The New Doctor Who Title Sequence Annoys Me
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- Опубликовано: 27 июн 2024
- With the debut of the RTD2 era came the debut of a new Doctor Who Title Sequence... And I don't like it all that much.
Special Thanks to ConorsMovieList for the opening narration: / @conorsmovielist
Go watch FiveWhoFans video on the Logo if you want a more comprehensive deep dive into that subject: • The Problem with the D...
00:00 - Intro
02:34 - Part One: Timing
09:35 - Part Two: The Missing Shot
12:49 - Part Three: The Logo (Section A: Design)
15:46 - Part Three: The Logo (Section B: The Animation)
19:10 - Part Four: They Fixed It
19:48 - Part Five: They Fixed It (For Real This Time)
22:06 - Part Six: Oh My God They're Out Of Sync Again
23:51 - Part Seven: An Ending
Twitter- / tommybnoe
Absolutely fantastic video. You effortlessly verbalised some of the issues I have with it, and taught me aspects about the theme and sequence integration I’d never considered (and thank you for the shout out)
I really hope we get to see the uncut title sequence at some point, as even if it’s cheesy, I’m curious to know what the original intended flow would have looked like.
That genuinely means so much, I’ve watched your Logo video a good few times now (especially in the run up to this where I didn’t want to step on your toes) so this is high praise! Thank you so much!
@@TommyBNoEI don’t like the logo they are reusing an old one. I think there should be a new one.
Hi Tom, the music for the 12th Doctor titles, was only finished a week or so before TX. Everyone was working to the original Eccleston theme. I often get asked about the audio sync issues, but I had no involvement in the build for the sequence, sadly. Just the concept. Members of the BBC Wales graphics team work for Realtime now btw!
Damn did not expect this comment in the slightest, absolutely love your work(and sync issues/my personal opinions on the music aside I do love the Capaldi titles, great work on that)!
Wild how tight to release the deadlines on these major bits of branding are. I know the 1st Smith titles were only done in the 3 or so weeks before broadcast or something like that.
With the temping of the Eccleston theme I’m reminded of the leaked copy of Rose using the Baker theme. Interesting to know they’re still temping into the more modern eras.
Sorry, fanboy moment…
IT’S BILLYDAKIDUK! HOLY!!!!!! I remember watching your OG concept fan made Capaldi titles!
What did you think of the official version that ultimately became the OFFICIAL 12th Doctor titles? Kinda wild showrunners haven’t gone to the fans more often for title sequences…😅
It just occurred to me that the underside of the Doctor Who logo is a perfect spot to slap the BBC logo. It’s blank down there, I’m not gonna say better but at least imo better integrated.
Bro, I saw the desync in Space Babies and did a full Wilf "It's happening again."
Someone actually praising Segun's version of the theme (which is the closest homage to Delia Derbyshire's) and the title sequence being weird wobbly alieny stuff to evoke the theme of the programme. How refreshing. Big thumbs up from me and the tiny club who appreciate it for its more Classic look and sound. 👍👍
I will say that there really isn't much I like about Chibnal's era, I don't even like the title sequence... but the theme song in the title sequence is something I have always liked. It sounds very 60's and very echoey. I like it.
( 12:19 ) yeah it’s weird that they didn’t storyboard a replacement if that shot didn’t work out? Like always plan ahead! Even if they reused a shot, it would at least keep the music as it was and not cut down.
I'm wondering if that missing shot is also part of the reason for the PNG logo. The missing shot would mean the logo came in too early, and the regeneration effects wouldn't be long enough to cover the remainder of the sequence, so while they fixed the timing on that, they used the PNG logo with a PowerPoint animation as a placeholder that ended up being in the final product.
One thing I think was actually a really cool side effect of the cut tardis shot was that in the 60th specials, the logo dissolved away with the rising strings in the 12th bar with the 13th bar syncing up with the episode title and writer, which I think worked really well, even if it was unintended. It's something I think they could run with if no other option exists with the current assets they have
Whatever people may think about the 13th doctor era, the time vortex was probably one of the best as it felt organic yet cosmic, as if the very fabric of time itself is alive which makes sense since it turns out that time is a living thing(we learn this in the vanquishers).
