This is my unsolicited advice but based on my personal experience being hurt in church before . 1. Do not forsake the fellowship /gathering of saints it's very important. But as you deal with the hurt , allow God to heal you of the said negativity, forgive and avoid resentment and bitterness. Allow God to redirect you to the correct place of worship if you went to the wrong church or listen to His direction on the next course of action. 2. Create and re-establish boundaries with people in church . Always remember church is just like a hospital , every one comes with their own spiritual ailment and all of us need God's intervention this includes pastors. Man may fail you but God will never fail. 3. There is a place for fatherhood check scripture it is very clear Elijah -Elisha, Eli - Samuel, Jethro - Moses -Aaron . The pastor you submit you can have his failings and cause you to be offended but always honor the mantle not idolise the person. See how Miriam was afflicted with leprosy coz of badmouthing Moses, yet Moses was on the wrong. 4. Ask God for gift of discernment - you will be able to test the spirits i.e people and situations and you can avoid snares even in church.
@@shunetsforever4301 you realize those things are not "cult"... the bible says women should cover their heads and not wear trousers and men not skirts etc... this is the bible whether you liked the chrch that's your own issue but that's not cultish, that's just following the bible lol.
I think Church community is vital to grow as a Christian. The Bible exhorts us not to forsake the gatherings of saints. Once you identify a place led by the Holy Spirit serve fully.
This is a very necessary topic. I don't go to church either. Gospel of prosperity seems to the only thing preached. I have found it to be an environment where people are most judgemental. The Bible says there will come a time we shall worship HIM in spirit and truth. I don't find any sort of fulfillment attending church. I feel better reading the bible and praying with my family. They are my congregation.
I also belong to @elevation church ...I feel like this church really knows what worship is and going to church also Pastor Steven Furtick literally just speaks to the soul💯...I really love this conversation
I'm really saddened by this post for two reasons. (1) people are getting hurt in a place where they ought to find help most. And I pray that you'll somehow find healing. (2) Christians are the biggest enemies of themselves. We should try not to give weapons to "unbelievers" against church. It's true we expect everyone in church to walk with integrity...but that would not be church, but a "holy club". "Church" used to be only for "holy people" until Christ came and begun interacting with sinners, that's how they (sinners) found themselves in church. They are still looking for the Lover of sinners (at church) to forgive them and heal their guilt. But when we have people who run away from "church" because of sinners then the Gospel has been understood upside down. It is very sad, if you've found the truth to run away with it from those rotten "lost sinners." The commission of Christ is very clear: "go preach the gospel...to the whole world... especially to sinners" (paraphrased) including those who belong within those buildings you are calling churches. If you saw real ("raw") sinners (sick people) in those places, Jesus tells you: "when you receive my spirit you become my witnesses to the worldly...(Acts 1:8, paraphrased), not run away from sinners. I'm sure within those church doors, ...were not only made up of abusive "father's" (or mothers in that matter), "shepherds" or even "pastors"...I'm sure there were also redeemed people like you in the worship team (maybe a few), in the pews? Running away from sinners (if you are a true disciple of Christ, you belong where the lost are found) or fellowship of like-minded believers within that fellowship (iron sharpens iron) can't be the solution. Please don't go to these places called church, spying on the sinners. Please look for like-minded-redeemed-people and minister to those people God is showing you to be "living in sin". We measure "Christianity" with Christ not your abusive pastors or any other people falling short of purity. Running away is telling the world that there are places on this earth that are "God-less"...non is. White man did not bring the gospel to Africa. They found nature (God's witness) here. Also, even if the messenger is wicked he/she does not change the content of the message, he's not the author of it. You talk about love...you haven't loved enough to share the truth with those sinners you are running away from?? Jesus leaves the 99 righteous and goes for 1 lost sinner. You leave the 99 lost sinners and go for 1 righteous (YOU)?? If you dared to engage the "sinners" you left behind to come to the "social media church" ...I'm sure, they too, probably, have your kind of story... maybe worse than what you are talking about. Some abusers have also been abused... Jesus made it clear: "narrow is the way that leads to heaven... Very few find it ... (Paraphrased). If you think you've found the"narrow road" of Christ...to take it and hide it at home is heartless and the most unloving thing to do. Shine the light in your "lost church" and let sinners come to Christ. All you "righteous ones" sitting at home (at "social media church"...you are the cause of sinners stumbling in darkness, you found the light and hid it, or ran away with it from church!!! I will stay until the last soul hears about the TRUTH!! I found bread I must share it with those dying souls including "dying pastors", "shepherds" etc. Love the Lord and serve His creation!!
God is restructuring HIS TRUE Church. False worship has become rampant in the churches and many are dancing on their way to hell coz of religion. The gospel has been complicated by many. You go there with burdens (sick) you return home more sick. Many are no longer hospitals. No encounters hence the spiritual stagnation. The ministry of the Holy Ghost is never at Work. Read the BIBLE with due diligence like the Bereans (Acts 17:10-12) , pray, fast as you ask God for infill of His Spirit always. He'll guide you in all TRUTH. As you test the spirit, BE DISCERNING as the days are evil. Falsehood, worldliness and manipulations in most churches. Many gather in HIS NAME but NOT for HIM. Shalom.
You popped out of my RUclips notification and I am so glad you said " Why you don't go to church". That you mention the verse on not forsaking the gathering of believers is spot- on , question is - who are the believers? I also don't go to church and I often listen to some"online" churches but I would love to fellowship with people who I'm comfortable sharing.
This couple have very real convos and that's one of the many reasons I love them,,,, Matters church man its tricky sana, that's why I say I would rather be spiritual than religious
Your channel just popped up in my suggestions and I was led to watch this video. I'm watching from the Caribbean and I am enjoying this video. It's very timely and I love your transparency. It's great that you shared your experience, yet you included the word of God as a compass for direction. I've seen many stray from the faith because of church hurt and as someone who has experienced my fair share of "church hurt", I can understand that strong desire to take a step back from ministry etc to heal and allow God to redirect. Thankfully, those experiences can help us to develop and grow in our Christian walk, and enables us to be better leaders in the body because it can teach us to be more compassionate leaders. May God continue to bless your union and your family and your ministry. Maybe your experience has equipped you to lead your own ministry someday ;-) You both seem to have a pastoral anointing. I'm definitely subscribing and looking forward to more of your content.
