I know the original 12 staying isn't a strict rule, but Nintendo isn't that dumb. People will be incredibly mad if any of the original 12 are cut, even if it's just Jigglypuff
At some point, he talks about how meta knight and faclo both have an history in smash as to why they're not likely to be cut, meanwhile jigglypuff is the most infamous melee character of history, hungrybox dominated the scene using her for YEARS and it's the only melee character that some people (mainly salty fox/falco players who want everybody to play the game hyper agressive like them) want to ban. Jigglypuff has more history in smash than falco and meta knight COMBINED. If anything, ness is more likely to be cut than her and he's not very likely to be cut, so...
If the community really want those characters to have completely different movesets, cutting them will be inevitable. However, Kirby would be a keeper, as he already has something that makes making a brand new moveset a breeze: his Ride Armor from Planet Robobot. Everyone else needs more development time, which means that they would have to be DLC or Free Content Updates if Nintendo doesn't see any value from charging for their eventual return.
she can always return as a dlc fighter, i acknowledge that she was iconic as hbox' main in melee but this does not mean that we need to have her in no matter what. i dont like the fact that most of us are completely overlooking the fact that she can return as a dlc fighter...
I'm glad someone pointed this out, echo fighters are 25x easier to make than original fighters because all they have to do is design a model. It's much like designing a skin.
@@j.otseidu5977 also tweak loads of parameters (which tbf is also done with original fighters), new animations (in case needed), record new voicelines (for at least English and Japanese, maybe other languages if the source character has their game in those), new victory theme (see animations), new sound effects (see animations), more models to make projectiles and/or weapons more appropriate towards that fighter (see animation), and that's about it if you don't want to count easter eggs (e.g Palutena's guidance in case she makes the cut or the Codec calls (in case they replace Japanese Roy Campbell and Snake makes the cut)), or the announcer's lines and stuff and stuff. They are way easier to make than real fighters, but they aren't an easy feat either, meaning that they'd be omitted also if the deadline's too tight.
What do you mean ARMS ballooned in sales? It sold better than all the Xenoblade Games, Pikmin 3 Deluxe, Fire Emblem Engage, All the Bayonetta Games, Octopath Traveler, Dark Souls Remastered and a solid number of Mario spin-offs. Just because it didn't sell like the Splatoon games, it doesn't mean that the game flopped.
Also why does he makes Min Min's inclusion as something so "confusing"? Springman is already an Assist Trophy and Sakurai revealed that there's no protagonist in Arms in his character presentation of Min Min, so yeah badly done research.
It actually sold very well, ~2.8 million copies is not a small amount. Considering the fact that it was a brand new IP and on a brand new console. That roughly matches Xenoblade Chronicles 2 and is slightly below Metroid Dread for context.
@@Axecon1meh, these numbers ain’t anything to brag about. With 143M Switch sold around the world, 2.8M isn’t big at all. For comparison, Splatoon, also a new IP, sold almost 5M on the Wii U, which had a much smaller owner base.
@@tacituskilgore7035 I'm sort of new to all things Nintendo, but wasn't Splatoon considered a huge hit? Like, it got way popular for what one would expect for a new release?
@@thearcanehunter2736 yeah that’s what I said lol. Splatoon sold better than ARMS while being on the Wii U. Showing that it was a huge hit, compared to ARMS.
When you said that Chrom is more popular than Lucina, you were referring to their popularity in Smash bros right? Cause in the Fire Emblem Community Lucina is one of the most popular FE characters of all time, probably being the second most popular FE character that is in Smash (the most popular being Ike). There is a reason why she was chosen as the Awakening representative in FE engage, while Robin&Chrom were DLC.
@@realnumbwentafk Nope. Fire Emblem Heroes held a popularity contest at one point (this was before Fates, so we can't say much about the characters that came afterwards) and 1st place was Lyn, 2nd place was Lucina, Ike was 3rd place, Tharja was 4th and Roy was 5th (though Roy counted as one of the 4 winners since they ranked the male&female characters separately). The thing is that Ikes votes were split between his young and adult versions, if you count both of them together he would have placed 1st. They do these votes every year, but the later votes are less reliable since the old winners can't be chosen again and now its known how the results affect the game. The first one was really just advertised as a popularity contest. If you are interested in all the results, they released them online, you can google "Choose Your Legends 1" to find them.
@@realnumbwentafk no, he's more the mascot of the series. He's kinda like Mario, where despite being the mascot of his games, most people play other characters if they can.
@@realnumbwentafkevery year there is a popularity contest of fire emblem characters electing 4 winners (2 male and 2 females) the 1st iteration of it elected Ike, Roy, Lucina and Lyn. iirc Mart won only some years later.
Nintendo said the switch 2 is being announced soon. The release will likely be somewhere between summer and winter next year, which does warrant these types of discussions. Even outside of the upcoming announcement, Nintendo is wrapping up the update cycles of their current games and don’t have many other first party games announced (there’s literally just a Mario Party, a remake of a Wii game, and Mario and Luigi Brothership. The other two games don’t have release dates and very little shown gameplay, meaning they could be meant for the next console). There’s not much to talk about yet, so might as well speculate
new console is soon but I doubt we will get smash right away- sakurai is working on something but we don’t know what it is. could be smash, maybe not 👁️👁️
Oh my gosh, I am so sick of the Smash fanbase saying that Lucario's moveset is a clone of Mewtwo's, it's literally just neutral special and that's it. Also Lucario was voted as the second most popular mon right behind Greninja in that Pokemon of the year poll. I don't know why you or this community thinks Lucario has had a massive drop off is popularity and relevance. Also Lucario is more likely than Mewtwo, Sakurai priortized him over Mewtwo for Brawl and base game Smash 4
I think it's just generally people have a light bit of denial about Mewtwo's chances. Due to having similar movesets, people put Lucario as a likely cut so that they can justify keeping Mewtwo on a fan roster. To be honest, I think if you're cutting down the smash roster, Gen 1 likely gets reduced down to Pikachu alongside Charizard as the second Gen 1 rep. If Lucario does get cut, which I could see coming, I don't see Mewtwo hanging around as well, since in popularity polls Lucario has consistently beaten out Mewtwo since 2008.
Isn't this "lucario being a clone of mewtwo" statment a Brawl thing (but for the little history, it's not a replacement ; they just didn't get enough time to implement Mewtwo but he was in Brawl's files) ? You may, for sure, hear some people here and there keep thinking this ... But imo it's a thing of the past now. And even back then (in Brawl), if we exclude their neutral b (which ... Doesn't work the same by the way ... But sure it looks similar, lets grant you this), no, they weren't similar. Maybe, in the video, by "drop in relevance", he means "in competitive pokemon game", which, despite my poor knowledge on it, I agree (if we exclude the mega form, that was busted in XY gen)... But that's frequent with old games, it's called "powercreep". And in popularity in general... No, not at all... At least that's the impression I get. And for the pokemon that would be cut ... Sure he isn't 100% safe ... But like Mewtwo i would say. My ranking would look like this. Pikachu : ... It's Pikachu, there's no debate about it. He stays. Jigglypuff : I'd say 50/50, since there's already A LOT of Gen 1 pokemon. And come on, there's 8 (!!) others generation, let them exist ! Pichu : He's out. He's pikachu but made into a joke. Mewtwo : Between him and Jigglypuff, personnally I would prefer Mewtwo, because of his boss statut, and for being less seen as a "joke pokemon" than Jigglypuff... But if a strict cut is needed, he isn't safe imo. Pokemon trainer : There's a big chance only Charizard stay (to remain in the logic of "All pokemon fight by themselves in Smash") ... And also because Nintendo can't get enough of this (way too overrated) (not a) dragon starter. Lucario : Aouch ... A tough one for me I won't gonna lie. Among my favorites pokemon (like Mewtwo) so the idea of cutting him makes me sad... And yeah, between him and Greninja, the second one would remain ... But with how popular he remains despite the year, I think it's very unlikely... But like Mewtwo, if there's an harsch cut in characters, he may not be there. Greninja : Already said above. Being the most popular pokemon (for reasons I totally get) grants him nearly 100% of being in Smash 6. Incineroar : Sorry Big "Grumpy Cat" Wrestler ... But despite how fun you are to play, and how good you're in competitive pokemon games ... I don't think you' ll make the cut. Not popular enough outside of Smash and Competitive pokemon. This way that would lead us to, in worst case in my opinion, 3 pokemons making the cut : Pikachu, Charizard and Greninja. If I can add one, that'ld be Lucario (I promise it's not because of my bias towards him, I swear ^^'), so you have 2 from old gen, one from "middle" gen and one from "recent" gen. Then Mewtwo, and after him Jigglypuff. For the last ones, they're very unlikely to come back.
Let's not forget Ash had a Mega Lucario in the anime and it was one of his most memorable pokémon of the last couple seasons. His popularity has still been decent!
Same Lucario is very unique, and people have been calling him a Mewtwo clone, and similar since Brawl. Aura sphere is like the only thing they have that’s similar but other than that, they have literally nothing else in common. Different combos, Lucario’s aura damage build up for his attacks, his force palm, Mewtwo’s confusion, that’s almost like saying Ike and Cloud are the same for having an identical up special, or saying Mythra are similar to Sephiroth for having similar fast side slashing moves. This is no offense to Siiroth btw, I just think this take is kind of absurd. Also Lucario still hasn’t fallen off popularity wise. Greninja is of course more popular, but Lucario is still one of the most popular Pokemon
- Wolf is not a clone, definitely not this time - "Jigglypuff was going to be almost cut in a game that was released more than a decade ago! She's just not that important" is not a great argumemt. She survived the cut, precisely for that she ain't gping anywhere. She's a STAPLE.
Rosalina is still relevant though. Wasn't she a major character in Mario + Rabbids Sparks of Hope. They can't cut her, she's the only fighter of her kind in Smash.
Tbf that was her most relevant role in almost a decade as 3d world came out in 2014 ( i think) either way shes one of the 3 duo characters and shes more of a reasonable mario cut id say shes above phirana plant but below Bowser jr
@@jourdonpatron212 she doesn't have to appear in every mario game it matters about her cultural popularity and game popularity and also she could have made a cameo appearance on the dark side of the moon idk. It's just you need to consider that because you might like her and others its what the game Devs decide and also that wasn't even a big talking point as majority of the community saw the twist coming and she does get the appearance but that won't really affect her chance's
You called Wolf a clone when he shares only 1/3 of his moveset with Fox, which is less than other clones you prioritized like Chrom. In addition, veterans like Wolf are what prompted the idea of Everyone is Here due to their high performance in the Ballot. To throw away a highly requested veteran under the false statement of "clone" is disingenuous. He's 50/50.
Wolf might not be a 100% clone, but unlike most semi clones he shares almost a lot of traits Fox has. If you are very good with Wolf, it won't take you that long to get good with Fox.
@@ejfiewfeuihefwiuwe Bullshit Wolf is just a sad worthless Fox Clone with even less creative moves!!!!!!!!!!! And once again!!!!!!!! How the Hell do you prioritize Wolf Over Krystal (A Character who isn't a worthless Fox clone who could have brought something more to the table)??????????????
feel like what Sakurai meant by saying not everyone will return like in smash ultimate again is that bringing every character back would be another huge licensing nightmare, not that he necessarily wants to cut down the roster
Yeah which means the ones Nintendo do not own will likely not return. Which means the three powerhouses that are Cloud, Sora, and Sephiroth will likely not be returning. Of course Smash had to make them able to not just one shot everyone else for the sake of gameplay.
@@Tracks2008I feel like some 3rd party characters will stay tho. Sega has very close ties with Nintendo and would love to put more than one Sonic rep in smash. Sonic and Pac-Man are both characters who aren’t going anywhere due to legacies as gaming icons and being extremely close to Nintendo.
He was comparing Chrom, the main protagonist of Awakening, the game said to have saved the FE series, to Roy, the protagonist of Binding Blade, which was never released outside of Japan (not even in NSO), Lucina is not talked about here, and even then, Chrom is just as, if not more popular than her, Smash is supposed to represent different franchises, not suck up to the competitive scene. So no, Roy is not more popular than Chrom, and Lucina is irrelevant.
@@kjkwru Yeah, you'd have a leg to stand on except the mobile game KINDA does this whole thing where it does popularity contests every so often... Lucina and Roy were both winners of that first poll. You know who wasn't? Chrom.
