As an oldtimer living in Holland, I watched this and was impressed by your thoroughness, and attention to detail. In past times I have built engines for racing of all types for wealthy Dutch businessmen who go away at weekends with their precious cars to clubracing circuits all over Europe. I have built Maserati, Ferrari, Lamborghini , Jaguar, Aston Martin engines, sixes, eights, and twelves, and the basic tenets of your approach to assembly are textbook perfect. Excellent show, thanks for the upload.
I'm a 53 year old Mechanic that has been building race motors for over 30 years. Attention to detail is everything in the building process. I would trust you and your dad to work on anything that I would need done. Your dad has a huge amount of knowledge to share, Makes me smile to see you take the time to learn this amazing process. makes me smile more to see father and son working together .Amazing shop and work guys ! Thanks for sharing
as a 20 year veteran of engine machining, its great seeing someone else doing things correctly and taking pride in their work. I miss doing the work, but I do not miss dealing with people lol. Your videos are greaet for the business as people are realizing just how much work and money it takes to do this stuff correctly
There is also something to be said for the hack that can beat seized valves out with a sledge hammer or pour coke into cylinders and make it run another 10 years. There is a LOT of things being scrapped because precision is cost prohibitive. I was quoted 5k last week on a JD lawnmower that's 2 cyl. As a mechanic I don't take anything apart that will have to be machined Not criticizing the trade but I have to get paid too. With the current QC crisis it's sketchy.
Same here. 35 years in the game and it looks like u do everything that I do including frost plug fitting with numbers to the top. Keep up the good work. I missed the trade.
I know what you mean about dealing with people. I'll never forget all those high school kids who used to tell me, "I made $2,000 this summer and I want an 8,000 rpm engine with 500 hp for my Camaro. That was back in the early 80's.
I am showing your videos to my students in the Automotive Service Technology class at Pioneer Technology Center. You do a great job and showing and describing the machine side of the Automotive industry.
*BRO, I perceive you as an excellent teacher! You explain things in a way that, "sucks me in" if you will and makes me focus on your speech and narration and I can't look away. Just wanted to let you know how much enjoyment I get out of watching you and your father side by side, hand in hand working together. YOU'RE AWESOME MAN, LOVE THE CONTENT TOO. DONT EVER STOP MAKING THESE VIDEOS!!!*
When balancing the pistons the benefits to a mill are nice clean cut marks but more importantly the repeatability from piston to piston . You want everything to look as clean and uniform as possible. Everything else looked good. Remember when drilling into the counterweights , the deeper you go the less it changes anything. Keep up the good work from one machinist to another.
i did my first balance job in 1959. for your first balance, you did exceptional. as you go a long you will become more comfortable. and you will refine your process. the overall numbers you ended with on you piston and rod assembly is way more than a stock driver needs. although the smoothness and performance will be greatly noticed. careful you dont get the "balancing addiction". as you know "the world is full of sloppy fitting parts!" LOL
I will never, EVER get into building engines. And yet I'm absolutely transfixed by your humbleness, work, work ethic, and skill level. I love that your RUclips channel AND business are growing, and I'm so envious of your opportunity to work with your dad. (I'm a contractor, who learned everything from my dad. He's still alive, and he's my best friend, but he can't walk or be on jobsites anymore.) I hope all the wonderful things for you and your family bud. Thank you for sharing.
Awesome story, I own a small Plumbing Heating and Cooling company, and because of covid, and the PPP not lending money to businesses under 10 employees till the very end, I have no employees left, but my son. He just started in the business and I'm training him right now. When I started training him I found out that I have a tumor on my brain stem. Which is terrible because my son had to go through seeing me have a massive seizure. Not sure how much time I have left I hope many years. Do you have any tips of what I should do while training my son since you are on the other side of that. Over my career I've always had apprentices with me trying to pass off the trade. Just about every one of those became licensed plumbers and I'd say 90% of those have started their own businesses. They still contact me for technical stuff. Training my son seems different than them. I guess because he's my son. He's extremely mechanical great with customers. So I have no worry that he'll make it, but is there something that your dad did to teach you that sticks in your mind that I'm be able to use?
@@godofplumbing I found your story very moving sir, I truly hope that you survive whatever the doctors recommend for you and come out the other side still able to teach your son everything he needs to know and much more.
Maybe video the more "interesting" encounters on jobsites and sit with your dad and watch/discuss them. I am certain you and he would enjoy discussing them.
After nearly 20 years as an automotive machinist/rebuilder, I do miss those years. I would sometimes use the Sunnen cap grinder to remove material from the pads on the rods for balancing. I would also machine the inside of the ends of the piston pins on the lathe... sometimes a small bevel cut would do it. After all, steel is heavier than aluminum. That is a lot of work moving the crank to another machine, to drill balancing holes. Don't envy you there! Thanks for the videos. Really brings back memories!
These guys are 10/10 for being exactly who they say they are Shops all over the world are charging for this level work and secretly under delivering. This is a great guide to be able to haggle what you need with the right lingo
I love you the fact that you have a high degree of skill, craftsmanship and integrity. Also humble enough to say that you are learning new things, don’t know it all and you’re willing to take advice from someone more experienced!! You’re one of the good guys!! Well done. And we’ll done to your parents!! I’d take anything I own to your shop!!
1 gram tolerance is fine on all the rotating assembly. Using up to 12 grams for oil works well on engines that run at higher higher RPM's for a bit more over balance. I use a Hines balancer just about everyday. In this case 4 grams is fine. I used 16 grams of over balance on a 406 SBC that we run up to 9200 rpms with titanium rods. Bearings always look better with this amount of over balance. This SBC engine made 887HP N/A for a drag car.
