Good video !!! I have to add that the most important difference between JBL and Arcam is that the DLBC option for the subwoofer is included into JBL, while on Arcam you should buy it from Dirac for almost $500. Also I've read that JBL use the ESS9028 while Arcam use 9026.
Emanuele- nice catch on those details. I was able to confirm both of your points. The differences in the DACS in particular may contribute to the reported higher performing output of JBL vs Arcam. Thanks again- Jon
My thoughts are there is no way that product is worth almost $30,000 Jon. IMHO these are products used by installers who wrap these ungodly prices into their installs and the customer has no clue. Your meticulous attention to detail is much appreciated.
Jack - coming from someone who has invested in McIntosh and is willing to pay more for quality, that is strong statement. I can somewhat understand how a smaller niche company like Trinnov will need to charge more to recover R&D costs with lower sales volumes. However Harmon, who is owned by Samsung, and shares technology over three of their own brands plus one OEM partner, has really crossed to line into deep profit taking. It is shameful that they can’t offer more than an HDMI 2.1 upgrade from their 2019 models launched three years ago. They should at least be enveloping these products with superior documentation and resources to support. I see their approach as greedy and lazy. -Jon
Well said my friend….and I cut my teeth on Harman Kardon as it was my first audiophile grade product purchased to enter that arena back in the day. I’ve owned a few HK products since then so I’ve always had an affinity for them but this price is jaw dropping for what you get.
@@ripewave I disagree with your conclusion. Doing a v2.1 upgrade is a complex undertaking for which they only charge $300 on the SDP 58. I challenge you to find another manufacturer who offers a v2.1 upgrade on ALL 7 HDMI inputs (not like D&M's single HDMI input layup that was a $600 upcharge and didn't work) for a 5% upcharge. And seriously the charge about crossing over into "deep profit taking" is uninformed unless you've been privy to Harman's/JBL Synthesis' marketing and financial inner-workings. I don't think the Synthesis brand has ever been about extreme value. Their rich resources come at a cost...overhead and facility costs are bound to be much higher than a Monoprice, for example, who outsources everything. I do agree with you that their manuals and published specs are abysmal in terms of thoroughness.
Thanks for putting in the effort, really appreciate seeing the differences clearly communicated. I would love to see more dante home theater developments, i would love one day to see less expensive dante only ( audio out ) processors as they could skip a lot of dac components and complexity
I believe JBL has the lowest cost option today. Storm supports as well at higher cost of entry. I have imagined a new concept in separates so you can update portions independently. Most in entirely in the digital domain. I may put into a video at some point.-Jon
Really great comparison, good work! There is an error in your sheet at 19:25 into the video though, or I am miss-understanding it. The SDP-55, and I guess the SDR-38 and 35 also, are supporting HDR10 and HDR10+. Spec on SDP-55 says: Cinematic Video Experience Dolby Vision, HDR10+, HDR10, HLG, HDMI, HDMI2.0b with HDCP2.2, 4K “Ultra HD” as well as 3D video capabilities are built in.
I just bought an Anthem AVM70 8K but sent it back because I found it's UI options [OSD, app and web interface] untenable and the units behavior quite finnicky at times. It looks like we're just not at the right point to start replacing our 4K processors. For the moment I'm returning to my trusty Marantz AV7702 mkII. As always, great video!
Hi Jon, Sorry, I hope I'm not disturbing you at this time but you don't have to answer me tonight. In your best option? Which AV processor have the balance XLR inputs? If you remember? I have gotten the Anthem AVM 70, which I returned back to the dealer, I was having issues with it. Now, I'm looking for another AV processor.
