What I think is especially fun about this, is that the tentacles from the movies also have a triangular cross section and seeing how this moves, this might actually be the way to go about it
And in an old comic where they showed some schematics on how they imagined they worked, while the exterior was tubular, internally each segment was drawn to have 3 pistons in a triangular pattern, quite a lot like this build, just using a different type of motion to get it done.
For the second prototype feel like a smaller version of each segment to reduce the strain on the base might make it look even more like a real tentacle arm.
@@Harlequin_Actor nah, tapering is better. Materials have limits, geometry has... later limits :D The strain is the product of load and lever. Increasing the diameter linearly with the arm length (=lever] means the base has to handle the same useful loads as any element. The structural loads (weight of the arm itself) add up, though, so the diameter should increase faster than linear.
Yeah, I'm not sure how he got an odd number. I'd understand another mistake maybe, but to add even numbers to get an odd one is a first for me. I feel like a genius now, because this man is damn smart. Gotta take what you can get, I guess. This is our moment. 🧠🤓
@@Love_N_Let_Live Doc Ock had his own brain, and the tentacles had a neural link which was supposed to partially think for itself, and interpolate his thoughts to the tentacles It's why he talks to them
can we appreciate how impressive real tentacles from octopus and squid and such are. To have the degree of flexibilty while still retaining strength is ceaselessly amazing
They are really alien creatures tho all the cephalopods are just built different from all other creatures even in all our oceans and bodies of water what with some being able to camouflage themselves with any surroundings, change skin textures, mock certain animal shapes, and just overall intelligence. It’s just other worldly tbh.
That's some biology for you. Invertebrates muscles are actually crazy. Heck, all biological "actuators" are. Google 'sarcomere' and share your thoughts (that's basically the modular molecular motor assembly which is present in pretty much any muscle of any creature. It's really power-hungry, but immensely strong and, duh, stackable) With cephalopods there is this quirk: their "limbs" don't have any skeleton inside, pure muscle, some blood circulation system and nerves. This plus their rather tough skin for said muscles to latch onto gives them that crazy strength. Wanna go further? Go full exoskeleton, get all from biological muscles, become an insect.
Further showing that Dr. Octavious' fusion demonstration really glossed over the robotics miracle of his tentacles. Great video, really can't wait for the next version!
Robotics, Artificial Intelligence, Fusion Power, man machine interfacing. Any one of which would revolutionized our society and he was using all 4 in one demo.
Look into using flexures rather than pivots. It should be lighter, and the springiness will give a lot of inherent structural integrity. I've had good results combining PETG with spring-steel inserts and elastic.
One could also tune these to get a pretension that the tentacle stays upright without any strain on the servos in the default position. So the servos at the bottom would actually pulling down for some moves, instead of just resisting gravity less, as it is now.
I bet that would get very tricky, because it's under-constrained. There are a lot of positions that top plate can be in where there are multiple ways to get there. So when you go to solve for joint angles, you get multiple answers. Picking from among those answers adds a new wrinkle.
@@matthahne Actually no, parallel manipulators are very easy to solve the inverse kinematics. The forward kinematics are where it gets complicated and there are multiple solutions. It's sort of the opposite of a serial manipulator arm. For a typical Stewart-Gough platform, you basically just decide "I want my platform here," which tells you where all six attachment points will be in space. You know where the six anchor positions are on the base, and you just need to compute the length between those six pairs of points to calculate the actuator lengths. This implementation is a bit tricker due to the extra links he's stuck in mid-way to expand the workspace size, but it should still be possible to work out a one-to-one solution, I believe.
That's really cool!! One relatively simple way through code to add some organic-ness to the motion would be to propagate the input to each segment with a delay. So, for a tentacle-y feeling, pulse the input through the base segment, then a slight delay before the second, then the third. If propagated in the other direction (tip first, then mid, then base) it would probably look more like a snake, where the head is making a decision where to go.
In the film, Doc Ock's tentacles DO move in that snake-like way in some scenes for precisely the reason you describe! They want to imply that the tentacles are making all the decisions, so they have the motion start from the end effector so it looks like a "head"!
Doc Ock quite often uses his lower tentacles for stability, so that might help with the weight issue. Also, I would say it's already a work of art, even sans LEDs.
The weight issue still applies to the individual tentacles. He uses his lower two for stability so that he doesn't flip over when he lifts something heavy. Strain will always exist. It's merely a matter of knowing your limits.
6:44 It's uncanny to me, how this setup looks somewhat lifelike as you operate the joystick. Yes, it's moving mechanically, but it does it with flow, it feels alive because of that.
Could you change the kinematic model such that each segment starts moving a bit before the one below? I think that might give it a slightly more organic feel, like it's curling into each movement rather than leaning.
I am really surprised how organic this looks, especially with some segments inverted. But there are so many more ways to move such a system. Probably a reason why octopuses have such a large brain. This would also be an interesting movement problems for machine learning to improve in a simulation.
