicing religious people in France woop woop)
"If we evolved from apes, why do they still exist." My friend, anyone who even thinks about asking that question really doesn't have the smallest idea what evolution by natural selection is all about. Your understanding is, quite frankly,childish. Don't you think that it would be a good idea before criticising something to take some time to learn something about it? And please, don't get you knowledge of evolution from creationists, get it from real scientists who won't lie to you about it.
Would god [assuming it exists] be able to create an object so resilient and indestructible that even he wouldn't be able to destroy it, after creating it? This is a question specifically designed to logically demonstrate the impossibility of omnipotence as an ability because this ability would immediately bring about an inescapable paradox. Thus, from my point of view, would logically forcefully removing the omnipotent status from god.
Wrongful thinking and definition of omnipotent. Omnipotent is a term used to compare God and His capabilities to other gods and humans....not to Himself. He is the ultimate power. None can compare to Him. Your point of view is illogical for it assumes a definition of omnipotent to mean no ultimate power...therefore always a paradox. The host of this youtube clip is also illogical. God is infinite, He has no beginning and no end. If God was created as this host of this youtube video claims, then God wouldn't be infinite Is the term infinity illogical? Is so, math is illogical, science is illogical, and humankind is illogical. Infinity must also be a paradox to you as well. God is logical, those who place God in finite terms are illogical.
Zero Helix"If god is capable of being infinite then what justification do you have for saying the universe can't be?" Do you believe in your sciences or not? It is science that claims that the universe is dying. See the laws of thermodynamics. The universe has a beginning...how?...explained again by science so not eternal or infinite. Justification? I do believe some things in science, just not always the details since man made. The bible and science agree in many areas but not always in the details. So, I have not invalidated my original statement. Maybe you are just someone who doesn't believe in anything.
joyrailroad "The universe has a beginning...how?" so what? how do you go from the question *how did the universe come to be?* to *therefore there is an infinitely powerful supernatural, intangible, invisible, eternal, personal being that cares who you sleep with and gets upset if you masturbate*? the universe had a beginning, and since time began with the universe, one can logically assert that the universe has always existed. You cannot talk about before the universe because there was no time and therefore using the ward *before is illogical because that word can only exist with a time context. Something cannot exist for 0 seconds or negative 5 seconds. That assertion would be illogical. Your argument fails because you assume that time stretches infinitely backwards but in fact it doesn't. Time started with the universe itself. Thus the universe always existed.
***** LOL You talk babble so I don't respond to nonsense. Example...claiming this god is x, y, and z doesn't make it so. God isn't x, y, or z. That is your babble. I don't blackout to your comments...I ignore bs.
Because there is proof all around you. The thing is you can't wait for someone to simply tell you you need to actively seek it. God reaches out to us all the time but when do we actually seek.
But I'm sure to you guy that answer is not sufficient cause you ask questions instead of finding the answers your self. I was a skeptic once till I actively searched on my own but it's not my place to tell you what to do.
Thank you, you hit the nail on the hammer. What if nobody created the universe. Exactly. No religion even explains how the universe came into being. In what is the universe, darkness. So nothing created itself. Therefore the universe created God, which created the big bang, which gave the universe all of it's scientific principles and know explains why everything is perfect.
+Bible Bill why? The caller clearly doesn't understand physics. He quite obviously doesn't know how light works if he thinks that we somehow perceive individual photons as rays.
Bible Bill seriously dude, you need to study science. Rainbows are the product of refraction of light through water droplets. Just because your book says something doesn't mean that it is true. It's far more likely is that someone decided that god must have done it so that's what they put in the book.
Bible Bill oh, you're a troll. I thought you were being serious. My bad. Just in case though... the banana was genetically engineered by humans (using giided evolutionary processes) to the form we have now. No divine influence there, just selective breeding.
Bible Bill you do realize that all of the copypasta you're dumping here is bullshit, right? Rainbows are caused by sunlight refracted by raindrops, man engineered bananas, and multiple languages are exactly what should happen when widely spread tribes of primitive man independently developed language over hundreds of thousands of years. If you want to discuss any of these I'll happily do so, but if you just want to dump some apologist's nonsense - I'm guessing Ray Comfort since he's the only moron who pushes the banana claim - then you might as well give up. All you are proving is that your indoctrination is more important to you than reality.
'God' doesn't need our help? Neither do pink unicorns; what's your point, david b? Neither are proven to exist, a nonexistent thing needs no help FROM anyone FOR anything. So what's your POINT?
This reminds me of the point I made to the last 2 bible pimps who came to my house.....'If there actually was an omnipresent omniscient god, he definitely wouldn't need a book or you knocking on the doors.'
cont'd. if you say ''i'm neutral'' you're an atheist, because you must believe in a god to be a theist. an atheist is someone who lacks belief in a god, just as any neutral person lacks belief. if a person believes there is no god, he's also an atheist, but his belief would require justification. where as implict atheism and weak atheism do not. atheism is the null hypothesis. in a world where gods are nowhere to be found, the default position is to have no belief in them.
"You're giving an answer that contradicts your premise, so thanks for calling!" Matt's a solid debater but Martin knows how to toss out the one-liners. How to use Christian paradox against this caller: if God is all-powerful then He can choose not to exist outside of space and time, and if He is omnipresent, then he already does. Even if this is the case, He's still irrational, immoral, immaterial, invisible, and ultimately once we get past this insane notion, irrelevant.
What if you are wrong and God is God. And of course be the time we pass away, and we either go into darkness or face God himself. I would not judge people who believe in God. Nobody truly knows.
@@nv7452 As you're dying, if you see God, you won't be able to discern the experience from a dream-like state being created by an oxygen-starved dying brain. You'll never be able to confirm the experience as real.
PT 3 - One thing that must be clarified as to the involuntary nature of glossalia. While the subject experiences a feeling of loss of control, the activity can be brought about on cue, suggesting either a conscious or unconscious control of the phenomenon. While not conclusive, it refutes your contention that it is PROVEN to be involuntary, and suggests a conditioned response pattern that is goal directed.
Obviously god (me) is Timeless, Spaceless & Immaterial. Why ? Because "Timeless, Spaceless & Immaterial" is the exact, the precise, the indisputable definition of Non-Existent. 🤣
It's not just "solving a mystery with a mystery" it is replacing a mystery by introducing a new mystery, then saying that the second mystery is insoluble.
The "grid" of space contains non-uniform densities, which helps create variations in space/time, by affecting the vortex-like movements of curved vectors. This means that "atoms" will behave differently depending on where they are in space.
PT 2 - Speaking in tongues or glossalalia shows every sign of being a learned behavior, including that the speech pattern and style of speakers is influenced by where it is learned and who from. Linguistic analysis indicates that there is no information content in the speech and brain scans indicate that there is very little activity in the language center of the brain, but much in the emotional centers. Outside of Christianity it is primarily found in Paganistic and Shamanistic religions
The caller was going to say that objects stretch as they approach the speed of light, so if god travels faster than the speed of light then it would stretch infinitely and be everywhere at once. However, the reality is that objects shrink when they approach the speed of light, not stretch, quite the opposite of what the caller claims - so if anything he would have proven that god is nowhere.
The caller is wrong, by the way. The whole point about time dilation is that the speed of light remains unchanged for all observers, irrespective of their speed, direction, or frame of reference. It won't get stretched out into a "ray" -- if you're traveling toward a light source of away from it, it will change color due to Doppler shifting, but all its other characteristics will remain the same.
What did those stars do for god to hang them? That sounds needlessly cluel. Did light get in his eyes and he freaked out so much that he crapped a magical rope out of his butt and started to hang them with it?
