I think you can add Akriva (Rexhep Rexhepi), Kerbedanz, R. Gutlier, D. Candaux, and Ludovic Ballouard to that list. Thanks for the always great video :) Merry Xmas, stay safe and healthy
Abdul, there's lots and lots more ... Philippe Dufour, Antoine Prezuzio , Vincent Calabrese ... just getting started. Merry Christmas 🎅 & Happy New Year 🥳 Take care and be safe, Bill😷
Hey Meson, what a kind thing to say. I wish I could give everyone a Philippe Dufour Simplicity, but my wife wouldn't let me... Merry Christmas 🎅 & Happy New Year 🥳 Take care and be safe, Bill😷
Thanks for all the hard work helping to keep us sane in a mad year😁 Merry Xmas and may the new year (and administration ) bring peace and prosperity to you and yours🎅🏽
My pleasure Alan! I think we'll all be stronger in 2021 ... at least according to Nietzsche...who also noted, "Blessed are the forgetful: for they get the better even of their blunders." Merry Christmas 🎅 & Happy New Year 🥳 Take care and be safe, Bill😷
Happy Christmas from the U.K. This year over various lockdowns my knowledge and appreciation of horology has increased tremendously, in most part due to yourself. Many Thanks
Hi Paul, we're all worried about the folks in the UK. By this time next year, I hope we have nothing left of COVID19 except dim memories. Merry Christmas 🎅 & Happy New Year 🥳 Take care and be safe, Bill😷
Thanks for another brilliant video Bill. I hope to add a Gronefeld in 2021. Thanks for helping your subscribers maintain relative sanity during the craziest of years. Best wishes for a merry Christmas and a happy and healthy New Year.
Hey Jeffrey, thanks man. I've been driven to quote Nietzsche, hoping we'll all be stronger in 2021! Nietzsche also said, "Blessed are the forgetful: for they get the better even of their blunders," and according to my wife, I'm very good at that! Merry Christmas 🎅 & Happy New Year 🥳 Take care and be safe, Bill😷
Really well done Bill! Excellent. I agree to disagree: Example :FP Journe is an excellent and great watch. Chanel owns 20% of the company at least. They might own more and Journe (the person) may not be around tomorrow All of the watch companies you mentioned are outstanding but don’t have the heritage or legacy the Holy Trinity Brands do. AP, PP & VC have the brand recognition, stories behind the Brand and have been tested over time. It’s like comparing Harvard, Yale, University of Chicago and Stanford to University of Connecticut, University of Austin, University of Florida and Ohio University. The last four schools are great schools but how many Presidents (of the United States) Supreme Courts Justices or CEOs of Goldman Sachs have the produced! Legacy is Big!! FP Journe and the others you mentioned are great but have no legacy & no club status. Isn’t that a factor of buying a watch? For me it is. The watches you mentioned all have the “Richard Mille Factor”. Another great watch of its peers but let’s see if it lasts the test of time. I don’t think that band will. Nice video mate. Merry Christmas 🎄
I don't agree. I wouldn't put these watches with RM together. For me heritage doesn't matter at all. I am much more willing to support a young passionate watchmaker than a well-known but nothing interesting big brand.
Hey, Tim, legacy is history held together with hyperbole. L. Leroy is a good example. Fabulous history as Leroy worked with Abraham Breguet, made a watch for Marie Antoinette's lover and held the record for most complicated watch from 1900-1989 when Patek Philippe made one more complicated ... and then surpassed by Vacheron Constantin in 2015. That's when I bought an L. Leroy ... it was ticking on an ETA, and the brass at L. Leroy said they didn't know what kind of movement it had! So much for legacy. Quality is quality; skill is skill, and craftsmanship is craftsmanship-with or without legacy. Merry Christmas 🎅 & Happy New Year 🥳 Take care and be safe, Bill😷
@@watchartsci hey Bill. The main issue are these micro brands going to survive after Covid? We shall see. AP we should all thank in the early 70s for keeping the mechanical movement alive. VC the oldest brand in the world will always be around with or without Richmond. I was told that VC wanted go low price (for them) to get the young collector in the 56 collection. It’s a VC! Who knows if a Greubek or Asaoka will be here in 20 years. Yes they a beautiful but what happens if you pass down this watch to next generation and they need service. Holly Trinity are meant to pass down. Stay Safe.
@@TimG-- In my opinion those big brands will get heavier hit by COVID. Many independents still have long waiting lists. Life is short and unexpected. I pretty enjoy independent watchmaking so far and that's enough for me.
