Off Grid "Air Conditioning" System That Costs Pennies
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- Опубликовано: 3 окт 2024
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Permaculture cooling tubes, earth tubes, Geothermal tubes. This is one part to a series of concepts in this regenerative, Sustainable build. The Greening The Desert Project.
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Use a "hot box" on the roof instead of a fan. A simple metal black box with a pipe coming in and out will heat up the air, that air will rise and draw air through your cooling pipes(through negative pressure) into the house. The best thing about it is that it is self regulating. The warmer the box on the roof gets the stronger the draw.
We'll actually incorporate that idea later on! We just need to get further into the build! Appreciate that!😅✌🏾
Curious as to where you are at. I am in Sun Valley Az@@GrowTreeOrganics
Right on! We're in the area of Seligman and Ash Fork!✌🏾
@@GrowTreeOrganics We are near Ramah New Mexico. A few hours but we have kindred goals.
@@frictionhitch oh nice! Perhaps we'll have to meet up in the future!?😅✌🏾
It's amusing to see a dedicated cooling system that contrasts with the old basement system used on every homestead. The basement was first excavated then lined with rocks or concrete. We kept our veggies and canned goods here. On hot nights, we would turn on the furnace fan to draw cool air upstairs. Your system is simply a dedicated, more efficient, linear flow variant without cool storage unless that is constructed separately.
Lots of similarities with concepts, but different design. The beauty of working with nature!✌🏾
See that big tree behind you at 5:40? I would bet that if your cooling tube intake was in the shade of that tree, it would give you noticeably cooler air. Just walking down a city street, passing under a tree results in surprisingly cooler air temperature.
We're definitely not finished. We'll be building the tubes towards the trees in the back for the shade and we'll line a basin out with rubber to create an evaporative cooling system. ✌🏾
I've been looking for a great explaination on how to install a DIY system like this for my tiny house. Thanks!
No worries, glad the video could help you out!👍🏾✌🏾
Cooling warm humid air to the dewpoint results in condensation...an ideal scenario for mold growth.
You're definitely correct! Why we're making the tube with stone!✌🏾
Good thing the air is dry in the desert. And other points-the dewpoint probably is not reached, plus the air is constantly moving. I don’t know what happens with the “monsoon” action described. I would be suspect of purposely letting moisture into the unreachable parts of the tubes.🎉 I think traditional methods used fountains at the base of cooling towers inside the home.
@@pcatful I'd totally agree with your points!✌🏾
In a humid climate, using inexpensive irrigation poly pipe and run it through a H2O air coil while still using some electricity will reduce indoor humidity. If you run both the earth tubing and solar hot water through a manifold the same system can heat and cool.
@@paulmarc-aurele5508 oh nice! Appreciate that insight!✌🏾
lol my mind goes places, for a second there I envisioned a tarantula cannon leading into your house.
Nature gives examples right!? We'll cover the ends with screen one we're finished, so nothing gets into the tubes!✌🏾
have you thought of utilising the roman method of cooling homes? The open central courtyard had a pool in the middle. This pool was fed with water from the roof, which sloped towards it capturing any rain. The pool helped to cool the courtyard and also provided water if needed to the house. They also did some really amazing stuff to purify that water to drink, and even had their holding tanks attached to help control any sudden rain fall or drought.
We'll be taking that concept and mixing it with a few others to create a hybrid. It'll be a little while before we get to that. Have to finalize and finish the rest of the structure first! Appreciate the suggestion!😅✌🏾
Great concept. Make sure to put critter proof screens on the outside of the tubes.
Most definitely will! Thanks😁✌🏾
I am always heavily impressed after watching your videos. You guys are very spot on with everything that you do. Besides the fact that plants prefer an ideal temperature spectrum, temperature control is usually also a big cost for any household. And too much humidity inside can also cause molds. As always a huge 👍
Really appreciate it! There's still a lot more for us to complete and everything will be more understandable once we get further into everything!✌🏾
It’s pretty sweet you guys are able to use stones from your land to build out those tunnels. That’s so much nicer than buying material. The greenhouse is looking great so far!
We agree! And thank you!✌🏾
Grazie per la condivisione dei suoi interessanti lavori!
Thank you for supporting our work!✌🏾
i have a old farm house with a basement furnace if i just run the furnace fan it cools the house all summer
I know a few people that also do that with their furnace! Nice that the furnace fan can do that for your place! Bonus if the furnace is in the basement too! ✌🏾
I never knew this. I could have helped my windows ac cool the house that way. Smh!
@@lani1life if your on a will spray or trickle water on the ac cooling radiator of the AC and it will cut cost hugly
I like your project, i have been a carpenter for 30 years i like rammed earth awesome to see you combined rammed earth and gabion baskets far superior to earth bags, good work.
Nice! Really appreciate it!✌🏾
You could also build an atrium perhaps in what most people would consider your patio or verandah area. It's that roman room with the hole in the roof and a rainwater pool, it's supposed to act as a wind funnel over the pool and into the house. You might need to artificially fill it at first considering your environment but if it's sufficiently deep it should be able to maintain itself for the most part and might act like a giant Olla for any plant life you want to put in and around the house. Though the Olla idea I presume would mean lining the pool with clay and I don't know what that would mean for water level maintenance.