1) We don't know that the kind of space warping necessary for FTL is possible. Hypothetically, it may be, but there is no proof of this. 2) You need to study relativity a bit more. Look up length contraction. In effect, at speeds near C, since distance traveled is = velocity X time, when your rate of time slows down, it effectively shortens distances also. 1 light year to you could equal a billion light years to us. It is weird, but true, that is why it doesn't violate the light speed limit.
How does anybody make someone else happy? I usually try to make people laugh and smile, help them when they need someone, comfort them when they need it. What makes someone happy can vary, and since people generally seek out happiness I do my best to give them some, even if it's only a little. You don't need faith for this, no gods, no demons, no religion. If you have empathy and actually like seeing people happy, why not try to make people happy? It's really quite simple.
Well sure, but that doesn't address the point I was making. A loving god would not use "Must believe in my existence" as the sole criterion for entering heaven. This god would know everyone better than they know themselves, will know how the actions they've taken have impacted upon the lives of others around them, and whether that impact has been positive or negative, and would judge us based on the nature of the impact we've had on the world, rather than solely our belief/disbelief in him.
To answer your first question...for all we know, "black holes" ARE arteries to the outside world. To answer your second question...if universes can be born, then they can also die. Recycling seems to be popular, at least in this universe.
I agree 1 of the definitions of Atheism is the rejection of belief in a god or gods. When You reject a specific belief it means You lack that belief. When You're neutral (NO position) on a belief it also means You lack that belief. When You deny a belief it also means you lack that belief. What pt. R U trying 2 make ? R U suggesting these definitions don't suggest a lack of belief ? Continued ....
What matt forgot didn't know or forgot to mention is that basically an universe with a flat geometry does not necessarily violate laws of thermodynamics. Nasa's WMAP studies have shown that: " We now know that the universe is flat with only a 0.5% margin of error. " (that's a straight quote from NASAs website). Secondly, quantum physics have shown that things do appear spontaneously without a cause at placks lenght scale (virtual particles).
@SeedsOfHatred The whole thing is on youtube. If anyone hasn't seen it, you should. It's explained beautifully by one of the smarter men who has ever lived. If there is anyone who can understand the vast array of complexities that it would take to create a universe, it's him.
SCIENCE PSA: Photons do NOT stretch, they are dimensionless quanta of light, a laser beam appears as a straight line because the wavelengths are synchronized to decrease diffusion. MATTER that's traveling at near the speed of light DOES appear to stretch. The reason for this is that the front of the object is hitting photons sooner than the rear of the object so that by the time the photons reach your eyes it appears stretched because of the massive speeds at which it's moving. This also occurs in everyday life but the effect is so slight that we don't notice it. You can also visualize this like driving a car in the rain. If you think of the rain like light then the picture you have of a car going very fast is going to look stretched because it travels further down the road in the time it takes the raindrop to fall.
If someone says that another human being is their property, let alone their own spouse, I will immediately count them as an immoral person. Amoral means a decision requires no moral assessment. Immoral means doing things that aren't moral. If you're agreeing with slavery and keeping women as property that means you're making an immoral decision and have no ground to judge anybody else in regards to that issue. I don't think you know what these terms mean or are purposefully using them wrong.
I never called you stupid, please point out where I said such a thing. I specifically avoid doing things like that because it doesn't help an argument. I will never stop being intelligent, seeking knowledge, asking questions, and demanding evidence. If I ever do, I would hope someone would slap across the face to shock me back to my senses. Truth is specifically tied to evidence, because how would you know something is true without evidence?
He gets it wrong in the first 1:30 when he says the light would not bounce off and the observer would not be able to see you. Light will reach the traveler at C relative to HIM and, when reflected, will return to the observer at c relative to the observer. Of course the observer would get back light waves so red-shifted he would need special equipment to detect them.
@Prologicful "is appropriate BEFORE you conduct an experiment or test a hypothesis." If you're the future of astrophysics, I worry. I'll lay it out simply: experiments for one thing are rarely done without preliminary experiments to test the premises. The experiments in abiogenesis, so far, have shown that it's possible for organic matter to combine naturally in an early-Earth atmosphere, which means it MIGHT BE POSSIBLE for the necessary organic compounds to form.
Is that really the right way to think? I'm an atheist and I have nothing wrong with showing emotion, but as a person (completely separate from my atheism) I think being overly emotional is counter-productive. Emotions are a natural part of human existence, it's how people act on them that makes all the difference, and that's the part that's taught. Faith is a mindset, not really what I'd call an emotion, anyway.
Supernatural doesn't get you to "a god created us and the universe," there's no connection between a "supernatural" experience and creation. Also, what if someone had a different type of experience than you and came to a completely different conclusion? Who's right and who's wrong? I'll tell you right now that not everyone can be right, but everyone can be wrong.
you are correct, which is why it isnt a dimension in the euclidean model. but in the minkowski model of spacetime, time is a dimension. it is dependent on the three spatial dimensions i think. my understanding of this doesnt go too much further than a buddy of mine who took physics at yale, a brian greene book, and wiki. i highly recommend the book THE ELEGANT UNIVERSE as well as THE FABRIC OF THE COSMOS.
here's the thing about infinite regression. Sure, if you want to say that there has to be a god outside of time and space, you open this slippery slope that there is no way possible to make a distinction between one god or an infinite series of gods who have to create each other. Now you have to say why you can recognize the distinction between more than one god and one god.
I like to hope there's more to my existence after I'm dead. Recently started flipping out in my mind that once I'm gone, there's nothing left to think, and to not think was absolutely frightening for me, still is mostly. The only things that bring me hope is the fact that I have experienced spiritual interaction from those who have passed on. This isn't some kind of hallucination and like religion, it isn't something I can prove to others. Also, I commonly experience deja vu. This to me makes me think that maybe there are multiple dimensions of reality and that existence is really something more than just myself. Maybe there is this bigger thought that for some reason I'm just part of some tangent. I don't know. I don't fear death, and I'm curious to know what comes next. I just sometimes fear the worst possible outcome, in my opinion, which is absolute nothingness after I die. I cant imagine not imagining since that's all I ever do as being alive. All I want to know is, what's next? If I can figure this out, I'm okay with whatever outcome I get. I believe eventually in my lifetime, I will figure this out, maybe I already have, but I will receive a confirmation that can be testable for not just myself, but others so they can also receive hope for the next step. I don't want it to be another religion. I believe that we have the capabilities to figure out and prove it scientifically, we just haven't developed the means to test and fail at proving it wrong. If I die before then, at least I tried. If not, then maybe a lot of the issues we have today can just go away. I think therefore I am. I can observe a universe, therefore I can assume it exists. I didn't know before I was alive, but maybe I was alive in another form? Maybe consciousness is like a cell that divides and becomes its own entity, where when it exists it doesnt not exist. When the car dies, the power is transferred somewhere else. Maybe my energy becomes concentrated heat to which it is enough for me to exist long enough to develop a sense of not worrying anymore about the thing I worry about, which is non existence. Again, I wish I knew and didn't have to worry about not knowing. Maybe if there was a way to encapsulate my mind, which I'm sure is possible, then I could better understand what it means. I don't think to live requires having a purpose other than to be alive, but understanding how it works may be a way to defeating this innate fear of non existence that I have, which I know a lot of people have, because religion.
8 Why 8? Is an infinite #. Evolution never ends Atoms are forming everything in the universe all the ( time) there are atoms that are in your body in short period of time, and some that are a long time. So your reality is created by atoms also known as infinite intelligence
Being an agnostic means that I make no claims of knowledge about the existence of any gods since there's no evidence proving one or disproving one, while being an atheist means that I don't believe since that evidence hasn't been presented. They're related concepts but they're not the same, since one focuses on making a claim, while the other merely focuses on the belief of that claim. Basically, I believe something that I know, but I don't necessarily know something I believe.