Hey Leigh, here's to a shaken' good time in Frakin Gulch! Lots more to outshine the much-loved Holy-T! Merry Christmas 🎅 & Happy New Year 🥳 Take care and be safe, Bill😷
Hey Nowshed, thanks man. It's been a while since the first thing I do is to flip a watch over and look at the workmanship on the back...to me that's where all the information and action is! Merry Christmas 🎅 & Happy New Year 🥳 Take care and be safe, Bill😷
Indeed Koji! I was thinking of adding Masahiro Kikuno and Philippe Dufour to the next list, but I do not know Kikuchi Magakawa. What can you tell me about him? Take care and stay safe, Bill😷
I am very glad to hear that Jacques, and I'm having fun always learning more about watches! Merry Christmas 🎅 & Happy New Year 🥳 Take care and be safe, Bill😷
JR, thank you for adding to some great discussions from a unique perspective that we would not otherwise have had. Merry Christmas 🎅 & Happy New Year 🥳 Take care and be safe, Bill😷
Great video Bill. Good to see so many really great watchmakers working today. Just a pity perfection is so costly! Have a great Christmas and enjoy your self.
There are great watchmakers and great "advertised" brands. They're not always the same. Merry Christmas 🎅 & Happy New Year 🥳 Take care and be safe, Bill😷
Bill, I almost feel guilty benefiting from your expertise! It feels like cheating to learn so much from you after all the research that you’ve done! Keep up the great work, and have a wonderful Christmas!
Bill, this video was (is) a best Christmas present this morning. (well I didn't get anything else:) 😄 But honestly, in my opinion the best watch video here by anyone to date!! Only the best here, and the very best to you!!
Hi Bill, this is a very informative and interesting list and I learned a few new names! It would be great if you may have another list of watch makers above the Holy Trinity but with the condition of having at least one model below $40K. FP Journe and Gronefeld from this list will qualify. De Bethune and Laurent Ferrier offer entry level models that below $40k, but not sure if you would consider them above the Holy Trinity. Would love to see the names you may have for us. Thanks again and take care, Bill!
Yesterday, my Soprod A10, case, dial and hands arrived! Back to watchmaking! And get this, Bill, my dial arrived with 4 'dial dots' ... I think the dial legs are too short...fits in perfectly with that's happened in 2020! Merry Christmas 🎅 & Happy New Year 🥳 Take care and be safe, Bill😷
All magnificent stuff. No doubt about these examples being above the trinity. Would it be pretentious to say fellas like Moser and Laurent Ferrier can be considered superior to the run of the mill trinity watches? Further contenders that very much share the style of Cyrill Brivet-Naudot are Belier and Remi Cools who too make stuff that to me ranks way higher than some mainstream HH watch. There's some stuff that's more out there in terms of design maybe thus making the comparison maybe a bit difficult but holds its ground in terms of finishing like Akrivia, Genus, MB&F, Urwerk, De Bethune, Crayon, Emmanuel Bouchet, Konstantin Chaykin, Thomas Prescher, Haldimann, Ferdinand Berthoud, David Candaux, Valerii Danevych and of course Romain Gautier do show the best watchmaking can be. Ok, I admit, I'm a huge fanboy of the independents which makes the span of what I personally consider superior even larger. Vault who worked with Andreas Streller for example made something so fantastic no PP, AP or VC is nearly as cool as their V1. HYT well, liquid time! I could go on forever 😂. Anyways, Bill I had no idea you had a RUclips channel, thank you RUclips algorithm. Haven't read anything from you in a while in Horology Talk hope you're doing well. Cheers
Someone started zapping me on Horology Talk; so I quit. The High Horology Lounge (FP) has been growing and keeping me busy along with Watch ArtSci ... both over 10,000. However, I'm very glad to hear from you! Take care and be safe, Bill😷
@@watchartsci I am very sorry to hear that 😔 trolls are the worst. I'm happy you found new and exciting projects. I really enjoy your videos especially on the likes of brands mentioned above. Stay safe and kind regards from Switzerland 😊
@@watchartsci Hi Bill, what about Philippe Dufour he must be up there as one of the best watchmakers .And would you have Lange up there with the best ,I think their better than PP ,regards Charlie
Bill, I don't think there is a "Holy Trinity" any more - it is pretty much a "two-horse" race between Patek and A Lange & Sohne. Beyond that, I would add the following to your list - Romain Gauthier (Dufour disciple), De Bethune brand, Christophe Claret, Ludovic Ballouard, Vianney Halter, and Ferdinand Berthoud brand. Happy Holidays.
