Kenneth Williams and Jimmy Reid - Parkinson 1973
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- Опубликовано: 21 фев 2020
- In early 1973, Kenneth Williams was a guest on the Parkinson Show, with actress Maggie Smith and Poet Laureate Sir John Betjeman. He became involved in a heated exchange with Michael Parkinson over the conduct of the trade union movement, and social and political ideologies more generally. Although by today's standards it was fairly mild, it garnered such a reaction that Kenneth was invited back to debate with union leader Jimmy Reid for a special show.
The complete segment from the preceding show can be found here;
• Michael Parkinson, Ken...
Six years later in 1979, Jimmy Reid appeared in an unlikely trio of guests with Billy Connolly and Lauren Bacall. Link to that companion upload here;
• Classic Parkinson: 197...
At the time of the debate episode with Kenneth Williams, Jimmy Reid had recently taken on the Heath government, staging a "work-in" at Upper-Clyde Shipbuilders in protest against plans to close the shipyard, with the loss of up to 6 000 jobs. The unusual industrial action received global attention, and the Heath government backed down, extending subsidies to keep the yard operating.
Whichever side of the argument you might be on, this is an illuminating debate, which provides a fascinating snapshot of 1970s Britain, and a side of Kenneth Williams rarely seen.
#KennethWilliams #MichaelParkinson #JimmyReid #socialissues #politicaldebate #politics #1970s #Britain #tradeunions #socialhistory
www.georgefairbrother.com/
RIP PARKY. Michael Parkinson has passed away, August 16th, 2023, aged 88. 🙏
Rip Michael parkinson. I have to say this is my favourite interview with the legend Jimmy Reid.
Two people speaking from the heart about what they believe. A host giving them time and space to air their views, and a BBC providing a platform for all of the above. This is the world we have lost.
Only lost to mainstream media (BBC, ITV). It can still be found abundantly if you know which channels to watch
@@GEOFF0906Would you care to say which channels those are?
@@martydav9475 yeah
me too lol 🙂😉
@@martydav9475 JRE is the best example to me
Entirely yes!
Jimmy Reid a real working class hero who never sold out.
I stood in Govan shipyard as a young man listening to Jimmy put fire in our bellies and understanding in our heads.
Yeah, he was your pimp. Brainwashing you into hating the people that gave you the chance to earn a living and feed your families so he could skim off your hard earned wages and not have to work hard himself
Total predator of the highest order. All trade union parasites should have gone to prison.
The days of respectful debate, and treating the audience as intelligent - it's like a parallel universe.
Jimmy Reid RIP, what a class human being intelligent and hilarious, never once felt anything but at ease in his company selfless.
And we are still fighting for our rights against the elite that Jimmy Reid was fighting back in the 1970's. We are still being screwed over by the Tories!
Absolutely right.
There are some comments below regarding a poem that Jimmy read on the show. It wasn't actually during the show, it was during the soundcheck and is a story worth telling. I saw this account on a TV show years ago and have never forgotten it.
Kenneth prided himself on his powers of debate and in the weeks preceding this interview had made disparaging remarks regarding the militant ship workers and Trades Unions in general and was relishing the thought of wiping the floor with this working class oik on national TV. What he didn't realise was that Jimmy had gained a formidable (self-taught) intellect of his own through years of hard work studying at night-school. Before the show they asked each man to test their microphones and Kenneth reeled of a few lines of poetry, turned to Jimmy and said (condescendingly) "I bet you don't know who wrote that?" "It was Keats" replied Jimmy, quick as a flash. Then Jimmy tested his mike and he too recited a few lines of eloquent poetry. He turned to Kenneth and asked him the same question and Williams was forced to admit he didn't know. That's when Jimmy played his ace by replying "I did!" Apparently, it totally deflated Williams who had the wind well and truly taken out of his sails, which is why he comes across a bit agitated and antsy in this interview.
Jimmy Reid was a true working class hero when being working class meant something. My late father, a lifelong socialist Glaswegian worshipped him. I can see why.
Wow. Truly epic battle.
That explains so much. KW's whole demeanour and body language in the first few minutes is defensive and slightly petulant, so unlike his normal expansive self. I love KW, incidentally, but this is so fascinating to watch.