Even if we're all brains in jars, it doesn't matter. The things we all experience every day is what makes up the reality we live in, and since there's no way to determine that we're brains in jars or a way to get out of them if we are, we need to live in this reality and discover things about it. Even if we're all just a figment of your imagination, without a way to know that or get out, we have to live in that reality and experience things within it.
@vaguevocalist17 I remember when that first came on TV. It was epic. What ever happened to that show? I watch the Science Channel all the time but I haven't seen it lately. The last episode I saw was with Eli Roth talking about Psychopathy.
@hgryphon It doesn't imply anything like that at all, it quite clearly states it would be wrong to apply laws from one universe to another where we don't know what the other universe is like, it's fairly straighforward really in that it means we "can't make things" up or "make assumptions" and use it as proof
@BankHeistVideos You do make me smile. Consider the lack of knowledge we would have if we only relied on are sensual perception. And then look at the tools we create to extend our understanding past our sensual perception. This is the reason that we know for a fact that our concept of reality is subjective and does not accurately represent the reality that is abundantly evident all around us. The illusion is our perception of reality and not reality itself. Reality itself is just energy fields
Would you care to back that up with references to a specific study which says this and has citations as to the methodology and time frames for the absorption of the statistics?
The Douglas Adams paradox God says - "I refuse to prove I exist because proof denies faith and without faith I am nothing" man says "what about the Babel Fish, that's a dead giveaway" "Oh dear " says God "I hadn't thought of that" who disappears in a puff of logic, having proven that he exists and therefore doesn't exist at the same time.
By one estimate, put forth by Dan Bollinger, a prominent opponent of circumcision, based on his review of infant mortality statistics, about 117 boys die each year as a result of circumcision. That estimate is cited often by critics of routine circumcision but widely disputed by medical professionals. A spokeswoman for the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention said the agency did not keep track of deaths from infant circumcision because they are exceedingly rare
3:40 He says because something had to create the universe because it can not create itself due to the law of conservation of energy completely ignoring that that law states energy can not be created XD.
It's not that we 'assume' this. It's the simple fact that we do not possess methods to observe anything outside spacetime. Anything can be claimed and asserted to be 'outside' spacetime, but those claims and assertions can never be checked, so they are as interesting as leprechauns, unicorns and flying spaghetti monsters
If my thinking processes were to change how would I know I was in the correct state-of-mind to make any rational decision in whatever type of hypothetical situation you're talking about? So far, my current thinking processes keep me skeptical of supernatural claims that have no evidence and to ask for evidence if someone claims something that doesn't fit within reality. If that were to change I hope someone would slap me back to my senses.
I am in possession of an English Standard Version of the bible, but my brother has a King James bible so I compare the two sometimes. My bible doesn't collect dust because I carry it around in my computer bag so I can read it and take notes on it whenever I want. It's always close-by so I can verify if someone says there's a passage or subject in there that I haven't memorized (because why should I memorize it?). I take notes and tab it to go back to it, but maybe I missed your personal 7.
The god has laws too that apply to him. He created this world with very accurate numbers. He couldn't choose any other numbers or we wouldn't exist. So he was restricted by laws that are beyond his control.
I like when ordinary people try to sound smart and bring up physics when all they know about it is what they saw on a discovery channel show. Then the first thing they always bring up to sound like they know what their talking about is time slowing down as you get closer to the speed of light.
I have a theory for life and nature as a whole. Please keep an open mind. The Universe is made of multidimensional "vectors" or "movements". In nature, a vector is not straight, but curved, because of a mirror effect that would cancel opposing forces. All straight vectors would automatically cancel out and become the compressed medium for the energy of the curved vector. This creates a "grid" system in which only "curved" vectors are allowed expression of movement.
What these friendly atheists don't realize is that by dismissing the concept of an unexplained eternal Creator, they're asserting the existence of an unexplained eternal universe. It's not like their position has any more explanative power or intrinsic rationality. The question is: which is more likely to be eternal? The universe, or an outside cause of the universe? My take is that what we know about the universe precludes the plausibility of it being eternal (having no beginning).
There is a giant force which includes all kind of kinetic, chemical, gravitational, evolutional kind of energy combined but that energy is not the one described in religious books. That energy doesn’t care if we do good or bad deeds. Human used his mind to create imaginary figure who punishes and rewards after life
and the bible mentions that in the last days people will love themselves following after false doctrines.Would you risk the life you love so much to save another from harm or death?
it is not that the laws of physics have changed, but OUR UNDERSTANDING of the laws of physics have changed...just as we know now, thru science, that the earth rotates on it's axis, around the sun; that life has evolved with time, not at the whimsical desires of a nonexistent entity.
The "medical" facilities where Mother Teresa took people were full of suffering people that could have been helped if they received proper medical treatment, but instead they were left in pain until they died of various infections and diseases. Mother Teresa sought state-of-the-art medical treatment for herself, but everyone else was left to die. Her philosophy was something along the lines of people finding Jesus through pain. That sounds very sadistic to me.
I hate when people say "exist outside of our universe". If it's not a physical phenomenon inside our universe, it does not exist by the definition of the word "exist". What we difned as "real" or that "exists" is something that can be measured. If you say it cannot be measured, then by definition it doesn't exist and is not real. That's how we know if there's a cup of tea on a table. The cup exists if we can measure it, otherwise it doesn't. It's that simple. Exist outside universe = oxymoron.
To prove God we would first need to define what God is. That in itself is an argument that can not be won either way. Quantum mechanics allows room for God, however it is not the Christain ideology of God. Existance as we percive it is now known to be an illusion, and this solidity that we base are concept of reality on is actually fluid. Energy is the fundemental of everything, and energy can exist without matter. This allows consiouness to exist prior to matter, and thought is the key.
I think it's incredibly unlikely, partially because there's never been a demonstration of the cause behind any phenomenon theists cite, and because many of the properties of their god don't mix. The main one is being omnipotent (all powerful) can get in the way of being omniscient (all knowing). Can this being know what they're going to do tomorrow? Can they not do it? If they can, they're not omnipotent, and if they can't, they're not omniscient.
@acr08807 You are correct that both C and E can be used as an eigenvector to explain quanta's. However this fact does not prove that time can exist independently of energy. Which was the premiss of your argument. Hamiltonian methods are not being questioned. Your statement that time is independent of energy is. How do you reconcile the indeterministic nature of the wave-function collapse? Also as time is considered 4D how do you explain the lack of energy? Space is 3D, and together = Space-Time
AronRa says it well, that a god who couldn’t possibly exist outside of reality can’t exist IN reality
I find it fascinating to listen to the amount of mental gymnastics that a theist will perform to try to rationalize their belief in a supernatural entity.
Gary Caissie ...and I'll bet, in some cases at least, them "prepping their argument" for the call is more thinking than they usually do about basis for their faith. And, to the minimal extent they listen and even (I can hope) comprehend and consider the host's replies...
Bible Bill You didnt address that to either if the people in this thread. Not a shocker. Cuz your comment is pretty well the generic assertion, both in the bible and used by religious leaders to control the "flock".
That we should be ashamed of ourselves.
I, for one, am not. But I think you should be.
+Bible Bill You must be kidding! Sure, deep down everybody believes in magical sky daddy's who shapeshifts into people and have themselves tortured to death to get over their own anger issues. Oh yeah, deep down we all believe in talking snakes and donkeys, unicorns and 4 headed cherubins. WRONG!! Some of us grow up!
