No, Star Wars isn’t "Creatively Bankrupt"
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- Опубликовано: 8 июн 2024
- It's like poetry. It rhymes. But what are rhymes, but one line ripping off its predecessor?
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#starwars #ahsoka #videoessay
Timestamps
0:00 Introduction
1:34 Rogue One
3:29 A New Hope
5:39 The Phantom Menace
7:35 Reading Baylan
10:23 Conclusion
Ahsoka, also known as Star Wars: Ahsoka, is an American television miniseries created and written by Dave Filoni for Disney+. It is part of the Star Wars franchise and a spin-off from the series The Mandalorian (2019-present), taking place in the same timeframe as that series and its other interconnected spin-offs after the events of Return of the Jedi (1983), while also serving as a continuation to the animated series Star Wars Rebels (2014-2018). The series follows Ahsoka Tano as she investigates an emerging threat to the galaxy following the fall of the Empire. Baylan Skoll is lightsaber-wielding mercenary for hire overseeing his apprentice Shin Hati. But make no mistake: although there was a time when Skoll knew the acclaimed Jedi Knight Anakin Skywalker, Baylan is no Jedi. 
Развлечения
Hey! Thanks for watching. Here's that Patreon link if you're interested! www.patreon.com/pillarofgarbage
You are in a cult
@@NuanceOverDogma bro really said ‘what’s the most ironic YT name I could pick’ 💀
@@PillarofGarbage well your YT name perfectly describes your channel. Enjoy simping for content that is pure trash & grifting off more popular content creators since you have little to no original ideas to offer. Without them your channel wouldn't exist & you'd end up being another overly emotional Disney reaction channel brainwashed by corporations on how to think & consume product. Veeeery Cool!
I think a problem with your argument is that this is like the fourth or fifth time that they made the literal homage to the Vader scene they did it with Luke and Darth Maul
I don’t see why Baylan can’t be recast. It obviously sucks because Ray Stevenson was really good in the role, but I don’t think he would have wanted that character to just end with his death. Plus, Baylan’s not a legacy character like Luke, Han, or Leia, so I don’t think a recast would be met with much backlash, other than people obviously being upset that Ray has died.
I think its kinda too soon. He might get comic/book/animation appearance any time, but live actions is few years at least
@@zandosdwarf-king I mean, it’s probably going to be a few years until Ahsoka Season 2, if it happens, which I’m assuming is when he’d pop up again. Acolyte/Skeleton Crew/Andor S2/Bad Batch S3 are all definitely happening before it, and I would assume Mandalorian S4 and a potential BOBF S2 would happen before it as well, maybe even James Mangold’s movie.
With the performance Ray gave it'd be insulting to recast him. That is unless the next time we meet the character he's Batlan Skoll no more, if he's messing with the One's he might be twisted beyond recognition.
@@alannatherson7721 I completely agree it was a great performance. I just think a recast is what’s best for storytelling purposes. I understand your belief that it would be insulting, but that isn’t the way I view it. Many franchises have recast characters whose actors have died, the main one coming to mind being Harry Potter with Dumbledore. I could see them doing something like what you’re saying where he gets corrupted, but I worry that would get rid of some of the character’s appeal.
@@alannatherson7721no it wouldn't.
I hope they recast Baylon. The charater deserves a conclusion.
Jóhannes Haukur Jóhannesson
The problem is nobody else can play baylan better than ray stevenson
Gerard Butler
@@akhos9876that's just not true
@@akhos9876well they have no choice
Yeah I also picked up on the Phantom Menace reference, actually more so than the Vader hallway fight. I personally noticed that the hallway fight in Ahsoka also establishes that Baylan's fighting style is quite similar to that of Vader, a.k.a. the one opponent that Ahsoka struggled the most to fight in the past, setting him up as a formidable opponent for Ahsoka.
I didn’t recognize connection to TPM’s opening sequence, but I definitely made the connection between Baylan and Qui-Gon. It’s part of why I actually enjoy his character. I wish he were in a better show, but that’s beside the point. It is cool to see this kind of character who is similar to Qui-Gon in philosophy, but with much more of a cruel version of “the ends justify the means.”
Baylan and qui-gon? He's a dollar store Dooku
That's a really compelling argument. I personally hope his character is recasted since you can't leave a character standing in the statues of the mortis gods and not continue the story. Tho it is really sad that Ray Stevenson won't be able to make it since it was the most interesting aspect of the show.
Baylan isn't just compared to Vader in his "hallway scene," he is also contrasted through choreography and lighting. Vader in Rogue One is an unstoppable force, effortlessly carving through rebels as the unstoppable killing machine Palpatine made him to be. Baylan, on the other hand, is a Knight who has survived decades after the purge. He also effortlessly slaughters the rebels standing in his way, but in a precise and calculated manner, honed through years of training and also out of respect for the old techniques. Considering this, Vader is characterized as a monster, while Baylan is characterized as "something more."
