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PATCsawyer
Добавлен 24 сен 2008
After the Storm: Border Route Trail/BWCA Tornado
Trail crew using axes and crosscut saws to clear storm damage. Traditional tool use in Wilderness. Clearwater Lake. Boundary Waters Canoe Area
Просмотров: 408
Видео
Axe Practice with Kelly Dandenong in Hardwood
Просмотров 8453 года назад
Axe practice with a decently hard hitting axe (and Christmas present from my daughter in NZ). The loose log absorbs some of the swing, so I'm not getting full penetration, but then hey, I'm an old guy and happy to just not chop my foot off! Catch my breath and chop another V, working my way down the log.........
Axe Practice with Double Bit
Просмотров 1503 года назад
Some hybrid chopping on a very dead, dry, oak. Standing 45° to the log, chopping straight down.
Rootball Stand Up With Tuatahi Axe
Просмотров 1,2 тыс.7 лет назад
Release cut on a top loaded blowdown.
Logout on Nicholson Hollow Trail
Просмотров 8618 лет назад
Finish cut on deadfall using Simonds #13 crosscut saw. Trail is in Wilderness area where chainsaws are not allowed.
Hammer setting a crosscut saw
Просмотров 3,7 тыс.9 лет назад
Use of a home-made hand anvil to vertically strike and set a crosscut saw tooth.
Crosscut Saw Sheath for Trail Work
Просмотров 2,3 тыс.9 лет назад
How to make a crosscut saw sheath from vinyl lattice material.
Logout on Jones Mountain Trail
Просмотров 1,1 тыс.9 лет назад
Location of blowdown tree on mountain trail by the Potomac Appalachian Trail Club's GPS Rangers, and its removal by a trail crew using a Crosscut saw and a Maasdam rope puller.
Single underbuck with axe
Просмотров 2,6 тыс.13 лет назад
Sticking an axe in a top bound log and undercutting it using an axe to support the crosscut saw
How I Repair and Maintain a TU-17 Griphoist (Tirfor)
Просмотров 15 тыс.13 лет назад
TU-17 Griphoist, Tirfor disassemble and reassemble, tool maintenance, repair, lubricate, parts diagram, troubleshooting. Step-by step
How I Sharpen a Crosscut Saw
Просмотров 107 тыс.14 лет назад
Step-by-step procedure for filing a one-person crosscut saw.
I just purchased a 3' one man saw with the 2 teeth one raker. I have someone who has Morin models 6-c & 1900 that I can purchase. Will either one of these fit my saw? 2 teeth raker 2 teeth length is 2 1/2" and center of raker is 1 5/16". Thanks
Wow, 15 years on and I'm still getting comments on this video....... The Morin 6-C is what I used in the video as a pin gauge and should fit your saw. You may need to give the shoe screws a good overnight soak with WD-40 before you try to remove them and flip the shoes around. I don't have any of the earlier Morin gauges for comparison but from pics, they don't seem to have removable shoes. I finish my rakers with an Anderson #2 gauge.
@@PATCsawyer Pat so can I use the opposite side of the pin gauge of the Morin 6-C to file down the raker flat and then start shaping? Will that side fit my saw? Thanks for you help!!!!
Do you know any tricks to recompress the springs for the jaws if they were removed without being pinned (released)?
Not easy, and I'm sure Tirfor has a special tool for this. If you're careful, cut a short length of 1/4" steel pipe and slot it on both sides with a hacksaw then widen the slot. Place the butterfly washer between the pipe and spring, align the slots with the pin hole and compress the spring over the shaft with a squeeze clamp until the butterfly washer is past the pin hole. Insert nail and de-tension the clamp. Wear safety glasses because this may take a few tries and you don't want that spring launching back at you.
