Old Vs New - How Have Mountain Bikes Changed? | GMBN Investigates
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- Опубликовано: 2 авг 2024
- Today's enduro mountain bikes are getting closer to downhill bikes, with geometry getting progressively slacker and suspension travel getting longer as each year goes by. But just how much have these bikes changed over the years? Rich Payne checks out one of the first 'Enduro specific' bikes to see what the differences are between old vs new.
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One thing I like about new bikes is how quiet they are on the trails. My old 2010 Trek with clutchless derailleur sounds like a shopping cart going down the hills 😅
I have a 2013 mega, but I've upgraded it with a shimano deore xt 1x11, fox 36 float factory grip 2 170mm and a rockshox monarch rt3, rides like a dream and doesn't feel dated, id say if you can't afford the new stuff the old stuff isn't bad at all.
I'm riding a Diamondback XR1 (around 2000) and it's safe to say that it feels a lot different to modern bikes. I went from a budget hardtail (that I'd upgraded heavily) with modern geometry to an older full suspension with outdated geometry. No matter how far back I reach, I still feel over the bars, so descending can be dangerous sometimes. I still love it and I'm going out on a ride today!
I went from old full sus 2005 giant bra to modern HT Orbea laufey. You hade to weigh the front when going slow on the flat. But you can take turns mutch faster and harder if you push the newe bike.
I still have most of my old high end bikes, mostly for nostalgia, I'd take my wife modern 1k trek hardtail over any of them for any ride over 10 min...
Was the “aloominum” for your US viewers?
@erikd6124 I ride a Laufey too. Love it. Mostly downhill or aggressive xc. It's a beast.
Aluminum is not outdated I think aluminum is the best thing to build bikes out of it's reliable and it does not break who else agrees with what I'm saying ❤❤❤
I know people who had new carbon bikes that got cracks or snapped in half so now I only ride aluminum cause I don’t trust carbon 😂
I don’t trust plastic bikes💯 aluminum all day!
Titanium in my opinion but price wise aluminium is awesome
I did a similar comparison on DH bikes this year. I got a an old downhill bike back that I used to own in 2009 for free and restored it and then compared it to my current Scott Gambler 2021, the old one was a Dabomb Dirt Bomb.
The old one was so scary to ride that I almost just left it in the car park, short, steep, horrible handling but I had lots of fun on it back in the days.
The suspension was not that bad with Fox 40 and Fox DHX 5.0, brakes was good with Formula the one Gen.1 but in the end the only thing I liked with it was that it fitted in my van, the Gambler is just too long :)
The camera work at the start of those laps 👌
should have given the old bike some new rubber... the ones on are the same age as the bike. -.-
Go to a bike park. That tends to be the case 9/10 times lol. Its alright most of us ride half assed tires anyways.
The old one's tires are shot, put some new tires on it, and make the front a 27.5 for a "mini-mullet", and that thing is still very much relevant. And I actually prefer all the aluminum.
Yeah me too, the carbon fiber seems too unpredictable for me in terms of durability.
been there, done that, can't recommand. Either you sacrifice lots of travel or the longer fork/higher wheels puts the rider too far back. I had lots of front wheel washouts with 650b/160mm. It could have been compensated with a far longer stem (70-80mm) but i prefer riding at 160mm, 26" and a 35mm stem by far.
I’m riding a 1992 Grove handcrafted Xinnovations, this video was super helpful to figure out the differences between my bike and modern day ones!
I have a modern short travel 29er and it feels like a downhill bike to me, but goes uphill like a rocket ship. Love it.
Your videography team is out of the world. Great job as always. Would love to see the BTS of how you guys get some of these beautiful shots!
By being part of the Disney Empire.
Maybe one day they’ll produce 4K content instead of 1080p?
Man this is an actually really interesting video idea! Downhill next pls!
Quick edit - It would be insane if gmbn tech could carry this through and talk about geo changes or breakthrough componentry and whatnot
I will buy the “old” 2013 used for $2000 then buy four more $2000 used bikes with the money saved from not buying the 2023! 😂 Bikes are not cell phones, they aren’t junk after 5 years….
Just got my daughter a 2010 jamis Dakar for 200 bucks. Can't get a better bang for your buck. The shock and fork both still work good
So true. Just bought my first bike. Got a '13 santa cruz. Carbon everything, full sus, Internal routing, dropper post, fox 36, sram xd1. All for $2k couldn't find something even half as well specd for close to that money.
E-bikes are ; )
You would be better of with a $2000 modern bike. 2020 or newer. Especially now there are loads of good deals around
Still riding my 1987 Mantis.
i have a 20 year old trek 820 and it will be a while before i get a new bike. it feels like riding a dinosaur across the desert but its still fun
That was my first "good bike" back in 1995! Until it was stolen... :(
There's a shocking 5mm difference... that's like comparing the sandala to the rocket. With one you'll be on the moon in 5 seconds, with the other it'll take you 1000 years...
