'Fake' guitarists, Online 'experts' and the guitar Olympics | RANT WARNING
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- Опубликовано: 30 июл 2024
- This video contains some material originally released on my 'Story of Prog Metal in 10 Albums' video.
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I am a drummer, producer and educator. I talk about Jazz, Prog and Fusion and the cultural context in which music has been, and is made. And sometimes, if you are lucky, I go off on one... 
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As always Andy, you are spot on. Super clean, emotionless, mistakless, perfect music that could have just been produced using software leaves me feeling stone cold. Whether it's live or on youtube, I always want to see the musicians being musicians.
Couldn't agree more!
For what it's worth, the more ranty, animated, and stirring-the-pot your videos are, the more I personally enjoy them. You're good at touching on the truth of a contentious subject and simultaneously delivering some good laughs (in my not so humble opinion). Keep telling it like it is, Andy!
That's some wild playing! I can hear bits of Allan Holsworth, Shawn Lane, Bret Garsed, Al Di Meola and all that good stuff. 👍🏼🎸
Excellent Video Andy
Thanks for all you do !
Well done Andy, your rants are always very informative.
I don’t know much about prog-metal but I see this phenomenon you speak of across different music genres on RUclips. These “experts” tend to be the self-anointed gatekeepers within their own deluded, narcissism-fuelled imaginations. And their cult-like followers are as insufferable, especially when they are sent off like a swarm of hornets to spam another musician’s channel. Andy, I love when you rock the boat. 👍
Thanks for explaining this.
I have official notation here from a little bitty band from Nashville known as Inferi.
I understand now that, it's fantastic material and a great learning tool: But don't expect to play it anything like they did in the studio.
I love this video and the point Andy is making here! Very well put. Just like that! Angry and ranty!
Hi Andy.. absolutely love your channel. I understand your concerns about your more thoughtful videos bringing in lower viewers. HOWEVER… please don’t stop doing them !! The interviews with working musicians are so very important. The videos you have aired regarding the psychology of performing and the creative processes ect. Are subjects , no one else is talking about. Not even the Rick Beato’s of the internet world .. only you. Your passion for music and for musicians honest and heartfelt. So please continue to be the authentic person you have shown yourself to be. Don’t chase the numbers.
I wish I could, but RUclips is a funny thing. I'm a weird RUclipsr in that I let the viewer in on my thought process. Hopefully by mentioning this on videos I know will perform well will draw them to the more esoteric videos.
Well stated. Thanks for the insight.
Really interesting insight into studio production techniques.
Thank you so much for explaining this in a way that I have tried time and time again on my channel and received so much hate. You nailed it sir! Keep it up
If you want some profile I could interview you about your career in the army, and then about music and guitar and why you made the change. I'm interested in the mental health issues as well...
@@AndyEdwardsDrummer that would be great, I’ve never done something like that before though, how would it work?
@@ZachJewell-dn8dg send me an email...
@@AndyEdwardsDrummer I sent you one. I look forward to hearing from you soon.
And breathe 🙂
Well said Andy!
I am old enough to have seen the birth and development of fusion guitar - I bought Igginbottom, and Spaces, and My Goal's Beyond, etc when they first came out - and there is no doubt the inherent viciousness and narcissism of the the social media age has negatively impacted genre expanding musicians today. Can you imagine if social media had been around when Jonny Mac, or Allan or Al Di Meola or Corrado Rustici or Frank Gambale etc had come up, I dread to think?!
Also, this need for perfection and to recreate studio recordings, has somewhat stifled the spontaneity and improvisational experimentation of live acts in some genres. Back in the day, bands were OK being a bit sloppy, Jimmy Page anyone, and this made the audience feel part of something unique and special. Live albums were also a big event where fans looked forward to their favourite bands extending and reworking their favorite tunes.
I bash about on the guitar and do a very poor impersonation of fusion styling, but I have been told I have very rapid technique (I apparently have good fast twitch muscles in my hands - don't know what that says about me 😬) - so have some ability to assess whether a guitarist is faking it. Allan didn't, as he demonstrated numerous times live, nor indeed does Jonny or Al, and I can see that Roy is the real deal also. And I don't say this as a fan with an agenda, I respect Roy immensely but his playing does not speak to me personally, so I have no skin in the game so to speak.
These armchair experts are symptomatic of a wider issue on the internet, namely the rise of so called Dunning-Kruger experts, people who possess an arrogant false over inflated belief as to their knowledge and abilities. It is not a million miles from the flat earth movement where the argument from ignorance fallacy abounds and seeks to deny accepted science. But, I have been lucky enough to see many of the greats live, and they are the real deal no matter what our armchair warrior friends would have you believe!