I've been lurking on the crosscut saw forum and saw you mention how you use that handheld dial gauge rather than a traditional four leg spider. Are there any drawbacks? I like the idea of eliminating the guess work as well as not having to keep track of multiple spiders set to different tolerances, but I don't have any first hand filing experience to base my opinion on. That said, I'm planning on taking the USFS filing class over in Missoula next year so I'm trying to workout what should be in my toolbox
This is an old video from back when I was trying different techniques. Today I set most big saw teeth on a 50lb. bench anvil made from a forklift tine. Is this the forum you mean: facebook.com/groups/Sawfilers I post a lot on that one and there are many other saw filers who answer questions and talk techniques. Watch my saw filing video and look at how I compare dial gauges with spiders. The dial gauges work best on flat saws where the teeth have been hammer set, since the tooth bend happens farther up the cutter. Saws that are dished or teeth that were wrested will throw a dial gauge set way off, as the gauges feet are not on a flat surface. Spider feet sit well below the tooth, and while slower, can be more accurate in some uses. Regarding your tool box, don't buy ANY tools from the Crosscut Saw Company. Quality is WAY inferior. Start surfing eBay for gauges and other gear. My personal gear bag has an Atkins #4 hammer, Anderson raker gauge, Atkins #15 pin gauge, home-made dial raker gauge, dial set gauge, and several spiders.
great demo, Thanks
That is a good video .
Nice work mate, cool vid👍👍🪓
i'm a forest service trail volunteer on 4th season. i was allowed to bring home some crosscut saws left outside a shed for years, I've cleaned and filed two of the three i brought home. i worked last week on our historic lassen trail a mix of pine and oak and was surprised at how well it cut oak. in watching your video for the 4th or 5th time it occured to me its a champion tooth (3 ft.). i was checking on a contracted crew two months ago sporting a Dolly Chapman filed saw, immediately fell in love and started an obsession. thanks for your videos
You're welcome. The saw in the video was a little Disston, good saw but not my favorite. The Atkins 390 on my YT cover photo is my go-to saw for single bucking. Dolly is indeed a National Treasure for her expertise and knowledge of traditional tools.
@@PATCsawyer tried to register on the crosscutsawyer forum days ago, to chime in and possibly get some answers to questions i have. has the site gone idle
@@billhackley3540 FB has a good page for saw filing: facebook.com/groups/Sawfilers
I've been posting on that site since 2016. Lots of good saw discussion.
Thank you so much for your hard work.
The storm damage was pretty gnarly when I was there. This was after your efforts though. Thanks so much for doing this!
We left anything that could be walked under and concentrated on trees actually blocking the trail. Those leaners were bound to come down over time. It's a remote area and the trail crews don't have easy access.
Genius work
Hey Dan, don't know if you remember me but I participated in a Griphoist class you taught in the Shenandoah many years ago. I'm still the Riprap Trail overseer, it'll be 20 years in the Fall. That's some nice sawing y'all are doing! I've been up to the BWCA with 3 friends and spent a week canoeing over by Ely. Beautiful area, saw eagle's, the Aurora Borealis and listened to the loons at night, caught some tiger muskie. Watch out for wild dogs.... I had one come out of nowhere and bit me on my left leg. Be safe. Thanks for the hard work to get that trail open.
Glad to hear you're still in the game. Most of that logout was weather perfect, plenty of sunshine except for the last day's sleet storm, and no mosquitos! Didn't encounter any dogs, but heard wolves howling at night.
Nice work! More video next time! With a week of work you ought to be able to get a couple of hours of interesting content! I like the use of the axe in lieu of an underbucker and using a lighter felling saw. I'm a fan of axing out trees on the ground rather than risking my 100 year old crosscut saw. Never been out to that neck of the woods...ever need a B crosscut sawyer for a week hit me up!
I wish! It was iPhone photos and video the whole way. I tried to convince a reporter that it would make a great story (and to bring along a photographer), but we were too far from civilization for that to get any traction. The one thing I wish I had captured was the sound of those tensioned trees exploding like rifle shots when we cut into them. Saw was a Simonds 325.
Great work! Sure is quicker with a chainsaw but just so much more satisfying listening to the sounds of a well working crosscut saw.
Yes, you hear every snap, crackle, and pop of the fibers as your saw sings through the log.
Good work as always 👍
Thanks to you and your team for clearing those trails! I'm an avid hiker in Virginia and have only had the chance to use a crosscut saw once, during a Forest Service training in Wise County. I have more experience with an axe, though not often enough to be as effective as y'all were with those larger diameter fallen trees.
The Southern Appalachian Wilderness Stewards are very active in Virginia. Their crosscut crews are out regularly much of the year and are always looking for help. Join them and make those saws sing.
