Thanks, copper patina is my nemesis and I know I'm not alone. Will try your tips tomorrow on a wee window hanger of a ginger cat I made for my beloved, I really wanted copper with all the golds I had used. Thank you 💗 for sharing your skills
@lpmluciano. The short version of the steps: have two copies of a pattern, cut one copy of the pattern, glue paper pieces onto glass, cut glass pieces, grind the glass to the pattern, clean, number and copper foil each piece, set up on a flat board, and solder together. Here on RUclips you will find a variety of videos on these steps. Best of luck to you!
I had an old timer teach me that black patina can be taken way back with 0000 steel wool, and that it won't damage the glass. It has to be 4-ought steel wool though!
I've never seen 'black' patina for solder turn any darker than dark brown. We've only used two brands- Classique and Novocan. You may want to check out Jax- they've got a whole slew of patinas out. Make sure you choose patina based on the metal you're applying it to. If the label doesn't say "lead" don't use it for 60/40 or 50/50 solder. Black patina for zinc (used in framing channel) turns a greyish-almost-black. It has to do with the chemicals plus the reaction with a particular metal.
Hi. regarding the copper patina...can you not wax it? and is it durable to the touch? I'm planning on tinting some solder I'm going to use to repair some dents in guitar frets to better match the frets original color. I realize this is an offbeat application but I'm curious to know your opinion.
The copper patina can't be washed off, but *should* be waxed to help seal it. It will tarnish/darken over time with air exposure. This patina works on lead solder, but I just have to caution you about touching lead- be sure to wash hands afterward. As far as durability goes, if the patinated metal will be continuously touched, this may contribute to more tarnish over time. Hope this helps, and thanks for watching!
LadyBerz thank you for answering. I've ordered lead free solder for this project . I hope the patina will work on that. It's a cosmetic issue at the end of the day. I don't think wax is an option in this situation. But reapplication of the patina shouldn't be a problem. This should be interesting 😉
The only way that the backing on foil won't be seen/won't matter is when using opalescent glass (translucent). If you are using any of the transparent or semi-transparent glasses like cathedral, clear, streaky, wispy, glue chip, etc, then the color of the foil backing is going to be noticed. Copper patina might look better if you mostly used regular foil.
I've been making stained glass items for over 30 years and I have yet to find a patina that actually makes the solder a bright copper color Either I'm getting tainted products, old products or something else is wrong. I always scrub the seams well with isopropyl alcohol before using patina and it makes no difference than if the solder still had flux on it. Could it be because I was using a cheaper solder 50/50 and not 60/40?? Over the years the solder has gotten so expensive that I went to the 50/50 which has actually caught up in price with the 60/40. I always pour some of the patina into a small container so I don't contaminate what is in the bottle. I've heard that some people just dunk their Q-tip into the bottle which WOULD taint the entire bottle. P.S. I am now using Novacan Copper Brite and I get the same results. Any suggestions, hints???? Many thanks
Copper patina is notoriously tricky to work with. In my experience, it interacts badly with *everything* so I wouldn't be surprised if the alcohol was to blame in your case. It goes on very ruddy and unevenly. We often have to scrub on several layers, then wipe off the excess with dry paper towel. Then wax right after. We use Liva polish nowadays, which is the closest I've come to the copper getting really shiny. That said, it's still copper, and will tarnish over time. If anyone has a more reliable solution, even a lacquer that gets painted onto seams, I'd love to know, haha!
@aksaraini - I've not ever heard of using ketchup on lead/tin solder, but on the 'net I read that zinc can be colored with ketchup, vinegar or orange juice. If you find anything natural that will work on the solder, please let me know! Thanks for writing!
the patina is *supposed* to react with the lead and the solder. I haven’t tried it on lead came, just on solder (40% lead) but just use a brush to apply, and see. :-)
@csnomore - Hobby Lobby is a store chain in the Midwest. They sell 12" x 12" sheets. You can also look up "stained glass studios __________" and fill in the blank with the city and state you're in. Hope that helps!
I used to use plain Turtle Wax for cars. It works fine. Now, though, I use Liva polish specially meant for stained glass. You can use it before and after patina, or just after patina.
