Spain's solar energy crisis: 62,000 people bankrupt after investing in solar panels • FRANCE 24
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- Опубликовано: 5 окт 2024
- Seventeen years ago, Spain’s socialist government decided to inject subsidies into renewable energy. As a result, thousands of Spanish families massively invested in photovoltaic energy. But, as you'll see in our report, the dream rapidly turned into a nightmare.
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I spent 12 years in Spain and it has serious levels of sunshine. Yet, the government pulled benefits for solar and imposed heavy taxes to kill it off. The reason later became clear - When I worked at Naturgy, there was an order given not to discuss alternative energy stuff with the clients. In Spain, most homes are apartments and everywhere has gas for heating and water. I never once saw an electric shower. When a Spanish friend came to my home in Ireland, they had never before seen such a thing. Exactly as the Spanish government want. They are in bed with the gas companies.
Correct.
Things are changing now. Installing solar panels is cheaper than ever. And it really saves money if you can afford the investment. They are popping around slowly.
But still not sexy for most people.
Installing solar panels in areas with low sunshine is still a bad idea, even if those panels got cheaper.
You would be better off looking for high-altitude land above the sunlight blocking clouds and putting solar panel farms there.
With such high gas prices, lets see who can survive.
I wonder if another problem is the storage of the electricity generated. In other words, with so many jumping on the bandwagon, where do the extra generated electricity go? Is there an infrastructure to integrate that or to store that? It seems like a half-baked project.
In this video, I don't see the sunshine nor the storage/integration infrastructure.
@@Birdylockso Yes, storage for electricity is indeed a problem. Tesla and others have been addressing that with big battery installations. Like they did in Australia and other places. So it does take investment in that side also. My first though when I saw the video was that it was maybe in the Basque country to the north or some place. But either way, Spain gets staggering amounts of sun. It should really be capturing it and selling it back to the EU. It is absurd to see what they are doing.
The lesson: Be careful about investing in business models that rely on government subsidies. Certainly don't spend your entire life savings on it.
As it’s been said, eventually you run out of other people’s money
The fossil fuel lobby had the right wing government in its pocket. They were taking directorships and put controversial taxes on.
Fossil fuels get way more in subsidies than renewables.
same thing happened in the states. The US government subsidized building panels up to the cost of the instillation and parts. (meaning the whole thing was basically free up to 80k), companies jumped onto it, and started ripping people off (with 80k free, they would charge people 10-20k, pocket the 80k from the government and even have the audacity to charge a continuing bill). These companies stuck 30year warranties on the panels knowing those panels only last about 20-25 years, then once the subsidies ended they closed up shop and walked away with all the cash, no longer needing to honor warranties.
The whole thing was a giant scam, it was even worse with companies like solar city (which is it's own type of scam in and of itself), the companies too dumb to fold tent when the subsidies ended almost all went bankrupt anyway.
@@arizona_anime_fan LOL that's right I remember all that now
This doesn't only hurt the families/private solar investors, it also hurts how foreign investors views Spain as a country to invest in as a whole. Trustworthy governments factors in. The government should also consider that.
Sounds like they didn’t cut off all the subsidies payments… no doubt the politicians friends still receive them out of tax’s
@@Kalus_Saxon the plural of tax is taxes
Whatever. Taxes should not go to pay for private profits.
I got your point but I would add that Spain wouldnt do that to big investors, they do this because they are just regular people with no power at all. This is the reality of our society.
You are so dumb, investors sign contracts that the government has to obey by unlike those suckers that got taken for a ride
Remember always trust your gut feeling and never trust your government.
Exact same thing happened in Belgium. And now they want to tax us for producing our own electricity or injecting our surplus into the network. It's insane.
Do it secretly and connect a battery bank to it aswell
Liberal government at work.
On one of the Channel Islands, if you install your own solar, you are charged by the state to subsidise the fossil fuel electricity on the rest of the island.
@@davidwebb4904 whytho
Same govt-led scam happening here in Australia. And sadly the battery storage technology we have is old, out of date and very expensive to buy (and house insurance will not cover the risk for electrical fire caused by either solar panels or battery storage). Why can’t the rich corporations just steal and scam other rich corporations and leave the majority poor people just trying to earn a living and scrape by alone 😔
I counted about 546 panels. 15 year old tech would make this project about 100kw. 1 million euro is very expensive even 15 years ago. Someone made a profit already. In Spain, maybe you can generate 200Mwh+ per annum with expensive trackers. It sounds like initially, the project was profitable with subsidy of more than 40 cents a kwh. Was the subsidy a fixed amount pre-allocated? And when that fund dried up after many jump onto the bandwagon, everyone got burnt. This reporting left out a lot of details.
I'm American so my info might be incorrect but with the high electricity prices in Europe i keep hearing about, I would figure those families should be doing much better. So this really bizarre to me.
@@Gwenpool2369 yeah, quite bizzare. In France a supply contract is signed with the grid with a multi-year FIT schedule. Why Spain has this issue is strange. If the subsidy can go away, the contract must allow it or the investor can sue. I suspect most of the investors knew this possibility but were betting the government would replenish the fund.
@@kc3366 France has load-following nuclear reactors capable of ballasting the instability of renewables.
@@gregorymalchuk272 that's very true. Just like Dallas has wind farms to round out solar. Eventually, capacitor farms are needed.
@@gregorymalchuk272 the load following of those nuclear plants is very limited, most of the load following in France is done with hydro. That is why there warning signs at many brooks and rivers in France. A peak demand can cause a sudden flood downstream of the hydrodams.
In my country (argentina) we have a history of similar subsidies, but with even less juridical security, so I equipped my solar system with batteries so I can be as independent from the grid and the government as possible, don't trust the government.
Also: 15 years for a return on an investment is SCARY
It is also scary because they producing less and less over time you can end up with a pile of trash before the return even point.