To Hell with keeping Chrom The only FE characters they should keep is Marth and Ike Nobody asked for Chrom prior to Smash 4 being released And nobody ever played as Chrom since he's just a sad worthless Ike clone!!!!!! And throwing in more FE characters isn't gonna make me buy all the FE games or buy 10 billion things of FE merchandise!!!!!!!!!!!! Throw in more Kirby characters!!!!!!!!!! Throw in More Zelda Characters that aren't more versions of Link or Captain Falcon (WHERE THE HELL IS SKULL KID)!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Throw in More Donkey Kong Characters (WHERE THE HELL IS DIXIE)!!!!!!! And Come back next year!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
You are correct on Wolf not being a clone of Fox. Even Falco is very different from Fox nowadays with him having mostly different air attacks (all expected Down air but even that has different Properties to it), and mostly different ground moves (they only share down smash, f tilt, down tilt, dash attack, and specials). The Star Fox characters have this weird reputation in the smash communities eyes that they all are 1 to 1 clones of Fox but that's not the case and has been since Melee when Falco was an actual clone of Fox
@@Depressed_korean bro you literally can't deny that their moves are the exact same lol, like they are the exact same on so many levels. obviously they work differently in terms of competitive formats but their similar movesets will turn off casual players. also, I do play smash, just not as much as you do.
Daisy is definitely safe, Nintendo seems to be taking a bias towards her. Echo Fighters don't see going anywhere unless they're decloning her her. I can let Dr. Mario go tbh.
I think they can get away with just replacing Doc with Waluigi (a spin-off character for another spin-off) or Piranha Plant with Toad, who both represent basic Mario species.
@@silveytd625 There are way more characters that deserve it over Waluigi now. I’d agree with replacing Plant with Toad but I’d replace Dr Mario with either Nabbit or King Boo
@@DDKoD The more deserving characters don’t ALWAYS need to be in over the more requested ones. Look at Donkey Kong for example, Dixie Kong is a more deserving character than King K. Rool was, but since K. Rool was more requested & was a fan favorite, he got in instead.
@@silveytd625 Actually I’d argue that K.Rool WAS more deserving than Dixe. He’s the main Villain of the entire trilliogy, 64(Which Dixe wans’t in btw), and Jungle Climber.
ARMS sold super well for a new IP and a fighting game in general and I wonder why people pretend it didn't. It did really good numbers on par with Metroid, Xenoblade and Pikmin
I’m not gonna act like I was completely paying attention when arms happened, but from what I remember the game just got hella overhyped so when it didn’t meet people’s expectations it got called a flop. But also, at least imo, if a game is a new IP and isn’t able to generate a sequel, that kinda is a bad performance regardless of what sales may say
@kyallon1213 IMO ARMS didn't get a sequel because it doesn't need one on the switch and they would rather wait until the next console releases. This dev team already handles the Mario Kart series which is obviously the priority for them, and they aren't really known for doing 2 games of a franchise per console so I think arms is fine.
Saying Arms flopped, saying Falco has more smash history relevance than Jigglypuff, and saying that CHROM is somehow more popular than Lucina.... Get out of the kitchen bro you failed.
Every time I watch these types of videos, nobody gives a damn about Corrin. I just feel like I’m the only one who actually likes Corrin as a character for Smash.
I feel ya, I like Corrin as a character as well, I may not very good with Corrin in Smash but he/she is still my favourite fire emblem characters in Fates, Engage and Heroes, I enjoyed Corrin in Smash 4 but in Smash Ultimate It seems he/she got nerfed too much
Yeah it's a shame so many want Corrin removed. Fates imo is one of the best FE games and corrin is an incredibly unique character in smash with a cool moveset.
@@NR-my3yl Can easily say the same as a ZSS main. In both of our cases, it’s the same character as an existing one even though the 3 Links are not technically the same as they are ancestors of each other.
Tbh I agree we would still get a persona rep probably since sakurai is a massive persona fan and sega is close with Nintendo so they wouldn’t have a problem with persona in smash and sega has been trying to grow the persona franchise but at the same time p6 would be more recent
Like, whether you like her or not, she's still a super marketable character She got a new form in S/V, she can reel in players like me who love cute, girly Pokemon, and is still one of the most iconic and loved of the original 151.
@@PlaystationSimmerShe's such a girlypop icon, I'd cry if she was cut! (But they really have to upgrade her because I _hate_ playing her, girl's ridiculously bad)
Jiggly cut 1) Melee: This was the second game in the series, the original 12 was not really as important. 2) Brawl: Jiggly was PART of the development delay. yes while she was not a priority as they felt her getting cut would not ruffle too many feathers, they added her in when they could. This was only the thrid game and since tehy had cut roy and dr mario, they felt it was fine to cut jigglypuff. The original 12 however has cemented their claim, they will never be cut at this point. Smash 10 will still have the original 12.
I’m not Jigglypuff’s defense, Melee being only the second game in the series, cut while they didn’t happen, could at least be easily considered. Kind of the same with Brawl because if you can cut Mewtwo (I know Mewtwo was originally meant to be in Brawl and wasn’t due to time constraints) then I’m sure they’d have no problem cutting Jigglypuff without fans being extremely pissed. After Smash 4 though, at that point Jigglypuff and the rest of the og 12 feels like a must have, and any being cut would make a huge uproar. Look at how worried people were when it took them so long to reveal Jigglypuff, Ness and a few others for Smash 4?
To Hell with Smash adding in more Pokemon characters (Pokemon is an overrated as sin Franchise that expects little kids who are 4 years old to buy stuff they don't need)!!!!!!!! Throw in more Kirby characters!!!!!!!!!! Throw in More Zelda Characters that aren't more versions of Link or Captain Falcon (WHERE THE HELL IS SKULL KID)!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Throw in More Donkey Kong Characters (WHERE THE HELL IS DIXIE)!!!!!!! And Come back next year!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
@ nah Pokemon isn’t underrated. Pokemon deserves the amount of representation it gets. It’s one of Nintendo’s most consistent franchises when it comes to making games and bringing in money alongside LoZ, Mario, and Fire Emblem. All of those franchises release games consistently. Now I don’t disagree with the idea of having more characters from Kirby, more diverse LoZ characters, or more characters in general from things like DK, StarFox and other series, but Pokemon has undeniably been a great thing for Nintendo.
21:02 i think sephy is ironically one of the most likely 3rd parties to come back, the FFVIIR trilogy has been incredibly well received and with the 3rd game most likely coming out in the next 3-4 years I highly doubt that Enix would decline the opportunity to advertise him in a new game of one of Nintendo's best selling franchises
Facts, and if anything I think Hero would be the most likely to leave out of the Square Enix reps, because the Smash team apparently experienced more difficulty in acquiring the rights to him than even Sephiroth & Sora if you’d believe it, and most people would assume that Sora was the most difficult to acquire the rights for, plus Sora was the most highly requested Smash Bros. character before he was added, so I’m cautiously optimistic that Cloud, Sephiroth & Sora are all coming back in the next Smash Bros. Game. My personal theory is that 3 characters from each fighters pass in Smash Ultimate are coming back: Joker, Terry & Byleth from Fighters Pass 1, as well as Steve, Sephiroth & Sora from Fighters Pass 2.
Speaking of Captain Falcon We need more F Zero Characters in the next Smash game for Cinder's sake!!!!!!!! Give me Samurai Goroh! Black Shadow!!! Deathborn!!! Might Gazelle Bio Rex Mr. EAD Ect.......................
I get what you're saying but this is kind of a stretch. They have overarching importance to the worlds of the main trilogy but absolutely zero narrative presence in 75% of the games.
What got me is when he said, "Do we really need to promote Xenoblade Chronicles 2?" Imo, Xenoblade 2 is the weakest in the series, but still promote that game! Man clearly hasn't experienced peak fiction.
@@hypernovagamingstation Yeah dude has CLEAR bias against certain series and knows very well most of the 3rd parties are more likely to get cut then what he put. Dude is a scrimblo rider
I literally don't think ive ever watched a video in this format that has been good. Smash players literally don't know what they're talking about for 90% of the video because all they play is smash and it shows. Admittedly I don't play many other games myself, but even I can clearly see that the approach of "this character isn't as relevant because a new game released" or "this series has less sales than this series and so deserves less characters" is so backwards. Cuts or reworks should be handled for fighters that almost no one gels with on a gameplay level. Even if you think "oh Lucina is a clone and isnt relevant" as far as i know, she's literally one of the most popular FE characters even still. And "Oh we shouldn't reinclude Pyra and Mythra because they copied a gimmick from 20 years ago and XBC2 is slightly old and Shulk is the mascot anyway" Just ignoring the fact that Pyra and Mythra are arguably bigger mascots and more lore relevant than Shulk is, and these characters have a very profound affect on the people who played their source material, not say Shulk doesn't but still. Characters like Min Min, Ice climbers, Kazuya, should be the ones on the chopping/rework block. As well as characters with outdated movesets. But no its always about "legacy" and "uniqueness in moveset" which basically translates to your very limited knowledge of the affect that a lot of these characters have on people's lives, and just assuming the characters you don't really like will be cut, and the characters that are "legacy" characters just get a free pass just because they're "iconic", as with every single video like this. Like, just rename it to "what characters I'd like to be cut"
@@Mike-di3mo Cut puff because she hasn't been relevant, but then doesn't cut Captain Falcon or Ness. Even makes the argument that Puff was almost removed once, and brings up the fact that Ness was even almost removed once, but uses one as justification, and doesn't use the other. It's literally so stupid and obviously biased. "I don't like Puff but I don't mind Ness so Puff goes" despite those characters being in the same situation as per this guy's own admission. The real answer is neither of them are being cut because... Obviously.
@@nekoblue77 This is so true I dont understand why everyone makes stupid excuses to cut puff, but then Falcon and Ness stay, when by definition I'm pretty sure puff is more likely to stay then both.
I’ve said this a few times, but I’m convinced Smash players just don’t get Fire Emblem. Marth might have the larger Smash Legacy, but Lucina and Chrom has more or less replaced him as THE Fire Emblem protags
@@Legithiro Smash players don't understand the subject matter of 90% of the games in smash. Because literally all they play is smash, and honestly, they don't even really play smash much either. Why do you think most of the community automatically throws a hissy fit when a character like Pyra/Mythra gets added because "man another anime sword fighter" despite those two being really fucking fun to play and their source game being great. Same goes for Byleth. Yeah fire emblem has too many characters but at least Byleth is fun and three houses is good. But then you have the characters that people pop off for because they're recognizable like Banjo and Steve, who both ended up being annoying pieces of shit. Which is a shame because I wanted Steve. But the community just reduces it all to just familiar faces because fuck the actual play experience and how it feels to actually participate in matches. All we need is characters that are iconic, and mainstream, forever and always. Remove anyone who "isn't relevant" anymore (aka: characters that I don't know) s/
No 3rd party is “untochable”. They’re all up grounds to be replaced if we’rew getting a hard reboot cause at the point you can reestablished some things. Like Smash being about Nintendo Allstars
That's not gonna happen. I doubt Smash is ever gonna be a Nintendo-only fighting game again. If that happens I'm not buying the next game and I'm sure a lot of people would not buy it either.
@@DDKoD I think that's why he put untouchable in quotes on the roster, it will *always* be possible for them to get cut because of legal reasons or because Nintendo wouldn't want them, but why *WOULDN'T* Nintendo want them. Even if Smash will undeniably sell millions without non-Nintendo fans, having third parties will also undeniably greatly increase profits, ESPECIALLY if they plan on having DLC. Nintendo DLC characters are waaaaaaaaaaay less hype than third party DLC because all of Nintendo's big names are in the game already, but having third parties gives basically endless popularities of big names. Master Chief? Kratos? Even Fortnite or Roblox? If we include indie games too, that'll generate a lot of hype too and isn't an impossibility either with the rise of indie games and a few got in as Mii costumes. Terraria is the 7th most purchased video game ever, after all. Indie games aren't a joke. I say this as someone who doesn't like many non-Nintendo games. Nintendo would be pretty dumb to remove all third parties just because.
@@NessMotherBound And at that point, Smash will have COMPLETLY lost all of it’s Magic. Like seriously, everything doesn’t NEED to be this super crossover that includes everything. It’s gotten so bad people legit want the next Mario Kart to be Nintendo/Smash Kart when that’s not what it was created to be.