Also, as you somewhat mentioned near the end, it’d be cool if the whoniverse bit was combined with the intro. They could have the camera looking at the whoniverse thing like it usually does then we see the tardis appear then quickly move across the screen into the time vortex bit we see at the start of the intro with the camera quickly following the tardis
They should just replace the title sequence with the entirety of this video for every episode.
Heres the thing that winds me up about the new shot they added for Season 1, it's a continuity error. The TARDIS clearly stops trailing the nebula/smoke its moving through, then the wide shot happens and it's still trailing it. Once seen, can't unsee
When you pointed out the fact that some of 12's titles were out of sync, my mind was actually blown. Like you mentioned, I never really noticed it was that bad because of most of the noise happening.
Thanks for the shout out mate! 🙌🏻
That "Whoniverse" logo is not a thing in the Disney+ versions. We get a normal BBC logo animation upfront as part of the video stream, and the BBC letter over the Doctor Who logo as you described. No Disney+ logo upfront either, but an animated Disney logo (not Disney+) after the end credits.
Annoyed in 73 Yards we couldn't of gotten the Intro but with only Millie's Name, think like for Heaven Sent where it's just Peter's Name.
Or maybe even like Death in Heaven where Jenna’s name comes before Peter’s.
Since its implied Ruby already lived that episode once before it started, I like not having an intro. It feels like we started the episode half way through:)
I never noticed the BBC being animated, but now I just want it at the beginning like in RTD1. And I hope they make the same move like they did in Series 4 by replacing the title music but keeping the visuals
If you noticed a couple of the chapter labels being numbered wrong, no you didn't actually.
Oh no, the Timeless Chapter Labels is canon 😂
Honestly this intro is the worst outta them all imo. There's no distinct vibe as to what the vortex is?? Is it the opening tunnel? Is it the blue tunnels seen in the background when Ncuti and Millies names appear? Or is it the tunnel when the logo appears?! That and the fact it's outta sync too just does not do any justice. The CGI is also questionable as we went from the glorious 2018 John Smith VFX titles to this. A multi-billion dollar company vs 1 man with his PC.
If we had single shot cuts too, that would've been great. It takes the immersion outta it as I have no idea what the TARDIS is doing surfing the vortex as opposed to flying through it? Even the promotional ads for this era had a better logo animation, better vortex vfx and better contrast/ lighting. It's such a let down as this era is supposed to be the latest and greatest, yet 2005 does a much more realistic job at TARDIS physics and vortex imagery as nobody has been able to replicate the look and feel of it since.
Honestly I Still think that the series 7b intro is the ugliest intro we’ve hard mainly for it’s ending.
Beautiful video!
I'm baffled by the clash between a bright blue logo and the purple/orange vortex - especially when we've seen a blue vortex in EoD. They even gave the png a slight pink tint so it wouldn't look too out of place.
I presumed the 'final' logo would emerge from the abstract blue shape behind the names with all the lines leading in. So many bizarre decisions.
Thank you for taking the time to tell me things about the logo I hadn't known I needed to realise! I am very much a viewer who jumps into the stream and enjoys being hurled downriver, to enjoy the white water ride, without thinking critically about graphics and plot holes, possibly because I am a graphic artist and subconsciously tune out, as my brain's 'not at work' then.
Which is why your analytically dispassionate dissection of the title sequence was a revelation. As you say, it would take so little to pick up the quality, so let's hope they have a further go at tweaking it for the Christmas special and season two.
"It's just a matter of emphasis." -The Editor, The Long Game.
I don't know why that quote about 'the right word in the right broadcast repeated often enough' popped into my head, but I guess it applies here musically.
Great video!
There seems to be a king in the chat 🫵
No way Dwfan91 commented bro! im a big fan
How old are you in your videos I think you said you grew up with classic doctor who I think you probably didn't but you sound like your in your 20s mabey 30s
@@Pat12379 91
@@OfficialAquafn Thank you!
i just bit my fricking toung after you cut out the spinny thing of matt's intro at 4:50. THE FPINNY THIN!!!IT'S SPINNIM ANB IT MAKES IT AUTOMAPICALLY THE BESP INTRO ITS AMAFING! (f$%k I actually just bled)
I agree I have to say I'm glad to see that diamond logo back but yes I agree it's not the best title sequence they should had made it more sinister like the original and progress more I also think having Murray Gold back is a backwards step I would prefer someone like Jeff Wayne or Rick Wakeman doing the composing they be brilliant they should have dropped the name titles and bring back the face I just feel the newer version is lazy despite what people think of the Jodie Whittaker era atleast her theme was progressing and it was scary the newer ones aren't.
