TO BE MORE THAN CLEAR: There is a) rated pressure and b) observed pressure. The rated pressure, as I said, is 8.5 bar. The observed pressure, which is what I show testing in the video, seems to be 6 bar. Some have said there is air in the puck and this skews the reading BUT I filled the puck fully with water which is an even more efficient blockade than coffee grounds. So, any air effect on the pressure will be inferior to that of on coffee. ALSO Some current users said Pesado will fit if you tighten it really tight and La Marzocco portafilters fit. My pesado is a bit loose but not negating it! And I had no LM on hand.
Also the pre-infusion pressure is on the low side and I suspect the water temperature is also on the high side, which puts an extraction too close to over-extraction for my risk taking sensibilities.
The pressure will be a function of the spring's compressed position and therefore the position of the lever. When fully compressed the pressure will be a maximum and then will decrease as the spring expands. You don't show this nor do you seem to show the pressure at the point where the spring just starts to expand - i.e. with the lever more or less horizontal. This can easily happen if there is any air above the 'puck'. If I have air above my puck the lever starts to resist late at about 45 deg and I know I'm operating with reduced pressure at that point. It's best to pre-infuse in a way that purges all the air through the puck. The position of the lever when it meets the 'resistance' tells all.
The video describes rated pressure and so-called ‘observed’ pressure. From what I can see it’s the review that omitted to observe or attempt to confirm the rated pressure. I could go on here in some detail about what's wrong with that experimental process used to evaluate this particular machine but I'll let the reviewer contact me if, in fact, there is any real interest in doing things in a rigorous and scientifically credible manner.
I sold my Rancilio Classe 5 and purchased a Profitec Pro 800 lever espresso machine. Best espresso ever, a simple design without complex electronics, and beautiful stainless steel design. I use a 22 gram basket and can make the best double latte ever. Great video, thanks for sharing!
I had to to swtich out the pstat, so figured we'd start filming while it was dissected haha! I always enjoy an inside look ,personally. Thanks for watching!
As a Vectis owner, this review was spot on. Not a perfect machine by any metric given the restrictions and quirks you mentioned in the video. As far as the value, I probably bought the first secondhand Vectis (that shut down the thread on HB 😅) and certainly would have been let down if I had paid new price + import duties. All that said, the thing is a great no fuss daily driver and super easy to DIY repair. Great video Lance!
@@TomJones-tx7pb exactly. I was cross shopping this with the Cremina and had the deal I couldn't pass up, 100% feel that I made the right choice sticking with the Vectis!
My 0.8 Bar boiler Europiccola does pre-infusions just fine, 1.2 Bar should be even better. The only problem is if you grind way too fine then it won't get saturated completely. I think that's one main benefit of these level machines easy pre infusion.
Been patiently waiting for this review! Thanks for this honest review. Very much appreciated. Was considering to replace my profitec pro 600 with this. Already had two Creminas on my bench before, they however had tilted group heads, so I returned them. Also i expected more when it comes to build-quality and price. Couldn’t live up to what I read online. Tough I love it’s appearance. So the search continuous. Probably a Stietman would be worth a look. Steam would be nice to have. Tough recently awesome external steaming options started to appear. Thanks lance!
@@blingbling2001 at least it was a thing. Can’t tell if it is still an issue. The group head was visibly not mounted straight on my unit. Next to the grouphead itself, one of the visible effects was that one of the shot glasses received 70% of the liquid when using the double spout. Can’t tell which effect it did have on extraction. After several mails to Olympia they opened that the production line was not set correctly. Still they claimed that everything was within tolerance. As they said that they fixed the issue, I returned the machine and ordered a new one of the newest batch. Still had the same issue.… so I gave up. If you plan to buy one, I recommend to check this upon arrival.
Olympia service I found awful. Ordered a Cremina, same thing and other issues like torn leaking seals out the box, and they couldn’t be less interested. Returned and bought a Strietman CT2, couldn’t be happier.
@@1kizzle12 yes they just massively benefit from all the internet exposure. TBH I was also not impressed with the so often praised build quality. Glad that you found the Strietman to fulfill all your needs. I also eyeballed with it, but the missing steam always kept myself from buying it
Looks like a copy of the (real) FAEMA E-61 portafilter - the original version that has thicker lugs than what is found on E-61's/Marzocco's these days. The thick-lugged portafilters are also found on pretty much every vintage commercial 58mm lever - so it is a 'standard size,' just not the standard that you - and many others - have. Rancilio portafilters should also lock-in, albeit at an angle and maybe needing a spacer on the top of the group gasket.
Genuine question: who the hell watches this channel and the level of content, and does NOT subscribe?! Come on, people, get on with the program (or fear excessive channeling! 😁)
@@classicrockonly it was originally what I wanted but it's taken quite a long time and they seem to be hitting lots of issues going by the newsletters they put out. I saw a video where a user noted it just felt rougher in terms of build quality.
@LanceHedrick Does it feel to you like a stripped down design, two levels down (Compressa being one level) from what the R24 stands for this brand or a machine designed as a true individual proposition and concept that can stand on its own in their line-up? It feels to me like the former and maybe why it falls short from certain expectations as they want to maintain a gap for the R24.
Hey @LanceHedrick, I think you're actually seeing a lot of steam forcing its way through your puck giving you the weird cone-shaped stream as the shot falls into the cup. It might be a good idea to do a cooling flush before pulling the shot or maybe relieve some of the steam pressure by opening the steam wand. I don't think this has to do with the freshness of the beans.
Yeah. It was a combo of steam and freshness. Issue is cooling flushes don't do much cooling in this bad boy haha! The temp kinda just keeps escalating.
@@LanceHedrick Maybe opening the steam wand a little would help but I wonder if that'll just tell the machine to heat up even more to create steam.. hmmm... I guess it's a lot like a La Pavoni Professional/Europiccola in that regard. Any reason they used a pstat instead of a PID? At $2k I feel like a PID would be a better choice.