Love your channel, keep it up! Years ago I worked with my Dad too - in construction. He passed away last year, and I so badly miss all the time we spent together. At least I have those memories... and all the skills he taught me. I just wish I could go back in time and learn even more.. I still have questions, and now I'm on my own.
I honestly love seeing how well you and your father work together! I am super happy to see a son taking over and learning from his father all the ins and outs of a very specialized trade! Just seeing your guys Thoroughness, and attention is absolutely remarkable! Thank you for putting out amazing consistent videos!
Very well presented, narrated and quite informative. Never actually saw the process before as a whole, and certainly supports the costs involved to complete this process, which in turn adds so much to the finished project. As a 35-year ASE Master Technician, good enough was never in my professional vocabulary. Thank you. Well done!
Good work you are on track with most of the engine machining world. We usually try to make all individual parts like pistons match within 1/2 a gram and a little higher is ok when you hit a gram or more it can be a problem in high hp and rpm engines. Though a lot of the imbalance can be hidden in balancing the crank or rotating assembly as a whole best practice is getting everything as close as possible first. Machining is definately not a school taught only trade and is highly skill and talant that some people have and some dont. Had to put that out there lol. Thanks for sharing.
For balance of the rods, before grinding on the pistons, do the small end mounted in the pin as well, then you can mix and match the whole assembly as needed, meaning you don't have to remove nearly as much material overall as you can take the heaviest piston with the lightest small rod end etc. Measure everything individually, but also as a complete unit.
Machinist for 24 years, half of that time I spent balancing every engine none to man, your operation is top notch. All your procedures are the same as I did. The only engines I had to turn away were the one cylinders. Way to much setup time and not enough money. Take care!
I want to take a minute and Thank the "Old Guys". My Dad was a aviation mechanic in the Navy and machinist I am 40 yrs old and don't know half of what he forgot honestly! He was old school tuff on us kids and would bust our asses when we made mistakes! As a kid back then in those days I absolutely hated the ass kickings everyday growing up, but when I got a little older and snot quit running out of my nose things became very clear to me as to why the Old Guys were so damn strict and all business each and every day. Some would say that the Old Guys were too hard on their kids, well I'm here to say Thank You for teaching us respect and values and most of all Thank You for passing on this undervalued trade! Originally I was going to comment only on how awesome these guys are and how much I appreciate seeing the precision and quality craftsmanship you hold yourselves to. But found myself wanting to give gratitude to the Old Guys who stood for something and understood before we did what importance it was to pass on Machinist skills and because of their trial and error it made our jobs much much easier. Enjoy this weekend together with your family and never forget who has died for our freedoms (whats left of them). Happy 4th of July everyone and God Bless the USA
I built a high performance engine years ago and had its rotating assembly balanced. Not sure why this customer would want to spend extra to balance an engine that is rebuilt to stock with cast pistons, cast crank, 2 bbl carb, etc. love the video and how you are so exacting in your work. If I lived close, I’d send my engine to you in a NY minute. 👍🇺🇸
How you're doing the pistons are fine especially cast. Most of the weight can be removed from casting marks/sprues. Billet/Forged were always very close for me. I would also source mine to be as close in weight as possible from my suppliers. Like indexing spark plugs. My suppliers would even let me go through their inventory to select the ones that fit my washers for each cylinder. Drilled or milled pistons when needed. Balancing the rods same thing with removing weight from forging lines and also helps to destress them in the process. The rest you already know for cranks etc. Well done for your final numbers and very true you can only get so close in real life of the engine running. Damn fine job polishing the crank!! With the right clearances, oil flow and viscosity, it will last a super long time. Unless the owner is going to run a massive nitro setup, supercharger/turbos with crazy boost levels.
One of The Machinist I used to use for balancing engines was a perfectionist and was well known for his work on racing engines, so he's the kind of guy that would be able to give you the best advice. But I do know he used to use a Mill to remove material from the piston wrist pin pads to equalize the weight of all the Pistons. You have to remember most of the forces in play are on the upper portion of the wrist pin bore, not on the bottom where you grind material,
We have just moved into another shop and all the machines we’re negotiated into the rent. These videos have been great to compare different methods of going about everything.
Another great way to chase down minor amounts of material removal on the balancer is to use an angle grinder with a flap disk. Congrats on being able to balance in house that's a big step 🤟🤟👌
Great video. When you think about the differences is the power of the combustion in each cylinder, it’s hard to see how a couple of grams makes a difference. But I never rebuilt an engine.
I do some crank balancing on motorcycle crankshafts. Anything under 1 gram isn’t going make much difference. But because I static balance all of my cranks, it’s hard for me to know how much difference a gram can make. With your dynamic balancer you will soon work out the tolerances you have work to. I use a belt linisher to balance the rods just the same as you.
John from San Jose California thanks a lot for the info I've been balancing rods that way for a long time haven't been able to do a crank but rods come out pretty good haven't thrown up any Motors lately I think the way you're doing is just fine
I love this channel. Very in depth knowledge. I tried my hand a rebuilding a motor in my driveway before and if i had this channel back then I wouldve had way more knowledge going into the build
WOW I can't imagine the hacks that "rebuild" an engine and skip or disregard stuff. Now I know the importance of a good shop. I love precision and "perfection". I always say you need to try to be perfect to get to excellence.