Seriously, am I the only one who thinks that differences in geometry are massively exaggerated these days? What about the driver? the brakes? The tire, etc...
4:15 look at the tyres, perished AF !!! No wonder you bottled the jump at the end lol
Great VIdeo, fun to watch!
loving that tracking headshot before the first test ride 😍
Brilliant editing and camerawork (as always)!
0:00 omg that is beautifull, forget biking one just wants to hug that ground and the trees! 🤍
PS: ''forget biking'' is just a figure of speech,
pedal on!!! : )
What about old Mega vs modern Scout. Old full sus vs modern hardtail. What would be better and around this kind of tracks-trails.
Also, we all know that full suspension 29ers were available in 2012
It amazing me to hear just how bad the older model was against the original review of that bike. Pretty sure Rich is simply trying to push newer models-
Bikes have changed so much since my 1997/2000 downhill years. I'm especially excited about ebikes and their future, especially now I'm older, more unfit and have injuries that still affect me.
I look forward to the future for sure
might wana go sort out your EMBN subscription then
@thesmf1210 I already did that long time ago. But I still like my normal mtb. Why, can't I?
@@briw4647 Ignore the ego maniac.... E-MTB is where it's at, these dinosaurs that like taking their bikes for a walk will get there eventually, if they can afford one that is....
@@briw4647EMTB is the future. Especially the SL models with the smaller motors and lighter batteries. There’s nothing like zooming down a mountain, and then pedaling back up like you’re a cyborg with powered legs.
@@MarioGoatse o totally agree. add a battery extender pack and you could easily cycle 60 miles of hills and dips comfortably. e bikes will , with the increase of technology and batteries just get better and better
29" vs 26" is silly. My 2013 Stumpjumper 29er has a 67 degree HT and 74.5 degree ST (72 degree actual). The reach is the only noticeable differences from newer geos.
I am sure that 2023 handles like a dream, i haven't priced it out yet but i bet its not cheap. If i were racing, even at a novice level maybe. However, i am a 53 year old dude in the States, with a mortgage and kids in college. So my 2013 MTB get me down the hill . I am willing to product test anything at anytime lol!
Mountain bikes have come a long away! They're so different to the old ones. They've changed for the better! 🤘
Nice opening shot in the forest, killed it!
I met a dude out on the trails.. he had fitted a new fork on the older nukeproof, and went full 27,5”!
Fitted with 2,4” tires he said dry/damp works completly without rubbing, but actual wet weather gets very messy..
Got me thinking what would happen if he tried to 29”/27,5” mullet it..
-are there any forks that would work in that equation these days tho? Guess you would go triple crown..?
A classic bike is more than a bundle of technology welded together by machines. My 1987 Mantis is a work of art.
I am still riding my 2003 hard tail and I am a tall guy. While I think I would have an easier time on modern geometry I wouldn't call the shorter geometry "sketchy." We all rode it just fine.
With old bike it seems weird if you apply new school riding style… switching my new age fulsus bike to my old one, I need to adjust my riding style as well. However, the new bike feels more composed and fun….😊
I'm riding a 2009 iron horse mkiii elite. I've upgraded suspension, group set, brakes, wheel width and hubs. Still works like a dream. I've never riden modern geometry though so I am blissfully ignorant. Until I can afford one. 😁
Got an 09 intense 6.6 slopestyle. All the og fun
I love my V3 Scout 275. It's just sad NP is gone! But suppose to be a "new NP" coming from Mike Ashley aka Evans Cycles/Chain reaction. So I guess we'll see what the "new nukeproof" is about.
I still remember a coworker arguing with me that mountain bikes from the 80s were just as good or better than bikes today 😂
I'm sorry, I know that Nukeproof are sponsors, fine, but the title suggests a thorough analysis of old V new not an advert about how much the sponsors current model has come on .....
My 2015 XXL Merida 99 has basically the same reach as a 2017/18 L Scott Spark. Makes me wonder what size I’d need to get if buying new today given how reach has grown. That said, stems have shortened and seat tubes steepened so that would perhaps offset some of the reach growth.
Which stem are you running on the newer iteration there payner? *The oilslick one...
I see huge evolutions in suspensions. The apparition of electronic suspensions and sensors, along with geolocalisation capabilities, will probably mean more adaptable and performing rides.
Still use my 1993 Scott Pan American. I only miss the power in my feet😅
I have some questions, was the old bike recently serviced, especially the suspension? Also the tires, no one is riding 12 year old tires so did you have an appropriate new set of tires on the old bike?