A remarkable sorry. I love Kenneth Williams but I enjoyed it all the same. Thank you for sharing. It's comments like yours that make the much derided RUclips comments sections worth reading.
Unions are nothing to do with representing the working class......the Labour Party are an elitist London-centric clique who totally despise the working class. Jimmy Reid may have been a good guy...as were many in the unions but their overall management were no more than part of the system.
@@allybally0021 You can't compare now to then - I agree with your comments on the current 'Labour' party.
It's mad how what Jimmy Reid was talking about with health workers is still happening.
Fast forward to 2020/21.
You have Graham Norton and a couple of giant egos...
The '70's really was a golden age on so many levels.
It’s really changed. There is no industrial power now, and union power has correspondingly weakened.
You never see real issues discussed now. It’s all about diversity and such like. The women standing up and talking about the real consequences for her children. Great!
@@richardjames1431 Agreed
Our attention spans are all over the place with hundreds of crap TV channels, 24/7 rolling news, social media etc etc. I do miss the days when we had 3 or 4 TV channels and meaty topics like this would attract large audiences which became water cooler moments at work on Monday. Rose tinted specs perhaps a little but I do miss those big moments.
This was unusual in the 70s and didn't happen again as a boss at the BBC advised the Parkinson producers that this kind of change within the Parkinson format should not happen again.
@@Omnicient. It kind of did happen again; BBC's Question Time first aired in the late 70s based on an invited audience with pre-prepared questions. Who would have thought the Parkinson show trail blazed the format?!!!
can you imagine..
these days lol
thankyou for sharing this! 🙂 x
Thanks for commenting, this kind of debate seems to be a lost art, sadly.
@@GeorgeFairbrother i like to hope, maybe, in some obscure corner...
a comment section on a video even? lol
i know i've chatted a bit with people here on RUclips..
stimulated by good content like this..
thanks again 🙂
Our IQ's have faded so badly since then. Where on Earth would you find a debate like this on our screens now?..
Fantastic upload though - thanks so much for sharing. 👍👍👍
Very glad you enjoyed it, I love it as well. Thanks for commenting.
@@nettils5555 All great points, thanks for commenting. I often think of an episode of Alan Partridge from the 90s when he's pitching programme ideas to the BBC commissioning editor...apparently ludicrous concepts like 'Lady Shapes', 'Inner City Sumo' and 'Cooking in Prison' and a few others so inconceivable that the studio audience are in hysterics. A generation later, they actually sound quite sensible based on current programming, and probably have all been done one way or the other.
I'd say that IQs haven't faded... there's just been a dumbing down in the media and politics...
The IQs are still there but not amplified in the media.
The working and middle class have definitely been dumbed down and it will get worse. Probably deliberately so that they will be easier to manipulate.
Imagine a discussion on that level on tv in 2020 😞
You're right. Not quite the same now, is it.
I like how at the end Kenneth Williams softened and said that everyone is due equal opportunity to housing, education, etc
Wouldn't be happening! The Labour are Marxists, the Torues are now control freaks, the LibDems haven't got a clue, the Greens want the UK to stop "climate change" by 100% when UK only give less than 1% of this supposed crap, and the rest just want to get more expenses for doing nothing!
Different time. Social media dumbing down society. I strangely remember this at the time.
@@ruthcollins5140 if you labour are marxists today, they were certainly marxists then
Exactly 50 years on, and Reid & Williams long departed, but how relevant this debate is in today's current Britain.
I'm shocked by how young Maggie Smith looks, how camp KW sounds, how erudite Jimmy Reid was, and how high the overall level of discussion was for a late night mainstream TV talk show. Great days in retrospect, we shall not see their like again.
All excellent points!
I don't accept that we can't have quality programming like this again
Absolutely fascinating, transfixing. I find it so odd that there’s parts where Kenneth is being deadly serious, but the audience laugh, because they think everything he did was for a laugh, when it was merely his manner.
What a wonderful man Jimmy Reid was.
Why do you say that about Jimmy Reid. Was he more ‘wonderful’ than Kenneth, Nick Heath?
@@janeelstree4984 Williams doesn't come across particularly well in this interview, imo. Perhaps Nick feels the same.
Williams was totally shown up by Jimmy Reid. He had no empathy for people who had come from backgrounds like his, and was the classic example of the "I've done alright for myself and sod the rest of you" attitude that Thatcher embodied.