Unfortunate about your experience with the AVM 70. Not many AV processors (included Anthem) support balanced inputs. Marantz - yes McIntosh - yes Emotiva - yes (expandable to 3) Storm - yes Trinnov - yes AudioControl- yes Rotel - yes (input only - no XLR outputs - odd) Anthem - no Arcam - no JBL Synthesis - SDP-75 only NAD - no Lyngdorf - no Monoprice Monolith - no Bryston - no Datasat - no Lexicon - no Yamaha - yes but now discontinued IOTAVX - no ToneWinner - no For the price point of the AVM70, Emotiva is the closest match. I would hold for the refresh which could come by year end. They have updated most circuits boards and software and adding Dts:x pro (but not Auro3D) IMAX Enhanced, HDMI 2.1 (all inputs) and eARC. It comes with 1 XLR input - expandable to 3 for the RMC-1 model. Jon
I'm a PC gamer I like playing movies and music only with my PC should I get the jbl spd 58 or the avm 90? I also use rtj speakers and 1 big s42ipal sub in a 7.1ch system
Each have their benefits Anthem AVM90 - $7,500 - 19 channels of processing - no Auro 3D support - HDMI 2.1 - Anthem Arc Genesis JBL SDP-58 - $6,900 - 16 channels or processing - Auro 3D support -HDMI 2.1 - Dirac Live
What the subwoofer is sitting on could have some impact; more if it is a down firing subwoofer. For front, rear and side firing subwoofers, I feel the affect would be minimal, but I have not tested. I believe paying attention to room placement and calibration can improve the experience the most. My 18 inch Rhymik subwoofers are sitting on a carpeted floor and I have no complaints. Not sure I would hear a difference if I only placed on a dolly. I have some that are hard plastic, so I might try that. I do find that on carpet, a dolly with a footprint smaller than the sub tends to make the subwoofer more tippy. -Jon
I had the chance to demo this model recently. It has the dynamic punch sound character we hear in cinemas. This was actually the sound I had been looking for for years. What I want to know is, are there any brands and models in the AVR category or AVP category that can give this cinematic character? Can anyone who has experience share it? I'm curious about Anthem AVR and AVPs, for example?
Does this SDP-58 processor support Auro-3D VOG channel (Also called as Top Surround) ???? And does it support full 13.1 channel configuration. Most of the AVRs and Processors not support full 13.1 channels. If we want VOG, we have to sacrifice Back Surrounds / Rear Surrounds in Denon, Marantz. Is it the same case with this Pre Pro too? Kindly clarify me becasue this point would be a critical buying decision for me. Thank you.
The manuals for Harman brands, JBL Synthesis and ARCAM, are not very helpful. The only state that Auro-3D is supported. They discuss what speaker outputs are assigned to along with what speaker types the 4 configurable outputs can be assigned and there is no mention of top surround (voice of god). Therefore, we can only assume that Auro-10.1, 11.1 and 13.1 configurations that require that placement cannot be achieved - leaving only 9.1 and 11.1 (7+4H) available. This is what more support. I just did a comparison video that outlines which models do support Top Surround (Voice of GOD) : ruclips.net/video/mfihX_7x0PM/видео.html Jon
@@ripewave Thanks for the reply. I see its frustrating when big brands with huge price tags failing to provide the real specs of their gear, so sad isn't it.
How are the displays comparing the arcam and the jbl? Looks like the display on arcam 41 is a larger and better screen than the jbl 58? I am planning on going with savant, I assume the jbl integration makes a substantial difference?
Larry - both the Arcam and JBL models have a color display. The Arcam appears bigger due to the window being wider. However, keep in mind that the Arcam has an inch border left and right of the actual LCD screen behind the window is therefore smaller then the window area on the Arcam. The JBL LCD screen goes right to the side edges of the window. There may actually be the same size.-Jon
Larry - I would expect strong integration support from JBL even if Arcam is running the same firmware with same feature set. JBL targets the integration market while Arcam is designed for standard retail channels.-Jon
@@ripewave thanks for the feedback. A few other questions..i think the synthesis has cooling fans? Not sure on the arcam…. Are the fans audible? Not sure if the units will stay in cabinet or out over time so concerned on noise…. Also currently i have the need for 7 powered channels but expecting to have a dedicated room in the future increasing the channels..am i better off going with the receiver and let that power the supplemental channels and leverage the separate amp for primary or keep it all separates? Looks like if i stay synthesis there is about a 2k premium to have 2 7 channel amps with processor vs 1 amp and receiver. It looks like approximately a 2k premium for synthesis over arcam.