This is the best solution for anyone interested in solar energy for home or business. Governments want to keep you tied to the grid because they are owned by the energy companies. Go off grid and be independent. Don't buy into government pie because it's only for the wealthy. The little people are lucky to get just the crust.
@@anirbanmukherjee7979 wtf
@@Fiercesoulking most manufacterers guarantee that it will produce at least 80% of its original output after 20 years. Practical experience shows that they produce much more than that.
What you are saying is just a story to scare people of.
@Timothy TwoTwoThree Old laptop batteries a là HBpowerwall, a couple of dollars for every pack and a lot of work to dissasemble and measure them
So if everything went according to plan he’d have a 15 year break even? That’s a horrendous return 🤦♂️
“What is history but the story of how politicians have squandered the blood and treasure of the human race?”
― Thomas Sowell
That's why smart people never trust politicians with their money, health, safety, security, and education. They're lawless, soulless opportunists.
@@Bob_Adkins well stated
No truer words......
Humanity is literally some people ruining it
you havnt a clue what this is about and the video only went for 5 mins. You hear the bit about being paid for the installation costs?
Lesson of the day: never trust what the government says
Exactly!!! People just don't learn; history has shown over and over again, citizens cannot trust government!
@@jcm9698 it's not governments so much as it is capitalism. When humans are required to operate within a system that rewards greed, then any collection of humans with a measure of power will always sell the other humans out because of their greed. It doesn't matter if that collection of humans is government or corporations.
he shouldve invested in a savings account... 1 million euros? that alone should've put his son through college and more!. Sounds like he put all his eggs in 1 basket just because it sounds like he was convinced he would see "profit" Not even I would fall for this from my government.
@@y0nd3r didn't you hear the phrase "socialist government"?
Never rely on anything subsidised by the State.
When regulators are not engineers just politicians these happens
Agree. Well meaning but ultimately failed strategy as no regards to basic technology or economics.
@@river2voya211 Yo, but we need more bureaucrats to fight tha globals warmings
Frankly, if you don't have a fundamental understanding of the physics and economics of what you do but trust government instead to do the nearly impossible you deserve to fail. The problem is on both sides.
Still, better than comedian.
Politicians are suppose the be the people’s voice. Unfortunately they are bought by corporations. I’m sure whichever contractor got the bid to do the “free” installations made millions and will do some nice political donations next time around if not already.
There needs to be a legal binding contract before such projects are undertaken.
I'm not sure you understand how laws work. Governments make laws and concomitantly can change laws. Therefore, effectively no contract with a government can be legally binding because a government can always change the law to invalidate any contract which had been subject to their jurisdiction.
That's why I hate the subsidies strategy. I'd rather have a tax break on the solar panels and on the energy sold. The government aid would be instantaneous and equal for everyone, no paperwork, no bs.
as if there's any significant difference between the scam of subsidies or the scam of taxation
just stop with all the fascism already !!
Just remove the fossil fuel subsidies and let the market do it's magic. Solar is the clear winner in most latitudes.
there's no tax.
@@MichielVanKets Just asking, but how did you get "fascism" out of Flavio's comment? This is a genuine request for an explanation.
I'm hoping you'll reply so I can follow your thought process.
Maybe I can learn something from this after you explain it.
I am willing to consider your statement, but I need more to make some sense of it. Again, not trying to judge, just trying to understand you.
@@burnerjack01 just some Yankee libertarian, they think all government is fascism.
"You can't imagine prime minister of your own country bankrupting you"
That's very common.
Europe's renewable energy plans were never assessed under Article 3(2) of the SEA Directive 2001/42/EC
Look at the LNP
At least 10,000 businesses were bankrupt in Canada because of lockdowns.
@@LTV746 what that?
Foreign Intelligence Agencies are responsible.
Please read
Why India should not sign Paris Climate Deal Scribd
Here in India, Desh Drohi **NAQLl** Hindutva Political Parties are investing heavily on Solar Energy and Wind Mills after taking Trillions of US Dollars as Loans from Foreign Banks. This will push India into Debt Slavery.
Moral of the story, never trust governments to deliver on promises.
Especially leftist.
I think you speak for the majority of us across the world!👍👍🇬🇧
especially socialist governments.
Or don't put all your eggs in one basket.
@@133col not even remotely true. Left and right governments are by essentially liars. One side is stuck in social utopia, and the other is in bed with the rich and crook.
62 billion spent on a solar project in the Nevada desert that was just abandon because it didn’t work and needed billions more to attempt to salvage a fraction of the production that was promised. It just not viable for everyone right now.
If these panels were implemented by the big banking institutions, the government would have guaranteed their returns.
Well, that's right, the big banks wouldn't invest in something so uneconomically viable without someone else taking the risk.
@@timhinchcliffe5372 And the banks that actually do uneconomically viable things are the ones that fail and get bought out. The news just doesn't report every failed business
The banks are not losing the loans have collateral on the real estate property. The panels outperform their estimated power production and the politicians cancel the buyback to continue buying gas climate change is only for tge peasants.
Banks lose money all the time, they simply make more. And it's not the banks fault when the government lowers standards when things aren't invested by big corp
Anirban Mukherjee India is definitely the next big super power along with China. Huge potential with young educated people.
Happened in Germany here too.
First with private agro-diesel, then with Wind, then with bio-gas.
All companies went bankrupt, when the state, against all promises, ended the subsidies overnight. Then the banksters came in and bought all the produktion sites for cheap.
If they need subsidies to be self-sustaining, they're not self-sustaining. All a scam. Simple.
Almost like it's all planned out before hand.
@@thatfatman6978
Exactly.
Every country has their system for giving money to the rich.
Here in America, congress pays for "cost overruns" in military and NASA contracts, and then cancels the project.
If a hole solar industrty is based on 40 cents a kwh +, there never was a place for it in reality. Everything you can put in a Eurocontainer will be cheaper in asia...