It is also worth mentioning Baylan despised Anakin (evident through his banter with Ahsoka in their first duel). In Baylan's eyes, Anakin was everything that was wrong with the Order. Skywalker was the definition of flashy and unorthodox and symbolized the hypocrisy of the Jedi being "peacekeepers." So instead of approaching combat all out like Anakin did, Baylan opts to remain reserved, doing no more than what is necessary.
Why but why use a similar scene in the first place? Out of the infinite amount of things you can do with your imagination, why do a soft copy and paste. How in the world is that compelling or interesting? Imagine Bane from TDKR not having the opening airplane sequence, instead robbing a bank with a bunch of people with Bane masks like the Joker did in TDK. Just make something entirely personal for that character and use your imagination not the ctrl-c buttons.
@@VonJay Brevity.
Script writing is more than just making cool action scenes. It's about telling a story. One common story telling thing you'll hear is "show don't tell." Rather than make some 20 minute scene with dialog to convey the character, they can copy a scene that most people who are going to watch are familiar with as short hand.
Plus, there are things that repurposing a scene can convey that wouldn't be conveyed as effectively in an original scene.
There's also a more utility reason in that, repurposing a scene rather than writing an original scene leaves them more resources to spend on other parts of the show.
This isn't only a tool in movie writing, but in many forms of art. Salvador Dali repurposed his "The Persistence of Memory" in "The Disintegration of the Persistence of Memory." That's not because he was creatively bankrupt it's because it served the art more.
Is the repurposing of the scene in Ahsoka something that helps serve the story more than hurt it? I don't really know. But it's not as simple as saying "just make an original scene."
I would like to point out that Baylon and Shin have orange lightsabers, not red. Which is a lightsaber colour Jedi have used in books, comics and games before. That honestly adds to the whole Dark Jedi grey area he and Shin exist in.
It's almost as if the concept of a powerful warrior (typically a villain) effortlessly slaughtering an entire retinue of stock soldiers is a common trope in fiction. Narrow hallways also being an opt choice for said trope because it feels confined, with little means to escape the onslaught.
It's literally the same scene, one person taking on the same type of personell with the same type of helmets. No one is behind Baylon they're all shooting and moving backwards. It's the same storyboard they just changed the lighting, the shape of the hallway and swapped out Darth Vader for a dollar store Dooku. And to note Filoni took JJ's young kirk sequance from Trek 09 when Sabine was running away for no apparent reason in ep1. I've watched all 12 episodes of Andor and I haven't seen one scene from that show that is a repeat of any other show in the history of film but Filoni and Abrams self cannibalize each other and the franchise because they're just garbage writers and have no good or new ideas.
@DrVonJay Nice to know I am not the only person to see through the BS. Frankly, you did a better job criticising the show that Piller of Sycophantism here
I didn’t see very many people complaining about Darth Maul’s hallway scene in the final Clone Wars season being an obvious homage to Darth Vader’s. Don’t know why they’d be upset about Baylan’s.
Cus from what I've seen, a lot of the critics of live action Ahsoka, view themselves as "too good for silly cartoons" and didn't watch Mauls hallway scene lol 😂
@@Techno_Bunny433 you don't seriously expect the mainstream audience to trouble itself with saturday morning cartoons, do you??
@@anonymous-hz2un hehe
@@anonymous-hz2un If they wanted to get most of the deep cuts here they should've.
don't forget luke's hallway
The shot of Shin in the outskirts of Lothal also looks a lot of the shot of Maul on Tatooine looking inwards.
I have many, many problems with Asohka, but saying "urr this scene look like other scene and that BAD" is a really stupid argument
Imagine Chris Nolan giving Bane a similar entrance to the Joker's Bank scene in TDKR. In the history of film, NOBODY DOES THAT BUT JJ AND FILONI. Filoni even ripped off JJs young kirk sequence from Star Trek 09. Why copy and paste someone else's work? What's the point in doing that?
@@VonJay Please tell me you're not serious when you say nobody copies scenes in the history of film, because I have some really bad news for you...
@@VonJayWhat if I told you that several scenes and plot points even in the Original Trilogy are pulled straight from other films that George Lucas watched
@@SymbiSpidey Let me correct myself, I'm sure that they're not the only ones in the entire film history that didn't copy and paste, but they seem to "self-cannibalize" scenes from within the franchise with FIloni taking scenes from earlier SW films (and that one ST film). JJ was intentionally derivative, as admitted by himself in TFA.
But all of us do know that there are directors and writers who don't copy and paste. So I'm guessing that you'd rather them copy and paste? Or you don't mind that they do? Or do you honestly think it's better if they created from their own experience outside of the media they consumed? I'd rather watch the latter. But like many of these shows they seem so uninspired and unimaginative.