JBL Synthesis seems to be the only game in town for decoding consumer multichannel audio bitstreams like Atmos and DTS-X and then sending the discrete channels out over Dante. My studio's main audio interface (Pro Tools MTRX Studio) is a Dante interface and for Home Theater Atmos I just can't afford to use up almost all of its analog I/O on a home theater pre/pro. What I would like confirmation on is that on that output channel page, I want to be able to assign each discrete output otherwise destined for a speaker to a Dante channel. Is that possible? The unit's documentation says nothing about its Dante implementation.
Rob - I will have to research a bit before I can answer. Harmon really has to put more effort into their manuals - I find them to be missing lots of detail. Them seem large at first until you realize that they include all the language translations into one single document. I’ll get back with what I can find.-Jon
I may have found a resource that addresses your question. JBL has a “Dante Channel Routing Using A Dante Controller” guide available as a document for the older SDP-35 (note the new SDP-38 webpage is lacking even the standard user manual - terrible). www.jblsynthesis.com/on/demandware.static/-/Sites-masterCatalog_Harman/default/dw81dc1bc8/pdfs/SDR35_SDP55_Dante%20Channel%20Routing%20Instructions%20v2_11JUN20.pdf Let me know if that document provides what you need. It seems that mapping to all the 16 channels is possible. -Jon
@@ripewave thanks, this explains it all perfectly. Seems that the unit is already configured to have 16 Dante transmitter channels that are pre-labeled to match the corresponding XLR outputs, with no additional setup needed aside from merely enabling Dante. A whole lot simpler than I expected, honestly. It doesn’t seem like it can receive any Dante audio from other devices though. Per this manual, the Dante functionality is solely for 16-channel transmission of its pre-outs. Again, I believe this is the only device on the market that can decode an Atmos bitstream to a home theater speaker configuration and then send said config out of discrete channels via Dante. Would love to know if any competing devices can do this. Many people who own professional Dante-enabled audio interfaces specifically for mixing and mastering Dolby Atmos content want to be able to also playback consumer Atmos content on the same system and it’s not very easy to do so, many times requiring an expansion of analog I/O to use with a pre/pro like the one from Yamaha with its multiple XLR outputs. This is a great alternative solution that drastically cuts down on cables and frees up that analog I/O for other purposes. But it is also crazy expensive just to use for that purpose as an Atmos decoder.
Thanks for the positive feedback that the resource covers your need - at least on the output side. JBL is the only brand I know that uses Dante - albeit Storm Audio claims compatibility with Dante. There is not much crossover between the home theater and professional audio worlds. With some competing standards for multichannel digital outputs it reduces options. The Storm processors I mentioned earlier support AoIP AES67 which I cover in a video about 30 minute in - ruclips.net/video/mDv0Cg6n_io/видео.html
@@ripewave Good grief I just checked that one out and its price is way higher than the JBL unit. The AES67 standard is compatible with Dante with some caveats, much better to go with pure Dante especially in a unit that is less than a third of the price.
That is the way I understand the JBL Synthesis range to work. Subwoofer 1 is always defined as a dedicated output. Channels 13-16 are definable and can be used for subwoofers 2-4 or another application such as height 3 or front wide channels at the cost of dropping total subwoofer count. -Jon
Marlon - good question and thanks for your patience as I took a break from responses. First, I do prefer JBL to other Harmon brands as you get true multi-sub output which is important if use have 2+ and can compare with Anthem on that feature. I also prefer Dirac over Anthem Arc Genesis but only slightly. Anthem publishes better specifications if you can believe posted supplier values. JBL gives you Auro 3D which Anthem hasn’t announced plans for. With JBL SDP-58 at a lower cost I would give the edge to JBL. I still dislike their manuals. -Jon
@@ripewave Guys thank u for responding, because I will be getting a new processor soon and I wanted to know which was better. We forgot about the DAC chipsets. AVM-90 has the AKM 4499 vs JBL has the ESS 9026 or 9028. Does that make a difference?