Just another comment, I remember my friends all talking about ordering XL Enduro bikes back then when they would normally fit a large (which I believe was common and the industry took note)
How does a 2012 XL with modern tires and fresh suspension service compare?
Great video
This wasn´t a real fair comparison, Rich.. ^^
The tyres from the old Mega were visibly old and really parished, so the grip was reduced.
@gmbn you can do better!
I'm guessing 0mm offset stems (similar to the raised reverse stem) and gearboxes are going to be commonplace in the next 10 years
I'm looking forward to gearbox bikes becoming more mainstream. Maybe when we can ditch the gripshift? 😊
26” is the most fun
I sense you were trying to do the Bentley meme😂
Nice comparison of the same model 10 years apart. Year over year, the changes are small, but 10 years layer it is a totally different bike.
Just putting it out there, this ain't that old lol. Bikes have changed in a huge way since 2013, yeah, but compared to my current rig ('94 Cannondale Killer V), its not that far off.
My issue is that companies want to get more people into mountain biking but let's be honest the pricing of new bike is just mental, I know you could go down the ebay route but sometimes it's nice to actually go into a shop and actually come out with the bike your looking for but for most it's just too far out of reach
Totally understand
In general they've gotten longer, lower, slacker, with more travel, and more weight too.
And way less reliable, with components that wear out the same year
@@cgeorgescu72 And way more expensive
Definitely weigh more now and much less reliable.
@@ldtriplesix I used to have a full carbon 2017 trek slash 9.8 and it weighed bang on 14kg with pedals, that's a massive 1.5kg lighter than their lightest gen 6 model, the 9.9 xtr build, which also costs more than a brand new suzuki rmz 450 motocross bike, what's going on with mountain bikes these days?
#askgmbntech why do most modern bikes have kink in lower part of down tube? I still like straight down tubes. Thanks
I'm wondering. With bike felt less alien to you, The old Mega or Anna's bike?
So the difference is mainly in the performance as in race performance. For us normal mortals who just want to have a blast in the slopes, an older massively cheaper bike will fulfill all the needs 😃
After years of watching these old vs new videos I'm still wondering why you don't size up to a older XL to keep the reach similar.
Exactly. I bet the outcome would be noticeably different and close the gap a bit more.
Interesting comparison although the disparity in price is equally shocking. My salary was frozen in 2008, and actually went down rather than up to this day, probably like many others, so the cost of living is making these high and mighty tech marvels sail off into fairy tale land. For the increasingly fewer who can actually afford them, enjoy!
“The super secret test track” explains exactly where it is
Specialized released their Enduro in 1999. Why did the sport take so long to catch up with the bike?
Brits: “Two Fousand And Free”. No wonder us Aussies have such terrible accents lol
They can't even annunciate: 'Aluminium' lol.
That HTA doesnt look like 65 degrees, more like 67.
Check geo one more time.
I just can't pull away from DIY eDH bikes..... all that travel combined with the power of a CYC X1 Pro just makes me smirk when I see a little flimsy enduro.
Great Video as always Rich, but the price has gone from £2K to £6.5K and you would have specced the old bike with a bigger fork.and ridden a XL..So not comparing like for like there..really.
My Motorbike has more tech and costs less than a push bike now.. Something fells wrong about that. Interestingly I have a 2018 Stumpjumper Evo and a 2018 Suzuki V-Strom and they both cost around the same new. ?? Is it profiteering or a much smaller market that drives the prices?? Food for thought.
I think the latter. I would guess the market for high end MTB is tiny compared to general motorbike sales. Plus, you are comparing a MTB in race spec with a motorcycle in standard spec. A race superbike is many times more expensive than an off-the-shelf model. All the race team R&D, event and sponsorship dollars have to be recouped through high ticket prices on the top models.
0:37 these tyres are old
Cool video but that old mega was ahead of the game. I remember 68 degree head angle, 140mm travel, 80mm stems, 720mm bars were massive and maxxis ardents were all the rage in the early days of enduro😂😂😂. Enduro really change bikes for the better.
Reach is what's changed , what's the difference between these 2?
Who else caught the top gear reference at 5:01?
A lot of what has happened is the industry has just found ways to milk people more effectively. The industry relies on marketing small changes as "gamechanging advancements" The most hilarious example of this is all these people with full stiff ass carbon setups that end up being uncomfortable and fragile for 3 times the price. The biggest advancements havent been weight, material, or technology, they've mostly just been frame geometry changes and tire size changes.
I think the bikes are currently at a performance peak and can hardly get much better. All that's coming now are electric toys that take the fun out of optimising your personal setup and thinking a bit about what you're actually doing. Yes, I'm looking at you "Flight control & co"!