Hello. Thanks for the video. It is very helpful. I don't know if you still have this TU-17 but I have just bought a used one and I am looking for couple parts to change. Is Torqhoist a good place where I can get new parts? Thanks. Andre
I haven't purchased any parts lately, but Torqhoist was my go-to place. They have regional sales offices in the USA. Mike Polster was my contact michael@torqhoist.com He may still be working there.
@@PATCsawyer Thanks for the info
Do you have the complete parts breakdown of the TU-17? Actually, my unit is almost all dismanteld. I found that the spring of the front jaw is missing. I took several pictures of my super unit !!
For sure, I saw the breakdown on your video but it's kind blurry. So, I don't see very well
@@aguertin3846 Try this www.torqhoist.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/05/127192941183775.pdf
nice im building a larger version of this as we speak
The winch wire wasn't matched to the block sheaves, as this was just a test setup. Nowadays a pro version would use Dyneema. Less chance of injury if you overload and snap the rope.
I only looked st 8:07 and your made Setting Anvil! Very nice, i will copy it since there arent any old Anvils in german speaiking Europa online. Atleast i didnt look too far, since my old 2 kg Handhammer did the job aswell. Thank you!
I thought that I was prepared to sharpen my first cross-cut saw. The saw that I purchased is identical to yours shown with the exception of nearly no wear or overuse. Then I read your RUclips presentation! What a terrific job you’ve done of answering all the questions I had that I thought might be answered in the process. They never would have been because I didn’t realize how particular one needed to be in measuring. Thank you for saving me from frustration and failure.
Thanks. Glad this video still holds up over time. It really helps to have good tools and gauges to keep the filing within close tolerances.
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Thanks for posting. I have two saws and need a sheath for each... doing trail maintenance in central Virginia with the Natural Bridge club. I'm also a member of the Potomac Club.
Ever work with any of the SAWS folks? They have an office in Roanoke.
@@PATCsawyer yes, Eric G.
@@saltymarine Eric 's a good guy. If you enjoy crosscutting, look into the Wilderness Skills Institute at the Cradle of Forestry in Brevard NC. Their program signup should be starting soon.
I've seen a couple of folks start using 3/4" PEX pipe. Takes a little more wrangling to get it on but it's a tad lighter and no sharp corners. We also use rubber straps to secure it with D rings to old luggage straps we get a thrift stores. Nice video! Thanks!
The channel lattice doesn't like getting drilled and screwed but the Velcro wraps keep it tight. I like firehose the least, as it soaks up water and can be punctured by the saw teeth.
Excellent video! I just successfully filed my first saw, cut great, but after watching this (despite my previous research), i have learned that I made some mistakes - I'll just do a better job on the next saw!
What mistakes did you make? That video is 12 years old, and while it covers the basics, there are many other steps/techniques that I use now that I couldn't include in the original video.
@@PATCsawyer mostly attention to the rakers. I swaged them right to .012", that left me nothing to dress to final shape with a file. Also I swaged some crooked, so I had no meat left on the tooth to correct with a file. I did the cutters ok, but the angles weren't consistent. That is mostly just due to lack of experience. Also I hadn't heard of rolling the file at the tip like you did. Now I'm itching to make a saw vise and sharpen another!
@@themadmailler Have you visited crosscutsawyer.com? Good discussion and database of filing info. I have a lot of posts on that site. Do you live anywhere near Michigan? Hartwick Pines is hosting their Black Iron days the last weekend of August. Lots of blacksmithing but I'll be the only saw filer there.
@@PATCsawyer I'll have to check out the site! Nowhere near Michigan, but if I was I would definitely check out that event. Thanks!
Woah. What a tutorial! I have two Disston singles; one common tooth and one with rakers (champion tooth I think?). I’m wearing out brand new files like they’re made of aluminum because I have a similar “high raker” issue, but there are no broken rakers or teeth! I am going to reassess my steps now. Clear the rust from the plate and teeth tips, rakers from end to end first, then I’ll finish up with the cutters. Thank you for sharing this! You’re obviously well experienced and there is a Massive Void of truly expert knowledge of this online. Please let me know if you’re still doing this stuff and if you have anything to add for a true saw rookie. I was tempted to break out the grinder but felt like that would be blasphemy. If you can recommend a brand new file that works like it’s 50 years old, please let me know! The new files I’m finding in stores are garbage and I can’t seem to put my hands on a good new old stock file for under an arm and leg.