Bible Bill Is that what they tell you in your church? That the only people that don't buy the bullshit they feed you are evil sinners? You must really need to swallow this nonsense. Here's a newsflash. There is no god, no devil, no demons, no angels, no souls, no heaven, no hell, no dragons, no serafins, no unicorns, and no jesus. There is just ancient fairy tales and gullible people who believe it.
Bible Bill Again, a generic post. From your copy paste pile of religious cliches. You can use your phone to make a post. But you, dude, are "just phoning it in". ie not even trying anymore.
Of course god is outside space and time; otherwise known as non existence.
weskal eternity**
The Creator is "outside" and unbounded by our space time laws and rules, which has endings and beginnings. It is The Creator. So why does an Advanced being have to obey his own laws he set up for your ass? Please do explain. They grafted YOU, our Universe was being programed and seeded with Life Forms, billions of years prior to your existence. So why would the programmers of our Universe be limited to it's creation's limitations. Your argument falls flat. Obviously, You atheists aren't as smart as you think you are. Lol Those Universal limitations or Laws and Rules are for y'all creations. You humans are trying to disprove of a highly advanced Supreme being based on your VERY limited consciousness and primitive understanding. Please stop! Lol Human beings had a creational point and you humans WILL HAVE YOUR ENDING point. You think your creator have to obey same rules and have the same limitations as you. This Goes for you Christians too. You're even worse. You Religitards create this watered down man made, jealous, vengeful over emotional God based on your lack of Ultrastanding and then wonder why we have Atheists. Dumbest shit I've heard in my life. Anyway, You "Earthbound limited Creations" are bound by movement of "time", and its very brief. That's why you age, you are designed to be utilized serve a purpose then like the dinosaurs, you will have your destruction and be base in order for something new to be brought upon this Space-Time. In other words, you will decay. The Creator God Non existent? What are you dumb? The Supreme Architect, the Divine Programmer would pre-exist before the creation began, which is outside of space-time, therefore he is ageless and ETERNAL. Again, God is unbounded by its own rules of which it created. The Big Bang "Explosion" had a Big Beginning, it will implode and collapse in on itself and that will be the Big ending. Lol No way the precise logical order of the Universe is out of random. Nothing is randomly placed. Even at the level of the microcosm of reality. All creations and projections have a purposeful order and intent, a structure set forth in motion, through space and time by an Advance Intelligence to serve a grand purpose. The cells in your Biological make up have pre programmed encoded messages for duties which is based on purpose and intent. So you can't tell me the physical human body was randomly engineered. Then that would mean you are insanely stupid. The Geometrical blue print of many life forms proves of a timeless creator with divine intent and logical purpose. An equation can't randomly appear out of thin air, you slow minded atheists!!! An equation has to be written in existence. Even the Celestial bodies are all utilized for practical purpose. Since there is no time, prior to the big bang, the Supreme Being would have to be "Eternal". If you are in existence, outside the realm of time, then duh you're ageless. There is no created or gestational period nor decay outside the fabric of time. You are complete.
We are like antennaes are one of many of The Supreme God's focal point for sending messages, moving through space & time. Still you are limited creations, have a fetish for thoughts and limitations which bound you by rules it's no wonder you believe God doesn't exist. You are ignorantly disproving of the Supreme Architect, the Programmer but only because the Grand Architect "God" isn't bound by the limitations you were created to be bound ans limited to? So mankind's limited existent would mean it's creator is also limited? Reaaaalllllyyy?
"Created beings" attempt to theorize disproof of your creator's existence, while using mankind bounded theories and concepts within a limited human conscious. Your existence is only a couple thousand years old , you are still class mental baby. Shut up! You think Advanced Intelligence has to be constrained by the same LAWS you are encoded to obey? How Advance beings create and then be limited to it the creation? Supreme Creator Beings don't obide by the laws of physics which is it many creations, which were set in time & space to follow. The Creator, can rewrite the blue print and reprogram your Laws of Physics that will change the fabric of the Universe.
The precise mathematical structure of nature (For example, the mathematical positions of the Sun and Moon to the Earth, is in perfect mathematic measurement to sustain and grow life. It is too precise to be random. That was purposefully arranged by a Logical living Intelligence. The Sun is in direct position to the Earth to grow life through time. Proof right there of an Intelligent Creator with purposeful intent. In summary, The Creator do exist. No the Supreme Architect which you call "God" isn't confined to the expansion/decay process of these multiple space time dimensional time frames. The Super Advanced Programmers are Eternal beings without beginning nor end because the programmer exists outside of our Space Time constructs. Therefore, The Ultra Advanced, Supreme Mental God is ageless, timeless etc.
Shiiii nigga much like Santa and Bigfoot, Issa not real
You mean eternity? If there’s a place where time doesn’t exist, then there’s no beginning and end
Listening to religious believers talk about the qualities of their God is like listening to people talking about their favorite super heroes and their super powers.
So a universe isn't allowed to either have always existed or come about naturally, but a god IS allowed to have always existed.
+DemstarAus Allowed by whom? Or by what?
+Vertical Horizon By the person making the argument that a god can be eternal but they don't accept or allow the concept of an eternal universe.
Of course. Special pleading doesn't count when it comes to God.
+Amon Ra Aten Ra I created God.
it's not that he is not allowed, I know it sounds stupid but God is the creator and we and the entire universe are the created. no one can fully begin to wrap their mind around the history and creation of the universe but we can look to evidence in every day life to make a judgement for ourselves to either have faith and be ridiculed for it or we can go along with the flow like robots and just do what society wants us to.
Why do callers on this show always sound like they're crying?
+Joseph Moon It's the same waver that was in my voice at 6 when I investigated the existence of Santa.
Joseph Moon they’re not crying they’re just drugged out of their mind
@@EmpireTextbooks 😂
probably they screen 'em so only the emotional ones get thru
Copium is a heck of a drug
He needed the 7th day to rest. He is affected by time.
@@nild9002 agreed 😎. Check out bitchspot blog channel.
'Outside of space and time' is just a more elaborate 'magical bag of holding'.
just don't put that bag into a portable hole....
@@ColinABarr ?
@@davidhatcher7016 - it's a Dungeon and Dragons reference. They are magic items in the game, that if you put one in the other, they cause a rift in the plane that sucks you in. God, I just realized how much of a nerd I am.
@@williamcarlson1131 ayyy lmao
Outside of space and time is when you die
God(s) can't live outside of time. If they did, They'd never have the time to do anything.
"They'd never have the time to do anything" A statement of finite thought. This is understandable for it is hard to wrap one's mind around the thought of infinity. Is time infinite and eternal? A God who is infinite, eternal and transcends the natural, is not bound by the things natural...time. Scientists say the universe is winding down. Does time continue when the universe ends? If time began with the universe (a factor scientists use to try to figure out the origin of the universe...as time approaches zero), is it logical to think time ends with the end of the universe? I'm not all knowing and I know you aren't all knowing so why couldn't God...an infinite, eternal transendent being live outside of time? What time is it for a being that has no beginning?
joyrailroad If you are just a human, then your thoughts on this subject are as finite as mine.
Time is chronology. All actions take place within a chronological order of events. Hence, a being outside of chronology does nothing. This apologist idea that yhwh lives outside of chronological events conflicts with the bible since in the bible, yhwh was creating even before he created this universe.
joyrailroad Where the Hell do Christians get fed all of this nonsensical bullshit about God's immunity to our logic and the physics of our universe? You speak as if you've studied God's nature somehow and that you've made conclusions based on observation of him in his realm. It's so funny to hear Christians say, "We are weak minded humans, so we will never be able to comprehend it...except for me, I can comprehend it". So often you guys negate your own argument because you attempt to explain God and his separate realm right after you just finished saying, "it is unknowable".
Come on people! You really want us to take you seriously?