And, as I have said before in comments Andy, if ever you are looking for fusion nerds to coe on one of your videos for a chat, I'd love to give my two pence worth 🤘
Keep up the good fight!
In all honesty, when I first saw Roy I could not believe he was that fast, but after taking a closer look, he's the real deal. Insane chops.
This goes back to the mid-60s. The fab 4 couldn't accurately reproduce live, the sound that George Martin crafted in the studio for their albums. There aren't many bands since the 60s (beside Punk bands) that could, on a live stage, precisely reproduce the sound they crafted on their records. Not the Beatles, not Pink Floyd, not even Rush. None of these artists could perfectly reproduce the sound that is found on their albums. That ship sailed in 1967.
The band Clutch once said "if you're gonna do it, you better take it to the stage" referring to all the over-the-top studio magic that makes the live experience so detached from audience expectations. I understand refining a track in the studio and mixing it properly, but when you go too far with the software and cannot convincingly replicate it live, you risk losing an audience. EDIT: Live shows are also too goddamn expensive these days to get a lousy performance.
I agree with all your point but are prog shows also 'that' expensive where you live? Cuz I assume you are talking about pop(ular) artists where tickets range between 100 and 3000 dollars, but since the vid is quite prog-focused, I am curious.
I bought tickets for Polyphia (already went and it was awesome), Periphery, Animals as Leaders, Tesseract and Sungazer this year, and I think the most expensive ticket cost me 32.50 euros.
I think ~30 euros is a very fair price for a modern prog band.
Right on. Thanks for sharing.
As Bertrand Russel said, "The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, and wiser people so full of doubts."
W.B. Yeats too - 'The best lack all conviction, while the worst are full of passionate intensity.'
Andy is the gatekeeper- caller-outer gatekeeper. 🙂
I am!!! We need a gatekeeper-caller-outer gatekeeper-caller outer-gateleeper to call me out now, Then they will need...oh never mind...
@@AndyEdwardsDrummermer who gate keeps the gatekeeper
Bravo!
So many folks have absolutely no idea how a record is actually made, and how they have been made for decades. I'm not a metal guy but I've been a recording guitarist in L.A. since the early 1980s. 90% of the time, whether it's in a big studio or a small, home, project studio - the engineer/producer wants a clean, D.I.'d track along with whatever amp sound (real or virtual). And if they don't ask, I usually try to encourage it.
Amen, Andy!! I remember even before analog "punch-ins", you had to improvise a part, and play it correctly ALL the way through a song!! I still do it. There are minor mistakes, and a great musician can make it work, or re-do their WHOLE parts, many takes. There was no way to digitally micro-edit anything!!. I'm sorry, but a PERFECT part is barely musical. People need to learn their instrument.
Thank you for making a video like this. I do not like the proliferation of the RUclips industry of sh*tting on people’s content and creations. And those people contribute nothing of their own. And it’s more egregious when that person is making inaccurate and false accusations.
Have you done a video on best live performance album? It's not prog or jazz, but the original Live at Leeds LP with the label note: "Crackling noises ok: do NOT correct!" stands as a shining example of taking complex multi-tracked recordings (Tommy) and distilling it to its essence while ignoring the production issues. Some of these current bands could learn from it - capturing pure energy - assuming they're capable. ELP was one of the prog bands that came alive in concert - compare WBMF tracks to the studio versions of Tarkus as just one example. I can remember sitting in a dorm room in 1977 listening to Brand X's Livestock and being blown away and amazed to find out it was recorded live. And there's the Eno/Manzanera/Simon Philips/et al 801 recording.
Excellent rant, Andy, in a good cause...
☝️😎
Thank you kindly
I never heard of Marchbank until I saw these videos. He’s got a white Kemper profiler head, and I just got one myself. So I’ll give him a few extra points for having taste. 🙂
Metal used to be about letting off steam, having fun and rocking out. Now it's just full of snobbery sneering and pedantry. There seem to be even more metal snobs claiming to be experts than those in the jazz scene these days, and that's saying something!
