No Power on a £300 Ministry of Sound Bluetooth Wi-Fi SPEAKER - Trying to FIX
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- Опубликовано: 10 сен 2024
- Here we have a Ministry of Sound Audio L Plus sent in by a viewer. This speaker was £300 when first released. I was surprised it was so expensive.
It has no power, can it be fixed?
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Remember that this is just for entertainment and I am not an expert in these repairs. The processes in the video may not be the best way, the correct way or the safest way to fix these things. I do love fault finding and trying to fix broken things, so I hope that comes across in this 'Trying to FIX' series. Many thanks, Vince.
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Spoiler Saver & Riddle
Riddle: Read the following and work out what it is... My 1st letter is in apple but not once in tart. My 2nd letter is in liver but not in heart. My 3rd letter is in giant and also in ghost. Whole I am best when I am roast??????
What is a pig for 100 alex.
@ 🤣
Feeling all clever I went to answer this and found that it's already been answered. Darn.
Damned work getting in the way of my riddle solving. Ah well, well done Craig 🐖
Keep up the good work Vince and stay safe.
Darn, another one I didn't get on my own. Maybe I'll know the answer to one of these one day...
Awesome again Vince! I love these longer videos where you just don't want to give up. It's hard to walk away when you're so invested but this shows that persistence pays. Well done 👏
Thank you Phil 👍
It's been hit with a high voltage event of some sort. The TVS diode did its job and clamped the rail but couldn't absorb all the energy and so failed short (as they are designed to).
The shorted TVS caused a high current to be drawn cracking the NTC before the slow blow fuse finally blew.
There's been a lot of lightning around recently, the flashover mark on the leadout of that diode is classic!
P6KE200A has a breakdown voltage of 200V. It is not put directly on the primary DC voltage (which is more than 300V), but is instead used to protect the switching circuit/oscillator. The NTC crack is likely not caused by the diode failure. At 10:46 you can see that the TVS diode is not parallel over the large cap.
This is why switch mode power supplies are garbage. Manufacturers use this garbage to add in a higher failure rate to their products.
Vince, you are a man a lot like myself. I repair all manner of things for friends and family as a hobby, it's amazing what you can learn when you get into the nitty gritty of electronics failures. I do work professionally in a hospital repairing equipment, but I seldom go down to component level as it is not deemed necessary or cost effective.
But definitely addictive doing the kinds of things you and I do. Sometimes I am nearly shouting at the screen telling you how to do or measure things and the next thing you have it sussed and sorted. Keep up the good work buddy!
It's rarely just a blown fuse. Good job finding the fault. 👍
Cheers Paul 👍
well done vince i have been fixing electronics for over 50 years and i find SMPS are a pain with no circuit diagrams.
we live in such a throw away society nowadays thats its so nice to see you fixing things that others would throw out ... i found a HP laptop once that was only a battery problem a person had left it on top of a recycling bin for the bin men to collect ... .. fixed it and its works perfect ..
I was sick today (still am but doing much better) and when i saw you're notification it made my day! Thank you for taking your time and effort to make these videos! Not only are they enjoyable but i learn from them! Thanks to you a few days ago i tried for my first time ever fault finding on a board with my multimeter unfortunately i couldn't find anything it was too complex but I'm sure in a few months i will get much better thanks to you! I've learned so much watching your videos I'm only an ordinary guy who's 16 years old and everyone in my neighborhood and all of my friends say that I'm smart i just want to thank you i really appreciate your time put into these videos! ❤❤
I felt this was something I could see myself giving up on. I get to worried with power supplies. Very cool to see you push through and finish!
Well done. I rigged up a 10K 1 watt resistor on two crocodile clips, so that I could short across the smoothing capacitor and discharge it more quickly. I'm sure someone has suggested this before..
Hi Vince, as a rule it’s best to check diodes with one leg lifted out of the board.
