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yeah very valid point that

@@michaelbrennan2209 thank you! Glad you liked it. It’s gotten to the point where organizers have to warn people not to bend their flappy paper or else their timing chip won’t work 😅 amateur racing at its finest

@@alfredobarbieri77 thx! Glad it was helpful

man this couldn't be more timely. I've been 'battling' with this as well. Due to circumstances I've spent less time on the bike of late and have done more gym work and have felt amazing doing so. I mean yeah sure I'm heavier and slower going uphill but in the grander scheme of things like you said it's so much more worth it! A more holistic, multi-dimensional approach works a million times better for me.

I only recorded parts of it so I don't have the full race

@@dieterdevos8907 absolutely. Start with the ‘medio’ fondos to ease into it.

@@dieterdevos8907 😅

guilty as charged lol ! I would be the worst at all of the things you mention

oh sorry! thanks for catching the error

@@Y3riel unfortunately I won’t be there due to circumstances :( I did a channel update video about that. The one before my most recent video. Good luck and have a great day out!

@@fondoquest that’s too bad! Next year?!?

@@Y3riel not sure tbh. Will see if I can make it across the pond.

No, the beginning typically tends to be yes but when the field breaks up they just put a motorcycle in front of the 'peletons' and then there will be marshalls at intersections etc to stop traffic. But traffic in the opposite direction is very much a factor. Some fondos do this better than others (which at times are downright dangerous)

@@Simply1ism yes peaking is a factor that hasn’t been discussed in the comments here.

@@fondoquest A good vid. You'll look back at where two wheels took you, a well balanced perspective.

@@Simply1ism thanks!

@@tonytopanga6407 yes they have more general plans. One of them a specific FTP builder

Thanks for the reply. Currently got a Zwift subscription but I read that the quality of their workout plans is quite lacking. Join seems like a good alternative to get in to structured training for me as a beginner.

@@tonytopanga6407 their plans and training sessions aren't wildly innovative, but the tool is great for fitting structure around your life. It takes the thinking out of if.

@@mikicastan undoubtedly so! It’s the time element that blocks more than anything I’d say

It's all relative right.. I know what I can do with the training I put in and if I see what the top guns in this particular race bring, then I can only determine that that is exceptional for my standards. But agreed that for more seasoned, trained riders it will be somewhat of the norm.. I'm just hoping to bring the perspective from somebody who knows he isn't slow on the bike in the grand scheme of things (world population) but has no business at the front in what is essentially an amateur race.

@@fondoquest Fair enough. My experience of race/fondos is that there are plenty of middle aged men who are ridiculously fit but who train a ridiculous amount to be so. The times of the fondos haven't change much over the last 10 years however. And there are "freaks" everywhere, who with less training have so much natural talent that they will still compete. The biggest problem with a fondo is always repeated efforts at or near maximum. Those who've done enormous miles to build stamina can usually manage.

@@winstoncat6785 couldn’t agree more with the time element

yeah I'm not a fan of comparing to others, but volume will do that, agreed. It baffles me how they pull that off though... I mean something's gotta give right? Your kids, partner... It's not something I fancy doing tbh.. anything more than that 12-15 hour range burns/bores/stresses me out.

@@fondoquest some partners and families are incredibly understanding! I look at a few people I know in strava and cringe quite often! But it#s their lives and they are clearly okay with it.

I'm painfully reminded of this with every local Gran Fondo I ride lol

says it all yes I guess...

very true, if nothing else, it's a surefire way of going past your limit and ride at that level (even if only for a brief moment in the race)

sorry, not following here? what handlebar?

@@olsmxl6975 haha love that!

Yeah you are right kind of, I do kind of also feel that with more volume I could likely be closer but more volume than say around 10-12. hours per week, burns me out and I lose all motivation to ride. It's cool to be fast, but, for me, not at the cost of neglecting other important parts of my life.

You'd probably find if you are racing once a week, that your training is already optimised. 220NP is roughly Z2 yeah? Racing will give you your VO2 efforts. Not much would change from that, maybe one more day of Vo2 or threshold, but offsetting that overload would be a requirement for more recovery, so less day to day 220NP. Perhaps you would improve 5% but not a guarantee. Sounds like you are at a very good level, regardless.

@@fondoquest Knowing yourself and your limits is the best way to get the best performance from yourself. I have done big weeks of training and am very motivated, but it became clearly very quickly that there's a lot more to racing than having time to train. You also have to have the mentality and resilience to do the big hours. Finding that happy medium is key I think, sounds like you've got it nailed down nicely.