Hearts0fSpace "Where the Hell do Christians get fed all of this nonsensical bullshit about God's immunity to our logic and the physics of our universe?"
You answered your question. Christ. Jesus of Nazareth calmed the sea, fed 5000+ people, raised the dead, etc. You seem to have a problem because the only god you can conceive of must be physical only. God's nature isn't just natural...meaning the physical only. You really aren't upset with me, you are upset with the claims of Jesus Christ.
"You speak as if you've studied God's nature somehow and that you've made conclusions based on observation of him in his realm."
Again a statement limited in scope. I've studied God's nature not somehow, but by reading His word (the Bible). Again, because you can conceive of only the physical, you think of only the physical sciences as being able to observe and test. Science is the "study of." May you should study the person of Jesus Christ and His claims if you dare. His claims changed his brothers, changed his followers, changed Paul, etc. You problem with Christians is in short your problem with Jesus Christ.
"So often you guys negate your own argument because you attempt to explain God and his separate realm right after you just finished saying, "it is unknowable"."
Again such limited thinking. You are thinking same sense when we are talking about two different senses. You see a contradiction where there is none. I can be a father and a son at the same time, but not in the same sense...not in the same relationship.
incomprehensible14 "If you are just a human, then your thoughts on this subject are as finite as mine."
Not a totally true statement. Yes, our minds are finite, but my thoughts are not the same as yours. You can not think of something that is possible outside of the physical realm.
"This apologist idea that yhwh lives outside of chronological events conflicts with the bible since in the bible, yhwh was creating even before he created this universe."
I can be a father and a son at the same time, but not in the same sense...not in the same relationship. There is no contradiction in yhwh creating even before he created this universe. Creating in the spiritual realm and creating in the physical realm are two different senses...they are not in the same relationship. My thoughts aren't as finite and limited as yours and I am just as human as you. You see a conflict, because you have a conflict with the person of Jesus Christ and His claims.
'Napkin God' is the 1 true god because it says so right here on this napkin that the universe and life can't exist without Napkin God, therefore it's true.
Haha
Can you forgive me of sin of mocking you 😐😣😕
no gods, just live your life.
dkthg ...
@@TheKSProduction ?
@@davidhatcher7016 ??? It's a sexual approach what's confusing?
Lol
"A lot of background in physics" "That object would actually stretch" I'm pulling the BS flag.
As you approach the speed of light, time slows, mass increases, and you lose length. Nothing would appear stretched from either viewpoints. All light outside of the ship would appear behind the ship at a point. To observers you would appear squished in length.
I assume this layman was saying that from within the ship, god would have a completely omnipresent view. However, if god didn't have mass and could reach c, god would also not have time or length. If a god transcended having mass and length and existed in some 2D form, god still wouldn't have time and would be unable to react with the outside world. If god transcends mass, length, and time, then there's no reason to bring up relativity. There's no rational argument to be made here.
He can't prove gods exist, so he tries to prove omnipresence. :/
Why?
@@davidhatcher7016 I haven`t got the foggiest .............
You see, if the rules that govern the universe according to science doesn't support my imaginary beliefs I get the create my own imaginary rules to support them. If you find a flaw in those imaginary rules I can then change them or demand special rules that do support my imaginary beliefs to justify them as real.
Michael B
Pretty much .
Jeff Dees vs. O'Reilley might even be more fun. The way Jeff gets excited and starts raising his voice, and the way Bill always tries to shout down his opponent, it could turn into a regular brawl.
A "god" (not necessarily a creator) is probably defined as the being with the most technology (knowledge). To beings with less technology, that being would be making "miracles" and seem like a god. So, if there are billions of habitable planets in this universe, and thus thousands of sentient beings, all you need is to list all beings within this universe on a technological scale. Look at the top of the list... that's "god."
It's an interesting thought but as Matt and Tracy and others have said many times, it's all speculation until you can identify what the caller or person making the claim defines. Once there's a definition then you can assess the claim's evidence and logical viability.
I don't think so. I think there are exactly 2 relevant questions:
(1) are there other being out there?
(2) are some of them MUCH more advanced?
Thats it... the rest is just a coincidence of them happening to pick a planet to visit with less intelligent life (say earth), and showing the earthlings a bit of their tech (intentionally or otherwise).
How do you get from "the possibility of alien life" to "alien life is god"?
Interesting. I thought of that too.
For one, I had a Muslim client in Dearborn, Mi who was convinced that he had seen the prophet during Ramadan (I think he fasted too long). Or for a more famous case check out Tony Blair's sister in law who claimed to have had a profound spiritual experience at the shrine of Fatima and immediately converted. "...felt this shot of spiritual morphine, just absolute bliss and joy." All religions report such experiences. It leads me to think they are artifacts of the mind.
I don't know where to start to list all the things that are wrong in this claim.
special pleading fallacy + unfalsifiable hypotheticals = no evidence.
here is a thought to chew on, if practicing religion is remotely as important as practicing science then suppose the world stopped entirely of one of the two. one effect would be people becoming more rational and less gullible, and the other would devastate the world and halt human progression of delving into the beautiful and ugly mysteries of the universe.
The problem is that many people suppose mystery when there isn't anything mysterious about thr subject. Lots of irrational people will see a scientific, rational explanation for a things and a mystical one thinking they are both fair calls and make an assessment without properly examining the evidence. Just look at all those supernatural top 5 lists about creepy things in the woods and aliens and the bullshit 'some theorise such and such' or 'perhaps it's this whacky thing'. Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.
Yep
A ray is a mathematical concept of a line that has a starting point and continues infinitely in one direction. It is not a concept in physics.
I am scared shitless of dying and what happens after ,, but i will not try to make myself believe in a "god" or anything else.
Scared of what?
+Katherine Daniel non existence.
paberry007
What exactly is scary about that?
Do you occasionally wake up in a cold sweat when you think about how you didn't exist before your parents conceived you?
Personally it didn't trouble me in the least, and thus the notion that we'll simply cease to be after death is hardly worrying either.
Katherine Daniel as an atheist myself I know a lot of people scratch their head at the prospect of being afraid of death, I'm not as afraid of it anymore now that I have come to grips with it, but just thinking about not existing really bothers me sometimes so I simply choose not to think about it as much as I can.
paberry007
Why don't let's reflect upon that?
Give me some details: what exactly about non-existence troubles you?
@FFreethinker I just wanted to say that I watch your show from France, and it's awesome!; Pretentiously enough, I give you my support in the name of the whole country. (only about 1/4 practicing religious people in France woop woop)
How does Matt articulate everything so perfectly?
Years of practice.
"If we evolved from apes, why do they still exist."
My friend, anyone who even thinks about asking that question really doesn't have the smallest idea what evolution by natural selection is all about. Your understanding is, quite frankly,childish.
Don't you think that it would be a good idea before criticising something to take some time to learn something about it? And please, don't get you knowledge of evolution from creationists, get it from real scientists who won't lie to you about it.
Would god [assuming it exists] be able to create an object so resilient and indestructible that even he wouldn't be able to destroy it, after creating it?
This is a question specifically designed to logically demonstrate the impossibility of omnipotence as an ability because this ability would immediately bring about an inescapable paradox. Thus, from my point of view, would logically forcefully removing the omnipotent status from god.
Wrongful thinking and definition of omnipotent. Omnipotent is a term used to compare God and His capabilities to other gods and humans....not to Himself. He is the ultimate power. None can compare to Him. Your point of view is illogical for it assumes a definition of omnipotent to mean no ultimate power...therefore always a paradox.
The host of this youtube clip is also illogical. God is infinite, He has no beginning and no end. If God was created as this host of this youtube video claims, then God wouldn't be infinite Is the term infinity illogical? Is so, math is illogical, science is illogical, and humankind is illogical. Infinity must also be a paradox to you as well. God is logical, those who place God in finite terms are illogical.