Those books you needed from the begining. A varistor is between neutral and live and start shorts when voltage is over certain value, a negative thermistor is conected in series on live terminal and start with high value and when get warm {is loaded} drops its value. SMPS are very advanced devices. With the help of the fast swithing element, the input voltage is chopped by shorting a low resistance primary coil of the impulse transformer to input power terminals. That cause storing of energy into the transformer's primary coil called EMF {Electro Motive Force} with high current and get transfered by an induction in secondary coil. If a fault in SMPS occurs - the whole unit failing safe, oscillation is stopped and PWM controller get turned off. Unlike the regular iron core transformers, impulse transformers have ferrite core and need high frequency to be able to sustain induction but the plus is that their size is small but power eficiency on such PSU can get to 95% for compare with iron core - arround 60-80%. High frequency = better eficiency
Your switching power supply is regulated by changing the duty cycle of the primary winding of your transformer. A small chip or oscillator is responsible for this switching (so the changing of duty cycle). Normally this small chip/oscillaror is fed via a secondary winding of the transformer. It uses only a few volt. But at startup the transformer is not working yet because the chip is not yet working, so the chip/oscillator gets no supply power. Therefore at startup the chip/oscillator needs to get its power from somewhere else. It get its power from directly the primary DC voltage, which is very high. To drop the voltage the chip is fed via a large resistor (33K ohm in your supply) with in series with the chip/oscillator. The TVS diode is like a zener diode, it cuts of voltage spikes which might damage the chip/oscillator. The fault is not very common. Good find. (The NTC is there to limit the inrush current to the large cap, as high currents might damage the cap or bridge rectifier.)
Thanks for the write up Kris 👍👍
Thanks to the shout-outs, I will never forget the names Kip Hakes and Max Rockatansky! 😎👍
We here in the U.S. are daZzled and impressed with your use of 240VAC. ShOcK & AWE voltages. Just saying. Cheers!
Outstanding solution sir finding a working speaker and checking between the two.
Dented in speaker centres - I fixed this once by the simple means of putting the end of a cardboard tube over the centre and sucking! I didn't expect it to work, but it did.
....... My Wife does that !
Nice to see he got the ifixit kit!
I wonder if it was a power surge that took out the parts.
Brilliant video thank you very much indeed
Knowledge is power mate you have gained invaluable experience keep up the good work
When i watch your videos , i become very very happy
Hi Vince excellent video your fault finding skills are getting really impressive . I think sometimes you just have to go with your gut and persevere . If you had discovered the pass through USB ports earlier on you wouldn't have needed to order a second unit . Sometimes the circuit boards are not as clever as you think . Keep making the great videos !
The "cones" in the middle are dust covers for the driver/voice coil. I don't think it affects the sound, but it still sucks because its an eyesore when they're dented. Sometimes they're easy enough to remove maybe with a little heat and you can push them back out or put on new ones
This troubleshooting was really well done. One thing you might want to try to do is sketch out the circuit where you saw the fault and stare at why it would read as a short? It’s part of the buck converter where they have tuned the resistors and capacitors to get the 18V output. The diode I think is part of the buck circuitry.
Hello to ALL on the Planet~E and Beyond! Thanks for the 'typed' input on component info.
All those parts; I didn't get what said . . . lol - but Now You have those BOOKS that Can always be Read.
28:45 - the term you are looking for is marshalling, it's a way to keep cabling neat and of course keeps the board count down.
I cannot believe something that simple actually worked🙄🤣❤️
Impressive construction. Thanks for the video.
That Thermistor is probably there to shunt excess current away to protect the rest of the circuit. Ideally you should have replaced that before powering on.
Its a Varistor.
Enjoyed the video vince I was scared to lift my phone incase I touched a compasitor😂😂😂 so engrossed,keep em coming vince that's why I subscribe 🎉🎉🎉
Dude, make a series board which consists of a 100w or so incandescent bulb serially connected with a socket to the power source. You connect any device to that socket and if it is shorted, the bulb glows else it stays off. With this you will be safe from electrical hazards.
