Who is Sauron? - The History of the Dark Lord from LotR in Tolkien's Lore (Spoilers)
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- Опубликовано: 12 авг 2017
- Who is Sauron? What's his story? Today we have a look at the antagonist of Lord of the Rings and his history in middle-earth. This ancient evil entity is in fact the Lord of the Rings and has troubled elves, men and dwarves for over 6500 years.
He is the servant of Morgoth (Melkor) in Tolkien's Universe. In the Hobbit or the Lord of the Rings, you don't learn too much about him, but in the Appendices and the Silmarillion we find a lot of small background story about the Dark Lord and learn about his lore from the LotR books and the Silmarillion, which explains why he gave Aragorn, Gandalf, Fordo, Sam, Gimli and the others so much trouble with his One Ring.
Notes:
- I pronounce names as Tolkien described it (so a rolled R)
- This video contains spoilers
- The main books (The Hobbit, The Lord of the Rings & the Silmarillion) are my main source
- There are some mistakes in the video
Mistakes:
- Fréaláf Hildeson was Helm's nephew, not his son.
- Morgoth is Sindarin (which is strange) and means "Dark Enemy". He was also called Morgoth Bauglir (Bauglir as some kind of title) and Bauglir means "constrainer" or "tyrant". The name Morgoth and its translation also went through some iterations, which probably results in Morgoth being a Sindarin name instead of a Quenya. AfaIk Tolkien never finally decided on this.
- Arrow placement and text mistake: Ungoliant tries to kill Morgoth near Angband (in Lammoth to be precise) not Ûdun.
- When I say the First Age is short, I mean the First Age during the Years of the Sun. The term First Age is imo very confusing for the Years of the Trees when you use it to express an actual date. As a result (for simplicity) First Age in my videos always mean First Age of the Years of the Sun and for the time prior I simply use the term Years of the Trees (where Valian Years are used, which makes using First Age for this time actually confusing). This is consistent throughout my videos and is also corresponding with e.g. how TolkienGateway.net uses dates.
- Eärendil as son of Tuor (of the Edain) was also a hero for the Dúnedain (and for Men in general) too, though he decided to be an Elf and was not a Dúnedain himself. I worded this a bit wrong in the video though. It must be noted that Eärendil (as halfelven) decided to be counted as Elf for his wife's sake.
- The term "Years of the Lamps" was never used by Tolkien in his books, it's more an "internet term", which I like to use, due to it explaining what it means by itself. So it's very efficient. Tolkien called the time the (first) "Spring of Arda". The "Years of the Sun" are also called "Second Spring of Arda" in the Silamrillion.
I recommend my following videos:
- The long Story of Aragorn, Minas Ithil and Númenor
• The long Story of Arag...
- The History of Rohan
• History of Rohan - Hel...
Cirdan and the History of the Elves:
• Círdan - History and L...
Who is Haleth and the Haladin?
• Who is Haleth? - Edain...
####### Sources and Links ######
Books:
Main Sources:
Lord of The Rings (1954-1955) by J. R. R. Tolkien
The Silmarillion (1977) by J. R. R. Tolkien
The Hobbit (1937) by J. R. R. Tolkien
Unfinished Tales (1980) by J. R. R. Tolkien
The Letters of J. R. R. Tolkien (1981) by Humphrey Carpenter and Christopher Tolkien
Secondary Sources:
Morgoth's Ring (1993) by J. R. R. Tolkien; Editor: Christopher Tolkien
The Peoples of Middle-earth (1996) by J. R. R. Tolkien; Editor: Christopher Tolkien
Parma Eldalamberon XVII
Sites:
lotrproject.com
tolkiengateway.net
Pictures from:
The Lord of the Rings: The Fellowship of the Ring (2001)
The Lord of the Rings: The Two Towers (2002)
The Lord of the Rings: The Return of the King (2003)
The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey (2012)
The Hobbit: The Desolation of Smaug (2013)
The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies (2014)
► Playlists:
If you are interested in Tolkien's legendary #fantasy Epic The Lord of the Rings and his related works, here some recommendations:
➥Book/Film Differences Series - • LotR Prologue Explaine...
➥Recommended Lore Videos - • Who are Tolkien's Wiza...
The Philosopher's Games / TPhGames / TPhLore
► Social Media:
➥Twitter (@PhilosophGames): / philosophgames
➥Twitch Channel - / thephilosophersgames
➥Discord Server - / discord
I usually make analytical gaming and Tolkien & LotR lore content. Feel free to check my channel (ThePhilosophersGames) for more:
/ thephilosophersgames
► Hashtags:
➥ Sauron #Lore #Tolkien #TPhLore #TPhGames 
Развлечения
someone commented on the silmarillion audiobook: “no matter how goth you are, melkor will always be morgoth”. hahah
haha yes that's a great one ^^
That's so good.
Big facts.
Honestly for me the silmarillion was me banging my head against a brick wall
Lmao
Tolkien...It took over an hour to explain one historical character. This is amazing.
Tolkien's universe is the most complex and intricately beautiful literature I have ever seen
Yes I agree. It's beautiful and so rich. I make videos (about Tolkien's universe) for 2 years now and I still discover and learn new things about it :)
PS: sorry for the late answer =/
@Jan-Ola Ellingsen the whole middle earth stuff with creator, maiar, valar etc is basic christianity. look up theology stuff for divine council etc (Michael S. Heiser and others...). It is just very cleverly disguised christianity. even the metaphors tolkien is using here (the creator is singing the earth into creation, together with his maiar) are found in the old testament.
not by a long shot. he copied myths from different cultures and countries (and wasn't even particularly good at it). the languages were admittedly a bit interesting.