@@DDKoD bro, this isn’t the hill to die on. I love all the Nintendo reps (except ironically Mario), I all of my most played characters belong to Nintendo, but as long as Nintendo can get the rights to other third-party characters they most certainly will included them. If anything they might double dip in Street Fighter and Final Fantasy alone
I reckon Wii Fit is staying, just like ROB has. The Ring Fit Trainer's... well, ring, is too bulky to do a lot of what Wii Fit Trainer does. And Wii Fit has a ton of interesting things to her, while also never really needing to be updated in any significant way. She represents the Wii too, maybe Nintendo's biggest console.
Smash RUclips gotta be the dopiest corner of this website. Watch them go back on their word and bring everyone back after all and make everyone who made these stupid cut discussion videos look like clowns. There are no rules for who gets added or cut beyond licensing agreements for third party characters.
Voices aren't really an issue. Laura Bailey hasn't voiced Lucina since 2015. Besides Jennifer Hale basically has solidified being her new VA. They could also reuse Atsuko Tanaka's clips if they needed to.
@WaterKirby1994 idk her series is basically nintendo property at this point. Sega may own the ip but nintendo is their only publisher and they have been pushing games since then.
Think you didn't really consider all the reasons Daisy may stay tbh. Yes she got into wonder but your forgetting she got into Mario run, she's apart of Nintendo world now, was heavily considered for the Mario movie and now becoming like a main character to create a core six. I think what may push her to staying is if she's in the movie sequel.
Sakurai says many ludicrous things, such as Ridley being impossible to be a fighter because of his size, and yet the canonically tiny characters like Kirby and Pikmin were perfectly playable.
"There's really no instances of a character who is their sole series representative getting the axe." Snake did come from a stealth game after all, cuz he's hiding in plain sight
Speaking of Snake If they ever do another Smash game and Snake Returns Please Oh Please Just give him some new Codec Calls Plus give him some guns to use Make his Final Smash be Metal Gear Rex Plus give me these characters- Crash Bandicoot Spyro The Dragon Rayman Klonoa Abe From Oddworld Gex The Gecko Croc From Croc: Legend Of The Gobbos Lara Croft From Tomb Raider Leon Or Jill From Resident Evil The Pyramid Head From Silent Hill 2 To where we can finally have a Proper version of PlayStation All Stars
Xenoblade 2 is still the best selling game in the series. I don’t think Aegis are going anywhere. Plus they can always dabble with Pneuma if they want to expand their moveset. What I’d say is more likely is we get Shulk, Aegis, and Noah/Mio in Smash 6, THEN in Smash 7, Noah/Mio get cut, leaving Shulk and Aegis unscathed.
people always bring up the pokemon popularity poll in 2020 for some reason when talking about these when it had a massive issue(voting by generation) and is outdated because a 2021 poll exists
@mrmelonman2893 ehh its more of a 50 50 at this point. If this was 2018, he's coming back for sure but hes losing relavence every year goes and tpc doesnt seem to do him much special treatment. He also missed 2 pkmn games in a row and lost a form he had. He clearly isnt as notable as he once was 10 years ago. He can still stay, especially considering his inclusion in Smash is quite delicate but hes not as safe as most say
@@masterwoo4359 nah hes staying cause pokemon za is coming out and megas are returning with great emphisis on his gen. Also he only really gone from gen 8 arceus doesnt count since it was focused in sinnoh and most pokemon werent there anyway
@mrmelonman2893 iirc he was gone from us um(transfer only) and ss. He returned in sv but 2/4 is not a good attendence. Like he was the only mon from smash that didnt eventually get into ss. Its likely za isnt going to be in the same timeframe as smash 6. If smash 6 releases within 2 or 3 years gren has a good chance but if its 4 or 5 the push from plza arent going to affect it much
18:44 I dont really think that pyra and mythra are in danger of being removed. Xenoblade is rising in popularity and sakurai is clearly a fan of the series so I really doubt that the aegis girls are leaving. Plus, removing a character from a series that only has 2 reps in smash is really odd.
While I think it's up in the air, I also think it could be pretty likely that they change the characters drastically to make Rex the fighter fighting with Pyra and Mythra. Doing what they originally wanted to do with the character and better representat that driver and blade dynamic from the original game.
@@XBC3403 true, but I can also see them keeping Pyra and Mythra the same as they are right now. Although I'd like to see what they do if they were to ad Rex to the moveset.
Gosh dang it… No Little Mac isn’t a retro one off as the Punch-Out!! Series has had 5 games the latest being on the Wii, and 2 of them wheres he’s actually the main character so that argument goes right out the window. Going by that logic that’s like calling Ness a retro one off cause he’s only ever been in one game despite the mother series having 3 games the last one being before Punch-Out!! Wii so no.
Puff got more recognition since gen 7 when they put it in more anime scenes and promotional material. The push from mainline games such as getting new forms is pretty rare too, its not very often a legacy mon gets highlighted. So its kinda hard to gauge how much interest a mon has depending on this. Not only that, but they dont always go based on relavency, its applied on a somewhat random cast. It's much better to judge based on promotional material like in collaborations or anime.
I have a theory that they will stick with daisy just so that they can give peach a complete new moveset based on Peach:Showtime. And have daisy stay for her old moveset. This would honestly make most people happy.
“It’s kinda cool to see Samus without the suit, it’s a unique scenario. but does it really need it’s own fighter slo-“ Every man on earth expect this dude: *yes.*
Pyra and Mythra better come back. They're finally the duo characters done right. Sure Zelda and Sheik did it too, but Zelda has been in the low/garbage tier through both swap and independant versions. So no one plays as her much in the swap case. Pyra and Mythra complement each other with stark move differences, and while Mythra is the better half, Pyra's not in a garbage tier like Zelda, and is the main KOer of the Aegis duo. Palutena can stay too. She's fun and we need more females. You've been giving the axe to too many ladies. Steve can go, he fucks up the game too much.
@@skategoats5266How does a 2-in-one fighter featuring 2 well-liked characters from an IP owned by Nintendo 'ruin a slot' in a Nintendo crossover fighting game? If anything, a 'ruined' slot would be Piranha Plant, as despite the fact that it wasn’t in the fighters pass, it got given a slot on the roster, and unlike Pyra and Mythra, who are extremely complex and important characters in the game series they’re from, the Piranha Plant is just a normal enemy in Mario games. Even Petey Piranha would have been better as the fighter.
i dont think jigglypuff is going anywhere as Nintendo should know how much hate and backlash they will get if they remove one of the core 12 characters not even mentioning jigglypuffs history with smash
We all know that fighters will be cut for the next smash game but what we dont know is what fighters could become assist trophies and vice versa. What characters are seen as memorable enough to be in the game but not playable and what assist trophies could earn the right to fight.
They'll only demote characters to Assist Trophies if they're stupid. That would come off as a slap in the face and be worse than them not being playable almost.
i get what youre saying about past "rules" being broken numerous times and that some of the og cast have not had the highest priority to get a roster spot but i think its important to note that their inclusion was questioned for the earlier entries. they probably thought about cutting some characters back then because the series wasnt as established as it is now. legacy characters are a thing in a bunch of long-running game series so i would be shocked if any of the 12 original characters would not get into the next smash.
This is what I've been thinking. I doesn't matter if it was considered in the past, I just can't see Jigglypuff being cut at this point. She's become two much of series staple just like the rest of the original 12.
Exactly. Jigglypuff has been in the series for almost thirty years. Even if you wanted to entertain the idea of her being cut, placing her odds at 50/50 is like, legitimate nonsense
Smash N64 was 2000 so almost 25 Years. I can't think of a case of an Assist Trophy being playable in the same entry, & it was never a rule that an assist trophy couldn't become playable in the next game.
@@WaterKirby1994 Right like I don’t understand what “rules” he’s even talking about. No one has ever said an assist trophy couldn’t one day become a fighter, just that it wouldn’t happen in literally the same game
Soar will be one of the hardest characters for Nintendo to get back because of how tightly Disney holds on to their characters. Especially if kingdom hearts ever gets a movie on Disney+.
Disney was fully on board to get Sora into the game from the beginning. It helps sponsor their own IP, and they were able to profit from it. Nomura, the creator of the Kingdom hearts franchise, was the one who was hesitant because of how they’d represent him. But overall, I think he was a great addition to the game.
I think Roy would be justified returning, since he is the only GBA rep for Fire Emblem, but Robin is definitely the only Awakening rep that should return, that way, people stop getting pissed at all the lord clones, since Roy and Marth are now functionally distinct from each other, and wouldn't have a separate clone for roster padding. Also, basically everyone, except for his mains, want Corrin gone. That would mean one NES/SNES rep (Marth), one GBA rep (Roy), one GC/WII rep (Ike), one DS rep (Robin), and one switch rep (Byleth).
Roy is a terrible rep for the GBA era. Only appears in one single game, which is also Japan exclusive, and he's somehow more bland than Corrin personality wise. Hector or Elliwood are objectively better picks for GBA FE game, and that is if you even consider the need to have a GBA FE game. Honestly, Roy should have never been in Smash. Dude debuted in melee for fucks sake, had FE6 been cancelled for some reason, then he would literally be a smash character.
@@namelessbag I wouldn't say Roy is bland, but I'll admit, it doesn't make since that Sword of Seals is still Japan exclusive. However, I wish they had made Roy's moveset more faithful to his game, where he is a fencer, rather than the brusier style that he was given. Also, I don't think Roy is necessarily a bad rep, Erika and Eliwood would probably be worse, assuming they don't give them their horses. I wish they would stray from the sword-lord character, if we got Marcus from FE6, that would be great, so we could have a unique mounted fighter.
I really don't see how pure console representation is at all relevant honestly. I love Fire Emblem but Roy doesn't really bring much to the table for the Smash series other than literally just saying his games were on the Gameboy
While I don't main her I really like Corrin being in Ultimate & would want her to return in Smash 6. As for Roy I admit he's only still in Smash because he was in Melee & it was a mistake not to translate Roy's GBA Game after putting him in Melee.
With the box office success of Sonic 3, I 100% wouldn’t be surprised if we didn’t get a shadow skin for Sonic, if not a whole new character. Same thing for eggman.
The only similarity between lucario and mewtwo is the neutral B. That's it. You're making it sound like you never even played the game you're talking about.
Bro tweaked when he said "chrom is the more popular character" mf its lucina. Plus roy aint gonna be cut. Hes the inverse to marth, thus making him outright a need in the game in the first place. The tier list for this is wack. Do more research please
Yeah your FE knowledge just flat out sucks. Ike, Lyn, Roy, and Lucina are THE four most popular characters in the series. FEH made that extremely clear
@@Mr.Feather130 I doubt it. MAYBE if her game is remade by then but she’s also from the same period/region as Roy and personall I feel there needs to be 1 character per period/region. Hell Sigurd will prolly be the most relevent bu then and he uses lances and is on calvery so he has uniqueness on his side
Young Link is for people who liked to play link before Ultimate, some different moves and obviously the bomb which practically makes his game plan pretty different
Shout outs to Sonic and Bayonetta for being the two most likely of the 3rd party characters to stay. They may as well BE Nintendo characters at this point.
If you don't mind me asking, would you be interested in doing a video on new characters most likely to get in Smash 6? For example: Do you think Raven Beak from Metroid Dread can get in as a new Metroid rep? Or Shovel Knight or Shantae as new indie rep? It's your choice if you wanna do it, but at least think about it, okay? That's all I ask.
Well, if smash 6 ever comes out, there’s that tiny chance that Sakurai doesn’t cut anyone and just adds new characters. Though that chance is smaller then Kirby’s canonical height.
I think Aegis is safer than people give them credit. They are arguably the second best fighter in the meta (you could make an argument for best). Pyra & Mythra are just as important to the Xeno lore if not more than Shulk (and equally as loved). There's no guaranteed that a new stance fighter will be introduced so cutting that gimmick is very risky. Lastly, Monolith Soft does a lot of heavy lifting in Smash's development for stages & backgrounds. I'd move Aegis & Bayonetta into the danger zone. Shulk should be promoted to the safe tier for similar reasons stated above and the lack of JRPG characters in that Tier as of this video's rankings. Lastly drop Greninja into the 50/50 tier, popular Pokemon phase out regularly, kids playing the current 9th generation probably don't care about the frog anymore.
I mostly play Fire Emblem characters, that’s the thing that makes me the most scared with a Smash 6, I know not all of them will make it, but the question is which ones As long as Ike makes it though I’m happy enough, but I do play pretty much all of them all the time with Marth and Roy being the ones I don’t use that often
Same. I use Marth, Roy, Byleth and once in a while a few others (mostly fire emblem characters though) when hearing some characters are probably leaving I just said “uhhh no please.”