For the macro positioning, you could use a parametric spline function. As you know the length of each section, you can easily calculate the 3d slope at a given point along the curve, which will give you the normal for the platform that you can feed into the inverse kinematic function.
You should have the sections taper, get smaller and smaller towards the end. And you should definitely do a version with twisting. And more pronounced movements, wider range, more extension, more compression, more bending. So cool man. One of the top channels on RUclips. Always fascinating. Thanks.
Twisting is not really required if each section can move in any direction, you would only need rotation at the end for the gripper. And adding the rotation will add complexity and mode springiness in the movement, especially if you do not use some rim bearing. A central shaft would make it quite a lot less durable and wobbly.
In order to reduce the stress on the bottom tiers, you should make each tier slightly smaller than the last. This'll reduce the over-all weight as well. This also will help it look more similar to the source material.
I think it would be cool to try using pnematics for something like this! You can make it stretch and contract with very light materials! Not sure how the tubing would work though
The original comics uses something that looked like pistons. But they could probably be linear actuators in a shell. The problem otherwise with pheumatics is piping and valves, and you would probably go hydraulics since pneumatics using air get more springy, and would bounce a lot more.
What I see as an interesting use case for these three stages (maybe 4) is a flashlight/floodlight that follows a target that's been picked up by some sort of sensor-array. That way your security light doesn't just come on and flood the area, but roughly follows a target around - creating a much bigger feeling of "being followed" rather than just the whole yard lighting up...
Would love to see how it looks if the middle section was delayed 100 milliseconds, and the top delayed 200 milliseconds. OR if the top one responded first, then middle, then bottom. I think you'd get some really organic motions.
This is a super interesting design and implementation. I wonder if you might get quite a bit higher ratio of bend per segment by doubling the servo assembly on both the bottom and top of each segment -- basically, you would get twice the extension and compression for each segment, without adding any length, so even though your weight of motors would increase, you would still probably get a tighter radius of bend in fewer segments. As always, you're doing an incredible job pushing the edges of what's possible - I always love sending your videos to my Industrial Design university students, it's a great kick in the pants for them to just try something.
When you mentioned independent control of each section I started to think about ways to have more control over each section. There are 3 joints between the palm of your hand and the tip of your finger, so maybe it would be possible to have more independent control by controlling it with your fingers? Maybe you could use 3 or 4 fingers to control multiple directions. A device to accurately determine the position of each joint of your fingers may be a challenge though. It would probably require some kind of glove. Maybe with strings or a hydraulic system? One of the problems I currently see is that finger joints are rotational, so there isn't linear control for extension or retraction. Therefore horizontal movement and making the arm longer or shorter wouldn't be easily achievable with finger control. The thumb has a lot of control, so maybe you could have 3 points in space to switch between rotational, horizontal, or vertical motion? Like, you move use your thumb like it's one of the sticks on the controller. But if you have it in the bottom right you control horizontal movement, in the bottom left you control rotational movement, and at the top you can control vertical movement. Then you can also mix those types of movement by having your thumb in-between the positions. It sounds like an interesting way to control an arm, but I also expect it to have a steep learning curve 😅
That worm motion you mentioned would look really cool with 6 or so joints, i can imagine a pulsing motion periodically moving from the base of the tentacle to the tip, even when the arms are just still, it woyld make them look so full of life
you could make the bottom servos beefier and make each stage successively smaller and lighter, because it only has to be able to move what is above it, a bit like a pyramid
I feel like if you made 4 or 6 of these 3 section tentacles and put them on rotators connected to a platfrom, they would work quite well as legs (especially with the added supports you mention) because that heave/contraction motion could help with the clearance required to move a leg. Nice work!
I would love to see him build a robot like those from the Matrix movies. The eyes could be replaced with sensors that allow it to navigate its environment using some form of AI, like what boston dynamics use.
Good and nice job ! I would like to add that most probably every next segment of the tentacle should be scaled down to reduce the weight and force at the end of the tentacle itself. Like branches attached to the main trunk of the tree.
You have an amazing mind. The speed at which you come up with new ideas and bring them to fruition is so amazing. You inspire me to learn about computer code, and how to program. You have such a vast knowledge of computer programming and electronics. It’s very impressive.
Something to think about, use cables to strengthen and stabilize the segments. They don't need to move or actuate any part of the assembly, just hold it together at extreme angles.
You can also do a Tentacle that uses gravity as -y . That way you only need a motor that tenses cord counter gravity to lift, and have two similar motors that tense the tentacle sideways. Ideally the tensing motors would have a some paracord that it can deploy and recall to tense and relieve, they could be at the center of the tentacle to provide "elbow dynamics", use a sleeve to channel the cords, and some kind of aluminum spring deformed to conform to the desired shape of the tentacle... I think it should be inside of the sleeve and be a tight fit, so that the channels with the cord remain stable. I thinks this is much cheaper, and the design is much flexible with a much higher tolerance for error.