👍
Vince please read that comment. I think that you should buy CAT S60 smartphone with build-in FLIR thermal camera, short will be found in seconds and this phone is super cheap in used condition. Worth every penny.
Thanks Solve, I checked on eBay and they seem to be as expensive as a FLIR camera on the listings right now in the UK. I've have been considering a FLIR camera for a while. I will also look out for this CAT S60 to see if any cheaper ones are listed. Thank you 👍
@@Mymatevince i bought my unit for about 100£. Best place to look is Facebook Marketplace / local Craigslist. And you are right, I check right now and for about 100£ you can buy FLIR One for Android attachment at Ebay, so I feel like it will be better deal than CAT S60. In my country ( Poland) I was checking for like half year to buy any FLIR in used condition but nobody sell that stuff here, so CAT S60 was only option for me :) BTW: Maybe hunt for broken unit, that would be cool trying to fix video!
Great video as always, glad you fixed it !
When I take appart stuff like thta with multiple similar connectors, I use different colored sharpies and mark both side of them before unplugging, so I know straight up where they go back.
I wait all the day for one of your amazing videos
Hello my mate vince your videos are amazing and you really good at fixing things and you are so funny 😆 and your description is amazing too
Very well done vince 👍😊 brilliant fix
Thank you Jinxy 👍
@@Mymatevince Your welcome buddy
It shows you get better at fixing stuff, for sure.
That looks exceptionally built
awesome repair once again Vince :) well nice to see the fault finding :) shame you had to get another to do this but it did help you find what was wrong so its all good :)
Lovely Vince. Cracking job as always buddy. I admire your perseverance!!
Thanks Wayne 👍👍
Cool video mate . i Wish i had the patients & knowledge to try and fix my car stereo amp..
Thank you, had the same problem this summer i believe but i had warranty and did not chance on me fixing it, and now i know i did the right thing! That was hard even for you ;)
Great work hope you get one of them sold or do they work in sterio, some do.
Thanks Anders, I think these can work in stereo. I have sent the original back to the owner, so I just have the one now 👍
A method to fault find on SM power supplies that works quite well, is to put a low wattage incandescent bulb in series with the power supply line (as a current limiter).
I do believe that method to be more commonly use in old vacuum electronics, it still wouldn't have helped in this case as it was a direct short throw the diodes. BTW have you ever tried to light a Incandescent light bulb with a step mode PWS lol old light bulbs don't really like the high frequency of step modes they like the nice smooth slow 50 - 60 hz sinusoidal wave lol
@@patprop74 Point taken. In this specific case it would not help the diagnostics. If you have a fault that is not detectable with a DVM (low voltage), like a transformer internal short or other components that leaks or arcs over at mains voltage, it helps a lot to put a "cheap self indicating current limiter" in your mains supply line. It also stops me from closing my eyes and switching on the power with a long dowel :-) .
An interesting and informative RUclips channel on Switch Mode Power Supplies "DiodeGoneWild". PS. I could not care if the bulb likes it or not, it works LOL.
Really enjoyed that, wish I knew how to use my multi meter with your proficiency 🤣. Nice speakers and awesome fix.
Thanks Dorian 👍👍
Awesome stuff, Vince! I think this is the Audio L plus? I've had an Audio S before and the sound quality is pretty decent. They seem to be solidly built too! 👍
Yes it is the Audio L Plus Steve. Cheers mate 👍
Great well done Vince once again 👍👍👍👍👍
A varistor is an electronic component with an electrical resistance that varies with the applied voltage. Also known as a voltage-dependent resistor (VDR), it has a nonlinear, non-ohmic current-voltage characteristic that is similar to that of a diode.