I really respect Lance’s reviews, but I wanted to offer a different perspective from someone who has used this machine daily over the last few months: The bad: my pressure stat as mentioned in this video has been mildly troublesome, but the issues occurs 1/10 times I turn the machine on and Reiss is sending one in the mail. He is always very very responsive. This is really the only negative in my opinion. This machine isn’t built for the kind of person that wants to experiment with different portafilter, baskets, shot sizes, etc, it’s for the person that wants consistent shots that are repeatable and delicious. I transferred my ims basket form my gaggia classic to this machine with no issues and haven’t looked back. The good: coming from a modded gaggia classic, this machine is so much more consistent with far greater steam power and an incredibly attractive workflow. Watching this video stirred up feelings of discontentment, but then I realized that there is absolutely no reason for that. This machine does exactly what it promises in delivering consistent and phenomenal shots with great steaming capabilities. I consistently pull shots while steaming with 0 issues. It makes the gaggia feel like a toy. I had the argos on preorder for a year before looking elsewhere. The pro 800 and Strega are too big for my I considered a Cremina SL, but I’m very glad I saved $2K and have a machine that I think looks more attractive on my bar. Disclaimer: not a coffee pro, but really enjoy this machine.
heck yeah! that's fantastic! Yes. It will make the gaggia (unmodded) look like a child's toy haha. you should never watch one of my videos and have remorse on something you enjoy! For me, it's not my preference. I prefer my 1973 Cremina, i'd prefer my Flair 58, Robot, etc, to spending the money for this at what it offers, but that is me, not you! I don't value highly milk steaming. I want espresso to be first and foremost and I am just not loving this one at the price point for what it does... FOR ME. lol So glad you are loving it, friend! Keep on ripping spro and steaming silky milky!
Wild, that looks like a 2000$ Pavoni with a spring and all the same issues. Thanks, but no thanks! Refreshing to see a video review that isn't overly hyping what's going on, thanks Lance!
Nice honest review, betters the product and we all benefit eventually. Psyched for the upcoming Argos review! About as difficult to get ahold of as a GR Corolla right now 😅 but maybe worth the wait?!
Great video. Nostalgia is great but can be impractical at times. I guess if you live on your own or as a couple it is a nice novelty. I have my VBM domobar super since 2004 and still making great coffee, so for a family of 4 and during gatherings it is a great machine, as much as I love all mechanical things, the lever is not practical.
I did have a look at this but the website let me down initially, so weird, but I’m glad it did. The build quality here is pretty naff once you look past the shiny shiny. So many issues looking at it. Proportions look weird as well. So glad I chose the Profitec Pro 800. It also gets to pressure in 15 minutes and after a few flushes is ready to go. Best decision in my coffee career yet!!
At point 2:22 I had already devided not to get this 😂 Quality issues can be a pain. About to upgrade the current setup and it is not exactly easy to choose. Mortals can choose only once
Its shame the machine is not quite there, I really wanted to get this machine as I live in London so its cheaper without import tax. I will have to wait for the 2nd interation if there is one, hopefully there will be where that pressure can get up to 9 bar. Edit: On second thoughts, a lot of spring lever machines do not create 9 bar pressure, the Olympia Cremina SL certainly does not so Lance considering the issues you have raised the others being rather minor and do not negatively affect t the performance let alone were initial issues that have been resolved by Londinium, if you live in the UK where there is obviously no import tax than this machine is certainly worth it compare don other Spring lever offerings, the only real competitor is the Bezzera Strega a true, tried and tested machine.
I'm subscribed! Been for a while. I love levers, and manual mechanical bits in general - just no room for the lever to rest under my cupboards above my counter. I'm waiting for the wood-fire-heated boiler trend to take off...
I've been using my Bezzera Strega nearly everyday for the last 10 years or so. I occasionally think about buying a new machine, but the cost of, say, an Olympia Cremina has put me off. I hope Londinium get the issues with this machine sorted, but I'll stick with my Strega for now.
I have the same issue, using a Strega for years but always looking for possible upgrade as well. But the Strega rocks. Mine has the mod (small spring out, other pump with lower peak pressure, no pid tho) and its an unbeatable machine. And I can’t justify a €5k machine like a Nurri to myself
@@CaldwellCoffeeI see, thanks for the info! However, I personally would prefer to spend those 800 extra dollars to have a solid, high quality lever machine that allows me to use whichever basket & portafilter I want to use…
I recently decided to get a Profitec Pro 800 instead of this one. It’s not that much more money in the EU (after import taxes for the Londinium) and it’s a much more capable machine. After watching your review, I’m even happier with my decision! Great video Lance!
Thanks for the review been looking forward to this one. There was no mention of temperatures and stability. Another YT reviewer is reporting wild Scace readings. Interested in the experience you had.
daddy got coffee in his pinned comment has some temp readings after elapsed machine heat up times. Maybe I am misinterpreting them but the way I read is that the brew temp just keeps creeping up the longer you leave the machine on, getting to well beyond boiling. He also reported a 20deg F decrease during the shot which may be normal. @@LanceHedrick
Makes 100% sense to me. This is some of a ‚luxurious Pavoni‘ or Cremina and as such will gift us the same ‚challenges‘. Something for the addicted and lovers mostly, not for average users serving family and guests
@@LanceHedrick Dear Lance! I often come back and rewatch your vids, yet just realized this review became a kinda battlefield 😢 True, Sir Hoffmann had made me love coffee vids, but you made me love coffee! You rock!
seeing those welds an the drip tray doesnt seem like a QC issue to me, but just something were they saved money in the manufacturing process! you could clean these welds relatively easy (or improve the welding process, so they wont appear that much!!!) if the inside looks somewhat the same as the outside of the driptray, it will start to rut over time...
this is definetly a QC issue! (or again someone trying to save money by not optimizing the welding process. I you take a little time to get this process right, you just should not have this issue!)
I’m really interested in a lever machine - got my eye on an odyssey espresso Argos but I’m not pulling the trigger until I see a review from you or Daddy Hoff. Any plans to check it out?
If this is not the one to get. What lever with a 58mm portafilter for home use would you all recommend. I current have a Elektra micro casa leva and want to upgrade.
I agree smaller lever machines like this should be using a 54mm portafilter. No longer buy the excuse that 58mm is the standard when so many companies use 54mm +/- in the home and pro-sumer espresso market.
The comment on the the springpressure feeling too light doesn't make much sense. This machine has a long lever. Of course it feels light. Grip the lever two inches lower and pull it. I'm pretty sure it will feel like a 10 bar spring that way.Simple physics.
@@EvanMcClain That one doesn't use a standard E61 58mm either!? That's one thing I'm not liking about the Breville Dual Boiler, why make a 58mm machine and NOT use E61 compatible portafilters. Apparently the Vectis does use E61 portafilters according to the manufacturer?