I hope to god they fix the melody. The fact that the "ooo e ooo" bit is cut off halfway by the sting being repeated pisses me off. That and the theme itself ends WAY too damn early. Why couldn't they just reuse the structure used in the RTD era for the new arrangement?!
Notice how every era so far has had consistent timing with the other episodes IN ITS ERA. This is a new era of doctor who so I can imagine this timing will stay for a while.
Just noticed the little Captain Scarlet marionette on the shelf behind you. Absolutely based.
About music releases:
I‘m still waiting for original synth Series 1 and 2 soundtrack even if it is unlikely. One could hope...
Don't lose hope. I've found from experience that waiting for things patiently does eventually pay off. I talked on and off for years to the composer Dave Cooke, who produced the music for ChuckleVision amongst other shows, about his plans to release the soundtrack to the show digitally. Finally, about 8 years ago he released the first album of music on Spotify and another half a dozen albums followed, something I never thought would happen. Same with Roger Bolton, another TV composer most famous for the BBC 999 theme tune. I happened to get talking to him last year when he was in the process of going through his archive as the show's 30th anniversary was approaching. So, it's definitely possible. Perhaps not from Murray Gold himself; I do recollect from a podcast interview in which he admits his archiving habits aren't exactly the greatest and much of his music is languishing on old computers and hard drives somewhere. However, the best bet is probably the BBC themselves who probably have a complete, isolated soundtrack for each episode in their archives somewhere. The greatest hope is that they'll do something similar with the classic series DVDs where they release an isolated score to listen to when they eventually get on to releasing the new series in the Collection Blu-ray boxsets. Hopefully it's something they consider and maybe someone could put the suggestion forwards. You never know, they might use it.
The part about the intros being out of sync finally made me realize why I had so much trouble getting a feel for the flow of the intro this new season (like predicting the moment the Tardis would fly out of the nebula) - the flow wasn't consistent in the first place! Very interesting stuff, really enjoyed the video
I mostly liked the title sequence. For the 60th anniversery specials, the logo also would have worked better, when it used more references to the classic openings, like zooming the logo to give the background the shape of it. Or by using with the "WHO-Zoom" the same effect as the 80s titles.
For the "fixed" titles it just annoyes me the ending with another "ooweeooo" for it sounds so weird, it would have worked with using an echo effect like in 70s. And also there had been so many opportunities to give the background the shape of the doctor.
I might get back into 3D animation/compositing to try to recreate that missing shot. Used to do it in college and I can picture it perfectly in my head, I can imagine the missing shot as it was perfectly and I can imagine a slightly tweaked version
Awesome video! I remember hearing somewhere in some piece of media/interview that RTD said the TARDIS' sparks in the sequence played a part in the story for this season. I won't say what that ended up being for the sake of spoilers, but the way I take this, could that mean we may see another iteration of this sequence for Season 2?
Great video. Just a small correction, though. The effect used to create the original titles was called 'Howlround', not 'Howl-a-round'. It's a common misnomer, but a misnomer it is!
12:21 To be honest, I'm glad they cut that part off because I would have cringed and be like what the fuck? (mentioning about The Doctor and Donna in the time vortex with the TARDIS)
it is impressive you managed to make a 27 minute video on a 40 second title sequence
thank you for apologising for wasting my tim- oh, no, I seem to have subscribed...
THANK YOU! From the first time I saw it the titles were musically out of sync for me and it's subtle enough that it just felt off in a way I couldn't pinpoint why. And the fact that it's not even consistently off is aggravating. Thanks for the excellent breakdown.