I am a bit late watching this one, but the following maybe of use in future switch mode power supply fixing for you: You went as far as anyone could go with just a meter. What you couldn't check is if the rectified mains was being turned into high frequency AC and then being applied to the primary side of the transformer. The next step would be to power the unit from an isolation transformer and use an oscilloscope to check for that HF AC waveform on each side of the transformer. Note that the power supply CANNOT just be connected to the mains or you will blow your oscilloscope, it must be an isolated supply or use an (expensive) isolated differential probe box before the oscilloscope. No HF AC on the transformer could then be an issue with whatever components create it from the DC on the primary, or the feedback components from the output side (that regulate the input side) could have an issue. Hope this in some way helps you learn more about these things.
Thank you Mike 👍👍👍👍
I wish i lived closer to you i would buy one of those from you
You can use a vacuum cleaner to suck the centre cap back out if they get pressed in, works a treat.
Thanks Scott, nice tip 👍
@@Mymatevince It doesn't actually affect the function of the speaker but it doesn't look very nice.
What a nice fix. It was very interesting. Thank you.
Thanks Leon 👍
Vincent's Matey crew roll call 😇
it would be great if you could start livestreaming this kind of stuff. Some viewers might be able to help fault finding.
Two working speakers is better than none. Resell value on these will be worth the effort and the fix.
Vince, you're a legend mate. Have one on me 🍺😁👍🏽
I was told many years ago when doing cb radio repairs . To remove the diode from the board to check it correctly.
Great repair and systematic troubleshoot. Usually you take a different direction (better mostly) to me, but this time I would have followed exactly the path that you took. Another lovely video from the master of such videos. Cheers Vince!
Thanks for the kind words Roger👍👍
Nice work again like always Vince. Keep it up.
Failed TVS is a commun problem in switching power supplies.
Best Regards.
This is partly why I hated Elec Eng at university. It was part of my Mech Eng course but I often struggled with stuff like this.
like your style man! complements....
I just bought a W King 30w Bluetooth speaker. Only costed £40. I didn’t really research because I find it hard to make up my Mia day I didn’t want to spend too much, in case sound is bad. I remember buying Logitech creative little pc speakers with around 12inch subwoofer only costed £50 around 2003 and I had them for many years and to my surprise, they sounded great. The 30w is for riding bike and e scooter, if I can fit on somehow. If speaker sounds good I’m going to buy 2X 50w version for at home. Anyway, let the video roll. Ps, I can’t barely change a fuse on a plug, so this bloke is like God, to me. 😭
Well done vince :-D
Switchmodes usually wear out the output capacitors, they puff up and vent.
Too much work and often right up against other hot components. (done on purpose?).
Output diodes can also go short because they are under rated in a sealed case.
Wasn't there something called the capacitor plague that contributed to power supply failures for a while? I guess some of those are still out there.
@@MarkMcCluney Yes there was a long time ago, but capacitor manufacturers are not using the faulty stolen formula any longer.
Capacitors are often too cheap and they fail because of it now.
I happen to have the searchable PDF files of these books if you're interested.
care to share? pdf@allthingscitrix.com :)
Any chance you could post these?
@@eltereding I pinged you via email...
@@rasscal No place to post them, but you can find my email in the "about" section of my RUclips page.
@@TechGorilla1987 There's no email in your "About" page, can you save it in your Google Drive and share the link?
Well done England !! lesson learnt, resistors in parallel worth reading their value cos that would have confirmed....cheers.
Plot twist it's not broken to begin with it's just playing the Sound of Silence.
hello darkness my old friend
@@Add-handle-name-here Because a vision softly creeping
@@Add-handle-name-here And the vision that was planted in my brain
Still remains
It just plays John Cage's 4:33.
worst sleeper speaker
I actually fall a sleep to music and I will literally wake up without music or if it stops playing that will wake me up.
If I had this speaker I would be a zombie
He could probably gut it if its broke and put in another amp and at least pretend he fixed it!
nice video Vince. Looks like a great piece of kit also
Thanks Emma 👍
We need a setup tour!!
small sugestion for an alternative fix ... bypass the power board , with an 15 - 16 volt powerbrick
Great fix and interesting to watch as always. 👍
T stands for "Träge" (lazy, slow) on a fuse. Which means it doesn't blow instantly and can handle some peaks.