Okay, what is your advice to re-do copper patina. My first piece may not have had the flux cleaned off correctly and I think the class had me wax and then patina and then wax...Regardless, I want a "do-over".
I had someone give this great advice once- take #0000 (extra fine) steel wool and very carefully scrub over the seams only. Get most of the patina off. It will bring the seams back to a mostly dark silver. Wax the window to make it extra clean. Then re-apply the copper patina. Wipe it dry, then re-wax. It should look much better.
+H. Vitae If you start out with lead came, then the black for lead works on it. When you use zinc came, then use black patina for zinc. Novacan makes a formula, and the writing on the bottle is black, not blue. Since zinc and lead are different metals, the patina looks a little different on the zinc. It is more dark gray, as opposed to the brownish color of the black patina for lead. As well, you have to apply it on CLEAN came (no fingerprints) in layers (wipe, wait, wipe, wait,) and have patience! Do a google search to find a bottle of it. Good luck & thanks for watching!
There is a way to take off patina but it's no fun.. have to run the iron over every seam to regain a fresh surface. I've had some problems with my first copper color run and I think you expained it.. i had flux residue and it messed with it came out too dark.
You're exactly right, Randy. You can go over *all* of the solder again to remove the patina, but let's face it- who really wants to do that!? :-) I tell my students to get 3 other student's opinions before choosing to patinate. It can be a big decision, but one that usually has good results.
Hey- just so you know- If you have a question for me, please feel free to ask it here. The response, however, will be sent to your email. It will not be posted here, because my responses are usually too long to fit here. :) Thanks to all of you who have already asked lots of questions- I'm here to answer them :)
Even after all these years, this video remains very useful and suggested by the youtube algorithm. If you see this, thanks a lot LadyBerz! :))
You're very welcome!
Thanks, copper patina is my nemesis and I know I'm not alone. Will try your tips tomorrow on a wee window hanger of a ginger cat I made for my beloved, I really wanted copper with all the golds I had used. Thank you 💗 for sharing your skills
Good luck!
@lpmluciano. The short version of the steps: have two copies of a pattern, cut one copy of the pattern, glue paper pieces onto glass, cut glass pieces, grind the glass to the pattern, clean, number and copper foil each piece, set up on a flat board, and solder together. Here on RUclips you will find a variety of videos on these steps. Best of luck to you!
I had an old timer teach me that black patina can be taken way back with 0000 steel wool, and that it won't damage the glass. It has to be 4-ought steel wool though!
Yes! We discovered that shortly after this video was made. #0000 is the ticket. Thanks for watching!
I've never seen 'black' patina for solder turn any darker than dark brown. We've only used two brands- Classique and Novocan. You may want to check out Jax- they've got a whole slew of patinas out. Make sure you choose patina based on the metal you're applying it to. If the label doesn't say "lead" don't use it for 60/40 or 50/50 solder.
Black patina for zinc (used in framing channel) turns a greyish-almost-black. It has to do with the chemicals plus the reaction with a particular metal.
Hi. regarding the copper patina...can you not wax it? and is it durable to the touch? I'm planning on tinting some solder I'm going to use to repair some dents in guitar frets to better match the frets original color. I realize this is an offbeat application but I'm curious to know your opinion.
The copper patina can't be washed off, but *should* be waxed to help seal it. It will tarnish/darken over time with air exposure. This patina works on lead solder, but I just have to caution you about touching lead- be sure to wash hands afterward. As far as durability goes, if the patinated metal will be continuously touched, this may contribute to more tarnish over time. Hope this helps, and thanks for watching!
LadyBerz thank you for answering. I've ordered lead free solder for this project . I hope the patina will work on that. It's a cosmetic issue at the end of the day. I don't think wax is an option in this situation. But reapplication of the patina shouldn't be a problem. This should be interesting 😉
Is there any way to fix making copper foil black after noticing you didn't use all black backing?
The only way that the backing on foil won't be seen/won't matter is when using opalescent glass (translucent). If you are using any of the transparent or semi-transparent glasses like cathedral, clear, streaky, wispy, glue chip, etc, then the color of the foil backing is going to be noticed. Copper patina might look better if you mostly used regular foil.