@DrVonJay Even on that front, this is literally still nothing new for Star Wars. George Lucas has gone on tape saying he made the Prequel Trilogy to draw parallels to the Original Trilogy, with certain plot elements and scenes deliberately referencing scenes from the OT (Anakin destroying the Droid battleship in TPM/Luke destroying the Death Star in ANH, Anakin choosing to save Palpatine in RotS/Vader choosing to save Luke in RotJ, Anakin getting his arm cut off by Dooku in AotC/Luke getting his hand cut off in ESB). Hell, Return of the Jedi literally brought back the Death Star.
Star Wars has ALWAYS been self-referential, dude
I'm glad that Thrawn escaped where he link up with Imperial Warlords to unite and fight the New Republic.
While Ezra is reunited with Hera and Chopper. It'd be awesome if Zeb was there in the reunion, and also Jacen, son of Kanan.
I want Ezra to train Jacen
I think the passing of Chadwick Boseman set a bad precedant where characters can't be recasted due to actor death. I'm pretty sure most actors would want the story of their character to live on after their passing than to die with them. I think a recast is also more respectful than the digital zombies we've seen so far.
It happened with the Hulk where Edward Norton has been recasted by Mark Ruffalo. So why not?
@DarkZerol And recasting Don Cheadle as War Machine.
I'd argue that it started with Heath Ledger.
Obligatory "it's like poetry, they rhyme"
rhyming isn't allowed anymore. when Lucas rhymed it was genius, when Woke Disney does it, it's _literally the final nail in Star War's coffi_
@@PillarofGarbagewas literally thinking the same thing. Also whenever a new Star Wars show is good it's because Filoni and Favreau are brilliant but if it's bad, it's because of woke Disney. Nevermind if those two guys worked on a project and it turned out bad lol
Wish they learned to rhyme different words and not the same word twice. Oh wait, that's not rhyming, that's just repeating.
@@VonJay this has already been explained to you multiple times in this comment section, but I'll try to make it REALLY simple so you can grasp it:
*Word #1* (Vader scene) features a single force user single-handedly slaughtering his way through narrow, white, trapezoidal corridors filled with disposables saber fodder
*Word #2* (Baylan scene) features a single force user single-handedly slaughtering his way through narrow, white, trapezoidal corridors filled with disposables saber fodder
_Those would be the rhyming ends of the word, let's say "ore"_
*Word #1* (Vader scene) has dim lighting with red accents, lots of dark smoke, ominous scoring, and Vader fighting with a style that can only be described as "butchery" - it's flashy, over the top, and more in line with a horror movie villain than a Jedi
*Word #2* (Baylan scene) has light grey-to-white smoke, bright lighting, a musical theme that straddles the line between dark and triumphant, and smooth, elegant fight choreo for Baylan - his movements are precise and efficient, lacking flashy dramatics or excess
_These would be the non-rhyming parts of the words, "bef" and "neverm"_
Put together, Vader's hallway fight and Baylor's hallway fight therefore sound something like this:
_Although it had been explained before,_
_DrVonJay would understand it nevermore_
@@VonJayand if you want to be REALLY specific about it, the SW franchise less of a rhyming whatever and more of a sestina, a complex poetic form that depends on the exact repetition of specific words in different contexts...but I doubt you actually 1. know and 2. care enough to give it that much thought 🥰
Definitely noticed all three connections (Qui-Gon, Vader, Luke) on my very first watch, and so did everyone I know. Including my wife, who is not a SW fan-just watches to have fun with me. It’s funny to find out other folks didn’t notice! Or rather, not surprising to find more bad faith criticism about SW out there.
I've gone on record as not being the biggest Filoni fan. I don't think he's the "savior of Star Wars" like many fans claim and I don't care for some of the directions that he's taken the franchise in. That said, I'm not going to fault him for the hallway scene or any other homages in Ahsoka. Why? Because they're not the entire focal point of the story like a certain sequel trilogy was. If anything Ahsoka has proven to be a surprisingly fresh take overall. Yes, it features preestablished characters and indulges in its fair share of Clone Wars and Rebels nostalgia, but it's all in service of themes and developments that pushes these elements into new, unexplored directions (literally in the case of introducing an entirely new galaxy).
Also, c'mon, you gotta love those cute little hermit crab aliens.
The single most consistent thing in Star Wars is the way it uses repeated visuals and dialogue to emphasise and recontextualise moments. I have a bad feeling about this is a fun one but there are important repeated moments; all the no!’s or episode 3’s he’s too dangerous to be kept alive. It’s like poetry it rhymes gets made fun of all the time and yet no one actually seems to understands what that meant. But that’s just typical film illiterate audiences.
Finally someone else who gets it!
"Good soldiers follow orders" is a big one.