Appreciate that! I've definitely considered that concept and that might be something we do for our outdoor kitchen/ patio area in front of the structure!😁✌🏾
Right on, mate. Thanks for sharing.
Cheers!✌🏾
Dude, this simple explanation was great. You got a subscriber today.
Really glad it was a helpful video! Welcome to the journey! Thanks for Joining✌🏾
Fascinating. Love your explanations.
Thank you!✌🏾
He likes big words and is a master of synonyms.
You're right, thank you!👍🏾✌🏾
I always enjoy a warm synonym roll with butter on it.
Thats a great idea to deal with any condensation that may cause mold.
We're in the Desert too, along with air will constantly be going through it. I don't think mold has much of a chance!✌🏾
Lots of good ideas. AC is not the same as conditioned air. No comparison. Compare to a heater or heat pump.
Definitely!✌🏾
SUBSCRIBED!
Since you are interested in evaporative cooling, you might also like *indirect* evaporative cooling. Exterior air is drawn in and cooled, without adding humidity to the portion that stays inside. I have wondered about adding a second stage, with normal evaporative cooling, to get a bigger overall temp drop.
In the desert, adding humidity is probably a good thing. But TWO cooling stages is probably icing on the cake.
Appreciate you joining the journey! I have a couple other videos describing our full system for Heating and cooling. The cooling tubes are apart of that system, so creating redundancy with simple tech. But I think what you're talking about, that essentially is what we're doing. We'll be drawing in outside air that will be cooled by the tubes that will be buried eventually. But we'll create a swamp cooler inside, so we're not drawing humidity through the tubes, just inside. But im definitely Hip to your jive! Appreciate your input!✌🏾
it can also be boosted for the off grid situation with the use of a simple made windmill
Definitely a design feature that can be added! ✌🏾
I'm an inspector & Builder with 4 construction degrees and have never heard of this. This is amazing for desert areas. Thanks for this video you just opened a whole can of worms for me. lol This has got to be ancient technology before the days of AC.
I see, nice to hear from an inspector and builder! Definitely ancient, long forgotten technology, that does actually work!✌🏾
@@GrowTreeOrganics but does it work in humid environments?
@@y0nd3r it does! This does actually act as a dehumidifier in a sense. Burying the tubes far enough in the ground will be a cold point for when hot air comes in and condenses and most people have holes in the tubes underground to let water sink into the ground from the pipe. In more humid environments it will buffer that humidity more! appreciate the question✌🏾
@@GrowTreeOrganics where I am, the water table is also pretty high. I wonder if that would complicate things.
I live inner city and the lots are fairly small. Doubt I have 50 feet in a straight line from the house to the back fence, but I've thought about doing something like this because the only Electric company we are allowed to use has the Corporation Commission in their back pocket and all rate hikes are rubber stamped approved.
@@y0nd3r it definitely could bring in more humidity than you like. But you don't have to have a straight line you could coil the tube in a pit with flexible tubing. It's about maximizing surface area for the heat and cold exchange. Maybe that will give you some ideas!✌🏾
Thanks for the info, great compilation of graphics examples.
Super glad it was a helpful video for you! Thanks for tuning in!✌🏾
One issue with condensation in your tube is the possibility of mold and bacteria thriving. In wetter environments, this can make it wiser to use a separate liquid loop connected to some ratiators with 12v fans inside with these and a small pump running off solar.
Another consideration is adding screens to block varmints down to mice and depending on your area snakes or scorpions
We're in Northern Arizona, very hot and dry. I don't think we'll have much of an issue with mold and such.
It will also be apart of the finished tubes that we'll have screen and mesh to keep rodents and pests out. Although we do have 5 outdoor cats on mouse patrol here too!😅✌🏾
@GrowTreeOrganics One thing I haven't heard of anyone trying is separating a hot and a cold field. It's more effort but if you had one you only ever pulled air through when it's cold out then you could get much lower temps from the cold side and then do the same for the hot side. You just have to be able to divert it's output from indoors while "charging" it with heat during summer or with cold over winter. Twice as much digging and a little more complexity but you'd basically never need to burn wood for warmth unless you felt like it and still stay cool in whatever the AZ equivalent turns out to be of the crazy heat waves starting to hit the PNW...
@@johnassal5838 I see what you're saying. I guess that's similar to me why we're doing the tubes with rocks, acting as thermal mass to store hot and cold Temps to help reduce those energy needs inside. Appreciate your insight on that!✌🏾
@GrowTreeOrganics Yeah. It's amazing how many BTU are in a few hundred cubic yards of dirt. AFAIK rock is actually quite a bit more thermally conductive than dry earth so it's sort of extending the surface area of your earth tube's but unless you're running flue gases through they won't make much better use of the relstively low high temperatures they'll see. Definitely cheaper than any other sort of tube you could use though.
@@johnassal5838 I see nice! I'll look into that rock too! Sounds interesting! Thanks for that!✌🏾
Interesting build.
Thank you!✌🏾
I open my attic access, works like a chimney. Works ok.
Nice!✌🏾
Its a natural thermal battery . Super cool . Does the. Length help increase the differential
Length and depth definitely help cool the air more!✌🏾
@@GrowTreeOrganics
The air will cool to ground temperature, the trick is to provide sufficient airflow to ensure a temperature differential over the full length of the pipe. If the air drops to ground temperature in the first 15ft of tube, the rest of the tube will not be contributing any additional cooling. If you install temperature sensors at regular intervals in the tube you can see where the air reaches ground temperature inside the tube. If the air exiting the tube is a degree or two above the ground temperature, you`ll know the entire length of tube is being utilized.The longer the tube, the harder it is to achieve this.