I haven't gone to church almost 3 years now. I've interacted with pastors who live lives that do not in any way glorify God. I've had endless sexual advances made at me by men of the cloth. I've experienced the church asking and expecting us to suffer as a form of glorification to God. Heart warming to know that am not the only one struggling with the church. Unfortunately for me, my experiences shook my faith, am yet to recover. Great video.
Have experienced church hurt and betrayal and manipulation, but i thank God He directed me to another place of fellowship. All i can say God heals and He still has Remants, men of God who have not bowed to the idols and baals of this days... So many have misrepresented God but He still the Good Shepherd. May God lead you guys.
Oh my!!! This is such an amazing foundational conversation. I think church involves having relationships and relationships are generally messy, it's never easy because of so many things, however just as you guys have said it's important to also involve Christ in this aspect of our lives. And just like in family, work etc church (the people) aren't perfect and will wrong us so the most important thing is for me and you as an individual to take all this to the Lord in prayer and Allow him to heal us and his word direct us on how to respond. Thank you for sharing your lives with us❤️
Church is just a building, but I believe in power of fellowship. I can't leave a church just becoz I have been hurt coz I ain't a saint either. Just the way I can't quit going to work becoz someone at work hurt me. But anyway whether you go to church or not your relationship with God is all that matters. It hurts to see most of the churches imekua kama soko. You are told to give towards something ati you will be blessed. Kila tym nikutoa kutoa but anyway it's never at gun point so I do what I know and feel and know is ryt .
There is a certain level of maturity and grace that I always feel with this couple that is so powerful. God is going to use you two to make this world a better place, we really need more of such content!
Great conversation.. Godbless you two. I pray the lord returns us to himself coz he says he is a jealous God and will not share his glory with any of us. We turned worship of God to people and places of worship and got lazy to study his word.. May the lord forgive and have mercy on us. Theres a place for church as a building which we cannot despise. The problem is us believers when we begin to worship men of God and not God thru not studying and confirming the word of God they share from scripture.. I feel there's a shaking in the entire body of christ to seperate the wheat from the chaff. May we be found faithful. May everything we do in worship and faith be more unto God than for men.. God is real and he has a place in our journey of faith... May he order our steps into being in the place he has ordained for us.. May we not lose the place of directing our children and children's children in the way of God through not being where he wants us to be 🙏🙏🙏we all need accountability, reason for us having a church to attend. May the lord lead and guide you two and many others for his glory.
I have grown up going to church and being committed untilll I was molasted by the preacher and I was the gossip in the church ,I just started falling out of glory and just started not going to church but I pray and listen to preachings from home since I was 14 till now am 22 ..I can say I was disappointed but still I thank God that he gave me grace to know him more and have a personal relationship with him .. Saddest part is that my mom is still a servent in the same church and what she goes through it's just sad ,the mockings ,frustrations but God is always great ..i would rather fellowship at home rather than go to church my own opinion
I have been debating on this for the longest time I've been hurt by fellow people from the church,people I considered mentors, some pastors manze the whole thing I don't even feel like I'm in any fellowship and it affects my relationship with Him in that place I call church but looking back at how during covid I drew so close to God just at home I was feeling yes God we are walking together
I agree with you on having a personal relationship with God first. I also agree with you on the need for fellowship. He says in His word "where two or more are gathered in His name, then His presence shall be there" so God recognizes the place of fellowship in the life of a believer. The word in Acts especially does insist on fellowship, and "they continuing daily in fellowship" If you can, be part of a fellowship, to walk away from fellowship is to walk away from God. Now, on the church issue, in as much as there is hurt and disappointments in church, I personally believe a believer should go to church. He says that He did not come for the righteous but the unrighteous, we do not go to church because we are righteous, we appear before Him to be renewed and be transformed into vessels useful to Him. So the gossippers, and all these "bad" people do go to church, to be "worked on" by God. He says He searches the deepest part of man, and remember in Genesis, He says the heart of man is evil from its youth. So in church all people will be available, and that should not stop us from going to church. Plus, God recognizes the place of the church, He says "and I will give you pastors ,who shall teach you knowledge" but where are pastors located? In church. Then in Acts, still it talks about "Peter and John going to the temple, to pray" The temple is the church, Still in Acts, it talks about how the disciples continued in fellowship which was from house to house, and in the temple, and they found favour....Again the scripture says, They grow from strength to strength they that appear to God in Zion, Zion is the church, Again, upon Mt Zion there shall be deliverance and the seed of Jacob shall possess their possession. The word has so many scriptures backing church gathering and so I think it is necessary to appear before the King of Kings in Zion, to present yourself.