HeelvsBabyface's video 'Ahsoka Finale: Garbage, Horrific Fan Fic Written for Clapping Seals' is sitting right in the sidebar. I cannot for the life of me understand how one can be so angry at others for enjoying something that they don't. Like my god.
of all the videos I'll never watch in my life, that certainly sounds like one of them
Psst! You probably know this already, but I'll throw it out just in case; if you click the three dots on the side of a sidebar recommendation there's a "Don't recommend channel" feature that tells RUclips's algorithm to stop feeding you videos from said channel. I've done a systematic purge of all "outrage bait" reactionary channels like Heels and it's done wonders for my state of mind while browsing the site.
@@sentrysapper45 "Outrage bait"= person insulting something I like.
"WAH! WHY CAN'T PEOPLE JUST LET ME BE A GROWN TODDLER WITH NO STANDARDS! WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH!"
@@jeremyusreevu237we're talking about the guy who aped out over pronouns in a bethesda game
If they recast Balon Skoll, someone who comes to mind is Graham Mctavish who played Harrold Westerling in House of the Dragon.
He's a good pick. I've heard people say it might be Dominic Purcell who was Mick Rory from the flash when it was still decent.
"Uhm yes it is 😡😡🤬"
Really like Qui-Gon connection, i like the idea of him as this dark Qui-Gon
I don't think Disney+ star wars is creatively bankrupt but I do think it lacks anima. I don't want to call it soulless because clearly a lot of very creative people are pouring their heart and soul into these projects but the final product just seems to lack that unquantifiable spark of life that makes art great.
I believe they are creatively bankrupt because they utilize research groups and committees to influence scripts. You can look it up. And if you want the truth on it, Bob Iger wrote extensively about it in his book. So in the history of mankind, a story was the artistic expression of the individual, and Disney is treating it like it's the comment section of an amazon product. Their movies and shows outside of Andor are some of the most uninspired and narratively myopic and fragmented stories I've ever consumed. I know they felt off and couldn't put it to words until I did the research.
It lacks that thing that i cant adequately describe so therefore its lesser.
@@valentinchappa6702 I did adequately describe it? It lacks anima.
I'm only a casual star wars fan, but I IMMEDIATELY recognized the back to back Episode 1/Rogue One references, and what they were implying to the audience about Baylan. It was clear as day, and really clever and evocative, imo.
I swear, the people that shriek and whinge about new franchise installments online (at least the ones who do it professionally) either have zero media literacy or haven't even watched the old stuff.
It's almost as if they're either throwing a juvenile tantrum or they're criticizing in bad faith for ulterior reasons... 🤔
back into your content, I've been so busy with school. still amazing content man
I really hope Baylan is recast, his story still has so much left to be told and it shouldn't end with Ray's unfortunate passing. His memory should be honored by letting his character continue on and finish his story than let his character suddenly be sent off unceremoniously.
There is also the visual clue of the orange lightsaber. Neither Sith red or Jedi blue/green, its inbetween. The orange is a colour not used in lightsabers before Baylan and Shin. It meant to show they are not Jedi or Sith, but something possibly new iteration combining both. Baylan even says to Shin he is not training her to b a Jedi, but something "more". Baylan seeks balance or an end to the endlessly rotating wars between Sith and Jedi. The fact that the Immortus God The Father, representative of balance to the force, is what appears to be calling to Baylan is the final underlining of this.
actually the orange lightsaber had been used months before in the storyline of jedi survivor but i digress 😂
How naive of that small channel to think that Dave Filoni would reference anything NOT FROM the prequels era in his work. Dude has midiclorians for breakfast.
Imagine claiming to be a fan of something and then hating that something so much that you dedicate your entire channel to hating it.
Exactly!
Like Mauler?
@@thenewguyinred Exactly!
Yeah, I agree with your read on this opening scene. My first thought was, "Oh, so he's like a dark Qui-Gon," when I watched the way this scene played out. So yes, it definitely always read this way if you take the time to actually interpret film language and how different films can pay homage to each other to make a point (something that has always been a part of storytelling even before film, by the way).
Love the little jokes in the CC 6:19
Sorry to hear that you're not feeling well. Hope you get better!
It’s not that we *can’t* see Baylan again. There are a number of ways they could continue his story.
1) recasting,
2) continuing his story in animation (which also involves recasting)
3) continuing his story in comics or books,
4) some combination of all of the above.
"Star Wars is lik poetry it rhymes"
0:25 this short appeared in my feed literally the moment i came across this short lmao
I haven't ever participated in SW fan spaces/forums, but I have definitely used the phrase "creatively bankrupt" in many irl conversations (and haven't seen the short.) The phrase might be hyperbolic and imprecise; maybe "thematically caged" might do. Disney-era SW is overwhelmingly About Star Wars. That's as opposed to it being About Democracy's Descent Into Fascism or About Inevitable Need To Fight Fascism or the Vietnam War and so on. TLJ was a glimpse of a SW that was About Something New that got beaten into submission, and Andor is the glorious exception that we had no reasonable expectation to receive.