WOOOWWWWW I AM SO SO HONORED TO HAVE A LITTLE CAMEO IN THIS! Means a ton to me, even its just four seconds 😅😅 thank you so much! Also, your build is incredibly impressive, god damn
Two ideas for ways to modify the per-segment output: Provide an angular offset from each segment to the next, to get a helical kind of positioning. Have a delay between segments (either tip-to-base or base-to-tip) for a possibly even more organic motion.
Insane creation there. I couldn't understand anything or the mechanical, electronic or engineering side but I thoroughly enjoyed this contraption coming to life. Well well done!!!
An obvious minor upgrade is to route all the wires through the center. You would likely want to anchor the wires at the base of each segment with enough play to allow the full range of motion within that segment.
There's also some interesting work that's been done by Festo and Disney Research involving liquid or gas filled tubes instead of cable actuators. On either end of the line are syringes: when one is pushed the other is pulled
You don’t need the whole platform piece to rotate. Just the centre. Cut out a circle and make the whole price into a bearing or gear essentially with a motor controlling the rotation. Then attach the next platform to the middle circle.
Since the inside of each section is more or less hollow, it might be possible to add a servo within the top side of each segment that stands proud and connects to the base of the next segment above it, giving each section a kind of "wrist turn" motion. Granted it would be huge loads of math to process, but the additional flexibility and freedom of movement might be really neat!
This unlocked a memory for me, If you ever wanted inspiration for a skin for it Try checking out an Australian kid's show from the 90's called "Lift off" The whole show was a fever dream, but outside of the lift there was a living plant that was basically a tentacle with an eyeball on the end. I did a quick search and apparently the plant was called "Beverley"
now imagine if each of those sections was about 2 or 3 inches high but there were 50 stacked on top of each other and that's essentially what each tentacle in the movie version looks like it's made of. if you started with bigger segments at the base and slightly tapered them down to smaller segments at the far ends it might add support at the biggest places of stress while keeping the far ends as light as possible. it would also look like some Ock designs, as many have his tentacles tapering slightly as they go. definitely do more of this this has some real potential.
An excellent, though quite costly idea. I wonder how it'd affect the weight of the tentacle per foot of length? Also I would love if there were some way of surrounding each small segment in a hollow tube in order to get that comic book look, with enough of a gap between each that the segments can fully rotate. Though it likely isn't possible due to how the struts twist and turn in each segment. Unless maybe it's more of a shroud? Idk.
One suggestion I have would be rerouting the wiring to the interior of the arm. If you add a circular hole in the middle of each platform, you could use some form of wiring loom to protect everything from potential pinches or damage from the movement.
Great concept! I think you should move the cables to be in the middle of the tentacle. It does not only look nice, it also has the benefit of moving al lot less than they would when kept on the outside of the tentacle.
You should use rotational joints like they used building the " Newt Suit " for dry deep-sea diving. Each segment can rotate when a half nut ( like on a lathe) engages a central shaft that is threaded in both directions depending on how the half nut connects to it? Each segment would be flat on one side and have a 45-60 degree face on the other. The flats join with other flat faces and the angled sides connect to other angled segment faces. The central shaft drive would have U-joints at the bearing faces? I can see it in my head and I'm not explaining it very well? Sorry.
Fascinating. Not an engineer, so feel free to haze me hard if I say something stupid, but I could see pneumatic as being really good for this. If you had a central highly pressurised tube with connections at the base of each section, you could drive the stewart platform with pistons connected to solenoid controlled valves. Letting the pressure control the movement of the mechanise. I'd also sagest having each segment stacked around halfway (or whatever mathematically works) along the former, allowing a smother, more tentacle like movement due to the fact that this would allow the mechanise to efectivly counteract the angels necessary for a stewart platform to work. However, I have no idea how complicated this would be to get working right, if it's even posable, and if there would have to be some kind of mechanical stabilising ring that would lock the bace of each pistons position ,of each segment, to a parallel planer position to the base segment, no matter the place it holds in the chain. You could also use the expanding of the pressurised tube to help support the mass of the mechanise, having bracing rods paced on universal joints halfway along each piston and utilising the force exserted by the tube to hold them steady. This, I think, would solve the problem with the servos lower on the chain being under more stress and allow a more natural movement, as well as, since you would be using pistons, remove the problem of large amounts of joints coursing wobble. Not an engineer though, so just some plebs thoughts.
You could give the sections their own independent rotational movement if you used small electric hub motors mounted at the base of each structure, then instead of have a long central bar that spans each entire section you could have a smaller peg that slides the a bearing on the top of each section that sits flush with both section's surfaces.
I think all you really need for a tentacle is a set of stacked parts with 360 spin and single aces tilt motors. Other serape are just over complicates things.
You could also keep in mind how starfish and spiders move, I've seen a pretty crazy tentacle arm that works like a balloon, by inflating 3 different sections to get pitch and roll
I wonder how much the triangular platforms can be reduced in size, and how much closer to each other the long pieces can attach at the top, to give it proportions closer to a tentacle.
This looks awesome. One problem I see is controlling four of those at the same time, it might be a tad confusing with all those reverse switches. Other than that I think a hole in the middle for the cables to go in will be a nice last step for cleanup. Looking forward to version 2.0.