Stuff that starts off counter cultural always moves towards mainstream respect and acceptance. Metal is a bit like Al Pacino in The Godfather III...I'd rather have the original Godfather
Over the last 5 months I've studied some of what Roy has done and you can see a lot of the confusion by supposed experts has stemmed from his technique of tremelo picking very close to the bridge which thins out the note attack and really can do a lot to make it not sound like a guitar in some cases. I have to hand it to him that he's developed that technique while using different picks, some of them quite large and I hope he can retain this technique as he gets older because playing like that is like being a high level athlete - I still think the most amazing playing he has done here was the violin segment at the beginning of the video. That's not a gimmick, that's totally musical. I want to hear if he puts a record out now.
Rock music, for me, died when this obsession with perfection became the norm. It might be perfect, but it's not exciting. I want to hear a band playing live, warts (if they're there) and all.
Who needs authenticity? Just give me a good act and a song that grabs me and makes life hurt less. My memoir will be titled How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Love the Pop Narcotic.
Dont even get me started on this! You say what is the point? Well on the back of it endorsements and record deals have been made. Tends to more in the metal end of the market. Cant recall jazzers doing it.
Guitar is a minor instrument in jazz. In real jazz clubs you may not see a guitar in a month.
Academies are pouring them out because the kids want it. Daddies money gets the training, but spoiled kids got nothing to say or worth hearing.
@@donaldfrazell9540not looked for speeded up piano or sax videos, but they are likely there, as mortal humans struggle to detect speed increases up to 20% on guitar videos.
I don't concur with your comment about education.
exactly...and those guys can fake their solos till the cows come home. Although I would not call it faking, I would call it modern production methods. But the gatekeepers don't pick on those guys, and they are very specific on what they determine 'fake'. And then of course sometimes they accuse people of being fakes when they are not. And they don't have to worry about their opinions being valid or not, or prove their credentials as 'experts'. This industry is too nuanced and complex for these sub adolescent attitudes to have any currency, but it seems they do.
@@donaldfrazell9540 "Guitar is a minor instrument in jazz. In real jazz clubs you may not see a guitar in a month." 😅
I'm no guitar expert...I just like what I like
Well Said!!!!
Hello, please tell me where can I get the full discography of Roy Marchbank. Thanks!
Some of the NASCAR guys felt that way about Richard Petty.
If you want to hear the album stay at home. If you want an experience that can stay with you then go and see a real concert played for real. I'm old school, I want to see the mistakes or the song played in a different way because you could not reproduce the studio recording. It's about the group experience not wanking off. Best advice for performing I ever received was 'you are selling memories'
Unless you bootlegged it, it’s really hard to remember just from memory
I love all the genres Andy loves. Have played guitar semi-professionally for 50 yrs. I recently fell in love with Slow Dive (shoegaze). I have watched all their live videos & bought their albums. Amazingly to me, they sound better live & have gotten better live over the years. In some of their live concert videos they hit bad chords or had strings break which really threw a guitar wildly out of tune. With their massive delays & reverb, this creates some very interesting dissonances ;)
I watch their live videos repeatedly, more than their albums, and get chills every time. Even when I know a 'mistake' is coming up, I am amazed how they overcome the issue & mostly make the 'mistake' sound musical & unexpectedly interesting. They are so professionally & musically attuned as a band that even the 'mistakes' create a unique artistic moment.
I try to do this myself, with varying degrees of success, but my listeners still love the live experience. All that to say that even 'mistakes' can add to the enjoyment of a live experience, but it requires an even higher level of skill than merely creating the 'perfect' studio recording. In my opinion.
People seem to forget, or never knew, from the inception of audio recording, someone, usually the producer, was attempting to improve tye sound quality, tye performance or both. I guess these “so called critics never used an eq, compressor, or multiple takes. They’ve always done one take direct to disc recordings, I don’t recall who made this quote, I think it was the great producer, Lou Adler. “I don’t care about your artistic expression, I’m here to make and sell records!” And that’s been the struggle, to find a happy medium between the artist and producer.
Hi Andy 😎
Well said. There are nitwits in the cartoonist world who do similar nonsense. My friend was accused of all kinds of foolishness by a guy who did some lettering for IPC. (And that was it!) It seems the same is true in the music industry.
Since you're talking about your views and not about Roy, I will comment about him. It looks like a MIDI setup on his guitar. I've played with MIDI, and the thing about this setup is the latency, which is the time it takes for the signal from the guitar to go through the computer and then come out as sound. When playing through pedals (like a wah or a fuzz box) there is latency too, but it's so small you don't hear the difference. You will through MIDI, and what you see when Roy plays is the time difference between the note being played and the sound that comes out afterward.
Yes...but sometimes Roy is not playing midi, but he gets the same accusations
Never heard of this guy but the technique and sound is amazing.