Bought them for cheap and they still do not offer a solution to carbon which earth is naturally covered in.
Europe want to cut out Russian energy but cannot support their citizens that invests in renewable. What a shame
"You will own nothing and be happy"- written in stone, sir! Written in stone...
It's a problem with wind and solar period. Nuclear is the only way
This behavior has a name: exploitation or some kind of slavery.
@@richardnixon7248 storing energy in hydrogen is solution 😉 but they couldn't sell anymore oil...
@@vukkomsija no it isn't
Korean people invested rural area solar project and lost over 100 millions dollars. The government suppose to back up and private investor keep all the money and they couldn't pay back after the installation. Green project wasn't worked.
“You can’t imagine the Prime Minister bankrupting your country.”. You wanna bet?
That's what Biden and his Socialists are doing to America, Bankrupting us
It's happening in Canada too: our "leaders" has put the country into massive debt through irresponsible over-spending.
Doug, I think he said "bankrupting you" like, you personally, not the country.
@@jackdaniel7465 if you had ever lived in Spain, Venezuela, Portugal, Greece or anywhere in the eastern block of old, you would know what a true socialist is and how far from socialism Biden and democrats are.... Come on, stop over reacting and stop that "everything that happens in the USA is so much more important" attitude....
@@TheAllMightyGodofCod well little fella, Bankrupting the country, and us....How's that???
Never ever put all your money on one horse and don’t trust a government
Solar panels in 2007 is expensive. Yeah,... never trust a government.
The government has money from people but all of that money is used for certain people for their own agenda.
That is the very reason I try MY BEST just like Elon Musk to avoid tax. I hate it. Always and always learn how cash flow in government.
For me, I want to care about my business more than pay any tax. Then, if my business is strong enough. I will use that money to help people myself.
Yes, no one takes my money. No rats using government money. I have full control of it. Awesome.
@@frostsmaker8966 Avoiding taxes is literally how I was able to walk up the "social", aka, the economical ladder to the top 1%. Also, not having debt, just not having debt is already enough to get you in the Top 5%.
The guy tried to partner with a socialist government to make a buck.
Never trust anyone, especially governments, banks and insurance institutions.
banks and insurance would be fine if they weren't so heavily controlled by governments haha. By not doing business with them you could actually harm them. As it stands, government will just bail them out.
@@chrisknorr1326 Governments bail out banks using tax payers money 💰
Intermittents are a pipe dream. What other service do we rely on that only works 30% of the time? They use the grid as a crutch and everyone else picks up the tab.
Never start/ build a business (plan) based on subsidies from Government.I feel so sorry for these people.
Never be an early adopter
Except if you are Elon Musk...
@@luisodriozola79 Musk was a bit smarter than that. He didn't base his business model on perpetual subsidies. He leveraged specific short term subsidies and now his companies no longer require them to be profitiable.
@@wisenber 18 years is not "short term"
@@veduci22 It's also not perpetual.
Putting caps on how many could produce energy for the state would have easily stopped this from being a problem 😔.
Exactly here in the US most places have a 10Kw cap, or you can’t build the system past the highest months billing from the previous 12 month cycle. This is helpful on how to design the system.
the problem is socialist policies subsidizing economically unsustainable stuff with money they don't have... this is socialism in a nutshell, it allways ends in ruin... Solar can only work when the price of the instalation is profitable with no subsidies or price fixing... The solar panels should be dirt cheap and people should stop buying stupidly expensive solar panel products...
@@vineleak7676 only problem is oil & gas companies get massive subsidies already, so it will never be a fair fight across the board regardless
@@vineleak7676 "The solar panels should be dirt cheap" Those can't be cheap if subsidized. When You subsideze something it's price rise. If You want to encourage people to invest in some area You remove obstacles and decrease taxes.
@@i20918 amen
The guy kind of screwed up by going so heavily into it when he knew it was economically unsound because it relied on subsidies. If he did a smaller installation instead of trying to game the system so hard he wouldn’t be so bitter. His own greed got him.
> it relied on subsidies.
Dude the state made a LAW that said, the subsidies would last a couple of DECADES.
There was a time where laws like that where considered holy and stayed untouched.
This turned in about the year 2000. Now they try to hammer you into slave status no matter what.
And the hammering goes on btw. Look at inflation ffs.
The bankster are out to get us.
yeah harsh but i agree.. if he used the subsidy as a means of independence rather than a long term scheming of government funds, he would be in a different position.. and whats more, those funds are really his fellow citizens funds.. got what he deserves to be honest
But it works for nuclear, coal etc
The government promised subsidies and innocent citizens thought the government was trustworthy, or responsible. If you pull the greed card here, then government is what, demon? conmen?
The most fundamental basic of investing is to always diversify to lower your risks.
This is tragic but not unexpected. Things like new energy sources, rebates, civilian involvement, promises based on today's data without regard for the future - a bad outcome is expected in situations like these, particularly in the infant stages of a new technology. It's like trying to jump on a speeding train - the technology is rapidly changing, government finances are changing and the internal situation (unforeseen volume) is changing. Trying to pick one specific target in such a mix is near impossible.
NEVER belive in government promises!
And, mortgaging your home to invest in a business is a bad idea!!!
Why would anyone risk family's fortune on a business that rely on government subsidies.15 years just to get even on the investment? You've got to be insane. Solar isn't the problem. It's poor business planning and risk management.
Unfortunately, that won't stop the uninformed from blaming renewable energy itself.
yes, and besides that , how did he spend 1mil eur for 500 panels and a 200kva inverter block ...wtf
@@DEAR7340 It's not about renewable energy, there are many other things that matter, like energy output and cost of setup. Most current renewable energy options fail at that, and that's why coal and oil will still dominate
@@unlockwithjsr in india solar energy is cost effective because we produce our own pannel and rest of demand filled by chinese
@@rcmnet if i needed to spend 1 mil eur, then i have to at least another 1 mil eur stable saving (extra real estate)
I considered buying property in spain in the early 2000s but thought the government was far too corrupt to risk my limited funds.
smart choice
Any documentation behind your claim?