Hi Jovan, thanks man! As for Jean Dunand, the namesake for the brand is famous for Art Deco works, but just don't see as much from Art Deco Christophe Claret and Thierry Oulevay in the watches they produce-both of whom are legends in their own right. Would I like to have one of their watches? Definitely! They're all one-off and very expensive and are way above the HT! Take care and be safe, Bill😷
Love that Christmas sweater Bill! Merry Christmas to you. Excellent list; I 100% agree with you. Looking forward to your next list. Ps - or is this your Santa list giving the timing of your release on the topic?
Lots of suggestions for another list, MrV! I'd like to see more Asian watchmakers included. Maybe another list for New Years? Take care and stay safe, Bill😷
Bill. Merry Christmas. Maybe a subject you can answer in a video. How in-house is in-house, aren’t they just a variation on a theme - after all they all have a balance wheel, main spring and escapement plus wheel train, crown wheel and crown?
Thank you Gunther, and I like "Tswhy Guhzicht" ... if I say it enough time (and my wife doesn't hit me with a frying pan for being a pest) I can learn it! Merry Christmas 🎅 & Happy New Year 🥳 Take care and be safe, Bill😷
I'm interested in anyone's opinion as I don't have much knowledge in the ultra luxury high end realm of watches beyond a little reading and RUclips videos but it would seem among Patek,V.C., A.P., and I'll include A. Lange and JLC that they all make watches in the $10k to $50k range that are excellent but for lack of better phrasing below high end independents. But then they also make very high end $100,000 plus watches in very limited quantities that would seem in every imaginable way on par with any independent watch except for production numbers. Something like the Patek 5270P or Vacheron Traditionnelle twin beat perpetual calendar, would they be considered roughly equal to the watches in this video or is a clear distinction made because independents use more old craft style techniques and fewer hands touch the watch being made? All of these watches are way beyond my ability to afford but they are fascinating in regards to the work and craft that goes into them.
In appreciation of your continuing contribution to the advancement of general watch knowledge and graciousness among people interested in the hobby of horology. Merry Christmas to you and the Sanders clan.
As a source of discussion, Howard, you've added a great deal of knowledge, wisdom and whimsy to the interchange of comments on Watch ArtSci, and I, and others, are most grateful. Merry Christmas 🎅 & Happy New Year 🥳 Take care and be safe, Bill😷
To be honest , I am not convinced about holy trinity in watchmaking because it only limit the other companies who are doing well more than old continuous watch companies thus VC , AP , PP. When I look to the watch I like to see movement and style ; hands; dial .
Merry Christmas Bill. May Santa fill your Christmas tree with Parmigianis, F.P. Journes, and many Daniel Roths, and if not, at least leave a good sweater. Perhaps, and following the Christian spirit of the date, it should be the Holy Trinity and the 12 Apostles. It's not fair to leave pieces like the ones you mentioned out of watchmaking heaven.
Hey Oscar, we also need to get other religions involved; they've got lots of leaders! Broaden the borders of "watch collector heaven!" Merry Christmas 🎅 & Happy New Year 🥳 Take care and be safe, Bill😷
I would have put parmigiani fleurier on this list. They are probably the best finished watches in the world right now. I would say it is a more complete watch than say a FPJ. FPJ has been more about technical mastery anyways.
I agree, Ivan, some models clearly are. Their Ovale and Rattrapante are way up there. Their standard Kalpas and Tondas are extremely well made and undervalued. Take care and be safe, Bill😷
All things considered the holy trinity is really about the heritage not really about the watches. It’s like marrying a Kennedy. Does it really matter what he or she looks like?
Hi Bill, you’ve got the top four holy trinity watches ,but our local AP dealer flew 8 of us the the factory in le Brassus and we stayed in there hotel ,one of the guys was picking up his watch which was being fixed it was an AP ,I saw him 6 months later at a Rolex night and he showed me a more expensive model that the dealer sold him and they couldn’tfix the watch property and he had to pay the difference which I thought was bad ,it would put me off AP .Would you put Lange above PP ,what’s your thoughts,I know I would , thanks 🙏
@@charlieboylol527 Different models of Patek I'd prefer to A. Lange & Söhn and vice versa. Both are great watchmakers, but I'd rather have a watch by Marco Lang-either from Lang & Heyne or Marco Lang Watches.. Take care and be safe, Bill
@@watchartsci I take the German watches are your favourite,are they really expensive, I’ve had a look on their website and they look great , I like the Johann in Rose gold black dial Thanks
@@watchartsci Bill ,I’ve looked a video at Lang & Heyne and what workmanship,you’ve certainly opened my eyes on sublime watch makers ,just to have something that is very unique and not many people having one is great ,maybe one day lol , thanks again 🙏
I think you can add Akriva (Rexhep Rexhepi), Kerbedanz, R. Gutlier, D. Candaux, and Ludovic Ballouard to that list.