I was on a music forum and the kids on there were discussing Led Zeppelin IV and how it sounded quite good for the time. For the time! You'd have thought they were talking about scratchy old blues recordings from the thirties or something. People pining for "real" music like they made in the old days are out of luck I'm afraid. That ship has sailed, especially with young people who expect pristine Platonic recordings.
I know some people born 1994 on that "can't get" into classic rock because it "doesn"t" that good. The times we live in...the Instagram effect x 100!
Not true at all, there is a huge vintage music and retro sound scene among younger bands in all the classic genres (rock jazz funk etc) you just aint looking, there is so much I cant keep up, so many new releases all the time from young new bands all over the world small countries all alone recording with old analog gear music that sounds legit vintage in both the music and the recorded sound, purposely going for the natural to preserve the soul and feel of the past, nothing modern about it at all, much could pass for actual 70s groups. It's all out there and has been on the net for decades now, and always growing, all over spotify bandcamp yt, etc you just have to want to find it, its all out there in the niches not hard to find if you really love it as I do, but its not going to come to you with no effort...being fed what you want is for the masses not that into music, you have to love the styles and sounds enough to want to find it, if you did you already would have. Besides that, there is a never ending supply by the hundreds/thousands of more obscure 70s bands you will never run out or hear them all, no need to complain about new music or the sound of it, that ship aint sailed at all, if anything more and more lately it's coming back to port, the young ppl who know are making it happen
There are literally hundreds of instagram guitarists speeding videos up and well kmown guitarists doing playthrus, splicing their solos together etc. The focus on Roy Marchbank by certain influencers tells me they know he's legit but he's not in favour with their paymasters. They promote who the paymasters or king makers can control. That's why this is a music industry not a music cooperative. Keep on ranting on Andy, take em down! This video could go viral.
I can hear the sound of a big nail somewhere being hit squarely on the head!!!
Economy of Motion...some have it, most don't. I know. I'm in the "most" camp.
I think jealousy and envy are big factors in others who judge.
I’m not even a good musician, but I hear it on all levels. There’s always someone who wants to upset the apple cart.
Too many people looking to shut others down for doing something they disagree with.
Music has no right or wrong.... it’s a creative process. And it’s not expected to be perfect to all ears.
No different to fashion, Art, storytelling.
The music industry isn’t like it was 30 years ago... it’s all done for profit now, not talent.
I think the industry is itself damaging to aspiring musicians in trying to force them into particular boxes with regards to recording and production. Even worse than the musical gatekeepers are the audio gatekeepers who will tear productions apart which don't conform to their parameters of how things should sound. A friend of mine self-produced an album, submitted it to a bunch of audiophiles to critique, and had it ripped to pieces. As a result of this he recorded the whole thing again, this time with a "professional" producer, albeit working remotely. From something punchy, dynamic and exciting, he came back with something polished, slick and lifeless, with no more success than before, but the additional baggage of heartache and time wasted. We don't seem to have come very far from the attitudes of the EMI boffins in white coats when the Beatles first went into Abbey Road.
That guy was not a producer, he was a mix engineer. A producer would be able to recognise where the worth is.
@@AndyEdwardsDrummer Point taken, but doesn't it ultimately depend on whether the producer prioritises facilitating an artistic vision, or turning out something generic sounding and programmable? Seeing the worth in creativity, or marketability?
Im supposed to be working on my own videos but I'm watching you instead. Brilliant stuff, very entertaining. Not helping with my procrastination issues though 😂
There was a #1 hit when I was a kid by a band called The Rubettes. The guy singing their song 'Sugar Baby Love' on Top of The Pops was not the singer on the record. Lots (if not all) of people on TOTP were miming, that's well known, but most were miming to their own backing tracks. This guy was miming to someone else's.😆
This gets completely ignored by the gatekeepers, and then in Roy's case they accuse someone who can really play
That guy singing the ball-breaking vocal on ‘sugar baby love’ was Paul Da Vinci..he also sang the lead vocal on tight fit’s ‘the lion sleeps tonight’.!!..he still does the gig circuit.
Jimmy Page. I admire him for “leaving the mistakes in”, as he would say, because his live solos and studio solos both sound real.
This really brightened my day. Who doesn't love a good rant. If you're not having a rant in this day and age, there must be something wrong with you. I laughed out loud at "sociophobic stop-ins". How many people criticised Mike Oldfield for not playing every instrument live on stage like he did on Tubular Bells? Where would The Edge be without the dotted 8th delay pedal? Even Nuno Bettencourt used one on Flight of the Wounded Bumblebee. Unfortunately, you have to blame a lot of this on-line criticism on the RUclips algorithm, where "content creators" feel obliged to slate other peoples talent "for the views". Sad.