Another thing that annoys me is that the Gateway era now has this awkwardly extended ending to the theme music to accomodate for the fact that the logo is shown where the episode title used to be pre-Space Babies. It just feels wrong, since it just feels like they jammed 2 bars from a random point in the theme in there to bridge the gap between the ending of the main melody and the dramatic ending of the sequence
24:22 That sound is meant to be chuffing? I guess it makes sense because the logo looks like a train's, but it just hadn't twigged for me. I just thought the cameraman was panting from trying to keep up with the TARDIS!
That’s just me subtly referencing the forgotten series James May’s Toy Stories… I straight up don’t know what that sound is meant to be
What is the point in life anymore no more doctor who episodes till Christmas 😢
I’m with you there. I’m super excited to see where they take Mrs. Floods character in the Christmas special. Maybe she’s the God of Storytelling or the God of Winter. I love them dropping gods in this show instead of the usual Cybermen, weaping angels, Daleks, etc. I’m hoping they do more original stories too.
True bruh
Oh dear. It's sad, but there is one consolation - no more of those annoying 'RTD killed Dr Who', 'Woke Killed Dr Who', 'Dr Who ratings disaster, worst ever!' videos that have been clogging up YT for the last 2 months!
@Hayden1969-ws4vy there gonna come back at Christmas because thoes weridos do not have a life and instead they make videos on stuff they have never watched turning woke
@chillindylan9159 yeah I wish there where more episodes tho I only started watching last year and it's my favourite show ever now but I never git to experience tge 13 episodes seasons wall they came out
I was really waiting for the end where you actually do watch a doctor who episode and it happens to be one where the opening was out of sync and you flip a table
Hey! as a design student I really liked your analysis with motion shape and music!
My brain kept telling me something is off with that logo and I didn't know why... that's why... it has no interaction with the scene... thanks :)
7th doctor's sequence/tune was awesome!
Amazing vid and I’ve just started - instant sub
What I don't like about it is that there is a perspective change, (to my knowledge) all of the other ones have been one continuous shot...
Along with it not having the Doctors face in it
I thought it sounded like a cool idea but then you showed the concept. That does look bad and I can definitely imagine Moffat saying _cut that._
When I first heard about it I thought it would have been the doors facing the camera.
Loved this video, I learnt so much!
God I love watching exhaustive nitpicky breakdowns of things only I care about! Great vid, subscribed!
Thank you, I knew they were average from the moment they aired, but got attacked by fanatics everytime I said something. Was expecting something very refined and contemporary to follow on from the whittaker era titles, like something waveform would make.
Man this video was made for me. You addressed pretty much all my issues with the intro. One thing I will mention that's kind of a nitpicky thing is that the way the text moves feels weird for Ncuti's sequences. During the 14th Doctor specials Tennant's text moves smoothly towards the screen but Ncuti's seems like it suddenly jerks forward halfway through. Similarly the letters in Mille's text moves a lot more than Catherine's did to accomodate the Tardis and that isnt necessarily a worse decision I think it makes it look more awkward.
Edit: You say that if people didn't notice the Twelth Doctor's titles being out of sync it might be because the music makes it hard to know where the textual elements should land musically but I honestly think the opposite, i think it's easier to notice than previous instances of the Doctor Who intro being out of sync because there are so many instances of textual elements lining up with the music compared to the other intros, at least twice as many as the 2005-2010 intro. It could entirely be me being super focused on that stuff though but the fact that there are so many visual reference points for the music makes it hurt even more when the intro was out of sync.
Edit 2(Apologies): Also I'm surprised you didnt at least give at least a passing mention to the extension they made to the end of the intro music for the Season 1 titles.
i didnt notice any of this but now that you've pointed it out, well... thanks
Awesome video! The new sequence hasn’t really wowed me either, and this is all probably part of the reason why! It also sounds way too similar to the 9th/10th doctors’ theme.
In terms of visually, I’m not a fan of the clouds. They aren’t distinct enough, they’re just coloured differently. I think it needed more variation in textures.
I actually love the 12th doctor’s titles, I love the clockwork-like sounds and the spiralling clock face, it’s so steampunk. And I love when capaldi’s eyes come in on that beat, because it makes a big impact.
Also where did you get your shirt from? It’s awesome!
great, interesting video. enjoyed!
i feel like the shot of Doctor and companion hanging out of the Tardis would have gone between the nebula shot and the logo appearance- the string and wind flourishes accompany the Tardis movement across the cast names so perfectly during bars 5-8 I can't imagine it interrupting that- I think the new nebula shot with all the planets is slightly extended to allow for the lack of the Tardis team shot
I loved the snap zoom too :(
I really like your breakdown of the other title sequences!