Christopher - I used a cant saw file in the video because it was what I had on hand. Nicholson mill files from most any hardware store should hold up long enough to finish two saws. Some filers like Bahco or other files not locally available, but buying a single file online and paying the ship charge can be more expensive than getting a couple Nicholsons and accepting that they will wear out faster. Ebay is a good place to look for NOS tools but requires patience as "everybody" is looking for quality old tools. Perhaps try FB marketplace. A good source of saw filing info is crosscutsawyer.com The search function is a little slow but there are good exchanges among filers about tools and techniques.
@@PATCsawyer thank you! I Spent last night in the resources and bid on a bunch. Fingers crossed. I appreciate your input and experience! Thank you!
I’m waiting for my crosscutsawyer username to be approved; hopefully I will run it to you over there. Thank you again!
Thanks for getting back to me
What’s the grease you used on the grip hoist I’m reading it Has to be a special kind?
I use either a lithium or red tacky grease. The important thing is to NOT USE molybdenum disulfide (Moly) grease as it could cause the jaws to slip. As for the rest, I just lube it up good with heavy differential oil, as it will adhere better than motor oil. With the exception of the Moly grease, any regular lubricant is better than running it dry.
Go the Tassie! Good job
It’s cutting good! What grind do you have on there?
It's about 22° primary with a small secondary. Has to work harder in oak.
@Alexander Kayne I freehand the profile with a bastard file/mill file using a draw file technique and finish with various grits of sandpaper stuck to a Home Depot paint stirrer. Low tech all the way. I've posted a discussion on filing GA saws on crosscutsawyer.com
She's a big girl....
Ditto on that - I worked for Rocky Mountain Nat. Park in the 60's, and the guy who taught me did that, and I agree it is a natural transition.
I thought I was the only one who switched hands!
I've been chopping that way for so long I do it without thinking about it, just my natural swing.
Looks like some bevels on that double.
20° primary with a small secondary.
Nice chips man! I haven’t taken a double bit out on the trail here in northeastern MD but I’d like to at some point. Lately I’ve been liking my 4 pound plumb jersey I’ve tuned up. That extra weight really helps on the dead stuff in my experience.
My old AT crew would often bring a DB along to augment the Tuatahi and crosscut saw when clearing trail in Virginia.
Very nice tutorial. Thanks for taking the time to share your knowledge.
belle expérience en entretient. j'ai depiécer mon tirfort U16 JE voudrais un manuel pour assembler
Le TU-16 ressemble à un TU-28. C'est comme un gros TU-17. La maintenance est similaire mais les pièces sont plus grandes www.torqhoist.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/05/127192941183775.pdf
I made two of these for my saws...they work great!
Would like to see some more videos of this axe in action...
It's a hungry axe and likes whatever I feed it.
I really want one but they are pricey. No US distribution at this point. I have a big Hults Bruks en route to pacify me for now.
Looks like some undercut to help it release clean?
Yes, an offset underbuck to keep it from slabbing off.
I need to start using my axe to undercut. The more tools in the tool bag the better. 😁
Thank You for Your video! Tirfor is an amazing tool, I like it very much! I have 3 of them, with various load capacity. Both of them is great! They help if my 4x4 stuck in the mud, loading heavy goods on my trailer, or pulling tree stumps out of the ground etc. You can find a lot of situation when these tools can help You out. No electrics to go wrong, just simple and pure mechanics!
How can I send you a photo of my saw , need help identifying.
Post it on crosscutsawyer.com or this FB site facebook.com/groups/Sawfilers/
I am the Territory Representative for Tractel who manufactures Griphoist/Tirfors. Please reach out if you need any assistance with these.
I actually work for Tractel who manufactures the Griphoist. Contact me anytime at Lisa.ludwig@tractel.com if you need any assistance. I am happy to assist.
As I woke up in the middle of the night, it came to my mind, if the jointer tool accounts for the taper ground of the saw plate. Meaning, that the jointer is 90 degrees, but the taper is not. But I guess, that has a negligible effect on filing the teeth flat.