It looks like something which could be refined into a robotic arm with possibly enough dexterity to replace lighting and perform other ceiling work like hanging drywall in a safer, faster way from the floor.
don't calculate controls via trigonometry. it's annoying and error prone. instead, you know the destination position of the upper triangle, so you can calculate target length of each link, and from that length you calculate target angle. if you want velocity control, then do a small offset of the upper triangle in the direction where you want it to go, and then calculate the difference between the current angle of each servo vs this small displacement: your velocity needs to be proportional to this difference. it's like inverse kinematics, but it's fully constrained, so the problem is well defined and you can calculate all servo angles just from position of upper triangle relative to the lower one.
Another option is to put pneumatic or hydraulic cylinders along each side of the sections which take the brunt of the static load from each compounding tentacle. That way, the servos could be utilized for motion, and the cylinders for load.
you can achieve yaw with a stuart platform, you just dont have a great yaw component of force given the current actuators straight up/down orientation. Considering you have 3d translation and 2d rotation, this design actually has enough actuators for all 6dof but is leaving 1dof on the table with the geometry.
I have been trying to build a Stewart platform forever, but i could never find any help on programming anywhere. Thank You for your videos, in case no one has told you lately.
Start with a small tip with small servos, then work back toward the base with larger and more powerful servos, making the sections bigger each time. That way the servos at the base can handle the mass of the whole length :D
Have you seen the machine built by Carl Pisaturo? He's solved the problem of excessive weight at the far end by using a cable system that's really elegant.
Peristaltic motion worm is a great idea, you wouldn't even need the switches ,, you could just program the inverse of each section loop wise after each move.
Rotate the servos 90 degrees and fix them to a smaller base plate to allow for more tilt control. This won't be able to hold spiderman in a grip, he'll just slip through the hole due to abominably huge curve radius.
I'd imagine that as soon as you turn this sideways the servos will struggle to overcome gravity. Maybe some torsion springs in line with the servo axes could be added to counteract much of the force due to gravity so it's mostly just the inertia of the system the servos are having to overcome.
What I think is especially fun about this, is that the tentacles from the movies also have a triangular cross section and seeing how this moves, this might actually be the way to go about it
And in an old comic where they showed some schematics on how they imagined they worked, while the exterior was tubular, internally each segment was drawn to have 3 pistons in a triangular pattern, quite a lot like this build, just using a different type of motion to get it done.
@@davidmartensson273 Lots of people have put lot of thought into cómic book logic
I clicked this video and was "if they aren't triangles ima be mad" ...low an behold, they are. lol
Shorten the struts of each segment. Reinforce the motors. Augment with hydraulics.
Oh, yeah. It's all coming together.
For the second prototype feel like a smaller version of each segment to reduce the strain on the base might make it look even more like a real tentacle arm.
Or making the base out of stronger material and then moving to lighter material as you went further out
go big or go home!
@@Harlequin_Actor nah, tapering is better. Materials have limits, geometry has... later limits :D
The strain is the product of load and lever. Increasing the diameter linearly with the arm length (=lever] means the base has to handle the same useful loads as any element. The structural loads (weight of the arm itself) add up, though, so the diameter should increase faster than linear.
I also was going to suggest tapering segments, thank you for getting there first
@@Harlequin_Actor i guess it would be best to do both- taper and build them progressively lighter.
Ah yes 4+4=9
Yeah, it shout be 4 limbs, 4 artificial limbs, and 2 heads. So 10 really.
@@similar_username 2 heads? Whut?
Yeah, I'm not sure how he got an odd number. I'd understand another mistake maybe, but to add even numbers to get an odd one is a first for me.
I feel like a genius now, because this man is damn smart. Gotta take what you can get, I guess. This is our moment. 🧠🤓
@@Love_N_Let_Live Run it by a teenager. They'll get it real quick...
@@Love_N_Let_Live Doc Ock had his own brain, and the tentacles had a neural link which was supposed to partially think for itself, and interpolate his thoughts to the tentacles
It's why he talks to them
can we appreciate how impressive real tentacles from octopus and squid and such are. To have the degree of flexibilty while still retaining strength is ceaselessly amazing
Sure why not
They are really alien creatures tho all the cephalopods are just built different from all other creatures even in all our oceans and bodies of water what with some being able to camouflage themselves with any surroundings, change skin textures, mock certain animal shapes, and just overall intelligence. It’s just other worldly tbh.
Biology of crazy. Even the most basic organisms can be incredibly complex.
That's some biology for you. Invertebrates muscles are actually crazy.
Heck, all biological "actuators" are. Google 'sarcomere' and share your thoughts (that's basically the modular molecular motor assembly which is present in pretty much any muscle of any creature. It's really power-hungry, but immensely strong and, duh, stackable)
With cephalopods there is this quirk: their "limbs" don't have any skeleton inside, pure muscle, some blood circulation system and nerves. This plus their rather tough skin for said muscles to latch onto gives them that crazy strength. Wanna go further? Go full exoskeleton, get all from biological muscles, become an insect.
you SIMP for mother nature. im with ya
Further showing that Dr. Octavious' fusion demonstration really glossed over the robotics miracle of his tentacles. Great video, really can't wait for the next version!