I watched a video, from India I believe, where the guy had rubbish glass bottles. He would cut the bottom off and cement them into the top of the house walls with the wide opening on the outside. Apparently it cools the air coming through cools.
I know that method you're referring too. I think they also add like a waterfall or water has to pass over those bottles holes or I've seen them use pvc pipe. It's essentially a giant swamp cooler. ✌🏾
Will be interested in how well this works out. I'm not as adventurous as you, I think I would build a dog-house sized system before I went all in.
I've used this design before on the previous 4 Earthships we built. They definitely work! This design however will hopefully improve the cooling effect even more. We've still got ay little ways to go before it's finished! ✌🏾
They dont work for shit. That's why nobody ever talks about Temperature numbers. You'll get 80 degree air coming out and these people will tell you it works. It's beyond retarded to do this when an evaporate cooler would do a way better job and a shit ton less money.
Wondering what all species are going to expect to live in those tubes.
Whatever species you want! Especially if you leave it open to the animals and elements! Guess it's out of the question to put screens and barriers on the tube so nothing gets in... who wants to keep critters out!? That's just dumb...🤔
Curious if you could share more about the rock tube construction method?
Is it using grout? Adobe? Any wire reinforcement?
Totally can do! We've still got plenty more "tube" to do✌🏾
I see what you did there; 😁
My concern there is if water is laying inside the tube for long periods of time you could be looking at health issues, even modern Evaporative Systems need cleaning to stop Legionnaires' disease.
@@jamesmatheson5115 think it helps we live in the Desert and it's very very dry, but also that the finished "pipes" will be designed in a way to divert water away, towards water catchment basins and such. Air will be constantly drawn through the tubes, I'm not imagining significant lingering moisture.✌🏾
Great video! How do you keep animals from blocking your tubes or crawling in and causing obstructions?
Thank you! We have cats on patrol here, but there will be a mesh screen on both ends to keep rodents and insects out!✌🏾
Humidity is the bugaboo for earth tempered air in the humid states averaging 80-90% all July-August-September (Dog Days).
The (somewhat of a workaround) is to fan Circulate, Natural Roof Cupola circulate or otherwise.
Hope this helps. Or at least open a question file.
It definitely provides another solution and adapting design is always a crucial aspect to sustainable options. Appreciate your input!✌🏾
those tubes need to be wwwaaayyy deeper. might as well just use some pex and do a geothermal loop. swamp coolers dont work when the dew point reaches a certain point. here in phoenix swamp coolers dont do crap june thru august, which is when you really need some extra cooling. you want the home as deep into the ground as you can get it.
We're definitely not finished, and the tubes will be buried more. We also have to back bury more on the structure as well. Lots still unfinished! I'll have all the videos for when we get more finished on everything and can do the tests on temperature and humidity and how well everything works. You can Look back on some of my older videos where I show temperature and humidity inside our old Earthship Home in Montana. These tubes are different than how most people build them, so I hope to show how our method could be an improvement from old thinking and old design. Appreciate your input!✌🏾
so close but yet so far, the biggest mistake I always see is that earth tube people take outside air and try and cool it to room temperatures. In reality your far better off to take inside air and circulate it in a sealed closed loop to cool the air. why take the 100 degree outside air and try to cool it down to 85 when you could take the cooler inside air and provide nearly the same drop in temperature. of course there are caveats. The ideal slope of any drain line is ¼ inch per foot of pipe. In other words, for every foot the pipe travels horizontally, it should be dropping ¼ inch vertically. Many drains either have too little slope or too much slope. That's right, it is possible to have too much slope in your drain lines. second the intake should be higher than the exhaust. air is cooled and is heavier and should auto siphon. This also allows you to clean your system with mist or even rags tied to a rope and drug through. Yes you need makeup air from the outside but that system should be separate from the main cooling loops. Third is RADON. no need to bring that into you home if you do not have to. that is the big down side to earth formed tubes. Do a radon test to make sure that is not a problem. You are definitely headed in the right direction with all your ideas but adding a little modern science to this could easily give you a large increase in efficiency. The only problem with the outline methods is there is a substantial cost increase. I understand a lot of these builds are done on the cheap using labor as the main variable. Sorry for being a grumpy old dude but I have walked this road already and do not want to see people make the same mistakes I did. Would you like to know more? Best wishes and I hope you get the lifestyle your dreaming of because it is worth it.
You were mentioning radon, so wouldn't circulating the air inside contain the radon inside the house as apposed to the tubes bringing in fresh air and circulating fresh air constantly? It's hard to show perspective as well on video but our tubes have a slight downward tilt for any moisture, so it will go out as apposed to coming into the house. We're actually not fully finished with the tubes, so a ways to go, as well as the rest of the structure to, so it's hard to see what all this will exactly look like and function. But we are trying to do what you're saying, Simple tech, but adding the science to it. No worries on sounding grumpy, everyone has their free will to express their thoughts and opinions. Appreciate your insight and perspective on this. We're creating our lifestyle, one rock at a time! Thanks for stopping in!✌🏾
@@GrowTreeOrganics
If your tube is not airtight along its length radon from the soil around it will leak in then may get pulled into the house. The fresh air from the exposed end is probably helpful as far as radon goes.