Interesting stuff. I've been balancing jet engs. for about 40 yrs now, and watched a machinist balance a crankshaft on a YT video. I found one of his comments pretty funny when he said, "for street engs. we try and get down to a couple grams, and race engs about a gram". Then he stated "you can get it lower...but it's purely entertainment" LOL. :) P.S. Didn't know Sunnen made balance machines. I've run Schenk and Hofmanns, and when balancing on hard rollers, each pedestal has a safety device (with its own roller) above the area where your journals ride. If for some reason the crank wants to take off, you have a little protection. Just food for thought, and thanks for posting.
Much respect for asking for advice. Most would just go at it and if someone offered actual constructive criticism just play it off with some excuses. Love all your content.
At the shop I work at we always do the small end of the rods first, then just weigh the total and make the totals match from the bottom end. It is pretty efficient for us.
we use to take stock rods and cast cranks and balance after "shaving and lightening" to the point you would think that the engine would blow up--we ran them 9,000+ rpm @ circle tracks and never had a failure. balancing does wonders and lightening makes them rev high!
Honestly I have not a clue what any of this does and why it does but it's just so much fun to watch, hear about stuff, why you guys do it and honestly kind of learn some things as well.
I had no idea of the complexity of tuning the piston up ,I Knew they where balanced but to see it was eye opening. Am new to channel and look forward to watching your videos to catch up to date ,many thanks for your time and effort in explaining and showing how it's done,am totally hooked.regards to all
30 years ago I used to run a Hines balancer on automotive stuff and I used to remove weight from the inside of the wrist pins on my lathe. The inside of the pin is soft and you can get more weight out and not drill holes in your pistons.
I don't care whether you are reaching perfection or not.. I like the thought you are putting into this and I personally believe you are on the road to great success! Nice work guys.. Can't wait to hear her run!!
i find putting pistons in the lathe to machine the pads gives me quickest measurement of per gram calculation... each 020" cut will amount to a consistant gram... also adding a chamfer to the pin is nice and quick
I wouldn’t worry about the 2 gram difference on the pistons, it won’t make a noticeable difference any a stock application. Rods within a 1/2 gram are good but Of courseI always get those perfect. Also when I balance rotating assemblies I like to weight the big ends then balance the big ends. Then I just weigh the rod weights total and then grind the small ends to match the total weight. It makes it a little easier and faster as you don’t need to change setup or try getting the rod put on the hangers just perfect. I always shoot for under a .5oz per 1” imbalance when balancing the crank and like to have the imbalances as close to 180 degrees out from one another hope this helps!
That Pontiac is going to belt out Beethoven with all the balancing it's getting. After binge watching your videos, I'd rather have you rebuild mine than get a "new remanufactured" motor. I did go to my local parts guy for a reman, he's a great parts guy and 35 year friendship, I couldn't not give him business. The motor runs excellent and my '64 C10 loves it.
Ya well, when you don't get it right right things go wrong real fast. Attention to detail is critical in any engine assembly/crank service. Nice attention to detail. Excellent builders matter.
Use your milling machine set up on lightest piston for depth make sure piston height is same on all pistons remove material from rest to have identical weight. You will have to radius the ends of cut where they run into main part of piston to prevent stress crack. Grind a radius on flat bottom end mill to accomplish this.
I never knew about the proper direction of grinding and polishing the crankshaft would leave microscopic burrs that could wear out the bearings. Good stuff!
hi from Australia. stay well and safety, we're getting smashed with covid restriction here down under. love your channel, your workmanship is commendable.
In many other parts of the world, hospitals are getting smashed with unrestricted covid infections and deaths. Florida is a good example of what happens to deniers :)
@@einfelder8262 yeah, Florida should have followed New York’s lead and killed their elderly population right up front. Really helps the numbers later on.
One of my favorite things was bouncing engines some engines the rotating assembly was perfect but the rods and pistons are way out lot of Mercedes motors are like that it was fun to do we balance the small end first and then we finish out with the big ends and double check everything makes for a smoother and longer running engine and on the VW motors we recommended light flywheels 8 pin that way it doesn't beat the rear main bearing out. Lot of tricks on lightning flywheels to improve performance. Everything was balanced within half a gram shop procedure.
I'm a bit late to this channel but I am subscribed now. Love your work! I see you are already using a spreadsheet to keep track and do the calculations. The one thing I can suggest that can streamline your process a bit more is to use a lab scale that outputs the measurements to USB. There are even some that can output to bluetooth. The better ones will "send" the numerical reading followed by a carriage return. The computer "sees" the scale as a keyboard so no special drivers or software needs to be installed. There are also digital calipers and micrometers that can do output to USB (or bluetooth.) The industry name is SPC (Statistical Process Control) output. It really helps by reducing the number of keystrokes and change of focus on what you are doing. Also helps to eliminate transcription errors. All that said... try to stay away from proprietary systems that mainly lock you in to using their VERY expensive cables and modules and software. Starrett (as much as I love their tools) does this. Mitutoyo has much more reasonably priced SPC cables and their output is simple number+enter. There are some very reasonably priced measurement tools that do bluetooth that are of good quality. Ohaus makes reasonably priced lab scales that out put to USB. There are many others available.
I KNOW NOTHING ABOUT YOUR WORK BUT I WAS VERY IMPRESSED WITH YOUR SHOP. YOU DID WELL WITH YOUR VIDEO. PLEASE KEEP UP THE VIDEOS I REALLY LIKE WATCHING ALL THE PROCEEDERS. I LIKE THE PROCESSES, ILIKE THINGS IN ORDER TO REACH THE GOAL,FOR THAT IS RETTY LACKING. TODAY THEY JUST WANT A MACHINE TO DO ALL THE NITTY GRITTY AND BLOW IT OUT. THANKS!!