Thank you! Yeah. It was disheartening. Especially because I was in contact with him and we discussed things. He didn't convey what happened too accurately but oh well! Live and learn. Thanks for watching!
@@LanceHedrick I was going to get a Vectis and got some negative feedbacks similar to what you pointed from owners. Also I understand that temperature stability is wild with the machine. You were spot on from what I heard. Keep the good work!
@@BensCoffeeRants Well, right before I moved to the DF83, I had chance to use a DF64V with MP burr set for 3 weeks. I didn't compare them side by side so I cannot tell you exactly but for my sense they're similar - very low body and a lot of clarity and acidity. I've decided to move to DF83 mainly because of the workflow. The DF83 V2 have the plasma generator which is in my experience works very well. And I can also grind directly to my portafilter so I have less part to clean.
@@0909tong Oh nice. Yeah I have the DF83 v1 and even after I modded the declumper to open it up more, it's still very neat, no plasma generator even needed for mine at least! I'm going to experiment with some cheaper but supposedly good alternative burrs I found.
@@BensCoffeeRants Then I'm sure you will not disappointed with the DF64 V2 or DF64V with the MP burr. FYI, don't forget to consider waiting for a new Lap sweet espresso burr from SSP. As Lance have mentioned that SSP is in progress to make it for 64mm. And also the dealer company in Thailand which I purchase my DF83 from also mentioned specifically that they are doing for 83mm too.
Lance you make the point that there isn’t enough flexibility for a machine at this price point to allow for larger ratios etc. We all like to play a bit; but I am wondering if this a bit like the IOS V Android debate. I do genuinely wonder what else is there at the price point that you rate more highly though in terms of this flexibility / ability to extract texture? Arguably the Argos - but that also has its own issues too
Lance, going to be in Lisbon for a week for a work conference in a couple of weeks. Would it be possible for you recommend some coffee spots please? Sorry if I've missed a video on this in the past!
Torra Roasting & Coffee. We tried a good dozen places, and this was the only standout. The owner is a delightful coffee nerd. It's a short ride from the city center on public transportation.
Hi Lance. I'm always a big fans of you and I have learned a lot with you videos. May I ask a question that is irrelevant to this video? I've always encounter the problem of having a shot of sticky crema when using some darkly roasted coffee. This is quite frustrating because it is more difficult for me to do latte art that requires rippling like Rosetta. I think this problem only comes from home espresso machine and I'm using the gaggia classic with pid control. I'm sure the coffee beans i used is not the reason since it is by Simple Kaffa and extremely delicious. I think it's something to do with the pressure of the espresso machine. Is there any way to fix it other than just swirling the espresso shot before pouring the milk? Or am I dialing the shot wrongly? (19g in 38g out in 30s). Thank you very much!
Hey, Lance! Great video! I was wondering if you would review the new Varia Evo hybrid grinder. I’m interested to see how it stacks up as a budget grinder to grinders like the Baratza ESP.
Great review as always! Apologies if someone already asked this in the comments but did you do any temperature testing? I saw on their website that the machine doesn’t overheat even with long idle times or when pulling multiple back to back shots. Did you find this to be the case? Thanks!
If you're having issues with the pressure stat going too high / over heating then I'd think the whole machine and brew temp would be affected! I think I had a shot from a small roaster / cafe on this machine and was surprised because I never had a shot that BURNED my tongue on the first sip before. So it felt like it must have been brewed at like 120 celsius! lol.
You could have explained that this machine is a ‚dripper‘ and what that means in terms of limited temperature control. You could also have investigated temperature stability on consecutive shots and/or longer idle time. Very relevant information about drippers. Other than that, nice and somehow informative video
Great review of a product that I would never buy. A Breville dual boiler seems to give better choices, and there is no way I would swap my Flair 58 for this machine.
I was thinking the same thing while watching Lance highlight all the flaws. Pretty hard to justify the asking price when MY dual boiler (with the Slayer mod) can do everything, and I suspect, better than this Vectis. If you are lusting after a lever machine there are plenty of better options. Pass!
Can somebody explain to me what the benefit of a spring based lever espresso machine is? Like I totally get manual espresso giving you more control over pressure and flow. I don’t get how a spring, which basically sets the pressure for you automatically is any better than a auto machine. It just seems like more work and less control than an auto espresso machine
With the existence and seeming popularity of the flair/standalone lever espresso machines, I think it's about time someone makes a standalone milk steamer. Or maybe I'll just buy this thing.
@@LanceHedrick had no idea about the nanofoamer pro. Always had a prejudice against that type of frother because they always seemed kinda bad compared to a normal steam wand, but your video about it changed my mind. For the next setup!
Sometimes I feel like you can lose the plot with some of these reviews as far as them being more than just a break down of the machine. This one felt very focused, while still being really detailed and honest. Very good, sir.
LaPavoni (cheapest one) with Bluetooth pressure sensor and additional analog sensor will set you back 1300EUR. Much less than this one and 1:2.5 ratio is possible without Fellini.
@@dan138zig Read more about levers. My understanding is that Reiss' technical points are all absolutely accurate, and in many areas lance is simply uninformed and wrong - it's unfortunate for Londinum/Reiss that the response was so emotionally colored. It would have been fair and reasonable for Reiss/Londinum to respond simply with: "We need to change our documentation for inexperienced and ununinformed users."
@@CaldwellCoffee not much! My default (and most other PVL owners) is to do a two-pull shot, but currently I am doing single pull ristrettos on an Italian dark roast and getting 18-20g, but that's with a boiler pressure pre-infusion.
It’s one thing to require a custom portafilter, but to provide one that is 58mm standard diameter is practically a form of mockery. Love the form factor, appearance, price is reasonable, but hard pass!
It may be off the shelf, but it severely limits your choices. My proprietary philanges was clearly a joke. Anyway, none of my other portafilters fit and I have quite a few (about 2 dozen)
I liked the MacGyver moment, although fun fact MacGyver did not like to drink coffee, so he would probably not have approved of this episode :p Interesting to learn about this machine though, but why did they bother with 58mm if it is not compatible with other portafilters?
So it can fit la marzocco and pesado ones I've discovered but it's odd- la marzocco can also accept other portafilters. This one is just a bit more loose. Those somehow fit just barely.