Correct. It's precision work, but it's not rocket science.
Oh, and one last thing: I plan on using setting pliers before I do the cutter sharpening, so that I do not dull their tips. What do you think about it?
I mostly hammer set. I set my teeth before filing them, but before I do either job, I profile and shape the teeth to reduce the flat jointing dot. Once set, I complete the final point up. This is an extra step, but it's how I file a saw.
@@PATCsawyer thats exactly what I intent to do. Thanks a lot for your time.
In the videos by Crosscut Saw Filer he says the rakers should be sharpened to basically „a knife edge“. You say, there should be left little flat spot.
I prefer to use an Anderson gauge with its sloping filing plate. That model gauge will give you an exact and reproducible edge and height. When using a flat topped raker gauge, there is no slope to the cut and you are left with a shiny flat spot atop the raker which can be thinned as you final-shape the raker. If you file away all of the flat spot, how do you know if you've filed too far? If you file past the shiny edge, you will probably cut the raker lower than you wanted.
@@PATCsawyer Ok, now I get it. So it is rather for the purpose of being sure I did not overfile it. Someone somewhere mentioned it could also strenghten the edge a bit.
@@johnytwo I've never broken a raker while sawing, but I also don't thin my rakers to a wire edge.
Hello, I managed to get some old saws (german origin, I assume) for the purpose of cutting firewood for winter. I am sharpening one of the 140cm tapered ground champion tooth saw now without any gauges (could not get any in the Czech Republic, there is about 1 or 2 mentions of such things on the czech and german internet - funny). So I jointed it by hand (needed very little), shaped the rakers, swaged (using hammer and a bolt) and then filed rakers using feeler gauges. Wanted to ask you: 1) Do you think that it is necessary to use the jointer when sharpening once per season (maybe less, I dont know)? 2) What raker depth and set would you recommend for cutting mostly almost dry spruce or pine? (the set is 0,2 mm (0,08inch) and I have the rakers filed (overfiled rather :) to 0,8 mm (0,031inch) now. I am going to test it, when I finish 3) If I overfiled some rakers by 0,004, does it matter much, or not? Thanks.
Many crosscut saw tools can be home made if you're handle with tools, though the raker gauge would need a hardened filing plate. I joint my saws every time I file them, but after the first jointing, I don't need to take them down much. If your saw is a flat plate, I'd file set the teeth at 0.015" and the rakers at 0.010". Those are pretty basic settings. I'd set the teeth on the taper-ground saw at 0.010". Slightly overfilled (low) rakers are more forgiving than unfiled (high) rakers, though your saw will not cut smoothly if your rakers are all different heights.
@@PATCsawyer thanks for such a prompt reply. Should I file down the left raker tip to be the same hight as the overfiled right raker tip, or better leave it as it is?
@@johnytwo It depends on how much lower it is and how many are different. If just a few thousands, leave it alone. If the settings are all over the place, rejoint it and use the lesson as practice.
Great job!
This video is a study in excellence. I set mine across my lap and hit it with whatever file I have within arms reach. Then splash it with turtle wax. Outstanding!
Hello, why do you leave the „dot of unfiled metal“ on the cutter teeth? Does it stay there, or did I miss the point, where you, make it totally sharp?
The "dot" is actually much smaller than the period at the end of a sentence, but is still a microscopic flat spot at the tip of the cutter. The little reflection tells you that the cutter tooth is still at the original jointed length. If you file past the dot, you have no way of knowing how much shorter the tooth is relative to all the others. A short tooth will just ride along, not do much cutting (severing of wood fibers) and contribute to "whiskered" noodles, which occur when the raker peels out unsevered fibers.
@@PATCsawyer thanks for your very informative and prompt reply.
Great vid. I shot out into the garage to make a start on my small single handed xcut saw (while it was fresh in my head), only to find my tooth pattern is a simple M pattern, not 'champion'. Q: should the set on both teeth (each 'M') be the same direction or opposite?
Typically, an M-tooth saw has a gullet between each M. The points on each M are set in the same direction and alternate with each adjacent M. Google "Tuatahi work saw" and look at the images.
@@PATCsawyer Thank you so much