Zero Helix"If god is capable of being infinite then what justification do you have for saying the universe can't be?"
Do you believe in your sciences or not? It is science that claims that the universe is dying. See the laws of thermodynamics. The universe has a beginning...how?...explained again by science so not eternal or infinite. Justification? I do believe some things in science, just not always the details since man made. The bible and science agree in many areas but not always in the details. So, I have not invalidated my original statement. Maybe you are just someone who doesn't believe in anything.
***** LOL. Logic is beyond you.
joyrailroad "The universe has a beginning...how?"
so what? how do you go from the question *how did the universe come to be?* to *therefore there is an infinitely powerful supernatural, intangible, invisible, eternal, personal being that cares who you sleep with and gets upset if you masturbate*?
the universe had a beginning, and since time began with the universe, one can logically assert that the universe has always existed. You cannot talk about before the universe because there was no time and therefore using the ward *before is illogical because that word can only exist with a time context. Something cannot exist for 0 seconds or negative 5 seconds. That assertion would be illogical.
Your argument fails because you assume that time stretches infinitely backwards but in fact it doesn't. Time started with the universe itself. Thus the universe always existed.
***** LOL You talk babble so I don't respond to nonsense. Example...claiming this god is x, y, and z doesn't make it so. God isn't x, y, or z. That is your babble. I don't blackout to your comments...I ignore bs.
When theists tell me that God is outside our realm of understand, I say, "Good, go away and stop bothering me with your meaning God."
Lol
Guy has absolutely zero knowledge of relativity.
Or less ...............
As soon as I hear "Outside Of Space And Time", I think "Daleks in a voidship".
Any Christians here because they were looking for "proof of God"?
im not here for that i am here just to watch people fight over something that they perceive does not exist. Argementive shadow boxing
The question itself is ironic. Why would you believe anything that you had no proof even exists.
Because there is proof all around you. The thing is you can't wait for someone to simply tell you you need to actively seek it. God reaches out to us all the time but when do we actually seek.
But I'm sure to you guy that answer is not sufficient cause you ask questions instead of finding the answers your self. I was a skeptic once till I actively searched on my own but it's not my place to tell you what to do.
Which hand does he reach out with?
Thank you, you hit the nail on the hammer. What if nobody created the universe. Exactly. No religion even explains how the universe came into being. In what is the universe, darkness. So nothing created itself. Therefore the universe created God, which created the big bang, which gave the universe all of it's scientific principles and know explains why everything is perfect.
Agreed. Check out bitchspot blog channel and tell him that.
Anyone actualy believe caller 'Haven' is an expert in physics as he claims? I'm betting he can't recite the multiplication tables.
+Bible Bill why? The caller clearly doesn't understand physics. He quite obviously doesn't know how light works if he thinks that we somehow perceive individual photons as rays.
Bible Bill seriously dude, you need to study science. Rainbows are the product of refraction of light through water droplets. Just because your book says something doesn't mean that it is true. It's far more likely is that someone decided that god must have done it so that's what they put in the book.
Bible Bill oh, you're a troll. I thought you were being serious. My bad. Just in case though... the banana was genetically engineered by humans (using giided evolutionary processes) to the form we have now. No divine influence there, just selective breeding.
Bible Bill Uh... have you ever heard of diffraction? Prisms?
Bible Bill you do realize that all of the copypasta you're dumping here is bullshit, right? Rainbows are caused by sunlight refracted by raindrops, man engineered bananas, and multiple languages are exactly what should happen when widely spread tribes of primitive man independently developed language over hundreds of thousands of years. If you want to discuss any of these I'll happily do so, but if you just want to dump some apologist's nonsense - I'm guessing Ray Comfort since he's the only moron who pushes the banana claim - then you might as well give up. All you are proving is that your indoctrination is more important to you than reality.
To say that god exists outside of reality is the same as saying he does not exist in reality.
defending God is like defending a lion homey,,,,,, he don't need your help
Then why are Christians spending all their time trying to defend God and can't do it at all?
'God' doesn't need our help? Neither do pink unicorns; what's your point, david b? Neither are proven to exist, a nonexistent thing needs no help FROM anyone FOR anything. So what's your POINT?
This reminds me of the point I made to the last 2 bible pimps who came to my house.....'If there actually was an omnipresent omniscient god, he definitely wouldn't need a book or you knocking on the doors.'
cont'd. if you say ''i'm neutral'' you're an atheist, because you must believe in a god to be a theist. an atheist is someone who lacks belief in a god, just as any neutral person lacks belief. if a person believes there is no god, he's also an atheist, but his belief would require justification. where as implict atheism and weak atheism do not. atheism is the null hypothesis. in a world where gods are nowhere to be found, the default position is to have no belief in them.
"You're giving an answer that contradicts your premise, so thanks for calling!" Matt's a solid debater but Martin knows how to toss out the one-liners.
How to use Christian paradox against this caller: if God is all-powerful then He can choose not to exist outside of space and time, and if He is omnipresent, then he already does. Even if this is the case, He's still irrational, immoral, immaterial, invisible, and ultimately once we get past this insane notion, irrelevant.
What if you are wrong and God is God. And of course be the time we pass away, and we either go into darkness or face God himself. I would not judge people who believe in God. Nobody truly knows.
@@nv7452 As you're dying, if you see God, you won't be able to discern the experience from a dream-like state being created by an oxygen-starved dying brain. You'll never be able to confirm the experience as real.
I dont have to prove anything to a man on earth. I only obey God and bow down to God.
It's not that you don't have to. It's you can't.
seek counseling
Why am I getting ads for Prager U. before every one of these videos?
😆😆 same thing always happens to me with star wars.
This is gold
There's no outside of time. Outside of time is a nonsense concept.
Ikr
PT 3 - One thing that must be clarified as to the involuntary nature of glossalia. While the subject experiences a feeling of loss of control, the activity can be brought about on cue, suggesting either a conscious or unconscious control of the phenomenon. While not conclusive, it refutes your contention that it is PROVEN to be involuntary, and suggests a conditioned response pattern that is goal directed.
Obviously god (me) is Timeless, Spaceless & Immaterial.
Why ?
Because "Timeless, Spaceless & Immaterial" is the exact, the precise, the indisputable definition of Non-Existent.
🤣
10 years later and still potent as hell
It's not just "solving a mystery with a mystery" it is replacing a mystery by introducing a new mystery, then saying that the second mystery is insoluble.
The "grid" of space contains non-uniform densities, which helps create variations in space/time, by affecting the vortex-like movements of curved vectors. This means that "atoms" will behave differently depending on where they are in space.
PT 2 - Speaking in tongues or glossalalia shows every sign of being a learned behavior, including that the speech pattern and style of speakers is influenced by where it is learned and who from. Linguistic analysis indicates that there is no information content in the speech and brain scans indicate that there is very little activity in the language center of the brain, but much in the emotional centers. Outside of Christianity it is primarily found in Paganistic and Shamanistic religions
The caller was going to say that objects stretch as they approach the speed of light, so if god travels faster than the speed of light then it would stretch infinitely and be everywhere at once.
However, the reality is that objects shrink when they approach the speed of light, not stretch, quite the opposite of what the caller claims - so if anything he would have proven that god is nowhere.
The caller is wrong, by the way. The whole point about time dilation is that the speed of light remains unchanged for all observers, irrespective of their speed, direction, or frame of reference. It won't get stretched out into a "ray" -- if you're traveling toward a light source of away from it, it will change color due to Doppler shifting, but all its other characteristics will remain the same.
Who is hanging the stars in their place? Answer : God
Physics. Idiot
What did those stars do for god to hang them? That sounds needlessly cluel.