Wish I could get to share my own experience with church.nawadaiz.,I know I am young bt I thank God for opening my eyes from being mislead by the so called pastors,its something that is happening pple are being mislead,thnk u fr this awareness
Great conversations. We have been stuck up with the notion that church is a place, a joint that we check in once a week. For a married couple with children church is built by dedicated families connecting, communing and developing Christ centered relationships with one another. You are modern day leaders and evangelists using RUclips as a platform. You are technically running a church you are the church. Keep it up
The church is full of a lot of imperfect people (including ourselves) at different maturity levels so that helps to know that there is probably going to be hurt and problems but what's important is how to manage these challenges and grow from it. You grow better when you address the problem instead of running away from it. Its something that I'm also learning
Guys it's amazing to find a couple that shares alot with us! Me and my hubby also belong to an online church coz simply we haven't found a place we can call home.Your story is amazing and would love to share ours too with you
Please the laws are there and we as born again Christians MUST follow them because it's the cost of salvation.....we should not look for churches which favour us in terms of dressing ,class and structure.... please
People are hurting coz of chur.set a time to pray for them.I cried for one year after being hurt by a pastor I trusted. I cried every nyt for one year.it has taken me a journey to heal.but never contacted him or visited his church again.its been 5 years now.but my hubby and I still remember. It's hard for me to trust even a fellowship after that.I am born again and I love christ as my personal saviour
No one can underestimate the kind of pain caused by the wave of our "celebrity pastors". People we based our lives on instead of Christ. We thought they were "perfect" until we found out that they were flawed. So was the message flawed because the messenger was? Anyway, that's besides the point. From where I sit or stand... there are only two systems operative in "Christendom" namely: religion and followers of Jesus Christ. What's the difference? Religion and it's people try to make us "righteous" by their man-made rules and regulations. In religion, if you don't toe the "holiness" line, you'll either be called names (+on social media) or be abandoned. On the other hand, Followers of Christ (not perfect themselves) are full of God's love and relentlessly pursue those we call "sinners" to point them to Christ (both religious and non-religious "sinners"). Jesus came for both of them. People who are carrying stones to stone "the adulterous woman (& man)" are not with Christ but on the religion side. Pls don't get me wrong. We must never glorify sin anywhere, especially in the church. But we must relentlessly search for the lost even among the churched. This includes, so-called pastors, shepherds, fathers etc. Remember, there's no end to the "art of running from sinners". So you went to church thinking it's made of "holy people"...you were shocked to find sinners there. You ran away. Now you and your partner are church... until (God forbid) you find out his/her "real flaws" the real sinner in him/her manifest...then you'll run away from her/him??...to where?? Now you are TV members of elevation church... until (God forbid) the shortcomings of pastor Steven Furtick...are brought to the fore (I'm sure you know satan works very hard to bring the flaws of this front-line risk takers...and we should not help him, he's capable of fault-finding without our help) then your running continues to where?? There's no resting place on earth: ONLY IN CHRIST. If you've not found Christ in the midst of the "dirty storms" I pray for you that you do sooner than later. Because that's what we sons and daughters of Adam are made of. Christ has saved us...but we still wrestle with our sinful nature (Galatians 5). We live daily at the shadow of Calvary admitting we are sinners in need of truth, grace and God's forgiveness. "If we claim we have no sin, we deceive ourselves and the truth is not in us..." (1 John 1:5-10). We must walk in the light and truth and recognize that on this side of life...those who think are "righteous" must humbly help (if they are followers of Christ) those whom we deem to be "lost" to find the way. All of us (Christians) as shepherds under the great Shepherd Christ... must defend the sheep of Christ from ravenous wolves (even if such are found among pastors...). We must not be like religious shepherds who take to the social media or to our homes as soon as we discover sin or "wolves" among God's people or at church (John 10:1-21). Love them enough to pray, witness and correct them not RUN!!!
This was a nice share. My take out is knowing God for yourself because the ‘men of God’ more often than not stumble plus these are the last days and the spirit of deception is on the rise.Lets handle our own salvation with fear and trembling🙏
The time we were preparing for our wedding the church we go to was just never there for us like they do to other new couples and my wife was so disappointed and we have never been visited like my wife feels unwelcome in the church coz before wedding she used to go some church then joined to this church after the wedding
I also think its particularly hard if one is borne in a traditional church family i.e Catholic, SDA....weuh coz the practices r almost impulsive, reflex ....its sth u grew up seeing happening....the religious practices etc. I do respect the conversation.These r conflicts many pple endure everyday.
Thank you for your honesty. Just remember that many people look up to you and many will follow what you say. May God give you wisdom in all that you say and do.
As the Holy Spirit leads, let's pray for the church of Kenya..it's sad when souls are lost from poor leadership...I see other nations praying for their churches and this is sth I'm personally learning coz it didn't seem to make sense to me to pray for churches...but as the Holy Spirit leads I pray we be sensitive to listen.. He'll help us discern Also, the word..the word of God is the manual..may the Holy Spirit guide us through the scriptures and may He bless us with understanding and wisdom and may He reveal Himself through us as we surrender and daily empty ourselves for Him to fill us as we read our Bibles and surrender daily wholeheartedly to the Spirit of God..no teacher is better than Him... But still let's not neglect fellowship no matter the gathering size😊
That was very important,I was also listening to a sermon online and the priest mention don't do what others are doing because everyone is saying is okay,that is wrong, you guys are amazing couple, kwani mulitoka wapi?,very few couple like you guys.
Wow yaani just when I'm at a place of experiencing church betrayal,good content shunets nation thank you for sure church can be a tricky place because I bet when one goes to church we expect the church to hold us when we are drowning but they don't show up at that dire time of need we feel betrayed and cheated
This is exactly my position. Haven't been in church for two years.. I get PTSD at the thought of being in one Perhaps it will change.. With what I know now,i don't know where I would fit in.. So home fellowship is what I have been attempting.
As for me I miss church based on JESUS not money or fame....where the HOLY SPIRIT rules is very hard to find. I still go to church but am still thirsty
Finareee someone is talking about this. Pliz do a series on this and open up. You will help so many. Grace on being in church 5times a week and no compensation...I totally feel yah.
This is such a relevant conversation for this generation. It would be interesting to know how your ministry deals with congregants/members who have stopped attending service or actively serving in different ministries.
I have not gone to church since March last year I have not gone through any church damage per say but I understand that part of over serving in church I have gone through it Currently I go to ufic ministries in Zimbabwe through my bundles lol (Prophet Emmanuel Makandiwa) #teamonline hoyeee I too feel I need to change church like you,am trusting God to lead me where I should be
Talk about a channel when you come and leave edified Such an intriguing conversation, hahaha the part of being in church almost the whole week- so tricky,, I can so much talk about church, but I also feel not really ready maybe soon. Am at a point where I'm learning the truth of the gospel that is not actually taught in Church. Alot of religion But gathering of saints is coming together to discuss Christ, and it mustn't be in church....so the era where your attendance to church was the measure of your maturity in matters spirituality.......is over, have the knowledge of the word #shunetnation
This was a great conversation and we agree with you guys...and for us we feel the church has made more people poor than rich...they still our time, resources etc
It's very clear that we should observe the Sabbath. I hope you shall find a church where you shall be going to fellowship and focus on your God even when you are hurt. Speak it out when you are hurt too to keep the fellowship. Going to church is so important for every believer. Christ said that it's about carrying your cross daily. Go to church I beseech thee.
This conversation is candid and something that many of us Christians are not ready to openly talk about. Thank you guys I am helped y'all are a blessing!