Or simply incapable of integrating with a modern society ...
You saved yourself from the property bubble bursting in 2008. That said, I moved to Spain in 2016 and bought me a cheap little home in the outskirts of Madrid. Couldn't be happier
@@OmmerSyssel yeah, lots
@@OmmerSyssel Your comment is banal.
15 years ROI sounds like a terrible investment. They are dozens of markets offering 12% per annum in safe vehicles.
Trusting government... when will people learn?
Never.
@@beekeeper8474 Exactly. They will never learn.
These guys were counting on subsidiaries for ever. Without counting that these are limited in time, and that electricity got cheaper. Still it gives them a 7% return on investment. Do not always listen the people saying they are ruined, they are just greedy.
Why would any sensible person invest in a project with 15 year payback?
Because they care about the environment? Not everything is about money. This isn't the US.
Normally long payback periods is understood to be more stable and less risky
This is nothing more but the government of Spain tricking ordinary people into investing.
It's now 4-5 years in Turkey. According to your logic no one should buy rental properties tho because its payback time is way over 15y. Warren Buffet says if its below 20y take the deal. If you are growth investor it might sound like a lot tho.
@@toyotaprius79 indeed in general if we expect the CAPM (capital asset pricing model) logic to hold. But in practice, I’ve rarely seen an investment proposal been welcomed if payback was long no matter the NPV or ROI, at least in the places I’ve worked, including in Spain. If the payback period is a significant faction of your remaining expected lifespan, as an investment, I would be skeptical. Still, as David Gutierrez and Armen Markossyan say, if there was a government “guarantee” one might have been tricked.
1:08 "Can you lean on the panels to show your grief?", "Yeah, like that, perfect!" 😀
oh, you're so cynic 🤪Jokes aside, the man and his family truly are screwed up by bad government decisions. I feel for him 😥
I think he also washes his solar panels using his tears.
he invested 1 million $ in a business rather than his son's education. I would rather trust my son 104% than the gov these days...
Anyone can be bankrupt on a project if the lender/government rips up the contract and your forced to sell all your goods at a higher price and while expanding the loan payments
The govt chokes oil resources to raise prices, then promotes fantasy. I say for clean energy we run the world on unicorn piss.
@@williamkennedy3837 The Arabs control oil prices ,it gives them a nice lifestyle and lots of power . They thank you .
@David A. Foolish to invest so much money without a Contract
if a normal person does this that's called fraud. this is why you dont vote for socialists
The feed in tariff in Spain was much too high, it was at the same level as in Germany, although in Spain there is much more sunlight so you can produce the power much cheaper. There was also no lid on the installations, so subsidies quickly got out of hand.
The UK government made the same mistake. France 24 is being dishonest, though, as it sounds like the investors got their million Euros back. I suspect the scheme was intended for people to put a few solar panels on their roof, and these guys got greedy. I don't know, but that would make more sense to my mind. What is it with the media these days? They can't be straight about anything.
In Spain, installations done in 2007 received €65 cents per kWh since 2007 to 2013. Since 2013 they are receiving €45 cents until 2038. Total 30 years. An investment of 1€ returns 3.2€ in 30 years
@@robinmorritt7493 I am spanish and I can say that you are right. These facilities get paid €65 cents per kWh from 2007 to 2013. Now, they get paid €45 cents until 2038. Total 30 years. An investment of 1€ returns 3.2€ in 30 years with a 7.4% annual returns. They want to be rich with subsidies.
@@elmurrial685 Great information. Thanks. 👍
@@elmurrial685 exactly, in Germany a field installation build in 2007 received 38€ct/kWh for a period of 20 years. This was already enough to be profitable despite the lower solar radiation in Germany.
Edit: By the way, such field installations that are built now only get 4.5€ct /kWh if they are smaller than 100 kWp. Larger systems don't get a fixed price anymore and have to sell their power themselves.
"You can't imagine the Prime Minister of your country bankrupting you."
That is a failure of imagination.
That's the most delusional thinking process I've ever seen.
Hahahahah 🤣🤣🤣
That's mostly what I imagine them doing
I would imagine that is the only thing they want to do
from here we can learn one thing..... BOOTSTRAPPING strategy is more SAVE than we loan money from BANK or any investor.....
despite bootstrapping strategy is not easy as well
What a surprise! Government promised the world, and then abandoned the people 3/4 of the way through the project!? Who ever could have seen that coming???
Oh well. A socialist government seeks to own everything by definition. They'll get it one way or another. This gentleman's home, property, and the contained solar panels are now property of the state, I imagine. Just as they think it should be.
This is really sad, but it also highlights one of the big factors to consider when making an investment: Never invest more than you can afford to lose. That said, the government here is absolutely in the wrong. they made a bad call, failed to stick with it, and made their citizens pay the price.
And never depend on subsidies.
Investing with the government is supposed to be as risk-free as it gets.
@@triplebeans4159 Only if you believe politicians. There's a reason the word politician is synonymous with the word lair.
@@alterego157 I don't trust politicians but you should be able to trust the government.I trust he made a deal with the government and not some politicians.
@@triplebeans4159 I fail to see how you can trust a govt that’s run by people you said you can’t trust
This same thing happened in America a couple of years back with the Federally owned Tennessee Valley Authority (TVA). People installed solar on their farms and residence with the promise of 9 cents per KwH, but TVA later changed this to 2 cents and they dropped their contracts with their customers.
Greedy people get what they deserve.
I'd Sue the TVA for breach of contract and take my money.