The geometries are absolutely top at the moment. Half a degree more or less can be achieved via flip chip.
The only thing I see for the next 10 years is more lugged frames and more sophisticated materials. This is particularly desirable in the case of carbon and its enviromental footprint, as the production process produces enormous CO2 emissions.
I would like to see more steel on the tracks!
In addition, however, I would like to mention that I am not completely against electrical equipment! As far as electric shifting is concerned, I see that it will become much cheaper in the future and will also become more common in the mid-price segment, up to a certain level of standard equipment on bikes from around 3500 Euros upwards.
However, I think electric suspensions are nonsense and unnecessary. Likewise a "stabilisation" of the steering (Canyon).
A mountain bike review channel shouldn't be sponsored by a mountain bike company 🙄
Aluminium over carbon for me, the bike is basically the same yet with much more expensive parts. Gimme the gen 1!
If i had a choice w same parts carbon every time but bike brands love using carbon as an excuse for extra 3k on the price
@benphillips1149 - The gains aren't that much, either. If you Want that sort of thing then go for it. Makes sense for people using them in races, etc, but for the average customer. It is complete overkill.
@@MrMuz99I agree the only time a Carbon bike is ok is in a race situation. Why!? Because if and when the bikes break they can just get a new one from there sponsor! For the every day rider a carbon bike is the biggest mistake possible!
@joshuaallswang8016 - Some people will buy the best just to have the image, then 'normal' riders assume they have skill.
I'd say even IF I had the money to afford a carbon race machine, I wouldn't go for it. Aluminium or Maybe Titanium.
@@MrMuz99 they handle nice tho lmao
I had no idea you were sponsored by any bike brand.
LoL wow😆
Is Doddy still at GMBN?
Dude NO he quit for another job offer they talked about it a couple weeks ago on like every video😂
I ride a 66.5 hta 29r over everything no problem. I climb a lot as well so I wouldn't want to be driving a canoe up the trail
Would be interesting if old bike had some new modern suspensions
One thing I hate about enduro racing is they dont time the uphill and only downhill. The whole rade should be timed all together imho.
Yeah, lets do 50km@2500m timed. Fuck XC
The real question is, in 10 years will that new plastic bike still be operating?
wow, cannot remember seeing one of the guys skip a jump on a bike before
marketing trick to make you think its not possible so you buy the new bike ;)
The eeveelution? Huh.. went from mtbs to pokemon
Give me the metal one over that plastic monstrosity any day of the week!!
Aloominum? Oi! Noooooo!
Lemme guess: longer, lower, slacker, more travel.
How is this an old bike? It’s probably cheaper and stronger than the new one. Internal routing is annoying.
I bet if you did this video again in 2033, 2023 bike's carbon parts wouldn't be doing so well..
All that carbon sounds sketchy to me! I don’t trust plastic bikes! Aluminum all day every day!!. “Carbon” is probably the biggest scam of the bike industry💯
There should NEVER be wireless brakes! If they run out of battery mid run you will probably crash.
12 years and only 5% better?
"Modern Enduro Bike" = carbon, frame + carbon wheels + carbon bars??? Since when??? I think you meant to say Modern XC bike.
I love riding my gary fisher hoo koo e koo.
SSDD. 🙄
Zero old mountain bikes in this video
2012 was over a decade ago. It's old geo and old suspension.
Mullet !!!!!
You wanna tell me that bikes in 2012 didn't have piggy backs and 4 pot brakes??!?!?! Gmbn at its finest ones again with wrong info...
Nukeproof on top
I get more exited watching the videos.
Biased and unobjective review. The old bike Specs are not accurate and the overall condition of the old model is just trash(look at his tyres for reference), vs fresh all new bike. So i am sorry, but reviews like this one, just making me question about your credibility for the next one. Feeling not right at all 😢
Not the mention the natural variation because of the wheel size. At lease they could of put new rubber as you said.
This guy can’t even say aluminium right 🤣
Darn it! I wanted to be the first to comment 😡
Unusually poor video quality.
Just a video promoting Nukeproof 😴
20 years of development and mtbs in general look uglier and uglier. Why is that?
aluMINIum!!!!
You should apply for a home equity loan and buy the new nukeproof or any other new bike.
Typical new bike salesman BS...🥱
Here's an idea; stop being 'sponsored' by Nukeproof. You can save the $$$ by firing Rich!
Wtf is this hate? He talks facts and no bs. Stop crying, ride your old bike (which you obsvly have) and watch something else.
@@kleinkurti - GMBN is a great resource. It sucks to see them slide down the hole of being just another shill site, and Rich seems to have been hired specific to task. Those aren't 'facts', they're well disguised salesman patter, laid out to part rubes like you from their $$$.