I like how they fixed that in the Spider-Man game by having Doc Ock's research be about prosthetics.
Robotics, Artificial Intelligence, Fusion Power, man machine interfacing. Any one of which would revolutionized our society and he was using all 4 in one demo.
Look into using flexures rather than pivots. It should be lighter, and the springiness will give a lot of inherent structural integrity. I've had good results combining PETG with spring-steel inserts and elastic.
Was thinking something similar, possibly with the servo pulling the center to bend it.
One could also tune these to get a pretension that the tentacle stays upright without any strain on the servos in the default position. So the servos at the bottom would actually pulling down for some moves, instead of just resisting gravity less, as it is now.
Yeah and then using wires to control the placement of the tip, like how most mechanical hands work
Implementing inverse kinematics for the end effector plate would be a very interesting follow-up!!!
it would be a good opportunity to make a video on the inverse kinematics of parallel mechanisms!
I bet that would get very tricky, because it's under-constrained. There are a lot of positions that top plate can be in where there are multiple ways to get there. So when you go to solve for joint angles, you get multiple answers. Picking from among those answers adds a new wrinkle.
@@matthahne thats why we have random number generators
@@matthahne you could use something like FABRIC, which works for systems with multiple solutions.
@@matthahne Actually no, parallel manipulators are very easy to solve the inverse kinematics. The forward kinematics are where it gets complicated and there are multiple solutions. It's sort of the opposite of a serial manipulator arm. For a typical Stewart-Gough platform, you basically just decide "I want my platform here," which tells you where all six attachment points will be in space. You know where the six anchor positions are on the base, and you just need to compute the length between those six pairs of points to calculate the actuator lengths. This implementation is a bit tricker due to the extra links he's stuck in mid-way to expand the workspace size, but it should still be possible to work out a one-to-one solution, I believe.
Amount of servos this guy uses in his projects is mad. Respect ++
And I recall him having bearing and 3D printing sponsors, but servos? James might be a whale for AliExpress
Imagine the peak current draw 8o.
I for one cant get enough of that sci-fi servo sound :Q__
That's really cool!!
One relatively simple way through code to add some organic-ness to the motion would be to propagate the input to each segment with a delay. So, for a tentacle-y feeling, pulse the input through the base segment, then a slight delay before the second, then the third. If propagated in the other direction (tip first, then mid, then base) it would probably look more like a snake, where the head is making a decision where to go.
In the film, Doc Ock's tentacles DO move in that snake-like way in some scenes for precisely the reason you describe! They want to imply that the tentacles are making all the decisions, so they have the motion start from the end effector so it looks like a "head"!
This is exactly what I was thinking!
Damn I was gonna suggest that, that's basically what we do in 3d animation.
Really great video! And thank you for mentioning my work!
Doc Ock quite often uses his lower tentacles for stability, so that might help with the weight issue. Also, I would say it's already a work of art, even sans LEDs.
The weight issue still applies to the individual tentacles. He uses his lower two for stability so that he doesn't flip over when he lifts something heavy.
Strain will always exist. It's merely a matter of knowing your limits.
I too use my lower testicles for stability.
@@elijahbutterfield4869 r/cursedcomments
This is one of the coolest projects you've done in quite some time! Love it! Keep it up
I agree 100%
6:44
It's uncanny to me, how this setup looks somewhat lifelike as you operate the joystick.
Yes, it's moving mechanically, but it does it with flow, it feels alive because of that.
Could you change the kinematic model such that each segment starts moving a bit before the one below? I think that might give it a slightly more organic feel, like it's curling into each movement rather than leaning.
I'm always impressed by the scale of the projects you put out. It would take me months to design and build what you do in a week.
Practice
I am really surprised how organic this looks, especially with some segments inverted. But there are so many more ways to move such a system. Probably a reason why octopuses have such a large brain. This would also be an interesting movement problems for machine learning to improve in a simulation.
No other channel gets be as excited for an upload as James!
For the macro positioning, you could use a parametric spline function. As you know the length of each section, you can easily calculate the 3d slope at a given point along the curve, which will give you the normal for the platform that you can feed into the inverse kinematic function.
I’d love to see a movement that each stage mimics the motion before it, but with a slight delay. You could get a really cool snaking effect with it
Literally the coolest robot-building video I have ever seen! So thrilled for part 2!
It's amazing how you've managed to make something so mechanical seem so organic and alive!
Honestly...you are a genius! You're my inspiration for being at a STEM college right now! Thank you for making such cool stuff!
See, I have the oddest feeling that he’s gonna build a whole human, and keep it open source, so we can all build our own.. which.. I’m down for.
catgirls
With three sections I would say it really is more like a worm. The cords even look like the digestive tract.