I actually enjoy the Vectis very much, and the price is okay, considering the rising material prices and labor shortages. In the last 6 years, I had 2K EUR repairs for my 8KEUR flow profiling machine. Vectis spare parts are cheap and easy to replace. Over the long run, I guess it will be cheaper than machines with more moving parts
It's a very nice machine but at this price point, as we talk for spring machines, i prefer the witch, that's right ... Bezzera Strega And as always for your videos, you dive into the things, i love it ♥️
my thoughts as well. I wanted this machine initially. now it will cost as much as a Strega in my country. Also I was not quite satisfied with its limit of yields and lower max pressure - there is another review on YT showing just below 7 bar. So I bought a Strega.
@@jameschang8174 Yes strega is a much better machine in my opinion It's a HX machine, spring up to 9 bars, so no limitation, pump to preinfusion up to 11 bars if you want, much better steam(for someone who cares), and costs less
maybe the spring can hit 8 bar if it just sits with a blind basket or something? imo this was built to try and capitalize on what appears to be just limitless coffee machine budgets on the consumer market
Interesting.... 'steam preinfusion' will be at a boiling temperature, but the heat content (not the temperature) of steam is MUCH higher than liquid water at the same temperature owing to the latent heat of evaporation (the amount of energy needed to turn water at 100C to steam at 100C). So, I guess the question is can this burn the grounds, or over extract in comparison to liquid water pre-infusion?
It does not preinfuse with actual steam, it just uses the boiler steampressure to preinfuse with boiler water. As opposed to pump driven or water line pressure driven preinfusion on more expensive levers.
TO BE MORE THAN CLEAR:
There is a) rated pressure and b) observed pressure. The rated pressure, as I said, is 8.5 bar. The observed pressure, which is what I show testing in the video, seems to be 6 bar. Some have said there is air in the puck and this skews the reading BUT I filled the puck fully with water which is an even more efficient blockade than coffee grounds. So, any air effect on the pressure will be inferior to that of on coffee.
ALSO
Some current users said Pesado will fit if you tighten it really tight and La Marzocco portafilters fit. My pesado is a bit loose but not negating it! And I had no LM on hand.
Also the pre-infusion pressure is on the low side and I suspect the water temperature is also on the high side, which puts an extraction too close to over-extraction for my risk taking sensibilities.
The pressure will be a function of the spring's compressed position and therefore the position of the lever. When fully compressed the pressure will be a maximum and then will decrease as the spring expands. You don't show this nor do you seem to show the pressure at the point where the spring just starts to expand - i.e. with the lever more or less horizontal. This can easily happen if there is any air above the 'puck'. If I have air above my puck the lever starts to resist late at about 45 deg and I know I'm operating with reduced pressure at that point. It's best to pre-infuse in a way that purges all the air through the puck. The position of the lever when it meets the 'resistance' tells all.
So it is an 8.5 bar spring after all? 😵💫
@_aichan_ I never said it wasnt... let's all learn to pay close attention
The video describes rated pressure and so-called ‘observed’ pressure. From what I can see it’s the review that omitted to observe or attempt to confirm the rated pressure. I could go on here in some detail about what's wrong with that experimental process used to evaluate this particular machine but I'll let the reviewer contact me if, in fact, there is any real interest in doing things in a rigorous and scientifically credible manner.
I sold my Rancilio Classe 5 and purchased a Profitec Pro 800 lever espresso machine. Best espresso ever, a simple design without complex electronics, and beautiful stainless steel design. I use a 22 gram basket and can make the best double latte ever. Great video, thanks for sharing!
I really appreciate that you take the machines apart! Definitely helps me understand the machines a lot better!
I had to to swtich out the pstat, so figured we'd start filming while it was dissected haha! I always enjoy an inside look ,personally. Thanks for watching!
Another great review! Was considering this but will just wait until all the issues are sorted out!
Review seems more....candid than usual? Which is much appreciated, I must say!
oh nice! I wasn't trying anything different. Psychology is a weird one, eh? haha!
It has too many issues to be a viable buying option. I'd have been much more harsher.
As a Vectis owner, this review was spot on. Not a perfect machine by any metric given the restrictions and quirks you mentioned in the video. As far as the value, I probably bought the first secondhand Vectis (that shut down the thread on HB 😅) and certainly would have been let down if I had paid new price + import duties. All that said, the thing is a great no fuss daily driver and super easy to DIY repair. Great video Lance!
Thank you! Yes very easily DIY. I tried to show that in the video. Thank you for the kind words!
Definitely has its place in the market, and I would prefer it over an antique lever machine.
Should of bought the Argo.
@@TomJones-tx7pb exactly. I was cross shopping this with the Cremina and had the deal I couldn't pass up, 100% feel that I made the right choice sticking with the Vectis!
@@ccuellar6212 Ahh, the Argos... might as well be made of unobtanium, from where I sit, at the bottom of the planet...
Thanks for doing what you do Lance.
Yes...Very nice Lance! 👏 Solid presentation, Professional and great delivery!
Was waiting for this one!
heck yeah!
Me too. Would love to see Lance review the Argos lever machine vs this.
My 0.8 Bar boiler Europiccola does pre-infusions just fine, 1.2 Bar should be even better. The only problem is if you grind way too fine then it won't get saturated completely. I think that's one main benefit of these level machines easy pre infusion.
That fill valve thing is pretty cool.
ooo i have been waiting for this particular one
hope you enjoy!
Been patiently waiting for this review! Thanks for this honest review. Very much appreciated.
Was considering to replace my profitec pro 600 with this. Already had two Creminas on my bench before, they however had tilted group heads, so I returned them. Also i expected more when it comes to build-quality and price. Couldn’t live up to what I read online. Tough I love it’s appearance.
So the search continuous. Probably a Stietman would be worth a look. Steam would be nice to have. Tough recently awesome external steaming options started to appear.
Thanks lance!
You returned two Creminas because of tilted heads? Is that a fault with them?
@@blingbling2001 at least it was a thing. Can’t tell if it is still an issue. The group head was visibly not mounted straight on my unit. Next to the grouphead itself, one of the visible effects was that one of the shot glasses received 70% of the liquid when using the double spout. Can’t tell which effect it did have on extraction. After several mails to Olympia they opened that the production line was not set correctly. Still they claimed that everything was within tolerance. As they said that they fixed the issue, I returned the machine and ordered a new one of the newest batch. Still had the same issue.… so I gave up. If you plan to buy one, I recommend to check this upon arrival.
Which external steamers are you looking at?
Olympia service I found awful. Ordered a Cremina, same thing and other issues like torn leaking seals out the box, and they couldn’t be less interested. Returned and bought a Strietman CT2, couldn’t be happier.