Watching all the videos on this build, The amount of time and attention to detail. It makes me wonder how GM and others mass produced high performance engines back in the day. I would love to see how they put together solid lifter 396 and 427s at the factory on a production schedule.
Shinano Belt Sander 30 x 540mm Belt SHINANO SKU: SI2830 I find this tool the best to get into the tight spots while the crank is still in the balancer. It enables you to get into the throw side of the crank and remove weight.
We spot drill the back side of the piston, since you already have a piston vise thats the easiest and fastest way to do. For sand the rods, we use a 2x48 belt on a bench grinder from trick tools
Watch Horsepower Academy's video on engine balancing. They go pretty deep on it. Also you should balance the pistons with the rings. You can mix the parts to balance out before removing material.
Each time you spin, deburr the hole. This little bit will give you a precise number when you spin. Also some of those cast pistons have heavy casting marks, these can also be deburred prior to weight. Keep up the good work. There are some real masters out there.
I used to build racing hemi's. I also flew charters for the auto plants in Detroit mostly bringing in parts for the factories On one occasion I flew a charter to one of glass plants to pick up the oval opera windows used in the Continentals While there I saw a technician polish out a minor scratch in a windshield. When he was done it looked like the scratch never happened. I asked what he had used and he said" it was 10,000 grit jewelers rouge diamond dust impregnated in a cork pad. If you could get some of that and use in the final polish this would eliminate the directional burr on the journal and give a smooth almost mirror finish. We tried this on a hemi crank and under a microscope even with ziglo dye we could not find any indication of a directional burring. Usual the diamond dust can be found at a diamond cutting/polishing supplies known to the jewelry industry. Great video and always enjoyed building engines just enjoyed flying a little more and wound up flying for a major airline until retirement.
I came across this video when surfing RUclips and peaked my interest. I subscribed to your channel and have been binge watching all your videos. One question/statement, you must go through a butt load of detergent in your small spray washer. You wash and rinse a block and/or cyl. head 2-3 times on average it seems. Rinsing them while inside the washer has to dilute the detergent to water ratio quite fast. I do appreciate the thoroughness, very refreshing nowadays. Sad note, I worked in a machine shop for a year in High School before going into the Army. I did all the glass beading for the shop and got to work in the cyl. head department when I had free time. Here’s the sad note, I ruined a pair of small block Chevy 2.02 double hump heads by not drilling out the valve guides perfectly straight. Yikes!!! Fortunately it was in the late 70’s and they were still available. So like I said I appreciate your thoroughness and attention to detail!!!
That's the most common way it's always been done, from what I have seen in shops anyway, that little number eight should rev up like a fire cracker with all that work, just hope the owner knows how to set up the carbs as a new cam shaft needs 2000 rpm for a few minutes to break in, you don't want to do that running lean or having the motor cutting out. Just a thought, do you plan on setting up a dust free room with a inspection plate for precise measurements, if so that would be a great place for the scale to weigh things, doesn't have to be big, just a clean dust free spot in the shop at a stable temp.
We just use a belt sander for all the balancing on rods and pistons, but yeah we have a dedicated belt sander similar to a knife making sander that gives access to the radius part of the belt for sanding into tight areas
As an oldtimer living in Holland, I watched this and was impressed by your thoroughness, and attention to detail. In past times I have built engines for racing of all types for wealthy Dutch businessmen who go away at weekends with their precious cars to clubracing circuits all over Europe. I have built Maserati, Ferrari, Lamborghini , Jaguar, Aston Martin engines, sixes, eights, and twelves, and the basic tenets of your approach to assembly are textbook perfect. Excellent show, thanks for the upload.
A proper engine overhaul is far more than just "throwing parts together" - thnx for sharing
I'm a 53 year old Mechanic that has been building race motors for over 30 years. Attention to detail is everything in the building process. I would trust you and your dad to work on anything that I would need done. Your dad has a huge amount of knowledge to share, Makes me smile to see you take the time to learn this amazing process. makes me smile more to see father and son working together .Amazing shop and work guys ! Thanks for sharing
as a 20 year veteran of engine machining, its great seeing someone else doing things correctly and taking pride in their work. I miss doing the work, but I do not miss dealing with people lol. Your videos are greaet for the business as people are realizing just how much work and money it takes to do this stuff correctly
There is also something to be said for the hack that can beat seized valves out with a sledge hammer or pour coke into cylinders and make it run another 10 years. There is a LOT of things being scrapped because precision is cost prohibitive. I was quoted 5k last week on a JD lawnmower that's 2 cyl. As a mechanic I don't take anything apart that will have to be machined Not criticizing the trade but I have to get paid too. With the current QC crisis it's sketchy.
Same here. 35 years in the game and it looks like u do everything that I do including frost plug fitting with numbers to the top. Keep up the good work. I missed the trade.
I know what you mean about dealing with people. I'll never forget all those high school kids who used to tell me, "I made $2,000 this summer and I want an 8,000 rpm engine with 500 hp for my Camaro. That was back in the early 80's.
How much does a bottom end build and balance cost then?
Liar.
I am showing your videos to my students in the Automotive Service Technology class at Pioneer Technology Center. You do a great job and showing and describing the machine side of the Automotive industry.
Now there's r recommendation you can take to the bank guys!
*BRO, I perceive you as an excellent teacher! You explain things in a way that, "sucks me in" if you will and makes me focus on your speech and narration and I can't look away. Just wanted to let you know how much enjoyment I get out of watching you and your father side by side, hand in hand working together. YOU'RE AWESOME MAN, LOVE THE CONTENT TOO. DONT EVER STOP MAKING THESE VIDEOS!!!*
Really enjoy watching the set of videos on the 68 pontiac engine
This is the only right way to tune an engine 100% and from A to Z.