I got a question, can we consider Supertramp as a Prog band ? 🤔 Breakfast in America and Brother were you bound came in 1979 and 1985 and felt for me as a musician very sophisticated just like pink floyd back in the 70'. thanks for answering
Love it
Sorry Andy and this is not meant to criticize you by any means, rather the self proclaimed experts and the times we are living in but the whole topic they created is similar to music arguments i had with my friends...in primary school..seriously.
The fact that there is a need for you to make a video about it brings to light the decadent times we are living. Really very sad and hopeless.
Exactly...but it affects people's careers. I have seen what it has done to Roy and fellt I should do something about it. Hopefully the many comments here like yours might show these arrogant individuals up
@@AndyEdwardsDrummer The fact that people's careers have been affected by that indicates a huge problem in our civilization.Those self proclaimed experts are just the tip of the iceberg, a bit deeper is the audience themselves, who can not recognise what is real music and what is important and can be fooled by those experts. We really need to not only go to the root of the problem but also address it and do something about it. A video like yours calling them out is a great start.
Personally I do not want the experience of the album when I see a band live. I want improvisation and the band changing the dynamic. How boring for the band if they play the same song the same way hundreds of time, night after night. I can appreciate technical excellence but today it is like who is the fastest gun. One of the greatest guitarists was Les West. It wasn't what he played, it was what he didn't, the space he left and the feel he had. That is an art as much as high technical proficiency.
I knew when I first saw Roy that it was real though, that question of if it was real or not never appeared in my mind
I remember Marco Pierre White saying 'I was being judged by people with less knowledge than me' I thought yep that sounds about right.
Maybe just hanging with jam band is as good as it gets these days, no industry, no money, just friends playing together in the same space. I am SICK of what the machine heads take as 'perfect'. The stuff they edit out is the life of humans making music.
Brilliant Rant Andy
So good never seen this before very much like Dam I forgot his name and band. He plays through synth and has a foot peddle to act like the note changer roller thingy on synths. I think Joe Satriani did a song with him. This is very much in that field of music sort of electro fusion Jazz Progressive rock. This is not fake it takes some skill to make your own sound in music.
Prog Metal is the worst offender with all the plugins and stuff...they are like religion fanatics of gear. Great video Andy!
Good video. These "experts" might be taken to account for their reckless accusations, especially if a retraction is not made. I understand libel and slander laws in the United Kingdom and the United States are very different. Without getting into too much detail, the defamation laws in the US are more defendant friendly and the defamation laws in the UK are are more plaintiff friendly. The most famous UK defamation case of contemporary vintage would be the case of the infamous holocaust denier, David Irving, vs Deborah Lipstadt.
I beleive these videos are slanderous, The problem is their acolytes then spread these mistruths on various forums and chat sites. And then before you know it, the artist is finding all the doors closing.
@@AndyEdwardsDrummer It certainly sounds like the damages element of a defamation action is well covered. So often damages are overlooked by Plaintiffs. You can have actionable defamation, but if you have no provable damages, you have no case.
Oh my Perplexed Meister Soul i the Heavekly Realm,- That is a very very fast guitarist - and VERY melodic, lyrical , but most of all - he has his own style - granted , i hear alot of Django , a little Allan , a littte EVH - but i dont get why anyone would call him a fake !? - that sound like very low intelligent nontalents , with a set of bias , that they need to get re-inforced ,to have there sad reality make sense - i believe its called narcisism.....
Rant of the Week Series needs legs!❤❤❤
You cranky bastard. Do you need a hug? LOL! Love it!
Poking the nest😂 is this like John Mitchell's Prodding the Scorpion?
Just a thought. Instead of cymbal and drum endorsements couldn't you get a Nescafe endorsement?
Loving the coffee induced rants.😂
I would say Frost* sounds like the records live..
I hate to think what Mitchell means by 'prodding the scorpion'
We had backing tracks when I played with them. Not much but it was there. I don't know how much the recent live stuff has been buffed up in ProTools, but I imagine they have. This is what they sounded like when I played with them. If I have headphones on then I'm playing to backing tracks...ruclips.net/video/j6c_LgmefgI/видео.html
@@AndyEdwardsDrummer I saw Jem did a video where elaborate studio constructions involving many tracks could be sampled and then played back on a keyboard on subsets of a sampling keyboard which was a clever way of doing it. With only 4 guys. Kind of like Tangerine Dream in the 70s - they would do custom tapes of elaborate moog sounds which were always monophonic at the time and then they were able to do “polyphonic” moog sounds live via custom tape sets on the mellotron much to Bob Moog’s surprise. They also had backwards piano thru a Leslie which was cool.