I've been making stained glass items for over 30 years and I have yet to find a patina that actually makes the solder a bright copper color Either I'm getting tainted products, old products or something else is wrong. I always scrub the seams well with isopropyl alcohol before using patina and it makes no difference than if the solder still had flux on it.
Could it be because I was using a cheaper solder 50/50 and not 60/40?? Over the years the solder has gotten so expensive that I went to the 50/50 which has actually caught up in price with the 60/40.
I always pour some of the patina into a small container so I don't contaminate what is in the bottle. I've heard that some people just dunk their Q-tip into the bottle which WOULD taint the entire bottle.
P.S. I am now using Novacan Copper Brite and I get the same results.
Any suggestions, hints???? Many thanks
Copper patina is notoriously tricky to work with. In my experience, it interacts badly with *everything* so I wouldn't be surprised if the alcohol was to blame in your case. It goes on very ruddy and unevenly. We often have to scrub on several layers, then wipe off the excess with dry paper towel. Then wax right after. We use Liva polish nowadays, which is the closest I've come to the copper getting really shiny. That said, it's still copper, and will tarnish over time. If anyone has a more reliable solution, even a lacquer that gets painted onto seams, I'd love to know, haha!
@aksaraini - I've not ever heard of using ketchup on lead/tin solder, but on the 'net I read that zinc can be colored with ketchup, vinegar or orange juice. If you find anything natural that will work on the solder, please let me know! Thanks for writing!
Does the copper patina work for both lead and solder?
the patina is *supposed* to react with the lead and the solder. I haven’t tried it on lead came, just on solder (40% lead) but just use a brush to apply, and see. :-)
@csnomore - Hobby Lobby is a store chain in the Midwest. They sell 12" x 12" sheets. You can also look up "stained glass studios __________" and fill in the blank with the city and state you're in.
Hope that helps!
Hi, thanks for the great video, I just wanted to ask; what wax are you using with the novacan black patina? Thanks again!
I used to use plain Turtle Wax for cars. It works fine. Now, though, I use Liva polish specially meant for stained glass. You can use it before and after patina, or just after patina.
Okay, what is your advice to re-do copper patina. My first piece may not have had the flux cleaned off correctly and I think the class had me wax and then patina and then wax...Regardless, I want a "do-over".
I had someone give this great advice once- take #0000 (extra fine) steel wool and very carefully scrub over the seams only. Get most of the patina off. It will bring the seams back to a mostly dark silver. Wax the window to make it extra clean. Then re-apply the copper patina. Wipe it dry, then re-wax. It should look much better.
So steel wool, wax it, patina, don't wash, wax...wax on wax off...sorry, couldn't resist. ;-)
Is there a way to patina the different types of came? I want to end up with a dark/blackish finish on the entire piece (solder and came)
+H. Vitae If you start out with lead came, then the black for lead works on it. When you use zinc came, then use black patina for zinc. Novacan makes a formula, and the writing on the bottle is black, not blue. Since zinc and lead are different metals, the patina looks a little different on the zinc. It is more dark gray, as opposed to the brownish color of the black patina for lead. As well, you have to apply it on CLEAN came (no fingerprints) in layers (wipe, wait, wipe, wait,) and have patience! Do a google search to find a bottle of it. Good luck & thanks for watching!
Very helpful
Glad it helped! Thanks for watching!
What wax do you use?
For years we used turtle wax car wax! Now we use Liva polish.
There is a way to take off patina but it's no fun.. have to run the iron over every seam to regain a fresh surface. I've had some problems with my first copper color run and I think you expained it.. i had flux residue and it messed with it came out too dark.
You're exactly right, Randy. You can go over *all* of the solder again to remove the patina, but let's face it- who really wants to do that!? :-) I tell my students to get 3 other student's opinions before choosing to patinate. It can be a big decision, but one that usually has good results.
Yep, it is a last resort, but still much better than having to start over.
Hey- just so you know- If you have a question for me, please feel free to ask it here. The response, however, will be sent to your email. It will not be posted here, because my responses are usually too long to fit here. :)
Thanks to all of you who have already asked lots of questions- I'm here to answer them :)