You should have the sections taper, get smaller and smaller towards the end.
And you should definitely do a version with twisting.
And more pronounced movements, wider range, more extension, more compression, more bending.
So cool man. One of the top channels on RUclips. Always fascinating. Thanks.
Twisting is not really required if each section can move in any direction, you would only need rotation at the end for the gripper.
And adding the rotation will add complexity and mode springiness in the movement, especially if you do not use some rim bearing. A central shaft would make it quite a lot less durable and wobbly.
In order to reduce the stress on the bottom tiers, you should make each tier slightly smaller than the last. This'll reduce the over-all weight as well. This also will help it look more similar to the source material.
One of the best designs you have made! So amazing to watch!
I think it would be cool to try using pnematics for something like this! You can make it stretch and contract with very light materials! Not sure how the tubing would work though
The original comics uses something that looked like pistons. But they could probably be linear actuators in a shell.
The problem otherwise with pheumatics is piping and valves, and you would probably go hydraulics since pneumatics using air get more springy, and would bounce a lot more.
What I see as an interesting use case for these three stages (maybe 4) is a flashlight/floodlight that follows a target that's been picked up by some sort of sensor-array. That way your security light doesn't just come on and flood the area, but roughly follows a target around - creating a much bigger feeling of "being followed" rather than just the whole yard lighting up...
Would love to see how it looks if the middle section was delayed 100 milliseconds, and the top delayed 200 milliseconds. OR if the top one responded first, then middle, then bottom. I think you'd get some really organic motions.
This is a super interesting design and implementation. I wonder if you might get quite a bit higher ratio of bend per segment by doubling the servo assembly on both the bottom and top of each segment -- basically, you would get twice the extension and compression for each segment, without adding any length, so even though your weight of motors would increase, you would still probably get a tighter radius of bend in fewer segments. As always, you're doing an incredible job pushing the edges of what's possible - I always love sending your videos to my Industrial Design university students, it's a great kick in the pants for them to just try something.
We need version 2 asap! 😊
Who agrees with me?
"... Dock Ock has four tentacles and four of his own limbs, so that makes nine in total ... " written in the video description. But why nine?
Your forgetting the "third leg"
That's awesome! Can't wait to see the next version.
When you mentioned independent control of each section I started to think about ways to have more control over each section. There are 3 joints between the palm of your hand and the tip of your finger, so maybe it would be possible to have more independent control by controlling it with your fingers? Maybe you could use 3 or 4 fingers to control multiple directions. A device to accurately determine the position of each joint of your fingers may be a challenge though. It would probably require some kind of glove. Maybe with strings or a hydraulic system?
One of the problems I currently see is that finger joints are rotational, so there isn't linear control for extension or retraction. Therefore horizontal movement and making the arm longer or shorter wouldn't be easily achievable with finger control.
The thumb has a lot of control, so maybe you could have 3 points in space to switch between rotational, horizontal, or vertical motion? Like, you move use your thumb like it's one of the sticks on the controller. But if you have it in the bottom right you control horizontal movement, in the bottom left you control rotational movement, and at the top you can control vertical movement. Then you can also mix those types of movement by having your thumb in-between the positions.
It sounds like an interesting way to control an arm, but I also expect it to have a steep learning curve 😅
Very cool, I haven’t seen a project like this achieve such interesting motion so quickly before.
That worm motion you mentioned would look really cool with 6 or so joints, i can imagine a pulsing motion periodically moving from the base of the tentacle to the tip, even when the arms are just still, it woyld make them look so full of life
no its 8 limbs
what would be the 9th
wait a minute no no no nooooo
He must have watched the X rated version movie. That's not Doc Ock, that's Doc Cock.
But there's _two_ options, so it would still be 10!
Cool, reminds me a bit of your exoskeleton project. I expect you to rock the final build along with doc ock's spectacles.
This is the beginning of something amazing. I hope other RUclipsr do this too so the collaboration can push the idea further.
you could make the bottom servos beefier and make each stage successively smaller and lighter, because it only has to be able to move what is above it, a bit like a pyramid
man , i respect you soooo much for such projects cannt believe the time and effort put to this all my respect
I feel like if you made 4 or 6 of these 3 section tentacles and put them on rotators connected to a platfrom, they would work quite well as legs (especially with the added supports you mention) because that heave/contraction motion could help with the clearance required to move a leg. Nice work!
I would love to see him build a robot like those from the Matrix movies. The eyes could be replaced with sensors that allow it to navigate its environment using some form of AI, like what boston dynamics use.
not sure how to calculate the position for this type of stewart platform, but I know if you use linear actuators then it's fairly simple trigonometry
9 in total? Umm... 🤔
The guy's pretty good at building robots. He doesn't have to be a math wiz. ;^)
🍆🤔
Going to say it, I like these somewhat more number oriented and showing the math(s) ones. Good for you!
For V2 thoughts, can you use the yaw pole to be a pipe with running the wires through it?
Impressive use of taking an existing technology & putting it to an unintended use - the essence of invention.
Looking forward to v2.0.