@@voicelikemanywaters1017 I dunno about that...there are aspects of Christianity like there are aspects of pre christian paganism....
@@hvaladovienja5159 what books have you written? What entire worlds have you created? You sound like a true asshole and total fool... hopefully your like 15 years old cos if yr a grown person talking this way you should just forget it... you've lost the plot.....
In my youth I was such a Tolkien nerd, reading LOTR and the Silmarillion over and over again. But I haven't read them in decades. Thanks for reminding me of the richness of Tolkien's world. I think I'll start reading them again.
It's a wonderful place to go to escape.
My experience is they got better with age. I read Tolkien as a kid and loved it, again many years later and it rose in my estimation. One of the great authors. Lord of the Rings gets better every reading, which is the sign of truly great story. It's the ultimate fairy tale
@@ishmaelforester9825 I agree. I've since read it again and am now listening to the audiobook on the Internet Archive. It's great while working.
How I wished that old man Tolkien lived enough to fully complete his story.
Yes, we would have a lot more answers, to some long discussed topics.
We can only hope that his son will add to the story!
I disagree. The beauty of all that unfinished lore is that anyone can imagine and decide what you like the most. When I was younger a dreamed about the first age. Its so crazy when you think about it, so much lore and you can imagine even more. He created a land of dreams.
Ronivan Fontanez he would live forever then cuz he did it his whole life and only quit cuz he died. it was a game or lifelong passion. he knew he would never truly finish. it was never the point.
why does he need to complete the story? its all bullshit anyway
Tolkien's fantasy history is more complete than actual human history. Tolkien is a beast.
haha sometimes :D
Interesting :D but I have trouble to fully understand it; it seems partially old english :P
you speak this (language) or you say this;
I always (much?) then I don't get it, maybe something about elvish lore? It's either good or that I have no clue what I'm talking about :D
Sauron is the Lord of the Rings, like? he is the one creator?
Ah thanks :D A bit, but not really (if I understand this correctly). I'm from Germany and I like etymology, which helps a bit. Also while doing research I learned a bit about Old English. It's very interesting.
that is why it is called fantasy!
you should visit a library once in life
What makes me respect fantasy writers is that they have to build a complex world like the one we live in, rather than just using the one provided.
agreed!
Me about to sleep at around 3:00 am.
WHO IS SAURON?
Me: "Well, well, well. Let's find out..."
LoonaHaseul fuck... I felt that
Yep, this dude is good. Very detailed
Fastest 1 hour in my life😂
Thank you ^^
2.18 doing exactly the same
After weeks of reading, writing, re-writing, voice recording and editing my Sauron Lore video is finally done. This is my longest video so far. I hope you like it :D
I think the First Age and Years of the Trees part is a bit confusing and I feel the point I try to make later is a little bit lost, but I tried.
There are probably some mistakes in it too.
Eg: Fréaláf Hildeson was Helm's nephew, not his son. Or Morgoth is Sindarin (which is strange) and means "Dark Enemy" (see description). Also there is a arrow placement and text mistake: Ungoliant tries to kill Morgoth near Angband not Ûdun.
You did great sir, keep it up!
This was amazing..great job man!
Thank you. Happy you liked it :)
Morgoth being a Sindarin name doesn't make any sense. Feanor is the guy who gave Melkor that name. Which was before the Noldor came over from Valinor to Beleriand and had first contact with the Sindarin Elves.
Exactly, this is one of the instances, where you can see, that Tolkien at some point had a different idea with it, but couldn't finish it before his death and Christopher had to go with it for the Silmarillion, since Morgoth is also mentioned in Lord of the Rings. J.R.R. Tolkien experimented with some Quenya names (according to Tolkien Gateway): Moringotto, Moriñgotho or Morikotto.
I think of Sauron as an extension to the old proverb about Greeks "Beware those who give gifts".
I really like this thought. Esp. considering that Tolkien loved Old Greek. maybe that's the inspiration.
@@ThePhilosophersGames Anatar "*Sauron*" is basically a genderbent Pandora. (pandoras box) *Laughs in mythology*
Φοβου τους Δαναους
Και δωρα φεροντας.
@@Sylinnilys Pandora’s Box was actually a large jar called a pithos not a box. That tidbit isn’t really relevant at all but I like to mention it as much as possible because I enjoy knowing obscure things with no practical application.
@@codieomeallain6635 That is true, for us though box is more relevant as a means of understanding the mythos. Hence, Pandoras [Box;Cube, etc] +1 for trivia facts.
Hey man, I'm a fellow LOTR youtuber, and I admire your work greatly, you have true passion for the works of Tolkien and it's evident from the effort you put into your videos (this video's lengths and details speak for itself). This type of passion is something I respect immensely, and I wanted to ask you if it would be cool if sometime I promote you on my channel? I just thought I should ask you in advance, instead of a random video just popping up! Keep up the good work mate!
Thank you ^^ I have seen some of your videos too and I only can give the compliment back. Your videos are very in-depth and well made, a reflection of your passion for Tolkien's works.
I feel honored, that you want to promote my channel and if you want it, feel free to do so. Thank you, I'll try to return the favor :)
GeekZone ohoho you are here too😉
My two faves!!
You guys are both bad ass! You both have awesome accents too. Team up for a video? Men of the West is an awesome channel too. Thank you guys so much. It's great to escape to Middle Earth and get away from the real world for awhile.
You're videos are so great. Thank you so much.
It's insane how the events of the Lord of the Rings are such a small part of this story, almost an epilogue. What an incredibly rich lore Tolkien created!
I love the tricks Sauron plays. It'd be like ted bundy convincing the FBI that he was the President.
"What's up! I'm the Lord of Gifts! I work for those angels off up over there. Anyway, where your weaknesses at?"