To be totally clear: I haven't seen Ashoka, but your defense of the character signifies this feeling. He's a novel arrangement of existing Star Wars sequences and symbols. He (from my limited perspective) is only allowed to be About Star Wars. That self-reference ouroboros is what burnt me out on caring about the franchise.
I definitely see what you're saying - and I won't pretend I don't share this sentiment, at least a little - but I'll just clarify the moment of self-referentiality I'm close reading here is a fleeting visual cue during the character's introduction, and while I do cite his dialogue throughout the show, I am pulling out lines and approaching them only with that self-referentiality in mind. There is more to Baylan, or at least the beginnings of more (see again, the discussion about leaving ideas as just ideas) that I've not brought out of that dialogue because of the video's narrow focus on this referential introduction - -some sketched out musings about history's cyclicality, for one. For my money, Baylan is maybe _limited_ by the focus on being About Star Wars, but not totally defined by it.
It kinda feels like, while still being about Star Wars, Baylan himself is aware and is also sick of being about Star Wars, and that is a motivation for his actions.
I think you would like Ahsoka. It’s very similar to samurai movies, especially in the character of Ahsoka. She’s even called a Ronin at one point. And Andor was basically a spy thriller, so I’m not sure why you refer to it as an exception when I think it could help your point even more.
Pillar of garbage? More like Pillar of gold ❤
more like the Tower of Babel but without the fall may he stand tall forever and I hope he feels better
I wouldn't call baylan and his apprentices swords as red. they are clearly orange, with his just a tiny bit more on the red side. which totally fits your thesis. he's not on either side. neither yellow, neither red
this is a great point which I probably would have picked up on and included were I not colourblind
lmao
Get well soon 🙏🙏🙏
If hallway scene is creatively bankrupt becasue its self ripoff, then each openig crawls in the beggining of movies are too
The Wilhelm scream😂
would love to see SW stories in:
-the far future(500yrs+) AND also
-the far past(1000yrs+, looking forward to the mangold jedi origin epic) AND
-in different galaxies where writers are free to do unrelated stories
would you consider doing a video on such topics please?
these could be cool but I’m really not sure what I could add to this thought, sorry!
I definitely picked up on the allusions that the intro sequence gave, and it really did a good job of setting up Baylan as more of a Dark Jedi than anything resembling a sith. Robinswords had a really good short pointing out how this characterization was further reinforced by his fight with Ahsoka in episode 4: ruclips.net/user/shorts1eVLvXIT1DI
He’s got a brown (Jedi color) sash on in his final scene … atop the great hand of a Jedi like statue …
Can't believe star wars is repeating stuff now. What's next a 2nd death star?
Nah, they should make an even bigger third one and put a sun inside it and .... oh....
I love the hallway scenes ! They’re awesome. Darth Maul had his, Luke Skywalker had his, it’s just a cool thing to do.
Difference between Phantom Menace and Ahsoka, the former are an expected, diplomatic delegation and the later suspected enemies that are allowed to board a prison transport. You purposefully misrepresent the situations as equal. They are not. The former makes sense, as the Trade Federation try to deceive the Jedi, not the other way around. The later is ludicrous nonsense, as it is a prison transport that allows boarding of someone with outdated codes and whom the Captain expects to be criminals. Which other reason than a prison break could they have and that shuttle could contain 10 Droidika or crates full of thermal detonators for that purpose. To either do the prison break or cripple the ship for subsequent forces. The last thing the Captain should do is allow the boarding.
I mean, it’s pretty obviously creatively bankrupt, at least under its current owners. At this point light sabers are just like jangling keys for toddlers.
yes! his light saber is RED! its 'supposed' to be orange but the only orange that looks even close to that is blood orange, and theyre called that cause theyre red! ugh 😤
Love the channel - I often save videos that can be have spoilers for shows I plan to watch - would love a spoiler warning at the beginning of the episode instead of the middle - was willing to hear about the first episode of Ashoka but not the finale 😕🤔
ITS LIKE POETRY. THEY RHYME.
You already had me, but "PS2 stud farming" got me completely on board
Ugh, I'd have to watch the show to fully understand this.
I work 70-90 hours a week (91 this week, not an exaggeration)
I can't afford to use any time on entertainment that hates me, and I don't know if this show does yet, but the groundwork has been laid. I have to hear glowing reviews to give anything from disney a chance now.
I'd like to point out that the first person to say that Star Wars was creatively bankrupt was Rich Evans, and he said it some six years ago
? I don't think So, it's probably not him, I think it's more probably that it was someone during the prequel era, which is probably where George Lucas made that "it's like poetry, it ryhmes" thing
@@minestar2247 That's not being creatively bankrupt, that's just drawing parallels between the trilogies. It's a storytelling technique.