@@rightsdontcomewithpermits7073 More like people's credulity was exploited
Happened in Ontario too,
@@BillyBob-fd5ht this should give us all a lesson on trusting our government huh.
Then why gov is not using extra energy for factory uses
Government didn't keep promises. Imagine that. First mistake was trusting the government. What a harsh lesson to have to learn. Second mistake was investing your whole life savings into something that takes so long to pay back. A lot of things can and will happen within 15 years.
I sure hope these people are able to recover.
Bingo
The problem with Europeans is they are too trusting of their government
Exactly what is a government? Politicians. And you should never trust a politician.
You are wise.
Right! Also, this program was designed for families to slap a few solar panels on their roof and get rewarded. This guy made a whole power plant…
if it needed a subsidy, it wasn't worth investing in to begin with, because it was not profitable enough on it's own.
Subsidies are useful for some things - like if they subsidized the purchase price of the panels, which would have been a fixed amount, and when the subsidy went away, there would not be any people screwed. You can use subsidies to jump start a market, but you do not want to use subsidies to create and sustain a market from nothing. Looking at you, ethanol.
Do you have any idea how much is spent on subsidies for the oil and gas industry? Look it up.
Oil and gas industries has massive subsidies, same with a lot of manufacturing and farming. Main reasons for subsidies are to prop up and ensure sufficient supplies and industry deemed essential for the country. In the above 3 it is energy supplies, certain manufacturing capabilities and food security. There's plenty of others like healthcare, education and arts as well.
By definition government runs at a loss instead of profit, they are to spend money collected by tax and other funding to take care of the country, not make a profit. It's the big difference between government and businesses.
I agree ethanol was a complete failure, but I seem to remember Corn Farmers in the US being subsidised years ago. Can you tell me one benefit, other than Obesity, High Fructose Corn Syrup has given the Human Race?
@@jocelynweatherbe222 keenly aware. I am generally against long term subsidies. I don't care what they are used for.
@@tsubadaikhan6332 blaming a particular thing people freely consume for the effect it has is not a valid argument. I am fine with obesity. If you want to be fat, healthy, etc.... personal choice.
That being said, it is cheaper, easier to make, and more or less on par with granulated sugar. The issue isn't with high fructose corn syrup, the issue is with the amount people choose to consume.
My father in law invested heavily in renewables. I told him it wasn't a good idea because their revenue depended on subsidies from the government, hence they had no working business model.
He insisted the subsidies insured the benefits and that this was bulletproof.
I mentioned the possibility of a change in government and a scrapping of these subsidies.
He insisted that this would never happen.
Zapatero lost the election. The rest is history and my father in law was ruined. Decades of hard work down the drain.
your father in law deserved the loss well
That's his fault. Some people are so Stubborn, if they refuse logical don't suffer with them. I've had to deal with so many people who will refuse logic because they have an inferiority complex don't waste your time helping when they come crying you were right.
@@spacecowboy07723 but never say no to give a helping hand, and as you say if they later come crying is their fault for not listening.
Obviously he did it wrong I’ve already invested $2500 in Solar it has not done me wrong I made my money back within the first six months I have a grow operation that it runs best investment I’ve made yet if I pull in too much kilowatts I can sell it off
@@BillionDollarMUTT666 watch the video, the government screwed him. Nothing to do with his setup
If solar is a good investment, why does it require so many government subsidies?
It is sad indeed. Similar in Czech Republic where we had one of the biggest solar scams of all time. Where huge subsidies were provided only to privileged people with political connections.
Welp the opposite happened there. Now Solar PV is a profitable electricity output and those people with Political Connections are now enjoying the profits. That is just another of case of Insider Trading get access to valuable business early.
Nonsense and lies. I was working in the Czech Republic (2006-2010) for a company that was installing it on ordinary family houses. Back then, even the most ordinary person could get a subsidy without any problems. Unlike the Spanish state, the Czech state did not break its word and all the time even the most ordinary people got enough money from their solar installations.
The problem was you had to do the installation until some deadline date 31.1.2010 I think regardless of capacity that is being criticized some people installed large capacities ensuring they will get fairy tale income regardless of actual benefit for the network that is now part of your average electricity bill I think 20%?
Same in Bulgaria!
Such subsidies should not be taken away. The agreement should be signed for whole 15 years. People should never trust government again.
who said to trust anything the government says? it is known to not trust government. last 3 years should be more than enough to show you.
Indeed 👏👏💯
Some people will always trust their governement no matter what, look at the vaccines and all the withheld information regarding it, that is slowly coming out next months...
The sight of them wearing muzzles tells me they have still much to learn..
First place, there should be no subsidies at all. Why to subsidize inefficient way of energy production, hence greater amount of pollution?
Courts require that all valid contracts be honored; unless one party is the government.
This is insane. Knowing it would be a David vs Goliath, can't you sue your government for cases like this?
@@tubal1
No cause it's a subsidy and given a verbal promise
If it was a written contract then you could take them to court
And then after 15-20 years the panels reach their use by date
The 9 most scary words In the English language
“I’m from the government, and I’m here to help. “
Also scary "I am a corporation, and I'm here to help"
@@death2colonialism “I’m Jeff bezos, I’m here to help”
Even shorter in six words : "Trust me, I'm from the government."
@@ronnelacido1711 doesn’t work as a one liner with though
@@death2colonialism corporations make cheap useful things tho?
And people wonder why companies worry about investing in countries with governments like this one. They fail to understand that the long term damage to Spain cannot be ignored.
Excactly, the entire business world is now doomed for ever!!
How about the gigantic Leeman scam, ruining millions of ordinary USAmericans life and future?
They don’t care about emissions they cancel the renewable energy to purchase more gas.
no matter what happened, or will happen they will keep voting in a socialist party and expect a different outcome.
"And people wonder why companies worry about investing in countries with governments like this one. "
Perhaps companies should invest in projects that don't require government subsidies to be profitable?