It's part of what I love about this lore. One has to imagine a world where news travels slow and anything could be happening in other parts of the world. That, and the long stretches of time during which plans are put into action.
Morgoth? *puts on eyeliner" MORE-GOTH!
haha I did not think about that pun and I think a lot about puns :D Should he ever visit Sauron, he would have to go through a lot of Doors :P
Warum nicht auf Deutsch?
Because I like to produce my content in English. Good practice. Also I do more niche content and that would drastically reduce the chance of anybody seeing it.
Gothmog must've been pretty goth too
Vanalovan/-
It’s always “Who is Sauron?”, not “How is Sauron?”...
I’ll do you one better, why is Sauron!
I enjoyed this comment 😂
"is Sauron?"
Sauron?
Sau ron?
"I am a servant of the Secret Fire, wielder of the Flame of Arnor...."
That line sent shivers up my spine when I first heard that as I had no idea what it meant....it was pure fan service for the LoTR dorks that knew the lore...lol
SD so i’ve just learned that it is apparently “flame of anor” bc i always thought it was arnor. but i guess both could fit. trying to see the subtitles
@@sarikatimmi Flame of Anor, or Flame of the Sun aka the very flame of life in Arda. The Gondor province of Anorien and the city of Minas Anor (now Tirith) are also of a similar source as is Isildur's brother Anarion.
@@SantomPh Also Gandalf/Mithrandir is wielder of the ring of flame so it fits 🙂
And a direct quote from the book.
Sauron is basically Gandalf (or any other Wizard from Istari/Maiar race) who joined the Dark Side. That's it. Now you know why Gandalf was so afraid of Frodo giving him the Ring, afraid of temptation and the consequences that would follow. Read _Silmarillion_ .
Yes, basically :P
With the massive difference that the Istari followed the orders given by the Valar to not use their full powers in middle earth, while saurons master is basically an ex-Valar, or "fallen angel"/"Devil", and thus had no concerns for those laws and therefore seems so much more powerful.
I thought he was Orthennar, Melkor's Maya...
But why was Saruman so weak then... or better said not as powerful as Sauron?
JOIN ME AND TOGHETER WE WILL RULE THE GALAXY AS FATHER AND SON
49:10I wouldn't say the Valar didn't care about humanity...it was that they cared too much and knew too little about the Children of Iluvatar. The Valar knew that when gods go to war whole continents blow up and, since Man was weaker than the Firstborn, they didn't want to make a move against Morgoth when humans were born. Later, they became almost paranoid about taking direct action, since whenever they did it seemed to make things worse, and thus removed themselves from the world. Of course Sauron came to power in the Third Age and the Valar even under their self-imposed exile couldn't do nothing, so they sent the Wizards to help indirectly. This is one of the most moving aspects of Tolkien's works, that we initially think the divine have abandoned the world and mankind, but it turns out they haven't and are indeed subtlety active.
I agree it's a strong motive. They later sent help in form of the Istari, but if i think about how long men from the east ans south were under the influence of Morgoth and his servants, I would still stick to my comment. They ofc didn't understand men that well (in contrast to the Eldar), but they understood Melkor/Morgoth. But I definitely see your point.
Thanks for watching and listening for so long ^^
Yes he became the 2nd Dark Lord in the Second Age, but was Morgoth's highest Commander with Gothmog during the First Age and before (Years of the Trees).
I agree but I think an additional reason for their caution and reluctance to take direct action is to avoid being corrupted themselves. Taking charge of things means wielding control. The Valar didn't want to replace Morgoth with themselves in the process of throwing him down. That's why the maiar who were the Istari came in the form of old men, hale but wizened. Their job was to give wise council and inspire the races of Middle-Earth to take action, not to rule.
Look it's not real ffs you know more about this shit than the message of faith sent to humanity
@@blueboy1430 Ok Boomer 🙄
"Melkor" sounds like some kind of dutch milk chocolate
haha now I'm hungry ^^
@@ThePhilosophersGames Maybe that's why he turned out such a paranoid control freak. Still it did not stop him from ending up as chocolate of the void.
Dude, I think you used up all the rolling "RRRR's" in the human language.
haha probably, but I use them ever since and it seems there is still enough ^^
👏👏🤣🤣🤣
@@ThePhilosophersGames Really appreciate this but all those rolling "RRRR's" dude! It was pain! My name begins with R and I also roll them but it just takes away from the awsomeness of this.
@Isaiah Tufor He literally starts pretty much all his videos with a little disclaimer about the amount of rolled R's, because that's how Tolkien described they should be pronounced. So yes, he is trying to sound all 'middle earth'. Because it's a video about the lore of middle earth. Seems appropriate to me
@mattajas I'm maori, we have them too. A = ah, e =eh, I = ee, o =or(without the rolling r like English) u= ew like, ew that's disgusting without the ee sound)
Then h, K, m, n, t, w, ng=gn same as Italian, and wh = which is an f unless the other tribe doesn't have an h which revert to a w, or a w which reverts to an h.
I love that lotr stays relevant and that people keep digging in the lore
Yes it's very nice to see how many people are still interested in the lore. Thank you for commenting :)
relevant compared to what? its just fiction
Plummet
Relevant to this day, Because some Books and Movies got suddenly popular, but become irrelevant in just few years, months or even weeks.