Imagine if sponsors could quantise football matches before they were aired so that every tackle, pass and shot was perfect. How boring would that be.
Shot? Is that the kick right after a touchdown?
@@PerryCodes Shot at goal in football. Touchdown is rugby.
@@TractorCountdown Football - with quarterbacks... where they throw the ball to a receiver... in the endzone... for a touchdown!
Ohhhhhh.... soccer? ;)
@@PerryCodes Crossed wires, eh :) Yep, I'm in the UK.
I like
I know Animals as Leaders are not identical on record than live; however, idgaf, they are absolutely incredible live.
I saw Polyphia live as well. Insane live act. Love it.
I like bands playing with production that create an amazing experience with headphones. I do not expect the same live, I want fun, excitement and a good show. I want to see some inprov and great band chemistry.
Yes..as I said they are amazing players, but their albums don't sound real at all to me. The drums sound programmed and the guitars are just so rhythmically accurate it all sounds a bit lifeless. But that is their aesthetic. They are influenced I think by the glitchy aesthetic of Pahex Twin and Squarepusher. I get it. But I like the sound of people playing together
@@AndyEdwardsDrummerHi Andy, I hear you. Don't worry, I have had the biggest obsession with Close to the Edge because of your videos. I have been listening to prog rock with a new understanding because of you.
With that said, Parrhesia by Animals as Leaders will always be close to my heart ❤
I also come to you as a teacher, I may differ on your opinions of the *aesthetics* on occassion, but I listen to you to learn ❤
Man I can agree with that. Cool as Polyphia and AaL is, it’s dull and lifeless sounding. I never go back for repeat listens of that stuff.
Hard disagree. I would agree if it wasn't for Matt Gartska's composition underneath the guitarists. Arithmophobia is far from lifeless, the rhythms and detail are insane.
I think Matt Gartska is one the most talented drummers alive. Insanely high-level jazz fusion drummer that likes Meshuggah and Car Bomb style metal.
Animals as Leaders don't just play fast, they are extremely interesting. Saying their lifeless isn't really arguing anything 🤷♂️
It's a real shame that musicians are under so much pressure to make their live performances sound like the studio recordings. I remember a Jethro Tull performance in the late 1970s that was the first time I realized I was watching a band play to a "Music Minus One" backing track. What a disappointment that was. If I want to listen to a recording, I don't have to leave my house for that. In the arts, market forces do nothing but encourage lowest-common-denominator mediocrity.
Oh, and if we are ranting about live music, what the hell has happened to the quality of the front of house guys??? I have been to a number of gigs recently where the sound volume level is so over the top you simply can’t discern the detail of the music. This is especially problematic with dense music like prog. They seem to think volume equates to excitement, but when the sound pressure levels go above a certain limit your ears simply can’t cope.
For example, I am a huge Steve Hillage fan and have been going to his gigs since the 70s, but I actually walked out of his latest tour a couple of weeks ago due to the awful sound. What makes it worse, I saw him on his previous tour at the same venue before the pandemic, and the sound was fantastic. I also nearly walked out of a Glenn Hughes gig at the same venue the other week due to the ridiculously loud mix, which ultimately didn’t help Glenn either as his voice isn’t quite as strong as it used to be.
You expect sound guys to have good ears, but maybe years of engineering loud gigs has shagged their ears so much they simply can’t discern a good mix?
Mini rant over!
Paraphrasing Oscar Wilde: 'when something becomes an industry it becomes ugly' ?
I was called out by one of those people (a troll) over some political comments I made. After I took the time and effort to explain myself, he posted an emoji laughing at me.
Use those trolls as a way to organise your thoughts. their replies only matter if they counter your arguments with a reasoned reply. If you feel they have a point adjust yours and report that adjustment. But be aware, their indoctrination means they cannot think like that. They are invested in their ideas as they support their own notion that they are a good person.
I've heard that many of the "sit in front of the camera" types are faking it - i.e. pre-recording the guitar part in as many sections as it takes to get a perfect rendition then miming to it with a DAW running in the background to make it look legit.
Yes...some are doing that. Roy isn't though. If he does a cut he changes the camera angle. So why is he getting accusations against him?