@@Deuteromis a storytelling technique? Then why is it than when jj abrahams or Ryan Johnson (under the approval of abrahams) does it, it's creative bankruptcy
@@minestar2247 Because George had elements that paralleled what happened in the previous movies nothing more. That's why one of the big criticisms with The Prequels was people said they were nothing like The Originals.
Meanwhile JJ literally just made a ripoff of New Hope. Rian not so much, but 8 had elements of Empire and Jedi that just couldn't be ignored. Also didn't help that by Last Jedi the Resistance was called Rebels. But the other problem was how 8 went in a direction that just made zero sense when it came to what happened in 7.
@@Deuteromis the new hope reuse was thematic, because of what you said that people thought it was nothing like starwars. Also, you're wrong about 8 going into an opposite direction, if you look at it's plot(the rey reveal) and themes, it's basically a jj abrahams movie, he approved of the script so much he even said he regrets not directing it
even if they don't recast him in live action, he could still show up in animated things
I also noticed the parallel with episode 1.
But unlike some, I know they do this on purpose. George Lucas said "its like poetry, it rhymes" like one time and now all the creators are running with it
Yeah but Lucas never Rhymed like they're trying to rhyme. He'd switch the words around at the end of a bar, but these guys are just repeating the same words thinking that they're rhyming.
"It's like poetry. They rhyme" - George Lucas
honestly his first scene was the only time i ever thought he might be a vader knock off his actual character is vastly different from vader
I’m genuinely surprised that you didn’t pickup that Baylan and Shin’s sabers are *orange.* But, it’s because you’re right… they’re not in boxes. Their swords are combinations of yellow AND red… so orange, because they’re **not** sith! 😊
(I am colour blind)
@@PillarofGarbage **OH SHIT!** Asking earnestly… Do I owe you an apology? (But my one point stands, and I forgot to mention in my orig comment: Dave Filoni stated that their two sabers are a combination of red and yellow, specifically because they aren’t just one thing, which means your reading is 💯% correct.)
nah nah it's fine haha
Baylen is a dark jedi. He is not Sith, but he does what is best for his personal ambition. Like Jerec for Dark Forces 2.
Great video! Thanks! I'd love to hear your thoughts on Gen V if you're interested in watching that show! 🙂👍
I'd need to watch The Boys first 🤐
@@PillarofGarbage wow! you replied! you don't need to watch The Boys first. the viewer gets a great feel for the universe by watching Gen V... but watching the Boys before COULD help LOL... 😅
Well, now I can’t stop thinking of Babylon as Qui Gon Sith.
"No, Star Wars isn't creatively bankrupt"...at least, it has no reason to be.
I think you're right about the homage.
See when other series do the exact same thing that was done here in Ahsoka no body complains about it but the moment star wars does it it's not "creatively bankrupt"
It's like poetry, it rhymes
But there are some poems that don't rhyme.
My problem with the hall way sequence is that it didn't work for me. I did make the connection between the two, but I fell like the Ahsoka one didn't work. The original showed Darth Vader as powerful, a force of nature, but the Ashoka one, even if he did the same thing, it didn't make me fear him. Maybe because I grew used to "red shirts" getting killed or because his choreography was unpolished, he looked more goofy then anything and this making him a cheap copy rather then a character reminiscing of the original. And here is my problem, copy if it's narratively necessary, but don't forget what made the original impactful
Since going into Star Wars fandom through Clone Wars I understood one truth: nothing will be enough and that any interesting concept passes by for one minute and may get some light praise, but overall, you stuck in franchise that both too free while going stupid and too tied to origins while being overthinking by makers and fanbase. If anything talking about SW "Creative Bankruptcy" is the most creative bankrupt road you can take.
People loved Clone Wars.
@@HeilRay yes..... didn't care for rest.
Ahsoka was okay. Good by Disney standards. People need to learn how literature and film work. These allusions were pretty obvious. The liminality of said characters are also displayed in the apprentice’s braid (padawan) and their lightsabers hued more orange.
eh? how else are you supposed to do that scene? pretty dumb complaint.
“How dare they film an action scene in a hallway!”
It rhymes
They should recast Baylan with Kevin McKidd.
The well of creativity is essentially endless. Star Wars almost everything keeps revisiting old themes, visuals and plots. Call it a homage if you want but you can also call it creativity bankrupt. They are bankrupt as they have thrown creativity away due to laziness, lack of skill and inability to further the world with some new, instead it just riffs off the old, So much of Ashoka was using ideas from the original trilogy, throw in a sprinkling of Clone wars and Rebels, a bad writer and director (At least of live action) and you have this series.
I mean isn't that what every franchise whether it's a TV series and movie series or a book series do though they literally have call backs or homage to all things happened in the story all the time. Hell anime is notorious for having flashbacks.