@@bessiehillum6498 Utter bollocks.
@@kendalbintnot really he hated Tories he's Welsh we are literally the opposite of Tories even treacherous scum. It's more like Jimmy is arguing for a better future and Kenneth is saying what is now They're basically having two separate conversations that's why they disagree if they were having the same conversation they would agree. Jimmy is rightly looking ahead where is Kenneth is limited ironically by his lack of imagination probably too much drink where is Jimmy doesn't seem to sort to need a drink to perform 🤔. You cannot boil celts down to politics that is in English priority we transcend Germanic b******* we speak as humans not as political animals.
I met Jimmy Reid at a reception in Glasgow a number of years ago. I talked to him for about 20 minutes. During that time he asked me all sorts of questions about myself. I tried repeatedly to turn the conversation round to talk about home but with limited success. I relayed this conversation to others who knew Jimmy well and they all said that it was typical of Jimmy. He had an endless interest in other people; he wanted to know what made them tick. Although I didn't get him to talk much about himself (we had both worked for the same newspaper company - but not at the same time - so I knew something of him anyway) I found home a hugely engaging, intelligent and likeable individual.
'Home' should be 'him'.
Thanks so much for sharing that personal insight. Always nice to see the human side.
The best, one of the very best Parkinson interviews. The likes of Ross, Norten and Corden can never hold a candle to Parkinson. I'm not familiar with Jimmy Reid but makes an excellent contribution. All 3 men are sadly no longer with us. There will never be another like Michael Parkinson A true legend who has interviewed many legends, and a gentleman. This might have become the benchmark for Question Time.
Thank you so much for uploading this gem from sadly a bygone era. Most edifying.
You are very welcome and I'm so glad you enjoyed it
What a wonderful, dignified contributor Mrs Pearce is. The overall standard of debate is high, not necessarily intellectually, but the honesty, the respect, the openness - seem a lot higher than the closed-minded soundbites you get from TV audiences in 2021.
These were the days people were able to talk in complete sentences and to listen to the other persons view. Now it is all sound bites and interruptions.
I wonder what happened to Mrs Pearce and her sons
The head teachers concerns about comprehensive education came true.
Respectful gentlemanly debate.
Wonderful to watch. These kinds of honest, earthy current event discussions no longer exist sadly. As someone else said, debate these days is completely stifled.
I think not only stifled but also hijacked by people who can't have a disagreement without generalising and name-calling. I think that 24 hour news channels are not always a force for good in this way, although they like to blame social media.
Public Service Broadcasting - Fascinating to watch... imagine getting that level of intelligent interaction and debate on mainstream TV in 2021
it would be impossible as we lack Quality individuals
According to Kenneth Williams' diaries, the BBC saw to it that this was never to happen again, with a 'keep it light' attitude prevailing from then onwards.
The discussion on this show feels very different, because it genuinely sought to involve everyone, rather than Question Time's facade of doing so.
@@elvisleeboy A real pity. Clearly they didn't understand the quality of what the had there.
@@herbertdaly5190 Or perhaps they knew all too well, because had this sort discussion involving everyone been a regular occurrence on national television, rather than just those who the BBC deem to worthy of airing their views, it would have produced a vastly different outcome.
Jimmy Reid, what a class act
Wow! You tend to forget what a real chat show used to be
Michael Parkinson rather misrepresented this later in his life. In a documentary about Kenneth, he gave the impression that Kenneth Williams spent the entire episode sulking and withdrawn, so when I viewed this for the first time myself, it came as a surprise to see that, whilst possibly anxious and not quite his usual uninhibited self, he conducted himself admirably and more than held his own.
This particular show is remarkable, in that it is highly unusual for what was an entertainment programme, to break off and address these serious issues. According to Kenneth's diaries, the BBC sought to avoid this sort of thing from then onwards.
Parkinson didn't like Kenneth Williams.
@@ppuh6tfrz646 Yes, he said so later, but I'm not convinced. I think perhaps it may have been a case of him having subsequently read the snarky remarks Kenneth wrote about him in his diaries, and him not wanting to lose face, so he retrospectively claimed that the feeling was mutual.
I think he did like Kenneth, and was completely unaware that Kenneth disliked him until he picked up his diaries. Many people who spent time with Ken had a similar experience.