Respect👍.
I'm Only 68, but I'm Still learnin' ! Very informative. I had a '67 GTO with a 400 and a Turbohydramatic behind it. Loved that engine !
I'm nearly 48 and hope in ~20 years time I can say those same words: "I'm only 68" 👍🏻
When balancing the pistons the benefits to a mill are nice clean cut marks but more importantly the repeatability from piston to piston . You want everything to look as clean and uniform as possible. Everything else looked good. Remember when drilling into the counterweights , the deeper you go the less it changes anything. Keep up the good work from one machinist to another.
i did my first balance job in 1959. for your first balance, you did exceptional. as you go a long you will become more comfortable. and you will refine your process. the overall numbers you ended with on you piston and rod assembly is way more than a stock driver needs. although the smoothness and performance will be greatly noticed. careful you dont get the "balancing addiction". as you know "the world is full of sloppy fitting parts!" LOL
I have always wondered how an engine was balanced and now I know. Thanks for explaining it so clearly.
great job, 42 years in the business. keep up the good work. it is nice to see younger guys carrying on the craft of engine machining and building.
I will never, EVER get into building engines. And yet I'm absolutely transfixed by your humbleness, work, work ethic, and skill level. I love that your RUclips channel AND business are growing, and I'm so envious of your opportunity to work with your dad. (I'm a contractor, who learned everything from my dad. He's still alive, and he's my best friend, but he can't walk or be on jobsites anymore.) I hope all the wonderful things for you and your family bud. Thank you for sharing.
Awesome story, I own a small Plumbing Heating and Cooling company, and because of covid, and the PPP not lending money to businesses under 10 employees till the very end, I have no employees left, but my son. He just started in the business and I'm training him right now. When I started training him I found out that I have a tumor on my brain stem. Which is terrible because my son had to go through seeing me have a massive seizure. Not sure how much time I have left I hope many years. Do you have any tips of what I should do while training my son since you are on the other side of that. Over my career I've always had apprentices with me trying to pass off the trade. Just about every one of those became licensed plumbers and I'd say 90% of those have started their own businesses. They still contact me for technical stuff. Training my son seems different than them. I guess because he's my son. He's extremely mechanical great with customers. So I have no worry that he'll make it, but is there something that your dad did to teach you that sticks in your mind that I'm be able to use?
@@godofplumbing I found your story very moving sir, I truly hope that you survive whatever the doctors recommend for you and come out the other side still able to teach your son everything he needs to know and much more.
Maybe video the more "interesting" encounters on jobsites and sit with your dad and watch/discuss them. I am certain you and he would enjoy discussing them.
Building engines is pretty fun. It's about the only part of mechanics that I would say is enjoyable.
After nearly 20 years as an automotive machinist/rebuilder, I do miss those years. I would sometimes use the Sunnen cap grinder to remove material from the pads on the rods for balancing. I would also machine the inside of the ends of the piston pins on the lathe... sometimes a small bevel cut would do it. After all, steel is heavier than aluminum. That is a lot of work moving the crank to another machine, to drill balancing holes. Don't envy you there! Thanks for the videos. Really brings back memories!
Your dad is a heck of a teacher, but for being such a young guy with your level of knowledge and expertise is incredible. Very impressive.
These guys are 10/10 for being exactly who they say they are
Shops all over the world are charging for this level work and secretly under delivering. This is a great guide to be able to haggle what you need with the right lingo
I love you the fact that you have a high degree of skill, craftsmanship and integrity. Also humble enough to say that you are learning new things, don’t know it all and you’re willing to take advice from someone more experienced!!
You’re one of the good guys!! Well done.
And we’ll done to your parents!!
I’d take anything I own to your shop!!
Now after years I understand balanced. You have a gift. Some spend 40,000 on a race engine and I see all the equipment and knowledge needed. Thank you
1 gram tolerance is fine on all the rotating assembly.
Using up to 12 grams for oil works well on engines that run at higher higher RPM's for a bit more over balance.
I use a Hines balancer just about everyday. In this case 4 grams is fine. I used 16 grams of over balance on a 406 SBC that we run up to 9200 rpms with titanium rods. Bearings always look better with this amount of over balance.
This SBC engine made 887HP N/A for a drag car.
These series of 8 videos are very best I've seen on this subject. And the best machinists I've seen. You guys really are thorough. Thankyou.
Love your channel, keep it up! Years ago I worked with my Dad too - in construction. He passed away last year, and I so badly miss all the time we spent together. At least I have those memories... and all the skills he taught me. I just wish I could go back in time and learn even more.. I still have questions, and now I'm on my own.
One of the best clips on youtube that covers this topic precisely and thoroughly . Thank you .
I honestly love seeing how well you and your father work together! I am super happy to see a son taking over and learning from his father all the ins and outs of a very specialized trade! Just seeing your guys Thoroughness, and attention is absolutely remarkable! Thank you for putting out amazing consistent videos!
David Vizard did a great book about balancing.
Very well presented, narrated and quite informative.
Never actually saw the process before as a whole, and certainly supports the costs involved to complete this process, which in turn adds so much to the finished project. As a 35-year ASE Master Technician, good enough was never in my professional vocabulary.
Thank you. Well done!
Good work you are on track with most of the engine machining world. We usually try to make all individual parts like pistons match within 1/2 a gram and a little higher is ok when you hit a gram or more it can be a problem in high hp and rpm engines. Though a lot of the imbalance can be hidden in balancing the crank or rotating assembly as a whole best practice is getting everything as close as possible first. Machining is definately not a school taught only trade and is highly skill and talant that some people have and some dont. Had to put that out there lol. Thanks for sharing.
