The little known wire wick lathe oil cup
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- Опубликовано: 13 сен 2024
- We look at an uncommon oil cup metering system used by Schaublin metal lathes which prevents over oiling. Read the following important information.
The wire wick must touch the top and each side of the central feed tube wall for good capillary action/flow to occur.
Do not use electroplated wire as it can reduce oil flow significantly.
The wire diameter for the 9" swing Schaublin tool makers lathe shown is 0.04" diameter - fed with Dexron 3 automatic transmission fluid (which is about SAE 15 viscosity).
The oil cup gives about one hour run time.
Camera: Nikon L820
Very interesting. I would have never guessed.
G'day Rob. That was a slippery subject handled well.
Thank you. This has actually answered questions I didn't know I would have. I'm restoring an old Australian Mars lathe and I had 4 of these (two on spindle 2 on drive gear drive shaft) and all but one were broken beyond repair. Given your explanation I have been slowly cleaning the broken ones to reveal that one did actually have a metal wick, two wires twisted into a hook exactly as you describe. Given the amount of swarf I would have written that off without your video. I'm in debt (probably hours in debt).
Glad it helped Philip. Capillary action works basically the same way in a cloth wick, but wire wicks can adjust the flow rate by varying the size/surface area etc of the wire. Using two twisted together is a good idea for large applications and high feed rates. Cheers Rob
@@Xynudu any idea where to get new ones from? 😂
I had to make mine. It's not difficult. You can buy aftermarket ones of various styles, but they will vary in quality, thread type and price. New OEM originals would be unlikely and secondhand ones also much the same. Good luck. Australian Metal Work Forum had a few Mars owners who may be able to provide advice and photo's of what you need. They also have secondhand sections for selling bits and bobs and wanted to buy.
metalworkforums.com/
Cheers Rob
@@Xynudu thanks. My login has only just started working.
I have 4 of them but only 1 has a cap. Maybe I just need to work out how to make new lids.
Lids are easy. You should be able to handle that OK.
One never ceases to learn something new! What a deal, thank you for sharing this one.
Brilliant. Makes total sense Rob.
Thanks for uploading. That Schaublin lathe is a real little beauty, I look forward to videos where you show it. cheers
There are quite a few previous videos where it features, and the web page below:
users.tpg.com.au/agnet/s102.html
Cheers Rob
Thanks for the links, cheers.
Very interesting video Rob. Thanks for doing the research and passing the info on to us. I will be taking your lead here and make a video of the head-stock lube system on my circa 1890's Seneca "Star" lathe. When I removed the head-stock bearing cap the first time I saw a steel ring that runs freely on the shaft and rotates through a reservoir of oil beneath it carrying oil up and around the shaft as it rotates.. Pretty interesting and again a very simple system. cheers- Fred
Hi Fred,
That system sounds very similar to what is used on that vintage Century repulsion start electric motor I showed a while back.
Be very interested to see your video.
Cheers Rob
Hi again Fred,
Just for interest check out some of the YT videos on the old Century motors and you will see a few with a close up and explanation of the little bath oiler and spindle ring they have.
Cheers Rob
Neat tidbit of info Rob..... .035 is a standard size for mig wire spools for those that have buddies that weld and would give you a foot or so. Or take a micrometer to the office supply store and measure up some paperclips :)
You can strip down any multicore wire (electrical etc.) and use a strand from that.
The wire can be any material.
Cheers Rob
Interesting stuff. Thanks for sharing. I think I will look into the oilers on my shaper refurb' All the best Mat
Great video Rob, learned something new, thanks, Cheers, Doug
Hi Doug,
We are always learning.
Glad you got something out of it.
Cheers Rob
The wire diameter I use for my 9" swing Schaublin 102 tool makers lathe is 0.04" diameter. That is used in conjunction with ATF (automatic transmission fluid) which is about SAE 15 viscosity.
I originally used 0.06" diameter but found that it over oiled with that size.
Cheers Rob
xynudu where do you find these lathes at? I would like a small one like this but buying a new one costs a small fortune, not to mention the small fortune worth of accessories that I will need to get just to get me started.
Hi Russell,
It all comes down to luck (and maybe fate). Just watch Ebay, Craigs list and Gumtree (here in Oz).
It's amazing what comes up at times. I'm still looking for a Schaublin cross slide/compound for the last 102 I bought (was found under a tree) LOL.
Cheers Rob
xynudu im usually petty good at finding deals but i just can't seem to find one under 500 american freedom dollars. At least not one that has a carriage that will allow me to cut threads. And im still unsure about a new Chinese 10" machine.
Toolmakers lathes as shown don't have a carriage, so thread cutting is only available via a very rare add on system.
Thread cutting ability is something only the bigger European lathes of this era generally had.
I have a 10" swing CQ9325 Chinese lathe and it works great. Accurate, hard wearing, has been flogged mercilessly for over 10 years with no problem that I didn't cause.
I would definitely buy a new Chinese lathe over some worn name brand unit from days gone by.
cheers Rob
xynudu Well thats good to know. I may pick one up in the near future. Thank you!
Check date... Hmmm, it's not April the 1st.. Ok, it must be true!
Nice one, Rob, very interesting indeed. I learnt something new today, thanks.
Mart.
He He. No BS on this channel.
Rob
You see these all the time on model steam engines. I didn't know about the wire so I will need to give that a try!
good to know!
Demo required good sir
I would suggest that the length of the wire on the drip end will affect the rate of flow.
the lower the tip is the faster the drip rate, as would happen with siphoning fluid with a siphon hose.
Yes. You make the long part of the "J" as long as possible to get maximum effect. Shortening the wire should reduce flow as well.
Rob
Gonna test this today. Hopefully it works as it'll mean I don't need to buy anything :D
Quite interesting. Why does the oil not just travel up the center tube and down it? It has a far larger surface area than the thin wire.
I do not have any machines with those or I would experiment with them.
Good question. I expect because there is not enough height difference between the base of the cup and the screw end of the mounting thread.
Cheers Rob
Very interesting. I have a Smart & Brown lathe (quality) which needs oilers. I'm guessing you lift the wire wick out to stop the oil feed when not running the lathe - ?
Hi John,
No. The wicks are very hard to grip. The oil pots are small and only hold enough oil for about an hour run time. If I only want to do a quick job I just add enough for a few minutes.
Cheers Rob
I'm assuming that no contact with the spindle is required, and movement of the spindle is also not required?
Correct
very cool
Very good information. Beautiful old brass oil pots. Did you use aluminum or stainless for the tops on the ones you made.
The tops are stainless steel, but brass is used on the originals.
Could you vary the oil flow of a wick type by using a different viscosity oil or is it specific lathe oil?
Yes. But the oil type generally falls in line with size - eg. light oil on sewing machines and heavy oil on diesel engines.
So I would use an SAE 15 on small lathes and maybe double that viscosity for bigger lathes.
The oil will also flow differently at different temperatures.
Cheers Rob
Great info Rob. Is it critical how close to the shaft the bottom of the wire goes ?
No. The oil will find it's way to the spindle through the galleries in the headstock.
On the Schaublin it feeds into a gallery that is incorporated in the headstock bearings.
Having said that, a longer feed wire length is better, same as for any siphon system, so that you get the largest height difference between inlet and outlet.
Rob
@@Xynudu I'm sorry but there is no siphoning effect. It is by capillary action that moves the oil.