I do would like to know more! Do you have some hints about how to look up at this? Last time I tried, I end up in a Polish internet forum. Actual papers would be great.
@@fredericoevandro-veladelibra look for ijspr_0602_181.pdf
@@fredericoevandro-veladelibra unfortunately I cannot find the design that uses 4-inch tubes that loops back to your house. It by far having the best test results. I will keep looking for it
Blessing
Metal is a good conductor, but as the inside of the pipes is smooth, the air flows in a continuous stream, so very little air touches the interior wall and heat exchange is inefficient. A bumpy interior is preferable, as it disturbs air movement, which results in greater heat exchange.
What's more, the larger the diameter of the pipe, the less heat is exchanged between the air and the wall. So it's better to have more small pipes than a few large ones.
I am not sure but it looks to me that the tubes are not installed deep enough.
Another problem to consider: the water condensing from the humidity in the air must be able to drain away, otherwise the pipe will fill up with water and the system's efficiency will drop. It could also lead to the appearance of undesirable fungi and bacteria which are evidently damageable for the health.
That's why we'll be building it as a "rock" tube! But we're also not done with this so it will actually be buried! Still more work to do on this project!😅✌🏾
@@GrowTreeOrganics 👍
Interesting concepts. But, I checked the the soil temp gradient down to 200CM in the place I'm building, Philippines, and it would not be cool enough, especially with the high humidity. Even in Tucson where I'm at now, it would be a chore to dig down deep enough. The soil here is like concrete. One thing you might consider before burying those pipes is to drop a line of UV LEDs in them. They last forever and you can cycle them occasionally to kill and mold, fungus, bacteria and other bio growths from establishing a foothold.
I see... you can always dig down but also bury the pipe, as we are, adding 7-8ft more dirt on top so essentially doubling the depth of our cooling tube! We still ate in the middle of finishing this!✌🏾
Need a fence grid hope you don't have skunks.not in a skunk area. I was called on AC. Dead mouse in house vent in the wall or floor. Ozone generator. Would help eliminate smell, mold accumulation.without using spray disinfectant.
No skunks, but we do have patrol cats! We will put wire mesh over the openings when we're finished with the tubes. ✌🏾
The ozone generator is a good idea though!✌🏾
What about the math to predict the type and diameter of the underground tube and the output temperature?
That would be dependent on each individual case, which I had said, but how we're doing the cooling tubes will be based on the earthship design with back burying or building up the depth so it's underground. ✌🏾
In Az you gotta bury the tubes at least 6 1/2 feet down due to the intense heat.
You're totally right! We still have a lot to do, which includes building the tubes more and burying more!✌🏾
I grew up in lake havasu and the arizona desert ground is so hard and rocky you better have a backhoe to dig 6 feet down.
@@timothycarey3883 good thing we're building up and not so much digging down! We'll have over 6ft of earth on top of the tubes, simulating the same thing as being underground. This structure is modeled after the earthship designs with back burying the north, east, and west walls of the structure. ✌🏾
I understand the passive cooling system, running pipes underground, however Im not sure how you expect hot/warm air to travel downwards, then travel horizontally then come back out cool, I know with a venturi system you could draw air out but that doesnt get it in where a small blower would do all of that, on the other hand, Evaporative Air Con is something that off grid homes can have simply and cost effective, with a total outlay for less than $500 and a days work, we use to run a small 12V Solar Panel Grid hooked up to a 12V Truck Battery with a Battery Tender the house ran 12V lights, small gas stove using bottle gas, in winter you did as they did 150 years ago and use a wood stove for cooking and passive heating, I guess its the difference of living off grid or doing it as green as humanly possible in the confines of ones monetary wealth. The building construction is the key, having massive thick solid walls will help cool the internals down, yet in winter it will be so cold that it will be almost unlivable, in Summer time you need to get rid of hot air out of the ceiling and again our fore fathers designed roofs to do exactly that in a passive way, I guess we need to look back in our distant pass to find the answers we need today. Oh Im guessing you all think Im not every green, you're right there, I prefer to be practical and use whats available and I know what works, do many of you know that Bubble Wrap was originally invented as a insulator.
Convection is the answer you're looking for on how this system will work! 😅 Also why I show Earthship pictures, but maybe I wasn't all the way clear with everything... always room for improvement! We're not 100 percent done with the tubes or the structure its attached to. You can watch the latest video to see how everything has progressed! Appreciate your input and your own experience!✌🏾
The tubes have to be laid out carefully in a slope and cleaned so mold doesn't form.
Careful design is crucial!✌🏾
I was obcessed with this tecnique. It seams it's kinda popular in Poland, for heating. But a lot of educated people there call it a scam, since the labor/resorces/costs required are very high and the results are not that impressive. Also, you have to be carefull with toxic gases naturaly realised underground. And mold and rats. I don't plan to build it anymore, there're a lot of diferent passive cooling methods and my temporary house is confortable just for been builded observing the sun's path.
I steel think that's sick as hell, tho.
There a lot of differing opinions out there and it really comes down to our own personal discernment and what we wanna do for ourselves. This concept isn't for everybody and one design doesn't cover everyone. Appreciate the support!✌🏾
Your tubes are not deep enought and do not forget condensation that will occur in those tubes, depending on your topology, you need a solution to adresse this problem.