@@1kizzle12 yes they just massively benefit from all the internet exposure. TBH I was also not impressed with the so often praised build quality.
Glad that you found the Strietman to fulfill all your needs. I also eyeballed with it, but the missing steam always kept myself from buying it
Really good review, as usual. The production was very fancy. 😀
thank you! Hugo is an awesome videographer/editor.
Looks like a copy of the (real) FAEMA E-61 portafilter - the original version that has thicker lugs than what is found on E-61's/Marzocco's these days. The thick-lugged portafilters are also found on pretty much every vintage commercial 58mm lever - so it is a 'standard size,' just not the standard that you - and many others - have. Rancilio portafilters should also lock-in, albeit at an angle and maybe needing a spacer on the top of the group gasket.
I’m using the Bezzera Strega and it’s great value for the performance it gives. Please try it, Lance!
I just bought a Strega after seeing all reviews online before this one.
@@jameschang8174 have u tried it out?
My Pesado PF fits well on my machine. I use the billet 14-16g from Sheldon nowadays for light roasts.
My Pesado doesn't fit. I'll check again, but I wasn't able to get it in when testing me PFs
I can use my Rancilio Silvia (bottomless) portafilter with the Vectis, but it locks further like 4pm degree.
oh you can!? nice! that is like the only portafilter I have that I didn't try on the machine haha
Are you planning on doing an R24 review? Or was your one and only Londinium review the Vectis?
Good Q
Ayyy new vid ❤
yeeeeesssss
Genuine question: who the hell watches this channel and the level of content, and does NOT subscribe?! Come on, people, get on with the program (or fear excessive channeling! 😁)
Me. Was surprise I didn’t subscribed beforehand. Maybe I did and miss/double clicked it. Anyway, thanks for the head up!
Proprietary falanges.....😂 Lance, have you looked at the Argos from Odyssey yet? I would love to hear your thoughts.
+1 for Lance to review the Argos
I hear what you say Lance but I just can think: Damn this machine looks good!
I was waiting for this one, thanks Lance! Great review, well shot and edited! I guess the hunt for a "relatively" good price spring lever continues.
Not the Argos Odyssey?
@@classicrockonly the Odyssey looks amazing but you'd want to be immortal at this stage with the rate of production.
@@classicrockonly it was originally what I wanted but it's taken quite a long time and they seem to be hitting lots of issues going by the newsletters they put out. I saw a video where a user noted it just felt rougher in terms of build quality.
I think I’ll swallow the idiosyncrasies and go with the Pavoni or Elektra for a spring lever.
Pavoni do not make a spring lever
I like the footprint. Seems like the same as a Lelit Mara X. I like it
Definitely a nice footprint. I think it can be even smaller, but things take time haha!
@LanceHedrick Does it feel to you like a stripped down design, two levels down (Compressa being one level) from what the R24 stands for this brand or a machine designed as a true individual proposition and concept that can stand on its own in their line-up? It feels to me like the former and maybe why it falls short from certain expectations as they want to maintain a gap for the R24.
Thanks for being honest!
thanks for watching and supporting!
Hey @LanceHedrick, I think you're actually seeing a lot of steam forcing its way through your puck giving you the weird cone-shaped stream as the shot falls into the cup. It might be a good idea to do a cooling flush before pulling the shot or maybe relieve some of the steam pressure by opening the steam wand. I don't think this has to do with the freshness of the beans.
Yeah. It was a combo of steam and freshness. Issue is cooling flushes don't do much cooling in this bad boy haha! The temp kinda just keeps escalating.
@@LanceHedrick Maybe opening the steam wand a little would help but I wonder if that'll just tell the machine to heat up even more to create steam.. hmmm... I guess it's a lot like a La Pavoni Professional/Europiccola in that regard. Any reason they used a pstat instead of a PID? At $2k I feel like a PID would be a better choice.
I really respect Lance’s reviews, but I wanted to offer a different perspective from someone who has used this machine daily over the last few months:
The bad: my pressure stat as mentioned in this video has been mildly troublesome, but the issues occurs 1/10 times I turn the machine on and Reiss is sending one in the mail. He is always very very responsive. This is really the only negative in my opinion. This machine isn’t built for the kind of person that wants to experiment with different portafilter, baskets, shot sizes, etc, it’s for the person that wants consistent shots that are repeatable and delicious. I transferred my ims basket form my gaggia classic to this machine with no issues and haven’t looked back.
The good: coming from a modded gaggia classic, this machine is so much more consistent with far greater steam power and an incredibly attractive workflow. Watching this video stirred up feelings of discontentment, but then I realized that there is absolutely no reason for that. This machine does exactly what it promises in delivering consistent and phenomenal shots with great steaming capabilities. I consistently pull shots while steaming with 0 issues. It makes the gaggia feel like a toy. I had the argos on preorder for a year before looking elsewhere. The pro 800 and Strega are too big for my I considered a Cremina SL, but I’m very glad I saved $2K and have a machine that I think looks more attractive on my bar.
Disclaimer: not a coffee pro, but really enjoy this machine.
heck yeah! that's fantastic! Yes. It will make the gaggia (unmodded) look like a child's toy haha. you should never watch one of my videos and have remorse on something you enjoy! For me, it's not my preference. I prefer my 1973 Cremina, i'd prefer my Flair 58, Robot, etc, to spending the money for this at what it offers, but that is me, not you! I don't value highly milk steaming. I want espresso to be first and foremost and I am just not loving this one at the price point for what it does... FOR ME. lol
So glad you are loving it, friend! Keep on ripping spro and steaming silky milky!
Wild, that looks like a 2000$ Pavoni with a spring and all the same issues. Thanks, but no thanks!
Refreshing to see a video review that isn't overly hyping what's going on, thanks Lance!
@8:32 - very nice tease there Lance! 😂
haha! Appreciate you!
Nice honest review, betters the product and we all benefit eventually.
Psyched for the upcoming Argos review! About as difficult to get ahold of as a GR Corolla right now 😅 but maybe worth the wait?!
Great video.
Nostalgia is great but can be impractical at times.
I guess if you live on your own or as a couple it is a nice novelty.
I have my VBM domobar super since 2004 and still making great coffee, so for a family of 4 and during gatherings it is a great machine, as much as I love all mechanical things, the lever is not practical.
I did have a look at this but the website let me down initially, so weird, but I’m glad it did. The build quality here is pretty naff once you look past the shiny shiny. So many issues looking at it. Proportions look weird as well.
