I'm french and my english is quite bad but I understand everything you say. The flow of speech is very pleasant and the comparisons are honest. Great job!
5:24 The lens is very sharp in corner. You can see that the water between the boards is sharp because it's further away than the boards. The boards are just too close to be in focus.
I'm growing right now by about a thousand subscribers a month. I think everyone has to pay their dues. I've only been serious about this channel for the past two years and it has only really taken off in the past year.
As an E-mount user I can choose between Laowa's really fast 15mm F2.0 in native E-mount, or I could opt to go for this 12mm F2.8 lens since Laowa is planning to create a Tilt-Shift adapter fit into E-mount. Decisions.... decisions... By the way I love the fact that Laowa has put a mark where the Entrance pupil is on their lens. More lens makers need to do this.
Just bought the laowa 12mm for my A7rii used ! Previous owner lost the lens hood. Sometimes get a 'red blob' in the frame when pointing into the sun. Otherwise incredibly sharp! Am about to buy a hood from laowa. I hope this helps with the 'blob'.
Dustin Abbott Good thing. Also, I wouldn't be surprised if all pre-ordered lenses were very consistent, as I remember Laowa emailing us to tell us it would take a little longer for everyone to get their lenses because they had a hard time with quality control. Which makes me think they probably checked every lens twice before sending them.
Hi Dustin, very interesting review of an interesting lens. I live in the countryside north of Stockholm, Sweden, where the lanscape, ligtht etc this time of year is very similar to what you have in Canada. The gloom of this period really kills color and microcontrast and while I am sure you are correct in your assesment it would be interesting to know whether the color rendition aspect would be equally pronounced in less gloomy condition. Many thanks for all your great videos!
This lens' focal length and lack of distortion is perfect for my needs but it seems to lack contrast, it looks a bit hazy. I wonder how much post-processing can make the image match Tamron lenses.
Hi Dustin, nice review. Were you able to evaluate corner sharpness when you actually focus on the corners? I believe some of the perceived lack of corner sharpness is due to pretty pronounce field curvature in this lens (In your image of the pier, one can actually see a sharper plane of focus between the wooden boards). Mitigating field curvature can be tricky in the field, of course, because you don't just want to keep the corners sharp and you don't want to stop down like crazy but you can paint in sharpness from a separate layer (i.e. focus stacking).
Thanks a lot for this very informative Review Dustin. How would you compare this lens vs. the Samyang 12mm: a) re. absolute quality and b) re. price/value ? Best regards from Germany
I haven't used a full frame compatible 12mm from Samyang (14mm is wide as I've tested), so I can't really answer your question. The Samyang 12mm F2 that I reviewed is an APS-C lens so not a real comparison. I purchased the Laowa myself, however, and use it with their MSC to give me a shifting 17mm F4. Very useful.
I know that most of your videos are review videos, but it would be nice to have some "How to"-videos. Idea came from this lens as it is manual lens. So video would be "Workflow with manual lenses." (Taking picture + post processing). I'm have Canon 80D and these items might be different (easier) for mirrorless lens as you can see the end result in viewfinder. * Focusing. If you in f11 (so you WANT TO take picture with f11) do you always need to rotate back to maximum aperture to able to see through lens and focus. Effect on sport photography (well if you need to focus you might be to slow, but even if you do not need to focus will changing the be pain in ...). * Checking depth of field. Usually you just take a photo or press button to close down aperture for a second. * What it means that you do not get all EXIF data to image file. Just ideas to persons who do not have used manual lens and only after owning manual lens realize that they do not want so much manual work :-) I know that e.g. Samyang added to latest Canon mount 14mm an aperture chip that you can at least control aperture from camera. And use depth of field preview button.
Looks like a really interesting lens. I'm pretty crap at using wide angle lenses, but having been having some fun with it lately. Wouldn't mind having a prime or two that are smaller/lighter than my Canon 16-35 though. Often I just end up bringing my Sony 28mm because it's so tiny and get stuck with that as my most wide option.
Using really wide focal lengths well can be a challenge. You have to think in a completely different way. If you like smaller, though, this is the best way I know to get that wide in a compact package. I've got the Sigma 12-24mm ART right now, and it is massive by comparison.