The tubes aren't finished actually. We also live in the Desert with very low humidity, so I don't think moisture will be a problem. Appreciate the input✌🏾
I think you would need to Bury them at separate depths. The lower depth could be pulled in for cooling and the shallower one will be where the rocks were actually heated from the Sun....
We're actually not finished with these. This was more to introduce what we're doing and what it is! These will be way different one they're done! I appreciate the suggestions though!✌🏾
Don't use this for a home, because the tube can bring in high levels or radon as well as black mold. Better option is a hydronic (water) system using a heat exchanger (radiator). Still will use little power.
That said, best option to insulate your home well. best bang for the buck is 2x6 with 24 oc framing and 2" rigid foam for exterior. 12" SIP roof if you can include in your budget.
Wouldn't that be why you would do a radon test before hand and also why you would have an air filter, like any other house? Heat Exchangers are pretty nice though too. I've been to a few houses with em and people definitely say they're very efficient and work really well. Lots of options for efficient heating and cooling systems out there! Thanks for your thoughts on the matter!✌🏾
@@GrowTreeOrganics Air filter will not stop radon, nor totally filter all black mold. Radon is every where in the ground.
@@guytech7310 it is everywhere, but I never said a filter would take out radon, only that people would choose to test their ground to make sure. And basically every house has mold. But we're building the tubes in a way that no mold will be growing on the inside, plus we're in the Desert...there are other people with this system that can attest to no mold issues. It's also that constant fresh air is coming in and being exhausted out. So no recirculating air. But I can understand where you're coming from.✌🏾
@@guytech7310Well sure it's everywhere but it varies greatly by region due to local geology. For example the Atlantic and gulf coastal plains of the United States have a lower average ground radon concentration than the rockies or the interior plains.
So while it's important to monitor the risk may be significantly lower or even negligible depending on one's location.
@@whogavehimafork Lower, not not zero. It does matter where you live, Radon is everywhere. Its just not good idea to use this method. If you want to use ground source for climate control, use a hydronic system.
1:21 Dis dude lookin' like Azazello from the The Island Of Dr. Moreau. He even did the head twitch sniff. 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
😅 I don't know who that is, but that's still funny!✌🏾
Amazingly Simple & Common Sense! Thank you for sharing this video. Our people have utilized those concepts in traditional methods of living for thousands of years and living off the land, living in sustainable ways & in harmony with nature. We have lost some of our vital traditional, customary ways, we have also lost humongous natural resources due to colonization, introduction of Western religions & the so called development of Western, civilized society. I must say the Western civilized methods of governing has its many advantages in free press, channels of expressing opinions, ideas, innovations, stopping conflicts, wars between different tribes, nations & introduction of fair judiciary court systems & punishment of wrong doers. I thank you again & commend your good work in amplifying these cooling systems for homes. If all mankind can see our existence as a creation of a higher being who molded clay to make the first human Adam & then Eve & commanded them to multiply and live in harmony with nature & if mankind can do that & live in harmony with nature, utilize Green Technologies & on a wider wholescale then we may make a better world for ourselves and for our children and our grand children. We should think globally & act locally like what you are doing in building a cooling system & documenting this & educating others. Thank you. Greetings from Madang, Papua New Guinea!
No worries, thank you! So much has been lost in history, tradition, and what use to be common knowledge. In also simply learning what's been lost from time!✌🏾
If I undostood right, the tube should not go down and then up again, otherwise you can create a siphon effect once the deep point gets flooded by the condensation water. That would block the air. So make sure, the tube steadily goes downwards, so the water can just run out freely. Otherwise you might have to pump out the water once in a while.
You're most definitely right, only the context is what's confusing, because in the video I'm more referring to the downward angle horizontally as to direct the water away, almost like a sidewalk curve. But the we will be cautious with the vertical tube angle so as to not cause a water plug of any sort!✌🏾
You should use the Nabataean tribes way of cooling
Well, we can try it on a different project and see how it compares to our tubes when they're finished!✌🏾
Looks like the earthship design, but using rocks as walls instead of dirt packed old tires.
Question , instead of using stone and rocks has anyone used Hesco barriers for walls?
Probably cost more, but maybe quicker.
It is an Earthship design! I've never heard of anyone using Hesco barriers for Earthship walls, but someone could definitely try!✌🏾
What about naturally occuring radon gas in the soil? Or other types of gases? Just curious...
We'll have a meter to measure the radiation just like any other home, plus there will be constantly moving air and constant fresh air coming into the structure once completed!✌🏾
Aren’t the metal tubes best for heat transfer?
They can be, it just depends how you wanna do it yourself and your own goals. We're just utilizing the materials at hand. Rocks are good thermal mass and since their cooling tubes, we want the tube to absorb as much heat from outside as possible. ✌🏾
yeah right. try that in Phoenix. the ground temperature even down 10 ft deep is over 85 degrees
Wouldn't 85 be better than 118?😅✌🏾
How do you deal with moisture (condensation) and possible mold growing inside these tubes when you only have a shallow slope or even a "U-shape" into and out of the ground?