So glad I chose the Profitec Pro 800. It also gets to pressure in 15 minutes and after a few flushes is ready to go. Best decision in my coffee career yet!!
At point 2:22 I had already devided not to get this 😂 Quality issues can be a pain. About to upgrade the current setup and it is not exactly easy to choose. Mortals can choose only once
Its shame the machine is not quite there, I really wanted to get this machine as I live in London so its cheaper without import tax. I will have to wait for the 2nd interation if there is one, hopefully there will be where that pressure can get up to 9 bar. Edit: On second thoughts, a lot of spring lever machines do not create 9 bar pressure, the Olympia Cremina SL certainly does not so Lance considering the issues you have raised the others being rather minor and do not negatively affect t the performance let alone were initial issues that have been resolved by Londinium, if you live in the UK where there is obviously no import tax than this machine is certainly worth it compare don other Spring lever offerings, the only real competitor is the Bezzera Strega a true, tried and tested machine.
Thanks for another good review! What is its advantage over a La Pavoni, which has the classic, artistic look that Vectis doesn't come close?
I'm subscribed! Been for a while.
I love levers, and manual mechanical bits in general - just no room for the lever to rest under my cupboards above my counter.
I'm waiting for the wood-fire-heated boiler trend to take off...
@@CaldwellCoffee oak smells so nice.
Ok, Argos it is then. Thnx Lance. Awesome review!
I've been using my Bezzera Strega nearly everyday for the last 10 years or so. I occasionally think about buying a new machine, but the cost of, say, an Olympia Cremina has put me off. I hope Londinium get the issues with this machine sorted, but I'll stick with my Strega for now.
I want to get a Strega. I used one at HOST in Milan. Would like to put one through the paces.
@@LanceHedrickI would like to see Strega at action!
@@LanceHedrick
You didn't have a Strega?😮
Strega is the machine that started the Lever revival using a modern machine.
I have the same issue, using a Strega for years but always looking for possible upgrade as well. But the Strega rocks. Mine has the mod (small spring out, other pump with lower peak pressure, no pid tho) and its an unbeatable machine. And I can’t justify a €5k machine like a Nurri to myself
@@meelramon Anything can be beaten.
How is this any better/more innovative than the Bezzera Strega that has been around for quite some time???
But I can get the Strega for less than 2000$ (at least where I‘m from)….
@@CaldwellCoffeeI see, thanks for the info! However, I personally would prefer to spend those 800 extra dollars to have a solid, high quality lever machine that allows me to use whichever basket & portafilter I want to use…
I recently decided to get a Profitec Pro 800 instead of this one. It’s not that much more money in the EU (after import taxes for the Londinium) and it’s a much more capable machine.
After watching your review, I’m even happier with my decision! Great video Lance!
profitec 800 takes 45 minutes to heat up!
Yeah I’m thinking the same and the heat up time is a non issue. The bars of pressure too are a no go.
45min?? Jeez. that's crazy!
45 minutes is the spec. does anyone with real life experience know?
25 minutes with a couple of flushes. 45 minutes it’s if you don’t touch it at all
Love the music choice 😊
Thanks for the review been looking forward to this one. There was no mention of temperatures and stability. Another YT reviewer is reporting wild Scace readings. Interested in the experience you had.
Who is mentioning wild scace readings? That's odd. I didn't experience this. Did the typical decline for me.
daddy got coffee in his pinned comment has some temp readings after elapsed machine heat up times. Maybe I am misinterpreting them but the way I read is that the brew temp just keeps creeping up the longer you leave the machine on, getting to well beyond boiling. He also reported a 20deg F decrease during the shot which may be normal. @@LanceHedrick
Makes 100% sense to me. This is some of a ‚luxurious Pavoni‘ or Cremina and as such will gift us the same ‚challenges‘. Something for the addicted and lovers mostly, not for average users serving family and guests
Pavoni with a spring, for sure. So better to be compared with Cremina SL. But still a dripper
hope you can get your hands on the Kees upcoming lever the Spiritello
I am plannin on it!
That cup looks amazing, perfectly matches the Anthracite ECM Synchronika. Can you please share the brand, or a link for that cup ?
I loved the reflection of Hugo!
he is so beautiful, aye? haha
@@LanceHedrick Dear Lance! I often come back and rewatch your vids, yet just realized this review became a kinda battlefield 😢 True, Sir Hoffmann had made me love coffee vids, but you made me love coffee! You rock!
Gah. I really wanted this to be worth the money. Almost purchased it. Thanks so much for the review!
seeing those welds an the drip tray doesnt seem like a QC issue to me, but just something were they saved money in the manufacturing process! you could clean these welds relatively easy (or improve the welding process, so they wont appear that much!!!) if the inside looks somewhat the same as the outside of the driptray, it will start to rut over time...
Except when it is so bad a friend who got one had leaks at the corners lol. He filled the drip tray and it just leaked out the jagged edges
this is definetly a QC issue! (or again someone trying to save money by not optimizing the welding process. I you take a little time to get this process right, you just should not have this issue!)
Great video, very helpful and informative. Thanks for posting. Two questions: 1. can you get 50g with Fellini? 2. how did you like the milk steaming?
I like your cup what is it?
I’m really interested in a lever machine - got my eye on an odyssey espresso Argos but I’m not pulling the trigger until I see a review from you or Daddy Hoff. Any plans to check it out?
Also very curious!
You should review the Cremina SL!
can you do a hire pressure pre infusion by holding back the lever when you push the lever upwards?
If this is not the one to get. What lever with a 58mm portafilter for home use would you all recommend. I current have a Elektra micro casa leva and want to upgrade.
Good review. Thanks.
nice review, thanks so much
Got Londinium R for less then that. R24 kit coming shortly. Way bigger, but better choice.
Oh nice!
Bigger is better?
I agree smaller lever machines like this should be using a 54mm portafilter. No longer buy the excuse that 58mm is the standard when so many companies use 54mm +/- in the home and pro-sumer espresso market.
Nice review. Is the Canal Portafilter for sale yet?
Thnx
The Holy Lance of Londinium!
haha! Absolutely! About time I got my hands on one!
The comment on the the springpressure feeling too light doesn't make much sense. This machine has a long lever. Of course it feels light.
Grip the lever two inches lower and pull it. I'm pretty sure it will feel like a 10 bar spring that way.Simple physics.
It is in comparison to other machines with similar length levers.