Thank you for you deep review! I want lens mainly for cityscape for large print for my A7r, what lens will give me the best sharpness and overall results? Thank you!
Great and detailed work, however on Nikon there is a mechanical linkage to the camera body that transfers the aperture value from Non-CPU lenses to various camera functions, most importantly flash control and exif. Not so on Canon. Not so on every Nikon body. But present at least on the D8xx and D7xx and PRO Nikon bodies. Non-CPU you specify once and for all in your camera settings menu.
Nice clip but one thing i do not agree about the canon lens 16-35 mm III I never encounter so much vignette like you do. a little yes but really just a little. So I was little shocked that you had such dark areas on the edge. Maybe your lens is not good manufactured. I would recommend to send it in.
Hi Dustin. Would you trade your tamron 15-30 for this lens? I have the choice of buying the new Laowa 12mm for US$1,180 or a 3 month old (basically new) Tamron 15-30 for US$815. I like the Laowa for its convenient size, extra wide focal and zero distortion but the images just dont seem to be that exciting or pop like the Tamron. Is the the better image quality of the tamron worth the burden of carrying the extra weight and size?
Thanks, I went with Tamron and happy to see your reply now confirming my instinct. look forward to using and will be getting filter system this week to explore lanscapes!
I would love to see review of Samyang (Rokinon) 10mm XP f/3.5 for Full Frame. I'm considering that or Laowa 12mm f/2.8 as my extreme wide angle to be used with Tamron 15-30 when I need something more wide.
Hi Jakub, I'm not particularly motivated to review the 10mm. It is so incredibly wide that there are very, very few applications for a lens like that...and it has a very limited market.
A little less sharp and more vignette wide open, but less distortion (by a good margin). At landscape apertures the only real difference might be color rendition.
For Sony FE? Not necessarily, unless you feel you need the wider focal length. If the 15mm is wide enough, it gives you a wider maximum aperture and the ability to use screw-on filters.
The Laowa's biggest weakness is strong vignette, but I actually bought one to use with the Magic Shift Converter for interiors on Sony, and it's great for that. The Sigma is the easy lens to use, obviously.
@@DustinAbbottTWI Thank you. Even though it like 600 dollars more I was leaning towards the sigma bc of the 1.8 for hand held street photography at night, but the almost distortion thing is just so cool. The 1.8 aperture of the sigma is what makes me hesitate to get the Laowa. But in my head, my own personal thought though, I would think 12mm at 2.8 would absorb light closely to the sigma since it has a bit more field of view. I have a 8mm 3.5 apsc rokinon for an apsc camera and it absorbs like very decent compared to a 24mm f1.4 full frame that I have. I have not scientifically tested this, it is just my impression when handheld. But, do you think the sigma is worth the investment over the Laowa? Is the Sigma as rectilinear as the Laowa that is worth going for it over the Laowa?
This is actually a normal lens. The humans see with two eyes and the image they see is a combination that is processed by brain. That is called binocular vision and its visual horizontal field of view is around 110°. (Just check for binocular human field of view or Peripheral human vision on google or Wikipedia.) That corresponds to an ultra wide 12mm lens on a full frame camera. The single eye has a horizontal field of view around 46° (Due to the nose which obstructs) which coresponds to a normal 50mm on a full frame camera. However the humans see very sharply at a field of view around 10°. That coresponds to a 200mm lens on a full frame camera.
What is considered a "normal lens" is not based on how wide a view it has. Cameras are nowhere near as wide an aspect ratio as our humans visions has which means at "normal" lots more gets cropped than in human vision. It has everything to do with how foreground vs background scales look compared to normal vision. A 50mm lens on a full frame 35mm camera will give you an image that is very cropped compared to human vision but the relationships of objects at different distances will look like human vision. Further, the single eye has to see 110 degrees in order for binocular vision to be 110 degrees. The real total if you stare straight ahead is over 180 degrees as humans can see further back than straight to the side in our peripheral vision.