I think a lot of cuts are based off of character and not the move set. Ik it’s a hot take, but I genuinely think most echoes won’t get cut. The video is great! I love your content I just kinda wanted to throw my hat in the ring.
A cool concept is, what if smash first came out now? What would the most relevant properties be and who would be the “original 12” of 2024? Would series like fire emblem even get a spot on this roster if their popularity hadn’t been skyrocketed by smash so long ago? Would Falcon or the Star Fox characters have been completely forgotten if it weren’t for smash?
Idk about that ZSS argument followed right away with toon link, a clone by design. That’s just a bit ridiculous. “She’s unnecessary” can so easily be applied to toon link-If not more so because she has a FULLY original move set. Why would they spend time porting over a clone if their time is SO precious in this scenario and not use that time in cutting TL and keeping ZSS? That’s just silly. Any DLC (smash 4 to ultimate) being cut besides sephiroth or maybe banjo and Steve if things go south with Nintendo’s relationship with Microsoft is just not justifiable for any reason for multiple reasons I just don’t wanna waste my time getting into, it’s very obvious why that wouldn’t happen.
also she's one of the rare feminine characters in smash besides being loved by the community, she's not unnecessary, espacialy compared to toon link who is just link but with a moveset that allows more spamming and broken hitboxes, i hate toon link
@@totidoki05I see your argument and I understand it but “he’s just Link” is a pretty shallow view of Toon Link. He’s the sole representative of the toon style of Zelda games, his move set leaves much to be desired but cutting him just because he’s another Link variant is only viable in my eyes if you replace him with a character from his section of the series which I feel is highly unlikely.
And for Dark Samus to get a better chance? I would be pissed if Zero Suit Samus was cut for Dark Samus. That floating villain knockoff of armored Samus doesn't interest me. ZSS was my main for a while.
I'm sorry, i am so tired of people claiming the Dex cut is due to limitations. It is not. If rom hacks of game sliek Fire ed and emerald can have all 1025 Pokémon, along with additional forms, regional variants, Megas, Dynamax AND fakemon. (These are games from back in 2004, two decades ago) the games of today could handle all 1025 as well. Especially since the system hardware is far more powerful)
Models and sprites aren't comparable. The former takes up way more space than some pixels forming 2D images, especially if the models are actually detailed and high quality. And much like how we've had all the models and animations since Gen 6 and have just been adding to that database ever since, all the sprites for everything up to Gen 4 or 5 already exist. Only difference is those don't need to be polished regularly to match with new art styles or just look less crusty. Also no deadlines. That's nice. Getting to make what you want when you want with no rushing or interference from corporate. That's ultimately the reason Pokemon has gone down the drain. That and GamefrEAk just being dumb and lazy. Doesn't mean you can equate fans reusing and editing existing, low quality assets to the actual devs cooking with much better ingredients.
Honestly I could see them keeping the echoes for a really good reason. If they were to rework peaches moveset some people would probably hate it and prefer the old one. Bam keep daisy in the game with peaches old moveset so that if people want to be able to play with a character more familiar or fun in their opinion, they can play with the echo fighter. For cases like dark samus tho that probably wouldn’t work because a lot of people wanted that moveset reworked, but I still think it’s a great idea
It surprises me that not alot of people have been saying this. Plenty of the echo fighters could easily be made into alternate costumes. I suppose their taunts, voice lines, and victory animations would still have to be different to fit the characters, but I don't see how that would really be an issue.
@@magic2546 What's the point of turning an echo into an alt though? An echo is just a glorified alt, so you're not really saving any development time by demoting them.
@@SubspaceJigglypuff Agreed. Even if they did do that, it wouldn’t benefit them in marketing or sales. Echo Fighters help artificially increase the roster size. In other words, Nintendo has no reason to do this.
I think in Smash 4, originally Lucina, Dark Pit and Doctor Mario were considered to be costume changes for a while. But for Doctor Mario, Sakurai thought that fans of Doctor Mario would be upset that their character was just demoted to a costume change. So, then they decided to separate Dark Pit and Lucina as well. I think Alph was going to be his own character at one point, but I think due to time constraints/they couldn't distinguish him from Olimar in any meaningful way like the other three, Alph was kept as a costume swap. I doubt the Koopalings were ever considered to be a separate character as it would be a bit ridiculous, and there's basically zero evidence suggesting they ever were unlike Alph.
Come on you literally say "sakurai REALLY wanted to include chrom and said he would absolutely if there was more time", but then the only source that you provided in that scene from said interview says absolutely nothing of the sort, instead saying how chrom would have been "just another sword fighter" compared to the more unique Robin....like come on dude you have to do better than that
Fantastic list! So many people are really stubborn about so many characters being 100% locked as fighters in the next game, so I’m glad you put things into much more realistic terms. Heck I might agree with every single pick on here😂 *braces for replies*
Eh I’ll take 99% for Diddy it’s better than being cut like what most people try to say despite him being one of the more prominent DK characters though I don’t think Nintendo are hesitant to add him to spin-off games, more so they like prioritizing other characters for launch and having him as Free DLC…even though it’s really dumb but he’s likely to be in Super Mario Party Jamboree soooo that should push him to safe at least Edit: well this comment aged like milk since he got cut from Jamboree for just no reason but I’d still push him to safe mostly since Nintendo loves Diddy a lot since he was the replacement for DKJr much like how Bowser Jr replaced Koopa Kid not to mention aside for DK, Diddy gets so many merchandise from Nintendo that the other DK characters would wish they had as much as Diddy plus not to mention he was available at launch for Mario Kart Tour before Luigi was made playable and was big enough to be given a Power Up Band before Wario, Waluigi & Bowser so that should take precedent
I think a lot of characters have just been here for so long they've taken for granted by the fanbase. Meta Knight, Lucario and Ike also suffer from this, seems a lot of people have forgotten the value characters like them provide.
@@SubspaceJigglypuff yeah it’s more so people try to look at their playstyles or other characters and warrant those characters to get cut on their hypothetical roster despite Nintendo having huge favoritism towards certain characters and Diddy’s one of them which seemingly people tend to forget about
Characters I want added to next Smash: Waluigi (Mario Bros) Paper Mario (Paper Mario) Tinkaton (Pokémon) Updated Ganondorf (TOTK) Shadow (Sonic The Hedgehog) Dr. Eggman (Sonic The Hedgehog)
I think some people underestimate Terry's chances on coming back. It's totally fair to point how SNK's fighting games don't have much of presence in the States or Europe compared to other fighting games. However, I think if Sakurai and Nintendo both wanted him back, SNK would 100% be willing to play ball. It seems like that they were really easy to work with, if the amount of songs are anything to go by, and lately they've been putting extra effort into increasing series/brand recognition through crossovers. Not to mention, there's a new Fatal Fury game coming out. But, like you said, it's important to keep in mind what Nintendo could gain from keeping 3rd party characters in. Bayonetta on the other hand, I have no clue how she is 100% safe in your eyes. As much as I love the character and game, she's anything but safe. Kamiya has left Platinum for Capcom, and there doesn't seem to be any indication that Sega nor Platinum have any plans for the series anymore. Realistically, she's the 3rd-wheel when it comes to the playable Sega characters. The fact that Nintendo bought the full IP rights for Astral Chain from Platinum probably means that she's not needed anymore.
I know the original 12 staying isn't a strict rule, but Nintendo isn't that dumb. People will be incredibly mad if any of the original 12 are cut, even if it's just Jigglypuff
At some point, he talks about how meta knight and faclo both have an history in smash as to why they're not likely to be cut, meanwhile jigglypuff is the most infamous melee character of history, hungrybox dominated the scene using her for YEARS and it's the only melee character that some people (mainly salty fox/falco players who want everybody to play the game hyper agressive like them) want to ban. Jigglypuff has more history in smash than falco and meta knight COMBINED. If anything, ness is more likely to be cut than her and he's not very likely to be cut, so...
If the community really want those characters to have completely different movesets, cutting them will be inevitable. However, Kirby would be a keeper, as he already has something that makes making a brand new moveset a breeze: his Ride Armor from Planet Robobot. Everyone else needs more development time, which means that they would have to be DLC or Free Content Updates if Nintendo doesn't see any value from charging for their eventual return.
Jigglypuff can gtfo . I'm sick of people being annoying with her moveset
she can always return as a dlc fighter, i acknowledge that she was iconic as hbox' main in melee but this does not mean that we need to have her in no matter what. i dont like the fact that most of us are completely overlooking the fact that she can return as a dlc fighter...
after Rachael Lillis's passing, it just adds another reason why Jigglypuff shouldn't get cut
Jigglypuff already left quite a legacy in Smash
It is a crime that there hasn’t been a new Kid Icarus game on Switch after how amazing Uprising was
How do we tell him
@@Damian-x4f8s What??
@@Nextgenneptunia its really less likely for a new game
@@Damian-x4f8s I get that. All he's saying is it's a shame.
@@Nextgenneptunia ik i wanted to recreate the spongebob how do we tell him scene
Let's be honest they're NOT cutting the echoes. They're able to bloat the roster with less effort thanks to echoes.
I'm glad someone pointed this out, echo fighters are 25x easier to make than original fighters because all they have to do is design a model. It's much like designing a skin.
@@j.otseidu5977 also tweak loads of parameters (which tbf is also done with original fighters), new animations (in case needed), record new voicelines (for at least English and Japanese, maybe other languages if the source character has their game in those), new victory theme (see animations), new sound effects (see animations), more models to make projectiles and/or weapons more appropriate towards that fighter (see animation), and that's about it if you don't want to count easter eggs (e.g Palutena's guidance in case she makes the cut or the Codec calls (in case they replace Japanese Roy Campbell and Snake makes the cut)), or the announcer's lines and stuff and stuff.
They are way easier to make than real fighters, but they aren't an easy feat either, meaning that they'd be omitted also if the deadline's too tight.
They've cut Melee's echoes from Brawl.
Then explain why Doc, Pichu and Roy got cut from Melee to Brawl.
@@sigomare they're not echoes
What do you mean ARMS ballooned in sales?
It sold better than all the Xenoblade Games, Pikmin 3 Deluxe, Fire Emblem Engage, All the Bayonetta Games, Octopath Traveler, Dark Souls Remastered and a solid number of Mario spin-offs.
Just because it didn't sell like the Splatoon games, it doesn't mean that the game flopped.
this, the youtuber is reallly losing credibility by talking out of his ass, seems like he has no clue what he is talking about,
Also why does he makes Min Min's inclusion as something so "confusing"?
Springman is already an Assist Trophy and Sakurai revealed that there's no protagonist in Arms in his character presentation of Min Min, so yeah badly done research.
@@oliversantesson6148 This fool is lucky RUclips removed the dislike count.
People only bought Arms because it was one of the first switch games, no one would have cared if it came out now.
@@kado-2323assuming you’re talking about the youtuber, yeah
Just because ARMS didn't break every world record in existence doesn't mean it failed.
Exactly
It actually sold very well, ~2.8 million copies is not a small amount. Considering the fact that it was a brand new IP and on a brand new console. That roughly matches Xenoblade Chronicles 2 and is slightly below Metroid Dread for context.
@@Axecon1meh, these numbers ain’t anything to brag about. With 143M Switch sold around the world, 2.8M isn’t big at all. For comparison, Splatoon, also a new IP, sold almost 5M on the Wii U, which had a much smaller owner base.
@@tacituskilgore7035 I'm sort of new to all things Nintendo, but wasn't Splatoon considered a huge hit? Like, it got way popular for what one would expect for a new release?
@@thearcanehunter2736 yeah that’s what I said lol. Splatoon sold better than ARMS while being on the Wii U. Showing that it was a huge hit, compared to ARMS.
When you said that Chrom is more popular than Lucina, you were referring to their popularity in Smash bros right? Cause in the Fire Emblem Community Lucina is one of the most popular FE characters of all time, probably being the second most popular FE character that is in Smash (the most popular being Ike). There is a reason why she was chosen as the Awakening representative in FE engage, while Robin&Chrom were DLC.
marth isnt the most popular in the FEC?
@@realnumbwentafk Nope. Fire Emblem Heroes held a popularity contest at one point (this was before Fates, so we can't say much about the characters that came afterwards) and 1st place was Lyn, 2nd place was Lucina, Ike was 3rd place, Tharja was 4th and Roy was 5th (though Roy counted as one of the 4 winners since they ranked the male&female characters separately). The thing is that Ikes votes were split between his young and adult versions, if you count both of them together he would have placed 1st.