The DAC do influence the output, but they aren’t the whole story. I suspect that the AVM90 will sound better many then the JBL. However the JBL should be a strong contender nevertheless. -Jon
@@junior-OG I just found that out today, but a yr ago they said the DAC was the AKM 4499, but now it’s the ESS 9038 pro. They must have switched DACS chips. Thank u
It is my under that is correct. Neither the Anthem AVM90 nor the JBL Synthesis SDP 58 are able to support DSD - stereo or multi-channel. Seems inexcusable at their price point. While they may claim it is a dead format, we still see analog photo inputs, RS232 ports etc on these models. They should realize that our music collections remain past the selling date and we want to play them in their full glory. -Jon
@@ripewave Now that I think of it this shouldn't mean you can't enjoy these SACDs whether in 2 or multi-channel format. Any player capable or spinning an SACD is likely also capable of decoding b
@@ripewave DSD is normally converted to PCM somewhere along the chain. Sony originally created DSD as an archival format only using greater than the 1 bit depth the consumer version uses because they actually know 1 bit is not enough to diminish noise and distortion across the audio band. They also understood DSD would get switched to PCM data. It just depends on where and at what PCM bit depth and sampling rate it is converted to. Most audio processing engines are PCM based. They probably didn't think it was worth it to have their products do the conversion internally
Likely after Storm Audio offers product that supports HDMI 2.1 - them make the SDP 75 for JBL. Last I looked they hadn’t released a model yet with HDMI 2.1 support.-Jon
@@ripewave I believe that the SDP-75 is actually built by Trinnov for JBL. Just like the Monolith HTP-1 is built by ATI for Monoprice. It has much of the same features of the Trinnov Altitude as well as the same 16, 24, and 32 channel model choices. It does, however, include the JBL speaker house EQ curve in the calibration menus.
It is extremely disappointing that Yamaha, who was among the first wave of “claimed” HDMI 2.1 8K compatible units nearly two years ago still hasn’t resolved its issues. While models they released the following year faired better as not being impacted by the HDMI 2.1 chip design flaw, their firmware still remains feature locked to exclude key features including - 4K@120Hz, 8K@60Hz, HDR10+, ALLM, VRR, QMS and QFT support. HDMI.org’s position stated at CES this year helps Yamaha continue to claim support as they say all products can claim support provided they clearly state which “features” are supported. But as consumers that marketing spin makes it extremely misleading. It requires the buyer to fully understand what all that jargon means. Most won’t and will purchase a product that does not deliver on their expectations. While Denon and Marantz also failed round one of 8K product releases, they at least provided enough work-arounds to deliver a more comprehensive set of useable 8K features albeit limited to one input on board (or 3 inputs with a paid external adapter). So while Denon and Marantz had these problems they have since released a few entry level models that support on all inputs and we can assume their 2022 updated models will finally put those troubles in the rear view mirror. Yamaha has been so unresponsive here it is inexcusable. For today’s post I was a bit generous to mark all vendors who have launched “8K” solutions and Yamaha still markets their models as such. While I alluded to their problems, I will be sure to highlight them differently and express the ongoing issue in my next post. Point taken. -Jon
Good video !!!
I have to add that the most important difference between JBL and Arcam is that the DLBC option for the subwoofer is included into JBL, while on Arcam you should buy it from Dirac for almost $500.
Also I've read that JBL use the ESS9028 while Arcam use 9026.
Emanuele- nice catch on those details. I was able to confirm both of your points. The differences in the DACS in particular may contribute to the reported higher performing output of JBL vs Arcam. Thanks again- Jon
I just posted the corrected slide on community page. Thanks again for providing those details.-Jon
@@ripewave Thanks to you Jon, for those wonderful and detailed video !