Ken though did warm to Parkinson later on, as his diaries also record. I'm pretty sure that Parkinson wouldn't have had someone on so often as a guest, had he loathed them as much as he later claimed.
@@ppuh6tfrz646and he made it very obvious.. not professional.
I have been searching for this for ten years and was beginning to think that it was just a figment of my imagination. Thankyou so much for uploading, it hasn't disappointed in its thought provoking content.
I'm so glad you finally found it, and enjoyed it. I hope it was as good as you remembered.
What a guy Jimmy was! A true working - class hero! Let God bless and protect him.
A working class hero telling others to go on strike whilst still pulling his Trades Union salary? Aye the man was a Saint, right up there with that other self serving charlatan Scargill
Platitudes, fucking no sense
Are you fucking joking
smoking away and not even listening. He's entitled.
@@nigelbaldwin6438 that would be the strike that saved 800 jobs?
I loved watching this. I was a teenager at the time and it is still so vivid in my old memories. Magic. Life was better then.
Well never get them days back now we've got brain dead reality stars.
And thousands of vloggers here on yt who do and say nothing but give me your moneyyyyy
Brilliant show! Thanks for posting... highly relevant issues even 50 years on
Thanks for commenting. I agree, it remains a fascinating debate, even if some of the attitudes are perhaps a little cringeworthy by today's standards - the references to 'brain damage' for instance, and Parky correcting an audience member and calling her 'luv'; but you certainly can't doubt the sincerity, and you're right about the relevance now. Sadly.
Bloody hell we haven’t moved on have we? Jimmy Reid is so passionate to change the lives of people who are in any society, exploited. This kind of intelligent discussion would not be allowed in 2022 because it is too raw.
Fabulous debate from two learned men whom I respect greatly. Great to watch.
How thrilling to hear Jimmy Reid speak so coherently and passionately in defence of working class people! The Labour party meant something then. My Canadian father was an MP and MLA for the New Democrats, a democratic socialist party. These parties are watered down considerably now, but I was proud to be part of their philosophy in those days.
I remember this at the time. Anyone who thinks this wouldn't happen now should be aware that the idea that a self-confessed communist trade unionist getting this kind of prime-time to get a genuine hearing on a show watched by millions was unusual then. We already remember the old BBC Parky shows as old Hollywood celebs and Billy Connolly but this might be his finest hour.
There is absolutely nothing like this happening on British television nowadays. Everything now is ‘dumbed down’, puerile reality shows, most present tv encompasses the lowest common denominator, an insult to everyone’s intellect. All three here are putting their views/opinions so credibly that is impressive. One audience commentator suggested our society could regress, I think that has come to pass. Our society now is almost entirely centred on greed.
Imagine if our politicians could have a debate like this , with this level of discourse and mutual respect despite opposing views... tip of the hat to both these gentlemen
Couldn't agree more
This shows you the dire lowering of televisual standards of today.
Thank you for uploading this programme, wonderful! Excellent dialectic. Kenneth Williams's flat was replaced by office development. "Society should be run on the basis of social need and not private greed."
I'm so glad you enjoyed it, I find it endlessly fascinating myself.
Great proud man.
@@GeorgeFairbrother thank you for this wonderful opportunity.
The quality of the expressions of opinion - even from the audience - is massively above anything we see today. People on today's equivalent programmes would be shouting over other, and yet mostly totally incapable of voicing reasoned argument to back up their point of view.
How sad that is.
That's the influence of America for you; we have been culturally and linguistically colonised by the USA, and you can see it in our degraded dress sense, slobby attitudes to food and speech, expanding waistlines, increasing use of emotion over reason, and 'winning' by shouting over the other person in an argument.
Contrast this with chat shows today. It's incredible just how much society has been dumbed down over the past 50 years.
Arguments seldom heard now.
...And with a real sense of sincerity and authenticity borne out of personal experience.
Kenny was a great gentleman and genuine human being. His candour and simplicity is delightful.
Great to see this in full finally; many thanks.
Thanks and I'm very glad you enjoyed it.
Jimmy Reid was a principled giant of a man.
Very high quality debate. Such a thing does not exist anymore. How we have dumbed down.
Yes.
Utter class we just don’t get the same level of debate today
I wish TV discussion shows could be conducted like this now.