@@LanceHedrick
Not compared to a Strega.Half an inch can make a big difference.
Thanks for the review Lance. Have you tried the Argos? And comparisons to be had here?
I have not yet. Just waiting for one to be ready for shipment.
The proprietary portafilter is my main concern with the Argos, but I've been waiting for my preorder for a bit now.
@@EvanMcClain That one doesn't use a standard E61 58mm either!? That's one thing I'm not liking about the Breville Dual Boiler, why make a 58mm machine and NOT use E61 compatible portafilters. Apparently the Vectis does use E61 portafilters according to the manufacturer?
You must have seen Reiss’ response to your review. That was somewhat immature. You have my full support my man. 🤜🤛
Thank you! Yeah. It was disheartening. Especially because I was in contact with him and we discussed things. He didn't convey what happened too accurately but oh well! Live and learn. Thanks for watching!
@@LanceHedrick I was going to get a Vectis and got some negative feedbacks similar to what you pointed from owners. Also I understand that temperature stability is wild with the machine. You were spot on from what I heard. Keep the good work!
I've just got my new DF83 with MP burr today. Just telling :)
incredible! Hope you enjoy! That is a beastly combo.
Nice, have you had the 64mm MP burrs to compare with? I'm curious how much difference going from 64 to 83 with a similar geometry would make!
@@BensCoffeeRants Well, right before I moved to the DF83, I had chance to use a DF64V with MP burr set for 3 weeks. I didn't compare them side by side so I cannot tell you exactly but for my sense they're similar - very low body and a lot of clarity and acidity. I've decided to move to DF83 mainly because of the workflow. The DF83 V2 have the plasma generator which is in my experience works very well. And I can also grind directly to my portafilter so I have less part to clean.
@@0909tong Oh nice. Yeah I have the DF83 v1 and even after I modded the declumper to open it up more, it's still very neat, no plasma generator even needed for mine at least! I'm going to experiment with some cheaper but supposedly good alternative burrs I found.
@@BensCoffeeRants Then I'm sure you will not disappointed with the DF64 V2 or DF64V with the MP burr. FYI, don't forget to consider waiting for a new Lap sweet espresso burr from SSP. As Lance have mentioned that SSP is in progress to make it for 64mm. And also the dealer company in Thailand which I purchase my DF83 from also mentioned specifically that they are doing for 83mm too.
Lance you make the point that there isn’t enough flexibility for a machine at this price point to allow for larger ratios etc. We all like to play a bit; but I am wondering if this a bit like the IOS V Android debate. I do genuinely wonder what else is there at the price point that you rate more highly though in terms of this flexibility / ability to extract texture? Arguably the Argos - but that also has its own issues too
Lance, going to be in Lisbon for a week for a work conference in a couple of weeks. Would it be possible for you recommend some coffee spots please? Sorry if I've missed a video on this in the past!
Torra Roasting & Coffee. We tried a good dozen places, and this was the only standout. The owner is a delightful coffee nerd. It's a short ride from the city center on public transportation.
Hi Lance. I'm always a big fans of you and I have learned a lot with you videos. May I ask a question that is irrelevant to this video? I've always encounter the problem of having a shot of sticky crema when using some darkly roasted coffee. This is quite frustrating because it is more difficult for me to do latte art that requires rippling like Rosetta. I think this problem only comes from home espresso machine and I'm using the gaggia classic with pid control. I'm sure the coffee beans i used is not the reason since it is by Simple Kaffa and extremely delicious. I think it's something to do with the pressure of the espresso machine. Is there any way to fix it other than just swirling the espresso shot before pouring the milk? Or am I dialing the shot wrongly? (19g in 38g out in 30s). Thank you very much!
Id recommend pulling a ristretto for beans that have thick crema. Leave the extra space for volume of milk
Hey, Lance! Great video! I was wondering if you would review the new Varia Evo hybrid grinder. I’m interested to see how it stacks up as a budget grinder to grinders like the Baratza ESP.
I might. It depends on the price, etc.
@@LanceHedrick Sweet! Thanks for the reply.
You totally crushed this product. Hw about the Profitec 800 V2?
Great review as always! Apologies if someone already asked this in the comments but did you do any temperature testing? I saw on their website that the machine doesn’t overheat even with long idle times or when pulling multiple back to back shots. Did you find this to be the case? Thanks!
If you're having issues with the pressure stat going too high / over heating then I'd think the whole machine and brew temp would be affected! I think I had a shot from a small roaster / cafe on this machine and was surprised because I never had a shot that BURNED my tongue on the first sip before. So it felt like it must have been brewed at like 120 celsius! lol.
You could have explained that this machine is a ‚dripper‘ and what that means in terms of limited temperature control. You could also have investigated temperature stability on consecutive shots and/or longer idle time. Very relevant information about drippers.
Other than that, nice and somehow informative video
Yes. The temp increases as can be expected without some sort of system in place to mete that.
Not everyone will be aware of that. That‘s why I think this should (could) be said more loudly
@@Martin-i8o8n that's fair
dipper.
@justlovelyaintit: Right you are. Foreign language hard language
Great review of a product that I would never buy. A Breville dual boiler seems to give better choices, and there is no way I would swap my Flair 58 for this machine.
I was thinking the same thing while watching Lance highlight all the flaws. Pretty hard to justify the asking price when MY dual boiler (with the Slayer mod) can do everything, and I suspect, better than this Vectis. If you are lusting after a lever machine there are plenty of better options. Pass!
I would love to compare as you have.@@CaldwellCoffee
Great video!
Can somebody explain to me what the benefit of a spring based lever espresso machine is? Like I totally get manual espresso giving you more control over pressure and flow. I don’t get how a spring, which basically sets the pressure for you automatically is any better than a auto machine. It just seems like more work and less control than an auto espresso machine
Consistent declining pressure profile.
as John says, it is a predictable declination in both pressure and flow, increasing consistency and giving a lovely repeatable profile.
@@Hundredthldiotthanks that makes sense. It’s harder to do that manually so I accept that. Thanks for responding @lance!
I have a Cremina. Originally got the spring version, but switched to the original - more control.
With the existence and seeming popularity of the flair/standalone lever espresso machines, I think it's about time someone makes a standalone milk steamer. Or maybe I'll just buy this thing.
Nanofoamer pro and morning milk steamer
@@LanceHedrick had no idea about the nanofoamer pro. Always had a prejudice against that type of frother because they always seemed kinda bad compared to a normal steam wand, but your video about it changed my mind. For the next setup!