The concept itself is a dehumidifier. And it's not as intense as conventional AC systems, so far as that it's not creating condensation that drips. But it's about your design, making sure your tubing has holes in the bottom for moisture to escape and having gravel underneath the tubing to allow the moisture to drain. Adjusting your design to your area is the most important and maybe it could be you need a whole different concept that works in your area but does a similar function?!✌🏾
I had an idea like this years ago as a kid but dismissed it because I thought mold would be a problem. Have you come across any problems with mold?
There are thousands of people with this system and I have yet to see our hear anything about mold being a problem with these. I had talked to a guy over in south Carolina, that's humid east coast, that has had this system for over 4 years, no mold problems, no condensation problems. ✌🏾
@@GrowTreeOrganics wow that's interesting. I've noticed these all seem to be made of plastic even though it's not a good conductor of heat. My idea relied on either thin walled galvanized piping or stainless steel. Both would have to be welded, soldered or sealed to be waterproof somehow and would be pricey. I guess the different plastics work well enough. If I ever have a place of my own I want to have a system like this. 2/3 to 3/4 of my electric bill in the summer is because of ac. 🥵
@@nathanhale7444 yea all kinds of ways to design this system. What we're doing isn't the end all be all! That'll be great if you can eliminate almost all your electrical usage, or take it out of the equation all together!✌🏾
As a hvac contractor this is not air conditioning, air conditioning treats the air. removal of humidity, heat and particulates
Look into cooling tubes and earth tubes. They do exactly what the definition of air conditioning says. Treats the air, removes humidity, heat, and putting a filter on the ends of the tube takes out particulates. ✌🏾
nice snake habitat. cool
That's right! We'll keep this tube unfinished and wide open and won't put screen or wire mesh to block any rodents or snakes from coming in.... that just wouldn't be smart at all to do that!✌🏾
Until animals crawl into it and all you get is decomposing carcass air inside your home
Must be hard to imagine and think that you would probably put screen over the openings!? To you know keep those things out.😅✌🏾
So cool! ;)
😂✌🏾
What about critters and mold 😮
Both can be mitigated with proper design. Most conventional AC systems have mold in them, people just don't notice because it's an enclosed system. We're also in the Desert, very dry and we'll have that dry air constantly coming through the tube, so constant fresh air. It's also just logical to put an air filter like any conventional house would and putting wire mesh over the openings.✌🏾
I applaud this, but man everytime I watch these types of videos it scares me for what a post oil world will look like 😂.
We are so used to things being done fast with low labor. In a world with less energy like low oil, I imagine that things will slow way down and become way harder....
Thank you! It's definitely something for people to think about... future times, the state of the world and everything. The future is a part of us moving here and starting fresh and doing this project!✌🏾
Have you ever thought about using Mexican brick roofs to cool your house
May be a possible project on the next structure!? I'll have to look into that more! Appreciate That suggestion!✌🏾
Already the romans did that.
(Fist pump pump pump in the air) A grid locked city is just a roman camp!
Now let's take a look at the persian cooling towers...
Exactly, what we're doing is technically nothing new! But a lot of this knowledge has been lost to time, so most people think this is new!✌🏾
I’m confused the tubes look above grade why would u count them as geothermal tubes? Or consider them under ground
We still have much to finish and complete on the backside, which includes burying the tubes. We just can't dig down because of rocks, so we'll be building up the backside and building it up so as to "sink the pipes more underground"✌🏾
With this kind of setup how does one deal with bug and pests using it to invade your home or use the tube itself as a home blocking it off?
We'll end up putting screen on both ends to keep bugs and critters out! We also have patrol cats!😅✌🏾
i bet burying a standard aluminum tube could work, since it is thermally conductive
It definitely would work, most people use culvert pipe, but you can use all kinds of material! This is just the way we're making our tubes. It's the concept that's solid, the design can be changed since we're all different and have different ideas, goals, and such. ✌🏾
Wasn't "greening the desert project" Geoff Lawton's creation?
Anyone can Green the Desert and make it a project! It's not a Copyrighted slogan. But Geoff Lawton was a good teacher and mentor for myself and taught me a lot. ✌🏾
Will this work in the tropics
It can! The design just needs to be adapted... may mean a more shallow trench, so as not to hit the water table, and a longer trench. ✌🏾
I know someone who kind of did this. He won a truly ridiculously large amount of corrugated tube drunkly bidding on a government auction.
He ended them as air supplies for the air heat pump. Said his power bill is a fraction of what it used to be
Too funny about the guy you know! 🤣 people definitely use these in multiple different ways and depending what you're using it for is what creates the labeling!✌🏾
Corrugated pipes would be much stronger. What about critter control?
Most of the time on Earthships they're using corrugated pipe. We only needed a little section to go through the gabion walls, so we didn't need anything special✌🏾
Why not put a metal plate paint it black an use one of those fans that work from heat as the day gets hotter the fan would come on an blow air into ure duct work
But no electricity at all
There by have air moving thru youre duct work not a lot but would push air through
Plus put hot box on roof to one heat water plus pull hot air up through
Roof area plus that alone will pull
Cool air in rooms plus fan an water
Heater on roof
Nice yea that's a good idea. We're not finished with this project but we're definitely gonna do some of what you're saying, with the solar pulling hot air up and pulling cool air in!✌🏾
this is going to sound really picky, but is there a loss of micro organisms in the soil surrounding the tube as the summer air warms the earth and degrades the evolved habitat of the micro life?
I know, pretty picky. lol.