+Plummet it doesn't matter if its fiction or not, Lord of the Rings be it movies and novels etc and the interest in it still make Tolkien's work relevant. With people digging through the lore and coming up with theories, plus its just not Lord of the Rings that is relevant. There are other series out there where people discuss theories and dig into the lore, its just not lotr
Nazgûl you must have stayed dead....you witch king of Angmaar
I'll do you one better, WHY is sauron
:P
I'll do YOU better. WHEN is sauron
Trev Stauf Well, I have one answer. Tolkien was an observant Catholic,and after the death of each of his parents,certain priests mentored him. He clearly felt oathbound due to that. So,there are limited but very deep parallels between Christian doctrine and Tolkein's attempt to write the 'history' of the AngloSaxon culture.
So evil exists. Sartre says "Hell is other people". Tolkien being a WW1 not a WW2 soldier saw evil in terms of traditional Catholic doctrine. As such,he HAD to shape Sauron in terms of the son of the morning star. Lucifer.
The amazing thing to me is there is so little Christianity in LOTR,rather than just some.
HOW is Sauron?
@@rexrowan6411 Well now the one-ring was destroyed,Tolkien states he just becomes another minor spirit,endlessly gnawing at itself. So that is how is Sauron.
This is like a seminar on the LOTR for an hour.
yes the video got a pretty long in the end. When I started writing it, I thought would be like 20-30 minutes xD I hope you liked it :)
@@ThePhilosophersGames It turned out quite well, actually.
Thank you :)
It's interesting to me that Sauron actually delights in beautiful things but is willing to stoop to any means to rule the world.
It would be awesome and hilarious if he completely made ALL of this up!
haha yeah that would be funny. But also impressive ^^
thanksfernuthin yea "very funny" oh wait its not
Ouch! Teo! I thought, "Oh, he thinks it's funny." and then you hit me with the zinger! Sarcasm!
thanksfernuthin :)
That would be impressive... most impressive.
But not true, I've read the Silmarillion ^^
The last time the Valar moved openly against the evil of the world the battle caused much destruction and death (hell a part of the world were completely destroyed) and that persuaded the Valar to move more gentle - The Wizards (where 2 of them did go to the east) and the ever present eagles where some of the methods used.
Also, The Valar simply didn't understand mankind, Eru kept much knowledge about men for himself (like what happens to humans when they die) - the Valar are very much the Elven Gods.
That said Sauron/Melkor does seem like they only two who actually make plans in Middle earth and honestly they should have won like 7 times over but are always foiled by what seem to be coincidences - many attributes these "coincidences" as the machinations of the Valar.
Yes, that is a very good point (that they don't know that much about men either and that they are more the elven gods - really like this wording).
I would still argue, that the Valar still had at least some "responsibility" for Melkor and they neglected watching over him, which led to much corruption, esp. of men. Even though they are probably not that "close" to men, they should be at least look what their kin is doing.
Ofc it must also be noted, that e.g Tulkas was not happy with Manwë's decision to pardon his brother Melkor, which in the end caused much trouble.
Oh and from a writing perspective (of a "mythology") this makes totally sense. I just wanted to point out, that this is probably the reason, why so many men followed Morgoth and later Sauron. I think this Valar conflict and maybe bad decision gives the story some color.
Another point I agree with you and I really like about the Lord of the Rings story, are the Istari. As you said the last time they went into battle a big part of a continent got destroyed. Now they chose a far more subtile, but still effective approach. One could only argue, that it was a little late, but it turned out well and I think made an amazing story.
Thanks for commenting :)
Just to show how little the Valar understood men - when the Numenorians landed on Aman, Manwë had to call upon Eru to handle the situation, As the Valar were forbidden to take direct action against Men but also I think the Valar had no idea on how to handle the situation.
Yes, you can read it like that. They also debated how to handle the situation with Eärendil and Elwing, which resulted in this half-elf ruling, that they must decide for one - being Men or Elf.
The 'coincidences' are also lessons. Like the Hobbits Frodo and Sam confounding Sauron the Great. He doesn't simply lose, he gets a spanking by the most humble people. It's not just a defeat, it's a lesson to Sauron about the music. They were meant to find the ring, as Gandalf says. The suggestion is that was Eru Illuvatars plan.
@@Anacronian The Valar weren't aware of how far could the ambition and greed of men reach, that to point of wanted to take the sacred continent all by them selfs, that is how little the Valar understood the men
The backstory of the wizards and who they really are is one of the more fascinating aspects in the lore imo 👌 its all amazing but they have especially Gandalf the most influence upon the story we are all so familiar with
Loved the video. I've been on a Tolkien binge these last few weeks, and have been looking for a video to put things in order, I felt like this really did it. Amazing work.
Thank you, happy you liked it :) Yes it's a lot of information and getting this into an order and structure can help a lot ^^
Have to sleep, exams in 3 days, completely devastated.... oh, "Who is Sauron?", 1:15:30.... YOU BETCHA !!
haha sorry. But good luck/a lot of success on your exams :)
Yeah how did kt go?
Darth Vader 😂😂😂
"YOU BETCHA !!"
That sounds like Minnesota Viking language, don't'cha'know.
How did the exams go?
Tolkien was a mad man... So much information.. I almost couldnt keep up.
Yes, it's just so much and I already let out some information. He worked big parts of his life on all of this. Quite impressive.
Great video by they way good sir.
Thank you :)
There was so much information that Tolkien couldn't always keep up, hence his continuing to work on the whole masterpiece for his entire life.
8:51 Now things become complicated... bro I’m here at 3AM and I’m too drunk for this degree of brainfuck
Its not much better sober😂 i got 3 replays ahead before i get the first half
Finally a video that's not 10 minutes long on Sauron
haha yes I tend to make long videos ^^ It's an old video though. I originally planed to cover both Dark Lords in it, but that did not work out 😅 If I would make it today it would be like twice as long I think, because I would dive more into History of Middle-earth material.
What a marvelous accomplishment for you! Very long and very well edited; I loved every minute!