I'm watching this a yr later, I when she said going to church 6 times a week, I totally related. The damage I got from that🤦, I had to take a 1 yr break and now I'm back to church
The number of churches I have been too,lemme tell you Shunets...it's not been easy but I thank God and the holy spirit for having found a church that teaches true doctrine.To all those going through church hurt my prayers are with you🙏🙏.Seek the holy spirit earnestly and he will lead you to the church you should be part of.
The best conversation i have listened to today. I was hurt in church and its been more than an year since i went to a physical church but i always listen to online sermons.
I can sooo relate to church hurt. This happened to me about 10 years ago and it has affected me serving in church. I gave time, sweat and blood but my exit was dramatic. So im ok seating it through.
I have experienced my share of church and the not so Godly things that happen behind the scenes. I finally made a decision to go back to my child hood church. Very sad how church can actually affect your spiritual growth if you are not grounded in Christ.
Hi Shunets, love this topic. Quick one, you said you don't go to church and on your previous video you mentioned that 10% from each individual is tithe that you never fail to do. So where or how do you decide where to send your tithe?
It's 157am and listening to this podcast has revived me.i literally have felt the presence of God at this hour... something so deep I can't explain.be blessed guys.you've touched a soul,.
You're very beautiful Grace. Flawless skin. Could easily do a face cream commercial 😘💞. Interesting engaging topic. God continue to guide you as you navigate this season and that space.
Guys u just reason like me, my church full of gossip, peer pressure ya kushona vitenge every week and pastor only knows you when ur giving much than the rest, u struggle to even be recognized as a member, honestly am a child of God but I don't feel like being in church anymore bcz of my experiences.
I know church hurt all too well. I hadn’t stepped in church for about 1 year after my mum passed and the church wasn’t even there for me and my family. Then I decided to try again and found conmen and I ended up giving all my inheritance to the church and once the money was over I got shunned and so I left again and I don’t think I’ll ever step foot in a church again. Now I am officially Team Elevation 😂. I just choose to have a personal relationship with God I pray for myself and I fast and I read my Bible.
I used to work at church until a thief broke into my house and assaulted me sexually, my seniors werent bothered, i didnt get any days off even though i was hurting, police case nini nini, a friend who doesnt even go to church paid my hospital bill and another non member came to see me at hospital, i was thrown out of that building because the management said i was making up the story to tarnish their name, i needed money to move but i was being pressured with church rent to the extent of being scolded over things i used to give freely, why i hadnt, the pastor told me i needed to learn to never take things personally, good message-bad timing. Another one told me to focus on serving and not what happened, again bad timing… That was 2018 I still cry even when typing this, much as I like to think I healed, I only do online sermons. I dont think I will ever be a church goer 🤔 Team elevation church too, mostly !
@@somewhereinafrica6572 yoooow first of all I'm so sorry that happened to you it should have never happened to you. Nobody deserves that aki. About the church thing I also this it comes from ignorance. You can't ignore normal life experience in the name of serving spirituality there has to ba a balance I thing
literally in 2013,my pastor came and told my mum that God has shown her that am pregnant, and i wasn't. since that day, i always find myself doubting this pastors. That was sad as in God doesn't lie.
This is my unsolicited advice but based on my personal experience being hurt in church before . 1. Do not forsake the fellowship /gathering of saints it's very important. But as you deal with the hurt , allow God to heal you of the said negativity, forgive and avoid resentment and bitterness. Allow God to redirect you to the correct place of worship if you went to the wrong church or listen to His direction on the next course of action.
2. Create and re-establish boundaries with people in church . Always remember church is just like a hospital , every one comes with their own spiritual ailment and all of us need God's intervention this includes pastors. Man may fail you but God will never fail.
3. There is a place for fatherhood check scripture it is very clear Elijah -Elisha, Eli - Samuel, Jethro - Moses -Aaron . The pastor you submit you can have his failings and cause you to be offended but always honor the mantle not idolise the person. See how Miriam was afflicted with leprosy coz of badmouthing Moses, yet Moses was on the wrong.
4. Ask God for gift of discernment - you will be able to test the spirits i.e people and situations and you can avoid snares even in church.
Woooow so profound
I love this comment not coming from a point of judgement but love .
Learnt something thank you
Woooow!!!! Just wooo
@@shunetsforever4301 you realize those things are not "cult"... the bible says women should cover their heads and not wear trousers and men not skirts etc... this is the bible whether you liked the chrch that's your own issue but that's not cultish, that's just following the bible lol.
This so great and on point.. I also love the way you did it as noted above. With love, no judgment
I think Church community is vital to grow as a Christian. The Bible exhorts us not to forsake the gatherings of saints. Once you identify a place led by the Holy Spirit serve fully.
This is a very necessary topic. I don't go to church either. Gospel of prosperity seems to the only thing preached. I have found it to be an environment where people are most judgemental. The Bible says there will come a time we shall worship HIM in spirit and truth. I don't find any sort of fulfillment attending church. I feel better reading the bible and praying with my family. They are my congregation.
I propose the Shunets and Soila & Curtis should do something on this topic .You would help so many youths on this journey.