Correct - AKA slow blow or anti surge fuse
Great fix!
Mate do yourself a favor and get a power strip with a switch and place it close so you don`t have to reach across live components ,also handy if you have to shut it off in a hurry ( got a nasty burn reaching across a shorted power supply )
Great video lad keep up with the good work
nice curved bass reflex port.
Excellent =D
U didn't watch the video he just uploaded & u here saying excellent
Thank you Chris 👍
@@iwasFortuneWarrior I watch every single one of Vinces videos! They are the BEST on YT! Plus, I am a Patreon - I watched this a few days ago on early access!
I miss your old videos dude😔
Vince would you be willing to take a look at an LCD Game i have the screen has issues and I can't figure out what the issue is. I'm in the US
Nice job again, Vince :-)
1:11 with those rubber strips, i prefer to punch a hole wherever there is a screw, using a leather hole punch, i hate that once you take it off, it will never be stuck on again as nice as the factory
Very nice repair :) 👍👍
Thanks AR 👍👍
That story you told about your Friends Soundsystem and your friends was kind of funny
Awesome video. Love the fault finding pathways. Pls what's the name of the power supply you're using.
I don't know if you're aware, but this was the biggest revelation of my life many-many years ago. How do you very easily repair a speaker that has the middle of the cone pushed in? Take your vacuum cleaner and bring the end close to the middle of the cone and touch it with the vacuum cleaner. It will suck out the part that was pushed in... 2 seconds, literally. You're welcome everyone :)
Nice
I love my I love this RUclipsr I love this RUclipsr I watch all your videos RUclips please
You should replace that thermistor. It acts as a fuse. Not sure if it's not putting some resistance in the input
It's the green cap thing looking thing
My sound bar as recently stop working, with no power.i hope this will help?
Ooh another intresting video
Vince, surely you would check the power supply first?
Great win again !!! Thanks for great content .
Hi Vince, what does a short mean exactly? How do you find out on the multimeter what a short looks like?
I had the same question when I started. A full short will normally be less than 1 Ohm on multimeter with good leads. For example on my multimeter when it is on continuity it will beep on anything under 50 Ohms, but 40 Ohms (for example) is NOT a short, that is why just using continuity can lead to mistakes👍👍👍 Always best to read the resistances in Ohms to make sure. Also touch you leads of the multimeter together because the leads may read higher than 1 Ohm. If they read 3 Ohms then you know between 3 and 4 Ohms will be a full short. Hope that makes some kind of sense and I hope that info is correct👍
nice!
Something new and substancial to kick back with a pizza.
The denting of the dust caps doesnt realy ruin the sound at all but it is anoying and it is tempting though!
It might ruin the sound if the cap has been pushed in so far as to bottom out with the magnet at high volumes so its understandable if thats what happened to your friend's speaker at the party.
I would be super pissed if anyone did that to any of my nice or vintage speakers.
Thats one thing I can appreciate about some modern speakers having inverted dust caps. Its like they have already completed the deed for the loser who wishes to fuck up your speaker.
My mate Vince I have a broken x-box 1-s with broken soldier pads at the HDMI port. can you maybe do a video on fixing it? My Mate VINCE Pls help.
Cheeky! They were using sound insulation to make it sound less hollow
vince will you get the nintendo switch oled for a teardown and maybe if you can replace the screen with a normal switch screen and see how does it work
Vince. Hoping you could help. I noticed in a video you had a tool to test the continuity of the hdmi port that plugged in and had a pcb on it. Could you tell me where to find one? I found myself in need of one and can't find them anywhere
Oh yes, I haven't used that in a long time. If you Google 'HDMI Breakout' or 'Screw terminal HDMI' you will find something similar 👍👍👍
@@Mymatevince superb mate. Cheers
3.15 amp someone had shorted that diode out and there would of been a Big Bang , that’s what prob blew out the thermistor
Make series board and check with it if it shorted then blub will glow and if it's fix blub will not glow