I have been following and your doing a good job 👍. I have over 40 years grinding very large (20’+) up to 10,000 pounds and dynamic balance of them.
For balance of the rods, before grinding on the pistons, do the small end mounted in the pin as well, then you can mix and match the whole assembly as needed, meaning you don't have to remove nearly as much material overall as you can take the heaviest piston with the lightest small rod end etc. Measure everything individually, but also as a complete unit.
Machinist for 24 years, half of that time I spent balancing every engine none to man, your operation is top notch. All your procedures are the same as I did. The only engines I had to turn away were the one cylinders. Way to much setup time and not enough money. Take care!
I want to take a minute and Thank the "Old Guys". My Dad was a aviation mechanic in the Navy and machinist I am 40 yrs old and don't know half of what he forgot honestly! He was old school tuff on us kids and would bust our asses when we made mistakes! As a kid back then in those days I absolutely hated the ass kickings everyday growing up, but when I got a little older and snot quit running out of my nose things became very clear to me as to why the Old Guys were so damn strict and all business each and every day. Some would say that the Old Guys were too hard on their kids, well I'm here to say Thank You for teaching us respect and values and most of all Thank You for passing on this undervalued trade! Originally I was going to comment only on how awesome these guys are and how much I appreciate seeing the precision and quality craftsmanship you hold yourselves to. But found myself wanting to give gratitude to the Old Guys who stood for something and understood before we did what importance it was to pass on Machinist skills and because of their trial and error it made our jobs much much easier. Enjoy this weekend together with your family and never forget who has died for our freedoms (whats left of them). Happy 4th of July everyone and God Bless the USA
I'd say the 'old guys' taught DISCIPLINE.
I built a high performance engine years ago and had its rotating assembly balanced. Not sure why this customer would want to spend extra to balance an engine that is rebuilt to stock with cast pistons, cast crank, 2 bbl carb, etc. love the video and how you are so exacting in your work. If I lived close, I’d send my engine to you in a NY minute. 👍🇺🇸
When I balanced pistons we had a custom aluminum vice for pistons and we used a mill with an endmill it made it really quick work
How you're doing the pistons are fine especially cast. Most of the weight can be removed from casting marks/sprues. Billet/Forged were always very close for me. I would also source mine to be as close in weight as possible from my suppliers. Like indexing spark plugs. My suppliers would even let me go through their inventory to select the ones that fit my washers for each cylinder. Drilled or milled pistons when needed. Balancing the rods same thing with removing weight from forging lines and also helps to destress them in the process. The rest you already know for cranks etc. Well done for your final numbers and very true you can only get so close in real life of the engine running. Damn fine job polishing the crank!! With the right clearances, oil flow and viscosity, it will last a super long time. Unless the owner is going to run a massive nitro setup, supercharger/turbos with crazy boost levels.
One of The Machinist I used to use for balancing engines was a perfectionist and was well known for his work on racing engines, so he's the kind of guy that would be able to give you the best advice. But I do know he used to use a Mill to remove material from the piston wrist pin pads to equalize the weight of all the Pistons. You have to remember most of the forces in play are on the upper portion of the wrist pin bore, not on the bottom where you grind material,
We have just moved into another shop and all the machines we’re negotiated into the rent. These videos have been great to compare different methods of going about everything.
It was a really nice touch to ask for input. Mine will be just listen to your dad, he's forgotten more than we'll ever know.
Very interesting. I was initially skeptical of the necessity for balancing, but now appreciate the process
Awesome video , good to see a man taking pride in his work.
Another great way to chase down minor amounts of material removal on the balancer is to use an angle grinder with a flap disk. Congrats on being able to balance in house that's a big step 🤟🤟👌
Thank you for having the time to make the video.
Great video. When you think about the differences is the power of the combustion in each cylinder, it’s hard to see how a couple of grams makes a difference. But I never rebuilt an engine.
Awesome job thanks for sharing your knowledge, I’m learning so much! Please tell your dad thank you as well, you guys are awesome !
Thanks for watching! He reads all of the comments lol but I will tell him as well ☺️
I do some crank balancing on motorcycle crankshafts. Anything under 1 gram isn’t going make much difference. But because I static balance all of my cranks, it’s hard for me to know how much difference a gram can make. With your dynamic balancer you will soon work out the tolerances you have work to. I use a belt linisher to balance the rods just the same as you.
I had never considered that you would compensate for the weight of the oil in the crankshaft. I'm impressed with your attention to detail 👌
John from San Jose California thanks a lot for the info I've been balancing rods that way for a long time haven't been able to do a crank but rods come out pretty good haven't thrown up any Motors lately I think the way you're doing is just fine
I love this channel. Very in depth knowledge. I tried my hand a rebuilding a motor in my driveway before and if i had this channel back then I wouldve had way more knowledge going into the build
Very interesting how this process works. Your work is very professional.Thanks for sharing.
Excellent job! It will be great when you get your drill at the balancer. I’m sure that will be a HUGE time saver!
Wish you were over here in Scotland, taking the care you and your father do.
WOW I can't imagine the hacks that "rebuild" an engine and skip or disregard stuff. Now I know the importance of a good shop. I love precision and "perfection". I always say you need to try to be perfect to get to excellence.