No worries, I don't think that will be a problem, the microorganisms that are here are adapted to the harsh environment. So I think I would actually help microbes in the sense it would be cooler and not bombarded with UV, but at the same time there won't be really any food for them. There's still plenty of space for the microorganisms, especially now we've done all these earthworks and starting to add more organic material and diversity to the surrounding area. Are little tubes won't be taking away much. Appreciate the question!✌🏾
ok dude here we go imagine a car radiator at the entrance to your home! attached to the radiator a closed coil with glycol...this external coil attached to a cooler and dropping frozen gallon jugs into the reservoir the water in the cooler will be 28 degrees Fahrenheit so will the radiator at the entry to the home! other than freezing the ice jugs during the day with solar power your home should be downright cool and at night just grab a blanket! In the winter change out the frozen jugs with a type of ondol subterranean heating system and use solar to heat the cooler water the exchanger now heats the fresh air intakes! the ondol will heat the floors and insulating wrap around the home including the limes stones in the gabion baskets now can store the heat and charge up from the subterranean ondol! Convection works without fans wires or switches!
Sounds intriguing! Almost like you're talking about a heat exchanger? I almost have thoughts that are tubes and are other simple heating and cooling systems will be almost overkill. I'll be doing videos showing Temps and such in the future once the place is completed. ✌🏾
I’m curious I don’t know all the science here, I know this system works and is efficient we’re planing on using this system at our off grid properties.
My question comes from an issue I witnessed one other person having. The tubes buried underground can collect condensation, mold and mildew has the potential to grow.
I only heard of this issue in one situation. So I don’t believe the problem persists unilaterally in every situation. That being said how can someone mitigate the possibility of condensation and mold or mildew from growing inside the tubes?
Did the person that had the issues have drainage holes in the piping? Was there a gravel base before the pipe was laid? Mold and mildew come from constantly dripping and pooling water in an area that sits as well. If you have proper drainage the constant air intake should keep things dry. A lot of people have these similar concerns to yourself and I think in most cases it's user error that creates problems. It also takes adapting the design to your area. These tubes actually help regulate humidity hence the concern for the condensation and mold and such in the tubes. The design can be such that maintenance can be possible for either a brush or rag to be dragged or stuffed into the tube with bleach water or hydrogen peroxide, or to wear you could just "flush" the system with water. Just a few thoughts and ideas! Appreciate your question!✌🏾
@@GrowTreeOrganics I think drainage holes would definitely help like a drain pipe with a cheese cloth stretched over it to prevent dirt dust to enter? Could a trench dug with a slight elevation force any pooling of water to drain out? I talked to a scientific guy who specializes in hydrology he basically said water ends up in places that might surprise us.
Is it possible to do a bio char burn then some design a pvc pipe inlet into the house to put that char in the pvc like an in house air filter?
@@NevadaFarms all great ideas! The nice thing about natural/simple building. Easy to customize and expand the designs!✌🏾
@@NevadaFarms definitely key to know that the trench bottom has good drainage, but like you said a slight downward angle to it will also help water flow out and away from the tube. ✌🏾
We've got a lot of humidity in northwest Louisiana - seems like we might get some condensation and then some mold. Any thoughts?
Adapting the design would be one thought perhaps using more gravel than earth would help with airflow and keeping condensation down, but they're are people that have these systems on the east coast, like in Tennessee that have said they've had these systems for years and no mold issues or condensation. This concept is meant to dehumidify the air. So adapting the design could mean its a shallow trench and longer piping, or putting sand in the trench to bury the tube. This won't be like a conventional ac system pulling warm air and cooling it drastically. In the ground it's a gradual drop, so that's why distance and depth are essential to figure out. Depends how cool you want the air, your humidity outside, etc. I've heard some people that somehow connect the tube directly to a dehumidifier and how the air into the room. Then you have that water for watering plants! Hopefully you gained a little insight from that. ✌🏾
Do you got mesh on the ends to keep out rodents?
Yes there will be wire mesh and screen to close off the ends!✌🏾
I am in Tn. and have an old cistern on my property .The building that fed the cistern is long gone .The cistern is about 12' deep and at least 6' wide around its middle.It is concrete on its sides. Seems to me there should be some way to use the cool air down there. Have you heard anything along those lines.Anybody out there have any ideas.There is a pile of old carpet down in it and junk so water storage would be a major clean out job plus I am in Tn. near a large lake so water not a problem. The cistern was built before TVA made the lakes .
You could turn it into a giant swamp cooler!😅 if it can hold water that's something to take advantage of even if it's not for drinking purposes. Maybe a cistern for a garden? Perhaps you could just make it an in ground greenhouse. If it's concrete there's your thermal mass. I few ideas I could think of!✌🏾
I don't think you understand. I do not need water.The building is gone ,water would have drained off the building into the cistern .The cistern is now a big hole in the ground full of cool air. It is 90 degrees and the air at bottom of cistern is 65 degrees. So while you are digging trenches and putting down pipe to get cool air I have a giant hole in ground with cool air. Where I am in Tn. water bill is $25. for 3 months. It is under $100. to fill a 15x30 swimming pool. It is very humid here swamp coolers are not effective in humidity. All I can think of is to build a chicken coop over top of it and have a fan blow up cooler air for the chickens . Cistern is too close to road to put any kind of human dwelling.