@@aarondcmedia9585 my ftp in that race was around 260 so 220 np would be tempo. At my peak this season I was doing my zone 2 rides around 180-190.... Good point about the racing though, I only do a few gran fondos and have never done any crit racing here locally as that's beyond brutal that level lol

so I guess to you your point, yes I likely would add a layer on top if I do the odd race here at the weekend.... something to think about thanks.

@@kamilkurzynowski3836 for me as a mid-pack jack I’m not bothered with it. I race fondos for the experience and to get better versus myself. The racing element helps me push myself but getting 120th instead of 60th doesn’t change much for me. It likely would annoy me if I would battle for a top 5…

These amateurs should be tested and barred from racing if found with PEDs. How pathetic do you have to be to juice as an amateur?

@@ryand141 Unfortunately the world has no shortage of pathetic people.... so assume there is no shortage of them in the amateur racing circuit as well.... but then again... whatever rocks their boat I guess... it's their health...

they are not doing steroids... steroids are not a PED that is really giving results for cycling. It's more epo, sarms, peptides, stimulants, and painkillers. And yes, for the performing amateurs cyclist, it's even more a thing than for pros !

@@bertrandronge9019 sadly so yes :(

@@MrLeovdmeer it’s all relative right. If they’re putting in a vo2max effort to overtake you while you’re just cruising along, I wouldn’t worry about it

@@fondoquest I am never worried about it. HAHA. Just letting them go and keep my own pace.

@@elias_vandenbroeck thanks! haha as most of my viewers are from the US and Canada I doubt they’ll know who that is 😂😅 Sam’s fame stopped at our borders and maybe for the better. Somebody else pointed out I look like Bryan Cocquard….. fwiw

@@sanders3219 lol yeah so have I, post-pre race I know some who take this a bit too seriously wear compression socks for recovery but in the race..?? Aero perhaps? Mid race recovery? 😅

@@NeilSnapePhotography thanks! Timely response as I have a video in the works about ‘too much powermeter’

thanks so much!

thank you!

thanks, Marnix! I have a bit of a love-hate relationship with my HRV (and my whoop) for that matter as I haven't been able to quite figure out what drives it (besides the obvious heavy drinking :D or over the top efforts) - been doing more running of late and that seems to impact me quite a bit. Anyway, might do a video on that at some point.

@@fondoquest my pleasure. do you need to know the drivers ? In general I know what can be sources of stress (physical and physiological) but I do not know what exactly drives HRV measured at a given point in time. Nevertheless I can leverage upon my measured HRV : when HRV is low I won’t go for an intensive ride whatever the reasons may be I can only guess. Note: A small upcoming cold my cause low HRV days before you notice so HRV is a health metric that nicely matches a safe kind of Polarized training approach. By sticking to that HRV knowledge approach I see my other ride metrics moving positively on the long run but slow though. 😅 Sometimes i confess to be rather surprised when resulting ride Garmin VO2 max goes up. Keen to add that doing an on-site VO2max test once a year is the real stuff that never lies.

@@marnixcoenaerts4974 thanks for this! so much to learn still. Lab testing intrigues as well. Might do that for a video on the channel next year.

@@MorganBrown yeah I downplay it but that was kind of what I wanted to highlight with this video. Me being above average gets me nowhere near the front in what is essentially an amateur race

@@fondoquest I think I was reading Andy Coggan's book and he referenced having a mere 3.8 W/kg FTP but was racing as a Cat 1 (top level amateur in US) and I believe was a masters national champion in the TT. My point is that race craft can get you a LONG way if you have a 4 W/kg FTP. Correct me if I'm wrong, but it seems to me that if you could have been with the lead group at the base of the first selection climb, you would have had the W/kg to climb with them? A continental pro that I know used to have a competition with his friends in criteriums to see who could do the LOWEST power and still finish in the group. Another game they would play is to see if they could do an entirecrit without touching the brakes! Conversely, a woman on my former race team actually DID have a 4 W/kg FTP. She has done national level racing on Zwift but in real road races was not very successful as she wasn't comfortable mixing it up in the groups and wasted a lot of energy sitting in the wind. A lot of armchair advice from a heavy guy with maybe a 3.3-3.4 W/kg FTP at sea level. More like 3.1-3.2 W/kg where I live (Colorado). Can't climb. 😂

@@MorganBrown all very valid points tbh. I came to cycling late and have 0 race craft. I also don’t race enough for that. The top guns in this race would have ftps north of 5w/kg and would easily do 7 and more on that initial 2min ish climb if not more. So even with better placing and smarter riding I’d get spat out the back with my 5,5w ish effort on that first climb