Gosh..just started watching this..Society hasn't got any better since the 1970s. Brilliant interview
Oh, for the days when a TV audience for a prime time chat show could be a genuine public political forum. Even public political party meetings are a thing of the past.
I agree. I like the fact that it was possible to have a serious and robust disagreement, over a sustained period, without things degenerating into juvenile name calling. Social media seems to get much of the blame for everything that is wrong with modern debate, but I think so called 'opinion' commentators in the big media organisations have contributed in the race to the bottom.
wonderful to see this back on youtube. the full programme was on a year or maybe 2 ago but vanished after a while. Thanks ever so much George.
Thanks, Ian, it's a real favourite of mine as well.
So many echos for today in what Jimmy Reid said during that debate 50 years ago. Tony Benn often said that every generation must refight the same battles; it’s so true.
Amazing that the debate is still relevant now in 2024 as it was in the 1970s. Such a great shame
George Fairbrother. You are a wonderful Man to share this epic interview. Thank you.
Thank you, Norma. I'm so glad you enjoyed it.
I find Kenneth Williams endearing, admirable, intelligent and erudite; but there are some terrifying and brutal gaps in the heart of his worldview. However - appreciate his willingness to listen and find points of agreement.
Extremely well put, I thought. Totally agree.
You forget he was relatively uneducated. Despite that he shows incredible insight, intelligence, morality and foresight.
he was blaming the working class and poor for being poor and not the environment and economic circumstances in which they live.
Jimmy Reid was fucking brilliant.
I love how Kenneth stood up for himself here.
you're right. he did stand up for "himself" didn't he.
Yes, and got put down by Parky rather too much. We loved Kenneth, still do, I was so sorry about his suicide.
@@eatmywordsNot really, considering that he was strongly advocating for the right of choice for individuals. For example, he expressed his lack of resentment for those more successful and richer than him. Kenneth didn't get to where he got to via charitable handouts, he got there through resilience and his ability to offer something to people that they wanted.
Amazing eloquent debate. Such a great shame that it is still as relevant now in 2024 as it was in the 1970s
Well, I was always taught by my mum when I said we couldn’t afford to stay at the Ritz - “well darling, we can always go to tea”. And we did! Many times. 😂. When I started work, I used to take her for lunch. Dinner was too expensive 😂
good point, and a nice thing to do, too...My mum, oftentimes, used to visit 'The Europa' Belfast's most posh hotel, and the most bombed hotel in the world...But, more interestingly, it was opposite the best pub in Belfast. The Crown Bar....
Been wanting to see this debate for years... Thanks
I've found this today on a day when nurses are striking for a large pay rise, interesting points made here. Always loved Kenneth, got upset when he passed away.
I agree with Jimmy about putting certain people on boats abroad and not noticing that they have gone.
Numerous quango members, charity bosses, civil servants, race baiting careerists..
And perhaps some media 'opinion' commentators...
:p
Thank you for this upload
Thank you, so glad you enjoyed it. They don't make 'em like this anymore. 😅
Superb interviewing and entertainment . What a difference from today's rubbish
50 years on and nothing's changed. One wonders if it ever will.
Excellent discussion and surprisingly as relevant as ever.
How did I know he was gonna be a Scotsman? Great debate and great entertainment.
Would be wonderful, if true and honest unions still existed. We need them now very much again. A great conversation. 2 wonderful individuals.
As would it be wonderful if true and honest government existed
JR is a working-class hero!
A great example of scapegoating unions for the incompetencies of government.
Fabulous debate! Could never happen today!
Many thanks for this.
You're very welcome
Hats off the man. Anyone attempting to bring this kind of debate to tv now would cancel out Kenneth and not even bat an eyelid.
Simply brilliant. Thank you. 😊
Very glad you enjoyed it.
An adult debate for a change. Hard to find these days
I've never previously come across Jimmy Reid but have been completely balled over. I'm now a fan!
Agreed. Even if you don't subscribe to all of his political views, his passion and desire to try and improve people's lives, or perhaps empower them to improve their own regardless of circumstance, is something to be respected and admired enormously. I'm glad you enjoyed the video.