They do these votes every year, but the later votes are less reliable since the old winners can't be chosen again and now its known how the results affect the game. The first one was really just advertised as a popularity contest.
If you are interested in all the results, they released them online, you can google "Choose Your Legends 1" to find them.
@@realnumbwentafk no, he's more the mascot of the series. He's kinda like Mario, where despite being the mascot of his games, most people play other characters if they can.
@@realnumbwentafkevery year there is a popularity contest of fire emblem characters electing 4 winners (2 male and 2 females) the 1st iteration of it elected Ike, Roy, Lucina and Lyn. iirc Mart won only some years later.
@@Yemile31776 thx for the info
Everyone talking about this like smash 6 is right around the corner, I don’t think we will get smash 6 until we get another Nintendo console
I'm guessing it might even be an extra year compared to how long it took to get on Switch. My guess is 2027 as long as Switch 2 comes out 2025.
Nintendo said the switch 2 is being announced soon. The release will likely be somewhere between summer and winter next year, which does warrant these types of discussions.
Even outside of the upcoming announcement, Nintendo is wrapping up the update cycles of their current games and don’t have many other first party games announced (there’s literally just a Mario Party, a remake of a Wii game, and Mario and Luigi Brothership. The other two games don’t have release dates and very little shown gameplay, meaning they could be meant for the next console).
There’s not much to talk about yet, so might as well speculate
@@LegithiroThat may be but at least allow said Switch 2 (whatever it may be) to cook. Ultimate came almost 2 years after the first switch.
new console is soon but I doubt we will get smash right away- sakurai is working on something but we don’t know what it is. could be smash, maybe not 👁️👁️
@@lennydickson8845nah it’s been almost 6 years, if there’s gonna be a next smash it’ll be a launch title
Oh my gosh, I am so sick of the Smash fanbase saying that Lucario's moveset is a clone of Mewtwo's, it's literally just neutral special and that's it. Also Lucario was voted as the second most popular mon right behind Greninja in that Pokemon of the year poll. I don't know why you or this community thinks Lucario has had a massive drop off is popularity and relevance. Also Lucario is more likely than Mewtwo, Sakurai priortized him over Mewtwo for Brawl and base game Smash 4
This. Went i first started playing smash i wanted to know all the fuss about those two movesets but they are very different
I think it's just generally people have a light bit of denial about Mewtwo's chances. Due to having similar movesets, people put Lucario as a likely cut so that they can justify keeping Mewtwo on a fan roster. To be honest, I think if you're cutting down the smash roster, Gen 1 likely gets reduced down to Pikachu alongside Charizard as the second Gen 1 rep. If Lucario does get cut, which I could see coming, I don't see Mewtwo hanging around as well, since in popularity polls Lucario has consistently beaten out Mewtwo since 2008.
Isn't this "lucario being a clone of mewtwo" statment a Brawl thing (but for the little history, it's not a replacement ; they just didn't get enough time to implement Mewtwo but he was in Brawl's files) ? You may, for sure, hear some people here and there keep thinking this ... But imo it's a thing of the past now.
And even back then (in Brawl), if we exclude their neutral b (which ... Doesn't work the same by the way ... But sure it looks similar, lets grant you this), no, they weren't similar.
Maybe, in the video, by "drop in relevance", he means "in competitive pokemon game", which, despite my poor knowledge on it, I agree (if we exclude the mega form, that was busted in XY gen)... But that's frequent with old games, it's called "powercreep". And in popularity in general... No, not at all... At least that's the impression I get.
And for the pokemon that would be cut ... Sure he isn't 100% safe ... But like Mewtwo i would say. My ranking would look like this.
Pikachu : ... It's Pikachu, there's no debate about it. He stays.
Jigglypuff : I'd say 50/50, since there's already A LOT of Gen 1 pokemon. And come on, there's 8 (!!) others generation, let them exist !
Pichu : He's out. He's pikachu but made into a joke.
Mewtwo : Between him and Jigglypuff, personnally I would prefer Mewtwo, because of his boss statut, and for being less seen as a "joke pokemon" than Jigglypuff... But if a strict cut is needed, he isn't safe imo.
Pokemon trainer : There's a big chance only Charizard stay (to remain in the logic of "All pokemon fight by themselves in Smash") ... And also because Nintendo can't get enough of this (way too overrated) (not a) dragon starter.
Lucario : Aouch ... A tough one for me I won't gonna lie. Among my favorites pokemon (like Mewtwo) so the idea of cutting him makes me sad... And yeah, between him and Greninja, the second one would remain ... But with how popular he remains despite the year, I think it's very unlikely... But like Mewtwo, if there's an harsch cut in characters, he may not be there.
Greninja : Already said above. Being the most popular pokemon (for reasons I totally get) grants him nearly 100% of being in Smash 6.
Incineroar : Sorry Big "Grumpy Cat" Wrestler ... But despite how fun you are to play, and how good you're in competitive pokemon games ... I don't think you' ll make the cut. Not popular enough outside of Smash and Competitive pokemon.
This way that would lead us to, in worst case in my opinion, 3 pokemons making the cut : Pikachu, Charizard and Greninja.
If I can add one, that'ld be Lucario (I promise it's not because of my bias towards him, I swear ^^'), so you have 2 from old gen, one from "middle" gen and one from "recent" gen.
Then Mewtwo, and after him Jigglypuff. For the last ones, they're very unlikely to come back.
Let's not forget Ash had a Mega Lucario in the anime and it was one of his most memorable pokémon of the last couple seasons. His popularity has still been decent!
Same Lucario is very unique, and people have been calling him a Mewtwo clone, and similar since Brawl. Aura sphere is like the only thing they have that’s similar but other than that, they have literally nothing else in common. Different combos, Lucario’s aura damage build up for his attacks, his force palm, Mewtwo’s confusion, that’s almost like saying Ike and Cloud are the same for having an identical up special, or saying Mythra are similar to Sephiroth for having similar fast side slashing moves. This is no offense to Siiroth btw, I just think this take is kind of absurd. Also Lucario still hasn’t fallen off popularity wise. Greninja is of course more popular, but Lucario is still one of the most popular Pokemon
- Wolf is not a clone, definitely not this time
- "Jigglypuff was going to be almost cut in a game that was released more than a decade ago! She's just not that important" is not a great argumemt. She survived the cut, precisely for that she ain't gping anywhere. She's a STAPLE.
do NOT let him cook
Don’t know what you’re talking about
Do not not let him cease to not cook
@@Themoo_atcowsyour facing just like siiroth this entire video
@@QuestAccepter get your grammar together
@@SCHNAND3RS0Nno
Rosalina is still relevant though. Wasn't she a major character in Mario + Rabbids Sparks of Hope. They can't cut her, she's the only fighter of her kind in Smash.
Rosalina: (exists)
Odyssey Central: "crush, destroy cringe!!!1"
dang he really put Rosa in there
Tbf that was her most relevant role in almost a decade as 3d world came out in 2014 ( i think) either way shes one of the 3 duo characters and shes more of a reasonable mario cut id say shes above phirana plant but below Bowser jr
@@FillerofaName She wasn't in Odyssey but what role would she have played there? I don't think she needs to appear in every major title.
@@jourdonpatron212 she doesn't have to appear in every mario game it matters about her cultural popularity and game popularity and also she could have made a cameo appearance on the dark side of the moon idk. It's just you need to consider that because you might like her and others its what the game Devs decide and also that wasn't even a big talking point as majority of the community saw the twist coming and she does get the appearance but that won't really affect her chance's
You called Wolf a clone when he shares only 1/3 of his moveset with Fox, which is less than other clones you prioritized like Chrom. In addition, veterans like Wolf are what prompted the idea of Everyone is Here due to their high performance in the Ballot. To throw away a highly requested veteran under the false statement of "clone" is disingenuous. He's 50/50.
Tbh, I count villains in high regard when it comes to viability. He’s not really a clone either
Wolf should stay
Wolf might not be a 100% clone, but unlike most semi clones he shares almost a lot of traits Fox has. If you are very good with Wolf, it won't take you that long to get good with Fox.
@@BlazenPowers No? Wolf and Fox are very different from each other in terms of how they play and how their combo routes work
@@ejfiewfeuihefwiuwe Bullshit
Wolf is just a sad worthless Fox Clone with even less creative moves!!!!!!!!!!!
And once again!!!!!!!!
How the Hell do you prioritize Wolf Over Krystal (A Character who isn't a worthless Fox clone who could have brought something more to the table)??????????????
feel like what Sakurai meant by saying not everyone will return like in smash ultimate again is that bringing every character back would be another huge licensing nightmare, not that he necessarily wants to cut down the roster
Yeah which means the ones Nintendo do not own will likely not return. Which means the three powerhouses that are Cloud, Sora, and Sephiroth will likely not be returning. Of course Smash had to make them able to not just one shot everyone else for the sake of gameplay.
@@Tracks2008I feel like some 3rd party characters will stay tho. Sega has very close ties with Nintendo and would love to put more than one Sonic rep in smash. Sonic and Pac-Man are both characters who aren’t going anywhere due to legacies as gaming icons and being extremely close to Nintendo.
@@thebunnygamer422 Well okay then.
“Chrom is the more popular character as well” yeah no he’s not. Lucina is one of the 4 most popular FE character. Please do more research on this
He was comparing Chrom, the main protagonist of Awakening, the game said to have saved the FE series, to Roy, the protagonist of Binding Blade, which was never released outside of Japan (not even in NSO), Lucina is not talked about here, and even then, Chrom is just as, if not more popular than her, Smash is supposed to represent different franchises, not suck up to the competitive scene. So no, Roy is not more popular than Chrom, and Lucina is irrelevant.
@@kjkwru FEH dis agrees with you. It made it very clear the 4 most popular character are Ike, Lucina, Roy and Lyn right off the bat in CYL
@@kjkwru Yeah, you'd have a leg to stand on except the mobile game KINDA does this whole thing where it does popularity contests every so often... Lucina and Roy were both winners of that first poll. You know who wasn't? Chrom.
@@kjkwruYou comment was as embarrassing as your profile as well as its name 😂
To Hell with keeping Chrom
The only FE characters they should keep is Marth and Ike
Nobody asked for Chrom prior to Smash 4 being released
And nobody ever played as Chrom since he's just a sad worthless Ike clone!!!!!!
And throwing in more FE characters isn't gonna make me buy all the FE games or buy 10 billion things of FE merchandise!!!!!!!!!!!!
Throw in more Kirby characters!!!!!!!!!!
Throw in More Zelda Characters that aren't more versions of Link or Captain Falcon (WHERE THE HELL IS SKULL KID)!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Throw in More Donkey Kong Characters (WHERE THE HELL IS DIXIE)!!!!!!!
And Come back next year!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Wait. He said wolf is a clone? I’m pretty sure that’s not true…
You are correct on Wolf not being a clone of Fox. Even Falco is very different from Fox nowadays with him having mostly different air attacks (all expected Down air but even that has different Properties to it), and mostly different ground moves (they only share down smash, f tilt, down tilt, dash attack, and specials). The Star Fox characters have this weird reputation in the smash communities eyes that they all are 1 to 1 clones of Fox but that's not the case and has been since Melee when Falco was an actual clone of Fox
@@rossruss6901 Falco in Melee is so different from Fox, it’s silly to suggest otherwise.
Bro their moves are exactly the same fundamentally, they just have different effects.
@@purpleprawler9286 tell me you dont play smash without telling me you dont play smash
@@Depressed_korean bro you literally can't deny that their moves are the exact same lol, like they are the exact same on so many levels. obviously they work differently in terms of competitive formats but their similar movesets will turn off casual players. also, I do play smash, just not as much as you do.
Daisy is definitely safe, Nintendo seems to be taking a bias towards her. Echo Fighters don't see going anywhere unless they're decloning her her. I can let Dr. Mario go tbh.
The Plant IDK.. .
I think they can get away with just replacing Doc with Waluigi (a spin-off character for another spin-off) or Piranha Plant with Toad, who both represent basic Mario species.
@@silveytd625 There are way more characters that deserve it over Waluigi now. I’d agree with replacing Plant with Toad but I’d replace Dr Mario with either Nabbit or King Boo
@@DDKoD The more deserving characters don’t ALWAYS need to be in over the more requested ones. Look at Donkey Kong for example, Dixie Kong is a more deserving character than King K. Rool was, but since K. Rool was more requested & was a fan favorite, he got in instead.