Oil, gas, pharma, defense contractors…are all heavily subsidized in the US. It’s fine as long as the government is in bed with you. This same thing is now happening in Florida, where previous promises for solar buybacks and purchase tax credits are being reneged upon in order to kill or hamper the industry…because the state gov would rather stay in bed with fossil fuels.
So too much success was the problem. Here in Belgium almost the same happened. Some companies lay whole roofs full of solar panels, which got subsidized and in the end poor people without solar panels got to pay for them and for their higher electricity bill. There should be ways to limit subsidizing for small projects only??
They've done the same in the UK. The people with enough money to afford the subsidized cost of photovoltaic installations got cheap electricity, while the government funded the subsidies by raising the cost to everyone who didn't have, couldn't afford, the solar panels. Socialists, it's what they do.
what about no subsidies = fascist corruption at all
why do you westerners always seek to abuse others?
ow, wait, I know ... because you're a bunch of frustrated losers
@@greggv8 you mean the tories are Socialist lol
@@greggv8 umm this happens under all forms of government and at every level of business. It's called "people", and they often are making promises they can't keep and/or administrations that change an so too the plans and promises.
And I am sure this is solvable, but bigger interest with money want different outcomes. If you throw a bone to the little dog, the big dog surely will delight in yet another treat.
@@danielvilliers612 Yes they are , that's why conservatives the world over are pissed off. So called Conservative parties aren't conservative anymore.
Los paneles solares están mal puestos hacen falta un angulo donde se levanta y baja el sol ademas nesecitan batterias para acumular la energia sobrante.
That's BS... A contract is a contract. You have it in writing and made financial decisions based on that contract. You guys should sue the government. The government needs to honor their decision, even if it means selling it at a loss to neighbouring countries. Government would have been well aware of how many citizens signed up for it in advance based on the number of applications, so using the "9 times greater than expected" is a load of BS because they would have known how many there were prior to signing contracts with each individual. They simply could have capped it off and told any newcommers that they were too late and quota was already filled...
These installations get paid €65 cents per kWh from 2007 to 2013. Now, they get paid €45 cents until 2038. Total 30 years. An investment of 1€ returns 3.2€ in 30 years with a 7.4% annual returns.
This is Spain bro, those thing do not happen here, we are ruled by communist.
Who in their right mind paid a million euros for an approximately 130 kWp solar farm??? Corrently it costs 10% of that (without the tracking system). I understand they were promised subsidies and now they are not getting it, but it was bad investment from day 1, never viable.
If you made the calculation in 2007 with electricity price of 40c/kWh for 15 years, it made sense with a capacity factor a bit over 20%
130kW * 0,4 (price of electricity) * 0,2 (capacity factor) * 24 hours * 365 days = 1366560
@@rkan2 24 hours ? no electricity at night. But a solid 12/13, bit more on summertime.
@ The capacity factor is given for 24hrs, if it was shining 24/7, it would be double of course.
The same is happening here in Oz..we used to get paid 60cents per kwhr we put back into the grid..then it went down and down..now the energy regulator is suggesting we pay 2.5 cents per kwhr to put back into the grid.
60ct per kWh? That is insane! They say nuclear is expensive, but this is worse!
Its your own fault, if you think you can just place the inconsistent energy production and get money all year round. You have to pay for storage of energy as well, and not only for day/night cycles but for summer winter as well. If you add that cost before you invest you will see you will lose a lot money without government support. Assuming you have the same goverment polecy for 15 years in a quickly moving technologie sector is your own fault.
In UK i pay 15 cents per Kw/h
And they buy at 3 cent per Kw/h
And the government made it so that the existing companies had monopoly to decide the selling point.
In this crisis, I buy at 45 cents per Kw/h but I still have to sell at 3 cent per Kw/h.
Don’t trust the government. Ever. The end
Last week electricity cost 800€ MWh at peak hour (15;00). But, also the maximum production rate of solar panel installations.
Surprisingly the utility pays the customer 80€ per MWh of solar energy .... that difference generates some money for the utility.
In the meantime in Portugal " Portugal builds Europe's largest floating solar park " .....
What could go wrong!
Just shows how far you can trust governments.
Haha. You mean „people“, right? Or do you mean that there are only honest people on this earth, no scam, no crime , no selfish act ever committed ? Or is it rather that quite a lot of people are greedy or get greedy when they have access to a lot of funds, and government is just one of those places?
what am I missing,The government paid them back for the installation ? so they are just missing out on the profit. looks to me some just screwed up by doing LOC and ROI wrong.
Government said they would buy back excess power produced by solar panels and then they told everyone sike!
@@Wigwhom86 beeing an investor and only calculating ROI without riscs leads to nowhere. If you are an investor, risc - management is a must.
Excessive subsidies WILL be trimmed down, that is an 100% risk.
There was no grid storage to place and stabilize all that energy. This was doomed from the beginning.
Now governments have to come up with incentives for storage facilities.
Hydro plants are perfect storage facilities. Also I believe night consumption should be forced down as much as possible. Otherwise solar will never be viable.
The problem now is that any recompense will be too little too late.
"I am from the government and here to help." Thats when you turn and run as fast as you can. Do not look back.
tell that to all the US corn farmers who keep getting bailed out.
and they still want more
at our expense.
I find this hard to understand. He goes bankrupt for installing solar panels and delivering energy, yet the electricity prices in Europe has skyrocketed since fall 2021.
I said many times and say it again. Renewable energy only works in decentralized system which means it works well if you use it for personal consumption.
What? That doesn't make sense
@@silimarina. Yes it does.. Just THINK A LITTLE...
@@peteparadis1619 All those big solar and wind farms from around the world they all work just fine.
That's what I was thinking when I read this
@@silimarina. Such solar parks are not individual owned.