Did light get in his eyes and he freaked out so much that he crapped a magical rope out of his butt and started to hang them with it?
1) We don't know that the kind of space warping necessary for FTL is possible. Hypothetically, it may be, but there is no proof of this. 2) You need to study relativity a bit more. Look up length contraction. In effect, at speeds near C, since distance traveled is = velocity X time, when your rate of time slows down, it effectively shortens distances also. 1 light year to you could equal a billion light years to us. It is weird, but true, that is why it doesn't violate the light speed limit.
How does anybody make someone else happy? I usually try to make people laugh and smile, help them when they need someone, comfort them when they need it. What makes someone happy can vary, and since people generally seek out happiness I do my best to give them some, even if it's only a little. You don't need faith for this, no gods, no demons, no religion. If you have empathy and actually like seeing people happy, why not try to make people happy? It's really quite simple.
Reaching a conclusion without an equation and trying to create an equation to reach that conclusion is basically what a theist is.
Well sure, but that doesn't address the point I was making. A loving god would not use "Must believe in my existence" as the sole criterion for entering heaven. This god would know everyone better than they know themselves, will know how the actions they've taken have impacted upon the lives of others around them, and whether that impact has been positive or negative, and would judge us based on the nature of the impact we've had on the world, rather than solely our belief/disbelief in him.
To answer your first question...for all we know, "black holes" ARE arteries to the outside world. To answer your second question...if universes can be born, then they can also die. Recycling seems to be popular, at least in this universe.
How did they know? A lot of infants under 8 days old exsanguinated. You can notice *that* something happens without understanding *why* it happens.
I agree 1 of the definitions of Atheism is the rejection of belief in a god or gods.
When You reject a specific belief it means You lack that belief. When You're neutral (NO position) on a belief it also means You lack that belief.
When You deny a belief it also means you lack that belief.
What pt. R U trying 2 make ?
R U suggesting these definitions don't suggest a lack of belief ?
Continued ....
What matt forgot didn't know or forgot to mention is that basically an universe with a flat geometry does not necessarily violate laws of thermodynamics. Nasa's WMAP studies have shown that: " We now know that the universe is flat with only a 0.5% margin of error. " (that's a straight quote from NASAs website). Secondly, quantum physics have shown that things do appear spontaneously without a cause at placks lenght scale (virtual particles).
@TCupUK Stray question: would I need to read the whole thread to understand that seemingly contradictory comment?
@SeedsOfHatred The whole thing is on youtube. If anyone hasn't seen it, you should. It's explained beautifully by one of the smarter men who has ever lived. If there is anyone who can understand the vast array of complexities that it would take to create a universe, it's him.
SCIENCE PSA: Photons do NOT stretch, they are dimensionless quanta of light, a laser beam appears as a straight line because the wavelengths are synchronized to decrease diffusion. MATTER that's traveling at near the speed of light DOES appear to stretch. The reason for this is that the front of the object is hitting photons sooner than the rear of the object so that by the time the photons reach your eyes it appears stretched because of the massive speeds at which it's moving. This also occurs in everyday life but the effect is so slight that we don't notice it. You can also visualize this like driving a car in the rain. If you think of the rain like light then the picture you have of a car going very fast is going to look stretched because it travels further down the road in the time it takes the raindrop to fall.
In Heaven, there is a sign that reads..."Logic is not permitted on these premises".
Infants still die from circumcision. Do a search for the article "Deaths from Circumcision" at circumstitions com
@ 2:00 matt has it correct.
Faster one traverse the everything moves slower
If someone says that another human being is their property, let alone their own spouse, I will immediately count them as an immoral person. Amoral means a decision requires no moral assessment. Immoral means doing things that aren't moral. If you're agreeing with slavery and keeping women as property that means you're making an immoral decision and have no ground to judge anybody else in regards to that issue. I don't think you know what these terms mean or are purposefully using them wrong.
I never called you stupid, please point out where I said such a thing. I specifically avoid doing things like that because it doesn't help an argument. I will never stop being intelligent, seeking knowledge, asking questions, and demanding evidence. If I ever do, I would hope someone would slap across the face to shock me back to my senses. Truth is specifically tied to evidence, because how would you know something is true without evidence?
Tradition: Just because something has always been done one way does not mean it isn't incredibly stupid.
He gets it wrong in the first 1:30 when he says the light would not bounce off and the observer would not be able to see you. Light will reach the traveler at C relative to HIM and, when reflected, will return to the observer at c relative to the observer. Of course the observer would get back light waves so red-shifted he would need special equipment to detect them.
Quantum physics makes me think alot about all this
@Prologicful "is appropriate BEFORE you conduct an experiment or test a hypothesis."
If you're the future of astrophysics, I worry. I'll lay it out simply: experiments for one thing are rarely done without preliminary experiments to test the premises. The experiments in abiogenesis, so far, have shown that it's possible for organic matter to combine naturally in an early-Earth atmosphere, which means it MIGHT BE POSSIBLE for the necessary organic compounds to form.
Is that really the right way to think? I'm an atheist and I have nothing wrong with showing emotion, but as a person (completely separate from my atheism) I think being overly emotional is counter-productive. Emotions are a natural part of human existence, it's how people act on them that makes all the difference, and that's the part that's taught. Faith is a mindset, not really what I'd call an emotion, anyway.
God is spirit and God is love. God clothes himself in light but resides in darkness. Only a few can penetrate the darkness and see God.
Supernatural doesn't get you to "a god created us and the universe," there's no connection between a "supernatural" experience and creation. Also, what if someone had a different type of experience than you and came to a completely different conclusion? Who's right and who's wrong? I'll tell you right now that not everyone can be right, but everyone can be wrong.
you are correct, which is why it isnt a dimension in the euclidean model. but in the minkowski model of spacetime, time is a dimension. it is dependent on the three spatial dimensions i think. my understanding of this doesnt go too much further than a buddy of mine who took physics at yale, a brian greene book, and wiki. i highly recommend the book THE ELEGANT UNIVERSE as well as THE FABRIC OF THE COSMOS.
here's the thing about infinite regression. Sure, if you want to say that there has to be a god outside of time and space, you open this slippery slope that there is no way possible to make a distinction between one god or an infinite series of gods who have to create each other. Now you have to say why you can recognize the distinction between more than one god and one god.
I like to hope there's more to my existence after I'm dead. Recently started flipping out in my mind that once I'm gone, there's nothing left to think, and to not think was absolutely frightening for me, still is mostly.
The only things that bring me hope is the fact that I have experienced spiritual interaction from those who have passed on. This isn't some kind of hallucination and like religion, it isn't something I can prove to others. Also, I commonly experience deja vu. This to me makes me think that maybe there are multiple dimensions of reality and that existence is really something more than just myself. Maybe there is this bigger thought that for some reason I'm just part of some tangent. I don't know. I don't fear death, and I'm curious to know what comes next. I just sometimes fear the worst possible outcome, in my opinion, which is absolute nothingness after I die. I cant imagine not imagining since that's all I ever do as being alive.
All I want to know is, what's next? If I can figure this out, I'm okay with whatever outcome I get. I believe eventually in my lifetime, I will figure this out, maybe I already have, but I will receive a confirmation that can be testable for not just myself, but others so they can also receive hope for the next step. I don't want it to be another religion. I believe that we have the capabilities to figure out and prove it scientifically, we just haven't developed the means to test and fail at proving it wrong.
If I die before then, at least I tried. If not, then maybe a lot of the issues we have today can just go away.