Thanks for the always great video :) Merry Xmas, stay safe and healthy
Abdul, there's lots and lots more ... Philippe Dufour, Antoine Prezuzio , Vincent Calabrese ... just getting started. Merry Christmas 🎅 & Happy New Year 🥳 Take care and be safe, Bill😷
Merry Christmas to you and yours, Bill.
What a great vid. It's like a Christmas present to us all. Thank you so much.
Hey Meson, what a kind thing to say. I wish I could give everyone a Philippe Dufour Simplicity, but my wife wouldn't let me... Merry Christmas 🎅 & Happy New Year 🥳 Take care and be safe, Bill😷
Great video and excellent examples as always. Merry Christmas 🎄 Bill. Be well and stay safe.
Hey Bruce, thanks man! Merry Christmas 🎅 & Happy New Year 🥳 Take care and be safe, Bill😷
Merry Christmas Dr. Sanders. Thanks for an interesting watch topic. Take care.
The pleasure is all mine Chris! Merry Christmas 🎅 & Happy New Year 🥳 Take care and be safe, Bill😷
great selection, as always.
Happy Christmas, Bill. I wish and your family all the best :)
Hey Geezer, thanks man! Merry Christmas 🎅 & Happy New Year 🥳 Take care and be safe, Bill😷
Hey Geezer, thanks man! Always great to hear from you! Merry Christmas 🎅 & Happy New Year 🥳 Take care and be safe, Bill😷
Thanks for all the hard work helping to keep us sane in a mad year😁 Merry Xmas and may the new year (and administration ) bring peace and prosperity to you and yours🎅🏽
My pleasure Alan! I think we'll all be stronger in 2021 ... at least according to Nietzsche...who also noted, "Blessed are the forgetful: for they get the better even of their blunders." Merry Christmas 🎅 & Happy New Year 🥳 Take care and be safe, Bill😷
Happy Christmas from the U.K. This year over various lockdowns my knowledge and appreciation of horology has increased tremendously, in most part due to yourself. Many Thanks
Hi Paul, we're all worried about the folks in the UK. By this time next year, I hope we have nothing left of COVID19 except dim memories. Merry Christmas 🎅 & Happy New Year 🥳 Take care and be safe, Bill😷
Thanks for another brilliant video Bill. I hope to add a Gronefeld in 2021. Thanks for helping your subscribers maintain relative sanity during the craziest of years. Best wishes for a merry Christmas and a happy and healthy New Year.
Hey Jeffrey, thanks man. I've been driven to quote Nietzsche, hoping we'll all be stronger in 2021! Nietzsche also said, "Blessed are the forgetful: for they get the better even of their blunders," and according to my wife, I'm very good at that! Merry Christmas 🎅 & Happy New Year 🥳 Take care and be safe, Bill😷
Really well done Bill! Excellent.
I agree to disagree:
Example :FP Journe is an excellent and great watch. Chanel owns 20% of the company at least. They might own more and Journe (the person) may not be around tomorrow
All of the watch companies you mentioned are outstanding but don’t have the heritage or legacy the Holy Trinity Brands do. AP, PP & VC
have the brand recognition, stories behind the Brand and have been tested over time. It’s like comparing Harvard, Yale, University of Chicago and Stanford to University of Connecticut, University of Austin, University of Florida and Ohio University. The last four schools are great schools but how many Presidents (of the United States) Supreme Courts Justices or CEOs of Goldman Sachs have the produced! Legacy is Big!! FP Journe and the others you mentioned are great but have no legacy & no club status. Isn’t that a factor of buying a watch? For me it is. The watches you mentioned all have the “Richard Mille Factor”. Another great watch of its peers but let’s see if it lasts the test of time. I don’t think that band will.
Nice video mate.
Merry Christmas 🎄
I don't agree. I wouldn't put these watches with RM together. For me heritage doesn't matter at all. I am much more willing to support a young passionate watchmaker than a well-known but nothing interesting big brand.
Hey, Tim, legacy is history held together with hyperbole. L. Leroy is a good example. Fabulous history as Leroy worked with Abraham Breguet, made a watch for Marie Antoinette's lover and held the record for most complicated watch from 1900-1989 when Patek Philippe made one more complicated ... and then surpassed by Vacheron Constantin in 2015. That's when I bought an L. Leroy ... it was ticking on an ETA, and the brass at L. Leroy said they didn't know what kind of movement it had! So much for legacy. Quality is quality; skill is skill, and craftsmanship is craftsmanship-with or without legacy. Merry Christmas 🎅 & Happy New Year 🥳 Take care and be safe, Bill😷
@@watchartsci hey Bill. The main issue are these micro brands going to survive after Covid? We shall see. AP we should all thank in the early 70s for keeping the mechanical movement alive. VC the oldest brand in the world will always be around with or without Richmond. I was told that VC wanted go low price (for them) to get the young collector in the 56 collection. It’s a VC! Who knows if a Greubek or Asaoka will be here in 20 years. Yes they a beautiful but what happens if you pass down this watch to next generation and they need service. Holly Trinity are meant to pass down. Stay Safe.