@@silveytd625 Actually I’d argue that K.Rool WAS more deserving than Dixe. He’s the main Villain of the entire trilliogy, 64(Which Dixe wans’t in btw), and Jungle Climber.
ARMS sold super well for a new IP and a fighting game in general and I wonder why people pretend it didn't. It did really good numbers on par with Metroid, Xenoblade and Pikmin
It's kinda become this "echo chamber" thing to spread this as fact that Arms was a "massive failure" among Smash youtubers I swear.
@@Geneolgia I guess its to justify the hatred towards the character in smash or the franchise in general
Idc i will always love arms
I’m not gonna act like I was completely paying attention when arms happened, but from what I remember the game just got hella overhyped so when it didn’t meet people’s expectations it got called a flop. But also, at least imo, if a game is a new IP and isn’t able to generate a sequel, that kinda is a bad performance regardless of what sales may say
@kyallon1213 IMO ARMS didn't get a sequel because it doesn't need one on the switch and they would rather wait until the next console releases.
This dev team already handles the Mario Kart series which is obviously the priority for them, and they aren't really known for doing 2 games of a franchise per console so I think arms is fine.
Saying Arms flopped, saying Falco has more smash history relevance than Jigglypuff, and saying that CHROM is somehow more popular than Lucina.... Get out of the kitchen bro you failed.
Every time I watch these types of videos, nobody gives a damn about Corrin. I just feel like I’m the only one who actually likes Corrin as a character for Smash.
I feel ya, I like Corrin as a character as well, I may not very good with Corrin in Smash but he/she is still my favourite fire emblem characters in Fates, Engage and Heroes, I enjoyed Corrin in Smash 4 but in Smash Ultimate It seems he/she got nerfed too much
Cause you are (don’t worry in the only that cares about my main)
Yeah it's a shame so many want Corrin removed. Fates imo is one of the best FE games and corrin is an incredibly unique character in smash with a cool moveset.
If Corrin were removed & Alear chosen for Smash 6 I would refuse to get the game. Corrin is 1 of my Top10 characters in Smash Ultimate.
>I am the only one that likes Corrin
Good for you,
Keep that trash taste to yourself
Maybe in 2065 we will get another “Everyone Is Here” Installment.
Emphasis on Maybe.
Im a toon link main but i agree he should/will probably go
@@NR-my3yl Can easily say the same as a ZSS main
@@NR-my3yl Can easily say the same as a ZSS main. In both of our cases, it’s the same character as an existing one even though the 3 Links are not technically the same as they are ancestors of each other.
How many of us will still be alive in 2065? Also I think Sakurai-san is done with the series now.
I will be old by the time of that year.
Man, people are really sleeping on ARMS 2's chances
Joker is honestly a 50/50. He might be replaced by the Persona 6 protagonist if that game gets to sell even more than 5 did, if not, he's in.
Tbh I agree we would still get a persona rep probably since sakurai is a massive persona fan and sega is close with Nintendo so they wouldn’t have a problem with persona in smash and sega has been trying to grow the persona franchise but at the same time p6 would be more recent
Persona 6 is never coming out
@@batofdestiny Do you really think they won't keep milking their biggest franchise?
@@JDQuote Sonic and Yakuza are both way bigger than Persona
@@lamotou4banana383 Talking about Atlus exclusively, not Sega as a whole
Stop watching after you added Jipplypuff to the 50/50
Fr she is way too iconic to the smash series
Like, whether you like her or not, she's still a super marketable character
She got a new form in S/V, she can reel in players like me who love cute, girly Pokemon, and is still one of the most iconic and loved of the original 151.
@@PlaystationSimmerShe's such a girlypop icon, I'd cry if she was cut! (But they really have to upgrade her because I _hate_ playing her, girl's ridiculously bad)
Jiggly cut
1) Melee: This was the second game in the series, the original 12 was not really as important.
2) Brawl: Jiggly was PART of the development delay. yes while she was not a priority as they felt her getting cut would not ruffle too many feathers, they added her in when they could. This was only the thrid game and since tehy had cut roy and dr mario, they felt it was fine to cut jigglypuff.
The original 12 however has cemented their claim, they will never be cut at this point. Smash 10 will still have the original 12.
As they should
I’m not Jigglypuff’s defense, Melee being only the second game in the series, cut while they didn’t happen, could at least be easily considered. Kind of the same with Brawl because if you can cut Mewtwo (I know Mewtwo was originally meant to be in Brawl and wasn’t due to time constraints) then I’m sure they’d have no problem cutting Jigglypuff without fans being extremely pissed. After Smash 4 though, at that point Jigglypuff and the rest of the og 12 feels like a must have, and any being cut would make a huge uproar. Look at how worried people were when it took them so long to reveal Jigglypuff, Ness and a few others for Smash 4?
To Hell with Smash adding in more Pokemon characters (Pokemon is an overrated as sin Franchise that expects little kids who are 4 years old to buy stuff they don't need)!!!!!!!!
Throw in more Kirby characters!!!!!!!!!!
Throw in More Zelda Characters that aren't more versions of Link or Captain Falcon (WHERE THE HELL IS SKULL KID)!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Throw in More Donkey Kong Characters (WHERE THE HELL IS DIXIE)!!!!!!!
And Come back next year!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
@ nah Pokemon isn’t underrated. Pokemon deserves the amount of representation it gets. It’s one of Nintendo’s most consistent franchises when it comes to making games and bringing in money alongside LoZ, Mario, and Fire Emblem. All of those franchises release games consistently. Now I don’t disagree with the idea of having more characters from Kirby, more diverse LoZ characters, or more characters in general from things like DK, StarFox and other series, but Pokemon has undeniably been a great thing for Nintendo.
these opinions are just objectively bad
21:02 i think sephy is ironically one of the most likely 3rd parties to come back, the FFVIIR trilogy has been incredibly well received and with the 3rd game most likely coming out in the next 3-4 years I highly doubt that Enix would decline the opportunity to advertise him in a new game of one of Nintendo's best selling franchises
I think joker is also one of the most likely to come back all because of Mkleo
Facts, and if anything I think Hero would be the most likely to leave out of the Square Enix reps, because the Smash team apparently experienced more difficulty in acquiring the rights to him than even Sephiroth & Sora if you’d believe it, and most people would assume that Sora was the most difficult to acquire the rights for, plus Sora was the most highly requested Smash Bros. character before he was added, so I’m cautiously optimistic that Cloud, Sephiroth & Sora are all coming back in the next Smash Bros. Game. My personal theory is that 3 characters from each fighters pass in Smash Ultimate are coming back: Joker, Terry & Byleth from Fighters Pass 1, as well as Steve, Sephiroth & Sora from Fighters Pass 2.
And FINAL FANTASY 7 fans don't want to have only 2 songs again Sephiroth should return in the next smash bros game
Exactly, if a Sqaure character were to get cut it’s most likely Hero. FF is much more popular than Dragon Quest
@@Legithiro yeah true
3:17 I laughed out loud at that. Sure man. Sure we’ll get the Ring Fit character
I agree lmao, this dude is a clown
Hey at least the 2 total people who playing ring fit would like it
@@Knightgob😂
Just like how we joked about the Wii Fit Trainer getting a slot.
You need to stop edging us with this Falcon cut
I thought i was the only one 💀
Speaking of Captain Falcon
We need more F Zero Characters in the next Smash game for Cinder's sake!!!!!!!!
Give me Samurai Goroh!
Black Shadow!!!
Deathborn!!!
Might Gazelle
Bio Rex
Mr. EAD
Ect.......................
so jigglypuff is less likely than min min, pichu, and young link? ... right
19:38 pyra and mythra are very important in xenoblade outside of just xenoblade 2. I’d elaborate more but I don’t want to spoil the xenoblade series
Doth bother with this guy. He clearly doesn’t do research on games he don’t really care about.
True
I get what you're saying but this is kind of a stretch. They have overarching importance to the worlds of the main trilogy but absolutely zero narrative presence in 75% of the games.
What got me is when he said, "Do we really need to promote Xenoblade Chronicles 2?" Imo, Xenoblade 2 is the weakest in the series, but still promote that game! Man clearly hasn't experienced peak fiction.
@@hypernovagamingstation Yeah dude has CLEAR bias against certain series and knows very well most of the 3rd parties are more likely to get cut then what he put. Dude is a scrimblo rider
This list is ass lmao
I literally don't think ive ever watched a video in this format that has been good. Smash players literally don't know what they're talking about for 90% of the video because all they play is smash and it shows. Admittedly I don't play many other games myself, but even I can clearly see that the approach of "this character isn't as relevant because a new game released" or "this series has less sales than this series and so deserves less characters" is so backwards.
Cuts or reworks should be handled for fighters that almost no one gels with on a gameplay level. Even if you think "oh Lucina is a clone and isnt relevant" as far as i know, she's literally one of the most popular FE characters even still. And "Oh we shouldn't reinclude Pyra and Mythra because they copied a gimmick from 20 years ago and XBC2 is slightly old and Shulk is the mascot anyway" Just ignoring the fact that Pyra and Mythra are arguably bigger mascots and more lore relevant than Shulk is, and these characters have a very profound affect on the people who played their source material, not say Shulk doesn't but still. Characters like Min Min, Ice climbers, Kazuya, should be the ones on the chopping/rework block. As well as characters with outdated movesets.
But no its always about "legacy" and "uniqueness in moveset" which basically translates to your very limited knowledge of the affect that a lot of these characters have on people's lives, and just assuming the characters you don't really like will be cut, and the characters that are "legacy" characters just get a free pass just because they're "iconic", as with every single video like this. Like, just rename it to "what characters I'd like to be cut"
It's still kind of funny how he cut puff, yet kept both captain falcon and Ness for there legacy
@@Mike-di3mo Cut puff because she hasn't been relevant, but then doesn't cut Captain Falcon or Ness. Even makes the argument that Puff was almost removed once, and brings up the fact that Ness was even almost removed once, but uses one as justification, and doesn't use the other. It's literally so stupid and obviously biased. "I don't like Puff but I don't mind Ness so Puff goes" despite those characters being in the same situation as per this guy's own admission. The real answer is neither of them are being cut because... Obviously.
@@nekoblue77 This is so true I dont understand why everyone makes stupid excuses to cut puff, but then Falcon and Ness stay, when by definition I'm pretty sure puff is more likely to stay then both.
I’ve said this a few times, but I’m convinced Smash players just don’t get Fire Emblem. Marth might have the larger Smash Legacy, but Lucina and Chrom has more or less replaced him as THE Fire Emblem protags
@@Legithiro Smash players don't understand the subject matter of 90% of the games in smash. Because literally all they play is smash, and honestly, they don't even really play smash much either. Why do you think most of the community automatically throws a hissy fit when a character like Pyra/Mythra gets added because "man another anime sword fighter" despite those two being really fucking fun to play and their source game being great. Same goes for Byleth. Yeah fire emblem has too many characters but at least Byleth is fun and three houses is good. But then you have the characters that people pop off for because they're recognizable like Banjo and Steve, who both ended up being annoying pieces of shit. Which is a shame because I wanted Steve. But the community just reduces it all to just familiar faces because fuck the actual play experience and how it feels to actually participate in matches. All we need is characters that are iconic, and mainstream, forever and always. Remove anyone who "isn't relevant" anymore (aka: characters that I don't know) s/
No 3rd party is “untochable”. They’re all up grounds to be replaced if we’rew getting a hard reboot cause at the point you can reestablished some things. Like Smash being about Nintendo Allstars
That's not gonna happen. I doubt Smash is ever gonna be a Nintendo-only fighting game again. If that happens I'm not buying the next game and I'm sure a lot of people would not buy it either.
@@Josue_S_6411 Smash will sell millions without you Non Nintendo fans!
@@DDKoD I think that's why he put untouchable in quotes on the roster, it will *always* be possible for them to get cut because of legal reasons or because Nintendo wouldn't want them, but why *WOULDN'T* Nintendo want them. Even if Smash will undeniably sell millions without non-Nintendo fans, having third parties will also undeniably greatly increase profits, ESPECIALLY if they plan on having DLC.
Nintendo DLC characters are waaaaaaaaaaay less hype than third party DLC because all of Nintendo's big names are in the game already, but having third parties gives basically endless popularities of big names. Master Chief? Kratos? Even Fortnite or Roblox? If we include indie games too, that'll generate a lot of hype too and isn't an impossibility either with the rise of indie games and a few got in as Mii costumes. Terraria is the 7th most purchased video game ever, after all. Indie games aren't a joke.