Absolutely 💯💯💯
I also belong to @elevation church ...I feel like this church really knows what worship is and going to church also Pastor Steven Furtick literally just speaks to the soul💯...I really love this conversation
I'm really saddened by this post for two reasons. (1) people are getting hurt in a place where they ought to find help most. And I pray that you'll somehow find healing. (2) Christians are the biggest enemies of themselves. We should try not to give weapons to "unbelievers" against church. It's true we expect everyone in church to walk with integrity...but that would not be church, but a "holy club". "Church" used to be only for "holy people" until Christ came and begun interacting with sinners, that's how they (sinners) found themselves in church. They are still looking for the Lover of sinners (at church) to forgive them and heal their guilt. But when we have people who run away from "church" because of sinners then the Gospel has been understood upside down. It is very sad, if you've found the truth to run away with it from those rotten "lost sinners." The commission of Christ is very clear: "go preach the gospel...to the whole world... especially to sinners" (paraphrased) including those who belong within those buildings you are calling churches. If you saw real ("raw") sinners (sick people) in those places, Jesus tells you: "when you receive my spirit you become my witnesses to the worldly...(Acts 1:8, paraphrased), not run away from sinners. I'm sure within those church doors, ...were not only made up of abusive "father's" (or mothers in that matter), "shepherds" or even "pastors"...I'm sure there were also redeemed people like you in the worship team (maybe a few), in the pews? Running away from sinners (if you are a true disciple of Christ, you belong where the lost are found) or fellowship of like-minded believers within that fellowship (iron sharpens iron) can't be the solution. Please don't go to these places called church, spying on the sinners. Please look for like-minded-redeemed-people and minister to those people God is showing you to be "living in sin". We measure "Christianity" with Christ not your abusive pastors or any other people falling short of purity. Running away is telling the world that there are places on this earth that are "God-less"...non is. White man did not bring the gospel to Africa. They found nature (God's witness) here. Also, even if the messenger is wicked he/she does not change the content of the message, he's not the author of it. You talk about love...you haven't loved enough to share the truth with those sinners you are running away from?? Jesus leaves the 99 righteous and goes for 1 lost sinner. You leave the 99 lost sinners and go for 1 righteous (YOU)?? If you dared to engage the "sinners" you left behind to come to the "social media church" ...I'm sure, they too, probably, have your kind of story... maybe worse than what you are talking about. Some abusers have also been abused... Jesus made it clear: "narrow is the way that leads to heaven... Very few find it ... (Paraphrased). If you think you've found the"narrow road" of Christ...to take it and hide it at home is heartless and the most unloving thing to do. Shine the light in your "lost church" and let sinners come to Christ. All you "righteous ones" sitting at home (at "social media church"...you are the cause of sinners stumbling in darkness, you found the light and hid it, or ran away with it from church!!! I will stay until the last soul hears about the TRUTH!! I found bread I must share it with those dying souls including "dying pastors", "shepherds" etc. Love the Lord and serve His creation!!
God is restructuring HIS TRUE Church. False worship has become rampant in the churches and many are dancing on their way to hell coz of religion. The gospel has been complicated by many. You go there with burdens (sick) you return home more sick. Many are no longer hospitals. No encounters hence the spiritual stagnation. The ministry of the Holy Ghost is never at Work.
Read the BIBLE with due diligence like the Bereans (Acts 17:10-12) , pray, fast as you ask God for infill of His Spirit always. He'll guide you in all TRUTH. As you test the spirit, BE DISCERNING as the days are evil. Falsehood, worldliness and manipulations in most churches. Many gather in HIS NAME but NOT for HIM.
Shalom.
You popped out of my RUclips notification and I am so glad you said " Why you don't go to church". That you mention the verse on not forsaking the gathering of believers is spot- on , question is - who are the believers? I also don't go to church and I often listen to some"online" churches but I would love to fellowship with people who I'm comfortable sharing.
This couple have very real convos and that's one of the many reasons I love them,,,,
Matters church man its tricky sana, that's why I say I would rather be spiritual than religious
New subbie here na by the way I share a name am also Grace wanjiku
Your channel just popped up in my suggestions and I was led to watch this video. I'm watching from the Caribbean and I am enjoying this video. It's very timely and I love your transparency. It's great that you shared your experience, yet you included the word of God as a compass for direction.
I've seen many stray from the faith because of church hurt and as someone who has experienced my fair share of "church hurt", I can understand that strong desire to take a step back from ministry etc to heal and allow God to redirect. Thankfully, those experiences can help us to develop and grow in our Christian walk, and enables us to be better leaders in the body because it can teach us to be more compassionate leaders.
May God continue to bless your union and your family and your ministry.
Maybe your experience has equipped you to lead your own ministry someday ;-) You both seem to have a pastoral anointing.
I'm definitely subscribing and looking forward to more of your content.
I haven't gone to church almost 3 years now. I've interacted with pastors who live lives that do not in any way glorify God. I've had endless sexual advances made at me by men of the cloth. I've experienced the church asking and expecting us to suffer as a form of glorification to God. Heart warming to know that am not the only one struggling with the church. Unfortunately for me, my experiences shook my faith, am yet to recover. Great video.
Have experienced church hurt and betrayal and manipulation, but i thank God He directed me to another place of fellowship. All i can say God heals and He still has Remants, men of God who have not bowed to the idols and baals of this days... So many have misrepresented God but He still the Good Shepherd. May God lead you guys.
Oh my!!! This is such an amazing foundational conversation.
I think church involves having relationships and relationships are generally messy, it's never easy because of so many things, however just as you guys have said it's important to also involve Christ in this aspect of our lives. And just like in family, work etc church (the people) aren't perfect and will wrong us so the most important thing is for me and you as an individual to take all this to the Lord in prayer and Allow him to heal us and his word direct us on how to respond.
Thank you for sharing your lives with us❤️
This so post worthy
Church is just a building, but I believe in power of fellowship. I can't leave a church just becoz I have been hurt coz I ain't a saint either. Just the way I can't quit going to work becoz someone at work hurt me. But anyway whether you go to church or not your relationship with God is all that matters. It hurts to see most of the churches imekua kama soko. You are told to give towards something ati you will be blessed. Kila tym nikutoa kutoa but anyway it's never at gun point so I do what I know and feel and know is ryt .
Such a blessing, I really resonate with you guys on this. Personal relationship with God is everything n on fellowship choose wisely.
There is a certain level of maturity and grace that I always feel with this couple that is so powerful. God is going to use you two to make this world a better place, we really need more of such content!
Thank you Sharon and Amen and amen
Absolutely
Your prophecy came to be😍
Great conversation.. Godbless you two. I pray the lord returns us to himself coz he says he is a jealous God and will not share his glory with any of us. We turned worship of God to people and places of worship and got lazy to study his word.. May the lord forgive and have mercy on us. Theres a place for church as a building which we cannot despise. The problem is us believers when we begin to worship men of God and not God thru not studying and confirming the word of God they share from scripture.. I feel there's a shaking in the entire body of christ to seperate the wheat from the chaff. May we be found faithful. May everything we do in worship and faith be more unto God than for men.. God is real and he has a place in our journey of faith... May he order our steps into being in the place he has ordained for us.. May we not lose the place of directing our children and children's children in the way of God through not being where he wants us to be 🙏🙏🙏we all need accountability, reason for us having a church to attend. May the lord lead and guide you two and many others for his glory.