Hi Flair 58, you are still safe 😊
looks cool but it doesnt seem to be ready for prime. I will keep using my Eropiccola
Your Europiccola is a]manual lever machine not spring lever so you canto compare
@@CH-yp5by I can compare if I am to decide to buy one
very glad you made that video.... i can have a much better opinion now ... thanks :)
thank you! Glad you enjoyed it!
Sometimes I feel like you can lose the plot with some of these reviews as far as them being more than just a break down of the machine. This one felt very focused, while still being really detailed and honest. Very good, sir.
LaPavoni (cheapest one) with Bluetooth pressure sensor and additional analog sensor will set you back 1300EUR. Much less than this one and 1:2.5 ratio is possible without Fellini.
Not a spring lever tho
yes. it is not a spring lever. massive, massive difference there.
Lance can we get an update on your project with Breville please 😊
what is the brew temperature you found with scace?
On the first couple shots of after it's been on a while? Lol
@@LanceHedrick on regular use as you said ready to go,20 minutes+purge
@@guytzur9120 it is the most stable around then. 20-40min mark after turning on.
yes but what was the temperature?@@LanceHedrick
Steam pre-infusion??? To me that sounds like hot steam - 100°C - hitting the coffee?
Are you going to review the Sanremo You?
This video reminds me of: “Better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to speak and to remove all doubt.”
Lol
How that even relates to the vid
They are trolling me lol
@@LanceHedrick not everyone's ready for a honest review I guess. Keep doing what you're doing!
@@dan138zig Read more about levers.
My understanding is that Reiss' technical points are all absolutely accurate, and in many areas lance is simply uninformed and wrong - it's unfortunate for Londinum/Reiss that the response was so emotionally colored.
It would have been fair and reasonable for Reiss/Londinum to respond simply with: "We need to change our documentation for inexperienced and ununinformed users."
Reminds me of my own machine - the Pontevecchio Lusso. Kind of unfortunate that Londonium had us waiting for years, then basically re-invented a PVL.🙄
@@CaldwellCoffee not much! My default (and most other PVL owners) is to do a two-pull shot, but currently I am doing single pull ristrettos on an Italian dark roast and getting 18-20g, but that's with a boiler pressure pre-infusion.
@@CaldwellCoffee
ruclips.net/video/LPF_AIcTIoA/видео.htmlsi=biBenhq3TPjB3Y57
What is this “canal” machine you speak of?
It’s one thing to require a custom portafilter, but to provide one that is 58mm standard diameter is practically a form of mockery. Love the form factor, appearance, price is reasonable, but hard pass!
It is an off the shelf fracino 58 mm portafilter. Lance is wrong here. It isn’t a custom portafilter
It may be off the shelf, but it severely limits your choices. My proprietary philanges was clearly a joke.
Anyway, none of my other portafilters fit and I have quite a few (about 2 dozen)
I liked the MacGyver moment, although fun fact MacGyver did not like to drink coffee, so he would probably not have approved of this episode :p Interesting to learn about this machine though, but why did they bother with 58mm if it is not compatible with other portafilters?
So it can fit la marzocco and pesado ones I've discovered but it's odd- la marzocco can also accept other portafilters. This one is just a bit more loose. Those somehow fit just barely.
Cremina is the way to go 🙏🏻
Stainless welds need to be polished or otherwise cleaned to prevent corrosion
I actually enjoy the Vectis very much, and the price is okay, considering the rising material prices and labor shortages. In the last 6 years, I had 2K EUR repairs for my 8KEUR flow profiling machine. Vectis spare parts are cheap and easy to replace. Over the long run, I guess it will be cheaper than machines with more moving parts
that's great! good for you! Stoked to hear people happy with their machines. in the end, that's what matters most!
If cost is a factor it seems the Flair 58 has this beat by a long mile
It's a very nice machine but at this price point, as we talk for spring machines, i prefer the witch, that's right ... Bezzera Strega
And as always for your videos, you dive into the things, i love it ♥️
my thoughts as well. I wanted this machine initially. now it will cost as much as a Strega in my country. Also I was not quite satisfied with its limit of yields and lower max pressure - there is another review on YT showing just below 7 bar. So I bought a Strega.
@@jameschang8174 Yes strega is a much better machine in my opinion
It's a HX machine, spring up to 9 bars, so no limitation, pump to preinfusion up to 11 bars if you want, much better steam(for someone who cares), and costs less
@@wakeawaken430
But not a true lever but a hybrid.
@@justlovelyaintit why it's not a true lever?
You can NOT use the pump if you want
Of course. Buth that's not what the Strega is all about.If I don't use the sail of a sailboat that doesn't make it a raft.
Okay Lance, good job and thank u for ur efforts. PLease in the next video give me a tiny wink.
So Cremina or Vectis? Wasn’t the Vectis his answer to Olympia?
Personally, Cremina. Though, I love spring levers. This has too many kinks for me to prefer it over the cremina.
I need to get one
@@CaldwellCoffeelike Cremina better without spring; have tried both.
2:33 Hugo looking sharp!
he definitely is!
maybe the spring can hit 8 bar if it just sits with a blind basket or something?
imo this was built to try and capitalize on what appears to be just limitless coffee machine budgets on the consumer market
I did it with a blind basket (the portafilter I used has a valve I just closed completely and got it to stop leaking so max is 6)
ouch @@LanceHedrick
fair enough, personal preferences and advertised capabilities are kinda different imo
@@CaldwellCoffee
description says "READ PINNED COMMENT", however, there is no pinned comment 🤔
Oops. It was a top comment. Forgot to pin it. Thanks for looking out! Pinned now
Interesting.... 'steam preinfusion' will be at a boiling temperature, but the heat content (not the temperature) of steam is MUCH higher than liquid water at the same temperature owing to the latent heat of evaporation (the amount of energy needed to turn water at 100C to steam at 100C). So, I guess the question is can this burn the grounds, or over extract in comparison to liquid water pre-infusion?
It does not preinfuse with actual steam, it just uses the boiler steampressure to preinfuse with boiler water.
As opposed to pump driven or water line pressure driven preinfusion on more expensive levers.
thanks for the clarification! @@peter_oosterhoff
I love Londiniums, but they should come with a set of tools...always something
yeah. set of tools is always nice, but then people will complain that it is an extra cost and they wish it wouldn't come with them haha!