Whats the point of the merchant? Anyone who has to ask that is too focused on raw damage to understand the importance of trading in this game. With trading you can salvage every single run. Thats it. You have proven repeatedly that knowledge of the game allows you to beat it even at level 1. That levels, damage, constitutuon, etc, none of those stats are necessary to win. IMO they are a crutch. Merchent teaches you more about how to salvage a run than any other class that relies on RNG. Sure, a merchant stil has minor RNG depending on which shops appear, but thats still more than any other class. I would argue that Merchant is one of the best starting classes for a new player, and only gets stronger as your knowledge of the game improves.
I respect your opinion and I agree that trading is very powerful. I repeatedly have emphasised this to new players, mostly towards being able to buy potions, the rest of the items arent as important. Unless we're talking about enchanted items such as levitation, water walking or magic resistance. But it takes knowledge to be aware of them. Im looking at it from this perspective. What can a merchant do that a human, a automaton and a succubus cannot? They are all capable of free trade. They are all capable of identifying gems. Starting with 1000g does help. Starting with trading does help, but then I'd argue so does wanderer. Only wanderer has other tools that really help newer players more than a merchant. Similarly appraisal does help, but the moment any class becomes capable of appraising "1 perception" it snowballs quickly. So please educate me. What can a merchant do that humans, automatons and succubi cannot?
@@LyciantYT I think the argument "what can XXX class do that XXX race cannot is flawed" Since, over time, (and with some luck) all races and classes can do mostly everything. I mean, take the Ninja and Monk for example, two of what the community considers the strongest classes. What makes them strong is their stat spread, but there is nothing a Monk or Ninja can do that any other RACE cannot. A merchant is effectively a better Brewer without a backpack, if they find an alembic or buy one at s shop. A merchant is a better mechanist without an apron, if they find a tool kit or shop with a tool kit. A merchant is a better wanderer flat out. You brought up Wanderer, an example of a class who's entire kit is replaced by a single Goatman race ability (eating cans) IMO. I believe that race and class aren't something that can be compared as they are the core structure of a build or run. There are very few things in this game that are locked behind a class or race (Shaman or rare items like the boomerang and whip). But that is what makes classes unique and what makes races important. I would argue that, you're asking what makes them different, but the strength is what makes them the same. A merchant is strong because it makes any monster race practically a human or automaton, AND their core race. All the benefits of a Goatman, yet half the normal downsides. I am not saying you are wrong, I respect your opinion of the merchant completely. I like the Mechant Goatman combo and have for a long time. I find it wildly powerful due to effectively being a Brewer without the downsides of a monster race. I also simply love playing as the Goatman, and the mercant allows me to fulfill that power fantasy. Lets be real. No one wants to play as a human. So, what can a merchant do that a human, atomoton, or succubi cannot? The merchant can allow someone to play a race of their choice and still have unlimited access to shops. Playing as a human, automaton or succubi doesnt allow me to play a local friendly drunkard Goatman with access to shops.
Kinda awkward 😅 i tend to pick one of those 3 whenever i want to be capable of trading more consistently and I actually have a scheduled stream for tomorrow as a human shaman for that exact reason. That said I agree, not everybody wants to play as a human and yes merchant does give them the option to trade more than however many polymorph potions they have. I think at best we can both agree that merchant lets you play any race and freely trade. I can also agree that merchant can go into tinkering and into alchemy, but then i fall into the same point of view of "any class can do that", so why merchant? I dont quite agree with everything you said, but thats alright, you dont agree with my opinion either and thats okay :) Ive never really been a big fan of the class so chances are I am a little biased, but I honestly cant think of any reason other than consistent trade as a specific race that would make me want to play it and I very rarely trade enough, in a game to justify it. However I can see the appeal you have for it. I think whats most important is that we can both agree that everybody has their own playstyle and regardless of how we chose to approuch the game we both enjoy it! And as long as we can agree on that Im happy :) I do appreciate your insight into the class, I think I will pin the comment on the vod as it does contain information for playing the class. I feel like I didnt give it enough justice. So i will schedule another run and focus more on showing the pros of a merchant rather than dismissing it due to the scaling and my playstyle. I still dont think my opinion will change when it comes to chosing what to play myself. But I thank you for reminding me to consider the strengths and how it can potentially help others!