Thank you as always :D Happy you liked it. Yes indeed my longest video so far and also my most successful. I still think the Years of the Trees and First Age part is too confusing. I had a lot of problems condensing them and finding a good structure. Could still have done it a bit better. But the First Age is very confusing :D Still very happy and also surprised by all the positive feedback, so iI don't complain :P
Great lore video. Sauron has such a deep and interesting history.
Thank you :) Yes I knew he did a lot, but I was surprised as well while doing research for the video. Never expected the video to bis this long.
Sauron is one of my top villains of all time and he looks bad ass in that armor too and also in his eye flame silhouette form in The Hobbit.
I believe it was present in LOTR too, just not brought to our attention.
I'm glad you didn't split this up into 2 videos. I was so into your commentary. You helped me to understand this story line a lot better. Thank you.
Thank you! I guess YT- or business-wise it would have been smarter to split it, but I like having everything in one place (if possible), so much appreciated :) Happy you liked it ^^
Man, major props to you for replying to damn near all of these comments...for real
Thank you :) I have to admit this month I'm really behind. So many new comments. Also there are some comments, I simply can not see (esp. answers to existing comments are really hard to see). But I enjoy a bit of interaction with the people here and it helps the channel grow ^^
Linda Banks yo seriously. i’m never as excited as i get whenever he responds
Very well done video! I highly appreciate the extreme detail you go into, so well done!
Thank you, glad you enjoyed it. A lot of work went into it, so much appreciated :)
You made this very interesting and easy (as easy as it can be) to follow along with. Thanks for the heck of a lot of work you put into it.
This was merely brilliant! You did an incredibly good job of untangling Tolkien's monumental work. I have read the appendices and the Silmarilian, as well as The Unfinished Tales, but now I feel I have a better understanding of the whole thing. Excellent work!
"Melkor, your little pet caused a massive flood... please make him behave!"
"His name is SAURON! AND MY NAME IS MORGOTH!! DAD!!"
And thus, the war of hissy teen melkor began...
Almosr perfect. But...
"Alkar, your little pet caused a massive flood... please make him behave!"
"His name is Orthennar! AND MY NAME IS MELKOR!!! DAD!"
Perfect))
kill me now
Dude I laughed so hard my family is up now haha. Happy New Years man haha
Since he's more goth he should be more "You just don't get me dad!"
"MOREGOTH" hehe
Yeah I'm not going to lie, i was lost after 10 minutes. Great video though. Wonder how long it took Tolkien to make this universe, it's surprising how i thought lotr was the main chunk of the world but its really not.
I bought the silmarilion ages back. Ill have to try and find it and give it another shot..
You'll be lost after a hundred pages. It's all "..and he was the son of .. who was the son of ... , son of bla bla bla" for pages and pages on end. And then everything has fantasy names from the sun to the earth to the sky, etc., meaning after some time, you won't even remember who or what he's talking about without going back to the glossary.
Tolkien more or less wrote the Silmarillion for himself, and it shows.
There is so much about this universe, but a lot of it is more like in a "history" book. The Silmarillion e.g. can be a tough read, but some chapters are great, like the Downfall of Númenor or the story of Beren and Lúthien.
Thank you :) Yes I'm not happy with the First Age part. I think it's very confusing. It gets better after 28 minutes, when the 2nd Age starts.
I wrote someone here a summary of the first Age:
Morgoth/Melkor influences Elves (when they awake, first appear on Middle-earth)
Valar try to help the elves
Elves go to Beleriand to travel to the other continent Aman
Some elves stay in Beleriand and found a kingdom (Doriath)
Elf Fëanor crafts extremely powerful artifacts
Melkor/Morgoth steals artifacts
Fëanor goes insane with his sons and they swore an oath
They kill other elves to steal their ships and sail back to Middle-earth
Then 20 different things happen and a lot of elves die
Human Beren and Elf/Maia Lúthian retrieve one artifact on a crazy quest, which is the condition for Beren to marry Lúthien
And years later Feanor's sons again kill their own people to get this Artifact back because of their Oath, but still fail
Other elves are not happy with Fëanor's sons
The other Kingdom called Gondolin gets destroyed too and then a giant war (War of Wrath) with Valar and Dragons breaks out which Morgoth/Melkor loses at the end
In between all of this Sauron is active and tons of other things happen.
about 20 years. read the silmarillion
I was lost after like five.
Well apparently in the end Turin fights and destroys Morgoth in the FINAL battle, Turin, even in death, still carries the power of Morgoth's curse, which allows him to kill morgoth. So that is also a happy ending.
This was awesome thank you! It's hard to find long videos discussing all the events in Sauron's history. The Witch King is my favourite and you discussed him as well so I'm super happy, I'll watch this a few more times I'm sure. Thanks again! :)
Thank you :) Happy you liked it. Yes in general I would say my videos are longer. Feel free to check my other longe videos too :P
ruclips.net/video/JgcnVsMAnMo/видео.html
ruclips.net/video/lZDYJTTWknQ/видео.html
ruclips.net/video/19BnKSy8Xhs/видео.html
Also currently working on a 4 hour video about Elrond (will come in two parts or something) ^^'
I love this video, I appreciate anyone who knows Tolkien's universe and can properly pronounce the names as well. Excellent, excellent work!
Thank you :)
Wow, I am impressed at what you've put together, this is exceptional work & even more exceptional effort put into it. If even 10% of RUclipsrs put this type of effort into their creations wed be in the golden age of youtube.
Thank you, much appreciated :) Oh yes, it was a ton of work, but in terms of RUclips content it's quite inefficient, but I like it and the feedback is very positive, so I will continue. Maybe a bit shorter in the future, at least the next lore video will be shorter ^^
Growing up, I wasn't the biggest LOTR fan. But listening to your voice on Sauron's History was inspiring!