Pray for discernment.... On decision-making concerning church... Find a word and true Bible teaching.... But pray
I have grown up going to church and being committed untilll I was molasted by the preacher and I was the gossip in the church ,I just started falling out of glory and just started not going to church but I pray and listen to preachings from home since I was 14 till now am 22 ..I can say I was disappointed but still I thank God that he gave me grace to know him more and have a personal relationship with him .. Saddest part is that my mom is still a servent in the same church and what she goes through it's just sad ,the mockings ,frustrations but God is always great ..i would rather fellowship at home rather than go to church my own opinion
I also don't go to church for personal reason but pole this days church are not holy spirit filled but a red carpet of showbiz
@@fionanjeri3378 it's sad but we can't judge
I have been debating on this for the longest time I've been hurt by fellow people from the church,people I considered mentors, some pastors manze the whole thing I don't even feel like I'm in any fellowship and it affects my relationship with Him in that place I call church but looking back at how during covid I drew so close to God just at home I was feeling yes God we are walking together
I agree with you on having a personal relationship with God first. I also agree with you on the need for fellowship. He says in His word "where two or more are gathered in His name, then His presence shall be there" so God recognizes the place of fellowship in the life of a believer. The word in Acts especially does insist on fellowship, and "they continuing daily in fellowship" If you can, be part of a fellowship, to walk away from fellowship is to walk away from God. Now, on the church issue, in as much as there is hurt and disappointments in church, I personally believe a believer should go to church. He says that He did not come for the righteous but the unrighteous, we do not go to church because we are righteous, we appear before Him to be renewed and be transformed into vessels useful to Him. So the gossippers, and all these "bad" people do go to church, to be "worked on" by God. He says He searches the deepest part of man, and remember in Genesis, He says the heart of man is evil from its youth. So in church all people will be available, and that should not stop us from going to church. Plus, God recognizes the place of the church, He says "and I will give you pastors ,who shall teach you knowledge" but where are pastors located? In church. Then in Acts, still it talks about "Peter and John going to the temple, to pray" The temple is the church, Still in Acts, it talks about how the disciples continued in fellowship which was from house to house, and in the temple, and they found favour....Again the scripture says, They grow from strength to strength they that appear to God in Zion, Zion is the church, Again, upon Mt Zion there shall be deliverance and the seed of Jacob shall possess their possession. The word has so many scriptures backing church gathering and so I think it is necessary to appear before the King of Kings in Zion, to present yourself.
Wish I could get to share my own experience with church.nawadaiz.,I know I am young bt I thank God for opening my eyes from being mislead by the so called pastors,its something that is happening pple are being mislead,thnk u fr this awareness
Great conversations. We have been stuck up with the notion that church is a place, a joint that we check in once a week. For a married couple with children church is built by dedicated families connecting, communing and developing Christ centered relationships with one another. You are modern day leaders and evangelists using RUclips as a platform. You are technically running a church you are the church. Keep it up
Thank you so much sir this is very encouraging
Woooh this is the best video in the internet this week🙌🙌these are conversations that are necessary ❤️
I agree with you TOTALLY…
Aaaaw thank you fam 🤗 🙏 ❤
The church is full of a lot of imperfect people (including ourselves) at different maturity levels so that helps to know that there is probably going to be hurt and problems but what's important is how to manage these challenges and grow from it. You grow better when you address the problem instead of running away from it. Its something that I'm also learning
Guys it's amazing to find a couple that shares alot with us! Me and my hubby also belong to an online church coz simply we haven't found a place we can call home.Your story is amazing and would love to share ours too with you
Today's conversation was deep, thank you for reminding to reconnect to God by knowing his word....started reading new testament today.
You go girl 👏 thank you for watching 🙏🙏
Please the laws are there and we as born again Christians MUST follow them because it's the cost of salvation.....we should not look for churches which favour us in terms of dressing ,class and structure.... please
People are hurting coz of chur.set a time to pray for them.I cried for one year after being hurt by a pastor I trusted. I cried every nyt for one year.it has taken me a journey to heal.but never contacted him or visited his church again.its been 5 years now.but my hubby and I still remember. It's hard for me to trust even a fellowship after that.I am born again and I love christ as my personal saviour
No one can underestimate the kind of pain caused by the wave of our "celebrity pastors". People we based our lives on instead of Christ. We thought they were "perfect" until we found out that they were flawed. So was the message flawed because the messenger was? Anyway, that's besides the point. From where I sit or stand... there are only two systems operative in "Christendom" namely: religion and followers of Jesus Christ. What's the difference? Religion and it's people try to make us "righteous" by their man-made rules and regulations. In religion, if you don't toe the "holiness" line, you'll either be called names (+on social media) or be abandoned. On the other hand, Followers of Christ (not perfect themselves) are full of God's love and relentlessly pursue those we call "sinners" to point them to Christ (both religious and non-religious "sinners"). Jesus came for both of them. People who are carrying stones to stone "the adulterous woman (& man)" are not with Christ but on the religion side. Pls don't get me wrong. We must never glorify sin anywhere, especially in the church. But we must relentlessly search for the lost even among the churched. This includes, so-called pastors, shepherds, fathers etc. Remember, there's no end to the "art of running from sinners". So you went to church thinking it's made of "holy people"...you were shocked to find sinners there. You ran away. Now you and your partner are church... until (God forbid) you find out his/her "real flaws" the real sinner in him/her manifest...then you'll run away from her/him??...to where?? Now you are TV members of elevation church... until (God forbid) the shortcomings of pastor Steven Furtick...are brought to the fore (I'm sure you know satan works very hard to bring the flaws of this front-line risk takers...and we should not help him, he's capable of fault-finding without our help) then your running continues to where?? There's no resting place on earth: ONLY IN CHRIST. If you've not found Christ in the midst of the "dirty storms" I pray for you that you do sooner than later. Because that's what we sons and daughters of Adam are made of. Christ has saved us...but we still wrestle with our sinful nature (Galatians 5). We live daily at the shadow of Calvary admitting we are sinners in need of truth, grace and God's forgiveness. "If we claim we have no sin, we deceive ourselves and the truth is not in us..." (1 John 1:5-10). We must walk in the light and truth and recognize that on this side of life...those who think are "righteous" must humbly help (if they are followers of Christ) those whom we deem to be "lost" to find the way. All of us (Christians) as shepherds under the great Shepherd Christ... must defend the sheep of Christ from ravenous wolves (even if such are found among pastors...). We must not be like religious shepherds who take to the social media or to our homes as soon as we discover sin or "wolves" among God's people or at church (John 10:1-21). Love them enough to pray, witness and correct them not RUN!!!