You're tripping over your solution. The digging is already done. You simply coil your tubing, piping, ducting, etc. into the cistern and backfill. Route to home, add some fans and voila!
Oh no! you gave up the secrets of the ever green troll ending. Glad that the project is so big you can easily move to other things.
Oh, but you see the troll endings are just beginning!😅✌🏾
How do you eliminate the moisture order smells from mildew in a few years?
Activated carbon, or Charcoal scrubber! We're also in the Desert, the most we'll have to worry about is dust, but we'll also have screen on both ends for that and bugs and such. ✌🏾
Radon?
That's what a radon sensor will be handy for! 😅✌🏾
Your tubes are not deep enough in the ground. Or are you going to cover with 6 foot of dirt.
That's right we still have to back bury the structure so the tubes will be buried with about 8ft of berm!✌🏾
How does it preform in high humidity ....
Pretty well from multiple people on the east cost that have installed this system!✌🏾
Our soil temperature is around 75....
Seems the air at that temperature can hold to much moisture to be directly introduced to a moist living space....would make it muggy...would work great in the winter here.
Looks like a great way to get mice in your house
Good thing we'll be putting screen and wire mesh in the openings, just like any other house. Also helps we have 5 cats on mouse patrol here!✌🏾
@@GrowTreeOrganics Patrol cats, cool!
@@jkmarshall3553 😅✌🏾
This is the same as the Middle East cooling that they have used for centuries!
Exactly! Bringing back the old for a renewed comeback In the modern Era!😅✌🏾
You’re gonna get moisture in that pipe it’s not even a sealed pipe you’re using the wrong pipe. What do you think?
I think it's not finished it was a video describing what we're doing and how we're doing it currently. Plenty to still complete on this project! Thanks for input!✌🏾
I think you need a lesson on latent heat and calorimetry. Some of what you say about condensation doesn't make sense, like opposite of what I think is supposed to happen. Maybe I'm wrong. I'm not sure you know what you're talking about.
What was it that you didn't find correct? I'm curious so I can address it in the next video! Appreciate the feedback!✌🏾
Is there any chance you're having a mouse problem?
Not when we have 4 cats on mouse patrol!✌🏾
@@GrowTreeOrganics fantastic
✌🏾
This works great in low humidity areas. Try this in Houston and you will be miserable sadly.
Takes a little adjusting of design but there are people in more humid places that have used this concept and claim they've had no mold problems or lack of cooling. Actually Someone in the comment section said they live in Missouri I think but they've used this concept for years and had no problems with their set up. ✌🏾
These tubes will become factories for mold. Breathing in mold spores is not a good idea.
Oh, have you worked with these tubes before? Could you share some evidence of where and when this happened?
Or Are you presenting your opinion as a fact?✌🏾
@@GrowTreeOrganics Back in the day my father did this kind of installation near Desert Hot Springs. His thinking was that with proper drainage and arid conditions for most of the year, mold would not be a problem. Halfway down the line he created a filtered gasket-sealed 'observation' port to check on things from time to time especially after the odd rain storm or even cold snap. First year or so, no mold. Then one day he unsealed the port and got a nasty whiff of something. Condensation attracted mold spores. He pumped in anti-mold aerosols, but the problem always returned. He sold the property (with full disclosure) and moved to Los Angeles. I have no clue what has happened since.
@@zeekwolfe6251 I would think if this is a common problem it would be coming up for every sustainable house ever built with this system. Taos new Mexico is full of these systems in the Earthships, yet all the negative things people say have nothing to do with mold growing in the tubes or any concerns with the tubes at all. Designing these systems can be tricky, but problems are most of the time are human error. Besides the fact that you can install a filter on these just like any regular house to clean particles and such from the air. But the best part is you don't have to build one, no one has to build one, everyone is free to choose what they don't and do want to do in their own lives. ✌🏾
What happen as rodents enter the tube then die in there
Are tube is made of stone, so it can be disassembled if that was the case, but we have patrol cats, so rodents aren't a problem and it will have wire mesh to close the openings and still allow airflow. ✌🏾
not sure those are deep enough...
Because they're not finished!😅✌🏾
Use this information for entertainment. Can work only on RUclips videos.
It works in real life! I'll have the video in the future showing temperature differences and the results of everything! But it can be entertaining information for practical use!✌🏾
@@GrowTreeOrganics Temperature is half the equation you need to measure the air volume that comes with that temperature.
@@adobo6905 you're definitely right on that! I'll try to get that kind of information when we finish these cooling tubes! Appreciate your feedback.✌🏾
There are animals that build this in nature
Exactly, follow the example of nature!✌🏾
You’re gonna learn a lot about reptiles with this method
We have enjoyed learning about all the reptiles and bugs! Of course we are gonna be smart enough to cover them with mesh when they are done so we don’t have visitors inside.
Critters, rodents, snakes, bugs, creepy crawlies?
Think they call it wire mesh screen.😅✌🏾
Human should just live underground like in Coober Pedy
Probably for the most part I'd agree. Most animals and the nature in the world go underground!✌🏾
@@GrowTreeOrganics Lik'd Sub'd for the thoughtful reply. Look forward to past and future videos.
@@callmebigpapa I appreciate you joining the project! Plenty of old and new videos to watch!😅✌🏾
This ducting will be full of rust in no time.
Follow along and you'll find out. I'll make sure to document that for you personally!😅✌🏾