I don't know how anyone can say Star Wars isn't creatively bankrupt. They have the legends books to draw from and yet we got Episode 7 - 9 which were cut and pasted from the other movies.
Some of the stuff that's come out has been good i.e. parts of Mandalorian and Andor was great but apart from that how can 1 say that they are doing anything remotely original and creative?
Wishing for them to pull from the legends is the definition of creatively bankrupt. Just because the stories aren’t good doesn’t mean they weren’t created. I agree about the Abram sequels being the same. I don’t disagree just wanted to point out the irony
@@yukikid2195 Fair. I think we are getting older. I enjoyed the prequels when they came out but afterwards didn't like them and had problems. But the stories were original at least. George just needed an Andor/Empire level writer.
@@Deuwl again I agree! I’ve gone back and forth with the prequels. But settled on just enjoying them for what they are. And andor was fantastic.
@6:20: Trying to compare how that scene in Asoka was similar to the opening in Phantom Menace ignores how was an idiot for allowing two "Jedi" aboard his security ship as a major breach in security, versus Qu-gon and Ben being diplomats given permission to land on the ship who didn't want to be in the same room as two surprise Jedi.
One scene taking beats from another, getting them wrong because of misunderstanding, shows lack of creativity.
There is a difference in creatively good and bad storytelling. Just because it is creative does not make it either. Paying homage to a well beloved or known scene is not inherently bad.
Having said that the show does not feel much creative. What, we got Space whales, doctor who did it before and way better in just one episode. Pillars of Argonath, why? Because its cool, maybe we get more in 2nd season if any.
The interaction between the higher ups and Hera was far from what bureaucracy looks like. It was reduced to sassy dialogues from a rebel general. It seems to be written by someone who has no knowledge of hierarchical system. And you do not even need to be creative with it, just write it like a normal Army would behave in whole.
Thrawn does not do anything apart from asking the witches about everything and saying its all going according to plan.
We are but one ship yet we have enough resources to place a mine field in space.
The lightsaber duels were ok at best. It did not have any feel behind it. The movements were unnatural and felt forced. Did they even have a proper training for the fights? Not a single character had any charisma other than Baylon and even he did not get much screen time. Even Huyan seemed more expressive than any other character and he does not even have an expressive Face.
We have three appearance by Anakin, none of which have any impact on the overarching story.
The problem is that they introduce this world threatening events yet nobody in the universe is taking it with even a bit of seriousness. Oh, you found imperial loyalist, don't worry about it, we have former imperial workers with us in every section. Would they not be panicking that there were people under their noses who were working in the interests of the Empire?
When people notice too many of these instances they do tend to think it is bad.
In the end the show as in whole adds too little to the universe of star wars and could have been even just half hour of a movie build up.
Hey, I'm first to like and comment. That's a first for me in the history of my time on RUclips. Love your content! Always well spoken, empathetic and informative.
congratulations!
*orange lightsaber
I like all the characters in Ahsoka, especially Baylan and Shin, and look forward to seeing more of them.
They are absolutely gonna recast Baylon in the next thing. This character is not dead, nor will he simply disappear. And I hope it's a pure recast and they don't try any CGI fuckery. Maybe his contact with the Ones will transfigure him so his face changes. But this thread is not going to be left dangling.
Commenting for the algorithm
I enjoyed a good deal about this show, some of the choreography, all of the character mannerisms physical and vocal alike(they evoked the previous iterations of the character very well). It's a shame a good deal of man babies insist on watching with their eyes closed.
I would argue that they just reuse storylines but what they did with Balin was actually good… more or less. I mean whoever wrote his arc, should have a hand in future efforts.
Yes it is, Andor is the only worthwhile Star Wars product in the past decade and a half.
Did you see that Ahsoka appears in the series Ahsoka? Total rip-off of The Clone Wars imo
Yes you have these so-called Star Wars fans that just find fault in everything Star Wars.
No one hates Star Wars as much as Star Wars fans
Oh, yeah.
Those Star Wars 'fans' who seemingly only like Clone Wars, Ep. 3, and nothing else. Those two are wonderful, of course, but I think it highlights how alot of so-called fans don't really think about the films or television they consume, either because of ignorance or because they don't like 'complex' or 'boring' stories such as the Rogue One/Andor part of the franchise
"If you're a fan of something, you can never say anything bad about any entry of that franchise. Just endless positivity all the time."
@@jeremyusreevu237 Or you can cry and say Finn means white genocide 🤦🏿♂️
That's right it had Rogue One and Andor, so two projects in the past 8 years.
It doesn't surprise me that people would pointlessly nitpick a single sequence out of context as evidence that Star Wars is running out of ideas. Baylan can still be recast, though I don't envy the actor stepping up to keep the story going.