I say this as someone who doesn't like many non-Nintendo games. Nintendo would be pretty dumb to remove all third parties just because.
@@NessMotherBound And at that point, Smash will have COMPLETLY lost all of it’s Magic. Like seriously, everything doesn’t NEED to be this super crossover that includes everything. It’s gotten so bad people
legit want the next Mario Kart to be Nintendo/Smash Kart when that’s not what it was created to be.
@@DDKoD bro, this isn’t the hill to die on. I love all the Nintendo reps (except ironically Mario), I all of my most played characters belong to Nintendo, but as long as Nintendo can get the rights to other third-party characters they most certainly will included them. If anything they might double dip in Street Fighter and Final Fantasy alone
I reckon Wii Fit is staying, just like ROB has. The Ring Fit Trainer's... well, ring, is too bulky to do a lot of what Wii Fit Trainer does. And Wii Fit has a ton of interesting things to her, while also never really needing to be updated in any significant way. She represents the Wii too, maybe Nintendo's biggest console.
Smash RUclips gotta be the dopiest corner of this website. Watch them go back on their word and bring everyone back after all and make everyone who made these stupid cut discussion videos look like clowns. There are no rules for who gets added or cut beyond licensing agreements for third party characters.
Are we sure that Bayonetta's coming back? Her Japanese voice actress recently passed away, and her old English voice actress quit in pretty bad terms.
Copy paste those voicelines from the previous game fr
Voices aren't really an issue. Laura Bailey hasn't voiced Lucina since 2015. Besides Jennifer Hale basically has solidified being her new VA. They could also reuse Atsuko Tanaka's clips if they needed to.
probably just update her to Bayo 3
Bayonetta is probably 1 of the 10 Most Likely Characters to be cut for a Hypothetical Smash 6.
@WaterKirby1994 idk her series is basically nintendo property at this point. Sega may own the ip but nintendo is their only publisher and they have been pushing games since then.
Listen,If Lucarios Cut,Then Greninja is cut along with inceneroar
Yeah I think he underestimated Lucario’s odds significantly
Think you didn't really consider all the reasons Daisy may stay tbh. Yes she got into wonder but your forgetting she got into Mario run, she's apart of Nintendo world now, was heavily considered for the Mario movie and now becoming like a main character to create a core six. I think what may push her to staying is if she's in the movie sequel.
He just mad daisy got in over waluigi. He made a video crying about the whole thing doing smash ultimate hype years ago. He being a big cry baby.
Part 2 coming very soon.
3 weeks later.
FR
Sakurai says many ludicrous things, such as Ridley being impossible to be a fighter because of his size, and yet the canonically tiny characters like Kirby and Pikmin were perfectly playable.
"There's really no instances of a character who is their sole series representative getting the axe." Snake did come from a stealth game after all, cuz he's hiding in plain sight
Speaking of Snake
If they ever do another Smash game and Snake Returns
Please Oh Please Just give him some new Codec Calls
Plus give him some guns to use
Make his Final Smash be Metal Gear Rex
Plus give me these characters-
Crash Bandicoot
Spyro The Dragon
Rayman
Klonoa
Abe From Oddworld
Gex The Gecko
Croc From Croc: Legend Of The Gobbos
Lara Croft From Tomb Raider
Leon Or Jill From Resident Evil
The Pyramid Head From Silent Hill 2
To where we can finally have a Proper version of PlayStation All Stars
@@dylansmith5206I don't know, that's a lot to ask considering it would be premoting Nintendos No.1 Competetor
He doesn’t know how much does sakurai love kid icarus
Xenoblade 2 is still the best selling game in the series. I don’t think Aegis are going anywhere. Plus they can always dabble with Pneuma if they want to expand their moveset.
What I’d say is more likely is we get Shulk, Aegis, and Noah/Mio in Smash 6, THEN in Smash 7, Noah/Mio get cut, leaving Shulk and Aegis unscathed.
Agreed, Xenoblade is gaining way to much traction for Nintendo to cut either of its current reps right away
Noah having Lucky Seven as his final smash would be peak
people always bring up the pokemon popularity poll in 2020 for some reason when talking about these when it had a massive issue(voting by generation) and is outdated because a 2021 poll exists
Greninja is still staying
@mrmelonman2893 ehh its more of a 50 50 at this point. If this was 2018, he's coming back for sure but hes losing relavence every year goes and tpc doesnt seem to do him much special treatment. He also missed 2 pkmn games in a row and lost a form he had. He clearly isnt as notable as he once was 10 years ago.
He can still stay, especially considering his inclusion in Smash is quite delicate but hes not as safe as most say
@@masterwoo4359 nah hes staying cause pokemon za is coming out and megas are returning with great emphisis on his gen. Also he only really gone from gen 8 arceus doesnt count since it was focused in sinnoh and most pokemon werent there anyway
@mrmelonman2893 iirc he was gone from us um(transfer only) and ss. He returned in sv but 2/4 is not a good attendence. Like he was the only mon from smash that didnt eventually get into ss.
Its likely za isnt going to be in the same timeframe as smash 6. If smash 6 releases within 2 or 3 years gren has a good chance but if its 4 or 5 the push from plza arent going to affect it much
I do not understand the piranha plant cut
The only reason i see for cutting the plant is if you want only 4 mario characters in smash
How many characters would you keep Plant over? Especially on the first party side. Other than clones, I can think of like, two maybe
@ScrubReborn I would take the plant over that pudgy plumber character any day.
The paradox part about puff is funny because Scream Tail is popular in Japan
I am jigglypuff is also very popluar in japan
@@Mike-di3mo we japs all love some pudding :)
18:44 I dont really think that pyra and mythra are in danger of being removed.
Xenoblade is rising in popularity and sakurai is clearly a fan of the series so I really doubt that the aegis girls are leaving. Plus, removing a character from a series that only has 2 reps in smash is really odd.
While I think it's up in the air, I also think it could be pretty likely that they change the characters drastically to make Rex the fighter fighting with Pyra and Mythra. Doing what they originally wanted to do with the character and better representat that driver and blade dynamic from the original game.
@@XBC3403 true, but I can also see them keeping Pyra and Mythra the same as they are right now. Although I'd like to see what they do if they were to ad Rex to the moveset.
He a idiot.
Gosh dang it… No Little Mac isn’t a retro one off as the Punch-Out!! Series has had 5 games the latest being on the Wii, and 2 of them wheres he’s actually the main character so that argument goes right out the window. Going by that logic that’s like calling Ness a retro one off cause he’s only ever been in one game despite the mother series having 3 games the last one being before Punch-Out!! Wii so no.
Puff got more recognition since gen 7 when they put it in more anime scenes and promotional material. The push from mainline games such as getting new forms is pretty rare too, its not very often a legacy mon gets highlighted. So its kinda hard to gauge how much interest a mon has depending on this. Not only that, but they dont always go based on relavency, its applied on a somewhat random cast. It's much better to judge based on promotional material like in collaborations or anime.
I have a theory that they will stick with daisy just so that they can give peach a complete new moveset based on Peach:Showtime.
And have daisy stay for her old moveset. This would honestly make most people happy.
I was invested in those puff clips 😂
the only characters I personally want to stay are sonic and snake.
8:21 "But does it really need its own fighter slot in smash"
Yeah after seeing that combo fuck yeah keep zss shes sick as fuck
“It’s kinda cool to see Samus without the suit, it’s a unique scenario. but does it really need it’s own fighter slo-“
Every man on earth expect this dude:
*yes.*
no
Pyra and Mythra better come back. They're finally the duo characters done right.
Sure Zelda and Sheik did it too, but Zelda has been in the low/garbage tier through both swap and independant versions. So no one plays as her much in the swap case.
Pyra and Mythra complement each other with stark move differences, and while Mythra is the better half, Pyra's not in a garbage tier like Zelda, and is the main KOer of the Aegis duo.
Palutena can stay too. She's fun and we need more females. You've been giving the axe to too many ladies.
Steve can go, he fucks up the game too much.
bro steve changes smash bros to just an entirely different minecraft fighting game, he can *not* stay here 🙏
they need to go they're terrible characters and ruined a dlc spot
yeah cuz Meta Knight and Bayonetta were ever cut amirite
@@skategoats5266How does a 2-in-one fighter featuring 2 well-liked characters from an IP owned by Nintendo 'ruin a slot' in a Nintendo crossover fighting game? If anything, a 'ruined' slot would be Piranha Plant, as despite the fact that it wasn’t in the fighters pass, it got given a slot on the roster, and unlike Pyra and Mythra, who are extremely complex and important characters in the game series they’re from, the Piranha Plant is just a normal enemy in Mario games. Even Petey Piranha would have been better as the fighter.
@@paradox2210 just say you're a weeb, shulk was enough representation from you trash series
i dont think jigglypuff is going anywhere as Nintendo should know how much hate and backlash they will get if they remove one of the core 12 characters not even mentioning jigglypuffs history with smash
We all know that fighters will be cut for the next smash game but what we dont know is what fighters could become assist trophies and vice versa. What characters are seen as memorable enough to be in the game but not playable and what assist trophies could earn the right to fight.
They'll only demote characters to Assist Trophies if they're stupid. That would come off as a slap in the face and be worse than them not being playable almost.
i get what youre saying about past "rules" being broken numerous times and that some of the og cast have not had the highest priority to get a roster spot but i think its important to note that their inclusion was questioned for the earlier entries. they probably thought about cutting some characters back then because the series wasnt as established as it is now. legacy characters are a thing in a bunch of long-running game series so i would be shocked if any of the 12 original characters would not get into the next smash.
This is what I've been thinking. I doesn't matter if it was considered in the past, I just can't see Jigglypuff being cut at this point. She's become two much of series staple just like the rest of the original 12.
Exactly. Jigglypuff has been in the series for almost thirty years. Even if you wanted to entertain the idea of her being cut, placing her odds at 50/50 is like, legitimate nonsense
Smash N64 was 2000 so almost 25 Years. I can't think of a case of an Assist Trophy being playable in the same entry, & it was never a rule that an assist trophy couldn't become playable in the next game.
@@WaterKirby1994 Right like I don’t understand what “rules” he’s even talking about. No one has ever said an assist trophy couldn’t one day become a fighter, just that it wouldn’t happen in literally the same game
Soar will be one of the hardest characters for Nintendo to get back because of how tightly Disney holds on to their characters. Especially if kingdom hearts ever gets a movie on Disney+.
Disney was fully on board to get Sora into the game from the beginning. It helps sponsor their own IP, and they were able to profit from it. Nomura, the creator of the Kingdom hearts franchise, was the one who was hesitant because of how they’d represent him. But overall, I think he was a great addition to the game.
I think Roy would be justified returning, since he is the only GBA rep for Fire Emblem, but Robin is definitely the only Awakening rep that should return, that way, people stop getting pissed at all the lord clones, since Roy and Marth are now functionally distinct from each other, and wouldn't have a separate clone for roster padding. Also, basically everyone, except for his mains, want Corrin gone. That would mean one NES/SNES rep (Marth), one GBA rep (Roy), one GC/WII rep (Ike), one DS rep (Robin), and one switch rep (Byleth).
Roy is a terrible rep for the GBA era. Only appears in one single game, which is also Japan exclusive, and he's somehow more bland than Corrin personality wise. Hector or Elliwood are objectively better picks for GBA FE game, and that is if you even consider the need to have a GBA FE game.
Honestly, Roy should have never been in Smash. Dude debuted in melee for fucks sake, had FE6 been cancelled for some reason, then he would literally be a smash character.
@@namelessbag I wouldn't say Roy is bland, but I'll admit, it doesn't make since that Sword of Seals is still Japan exclusive. However, I wish they had made Roy's moveset more faithful to his game, where he is a fencer, rather than the brusier style that he was given. Also, I don't think Roy is necessarily a bad rep, Erika and Eliwood would probably be worse, assuming they don't give them their horses. I wish they would stray from the sword-lord character, if we got Marcus from FE6, that would be great, so we could have a unique mounted fighter.
I really don't see how pure console representation is at all relevant honestly. I love Fire Emblem but Roy doesn't really bring much to the table for the Smash series other than literally just saying his games were on the Gameboy
While I don't main her I really like Corrin being in Ultimate & would want her to return in Smash 6. As for Roy I admit he's only still in Smash because he was in Melee & it was a mistake not to translate Roy's GBA Game after putting him in Melee.