That's it very well put
Thank you Don
This was a nice share. My take out is knowing God for yourself because the ‘men of God’ more often than not stumble plus these are the last days and the spirit of deception is on the rise.Lets handle our own salvation with fear and trembling🙏
HEH I CAN ATTEST TO CHURCH HURTT AND "FELLOWSHIP" TRAUMA!!!!!!!!!! I WONT EVEN START!
The time we were preparing for our wedding the church we go to was just never there for us like they do to other new couples and my wife was so disappointed and we have never been visited like my wife feels unwelcome in the church coz before wedding she used to go some church then joined to this church after the wedding
A similar thing happened to me lol but you know God sent people God always comes through
Oh...wish I can like this a million times... It was such a "grown" conversation!
Thaank you 🤗🤗🤗
I also think its particularly hard if one is borne in a traditional church family i.e Catholic, SDA....weuh coz the practices r almost impulsive, reflex ....its sth u grew up seeing happening....the religious practices etc.
I do respect the conversation.These r conflicts many pple endure everyday.
May God help us
Thank you for your honesty. Just remember that many people look up to you and many will follow what you say. May God give you wisdom in all that you say and do.
As the Holy Spirit leads, let's pray for the church of Kenya..it's sad when souls are lost from poor leadership...I see other nations praying for their churches and this is sth I'm personally learning coz it didn't seem to make sense to me to pray for churches...but as the Holy Spirit leads I pray we be sensitive to listen.. He'll help us discern
Also, the word..the word of God is the manual..may the Holy Spirit guide us through the scriptures and may He bless us with understanding and wisdom and may He reveal Himself through us as we surrender and daily empty ourselves for Him to fill us as we read our Bibles and surrender daily wholeheartedly to the Spirit of God..no teacher is better than Him...
But still let's not neglect fellowship no matter the gathering size😊
That was very important,I was also listening to a sermon online and the priest mention don't do what others are doing because everyone is saying is okay,that is wrong, you guys are amazing couple, kwani mulitoka wapi?,very few couple like you guys.
Aaaaw thank you it's just God aki
Wow yaani just when I'm at a place of experiencing church betrayal,good content shunets nation thank you for sure church can be a tricky place because I bet when one goes to church we expect the church to hold us when we are drowning but they don't show up at that dire time of need we feel betrayed and cheated
It is sad I think the consolation is that our fait is in God not man
Sending you hugs
Exactly what I went through
Thank be strong God bless
This is exactly my position.
Haven't been in church for two years..
I get PTSD at the thought of being in one
Perhaps it will change..
With what I know now,i don't know where I would fit in..
So home fellowship is what I have been attempting.
We should start a support group at this point😂😂
"Hi my name is Ruby Ninah and I am currently a none church goer". "Hi Ruby,None Church goer nice to meet you"😊😊😊
@@rubyninah 😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂🥂
As for me I miss church based on JESUS not money or fame....where the HOLY SPIRIT rules is very hard to find. I still go to church but am still thirsty
I feel you 💯💯💯💯
Awww I feel you...and Ur so right
I can relate
So powerful
This is me
Amazing!!!!
I think we've all had church drama at this point. We've all left certain churches because we've been hurt by ONE person. So sad
It is actually but we keep believing there will be better
Finareee someone is talking about this. Pliz do a series on this and open up. You will help so many. Grace on being in church 5times a week and no compensation...I totally feel yah.
This is such a relevant conversation for this generation. It would be interesting to know how your ministry deals with congregants/members who have stopped attending service or actively serving in different ministries.
I have not gone to church since March last year
I have not gone through any church damage per say but I understand that part of over serving in church
I have gone through it
Currently I go to ufic ministries in Zimbabwe through my bundles lol (Prophet Emmanuel Makandiwa)
#teamonline hoyeee
I too feel I need to change church like you,am trusting God to lead me where I should be
And He will imagine His intention is for us to find a community and grow in relationship
Enjoyed your message 🔥
Speak in love. God bless you!
The true worshipers shall worship their God in true and in spirit .the church is located inside my heart
💯💯
Talk about a channel when you come and leave edified
Such an intriguing conversation, hahaha the part of being in church almost the whole week- so tricky,,
I can so much talk about church, but I also feel not really ready maybe soon. Am at a point where I'm learning the truth of the gospel that is not actually taught in Church. Alot of religion
But gathering of saints is coming together to discuss Christ, and it mustn't be in church....so the era where your attendance to church was the measure of your maturity in matters spirituality.......is over, have the knowledge of the word
#shunetnation
This is so post worthy 👏 🙌 ❤
I love this content and the convo is so much interesting I love you shunets💞💞 happy Sunday and remain blessed in Jesus name
This was a great conversation and we agree with you guys...and for us we feel the church has made more people poor than rich...they still our time, resources etc
I feel you
It's very clear that we should observe the Sabbath. I hope you shall find a church where you shall be going to fellowship and focus on your God even when you are hurt. Speak it out when you are hurt too to keep the fellowship. Going to church is so important for every believer. Christ said that it's about carrying your cross daily.
Go to church I beseech thee.
wow, you have earned a new subscriber. I think both of you have a gift of counsel
This conversation is candid and something that many of us Christians are not ready to openly talk about. Thank you guys I am helped y'all are a blessing!
I'm watching this a yr later, I when she said going to church 6 times a week, I totally related. The damage I got from that🤦, I had to take a 1 yr break and now I'm back to church
There's a season of going to an manipulative place and there is maturity to heal and allow God do his will.