@@leyay7540 see my comment to Bill. After Covid we will see if these micro brands are around still.
@@TimG-- In my opinion those big brands will get heavier hit by COVID. Many independents still have long waiting lists.
Life is short and unexpected. I pretty enjoy independent watchmaking so far and that's enough for me.
Great video and look forward to your next in this vane.
Hey Leigh, here's to a shaken' good time in Frakin Gulch! Lots more to outshine the much-loved Holy-T! Merry Christmas 🎅 & Happy New Year 🥳 Take care and be safe, Bill😷
I just loved this video. Mass watches doesn't excite me anymore. The goal is now to have a great watch rather than twenty watches. Thanks!
Hey Nowshed, thanks man. It's been a while since the first thing I do is to flip a watch over and look at the workmanship on the back...to me that's where all the information and action is! Merry Christmas 🎅 & Happy New Year 🥳 Take care and be safe, Bill😷
Merry Christmas Bill and everyone of your fans.
Beautiful watches on Christmas morning. Thank you.
The pleasure is mine, Phil. Merry Christmas 🎅 & Happy New Year 🥳 Take care and be safe, Bill😷
Thanks for another learning experience. You are possibly the most knowledgeable person I know when it comes to all things horological. Merry Xmas!
Hey Cirrus, thanks man! It's my pleasure. Merry Christmas 🎅 & Happy New Year 🥳 Take care and be safe, Bill😷
I would add Philippe Dufour and Kikuchi Nagakawa; great video!
Indeed Koji! I was thinking of adding Masahiro Kikuno and Philippe Dufour to the next list, but I do not know Kikuchi Magakawa. What can you tell me about him? Take care and stay safe, Bill😷
@@watchartsci No personal experience, sadly, but very fine in-house finishing imo, and micro-rotor Vaucher Fleurier movements
Merry Christmas Bill. Thanks for the videos, I’m always learning something new watching them.
I am very glad to hear that Jacques, and I'm having fun always learning more about watches! Merry Christmas 🎅 & Happy New Year 🥳 Take care and be safe, Bill😷
What, what no Rolex? Just kidding! This is one hell of a good video.
Merry Christmas to you & better half
Ooops! It’s frying pan time😉
Hey John! Whoops ... forgot Rolex! Merry Christmas 🎅 & Happy New Year 🥳 Take care and be safe, Bill😷
Merry Christmas and Happy New Year. Your wonderful videos have been a gift that keeps on giving. Thanks for the education and entertainment. Cheers
JR, thank you for adding to some great discussions from a unique perspective that we would not otherwise have had. Merry Christmas 🎅 & Happy New Year 🥳 Take care and be safe, Bill😷
Hi Bill, Merry Christmas & thanks for being a great gift, your humble subscriber, Marc!
My pleasure Marc! Hope you had a great Christmas! 🎅 Take care and be safe, Bill😷
Merry Christmas Bill!
Thanks Break Time! Merry Christmas 🎅 & Happy New Year 🥳 Take care and be safe, Bill😷
Great video Bill. Good to see so many really great watchmakers working today. Just a pity perfection is so costly! Have a great Christmas and enjoy your self.
There are great watchmakers and great "advertised" brands. They're not always the same. Merry Christmas 🎅 & Happy New Year 🥳 Take care and be safe, Bill😷
Hi Bill, I agree with you. They are all above the Holy Trinity. Thank you for sharing.
They're in line with what I consider 'exceptional,' Eugene. Take care, Bill
Bill, I almost feel guilty benefiting from your expertise! It feels like cheating to learn so much from you after all the research that you’ve done! Keep up the great work, and have a wonderful Christmas!
Robert, learning about watches is a hobby, and like all hobbies I do it for fun! Merry Christmas 🎅 & Happy New Year 🥳 Take care and be safe, Bill😷
What a nice surprise on this Christmas Day! Thanks Dr. Sanders.
My Pleasure Khai! Take care and be safe, Bill😷
Great video I learned a lot. Also happy holidays
Thanks Joshua! Merry Christmas 🎅 & Happy New Year 🥳 Take care and be safe, Bill😷
Bill, this video was (is) a best Christmas present this morning. (well I didn't get anything else:) 😄 But honestly, in my opinion the best watch video here by anyone to date!! Only the best here, and the very best to you!!