Interesting stuff. I've been balancing jet engs. for about 40 yrs now, and watched a machinist balance a crankshaft on a YT video. I found one of his comments pretty funny when he said, "for street engs. we try and get down to a couple grams, and race engs about a gram". Then he stated "you can get it lower...but it's purely entertainment" LOL. :)
P.S. Didn't know Sunnen made balance machines. I've run Schenk and Hofmanns, and when balancing on hard rollers, each pedestal has a safety device (with its own roller) above the area where your journals ride. If for some reason the crank wants to take off, you have a little protection. Just food for thought, and thanks for posting.
Yes when watching that I thought what if it decides to take off? I'd have some sort iPod hard safety above the pivot points I think
Man! You people are perfectionists, Love your work as you do...With lots of love from India 🇮🇳
You and dad are awesome. Thanks for allowing us to come into your world!
You are so knowledgeable and humble. I really aspire to do what you do. Keep up the great work and I hope to see this build complete! ❤️
Much respect for asking for advice. Most would just go at it and if someone offered actual constructive criticism just play it off with some excuses. Love all your content.
There is always room to learn! Thank you for watching 🙌🏼. This series has been a lot of fun for us!
@@JAMSIONLINE When you stop learning, you stop living! Nobody knows it all.
@@mikeznel6048you are absolutely correct but if that is the case then we have a huge amount of zombies stumbling around the countryside.
At the shop I work at we always do the small end of the rods first, then just weigh the total and make the totals match from the bottom end. It is pretty efficient for us.
Love to see the valve and rocker balancing
OUTSTANDING WORK, OUTSTANDING VIDEO! OUTSTANDING NARRATION!!
we use to take stock rods and cast cranks and balance after "shaving and lightening" to the point you would think that the engine would blow up--we ran them 9,000+ rpm @ circle tracks and never had a failure. balancing does wonders and lightening makes them rev high!
Honestly I have not a clue what any of this does and why it does but it's just so much fun to watch, hear about stuff, why you guys do it and honestly kind of learn some things as well.
Excellent video and very well narrated. Wish you were closer!
I had no idea of the complexity of tuning the piston up ,I Knew they where balanced but to see it was eye opening. Am new to channel and look forward to watching your videos to catch up to date ,many thanks for your time and effort in explaining and showing how it's done,am totally hooked.regards to all
30 years ago I used to run a Hines balancer on automotive stuff and I used to remove weight from the inside of the wrist pins on my lathe. The inside of the pin is soft and you can get more weight out and not drill holes in your pistons.
I don't care whether you are reaching perfection or not.. I like the thought you are putting into this and I personally believe you are on the road to great success! Nice work guys.. Can't wait to hear her run!!
Well done! I cut my teeth on a Stewart Warner balancer back in the late 70"s. Brings back memories.
Amazing!! I just hope this series ends with the engine in the car roaring happy
I could watch these all day
i find putting pistons in the lathe to machine the pads gives me quickest measurement of per gram calculation... each 020" cut will amount to a consistant gram... also adding a chamfer to the pin is nice and quick
ur doing fine, that is how it done, speed doing things not needed accuracy needed
I wouldn’t worry about the 2 gram difference on the pistons, it won’t make a noticeable difference any a stock application. Rods within a 1/2 gram are good but Of courseI always get those perfect. Also when I balance rotating assemblies I like to weight the big ends then balance the big ends. Then I just weigh the rod weights total and then grind the small ends to match the total weight. It makes it a little easier and faster as you don’t need to change setup or try getting the rod put on the hangers just perfect. I always shoot for under a .5oz per 1” imbalance when balancing the crank and like to have the imbalances as close to 180 degrees out from one another hope this helps!
Very cool. I have rebuilt many engines in the past. But never spent the time and money on balancing. But I think on my next build I will try it.
Great video!! Love the details on the orientation of the burs vs bearings, definitely nailed it!
Please continue!!
Thanks 🙏
this is a good point, and also provides the basis of support for why you're never supposed to rotate your engine backwards.
i like your work. esp favor the dad/son dynamic. keep it coming. best wishes
Outstanding Nick, Thank You.
What a fantastic set of videos you have created. If i lived near your shop you would absolutely get my business. Thank you!
That Pontiac is going to belt out Beethoven with all the balancing it's getting. After binge watching your videos, I'd rather have you rebuild mine than get a "new remanufactured" motor. I did go to my local parts guy for a reman, he's a great parts guy and 35 year friendship, I couldn't not give him business. The motor runs excellent and my '64 C10 loves it.
Man you guys have one of the coolest jobs ever. Keep up the good work!
Ya well, when you don't get it right right things go wrong real fast. Attention to detail is critical in any engine assembly/crank service. Nice attention to detail. Excellent builders matter.
Use your milling machine set up on lightest piston for depth make sure piston height is same on all pistons remove material from rest to have identical weight. You will have to radius the ends of cut where they run into main part of piston to prevent stress crack. Grind a radius on flat bottom end mill to accomplish this.
I never knew about the proper direction of grinding and polishing the crankshaft would leave microscopic burrs that could wear out the bearings. Good stuff!
hi from Australia. stay well and safety, we're getting smashed with covid restriction here down under. love your channel, your workmanship is commendable.
In many other parts of the world, hospitals are getting smashed with unrestricted covid infections and deaths. Florida is a good example of what happens to deniers :)
As a Queenslander I'm really feeling sorry for you guys down south. Dreadful situation and it just seems to be getting worse.
@@einfelder8262 yeah, Florida should have followed New York’s lead and killed their elderly population right up front. Really helps the numbers later on.
that's the cleanest machine shop i've ever seen. nice work!
very neat video, thanks for making it. I've never seen the process of balancing pistons, rods and crank shafts before.