The number of churches I have been too,lemme tell you Shunets...it's not been easy but I thank God and the holy spirit for having found a church that teaches true doctrine.To all those going through church hurt my prayers are with you🙏🙏.Seek the holy spirit earnestly and he will lead you to the church you should be part of.
Wooow we are so.happy for you fam 💯💯💯
I've looking for a church for three years now, maybe you could tell us your church tujaribu. who knows, might be what I'm looking for.
Life Church International, Limuru.
Thanks for being honest with us! praying that God will lead you to find the right people for fellowship
wow good content please do more vlogs on Faith this was soo good for nourishment of our faith and souls
Thaaaank you we definitely will as He leads
I agree😊
The thin line between recognising that pastors still fall short of his glory and Pastors should be the key example of Christianity 😬😬
That has been my situation this last month.
Thanks for bringing this up 😊
Hey guys just gonna throw my church out there because it's been home after church hurt too @CitylightersChurch held at Nairobi Cinema
So sorry fam
The best conversation i have listened to today. I was hurt in church and its been more than an year since i went to a physical church but i always listen to online sermons.
We feel you 💯💯
Maybe you can look for another one but do due deligence because kwanza hapa Nairobi so many churches have dramas but i am sure there are remnants
I can sooo relate to church hurt. This happened to me about 10 years ago and it has affected me serving in church. I gave time, sweat and blood but my exit was dramatic. So im ok seating it through.
I have experienced my share of church and the not so Godly things that happen behind the scenes. I finally made a decision to go back to my child hood church. Very sad how church can actually affect your spiritual growth if you are not grounded in Christ.
It's saaad
@@shunetsforever4301 Very...but God is faithful. He has His own way of leading and nurturing us through His word.
You people are anointed for sure! The depth yoh! Am touched
Glory be to God thaaank you
This is a much needed conversation . Very very valid points .
Thank you Amy
God knows his people. You can't run away from him if you are His 💯
Hi Shunets, love this topic. Quick one, you said you don't go to church and on your previous video you mentioned that 10% from each individual is tithe that you never fail to do. So where or how do you decide where to send your tithe?
You tithe to where you feed from and since we currently feed from Elevation Church that's where we tithe
Should there be a reason of not going to church?
Best couple on RUclips. Period.
It's 157am and listening to this podcast has revived me.i literally have felt the presence of God at this hour... something so deep I can't explain.be blessed guys.you've touched a soul,.
When u get a good church please share,thanks
Thank you, I can relate and I am so blessed. ❤️🙏🏾
You're very beautiful Grace. Flawless skin. Could easily do a face cream commercial 😘💞. Interesting engaging topic. God continue to guide you as you navigate this season and that space.
The background music is uncomfortable
I had to watch twice am was keen in every...line and statement..... I was also hurt in church .....
Guys u just reason like me, my church full of gossip, peer pressure ya kushona vitenge every week and pastor only knows you when ur giving much than the rest, u struggle to even be recognized as a member, honestly am a child of God but I don't feel like being in church anymore bcz of my experiences.
I totally get you ♥️
I still love you too bure
When you did this interview you were not going to church but now you started a church....how are you running your church? Am curious
So much authenticity in this conversition
Thank you
Thank you
That fatherhood thing sink Deep💯
I love this conversation..Keep going 👏
Thank you fam 🤗🤗🤗🤗
Great conversation, this is one of those real talks that no one talks about
I want to subscribe again to this channel each time...
😂😂😂 that's reassuring lol
I know church hurt all too well. I hadn’t stepped in church for about 1 year after my mum passed and the church wasn’t even there for me and my family. Then I decided to try again and found conmen and I ended up giving all my inheritance to the church and once the money was over I got shunned and so I left again and I don’t think I’ll ever step foot in a church again. Now I am officially Team Elevation 😂. I just choose to have a personal relationship with God I pray for myself and I fast and I read my Bible.
I went thru the same ordeal as you. My dad died and my calls went unanswered . No support at all from my pastor I’m trying to find another church
So sorry to hear that. May God continue to give you strength
Such a great conversation. Much love ❤️
woooow. i love love this.
Nawapenda
Tunakupenda sana pia fam
A moment of silence for those who are currently lost...like we don't know what we believe in anymore...
Hahaha the funny thing is that even where we are not looking for Him God is running after us
I feel lost, I know what I believe in but at this point in time im broken. Many times I want to pray but I can't get the words out... Is just crazy
He will definitely catch up with you
If you don't mind sharing, good or bad. What is your church experience like???
I have experienced church hurt.Where one of the praise members really judgemental
Very bad. Alot of manipulation, Alot of hypocrisy, felt lost.
I used to work at church until a thief broke into my house and assaulted me sexually, my seniors werent bothered, i didnt get any days off even though i was hurting, police case nini nini, a friend who doesnt even go to church paid my hospital bill and another non member came to see me at hospital, i was thrown out of that building because the management said i was making up the story to tarnish their name, i needed money to move but i was being pressured with church rent to the extent of being scolded over things i used to give freely, why i hadnt, the pastor told me i needed to learn to never take things personally, good message-bad timing. Another one told me to focus on serving and not what happened, again bad timing…
That was 2018 I still cry even when typing this, much as I like to think I healed, I only do online sermons. I dont think I will ever be a church goer 🤔
Team elevation church too, mostly !
@@somewhereinafrica6572 yoooow first of all I'm so sorry that happened to you it should have never happened to you. Nobody deserves that aki. About the church thing I also this it comes from ignorance. You can't ignore normal life experience in the name of serving spirituality there has to ba a balance I thing
literally in 2013,my pastor came and told my mum that God has shown her that am pregnant, and i wasn't. since that day, i always find myself doubting this pastors. That was sad as in God doesn't lie.
You guys always have the best conversation! 💖 well done!
Thank you fam 🤗 🙏
After all is said and done the bible says the narrow way only few will find it
Great topic 🙏💯
Thank you fam
Profound!!!!!!!!!!
Thank you
Really enjoyed this conversation - share more and more.
Cyndykaren representing
We seem youuuuuuu 🤗🤗🤗
I enjoy listening to Darmon
This is so so profound.
New subscriber❤️
Karibu sana 🤗🤗