I think therefore I am. I can observe a universe, therefore I can assume it exists. I didn't know before I was alive, but maybe I was alive in another form? Maybe consciousness is like a cell that divides and becomes its own entity, where when it exists it doesnt not exist. When the car dies, the power is transferred somewhere else. Maybe my energy becomes concentrated heat to which it is enough for me to exist long enough to develop a sense of not worrying anymore about the thing I worry about, which is non existence. Again, I wish I knew and didn't have to worry about not knowing. Maybe if there was a way to encapsulate my mind, which I'm sure is possible, then I could better understand what it means. I don't think to live requires having a purpose other than to be alive, but understanding how it works may be a way to defeating this innate fear of non existence that I have, which I know a lot of people have, because religion.
8 Why 8? Is an infinite #. Evolution never ends Atoms are forming everything in the universe all the ( time) there are atoms that are in your body in short period of time, and some that are a long time. So your reality is created by atoms also known as infinite intelligence
Go, Matt, go!
Yes
Being an agnostic means that I make no claims of knowledge about the existence of any gods since there's no evidence proving one or disproving one, while being an atheist means that I don't believe since that evidence hasn't been presented. They're related concepts but they're not the same, since one focuses on making a claim, while the other merely focuses on the belief of that claim. Basically, I believe something that I know, but I don't necessarily know something I believe.
Even if we're all brains in jars, it doesn't matter. The things we all experience every day is what makes up the reality we live in, and since there's no way to determine that we're brains in jars or a way to get out of them if we are, we need to live in this reality and discover things about it. Even if we're all just a figment of your imagination, without a way to know that or get out, we have to live in that reality and experience things within it.
@vaguevocalist17 I remember when that first came on TV. It was epic.
What ever happened to that show? I watch the Science Channel all the time but I haven't seen it lately. The last episode I saw was with Eli Roth talking about Psychopathy.
@hgryphon It doesn't imply anything like that at all, it quite clearly states it would be wrong to apply laws from one universe to another where we don't know what the other universe is like, it's fairly straighforward really in that it means we "can't make things" up or "make assumptions" and use it as proof
@BankHeistVideos You do make me smile.
Consider the lack of knowledge we would have if we only relied on are sensual perception. And then look at the tools we create to extend our understanding past our sensual perception. This is the reason that we know for a fact that our concept of reality is subjective and does not accurately represent the reality that is abundantly evident all around us. The illusion is our perception of reality and not reality itself. Reality itself is just energy fields
Would you care to back that up with references to a specific study which says this and has citations as to the methodology and time frames for the absorption of the statistics?
The Douglas Adams paradox
God says - "I refuse to prove I exist because proof denies faith and without faith I am nothing" man says "what about the Babel Fish, that's a dead giveaway"
"Oh dear " says God "I hadn't thought of that" who disappears in a puff of logic, having proven that he exists and therefore doesn't exist at the same time.
By one estimate, put forth by Dan Bollinger, a prominent opponent of circumcision, based on his review of infant mortality statistics, about 117 boys die each year as a result of circumcision. That estimate is cited often by critics of routine circumcision but widely disputed by medical professionals. A spokeswoman for the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention said the agency did not keep track of deaths from infant circumcision because they are exceedingly rare
3:40 He says because something had to create the universe because it can not create itself due to the law of conservation of energy completely ignoring that that law states energy can not be created XD.
It's not that we 'assume' this. It's the simple fact that we do not possess methods to observe anything outside spacetime. Anything can be claimed and asserted to be 'outside' spacetime, but those claims and assertions can never be checked, so they are as interesting as leprechauns, unicorns and flying spaghetti monsters
If my thinking processes were to change how would I know I was in the correct state-of-mind to make any rational decision in whatever type of hypothetical situation you're talking about? So far, my current thinking processes keep me skeptical of supernatural claims that have no evidence and to ask for evidence if someone claims something that doesn't fit within reality. If that were to change I hope someone would slap me back to my senses.
I am in possession of an English Standard Version of the bible, but my brother has a King James bible so I compare the two sometimes. My bible doesn't collect dust because I carry it around in my computer bag so I can read it and take notes on it whenever I want. It's always close-by so I can verify if someone says there's a passage or subject in there that I haven't memorized (because why should I memorize it?). I take notes and tab it to go back to it, but maybe I missed your personal 7.
The god has laws too that apply to him.
He created this world with very accurate numbers.
He couldn't choose any other numbers or we wouldn't exist.
So he was restricted by laws that are beyond his control.
I like when ordinary people try to sound smart and bring up physics when all they know about it is what they saw on a discovery channel show. Then the first thing they always bring up to sound like they know what their talking about is time slowing down as you get closer to the speed of light.
I have a theory for life and nature as a whole. Please keep an open mind. The Universe is made of multidimensional "vectors" or "movements". In nature, a vector is not straight, but curved, because of a mirror effect that would cancel opposing forces. All straight vectors would automatically cancel out and become the compressed medium for the energy of the curved vector. This creates a "grid" system in which only "curved" vectors are allowed expression of movement.
What these friendly atheists don't realize is that by dismissing the concept of an unexplained eternal Creator, they're asserting the existence of an unexplained eternal universe. It's not like their position has any more explanative power or intrinsic rationality.
The question is: which is more likely to be eternal? The universe, or an outside cause of the universe?
My take is that what we know about the universe precludes the plausibility of it being eternal (having no beginning).
There is a giant force which includes all kind of kinetic, chemical, gravitational, evolutional kind of energy combined but that energy is not the one described in religious books. That energy doesn’t care if we do good or bad deeds. Human used his mind to create imaginary figure who punishes and rewards after life
and the bible mentions that in the last days people will love themselves following after false doctrines.Would you risk the life you love so much to save another from harm or death?
"He's dancing like a fool." thinks the man with a cow on his shoulder. lol
it is not that the laws of physics have changed, but OUR UNDERSTANDING of the laws of physics have changed...just as we know now, thru science, that the earth rotates on it's axis, around the sun; that life has evolved with time, not at the whimsical desires of a nonexistent entity.
The "medical" facilities where Mother Teresa took people were full of suffering people that could have been helped if they received proper medical treatment, but instead they were left in pain until they died of various infections and diseases. Mother Teresa sought state-of-the-art medical treatment for herself, but everyone else was left to die. Her philosophy was something along the lines of people finding Jesus through pain. That sounds very sadistic to me.
I hate when people say "exist outside of our universe". If it's not a physical phenomenon inside our universe, it does not exist by the definition of the word "exist". What we difned as "real" or that "exists" is something that can be measured. If you say it cannot be measured, then by definition it doesn't exist and is not real. That's how we know if there's a cup of tea on a table. The cup exists if we can measure it, otherwise it doesn't. It's that simple. Exist outside universe = oxymoron.
To prove God we would first need to define what God is. That in itself is an argument that can not be won either way.
Quantum mechanics allows room for God, however it is not the Christain ideology of God. Existance as we percive it is now known to be an illusion, and this solidity that we base are concept of reality on is actually fluid.
Energy is the fundemental of everything, and energy can exist without matter. This allows consiouness to exist prior to matter, and thought is the key.
I think it's incredibly unlikely, partially because there's never been a demonstration of the cause behind any phenomenon theists cite, and because many of the properties of their god don't mix. The main one is being omnipotent (all powerful) can get in the way of being omniscient (all knowing). Can this being know what they're going to do tomorrow? Can they not do it? If they can, they're not omnipotent, and if they can't, they're not omniscient.
@acr08807 You are correct that both C and E can be used as an eigenvector to explain quanta's. However this fact does not prove that time can exist independently of energy. Which was the premiss of your argument. Hamiltonian methods are not being questioned. Your statement that time is independent of energy is. How do you reconcile the indeterministic nature of the wave-function collapse? Also as time is considered 4D how do you explain the lack of energy?
Space is 3D, and together = Space-Time