Hello Dustin, so I decided to return this lens after 15 days of experminetation , as a Realtor who's planning to shoot indoor, it's not good enough, the canon lense I have 17-40 is way sharper and colors are way better in low light ( both shot at same iso and aperture 4 ) but thanks for the review, you have a big fan here 😄👍🏻
I would check the written review referenced in the description to see if I mention the f/stop there. The downside of a lens like this is that the f-stop is not recorded, so I have no way of going back and checking that.
For real estate shooting I don't know that you would want auto focus, to be honest. I've shot with AF on in those situations and sometimes the AF does inconsistent things. Setting MF at the right setting would give more consistent results.
Many thanks Dustin, I asked other experts and you're the only one who answered my question with enough details to help me make 2 decisions, 1 buying this lens, 2 subscribing to your awesome channel, you rock! 🤟🏻
Dustin, I am somewhat disappointed in the quality of the images, these seem to be the weakest I have seen from this lens, I placed my order after a lot of research into its rendering and decided it was fantastic, but these images from the 5D IV seem lacking in contrast, micro contrast, 3D rendering looks flat sadly. Have you used this lens on a Sony A7rm2?
I don't own a Sony, but Canon's color rendering is consistently preferred to Sony in blind tests (check out a recent episode from the Camera Store about JPEGs). I have two things to suggest: 1) this is far from being the most vibrant time of year around here, so I'm stuck with the world I've got at the moment and 2) Most of the images I share in my reviews have received minimal processing to allow people to see lens performance as opposed to my processing ability. I can't account for other images you have seen or how they have been processed. That being said, I didn't feel that the images from the Laowa had the best color and contrast that I've seen from a wide angle lens. Not bad, but they did need some processing help to make them pop.
Curious, Dustin, as to what IS the lens that "had the best color and contrast you've seen from a wide angle lens"? Anything that is, in addition, sharp, no/low coma, CA or vignetting?
Dustin Abbott Maybe my copy is different, because when I start closing the aperture down I can clearly see seven points from F/4 to F/ 22. I have Lenses with curve aperture blades. My copy of the this Laowa lens does not look like those. If it’s possible, can You post images of the aperture blades of your lens in different F stops? Thanks in advanced for taking the time, and for your prompt response.
I'm french and my english is quite bad but I understand everything you say. The flow of speech is very pleasant and the comparisons are honest. Great job!
That's always great to hear!
Still the best, most honest, and extremely detailed reviews out there brother! Keep up the great work Dustin. Cheers.
That's very kind feedback, Steve. Thank you!
5:24 The lens is very sharp in corner. You can see that the water between the boards is sharp because it's further away than the boards. The boards are just too close to be in focus.
I don't get why Dustin hasn't more subscribers. He delivers such good content...
I'm growing right now by about a thousand subscribers a month. I think everyone has to pay their dues. I've only been serious about this channel for the past two years and it has only really taken off in the past year.
Hello Dustin,is the best your review for this lens,what think,this lens is worth it or No?,next plan i gone buy this lens if worth it….thank you
That’s far too open-ended a question. It’s worth it if you actually need a lens this wide, if you can tolerate manual everything, etc…
That slap bass intro was great !! ha ha :)
Thank you for your great work, as always a really precise work.
You're welcome.
As an E-mount user I can choose between Laowa's really fast 15mm F2.0 in native E-mount, or I could opt to go for this 12mm F2.8 lens since Laowa is planning to create a Tilt-Shift adapter fit into E-mount.
Decisions.... decisions... By the way I love the fact that Laowa has put a mark where the Entrance pupil is on their lens. More lens makers need to do this.
That is an interesting touch.
Excellent review Dustin! Really enjoyable and informative. Keep up the great work.
Glad to help out, and thanks for the nice feedback.
Just bought the laowa 12mm for my A7rii used ! Previous owner lost the lens hood. Sometimes get a 'red blob' in the frame when pointing into the sun. Otherwise incredibly sharp! Am about to buy a hood from laowa. I hope this helps with the 'blob'.
Enjoy
Great review, and very consistent with what I could see with my copy.
That's good to hear. I don't think any of us are really unbiased, but I do really strive to be as unbiased as possible.