Makes you wonder why European Union allowed such thing when they could connect to a network and export energy to other countries .
Solar energy is almost worthless to export since in the area of economic electricity transmission the weather is almost always the same. This April day ahead was sometimes at -55€/MWh duringsunshine hours.
Solar is great as a DIY project with battery storage but it is a huge burden if it is used on a grid scale. Adding more and more MWp just cannibalizes the inflexible electricity market and making everything more expensive. Nuclear is the way to go.
They did a similar thing in Germany when initially subsidizing solar. It worked so well that they ended up backing out of the promises. A quickly grown industry with 40.000+ jobs was bankrupted due to poor planning and big companies lobbying to slow down the transition. The new-grown industry was quickly nlost to china, while coal keeps being subsedized. It's sad.
Well to be fair, and ignoring subsidies vs tax incentives etc, coal can provide power 24/7, solar not so much.
That's what happens when you let criminal coal energy companies brib...I mean "lobby" for certain policies.
@@tobyglyn Yea, it can do that. But it has the single largest environmental impact, reducing the lifespan thousands due to the heavy metal spewn into air and water, displacing hundreds as their villages are turned into giant pits and having the most disproportionate CO2 impact as well. Brown coal is just evil.
@@tobyglyn Don't tell the trees the sun doesn't shine at night, they will refuse to grow then.
No, actually the Germans never went back on already installed capacity. They only slowed down the build out of new subsidized capacity - that's a totally different ballgame.
Hard to imagine GOVERNMENT could screw up a marketplace.
Except always and forever.
The angle of those panels make no sense at all,
here in the UK, latitude 53° north, they are ideal on most average pitch rooves: in Spain they should be much nearer the horizontal for best efficiency.
Lmao these solar panels are probably not connected to the grid since government doesn't pay them :D
It's should be around 34° tho you are right
I am pretty sure the move, they must be in their "rest" position.
If you pause the video at 0.01, you can see the length of the shadows, and the angles of the shadows, this clearly shows that the panels are correctly aligned with the sun.
I don't think those panels are functioning
I am lucky.
In Malaysia, we are at 3rd stage called NEM 3.
I paid for 10kwh for my house installation with rebate and sling extra grid in exchange of power consumption. I managed to reduce my bill for 95% and it is over a year now. My ROI is 4.5 years and I have 3.5 years to go. Warranty is 5 years for invertor and panel for 25 years. NEM 3 last for 10 years. By tje end of 5 years, I can save more and reversly I am earning or rather enjoying a free electricity for a cosy house electricity and air con. Though Malaysia gov does not has good reputation due to corruption but for Solar Panel, yes, we are lucky.
This isn't a story about the viability of renewable energy but mismanagement and corruption of government and big business at the expense of consumers, yet again.
Sorry bud the viability just isn't there yet, otherwise the government would have built this stuff themselves and not used it as an opportunity to enrich their patrons and themselves at the expense of their constituents and countrymen. Large scale "renewable energy" is currently cost prohibitive and ironically quite damaging to the environment and wildlife in ways people had not conceived of or prepared for and is likely to remain so for the foreseeable future, except for nuclear power but for some reason I don't think it's considered a "renewable energy" source. I would love to be able to just by myself some solar panels or a cold fusion reactor or whatever thing tesla used to pull free electricity out of the atmosphere to provide power to my home without having to deal with or pay the government's utility monopoly, but it's just not feasible yet and deluding ourselves about the inadequacy of commercial wind, solar etc power options currently on the market does nothing to increase their efficiency or practicality vs nuclear, coal or oil based electricity generation methods.
It is a scam mate, the scam is knowing that the renewables wont replace the fossil fuel, yet still pushing them in... This is the scam.
It sounds like the government didn't setup limits on the subsidies to ensure this didn't happen.
Subsidies were needed to jump start a new power source, it made a huge impact on the total cost.
subsidies = corruption = never needed, you fascist
@@MichielVanKets imbecile, you are OK with the trilions of subsidies that go to fossil fuels every year.
@@danielvilliers612 Do you want to back that up with facts or just feelings?
@@gjreels824 Have you just tried a Google search. I did and found the articles explaining it.
This story reminds me of the old saying: "If it sounds too good to be true, it usually is."
Did Xiden say that? /S
@@malekodesouza7255 No. Richard Carlson.
Despite this Sanchez and company will push an image of being such environmentalists!
Both PSOE and PP supported the privitization of the electric industry in Spain. They are all to blame.
and so do you ...
Lesson learned, never ever trust your government..
Investing based on subsidies is just insane.
There is two types of Solar panels, one generates Electricity the other heats water because of Pipes in a coil. I have both hot water via solar pipes and electricty enough to charge night lights.
This seems really strange. With the high energy prices we have today, the solar panels should be profitable even without subsidies. Especially in Spain with so much sun light.
the issue is that solar energy is not controllable, so when it produce you have too many energy on your grid because too much solar panel (and so you have to find a way to consume this overpower, which may be costly) and when it doesn't produce you need an other source of electricity. This is the issue with solar and wind. Until you don't have storage, solar and wind can't be really useful, and so aren't profitable...
One of the issues here is that the previous government created a tax for solar farms to use the grid if they want to sell their production. This was clearly designed to harm small investors and favor the large corporations that have very strong ties with the two largest political parties in Spain. Keep in mind that many former presidents and ministers were later hired by those corporations to basically do nothing. The level of cronyism in Spain is very high for Western European standards.
They, the windmills and the idea of running out of fossil fuels is all bs and they want to use nuclear which trounce all these things on every metric, but lots of money to be made with what people currently think
@@maxime7380 Isn’t there currently a way to store excess solar energy for future use?
@@maxime7380 fake...
in Germany, the system works. Feed in tarifs were adaptive as capacity was building.
Solar energy needs to be economically sustainable WITHOUT subsidy today. The equipment should not be expensive and must be reliable for long term running.