Yeah same here :) its always really great to see other people's perspectives about things and to learn! Also I know this isn't an excuse, but I had a very long day. Streamed a total of 10 hours in 3 different games so I think by the time I got to this one I approached it more of a casual stream rather than a thoughtful and helpful one. I mean I did mention quite a few things you could do. But overall if I think back on it I need to give it more love. But yeah :) I'd be happy to keep talking about it over on discord if you're up for it. Just ping me :) otherwise the remake will happen on Tuesday. Lets give this class some justice!
35:44 To be fair, the monocle is just the glasses but better. All uncursed glasses do is +1 perception, which is a stat buff the monocle already applies in addition to those other bonuses you mentioned at the start of the run. You can of course bless glasses to do better than that, but you can do the same to the monocle... If I had a *choice* between glasses and the monocle - and didn't need to play merchant to get it - I'd pick the monocle in a heartbeat. That being said, I've never seen a monocle generate in the world; only equipped to merchant players. lol
Yeah, you are absolutely right about this. The monicle is just normal glasses with a +200% speed increase when identifying gems and the same bonusses when getting blessed while also allowing you to interact freely with shopkeepers. Given the choice i too would take a -20 cursed monicle even over +30 blessed glasses. As being able to interact freely with shopkeepers is a very powerful ability by itself. One that is far more important than being able to appraise a few more things slightly faster. I should probably have said this during that moment. But ill pin the comment instead :) thank you!
@@LyciantYT Yup, you kill Sheelob in one of those spike room cages and go in to loot it, and a Skeleton walks up. "Who's laughing now, fleshy?!" and pulls the lever.
I'll be honest I haven't counted them and the game doesn't count them either (although it does have a list of your past games) I've played over 2000 hours at roughly 2-3 hours per win which is around 700-1000 wins, but I decided to nerf that number and start counting from 500 so that different streams can also be differentiated from one another.
If i took the game seriously, id win almost every time yes. But for the most part I just mess around push myself, challenge myself and do dumb things because I think itll be funny haha. What i meant was - if you look at my history of livestreams, they are mostly between 1h30m and 3hours. The shorter vods i probably never died in. The longer vods i died at some point or another. But even with those deaths its +-3 hours per win.
Whats the point of the merchant? Anyone who has to ask that is too focused on raw damage to understand the importance of trading in this game.
With trading you can salvage every single run. Thats it.
You have proven repeatedly that knowledge of the game allows you to beat it even at level 1. That levels, damage, constitutuon, etc, none of those stats are necessary to win. IMO they are a crutch.
Merchent teaches you more about how to salvage a run than any other class that relies on RNG. Sure, a merchant stil has minor RNG depending on which shops appear, but thats still more than any other class.
I would argue that Merchant is one of the best starting classes for a new player, and only gets stronger as your knowledge of the game improves.
I respect your opinion and
I agree that trading is very powerful. I repeatedly have emphasised this to new players, mostly towards being able to buy potions, the rest of the items arent as important. Unless we're talking about enchanted items such as levitation, water walking or magic resistance. But it takes knowledge to be aware of them.
Im looking at it from this perspective. What can a merchant do that a human, a automaton and a succubus cannot?
They are all capable of free trade.
They are all capable of identifying gems.
Starting with 1000g does help.
Starting with trading does help, but then I'd argue so does wanderer. Only wanderer has other tools that really help newer players more than a merchant.
Similarly appraisal does help, but the moment any class becomes capable of appraising "1 perception" it snowballs quickly.
So please educate me.
What can a merchant do that humans, automatons and succubi cannot?
@@LyciantYT I think the argument "what can XXX class do that XXX race cannot is flawed" Since, over time, (and with some luck) all races and classes can do mostly everything.
I mean, take the Ninja and Monk for example, two of what the community considers the strongest classes. What makes them strong is their stat spread, but there is nothing a Monk or Ninja can do that any other RACE cannot.
A merchant is effectively a better Brewer without a backpack, if they find an alembic or buy one at s shop. A merchant is a better mechanist without an apron, if they find a tool kit or shop with a tool kit. A merchant is a better wanderer flat out.
You brought up Wanderer, an example of a class who's entire kit is replaced by a single Goatman race ability (eating cans) IMO. I believe that race and class aren't something that can be compared as they are the core structure of a build or run.
There are very few things in this game that are locked behind a class or race (Shaman or rare items like the boomerang and whip). But that is what makes classes unique and what makes races important.
I would argue that, you're asking what makes them different, but the strength is what makes them the same.
A merchant is strong because it makes any monster race practically a human or automaton, AND their core race. All the benefits of a Goatman, yet half the normal downsides.