For me, its the cuts. I really liked the flow and smoothness of the title sequence. But the cuts to different angles and the snap zoom really doesnt sit right with me
I immediately noticed it. It felt like to me if lyrics/singing in a song wasn’t in sync to the music. Plus why would they shorten the intro theme?
Damn. Great job with out-of-sync frames counting. Never expected anyone to do it. I guess there are more driven people than I've realised 😎.
As for me, I am an absolute Peter Capaldi era fan and that includes my love for the title sequence. It was such a shame to see Series 8 pre-finale and finale titles being out-of-sync and I just couldn't believe it at first. Then I got used to it. At least there's a beat and if you try really hard the visuals do match the beat even with the present delay. To my mind, 'Face the Raven' version is not as bad, although many have the right to hate it.
But the brand new David Tennant / Ncuti Gatwa title sequence is all over the place. Having the previous experience, I subconsciously paid attention to the music and timing, which was slightly annoying. By the way, thanks for the providing information on the cut/missing part of the sequence. That was such a surprise 🤯.
I definitely agree with your point about Murray's soundtrack releases (or lack thereof). I really hope that a full, extended mix of the new theme will exist outside of fan stitching, but I get the distinct feeling that won't happen. I just love the bits in the classic era sig-tunes where it does melody 1 and then hangs on the bassline for 2 (or more) bars before resolving into melody 2. I don't think any of the modern themes have had that feature outside of fan remixes.
I should also point out that I do really like the diamond logo (heck, I pinched it for my channel logo as soon as the reveal of it dropped xD), but I totally agree about it not feeling at home in the title sequence. I must admit, I hadn't even really noticed the Powerpoint-esque transition during the specials until someone pointed them out to me, though I suppose that's part of the problem. The logo's prominence was so understated that I barely even noticed it!
This is wonderfull and your garded commentary, trying mot to give in to simple moaning, is good to hear but the fact that your never panning anything puts me at ease. You researched thoroughly and offer defence for problems and simple fixes but make no demands at the end. This is the best kind of fandom to me. This was the first video of yours I've watched and I'm subscribing.
Love this piece! Couldn’t agree more with everything you’ve stated here :)
Give this video a like, hopefully someone at Bad Wold Studios will see it and take notes.
Finally someone brave enough to say it 😍
Was sold on the title.
Loved the opening monologue, and subscribed upon seeing Captain Scarlet in the background ;)
A well presented critique.
I love seeing people as nerdy as me
In my opinion, the worst thing about the title sequence is the music at the end.
The music sounds like it is extremely sloppily edited to extend the sequence by two bars at the end . You can literally hear the discontinuity at the end of the penultimate bar, and the music extends completely unnaturally after the 4th to final bar. It sounds like they accidentally made the visual sequence too long (or Murray accidentally wrote it too short), and then at the last minute someone went into Audacity or something to shove in a copy-pasted sequence from earlier in between the last two bars. It genuinely sounds dreadful in my opinion.
Tbh since the brouight in that new bbc logo its been utter madness, theres still people using the old logo or using it in the wrong way or size or whatever
Oh WoW I didn't know someone else found that the new logo looked like the pat patrol log. I thought it was just me!
Does it annoy anyone else that the revived series mostly did away with showing the Doctor’s face?
Another strange music editing decision was looping the melody at the end of the title sequence and ending it with a nasty cross fade into the final crescendo. This is the music editor’s fault, not Murray Gold’s!
Ive loved the new title sequence so far! Im surprised others dont
my mom is the one who pointed out how different the title sequence was to me lol. i honestly, kind of embarrassingly, didnt notice anything wrong with it, said i liked it, when my mom chimed in with "i dont know... something seems off. i cant put my finger on it." im definitely going to show her this video because you, and her, were absolutely correct!
Thank you!! I don't like it much either, has it grown on me a bit yes but thank you for being one of the few to actually critique it
9:22 watch the intro for twin peaks the return. It's Russell opting to put more emphasis on his name than the name of the programme. A bit vain but hey he did have to come back after all.