That's the problem in EU, the bad habit of pushing policies with subsidies. Politicians are very open to apply it to policies that in some cases are either ideological and/or based on cherry picked facts. None of the succesive technological improvements required subsidies: it was inventive, iterational improvement and entrepeneurship and the proposal of alternatives that did the job better and cheaper what convinced clients to switch from one technology to the other. To keep it short: the transition from animal traction (mainly horses) to steam was clearly evident in the XIX Century when it outperformed the former; to be in turn succeeded by the petrol engines (Otto/Diesel) who also overcame some of the limitations of steam to reign on land, sea and air until nowadays.
Even lefty California is getting set to eliminate net metering to force home solar to be paid back at generator wholesale rate instead of full retail..
as if you can simply command those thing ... do you even own an economics book?
As if fossil fuels are? $800 billion in subsidies annually for fossils to kill us!
it's not. there's production costs. without subsidies there would be no solar. also, other forms of energy even oil have large subsidies. USA for example pays billions to the energy sector.
So the problem is that they are making too much power and this is excess power they don’t want ?
In India we are being pushed to the same avenue. Tall talks from the Govt with lucrative incentives but without much substance to rely on.
Technology has advanced by 15 years fr when the panels in this video were installed. In my state,there are plenty of consumers who installed solar panels who actually produce a surplus and the electricity board buys the excess off of them. It's an investment sure to turn profitable in a few years.
@@footballinshorts2711 exactly, in a 2020 study showed that solar is the cheapest form of electric production in human history. This is government policies that did not follow through and the irony is that these people main competitors are same solar farms that installed gigawatt at much more competitive cost and production.
@@danielvilliers612 okay we all get what you're trying to say and you're absolutely correct, there's no need to repeat it for a million times.
@@footballinshorts2711
@@SeattlePioneer No I literally know people who invested a few years ago and are making a surplus now
Basis your entire future on government subsidies?
...I feel sorry for this guy, but he should have predicted that this could happen, especially over 15 years
he thought he found a way to win, but the house always wins (the house being the government)
Subsidy dependents...
He says it so emotionally, as he was not expecting that in 15 years there would be flying cars…. Oh wait, there are still no flying cars, damn it
rely on gov subsidy as a business model. that is what you get.
How do you re-balance the power grid after solar energy destabilizes it?
"You can't imagine the Prime Minister of your country bankrupting you."
Canadian protesters say hi.
This has nothing to do with own sustainability. That's an investment.
“You can’t imagine the prime minister bankrupting you!” That’s where you wrong kiddo… 🤣🤣
The panels still gendrate energy if i understood it correctly, problem is redirecting it to demanded areas.
The most terrifying words in the English language are: I'm from the government and I'm here to help.
No to Sun tax
Wind tax
Oxygen tax
Water tax
He spent 1-million Euros. . .with the hopes that this would pay enough to pay for his son to study abroad.
It costs a lot less that 1-million euros to educated outside the country.
That's the beginning of where this story doesn't make sense.
If you were born in 1980, then you're my age. You should be able to analyze information in a deeper manner by now. Instead, you imply bad faith on the part of people who are victims? ew
Why don't they sue their Govt
All investments have risks and rewards. Although I feel sorry for this guy and I understand why he’s angry that government subsidies that were promised have disappeared, he rashly put his money - apparently all his money - into one basket. He’s not the first person to lose everything in an investment and he won’t be the last. I hope that the next generation understands risk management.
This guy had it coming. It was a Ponzi Scheme. For them to give him a subsidy, another energy producer (gas, coal, oil) had to pay a higher tarrif.
People think everything that government creates are somehow immune to losses; taxpayers will ultimately bail government out.
In a private world, counter party can walk just away with your investment hence transactions have many clauses to mitigate or at least clarify all the risks involved.
Under those cases you can only blame your own stupidity for getting into transactions that ultimately have heavy losses. Prudent risk management is essential.
he had a contract to sell power at a given rate for a specific number of years. (or what you call subsidies) The government (the buyer) simply changed the contract to suit them. Perhaps the lesson in risk management: don't trust the government past the next election cycle.
@@mrl22222 And another crucial element of risk management: Don’t put all your eggs in one basket.
@@richardcoughlin8931 Put eggs in one basket only if you have guts,skills,,knowledge and administration/management skills,dedication,hardwork,ready to sacrifice personal relaxation for the growth.
I know many many people who make millions and millions of dollars in just few years because of their skills.
*I don't know all that went down and caused this unfortunate situation for this man but I know that time was part of it.*
*€1 million for those few solar show that the price was still extremely very high when he invested in the business. Now same price could've gotten him more.*
*I believe this is something that for now should be left to big investors that can absorb loses. Cost wise it is not get ripe for small investors.*
1 megawatt solar park can now be built in Lithuania for about 700,000 euros
@@baltictherm But probably its way less profitable in Lithuania
@@baltictherm And in 20 years time it will cost 50k to build? the problem is we don't know, and this is why the subsidies existed becuase without them, normal people cant invest in solar, as the price falls unpredictably.
Yet the cost of enegy goes ever up! Someone is making billions.
Should have gone nuclear, wind and solar are laughable.
YES!!
salt water thorium reactors
@@MichielVanKets WTF is a salt water thorium reactor? I really don't think you want water anywhere near a liquified thorium SALT reactor
@@mal6232 it still produces nothing but heat, so ... water + heat = steam ...
it's just a very big steam turbine ...
I recently added solar panels to my house. I think the real problem with solar is the current lack of low-cost energy storage and/or long distance energy transport. I will get battery storage soon. This is the only way to realize most of the benefits of solar energy.
Just set up a solar plant 70 percentage against your energy consumption
This is the Achilles heel of wind and solar. On an industrial scale, its usefulness is limited by access to hydro-electric for energy storage.