Very happy to hear Brett! I've also got the best subscribers! Merry Christmas 🎅 & Happy New Year 🥳 Take care and be safe, Bill😷
Always informative.......Thank you and happy holidays~~!!!
Thanks Chin-Hwan! Merry Christmas 🎅 & Happy New Year 🥳 Take care and be safe, Bill😷
Hi Bill, this is a very informative and interesting list and I learned a few new names! It would be great if you may have another list of watch makers above the Holy Trinity but with the condition of having at least one model below $40K. FP Journe and Gronefeld from this list will qualify. De Bethune and Laurent Ferrier offer entry level models that below $40k, but not sure if you would consider them above the Holy Trinity. Would love to see the names you may have for us. Thanks again and take care, Bill!
Henry, I like that idea. Grönefeld have entry levels under $30k, but I'd like to include more. Take care and stay safe,Bill😷
@@watchartsci Thanks Bill and I look forward to your list:) Stay healthy and happy holidays!
Have a Merry Christmas Bill.
Yesterday, my Soprod A10, case, dial and hands arrived! Back to watchmaking! And get this, Bill, my dial arrived with 4 'dial dots' ... I think the dial legs are too short...fits in perfectly with that's happened in 2020! Merry Christmas 🎅 & Happy New Year 🥳 Take care and be safe, Bill😷
Again Merry Christmas , I like very much your deers ! There are free rides in this world one exemple is intellectual joy!!!Cheers
Hi Alex, we also have deer who visit our backyard ... all year round! Merry Christmas 🎅 & Happy New Year 🥳 Take care and be safe, Bill😷
Merry Christmas 🎅 Bill 🎄 Beautiful watches thanks for showing us Stay Safe 😷
Hey Junior, thanks man! Merry Christmas 🎅 & Happy New Year 🥳 Take care and be safe, Bill😷
All magnificent stuff. No doubt about these examples being above the trinity. Would it be pretentious to say fellas like Moser and Laurent Ferrier can be considered superior to the run of the mill trinity watches? Further contenders that very much share the style of Cyrill Brivet-Naudot are Belier and Remi Cools who too make stuff that to me ranks way higher than some mainstream HH watch. There's some stuff that's more out there in terms of design maybe thus making the comparison maybe a bit difficult but holds its ground in terms of finishing like Akrivia, Genus, MB&F, Urwerk, De Bethune, Crayon, Emmanuel Bouchet, Konstantin Chaykin, Thomas Prescher, Haldimann, Ferdinand Berthoud, David Candaux, Valerii Danevych and of course Romain Gautier do show the best watchmaking can be. Ok, I admit, I'm a huge fanboy of the independents which makes the span of what I personally consider superior even larger. Vault who worked with Andreas Streller for example made something so fantastic no PP, AP or VC is nearly as cool as their V1. HYT well, liquid time! I could go on forever 😂. Anyways, Bill I had no idea you had a RUclips channel, thank you RUclips algorithm. Haven't read anything from you in a while in Horology Talk hope you're doing well.
Cheers
Someone started zapping me on Horology Talk; so I quit. The High Horology Lounge (FP) has been growing and keeping me busy along with Watch ArtSci ... both over 10,000. However, I'm very glad to hear from you! Take care and be safe, Bill😷
@@watchartsci I am very sorry to hear that 😔 trolls are the worst. I'm happy you found new and exciting projects. I really enjoy your videos especially on the likes of brands mentioned above. Stay safe and kind regards from Switzerland 😊
Thx Bill, great content. I am looking forward to the next list of 10. Meanwhile, Merry Christmas, and stay safe.
Hi FFA, me too, but I'll bet there's still more! Merry Christmas 🎅 & Happy New Year 🥳 Take care and be safe, Bill😷
Bill,another splendid video ,it’s great that you go with all these great makers of fine watches ,thanks
Hey Charlieboy, thanks man! Wishing you a Happy New Year! 🥳 Take care and stay safe,Bill😷
@@watchartsci Hi Bill, what about Philippe Dufour he must be up there as one of the best watchmakers .And would you have Lange up there with the best ,I think their better than PP ,regards Charlie
@@charlieboylol527 Indeed, Dufour would be there. There are more! Take care and stay safe,Bill😷
Bill, I don't think there is a "Holy Trinity" any more - it is pretty much a "two-horse" race between Patek and A Lange & Sohne. Beyond that, I would add the following to your list - Romain Gauthier (Dufour disciple), De Bethune brand, Christophe Claret, Ludovic Ballouard, Vianney Halter, and Ferdinand Berthoud brand. Happy Holidays.