We make a good team!
I love your channel and the comparisons you make are just plain simple, easy to follow
Reggie - happy to hear that the comparisons are easy to consume.-Jon
@@ripewave I just purchased the 8500-HA and I'm wondering if I need to go 20amp breaker and bigger gauged wires
Long, but surprisingly good video with lots of information!
My thoughts are there is no way that product is worth almost $30,000 Jon. IMHO these are products used by installers who wrap these ungodly prices into their installs and the customer has no clue. Your meticulous attention to detail is much appreciated.
Jack - coming from someone who has invested in McIntosh and is willing to pay more for quality, that is strong statement. I can somewhat understand how a smaller niche company like Trinnov will need to charge more to recover R&D costs with lower sales volumes. However Harmon, who is owned by Samsung, and shares technology over three of their own brands plus one OEM partner, has really crossed to line into deep profit taking. It is shameful that they can’t offer more than an HDMI 2.1 upgrade from their 2019 models launched three years ago. They should at least be enveloping these products with superior documentation and resources to support. I see their approach as greedy and lazy. -Jon
Well said my friend….and I cut my teeth on Harman Kardon as it was my first audiophile grade product purchased to enter that arena back in the day. I’ve owned a few HK products since then so I’ve always had an affinity for them but this price is jaw dropping for what you get.
@@ripewave I disagree with your conclusion. Doing a v2.1 upgrade is a complex undertaking for which they only charge $300 on the SDP 58. I challenge you to find another manufacturer who offers a v2.1 upgrade on ALL 7 HDMI inputs (not like D&M's single HDMI input layup that was a $600 upcharge and didn't work) for a 5% upcharge. And seriously the charge about crossing over into "deep profit taking" is uninformed unless you've been privy to Harman's/JBL Synthesis' marketing and financial inner-workings. I don't think the Synthesis brand has ever been about extreme value. Their rich resources come at a cost...overhead and facility costs are bound to be much higher than a Monoprice, for example, who outsources everything. I do agree with you that their manuals and published specs are abysmal in terms of thoroughness.
Thanks for putting in the effort, really appreciate seeing the differences clearly communicated. I would love to see more dante home theater developments, i would love one day to see less expensive dante only ( audio out ) processors as they could skip a lot of dac components and complexity
I believe JBL has the lowest cost option today. Storm supports as well at higher cost of entry.
I have imagined a new concept in separates so you can update portions independently. Most in entirely in the digital domain. I may put into a video at some point.-Jon
Really great comparison, good work!
There is an error in your sheet at 19:25 into the video though, or I am miss-understanding it. The SDP-55, and I guess the SDR-38 and 35 also, are supporting HDR10 and HDR10+. Spec on SDP-55 says:
Cinematic Video Experience
Dolby Vision, HDR10+, HDR10, HLG, HDMI, HDMI2.0b with HDCP2.2, 4K “Ultra HD” as well as 3D video capabilities are built in.
I just bought an Anthem AVM70 8K but sent it back because I found it's UI options [OSD, app and web interface] untenable and the units behavior quite finnicky at times. It looks like we're just not at the right point to start replacing our 4K processors. For the moment I'm returning to my trusty Marantz AV7702 mkII. As always, great video!
That is unfortunate- sorry you had such trouble. I will be testing the same model soon and will be sure to report back on my experience. -Jon
Os vídeos do canal são sempre bem feitos, já chego dando o like porque o conteúdo é bom.👍👍👏👏🙂
Obrigado pelas palavras amáveis. Fico feliz que esteja gostando do conteúdo. -Jon
Hi Jon, Sorry, I hope I'm not disturbing you at this time but you don't have to answer me tonight. In your best option? Which AV processor have the balance XLR inputs? If you remember? I have gotten the Anthem AVM 70, which I returned back to the dealer, I was having issues with it. Now, I'm looking for another AV processor.