I'm was lucky enough to have in the back of my taxi now night many years ago what a lovely man he was
The phrase is "bowled over", not "balled over". It's a cricket term alluding to all of the bales bing knocked of the wicket by the ball. Where reid faield was in his outlook being so narrow. he failed to see the need of the country as a whole and would have happpily chosen communism to beter the lot of his class, which would have seen the entire country descend into shabby chaos.
Jimmy Reid was extremely well known in Scotland. I'm 61 and I remember him from a very young age. I used to watch Parkinson with my parents in the 70s , I've never seen this one before. It's a gem.
For those who might be interested in how the relationship between Kenneth Williams and Michael Parkinson unfolded in the ensuing years, they had a very enjoyable, warm and friendly encounter in July of 1987, when Parky was hosting the BBC's Desert Island Discs programme and KW was his guest. Link here to the BBC website to listen or download;
www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p009mljj
Parky "can you see Maggie Smith growing into one of our favourites?" - " ....... 'yes undoubtedly' Williams. ..... thank you George
The then controller of BBC One, Paul Fox hated this edition of Parkinson, especially the audience being able to ask questions and the confrontational nature, that he told Parkinson never ever again to go into this area of politics, otherwise his show would be cancelled.
@@johnking5174 Thank you for adding that - fascinating.
Parkinson's point here was a good one: that regardless, or perhaps because of Kenneth William's experience of being born to a blue collar background, his views paradoxically support and endorse privileged, middle and upper middle class people. Other British public intellectuals over the years have suggested much the same. For example, the assertion that Margaret Thatcher's success turned on the surprising support of a blue collar electorate, whilst her project was to economically and politically support the high end of town.
I always find it quite fascinating that KW close to the end also starts talking about things like housing and education as a fundamental right. It's all fascinating stuff.
Parkinson described this as Williams' worst performance, and I'm inclined to agree. He seems well-informed, but there's a lot of backtracking and logical subtefuge in his arguments (the way he responds to the audience member talking about her disabled son for example) which gives the impression he's thrashing around for the upper hand. Reid on the other hand comes across extremely well, but it's interesting how hostile the audience are to some of his arguments. Parkinson's objection to him quoting statistics is particularly fascinating. I presume this was done to level the playing field between the guests and provide balance, but it does result in the discussion becoming more subjective than it needs to be. But, that said, great piece of television - thanks for uploading.
Very good points. I wonder if Kenneth Williams came to this debate overconfident, seriously underestimating Jimmy Reid, and was actually quite rattled when Jimmy proved to be very articulate, polite and well read, and could match him, not only in politics and social issues, but also arts and poetry. The issue of hostility is an interesting one, I would imagine that feelings on both sides were running high due to ongoing and disruptive industrial actions, wage freezes etc. Thanks for your comments.
@@GeorgeFairbrother I have always wondered is Kenneth's centre right politics was also the reason for his frosty working relationship with some of his Carry On co-stars such as Sid James. Both Sid and Kenneth disliked each other. I wonder if it was down to politics too?
@@johnking5174 It's a fascinating point to consider. I can't imagine Kenneth Williams being hesitant to voice an opinion under any circumstances, and, unlike Sid, he wasn't always particularly polite. Yet he did have a very warm and close relationship with Barbara Windsor, and, apparently, also got on well with Babs' husband at that time, Ronnie Knight. I think a mutual respect evolved between him and Parky as well, as time went on, despite their political differences. I'm interested in the point you raise about Kenneth Williams' relationship with Sid, who by all accounts was enormously well-liked and got on with just about everyone. Worth looking into a little deeper. Thanks for your thoughts.
@@GeorgeFairbrother Thanks for that. I do know that in some ways Sid was conservative but not in politics. Sid's son Steven said his father used to like the children being respectful to their mother. When they were out for a walk, the son and Sid would walk on the edge of the footpath with the mother always walking in the inner part, showing respect. Sid hated swearing, and also detested people being rude, which Kenneth used to excel at, farting all the time, especially when the cast had lunch. Sid found that disgusting. However I do know from his son Steven that Sid James was liberal on sexuality. He was not homophobic, which I think Kenneth felt he was. That was wrong. Because John Inman from Are You Being Served said he and Sid got on so well especially during panto season. He told the story of when Are You Being Served had become a huge hit by 1975 and he was in panto with Sid. Sid came to John's dressing room on the night before they broke up for Christmas with a huge bottle of champagne, and toasted John's success. "Isn't it great" was the words Sid used, and John was so overcome we with happiness. Sid was wonderful to him. Now if Sid was homophobic, do you think he would have done that for John Inman, who was 100 times more camp than Kenneth. What do you think?