@@AndyEdwardsDrummer Probably because once you see him play you might want to throw your guitar in the bin. Mind you, doesn't have that effect on me. I don't want to play like anyone else (although I'll settle for a better version of me).
If someones faking it theyre destroying themselves , no fan help needed
"can't go wrong"...no wonder I don't like anything much that's put out these days, and I stopped tracking King Crimson as soon as I took one listen to my then new copy of Construktion Of Light round turn of century when it came out. In my book the whole giving over musical skills to computers to make 'perfect' recordings has given us the worst music in human history. I'm sick of the artificial sounds of the industry and crave the sounds of live instruments, recordings from the 30's through the 70's and even through the 80's and a little bit of the 90's. Drum machines and players who imitate them are no longer enjoyable to me. I feel like the wrong turn was already made when the Linn Drum came out. In this case the perfect has done a nasty job murdering what was good.
Flat line = dead.
Biscuits.
Roy is one of them
What does that mean?
The thing that i don't get is, how can an online critic have any effect on the career of anyone as talented as Roy Marchbank. Who pays any attention to those people?
The guitar world, that is who. I have worked in the world of prog for twenty years. I detect a certain nagativity about Roy across the whole guitar community. It's really not right.
I don't really know about the guitar world, listening to their opinions would put me off music
I miss punk music, miss the energy - the closer you get to perfection, the more the imperfection is magnified........
Computers made it possible to fake how good musicians are. I have been recording since the late 70's and I refuse to use a computer to track with.
Angry Edwards!😄
'Anger is an energy' John Lydon 1986
Rubber band around the fifth fret?
I get what you’re saying .. but really it is ‘faking it’. Meaning if you pass it off as you played it live then you are faking it. Period. That said, I think it’s fine to do whatever it takes in the studio to make a great song. But don’t try to act like you actually played it live
Watch Alien Love Secrets by Steve Vai. It is all mimed. This is the way the industry is. Faking it is what 99% of musicians do. Check out the new Metallica live video. That is not what they played. So my question is why ruin Roy's career when it is quite obvious he can play the stuff he is playing. These gatekeepers, as I said in the video, are focusing on two playthru videos he did to promote an album he was releasing. The vast majority of his RUclips is real playing. That is what I am discussing here. Gatekeepers mis representing creative musicians, and idiot musicians believing them
You tell them . Tear them that new Arshole that they deserve . Skip the other stuff and do what you do best besides play drums "Rant" , "Rant" , "Rant" and then some more "Rant" !
I have vague memory that I've seen this video before
No, I transcribed what I said then learnt it off by heart and filmed a new video wearing the same clothes.
When you ‘retrigger’ or ‘change pitch’ of ‘a coupe bum notes’, you are now a collage artist
What about if you do 50 takes to get it right? What if you don't record it in the room with the other musicians. The recording industry has been about collage for about 50 years. I addressed this in the video
If Ranting was an Olympic Event that Sir was a Gold Medalist Rant-gatekeeper-caller-outer performance, Just on the safe side before the medal is awarded I've imported the video into my editing software suite to check for any fake lip syncing Rants ................ and the Gold Medalist is ...................
I know I'm good at ranting...Stewart Lee is the master gold medalist however
Use the crap camera! Have you watched Uncle Larry?
Roy uses a hex pickup on some of his electric guitars to the Roland V guitar system (I use the same system) which has guitar to midi capability so it's very possible to do what he's doing. It's easy to assume he's faking what is happening but using a guitar synth/v guitar type setup allows you to not only use sounds not normally heard on the guitar but also playing with the attack of the notes - and even the pitch of the notes out of the normal guitar range - that combined with his stupefying technique there you go. He still has to play the guitar to achieve that - Don't discount the guy has probably practiced more than, well, anybody. There are fake players out there, but Roy isn't one of them. Notice too that some of those pointing the finger aren't players themselves or haven't played long enough to really know how hard it would be to play lines at that speed/accuracy.
Nonsense as usual - COSM and MIDI are different and I am sure I have explained this to you and others several times before now.. For once, do yourself a favour, desist in spreading inaccuracies about how you think I do what I do. Look forward to welcoming you to a front row seat at a Law of Thr3 gig and of course, we can have a chat afterwards.