Hi SouthNc, I need to extend the list! Merry Christmas 🎅 & Happy New Year 🥳 Take care and be safe, Bill😷
Very interesting video Merry Christmas Bill!
Glad you liked it Dominick! Merry Christmas 🎅 & Happy New Year 🥳 Take care and be safe, Bill😷
Nice video Bill! What do you think about Jean Dunand watches?
Hi Jovan, thanks man! As for Jean Dunand, the namesake for the brand is famous for Art Deco works, but just don't see as much from Art Deco Christophe Claret and Thierry Oulevay in the watches they produce-both of whom are legends in their own right. Would I like to have one of their watches? Definitely! They're all one-off and very expensive and are way above the HT! Take care and be safe, Bill😷
Love that Christmas sweater Bill! Merry Christmas to you. Excellent list; I 100% agree with you. Looking forward to your next list.
Ps - or is this your Santa list giving the timing of your release on the topic?
Lots of suggestions for another list, MrV! I'd like to see more Asian watchmakers included. Maybe another list for New Years? Take care and stay safe, Bill😷
Bill. Merry Christmas. Maybe a subject you can answer in a video. How in-house is in-house, aren’t they just a variation on a theme - after all they all have a balance wheel, main spring and escapement plus wheel train, crown wheel and crown?
Hi Light! I've wondered about that myself ... they're all copies of Breguet! Merry Christmas 🎅 & Happy New Year 🥳 Take care and be safe, Bill😷
Hi Bill Merry Christmas. I would pronounce it Tswhy Guhzicht. The German language is tough enough for the Germans let alone anyone else.
Thank you Gunther, and I like "Tswhy Guhzicht" ... if I say it enough time (and my wife doesn't hit me with a frying pan for being a pest) I can learn it! Merry Christmas 🎅 & Happy New Year 🥳 Take care and be safe, Bill😷
Beautiful stuff, Bill! Thanks for sharing.
As always the pleasure is mine, Matt! Take care and be safe, Bill😷
👍 Merry Christmas Bill. Ciao da Roma. 👍✋👋
Great to hear from you Domenico! Merry Christmas 🎅 & Happy New Year 🥳 Take care and be safe, Bill😷
WOW! Such a Christmas treat. Thank you.
The pleasure is all mine MindFire!Merry Christmas 🎅 & Happy New Year 🥳 Take care and be safe, Bill😷
I'm interested in anyone's opinion as I don't have much knowledge in the ultra luxury high end realm of watches beyond a little reading and RUclips videos but it would seem among Patek,V.C., A.P., and I'll include A. Lange and JLC that they all make watches in the $10k to $50k range that are excellent but for lack of better phrasing below high end independents. But then they also make very high end $100,000 plus watches in very limited quantities that would seem in every imaginable way on par with any independent watch except for production numbers. Something like the Patek 5270P or Vacheron Traditionnelle twin beat perpetual calendar, would they be considered roughly equal to the watches in this video or is a clear distinction made because independents use more old craft style techniques and fewer hands touch the watch being made? All of these watches are way beyond my ability to afford but they are fascinating in regards to the work and craft that goes into them.
Find the price you like and find good buys in that range. Take care and stay safe, Bill😷
In appreciation of your continuing contribution to the advancement of general watch knowledge and graciousness among people interested in the hobby of horology. Merry Christmas to you and the Sanders clan.
As a source of discussion, Howard, you've added a great deal of knowledge, wisdom and whimsy to the interchange of comments on Watch ArtSci, and I, and others, are most grateful. Merry Christmas 🎅 & Happy New Year 🥳 Take care and be safe, Bill😷
Merry christmas Bill!
Thanks Alexander! Merry Christmas 🎅 & Happy New Year 🥳 Take care and be safe, Bill😷
Merry Christmas Bill, how did you get a hold on my Xmas wish list?
Yes, Hannes and I forwarded it to Santa Claus at the North Pole! Merry Christmas 🎅 & Happy New Year 🥳 Take care and be safe, Bill😷
No peterman Bedat ? 😂 happy holidays
PD needs to be added, Marcus! Just getting started! Merry Christmas 🎅 & Happy New Year 🥳 Take care and be safe, Bill😷
Merry Christmas, Bill!
And to you Gary, Merry Christmas 🎅 & Happy New Year 🥳 Take care and be safe, Bill😷
Nice sweater. Merry Christmas 🎁🎄
Thanks Paul! Hope you had a great Christmas, and wishing you a Happy New Year!🥳 Take care and stay safe,Bill😷
To be honest , I am not convinced about holy trinity in watchmaking because it only limit the other companies who are doing well more than old continuous watch companies thus VC , AP , PP. When I look to the watch I like to see movement and style ; hands; dial .