The biggest problem with Star Wars fans is that they seem to have a belief that OT is some sort of perfect untouchable trilogy that they use as a personal measuring standartand and, to which, nothing will ever be close to as good. Some of them might even claim that the OT has flaws but that they aren't as bad as the new shows/movies, yet if they put the OT to the same type of scrutinity they put into the critiques of newer stuff, they probably would find the same level of flaws or even more to them. They will nitpick anything they can find as a "problem" in Ahsoka, Mandalorian S3, Kenobi, BoBF and overlook similar problems ins the ANH or RoTJ.
That's why I show little to no respect for these passive-agressive arrogant haters that compose the most toxic part of the fandom.
“It’s like Poetry, it rhymes.”
-George Lucas.
I don't think its getting season 2
Good, I think exploiting an up that much is dangerous on the long term
Lmao this video aged like milk.
Yes it is lol
I really don’t know if this is Baylan’s last appearance. It’s not like Star Wars is any stranger to having a character recasted. Hell, look at Anakin.
I would love to know how you feel about Thrawn? It was really weird hearing him be descriped as this dangerous admiral by all the characters but when we finally saw him he was just a smug imperial dude who kept post justifying all his failed plans and attacks.
Isn’t that essentially what he’s always been tho? Even in rebels?
@@yukikid2195 I only heard from him from fans up to this point. Both from what they told me and how the characters in "Ashoka" talk about him, it seems to me that he is supposed to be a way more menacing villain.
@@CFilmer ahhh I gotcha! I’m the same way but I’ve been catching up on clone wars and rebels! I don’t see him being much different than he was in Ahsoka. Maybe it’ll feel more natural cause the empire is a bunch of yuppies and that’s all he has to work with.
@@yukikid2195 Interesting. There might be a much more natural threat from a high ranking admiral during the imperial reign. But I think I would miss a scene that demonstrates why he is dangerous in these shows as well. Can't think of any iconic movie/TV villain who doesn't have such a scene.
@@CFilmeri mean he literally won. He never used any more resources than he needed to. He plan was to delay them, committing to killing them would use precious resources he doesn't currently have. The zombie troopers were volunteers, the tie fighters did there job, etc. The turbo laser bombardment was middling because there aren't using their full power. And was probably using less tibana gas as a result. At the end he still won and left them behind. Ezra won't single handedly beat thrawn by himself. The new republic is going to be shit on.
I'm just gonna say: Shorthand.
One change that could have made Ahsoka so much better - REPLACE SABINE SURPRISE JEDI-HOOD with EZRA AND SABINE ROMANCE! But of course Filoni and George Lucas can’t write that thus bring in Claudia Gray of Lost Stars. Romance explains why she gave up the map, the couple goes home together so no trooper armor nonsense because they are found kissing each other thus no helmets and Ahsoka is alone on Peridea so we can have a real Ahsoka centric season 2 😊. Simple fix to Thrawn get Zahn 🎉 to co-write with Gray ❤, so that everyone can shine like Avengers(2012) instead of the gender bias where Sabine, Ahsoka and Night mothers outdo Ezra, Thrawn and Xiona. Baylan and Shin are good because of the balance and equality 😮. Gray and Zahn would fix writing illogic, more adult/child balance and weaving in the under developed parts(more answers) 😅. Iiikkk
They’ve really set up the feels of being family rather than being in love
Dude, they can just recast Baylan. Given the thoughtfulness and skill Ray put into this character, I can't imagine he would want the character to die with him. Nothing wrong with recasting so long as they find a worthy replacement. Michael Gambon comes to mind.
Michael Gambon has also passed, last I checked.
@@geist988 I was referring to how Michael Gambon took over the role of Dumbledore and it worked out very well because he was such a great actor. A worthy successor to the great Richard Harris.
Gay restraint owner master bates with all the hamburger patties before they are allowed to be sold
Resteraunt
@@christiansmith-of7dt Hey man this isn't the PH search bar
🙏🏼🙏🏼🙏🏼🙏🏼🙏🏼🙏🏼🙌🙌🙌🙌🙌
i dont see what the hate is. while "the hallway scene" has clearly become a clichè at this point, it lets each of the force wielders be easily compared based on how each of them fight.
Darth vader makes abuses how his enemies are trapped between him and a wall, fighting defensivley both with the saber and the force, only killing those who get close.
Darth maul, with no lightsaber, has only the force on his side, and uses it the most creativley, by creating shields from wall panels and then "gravity gun + buzzsaw"-ing the clones he's fighting.
Luke does not use the force until he's thinned down the crowd of dark troopers in front of the bride (i think) and always holds direct eye contact with whatever he's using the force on.
Baylan holds his lightsaberwith both his hands during almost the entire scene, only letting go with one hand when he finally decides to throw a man. Notably his lightsaber swings are stiff and rigid, yet precise and swift.