But the guys accusing him are supposed to be experts. They are supposed to know about technique. To me it is obvious when Roy is playing synth sounds becuase it sounds like a sax or a flute etc. But these guys are saying it's midi when its a guitar going into his amp. Roy has really developed his guitar tone. It's astonishing. And these idiots cannot tell what is synth guitar and what is actual guitar. Roy also records all his solos live and does not record the midi. I have done this with VG88 and the midi does not track well at all. If that was midi that was being recorded then Roy should get a pat on the back for taking midi guitar to a level technologically that is not possible at the moment. But these so called experts aren't saying that. They are saying that his solos have been programmed or sped up. That is slander. These guys know about guitar, so why are they calling him out? I have read the conversations between Roy and these gatekeepers. They all know Roy has astonishing technique. So why try and ruin him? They are toxic and their acolytes are too stupid to see what is going on so they go spreading their mindless received opinions across the internet. They all seem pretty quiet here though don't they? Ignorant cowards....
@@AndyEdwardsDrummer With the V-Guitar system each string is processed individually via DSP. So a guy like Roy never has to deal with tracking delay because it’s not “tracking” in a conventional sense. But the more important thing is: he’s a musician not just a guitar player so that’s why when you hear a violin like sound he’s playing a line like a violin player would. Or a sax player. And most guitar players have very little experience with high tech guitar. I was going to do a demo myself because it’s so misunderstood. You can prove it’s not midi by scraping the pick along the edge of the lower strings windings and you will hear it. But frankly I would like to hear the naysayers records but they don’t have any.
@@aliensporebomb I have the VG88 system and know how it works. What Roy is being accused of is recording the guitar as midi and then editing it afterward. This is because they cannot deny he is playing at those speeds. But the recording of the midi is not great. The tracking of the guitar is very good but Roy uses the SWAM sounds on a laptop. But this is irrelevant as most of what you hear is a guitar into an amp.
Come on mate, hasn't Roy been at it for decades, well before RUclips? Have you left room for the possibility that his playing simply doesn't resonate with people? The criticism you're talking about is limited to one or two guitar forums. Literally NO ONE is making high-profile RUclips videos slamming the guy the way you're implying and there's a mere handful of people who give a rat's ass about Troy Grady forums. The ''cabal'' and 'plot' you're talking about is maybe 5 people - nowhere near enough to destroy a career.
It's admirable that you're trying to defend and promote your bandmate, but the real reason for Roy's lack of popularity is simply listeners making up their own mind.
When I started defending Roy, I did not know him. Someone sent me a video of his playing and I shared it and I was met with a wall of people saying it was fake. Because of this channel I am in contact with a large number of guitarists and I was met with an attitude towards Roy. It felt like contempt, and it's in your comment too. When I did meet Roy I was shocked to find out what a nice guy he is, and what an incredible guitarist. The thing I have realised is he does have his fans, as evidenced by the comments here, but the online structure means Roy's stuff does not get off the ground.
What is your opinion of Roy? How do you know there are no RUclips videos slamming him?
This . Its shite
And the Academy Award for Best Actor in a Useless RUclips Video goes to... Andy Edwards! 2:29
These twats are ruining people's career. I don't see why a bunch of anally retentive guitar nerds should be able to do that. Why should creative creative musicians be affected by the ignorant opinions of immature pedants. I wasn't acting, couldn't remember his name.
Not a fan of playback. Perhaps groups should record music that they can reproduce live without having to make major changes or worse yet add taped music during live performance.
There would be hardly any modern bands though
Internet Death Jam 3000
This again???
Is there any truth in the saying "there's no such thing as bad publicity"?
Is it possible we're only talking about Roy Marchbank because people have been calling him a fake?
This has really affected Roy's career negatively. He should be a houshold name in the guitar community. I have addressed certain issues I have seen in the prog world. I have done the same in the jazz world. And this who Instagram virtuoso guitar thing has some toxic apsects and I'm calling it out. I'm close to Roy so I have seen how this actually works up close. My association with Roy has come about through the direction of this channel. but also this video is out performing anything I have done for the last four weeks. So people are interested. I can understand you are not, check out my Matt Tavares interviews last week. They have some profound stuff in them.
@@AndyEdwardsDrummer It isn't that I'm not interested but I watched you do the same rant for an hour (??!!) only a couple of days ago.
Ok, here's another saying that you might not agree with:
"There's only one thing worse than people talking about you, and that's people not talking about you."
I wish Roy Marchbank every success. He deserves a wider audience.
Anyway, I hope it turns out that I'm right and you're wrong and the negative publicity actually does help bring him to people's attention.
AI isn’t the future, it’s already the past. The real future is live messy music played by people, not robots. We need energy not perfection. Quit bitching about musicians and start encouraging them and supporting live performances.
I'm not bitching about musicians in this video. I'm supporting them and calling out the gatekeepers