Dustin Abbott Good thing. Also, I wouldn't be surprised if all pre-ordered lenses were very consistent, as I remember Laowa emailing us to tell us it would take a little longer for everyone to get their lenses because they had a hard time with quality control. Which makes me think they probably checked every lens twice before sending them.
Great review is that you on bass?
I'm afraid not. I'm a drummer
Hi Dustin, very interesting review of an interesting lens. I live in the countryside north of Stockholm, Sweden, where the lanscape, ligtht etc this time of year is very similar to what you have in Canada. The gloom of this period really kills color and microcontrast and while I am sure you are correct in your assesment it would be interesting to know whether the color rendition aspect would be equally pronounced in less gloomy condition. Many thanks for all your great videos!
I wonder the same thing. It's hard to say, and I'm unfortunately not in control of the weather.
Very good review. this is something we find when think about a help to know better an equipment before to buy it. thank you
Glad to help out.
This lens' focal length and lack of distortion is perfect for my needs but it seems to lack contrast, it looks a bit hazy. I wonder how much post-processing can make the image match Tamron lenses.
If you are shooting RAW you can get what you want.
Great review, very informative. Thanks. I've been looking at this lens. I might just have to get one now..
Enjoy it!
Hi Dustin, nice review. Were you able to evaluate corner sharpness when you actually focus on the corners? I believe some of the perceived lack of corner sharpness is due to pretty pronounce field curvature in this lens (In your image of the pier, one can actually see a sharper plane of focus between the wooden boards). Mitigating field curvature can be tricky in the field, of course, because you don't just want to keep the corners sharp and you don't want to stop down like crazy but you can paint in sharpness from a separate layer (i.e. focus stacking).
That's not really something I tested.
the water under the bridge is in focus and its very sharp 5:27 i guess thats why the other things are not in focus not because lens isn't sharp enough
Thanks a lot for this very informative Review Dustin.
How would you compare this lens vs. the Samyang 12mm:
a) re. absolute quality and
b) re. price/value ?
Best regards from Germany
I haven't used a full frame compatible 12mm from Samyang (14mm is wide as I've tested), so I can't really answer your question. The Samyang 12mm F2 that I reviewed is an APS-C lens so not a real comparison. I purchased the Laowa myself, however, and use it with their MSC to give me a shifting 17mm F4. Very useful.
Good job Dustin!
Thanks
I know that most of your videos are review videos, but it would be nice to have some "How to"-videos. Idea came from this lens as it is manual lens. So video would be "Workflow with manual lenses." (Taking picture + post processing). I'm have Canon 80D and these items might be different (easier) for mirrorless lens as you can see the end result in viewfinder.
* Focusing. If you in f11 (so you WANT TO take picture with f11) do you always need to rotate back to maximum aperture to able to see through lens and focus. Effect on sport photography (well if you need to focus you might be to slow, but even if you do not need to focus will changing the be pain in ...).
* Checking depth of field. Usually you just take a photo or press button to close down aperture for a second.
* What it means that you do not get all EXIF data to image file.
Just ideas to persons who do not have used manual lens and only after owning manual lens realize that they do not want so much manual work :-) I know that e.g. Samyang added to latest Canon mount 14mm an aperture chip that you can at least control aperture from camera. And use depth of field preview button.
Looks like a really interesting lens.
I'm pretty crap at using wide angle lenses, but having been having some fun with it lately. Wouldn't mind having a prime or two that are smaller/lighter than my Canon 16-35 though.
Often I just end up bringing my Sony 28mm because it's so tiny and get stuck with that as my most wide option.
Using really wide focal lengths well can be a challenge. You have to think in a completely different way. If you like smaller, though, this is the best way I know to get that wide in a compact package. I've got the Sigma 12-24mm ART right now, and it is massive by comparison.
Thank you for you deep review! I want lens mainly for cityscape for large print for my A7r, what lens will give me the best sharpness and overall results? Thank you!
Great and detailed work, however on Nikon there is a mechanical linkage to the camera body that transfers the aperture value from Non-CPU lenses to various camera functions, most importantly flash control and exif. Not so on Canon. Not so on every Nikon body. But present at least on the D8xx and D7xx and PRO Nikon bodies. Non-CPU you specify once and for all in your camera settings menu.