This is so cool, more of this please
I would really like to see this upgraded in the way you mentioned it could be.
Good and nice job ! I would like to add that most probably every next segment of the tentacle should be scaled down to reduce the weight and force at the end of the tentacle itself. Like branches attached to the main trunk of the tree.
You have an amazing mind. The speed at which you come up with new ideas and bring them to fruition is so amazing. You inspire me to learn about computer code, and how to program. You have such a vast knowledge of computer programming and electronics. It’s very impressive.
Something to think about, use cables to strengthen and stabilize the segments. They don't need to move or actuate any part of the assembly, just hold it together at extreme angles.
You can also do a Tentacle that uses gravity as -y . That way you only need a motor that tenses cord counter gravity to lift, and have two similar motors that tense the tentacle sideways.
Ideally the tensing motors would have a some paracord that it can deploy and recall to tense and relieve, they could be at the center of the tentacle to provide "elbow dynamics", use a sleeve to channel the cords, and some kind of aluminum spring deformed to conform to the desired shape of the tentacle... I think it should be inside of the sleeve and be a tight fit, so that the channels with the cord remain stable.
I thinks this is much cheaper, and the design is much flexible with a much higher tolerance for error.
Really enjoyed this one. Look forward to seeing the idea develop
0:05 - 9 limbs you say... Wonder what the last one is?
Head.
Could be a good idea to mount it upside down so you don’t have to fight gravity quite as much.
This would matter more if you wanted to add more Stewart platforms
WOOOWWWWW I AM SO SO HONORED TO HAVE A LITTLE CAMEO IN THIS! Means a ton to me, even its just four seconds 😅😅 thank you so much! Also, your build is incredibly impressive, god damn
Two ideas for ways to modify the per-segment output:
Provide an angular offset from each segment to the next, to get a helical kind of positioning.
Have a delay between segments (either tip-to-base or base-to-tip) for a possibly even more organic motion.
4 robotic arms and 4 of his own limbs, making 9 total. Are you counting his 'mini doc' as well?
Insane creation there.
I couldn't understand anything or the mechanical, electronic or engineering side but I thoroughly enjoyed this contraption coming to life.
Well well done!!!
An obvious minor upgrade is to route all the wires through the center. You would likely want to anchor the wires at the base of each segment with enough play to allow the full range of motion within that segment.
There's also some interesting work that's been done by Festo and Disney Research involving liquid or gas filled tubes instead of cable actuators. On either end of the line are syringes: when one is pushed the other is pulled
You don’t need the whole platform piece to rotate. Just the centre. Cut out a circle and make the whole price into a bearing or gear essentially with a motor controlling the rotation. Then attach the next platform to the middle circle.
00:05 Doc Oc has 4 tentacles and 4 of his own limbs. So that makes 9 in total... Nice ;)
Since the inside of each section is more or less hollow, it might be possible to add a servo within the top side of each segment that stands proud and connects to the base of the next segment above it, giving each section a kind of "wrist turn" motion. Granted it would be huge loads of math to process, but the additional flexibility and freedom of movement might be really neat!
i am begging for a 2.0 of this!!!! absolutely mind boggling
"Looks like we got competition."
This unlocked a memory for me, If you ever wanted inspiration for a skin for it Try checking out an Australian kid's show from the 90's called "Lift off"
The whole show was a fever dream, but outside of the lift there was a living plant that was basically a tentacle with an eyeball on the end. I did a quick search and apparently the plant was called "Beverley"
Another step closer to evil mad scientist for James Bruton. I am in full support of this.
now imagine if each of those sections was about 2 or 3 inches high but there were 50 stacked on top of each other and that's essentially what each tentacle in the movie version looks like it's made of. if you started with bigger segments at the base and slightly tapered them down to smaller segments at the far ends it might add support at the biggest places of stress while keeping the far ends as light as possible. it would also look like some Ock designs, as many have his tentacles tapering slightly as they go. definitely do more of this this has some real potential.
An excellent, though quite costly idea. I wonder how it'd affect the weight of the tentacle per foot of length? Also I would love if there were some way of surrounding each small segment in a hollow tube in order to get that comic book look, with enough of a gap between each that the segments can fully rotate. Though it likely isn't possible due to how the struts twist and turn in each segment. Unless maybe it's more of a shroud? Idk.
I really like the Groot dance lol
One suggestion I have would be rerouting the wiring to the interior of the arm. If you add a circular hole in the middle of each platform, you could use some form of wiring loom to protect everything from potential pinches or damage from the movement.
Great concept! I think you should move the cables to be in the middle of the tentacle. It does not only look nice, it also has the benefit of moving al lot less than they would when kept on the outside of the tentacle.
You should use rotational joints like they used building the " Newt Suit " for dry deep-sea diving. Each segment can rotate when a half nut ( like on a lathe) engages a central shaft that is threaded in both directions depending on how the half nut connects to it? Each segment would be flat on one side and have a 45-60 degree face on the other. The flats join with other flat faces and the angled sides connect to other angled segment faces. The central shaft drive would have U-joints at the bearing faces? I can see it in my head and I'm not explaining it very well? Sorry.