@@johnking5174 That's a great story about John Inman, who I think is one of the most likeable performers of that era. I tend to agree, if Sid disliked KW it was to do with his manners and general behaviour, which I think even fans agree wasn't always ideal. Time to go back and re-read some old bios I think. The dynamic between all those personalities is fascinating.
All three here were giants in their own field. Fierce debate, still with humour and the ability to listen to each other, is a lost art, sadly.
Totally agree.
100% correct - social media age - all "spouting off" and inability to listen
Did anyone else find that conversation moving - I've not even had much to drink?
Very much so. Even stone cold sober. :)
I miss the days when people debated things and had constructive arguments.
Kenneth may have had the notoriety of overwhelming rhetorical powers, but Jimmy is at least his equal, or rather, his better, as his arguments are better.
And I think KW actually underestimated Jimmy Reid as well,.
Good debate even today.
Jimmy Reid was articulate, talked sense and did his best for the Union members!
there are so many points where I was surprised not to hear the audience clapping loudly for Jimmy Reid
The unions ruined Britain in the 70's, I'm not surprised that people were cheesed off at rail strikes, coal strikes, power cuts and 3 day weeks.
Jimmy Reid was a hero. An absolute legend in the West of Scotland. Could listen to him all night. A very, very astute man.
The 47 year old head teacher even in 19 73 was so naive about how the corrupt system works.
Strange how it's the same issues that we have today ,the ordinary people striking for a reasonable living standard and wage ....as Jimmy said it belongs to all of us🙏
Incredibly coherent true argument here.. Intelligent.. Intelligible.. Much that still needs addressing here in 2020,still as yet unresolved.
Why can't we have this today..
I have to say this was one of the best intellectual debate I have ever seen on a TV show ever it was quite astonishingly brilliant a discussion around education and equality in society Kenneth Williams wasn't just a good comedian but a brilliantly intelligent man as well as Jim Reid Parkinson that night looking back at was on a different level as a presenter than anyone else I believe I was so lucky to watch it when I was young ❤
I thoroughly enjoyed this, a very intellectual discussion with good points from both sides.
Could you imagine an interview like this happening in the 2020's? Ehhh......didn't think so.
The then controller of BBC One, Paul Fox hated this edition of Parkinson, especially the audience being able to ask questions and the confrontational nature, that he told Parkinson never ever again to go into this area of politics, otherwise his show would be cancelled.
It could be argued that because of discussions like this, at this time, led to Conservative governments that followed purposely allowed, encouraged even, the reduction of amd shutting down of so much of this countries labour based industries and moved towards a more service based society
wow! couldn't imagine auntie beeb broadcasting anythig like that nowadays.
I love all three people here, may they all rest in joyous peace.
A tv show host letting the guests answer . . wow !!
I don’t think Kenneth Williams opposed the principles that the unions purported to stand for, he simply opposed the means by which they went about trying to achieve it as being, in his mind, self defeating and hypocritical. I think he felt that the prevalence of mind in unions tended to be, “one for all and all for one, because it’s good for me” as opposed to “one for all and all for one because it’s good for us”. I’m afraid I think I tend to agree with him, considering what little use the Union was to my dad when he needed their help with an employer dispute, after he’d given all his time and money to them for years.
Both incredibly interesting people with their own passionate outlooks and passions. I am quite sure it'll be tough for RUclips commenters to jump in and feel they will need to back one and cancel the other, as is the horrid, corrosive nature of social media currently, but they both make great points on their personal experiences and views with value.
The last generation could handle themselves in a debate better than this generation.
Amazing to think this was mainstream prime time tv. Now what do we get? Mind numbing drivel like Britain’s Got Talent.
When people like Jimmy Reid, Parkinson and Kenneth Williams were kicking about, the fact Britain had talent was never in doubt.
We are receding.
It's fascinating to watch Kenneth Williams change when he hears an audience response. Much as he would like to be a philosopher, he reveals himself to be a true entertainer.
Jimmy is platitudes personified
@@djb1317 bullshit. If you think that you aren’t listening