That's definitely a Nikon advantage.
Nice clip but one thing i do not agree about the canon lens 16-35 mm III I never encounter so much vignette like you do. a little yes but really just a little. So I was little shocked that you had such dark areas on the edge. Maybe your lens is not good manufactured. I would recommend to send it in.
I'm not the only one to find the same. All reviewers did.
thx for your answer I watch your clip again I am interested in the 12mm ^^
Excellent review Dustin.
Thank you!
Hi Dustin. Would you trade your tamron 15-30 for this lens? I have the choice of buying the new Laowa 12mm for US$1,180 or a 3 month old (basically new) Tamron 15-30 for US$815. I like the Laowa for its convenient size, extra wide focal and zero distortion but the images just dont seem to be that exciting or pop like the Tamron. Is the the better image quality of the tamron worth the burden of carrying the extra weight and size?
+Aghahanta Das I wouldn't personally. I think the Tamron is a fantastic lens despite the size and weight
Thanks, I went with Tamron and happy to see your reply now confirming my instinct. look forward to using and will be getting filter system this week to explore lanscapes!
Excellent review!
Thanks!
I would love to see review of Samyang (Rokinon) 10mm XP f/3.5 for Full Frame. I'm considering that or Laowa 12mm f/2.8 as my extreme wide angle to be used with Tamron 15-30 when I need something more wide.
Hi Jakub, I'm not particularly motivated to review the 10mm. It is so incredibly wide that there are very, very few applications for a lens like that...and it has a very limited market.
@@DustinAbbottTWI Thanks for reply, I understand. I'm still thinking if my Tamron 15-30 is wide enough or do I need 12mm or 10mm.
new subscriber. really great review. thanks!
Glad to hear it...and my pleasure.
How does this lens compare to the Sigma 14mm f 1.8 and the Samyang 14mm f2.4?
A little less sharp and more vignette wide open, but less distortion (by a good margin). At landscape apertures the only real difference might be color rendition.
Will you recommend this over the 15mm??
For Sony FE? Not necessarily, unless you feel you need the wider focal length. If the 15mm is wide enough, it gives you a wider maximum aperture and the ability to use screw-on filters.
Yes for Sony FE!
So you have the ability to use nd filtre on the 15 but not the 12?
That's correct.
How would you compare this to the Sigma 14mm 1.8 Art?
The Laowa's biggest weakness is strong vignette, but I actually bought one to use with the Magic Shift Converter for interiors on Sony, and it's great for that. The Sigma is the easy lens to use, obviously.
@@DustinAbbottTWI Thank you. Even though it like 600 dollars more I was leaning towards the sigma bc of the 1.8 for hand held street photography at night, but the almost distortion thing is just so cool. The 1.8 aperture of the sigma is what makes me hesitate to get the Laowa. But in my head, my own personal thought though, I would think 12mm at 2.8 would absorb light closely to the sigma since it has a bit more field of view. I have a 8mm 3.5 apsc rokinon for an apsc camera and it absorbs like very decent compared to a 24mm f1.4 full frame that I have. I have not scientifically tested this, it is just my impression when handheld. But, do you think the sigma is worth the investment over the Laowa? Is the Sigma as rectilinear as the Laowa that is worth going for it over the Laowa?
This is actually a normal lens.
The humans see with two eyes and the image they see is a combination that is processed by brain.
That is called binocular vision and its visual horizontal field of view is around 110°. (Just check for binocular human field of view or Peripheral human vision on google or Wikipedia.) That corresponds to an ultra wide 12mm lens on a full frame camera.
The single eye has a horizontal field of view around 46° (Due to the nose which obstructs) which coresponds to a normal 50mm on a full frame camera.
However the humans see very sharply at a field of view around 10°. That coresponds to a 200mm lens on a full frame camera.
What is considered a "normal lens" is not based on how wide a view it has. Cameras are nowhere near as wide an aspect ratio as our humans visions has which means at "normal" lots more gets cropped than in human vision. It has everything to do with how foreground vs background scales look compared to normal vision. A 50mm lens on a full frame 35mm camera will give you an image that is very cropped compared to human vision but the relationships of objects at different distances will look like human vision.