@@namelessbag Roy is part of a handful of characters that appear in 2 gba games(although only at the end of the game)
Didn’t Steve require all the stages to be remade especially to fit his gimmick? I can see them deciding not to bring him back again.
They weren't "remade", they were only changed. And the stages would likely be coded with him in mind from the start in Smash 6.
They could just reuse a lot of the code Smash Bros Ultimate already reused a lot of code from smash 4 which smash 4 reused code from brawl
With the box office success of Sonic 3, I 100% wouldn’t be surprised if we didn’t get a shadow skin for Sonic, if not a whole new character. Same thing for eggman.
The only similarity between lucario and mewtwo is the neutral B. That's it.
You're making it sound like you never even played the game you're talking about.
Bro tweaked when he said "chrom is the more popular character" mf its lucina. Plus roy aint gonna be cut. Hes the inverse to marth, thus making him outright a need in the game in the first place. The tier list for this is wack. Do more research please
Yeah your FE knowledge just flat out sucks. Ike, Lyn, Roy, and Lucina are THE four most popular characters in the series. FEH made that extremely clear
yeah save that yap session for later pls😭🙏
@@FaddzzIf you got nothing of substance to talk about then move along clown 😂
So Lyn in the next smash bros game confirmed?
@@Mr.Feather130 I doubt it. MAYBE if her game is remade by then but she’s also from the same period/region as Roy and personall I feel there needs to be 1 character per period/region. Hell Sigurd will prolly be the most relevent bu then and he uses lances and is on calvery so he has uniqueness on his side
And Engage has them too
Interesting tier list. I always thought Jigglypuff was still popular. Glad to see Sonic for sure will come back. He's been my main since Brawl.
Nah man you were on a roll till jigglypuff 😅
Fr he really just lost the right to cook
Young Link is for people who liked to play link before Ultimate, some different moves and obviously the bomb which practically makes his game plan pretty different
Shout outs to Sonic and Bayonetta for being the two most likely of the 3rd party characters to stay. They may as well BE Nintendo characters at this point.
The fact that matt, a notoriously overpowered character, represents an amalgam of 3 fighters in hilarious
If you don't mind me asking, would you be interested in doing a video on new characters most likely to get in Smash 6? For example: Do you think Raven Beak from Metroid Dread can get in as a new Metroid rep? Or Shovel Knight or Shantae as new indie rep? It's your choice if you wanna do it, but at least think about it, okay? That's all I ask.
Well, if smash 6 ever comes out, there’s that tiny chance that Sakurai doesn’t cut anyone and just adds new characters. Though that chance is smaller then Kirby’s canonical height.
i don't think Chrom will be cut, since he was added SOLELY because of an outcry that became of his absence in Sm4sh
I think Aegis is safer than people give them credit. They are arguably the second best fighter in the meta (you could make an argument for best). Pyra & Mythra are just as important to the Xeno lore if not more than Shulk (and equally as loved). There's no guaranteed that a new stance fighter will be introduced so cutting that gimmick is very risky. Lastly, Monolith Soft does a lot of heavy lifting in Smash's development for stages & backgrounds.
I'd move Aegis & Bayonetta into the danger zone. Shulk should be promoted to the safe tier for similar reasons stated above and the lack of JRPG characters in that Tier as of this video's rankings. Lastly drop Greninja into the 50/50 tier, popular Pokemon phase out regularly, kids playing the current 9th generation probably don't care about the frog anymore.
I love how we all saw jigglypuff on the list and instantly jumped to the comments
Think we can all agree none of the original 12 are getting cut.
I mostly play Fire Emblem characters, that’s the thing that makes me the most scared with a Smash 6, I know not all of them will make it, but the question is which ones
As long as Ike makes it though I’m happy enough, but I do play pretty much all of them all the time with Marth and Roy being the ones I don’t use that often
Same. I use Marth, Roy, Byleth and once in a while a few others (mostly fire emblem characters though) when hearing some characters are probably leaving I just said “uhhh no please.”
I think a lot of cuts are based off of character and not the move set. Ik it’s a hot take, but I genuinely think most echoes won’t get cut. The video is great! I love your content I just kinda wanted to throw my hat in the ring.
Can’t wait until this ages terribly 😭
I feel like theyll keep all characters, change some movesets, and add 2 DLC passes for 10 more characters.
The original 12 will always be in every future smash bros no matter what lmao
A cool concept is, what if smash first came out now? What would the most relevant properties be and who would be the “original 12” of 2024? Would series like fire emblem even get a spot on this roster if their popularity hadn’t been skyrocketed by smash so long ago? Would Falcon or the Star Fox characters have been completely forgotten if it weren’t for smash?
Idk about that ZSS argument followed right away with toon link, a clone by design. That’s just a bit ridiculous. “She’s unnecessary” can so easily be applied to toon link-If not more so because she has a FULLY original move set.
Why would they spend time porting over a clone if their time is SO precious in this scenario and not use that time in cutting TL and keeping ZSS? That’s just silly.
Any DLC (smash 4 to ultimate) being cut besides sephiroth or maybe banjo and Steve if things go south with Nintendo’s relationship with Microsoft is just not justifiable for any reason for multiple reasons I just don’t wanna waste my time getting into, it’s very obvious why that wouldn’t happen.
also she's one of the rare feminine characters in smash besides being loved by the community, she's not unnecessary, espacialy compared to toon link who is just link but with a moveset that allows more spamming and broken hitboxes, i hate toon link
I take everything guy says with a grain of salt. Nothing said by him is set in stone
@@jcook7408no shit its an opinion
@@totidoki05I see your argument and I understand it but “he’s just Link” is a pretty shallow view of Toon Link. He’s the sole representative of the toon style of Zelda games, his move set leaves much to be desired but cutting him just because he’s another Link variant is only viable in my eyes if you replace him with a character from his section of the series which I feel is highly unlikely.
And for Dark Samus to get a better chance? I would be pissed if Zero Suit Samus was cut for Dark Samus. That floating villain knockoff of armored Samus doesn't interest me. ZSS was my main for a while.
Keeping daisy the way she is is a good way to keep some form of peach if they alter her moveset, so there is that
I'm sorry, i am so tired of people claiming the Dex cut is due to limitations. It is not. If rom hacks of game sliek Fire ed and emerald can have all 1025 Pokémon, along with additional forms, regional variants, Megas, Dynamax AND fakemon. (These are games from back in 2004, two decades ago) the games of today could handle all 1025 as well. Especially since the system hardware is far more powerful)
Models and sprites aren't comparable. The former takes up way more space than some pixels forming 2D images, especially if the models are actually detailed and high quality. And much like how we've had all the models and animations since Gen 6 and have just been adding to that database ever since, all the sprites for everything up to Gen 4 or 5 already exist. Only difference is those don't need to be polished regularly to match with new art styles or just look less crusty. Also no deadlines. That's nice. Getting to make what you want when you want with no rushing or interference from corporate. That's ultimately the reason Pokemon has gone down the drain. That and GamefrEAk just being dumb and lazy. Doesn't mean you can equate fans reusing and editing existing, low quality assets to the actual devs cooking with much better ingredients.
Honestly I could see them keeping the echoes for a really good reason. If they were to rework peaches moveset some people would probably hate it and prefer the old one. Bam keep daisy in the game with peaches old moveset so that if people want to be able to play with a character more familiar or fun in their opinion, they can play with the echo fighter. For cases like dark samus tho that probably wouldn’t work because a lot of people wanted that moveset reworked, but I still think it’s a great idea
Or, maybe, there wont be another smash game because the lore is destined to end at ultimate.
mario mains when nintendo reveals mario is coming back in smash 6:
Some of these Fighters could be costumes for other Fighters like Bowser Jr and the Koopalings.
It surprises me that not alot of people have been saying this. Plenty of the echo fighters could easily be made into alternate costumes. I suppose their taunts, voice lines, and victory animations would still have to be different to fit the characters, but I don't see how that would really be an issue.
@@magic2546 What's the point of turning an echo into an alt though? An echo is just a glorified alt, so you're not really saving any development time by demoting them.
@@SubspaceJigglypuff Agreed. Even if they did do that, it wouldn’t benefit them in marketing or sales. Echo Fighters help artificially increase the roster size. In other words, Nintendo has no reason to do this.
I think in Smash 4, originally Lucina, Dark Pit and Doctor Mario were considered to be costume changes for a while. But for Doctor Mario, Sakurai thought that fans of Doctor Mario would be upset that their character was just demoted to a costume change. So, then they decided to separate Dark Pit and Lucina as well. I think Alph was going to be his own character at one point, but I think due to time constraints/they couldn't distinguish him from Olimar in any meaningful way like the other three, Alph was kept as a costume swap. I doubt the Koopalings were ever considered to be a separate character as it would be a bit ridiculous, and there's basically zero evidence suggesting they ever were unlike Alph.
Everyone hates sephiroths pretty bad design. He might not make. I wouldn't be surprised unless he got a new design to make it on
Come on you literally say "sakurai REALLY wanted to include chrom and said he would absolutely if there was more time", but then the only source that you provided in that scene from said interview says absolutely nothing of the sort, instead saying how chrom would have been "just another sword fighter" compared to the more unique Robin....like come on dude you have to do better than that
They arent going to get rid of incineroar. Sakurai said he always wanted a wrestling character in smash and that's incineroar.
12:30 Donkey Kong knows what he's doing 💀
Exactly
Fantastic list! So many people are really stubborn about so many characters being 100% locked as fighters in the next game, so I’m glad you put things into much more realistic terms. Heck I might agree with every single pick on here😂 *braces for replies*
he said jigglypuff was 50/50 was captain falcon and ness are very likey 😃
Eh I’ll take 99% for Diddy it’s better than being cut like what most people try to say despite him being one of the more prominent DK characters though I don’t think Nintendo are hesitant to add him to spin-off games, more so they like prioritizing other characters for launch and having him as Free DLC…even though it’s really dumb but he’s likely to be in Super Mario Party Jamboree soooo that should push him to safe at least
Edit: well this comment aged like milk since he got cut from Jamboree for just no reason but I’d still push him to safe mostly since Nintendo loves Diddy a lot since he was the replacement for DKJr much like how Bowser Jr replaced Koopa Kid not to mention aside for DK, Diddy gets so many merchandise from Nintendo that the other DK characters would wish they had as much as Diddy plus not to mention he was available at launch for Mario Kart Tour before Luigi was made playable and was big enough to be given a Power Up Band before Wario, Waluigi & Bowser so that should take precedent
I think a lot of characters have just been here for so long they've taken for granted by the fanbase. Meta Knight, Lucario and Ike also suffer from this, seems a lot of people have forgotten the value characters like them provide.
@@SubspaceJigglypuff yeah it’s more so people try to look at their playstyles or other characters and warrant those characters to get cut on their hypothetical roster despite Nintendo having huge favoritism towards certain characters and Diddy’s one of them which seemingly people tend to forget about
Characters I want added to next Smash:
Waluigi (Mario Bros)
Paper Mario (Paper Mario)
Tinkaton (Pokémon)
Updated Ganondorf (TOTK)
Shadow (Sonic The Hedgehog)
Dr. Eggman (Sonic The Hedgehog)
You misspelt TOTK... Apart from that, good list
@@ImGoingQuackers My fault 😅 Thanks tho
I don’t think that like half the characters they add will be pretty much new versions of old characters but other than that its pretty possible
I love how you did all this and almost everyone makes sense of where they should be. but Bayonetta being 100% safe? Impossible.
I am fairly confident to think if Smash 6 were to drop, Mario would be playable, and probably Link too.
Puff is not leaving the series
I think some people underestimate Terry's chances on coming back. It's totally fair to point how SNK's fighting games don't have much of presence in the States or Europe compared to other fighting games. However, I think if Sakurai and Nintendo both wanted him back, SNK would 100% be willing to play ball. It seems like that they were really easy to work with, if the amount of songs are anything to go by, and lately they've been putting extra effort into increasing series/brand recognition through crossovers. Not to mention, there's a new Fatal Fury game coming out. But, like you said, it's important to keep in mind what Nintendo could gain from keeping 3rd party characters in.
Bayonetta on the other hand, I have no clue how she is 100% safe in your eyes. As much as I love the character and game, she's anything but safe. Kamiya has left Platinum for Capcom, and there doesn't seem to be any indication that Sega nor Platinum have any plans for the series anymore. Realistically, she's the 3rd-wheel when it comes to the playable Sega characters. The fact that Nintendo bought the full IP rights for Astral Chain from Platinum probably means that she's not needed anymore.