Thank you, happy you enjoyed this video :) Yes I have some friends, who e.g. struggle with the pacing of LotR, but still find the world and deep lore fascinating.
New subscriber and WOW! I just wanted to thank you for making these videos. I always found the lore of the Silmarillion to be too daunting from word of mouth and raw info on the wiki but you break down these very complex, intertwined, and sometimes conflicting chains of events and stories in such an easily digestible manner, without making me feel like I don't have reason to read them anymore. You've convinced me to dive into it headfirst and see what else Tolkien has to offer. Also, I love the long-form content and appreciate what an immense amount of work and research must go into these! (And don't mind the almost-certainly american crybabies in your comments. The effort you put into pronouncing Tolkien's works as accurately as possible to the source material is just another sign of the sheer amount of passion behind these videos, especially considering english is a second language for you.)
Only four minutes into this video and I'm already having to repeatedly rewind and watch again just to follow all the names, ranks, and getting the stories straight. Totally worth the trouble though. I love Tolkien books
This is my 199377th time watching this. Its like a whole movie for me. I ought to donate just because of this single video!
Sorry for the late answer. Thank you, happy you enjoy watching it so much! So far I have no e.g. Patreon account set up or anything else for direct financial support (outside of watching the ads in the video for 30 seconds). For now I want to stay completely free (outside of YT ads), even though I appreciate the generosity. Commenting, liking or even recommending my channel further to friends is a good way to support me :)
I love the way you pronounce the names like Sauron! Such a great video!
Thanks :) I use Tolkien's pronunciation rules, but sometimes I still mess up ^^ It's quite interesting, that some people love it while others find it very annoying. But I still assume the majority likes it, so I will continue with it.
Melkor during the song of creation plays a rock anime music instead of his fellow valars who sang opera.
lol
Yet another fantastic video mate...may you never tire or stop...you are simply one of the best youtubers I've ever come across
Thank you, I'll try :)
Excellent video, man! Very helpful. Keep posting!
Thank you. I'll try :)
This was a ton of work. Great job!
Thank you! Yes, that was a ton of work, but I'm very happy about how much positive feedback I'm getting :)
I was playing this in background and at the end I was like: About who am I watching the video? This was a whole history lesson. Great video I enjoyed it.
Thanks so much for creating these videos. I just started LOTR again. Your pronunciations have helped me read the book as Tolkien intended. I have to say, it's a lot more fun this way.
Big thanks for pronouncing names correctly (i.e. the way Tolkien would have)! Got really sick of videos made by Americans, all getting it totally wrong.
haha no problem ^^ Over the years i got better at it. This early video has for sure some pronunciations errors by my side too, but a lot of research went into this, so much appreciated!
It's kind of interesting though. When you try to say the names correctly, some people appreciate it and others dislike it, because e.g. they can't stand the trilled R sound or are used the film pronunciation. If you anglicise all names (like some other channels do it), some people will point out, that this is not how Tolkien intended the pronunciation. I guess you can't make it right.
I got a decent sized channel with the correct pronunciation, so I will stick with it, but I'm asking myself often what would have happened if I decided to anglicise the names instead. So I definitely have some understanding for the approach of other channels.
You’re not the only one. As an American son of an immigrant, it is infuriating how lazily most Americans anglicized historically ethnic sounding names and terms. Some of it is shameless and an obvious attempt to remove the original culture’s association.
I love how you include the appendix from return of the king. It was this section of the books that was so impressive. Tolkien’s fantasy world read like 13th century history. It made the impossible seem probable. Well done.
Never read the books, but saw the movies. Now I'm 3 videos deep of your lore and this is fascinating. Appreciate it!
This was so amazingly done finally someone who did a history of sauron, every detail, information, and timeline about this so excellently done. I know you did so much research of sauron that took so much of your time and effort and wow so that how sauron became evil and created Mordor love it, I learn a lot of sauron now.
There are movies this long.
I am excited and frightened by this excitement.
Have fun ^^ I hope you like it. The beginning of this video can be quite confusing. I personally think my Elvish lore video is a bit easier to follow (but even longer than my Sauron video): ruclips.net/video/JgcnVsMAnMo/видео.html Both cover many similar things.
Great video. Very well done. There are only two issues: Sauron did not continue Morgoth's work (destroying and marring Arda), but instead worked to corrupt its inhabitants and rule over the World (hence the titles of Lord of the Earth/Lord of the World and King of Kings); the temples în Middle-earth were devoted to worshipping Sauron ("Sauron desired to be a God-King, and was held to be this by his servants; if he had been victorious he would have demanded divine honour from all rational creatures and absolute temporal power over the whole world"), whereas the one in Númenor was to Morgoth ("Sauron, apparently a defeated rival for world-power, now a mere hostage, can hardly propound himself; but as the former servant and disciple of Melkor, the worship of Melkor will raise him from hostage to high priest"). Sauron never was loyal to Aulë or Morgoth, but was smart enough to see such service as a means for his own ends as well, similar to his double-faced servant Saruman ("Sauron had, in fact, been very like Saruman, and so still understood him quickly and could guess what he would be likely to think and do, even without the aid of palantiri or of spies"). He used the names of Morgoth and the Aratar when it suited his needs: by presenting himself as the representative of both parties he corrupted many Númenoréans and convinced the Elven smith to trust him. (Nowhere does J.R.R. say he awaited Morgoth's return, as it is obvious he was acting on his own).