Further, the single eye has to see 110 degrees in order for binocular vision to be 110 degrees. The real total if you stare straight ahead is over 180 degrees as humans can see further back than straight to the side in our peripheral vision.
You not wearing the same top for the second part of the review is triggering my OCD. :-X :-)
Hmmm, maybe I don't always shoot everything in one take :)
Hello Dustin, so I decided to return this lens after 15 days of experminetation , as a Realtor who's planning to shoot indoor, it's not good enough, the canon lense I have 17-40 is way sharper and colors are way better in low light ( both shot at same iso and aperture 4 ) but thanks for the review, you have a big fan here 😄👍🏻
Interesting. That's surprising to me, and as a realtor I'm surprised that the low distortion and wider focal length wasn't more attractive to you.
i had that 17-40, not a sharp lens at all when its wide open
So I got this lens, and I was wondering what's the middle ring on the lens ? I know one is for aperture and the other one for focal length
There only two rings. The first is for aperture, the second is for focus. The markings in between are for something called "hyperfocal distances".
Dustin Abbott thanks! I have to Google what's hyper focal distance now 🤔
the picture at 11:08, at which f-number was it taken?
I would check the written review referenced in the description to see if I mention the f/stop there. The downside of a lens like this is that the f-stop is not recorded, so I have no way of going back and checking that.
i think maybe i just get g master 24 & stitch panoramas for best landscaping
I haven't used that lens yet, obviously, but there are some solid options for Sony.
@@DustinAbbottTWI now I'm thinking of the sigma instead
I'm expecting the FE mount of the Sigma 24 today, actually, so I will be doing a review of that.
Is it good for Video ?
Sure. The low distortion is an asset, and the focus ring moves well.
Do you recommend if I use it to shoot real estate videos while moving with a gimbal ? my only concern the lack of auto focus ...
For real estate shooting I don't know that you would want auto focus, to be honest. I've shot with AF on in those situations and sometimes the AF does inconsistent things. Setting MF at the right setting would give more consistent results.
Many thanks Dustin, I asked other experts and you're the only one who answered my question with enough details to help me make 2 decisions, 1 buying this lens, 2 subscribing to your awesome channel, you rock! 🤟🏻
Thanks!
Dustin, I am somewhat disappointed in the quality of the images, these seem to be the weakest I have seen from this lens, I placed my order after a lot of research into its rendering and decided it was fantastic, but these images from the 5D IV seem lacking in contrast, micro contrast, 3D rendering looks flat sadly. Have you used this lens on a Sony A7rm2?
I don't own a Sony, but Canon's color rendering is consistently preferred to Sony in blind tests (check out a recent episode from the Camera Store about JPEGs). I have two things to suggest: 1) this is far from being the most vibrant time of year around here, so I'm stuck with the world I've got at the moment and 2) Most of the images I share in my reviews have received minimal processing to allow people to see lens performance as opposed to my processing ability. I can't account for other images you have seen or how they have been processed. That being said, I didn't feel that the images from the Laowa had the best color and contrast that I've seen from a wide angle lens. Not bad, but they did need some processing help to make them pop.
Curious, Dustin, as to what IS the lens that "had the best color and contrast you've seen from a wide angle lens"? Anything that is, in addition, sharp, no/low coma, CA or vignetting?
Round aperture blades??????
Rounded. That means there is a curve to them, so, as the aperture closes down, it continues to make a circular shape.
Dustin Abbott Maybe my copy is different, because when I start closing the aperture down I can clearly see seven points from F/4 to F/ 22.
I have Lenses with curve aperture blades. My copy of the this Laowa lens does not look like those.
If it’s possible, can You post images of the aperture blades of your lens in different F stops?
Thanks in advanced for taking the time, and for your prompt response.
Do you guys know what Laowa means in Chinese? It means old frog. Lao is old, and Wa is frog.
That's correct
this lens is not good for the money.
I'm currently having a blast using it with the MSC for doing shift shots on Sony FE.