One of my favorite things was bouncing engines some engines the rotating assembly was perfect but the rods and pistons are way out lot of Mercedes motors are like that it was fun to do we balance the small end first and then we finish out with the big ends and double check everything makes for a smoother and longer running engine and on the VW motors we recommended light flywheels 8 pin that way it doesn't beat the rear main bearing out. Lot of tricks on lightning flywheels to improve performance. Everything was balanced within half a gram shop procedure.
I'm a bit late to this channel but I am subscribed now. Love your work!
I see you are already using a spreadsheet to keep track and do the calculations. The one thing I can suggest that can streamline your process a bit more is to use a lab scale that outputs the measurements to USB. There are even some that can output to bluetooth. The better ones will "send" the numerical reading followed by a carriage return. The computer "sees" the scale as a keyboard so no special drivers or software needs to be installed. There are also digital calipers and micrometers that can do output to USB (or bluetooth.) The industry name is SPC (Statistical Process Control) output. It really helps by reducing the number of keystrokes and change of focus on what you are doing. Also helps to eliminate transcription errors.
All that said... try to stay away from proprietary systems that mainly lock you in to using their VERY expensive cables and modules and software. Starrett (as much as I love their tools) does this. Mitutoyo has much more reasonably priced SPC cables and their output is simple number+enter. There are some very reasonably priced measurement tools that do bluetooth that are of good quality. Ohaus makes reasonably priced lab scales that out put to USB. There are many others available.
I KNOW NOTHING ABOUT YOUR WORK BUT I WAS VERY IMPRESSED WITH YOUR SHOP. YOU DID WELL WITH YOUR VIDEO. PLEASE KEEP UP THE VIDEOS I REALLY LIKE WATCHING ALL THE PROCEEDERS. I LIKE THE PROCESSES, ILIKE THINGS IN ORDER TO REACH THE GOAL,FOR THAT IS RETTY LACKING. TODAY THEY JUST WANT A MACHINE TO DO ALL THE NITTY GRITTY AND BLOW IT OUT. THANKS!!
Very interesting process, you have more patience than me
Watching all the videos on this build, The amount of time and attention to detail. It makes me wonder how GM and others mass produced high performance engines back in the day. I would love to see how they put together solid lifter 396 and 427s at the factory on a production schedule.
Easy, they used thicker oil to make up for the high tolerances of their machining. That's why those machines leaked oil.
My biggest dream is to work in a american motor shop , im south african , 26 yrs in automotive eng but you guys just know your stuff , hell ya
Shinano Belt Sander 30 x 540mm Belt
SHINANO SKU: SI2830
I find this tool the best to get into the tight spots while the crank is still in the balancer. It enables you to get into the throw side of the crank and remove weight.
We spot drill the back side of the piston, since you already have a piston vise thats the easiest and fastest way to do. For sand the rods, we use a 2x48 belt on a bench grinder from trick tools
I really can’t give advice only a story back in the 70’s I balanced my Chevy 302 engine using a triple beam and bathroom scale it was a 67 Block ✌🏼
Cool! We need more of this!
Watch Horsepower Academy's video on engine balancing. They go pretty deep on it. Also you should balance the pistons with the rings. You can mix the parts to balance out before removing material.
Once you have the Big Ends all matched, you can work off total weight of the rod to make small end adjustments
Each time you spin, deburr the hole. This little bit will give you a precise number when you spin. Also some of those cast pistons have heavy casting marks, these can also be deburred prior to weight. Keep up the good work. There are some real masters out there.
I used to build racing hemi's. I also flew charters for the auto plants in Detroit mostly bringing in parts for the factories On one occasion I flew a charter to one of glass plants to pick up the oval opera windows used in the Continentals While there I saw a technician polish out a minor scratch in a windshield. When he was done it looked like the scratch never happened. I asked what he had used and he said" it was 10,000 grit jewelers rouge diamond dust impregnated in a cork pad. If you could get some of that and use in the final polish this would eliminate the directional burr on the journal and give a smooth almost mirror finish. We tried this on a hemi crank and under a microscope even with ziglo dye we could not find any indication of a directional burring. Usual the diamond dust can be found at a diamond cutting/polishing supplies known to the jewelry industry. Great video and always enjoyed building engines just enjoyed flying a little more and wound up flying for a major airline until retirement.
I came across this video when surfing RUclips and peaked my interest. I subscribed to your channel and have been binge watching all your videos. One question/statement, you must go through a butt load of detergent in your small spray washer. You wash and rinse a block and/or cyl. head 2-3 times on average it seems. Rinsing them while inside the washer has to dilute the detergent to water ratio quite fast. I do appreciate the thoroughness, very refreshing nowadays. Sad note, I worked in a machine shop for a year in High School before going into the Army. I did all the glass beading for the shop and got to work in the cyl. head department when I had free time. Here’s the sad note, I ruined a pair of small block Chevy 2.02 double hump heads by not drilling out the valve guides perfectly straight. Yikes!!! Fortunately it was in the late 70’s and they were still available. So like I said I appreciate your thoroughness and attention to detail!!!
That's the most common way it's always been done, from what I have seen in shops anyway, that little number eight should rev up like a fire cracker with all that work, just hope the owner knows how to set up the carbs as a new cam shaft needs 2000 rpm for a few minutes to break in, you don't want to do that running lean or having the motor cutting out. Just a thought, do you plan on setting up a dust free room with a inspection plate for precise measurements, if so that would be a great place for the scale to weigh things, doesn't have to be big, just a clean dust free spot in the shop at a stable temp.
We just use a belt sander for all the balancing on rods and pistons, but yeah we have a dedicated belt sander similar to a knife making sander that gives access to the radius part of the belt for sanding into tight areas