What's your favorite watch and watch company Mohamed? Take care and be safe, Bill😷
@@watchartsci some of Breguet watches , all de Bethune watches and a little of VC and there is a room in future for good watches.
Merry Christmas 🎄 from Scotland
Hope you had a great Christmas Charlieboy! Wishing you a Happy New Year! 🥳 Take care and stay safe,Bill😷
Hi Bill, hope you had a nice Christmas! HMoser is not in this list? May be on your next? Take care.
Hi Vik, H. Moser et Cie is a favorite of mine, but this first list was one of identifiable watchmakers. Take care and be safe, Bill😷
Mery Christmas 🎄🎄🎄🎄🎄🎄
Hey David, thanks man! Merry Christmas 🎅 & Happy New Year 🥳 Take care and be safe, Bill😷
Such beautiful and interesting pieces!
Hey Ced, thanks man! Happy New Year 🥳 Take care and stay safe,Bill😷
Merry Christmas Bill.
May Santa fill your Christmas tree with Parmigianis, F.P. Journes, and many Daniel Roths, and if not, at least leave a good sweater.
Perhaps, and following the Christian spirit of the date, it should be the Holy Trinity and the 12 Apostles. It's not fair to leave pieces like the ones you mentioned out of watchmaking heaven.
Hey Oscar, we also need to get other religions involved; they've got lots of leaders! Broaden the borders of "watch collector heaven!" Merry Christmas 🎅 & Happy New Year 🥳 Take care and be safe, Bill😷
I would have put parmigiani fleurier on this list. They are probably the best finished watches in the world right now. I would say it is a more complete watch than say a FPJ. FPJ has been more about technical mastery anyways.
I agree, Ivan, some models clearly are. Their Ovale and Rattrapante are way up there. Their standard Kalpas and Tondas are extremely well made and undervalued. Take care and be safe, Bill😷
I would buy a tonda or kalpa over a calatrava or a royal oak. The royal oak has been Invictaed to horrible levels. Its the opiate for the masses.
Lovely watches ,i bought a new watch PaM 1033it’s nice 👍,thanks
What's the movement in the PAM 1035? Take care and stay safe,Bill😷
@@watchartsci hi Bill sorry it was the Pam1033 the movement is p9011,thanks
My first question is: when they need maintenance or repair, what do you do?
Hi Tom, I sent both of my F.P. Journes to their service center in Miami-overhaul and service. Take care and be safe! Bill 😷
What do you think about Brexei
I really like the Dignitas Pure, but Brexei is just another brand I cannot afford Tiborcsercsa... Take care, Bill
@@watchartsci I can't afford it either,I just like it everything is handmade,Bill you are the best
Merry Xmas!!!
Hey Benny, Merry Christmas 🎅 & Happy New Year 🥳 Take care and be safe, Bill😷
All things considered the holy trinity is really about the heritage not really about the watches.
It’s like marrying a Kennedy. Does it really matter what he or she looks like?
And their "Swiss-ness" Ivan. They are excellent watches on the whole, though. Take care and be safe, Bill 😷
@@watchartsci AP can be accused of whoring itself out to the masses but VC and PP seem to be holding on to their chastity.
Take it easy brother.
the Langis called 'Zweigesicht' which is german for 2 faces
Yes, that's correct Bruno....now if I only could pronounce it correctly. Take care and stay safe, Bill😷
Stay safe 🙏
Will do! And you as well Charlieboy!
Hi Bill, you’ve got the top four holy trinity watches ,but our local AP dealer flew 8 of us the the factory in le Brassus and we stayed in there hotel ,one of the guys was picking up his watch which was being fixed it was an AP ,I saw him 6 months later at a Rolex night and he showed me a more expensive model that the dealer sold him and they couldn’tfix the watch property and he had to pay the difference which I thought was bad ,it would put me off AP .Would you put Lange above PP ,what’s your thoughts,I know I would , thanks 🙏
@@charlieboylol527 Different models of Patek I'd prefer to A. Lange & Söhn and vice versa. Both are great watchmakers, but I'd rather have a watch by Marco Lang-either from Lang & Heyne or Marco Lang Watches.. Take care and be safe, Bill
@@watchartsci I take the German watches are your favourite,are they really expensive, I’ve had a look on their website and they look great , I like the Johann in Rose gold black dial
Thanks
@@watchartsci Bill ,I’ve looked a video at Lang & Heyne and what workmanship,you’ve certainly opened my eyes on sublime watch makers ,just to have something that is very unique and not many people having one is great ,maybe one day lol , thanks again 🙏
:)
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