Thw only other issue is saying he had no control whatsosever over Balrogs and Dragons. I am not saying all of them served him, but some of them seem to have based on this: "And he gathered again under his government all the evil things of the days of Morgoth that remained on earth or beneath it." (All implies that from every Melkoric race there were some who followed Sauron). Another argument is Gandalf's fear of Smaug on Sauron's side: "The Dragon Sauron might use with terrible effect." (If Sauron hadn't already commanded a Dragon, why would someone as wise as Gandalf even think of Smaug as an ally/minion of Sauron?). The rest of the video is perfect. Apreciate the work you put into and hope I cleared up a bit!
awsome Video great effort thank you for taking the time to give us that gem
Amazing video, man. Super informational - testament to Tolkein’s work
Thank you :) Yes it really is and I even cut out several pages. It's always like just scratching the surface, when I make videos
Me listening while working on nursery
Wife walks in
"And he allowed her to ride him"
Wife walks out
haha :D
If you get lost in the beginning (~10 min), don't worry. Things are less complicated later on.
Thanks for the great video
Thank you :)
Yes totally agree. The beginning is (sadly) a bit confusing. I usually suggest skipping to ~ 28:00 mins (Second Age part) and then copy/paste a summary of the First Age events. Glad it seems to work.
In case anybody is interested, here the summary again :D
- Morgoth/Melkor influences Elves (when they awake, first appear on Middle-earth)
- Valar try to help the elves
- Elves go to Beleriand to travel to the other continent Aman
- Some elves stay in Beleriand and found a kingdom (Doriath)
- Elf Fëanor crafts extremely powerful artifacts
- Melkor/Morgoth steals artifacts
- Fëanor goes insane with his sons and they swore an oath
- They kill other elves to steal their ships and sail back to Middle-earth (First Kinslaying)
- Then 20 different things happen and a lot of elves die
- Human Beren and Elf/Maia Lúthian retrieve one artifact on a crazy quest, which is the condition for Beren to marry Lúthien
- And years later Fëanor's sons again kill their own people to get the Artifact back because of their Oath, but still fail (2nd and 3rd Kinslaying)
- Other elves (mainly Teleri elves) are not happy with Fëanor's sons (over the time, starting with Beren's and Lúthien's Quest)
- The other Kingdom called Gondolin gets destroyed too and then a giant war (War of Wrath) with Valar and Dragons breaks out which Morgoth/Melkor loses at the end
- In between all of this Sauron is active and tons of other things happen.
haha I had to pause every few minutes and google the names and backstories xD
It's very difficult to keep up with this. And I dont think I could blame you. This tree has a lot of branches. Maybe if you made this into a series. It would be slower paced and much easier to comprehend. But seriously though, great great effort on your part. I would've lost my mind trying to map all this information for viewers.
Excellent video! Thank you for making it so in depth! The map is so great to watch!
Thank you :) Yes the map is so helpful, agreed. Shout-outs to lotrproject.com ^^
Thank you so much for this. You did a lot of work so I really appreciate your effort.
I was enjoying this thinking of when to go to bed pressed pause, realized it was an hour. And kept watching. Gg dude. I love the way you pronounce the names with the r’s. Take my subscription.
haha happy you enjoyed it so much, even though it kept you awake. Thank you :)
I got lost about two minutes into the video, but it just goes to show how deep the lore goes on ONE character. This is like the biblical history version of LOTR.
You have put so much time and research into this essay. Well done and thanks so much.
Yes making this video took a while ^^ Thank you, happy you liked it :)
When there's a long hall, Mordor
When the swat is knocking, Gondor
After several of these I just went and bought the silmarillion
Nice to hear, I hope you enjoy it. It can be a tough read though. Always happy to hear, when people start reading the books after watching my videos ^^
You put a lot of effort into this. Well done!
Thank you :) Yes, the 1 hour+ videos are really a ton of work
Dude, I could listen to you all day. Awesome video.
Thank you :)
Very informative. Appreciate the work you put into the video.
Thank you :)
I came here just to hear him say 'Valar.'
:D
So THAT'S where Amon Amarth got its name! (Referring to the Swedish Melodic Death Metal band)
Yes, which is quite funny. I knew the band name for quite some time, but didn't noticed until I started making videos and the name popped up again ^^
I laughed so hard when I saw that, Brian Posehn named his Ogre in D&D (Nerd Poker Podcast) Amon Amarth; good, good stuff.
Also, Gorgoroth!
Just found this channel. This will probably be the first channel I gladly sat through a double advertisement to get to the video without skipping.
Thank you that is really much appreciated :)
I know the ads can be really annoying - esp. after YT started introducing the double ads. I can also somewhat recommend RUclips Prime for people who watch a ton of RUclips and want to support creators. It might be surprising but the Prime revenue for creators is really good (much better than ad revenue), though it seems a bit pricy.
Also: my policy on ads is just one ad break at the beginning and one at the end. And if the video is longer than ~40 minutes one in the middle - if it is different than that let me know, than there's a mistake (I also can only define where in the video ads are playing, not what is shown or what type, etc). But never feel forced to watch ads.
PS: welcome, happy you found your way to my channel ^^
@@ThePhilosophersGames I in no way feel forced, i just see how much work and love you put in and that just makes me really happy. I have recently considered getting RUclips premium (or whatever its called) but havent had the opportunity just yet. I look forward to seeing more content from you and I'm also excited to binge watch more videos :)
haha I wish you a lot of fun do8ing this ^^ Sadly I can't produce videos as fast as people watch them 😂
You have explained so many questions I had beautifully. Thank you!
happy I could answer some of your questions, thank you too for commenting :)
(If you want to look even deeper into the lore check my (so far) two Who is is Elrond videos (you might need a bit of time though 😅))
My forever best writer... He makes me feel I can write a book as well... My inspiration Sir Tolkien
Yes I can totally relate to this. His work is really inspiring. Interestingly the films and esp. the music of it also work well for me.