Fascinating.
Not an engineer, so feel free to haze me hard if I say something stupid, but I could see pneumatic as being really good for this.
If you had a central highly pressurised tube with connections at the base of each section, you could drive the stewart platform with pistons connected to solenoid controlled valves. Letting the pressure control the movement of the mechanise. I'd also sagest having each segment stacked around halfway (or whatever mathematically works) along the former, allowing a smother, more tentacle like movement due to the fact that this would allow the mechanise to efectivly counteract the angels necessary for a stewart platform to work. However, I have no idea how complicated this would be to get working right, if it's even posable, and if there would have to be some kind of mechanical stabilising ring that would lock the bace of each pistons position ,of each segment, to a parallel planer position to the base segment, no matter the place it holds in the chain.
You could also use the expanding of the pressurised tube to help support the mass of the mechanise, having bracing rods paced on universal joints halfway along each piston and utilising the force exserted by the tube to hold them steady.
This, I think, would solve the problem with the servos lower on the chain being under more stress and allow a more natural movement, as well as, since you would be using pistons, remove the problem of large amounts of joints coursing wobble.
Not an engineer though, so just some plebs thoughts.
Amazing work, James! I always love the complexity of movement you manage to get out of simple servo movements & a bit of maths.
You could give the sections their own independent rotational movement if you used small electric hub motors mounted at the base of each structure, then instead of have a long central bar that spans each entire section you could have a smaller peg that slides the a bearing on the top of each section that sits flush with both section's surfaces.
I think all you really need for a tentacle is a set of stacked parts with 360 spin and single aces tilt motors. Other serape are just over complicates things.
You could probably reduce a lot of weight by taking material out of those upper plates, to reduce strain on the servos and add more sections
This looks really fun to use
You could also keep in mind how starfish and spiders move, I've seen a pretty crazy tentacle arm that works like a balloon, by inflating 3 different sections to get pitch and roll
The organic movement on this is so good.
I wonder how much the triangular platforms can be reduced in size, and how much closer to each other the long pieces can attach at the top, to give it proportions closer to a tentacle.
This looks awesome. One problem I see is controlling four of those at the same time, it might be a tad confusing with all those reverse switches. Other than that I think a hole in the middle for the cables to go in will be a nice last step for cleanup. Looking forward to version 2.0.
It looks like something which could be refined into a robotic arm with possibly enough dexterity to replace lighting and perform other ceiling work like hanging drywall in a safer, faster way from the floor.
don't calculate controls via trigonometry. it's annoying and error prone. instead, you know the destination position of the upper triangle, so you can calculate target length of each link, and from that length you calculate target angle.
if you want velocity control, then do a small offset of the upper triangle in the direction where you want it to go, and then calculate the difference between the current angle of each servo vs this small displacement: your velocity needs to be proportional to this difference.
it's like inverse kinematics, but it's fully constrained, so the problem is well defined and you can calculate all servo angles just from position of upper triangle relative to the lower one.
Next is a full scale K2SO?
Another option is to put pneumatic or hydraulic cylinders along each side of the sections which take the brunt of the static load from each compounding tentacle. That way, the servos could be utilized for motion, and the cylinders for load.
you can achieve yaw with a stuart platform, you just dont have a great yaw component of force given the current actuators straight up/down orientation. Considering you have 3d translation and 2d rotation, this design actually has enough actuators for all 6dof but is leaving 1dof on the table with the geometry.
Excellent work. Perhaps some elastic supports would reduce the potential strain on each servo and add a bit of stiction to each joint.
Maybe having the base servos be twice bigger and stronger than the top ones would help
Like how a real tentacle tapers towards the ends
I have been trying to build a Stewart platform forever, but i could never find any help on programming anywhere. Thank You for your videos, in case no one has told you lately.
Start with a small tip with small servos, then work back toward the base with larger and more powerful servos, making the sections bigger each time. That way the servos at the base can handle the mass of the whole length :D
It doesn't look much like a tentacle but it sure as heck looks like a great big robotic neck.
Have you seen the machine built by Carl Pisaturo? He's solved the problem of excessive weight at the far end by using a cable system that's really elegant.
Peristaltic motion worm is a great idea, you wouldn't even need the switches ,, you could just program the inverse of each section loop wise after each move.
I’d have to say the best part of learning in my opinion is seeing something that you have no idea how it works, and then learning how it works
Rotate the servos 90 degrees and fix them to a smaller base plate to allow for more tilt control. This won't be able to hold spiderman in a grip, he'll just slip through the hole due to abominably huge curve radius.
I'd imagine that as soon as you turn this sideways the servos will struggle to overcome gravity.
Maybe some torsion springs in line with the servo axes could be added to counteract much of the force due to gravity so it's mostly just the inertia of the system the servos are having to overcome.
Great build! You might get more reach adding smaller levels say 10% smaller each level. Your tripod legs would make a nice gripper!