I am not saying you are wrong, I respect your opinion of the merchant completely. I like the Mechant Goatman combo and have for a long time. I find it wildly powerful due to effectively being a Brewer without the downsides of a monster race. I also simply love playing as the Goatman, and the mercant allows me to fulfill that power fantasy.
Lets be real. No one wants to play as a human.
So, what can a merchant do that a human, atomoton, or succubi cannot?
The merchant can allow someone to play a race of their choice and still have unlimited access to shops. Playing as a human, automaton or succubi doesnt allow me to play a local friendly drunkard Goatman with access to shops.
Kinda awkward 😅 i tend to pick one of those 3 whenever i want to be capable of trading more consistently and I actually have a scheduled stream for tomorrow as a human shaman for that exact reason. That said I agree, not everybody wants to play as a human and yes merchant does give them the option to trade more than however many polymorph potions they have.
I think at best we can both agree that merchant lets you play any race and freely trade. I can also agree that merchant can go into tinkering and into alchemy, but then i fall into the same point of view of "any class can do that", so why merchant?
I dont quite agree with everything you said, but thats alright, you dont agree with my opinion either and thats okay :) Ive never really been a big fan of the class so chances are I am a little biased, but I honestly cant think of any reason other than consistent trade as a specific race that would make me want to play it and I very rarely trade enough, in a game to justify it. However I can see the appeal you have for it.
I think whats most important is that we can both agree that everybody has their own playstyle and regardless of how we chose to approuch the game we both enjoy it! And as long as we can agree on that Im happy :)
I do appreciate your insight into the class, I think I will pin the comment on the vod as it does contain information for playing the class. I feel like I didnt give it enough justice. So i will schedule another run and focus more on showing the pros of a merchant rather than dismissing it due to the scaling and my playstyle.
I still dont think my opinion will change when it comes to chosing what to play myself. But I thank you for reminding me to consider the strengths and how it can potentially help others!
@@LyciantYT you're awesome man. Love the content. Love the discussion. Can't wait to see more!
Yeah same here :) its always really great to see other people's perspectives about things and to learn!
Also I know this isn't an excuse, but I had a very long day. Streamed a total of 10 hours in 3 different games so I think by the time I got to this one I approached it more of a casual stream rather than a thoughtful and helpful one. I mean I did mention quite a few things you could do. But overall if I think back on it I need to give it more love.
But yeah :) I'd be happy to keep talking about it over on discord if you're up for it. Just ping me :) otherwise the remake will happen on Tuesday. Lets give this class some justice!
35:44 To be fair, the monocle is just the glasses but better. All uncursed glasses do is +1 perception, which is a stat buff the monocle already applies in addition to those other bonuses you mentioned at the start of the run. You can of course bless glasses to do better than that, but you can do the same to the monocle...
If I had a *choice* between glasses and the monocle - and didn't need to play merchant to get it - I'd pick the monocle in a heartbeat. That being said, I've never seen a monocle generate in the world; only equipped to merchant players. lol
Yeah, you are absolutely right about this.
The monicle is just normal glasses with a +200% speed increase when identifying gems and the same bonusses when getting blessed while also allowing you to interact freely with shopkeepers.
Given the choice i too would take a -20 cursed monicle even over +30 blessed glasses. As being able to interact freely with shopkeepers is a very powerful ability by itself. One that is far more important than being able to appraise a few more things slightly faster.
I should probably have said this during that moment. But ill pin the comment instead :) thank you!
What if instead of releasing an update to spiff up armor like they're doing for hats/masks, they release an update that lets monsters hit levers.
Id be fine with that, but imagine if they locked you inside one lf those cages hahaha
@@LyciantYT Yup, you kill Sheelob in one of those spike room cages and go in to loot it, and a Skeleton walks up. "Who's laughing now, fleshy?!" and pulls the lever.
yeah that would be hilarious!
Does this game count your wins or do you have to count your wins yourself?
Ive been thinking about buying the game
I'll be honest I haven't counted them and the game doesn't count them either (although it does have a list of your past games)
I've played over 2000 hours at roughly 2-3 hours per win which is around 700-1000 wins, but I decided to nerf that number and start counting from 500 so that different streams can also be differentiated from one another.
Oh okay gotcha!!!
So you win every time that you play? If so you’re a barony god 💯
If i took the game seriously, id win almost every time yes.
But for the most part I just mess around push myself, challenge myself and do dumb things because I think itll be funny haha.
What i meant was - if you look at my history of livestreams, they are mostly between 1h30m and 3hours. The shorter vods i probably never died in. The longer vods i died at some point or another.
But even with those deaths its +-3 hours per win.