Flat earthers got an aneurysm at 40:31
:D
Thank you for actually being thorough.
Happy you liked it :)
I'm glad that I found your channel this is the kind of stuff that I love learning about, I hope you keep up the good work.
Thank you :D I plan on making a lore comparison video for Shadow of War soonish. I also started research for the next Tolkien lore video, but not sure if I will finish it this month. But there will be more at some point ^^
"They battled with powerful songs" So basically they had a rap battle :D
haha yes basically ^^
More like a drum contest
With magic
Except they were songs, not rapping.
He said "SONGS", so no. No rap battle.
Dominate for the purpose of creating order, his order of course
As pointed out by others, it's likely his end goal was relatively banal to what we imagine
Ex: orcs could in the end be largely useless, too prone to disorder and violence
But men, though initially rebellious could be taught and molded into loyal and orderly servants, likely his preferred servants for and until the ending of the world
He did not want to be the lord of war and ash
Beautiful presentation mate. Love your intricate details
Thank you, much appreciated! Happy you enjoyed it :)
This is so detailed and beautiful! Thank you so much!
Lord Melkor/Morgoth is the 'true' Dark Lord. The first to defy the authority of the Creator Illuvitar. The Defiler of the Music. The creator of orcs and dragons and the corruptor of men. All hail the Black Enemy! Slayer of the Two Trees and 'master' of Sauron.
I know the Shadow of Mordor games aren't canon, but there is an ancient orc on there who served Morgoth and thought of Sauron as nothing but a pretender and a userper.
I also think that Melkor's part in the music of creation it's necessary, there's need to be dissonance, he is also a part of Eru, he cannot be erased.
Yes Sauron was a pretender and a usurper; I mean he was only 2nd in command to Morgoth along with Gothmog and was one of his more powerful Maiar spirits and also given command of Angband while Morgoth was away but yes, Sauron was a total fraud.
The hate Sauron crowd gets further and further away from what is actually established Tolkien lore into their own invented head canon with each passing day.
@aaronsdavis so basically, everyone has to suffer so he can enjoy his lucky charms
@@danielhamilton351 yet sauron succeeded where morgoth failed, yet sauron is still around while morgoth was banished into the void while begging for mercy. Morgoth was deeply wounded by and afraid to face fingolfin, an elf not even a powerful maia spirit. He even had to call his servants to scare ungoliant away as alone he was to weak to do so on his own.
I thoroughly appreciate your work. Keep it up! More RUclipsrs need to adopt the quality over quantity policy. BTW thanks for making a video I requested whether or not you made it for me lol :D
Thank you. Well, you definitely influenced my decision to make this video :D I (sadly) forgot your username, but I knew someone in the comments suggested it and it was a really good idea. So thanks for your comments =)
Thank you so much for your videos and particularly for subtitles )) they helped me a lot!
No problem ^^ Happy you enjoy my videos. Thank you too, much appreciated.
Yes some people commented if I could create subtitles for my videos in the past and in my case it's not much work, I just have to copy paste my script and click on publish, then they are generated automatically. Impressive technology and it seems to help put people enjoying my content. It can ofc take a moment until they are generated for a new video or I forgot to confirm the publishing process 😅 If that's the case just hint at this in the comments.
@@ThePhilosophersGames I was happy to find so many information about Tolkien's Lore in the format of such detailed and comprehensible video. English isn't my first language, so when i find out, that here is subtitles i was 100 times happier - now i will understand every single detail!)) Thank you!
You did great mate. Loved the video.
Thank you, happy you liked it :)
3:28 Tolkien was a fan of the Finnish language, which had a strong influence in the development of Quenya. In Finnish, "sorron" means "oppression".
@@kassikasa1682 How would you translate "ja ettet taipunut sa sorron alle" into English?
@@kassikasa1682 All four of my mother's grandparents immigrated to the U.S. from Finland ~100 years ago. So, not Finnish _per se_ but 50% in terms of heredity.
My original point was that Tolkien might have drawn upon Finnish to name his oppressive antagonist in LOTR. It was never meant to be a grammar lesson.
After embarrassingly little research ( www.theonering.com/reading-room/critical-viewpoints/where-did-tolkien-get-his-names-from-language-in-the-rings ), "sauron" is from Old Norse meaning, abominable. So my question boils down to whether "sorto" (meaning oppression or tyranny) descended from that word--not quite as exciting a question, though I'm sure The Professor would be amused.
I really enjoyed this video you did a great job.Will you be doing a video like this for Morgoth?
Thank you :) While making this one I thought about, making one about Morgoth. Maybe, but it's difficult. First Age is very complex.
This is very impressive research and content. Thanks for putting all that time into it.
Thank you, happy you liked it :)
This was soo good! Very informative and easy to digest. I finally put all those names and places into their right places in my head. Thank you.
Thank you, happy you liked it :) Yes an overview of who did what at what time helps a lot, because there is just so much backstory.
@@ThePhilosophersGames It does! I'll surely check more of your content for sure. Thank you!
me: hey sauron....what do you even want to dominate middle earth for? why do you want to rule it?
sauron: because i wish to rule all
me: yeas but why.....what do you get out of ruling the whole world, whats your end goal after defeating everyone and you rule over an army of in-fighting orcs?
sauron: i'll-well
me: to bring peace to the world?
sauron: yea lets go with that
Sees one hour vid from philosophers games.... *straps in* this gon be gud
I hope you like it. The First Age is confusing
After reading the Silmarillion, it's a lot of story to process and this video is a nice addition to the story. Good work.
Thank you :)
Thank you very much for this amazing video!
Happy you enjoyed it, thank you too for commenting ^^