I can't believe I never noticed the title sequence was getting out of sync. As a video editor, that is absolutely mindblowing, I cannot imagine letting something like that happen, but it's like that in almost every episode?? Great video!!
I'm so glad to see other people as annoyed about this as I am 😅
I'm surprised you praised the current placement of the logo in the timing, it leads to the dramatic second half of the melody being completely wasted, if the logo was a bar or 2 later it would be amazing (timing wise)
Maybe the WHO is so prominent for a reason 0-0
where did you find the rip of the 60th concert?
Have you ever seen the Basement Film group titles?
Wow I love this intro
Tom - while I appreciate your focus and passion for Doctor Who - and the quality of your analysis and detail you put into this - I couldn't disagree more overall on the ultimate conclusion; Nonetheless, I'm looking forward to more content ...
My main complaint with the new titles is that they removed part of the melody that had always been there.
ruclips.net/video/sWuAt0swt7k/видео.html It appears at 23 seconds in this video for anyone wondering.
I don't know why they decided to remove it though.
15:50
That transition genuinely looks so bad.
Amazing video, been annoying me for ages
This title sequence is a prime example of the issue that I feel underpins most of RTD’s Who - it tries to be as appealing/as inoffensive to as many people as possible that it just becomes bland. It doesn’t stand out in any particular way because it’s trying to please the lowest common denominator.
URANUS
I think the overall quality of the titles don’t look good either. The designs good but something about the way it looks just looks cheap. In empire of death and space babies there’s vortex shots that looks so much better than how it looks in the title sequence and I don’t understand why.
The missing shot obviously isn't helping things but I still think there are other issues with the shot choices, the flow from one to another. And personally, might be a matter of taste, I just hate how it looks texturally. The RTD1, series 5, and Jodie titles all pretty much looked like they could have been filmed with a camera. The Capaldi ones are completely stylised, not supposed to represent a physical reality, so they get away with their fakeness. The 7B ones are an absolute mess of textures, 2D and 3D elements so we'll disregard that. The RTD2 one looks like it's trying to show us a real space-time journey, but it just never looks like something that was shot. It's concept is at odds with the aesthetic of the visuals.
Loved this video, so niche, nerdy, and right up my street. I think you've slightly misunderstood skeuomorphism, but your point still stands.
Having a similar fascination with fan themes, and the doctor who themes in general, i noticed immediately how off the theme was, which still bugs me
I like them
The closing credits are more annoying in terms of syncing after the 'next time' trailers. The actors credits are literally three seconds out of 45 seconds odd too - blink and you'll miss.
To credit your 9-year-old self, the 2010 theme really isn't "as hummable" 🤣
Finally someone like me
Thanks for referencing my 60th sequence Tom! This is such a great video. The new title sequence, much like the series itself, is a bit of a mess. What a shame :/
honestly, even ignoring the issues you bring up here, i'm just not a fan of this sequence. it feels like the most generic version they could make of the doctor who title sequence while still keeping it somewhat in-date with its contemporaries (i.e. title sequences for TV like to be Cinematic (tm) now hence the use of cuts, zooms and alternate camera angles). there are some nice flourishes - the tardis almost surfing on the vortex, the letters in Catherine Tate and Millie Gibson's names scooting out of the way of the tardis, but on a broad concept level it just feels like a bland reskinning of the RTD1 title sequence, from the vortex all the way to the music, which very much feels like a redo of the series 4 / specials theme. it really doesn't feel like it has its own identity in the way that Whittaker, Capaldi and Smith's intros did (regardless of my thoughts on those eras as a whole)
Uhh I think you might be kinda inventing things to be upset about...
The logo is square which is bad because widescreen? It was never 4:3 originally and it looked fine then... I mean, a diamond would look kinda bad if it was almost wider than it was tall... what's your problem with diamonds...?
Also the movie's title is "widescreen" but the picture is still 4:3, what gives there? You apparently liked the movie one
Great video. I feel very much the same about this sequence, but gotta be honest, my biggest quality control issue is one you didn't mention. The cast name lettering doesn't appear correctly as the TARDIS wipes past it. And somehow it got worse when they updated it for Gatwa.