@@robbeelsas yeah 160km in a ‘peloton fondo’ like this is filled with relatively speaking ‘free miles’ there are very few ‘free miles’ at the marmotte or tour des stations 😅

yeah that's very true, there's only so much you can do in 10-12 hours - and putting in 20 hours is just going to break other parts of life (family, work)

@@fondoquest that should be enough to get a solide base to ride 250w+ easy then its all about structure

@@Teraaria-uy4bf depends on how long you mean at 250w+ lol

@@fondoquest like for 3-4h so around 3.5-4.2w

@@Teraaria-uy4bf with my genetic make-up I'm not sure that's possible on 10 hours, I would need to go and find 50-ish watts somewhere over a 4-hour ride... if I increase my training volume, maybe but that will burn me out in no time....

I guess there'll always be somebody different but sometimes a more level playing field would be nice :) thanks for watching!

@@fondoquest exactly what I was thinking.

@@pepkthx the definition of ‘baked into their genes’ I guess…

Absolutely, and then there is the amateur doping. Leave them to it, let them buy now and pay later. I just try to enjoy my own cycling and forget about the dopers. If you can’t keep up with those who are supposedly at your level, there’s a good chance you’re looking at dopers, so the video creator shouldn’t worry about it. It’s NOT a level playing field.

@@paddymurphy-oconnor8255 thanks! Couldn’t agree more. These races are fun either way as there’s always a race to be found in the race so I don’t mind one bit. Was just a realization I had while on the bike at in parts 40+k/hour racing for 120th 😅😂

@@ToOldToTurnProcycling don’t get me wrong, this doesn’t put me off racing in the least. In fondos there’s always race in the race. The video was just my realization that with my genetic make up I have little chance of ever making it to the front (for long)

@fondoquest my first Gran Fondo was at the Sierra Neveda on Spain, the ladt 20km was up hill over 2k meters evaluation. 255 starters, I came in 105 putting 8th in my age group.

@@ToOldToTurnProcycling that's very solid! I actually would love to explore more of the Spanish fondos - do you have any good recommendations for the 2025 season?

@fondoquest if you look, up the Sierra Nevada Limite, it will take you to there site, including next year's events👍

@@fondoquest the next in Spain is the Sierra de Cazorla near Jaen in October.

@@forton615 yeah valid point. The popularity pushes the adoption and overall practice of the sport. Look at the amount of girls and women I see out on the road since Lotte’s rise to fame

I've often wondered about that indeed. Would runners get that worked up as well as they're prepping for a marathon or are we the only nutters out there :D

@@fondoquest will never be like this in running. Even if you're a bit nutty and run 100 miles a week, this will never take you 20h like most of these cycling freaks train per week

At some point we can start wondering what on earth we can still consume (besides water)

Yes maths took a hit on that day ;)

@@cerocerocinco sounds about right and therefore way out of my league lol

Impressive 😱 Did he rank at least in the top 5 ?

That's how we mid age men fight out demons I guess. Some have more demons to fight.

@@nicolas2838 our form of meditation ;)

@@nicolas2838 yeah those slit demons

Wow! That's quite the transition but one I can only massively support! Thank you for sharing. I have to say that as time progresses, I gradually seem to find less and less value in my reduced consumption. I'm now contemplating another long stint without any alcohol and might even just call it entirely soon enough.

@@fondoquest Yeah, once the body clears the booze it has no appeal whatsoever, for me anyway. I’ve had plenty of good times social drinking but those days are now gone. I very occasionally have a sip, and it is just a sip, of a mates latest home brew but out of politeness and do find it a struggle to drink. Enjoying your channel, I’m gearing up for a big ride next year myself.

@@anemlachhomebrewing3690 You gotta do you buddy! We've only got one body so treat it well :) - good luck with the ride and thank you for following the channel, let me know how you get on.

Even if... far as I know we're talking approx a 10% performance increase if you're juiced.... I'd still be miles of the front :D

thanks but wait until you see my next video, you might change your opinion of me lol :)

yeah good point, but I don't have the watts even if I would battle for the front....

@@fondoquest you can save your strength a long time if your with the front group 🤷‍♂️🤷‍♂️🤷‍♂️🤷‍♂️ I’ m not saying you would win but you sure as hell wouldn’t get dropped

yeah fitness.... it comes slow but goes fast, I'm facing the same thing at the moment and am trying not to get affected by it too much...