Unfortunate about your experience with the AVM 70. Not many AV processors (included Anthem) support balanced inputs.
Marantz - yes
McIntosh - yes
Emotiva - yes (expandable to 3)
Storm - yes
Trinnov - yes
AudioControl- yes
Rotel - yes (input only - no XLR outputs - odd)
Anthem - no
Arcam - no
JBL Synthesis - SDP-75 only
NAD - no
Lyngdorf - no
Monoprice Monolith - no
Bryston - no
Datasat - no
Lexicon - no
Yamaha - yes but now discontinued
IOTAVX - no
ToneWinner - no
For the price point of the AVM70, Emotiva is the closest match. I would hold for the refresh which could come by year end. They have updated most circuits boards and software and adding Dts:x pro (but not Auro3D) IMAX Enhanced, HDMI 2.1 (all inputs) and eARC. It comes with 1 XLR input - expandable to 3 for the RMC-1 model.
Jon
Great info…Thank you😊
I'm a PC gamer I like playing movies and music only with my PC should I get the jbl spd 58 or the avm 90? I also use rtj speakers and 1 big s42ipal sub in a 7.1ch system
Each have their benefits
Anthem AVM90 - $7,500
- 19 channels of processing
- no Auro 3D support
- HDMI 2.1
- Anthem Arc Genesis
JBL SDP-58 - $6,900
- 16 channels or processing
- Auro 3D support
-HDMI 2.1
- Dirac Live
Would you recommend I leave my subwoofer on the floor or a Hardwood Dolly for cleaner bass?
What the subwoofer is sitting on could have some impact; more if it is a down firing subwoofer. For front, rear and side firing subwoofers, I feel the affect would be minimal, but I have not tested. I believe paying attention to room placement and calibration can improve the experience the most. My 18 inch Rhymik subwoofers are sitting on a carpeted floor and I have no complaints. Not sure I would hear a difference if I only placed on a dolly. I have some that are hard plastic, so I might try that. I do find that on carpet, a dolly with a footprint smaller than the sub tends to make the subwoofer more tippy. -Jon
I had the chance to demo this model recently. It has the dynamic punch sound character we hear in cinemas. This was actually the sound I had been looking for for years. What I want to know is, are there any brands and models in the AVR category or AVP category that can give this cinematic character? Can anyone who has experience share it? I'm curious about Anthem AVR and AVPs, for example?
Does this SDP-58 processor support Auro-3D VOG channel (Also called as Top Surround) ???? And does it support full 13.1 channel configuration. Most of the AVRs and Processors not support full 13.1 channels. If we want VOG, we have to sacrifice Back Surrounds / Rear Surrounds in Denon, Marantz. Is it the same case with this Pre Pro too? Kindly clarify me becasue this point would be a critical buying decision for me. Thank you.
The manuals for Harman brands, JBL Synthesis and ARCAM, are not very helpful. The only state that Auro-3D is supported. They discuss what speaker outputs are assigned to along with what speaker types the 4 configurable outputs can be assigned and there is no mention of top surround (voice of god). Therefore, we can only assume that Auro-10.1, 11.1 and 13.1 configurations that require that placement cannot be achieved - leaving only 9.1 and 11.1 (7+4H) available. This is what more support.
I just did a comparison video that outlines which models do support Top Surround (Voice of GOD) : ruclips.net/video/mfihX_7x0PM/видео.html
Jon
@@ripewave Thanks for the reply. I see its frustrating when big brands with huge price tags failing to provide the real specs of their gear, so sad isn't it.
Asking them to clearly document isn’t a big ask - I agree, especially for expensive models. -Jon
How are the displays comparing the arcam and the jbl? Looks like the display on arcam 41 is a larger and better screen than the jbl 58? I am planning on going with savant, I assume the jbl integration makes a substantial difference?
Larry - both the Arcam and JBL models have a color display. The Arcam appears bigger due to the window being wider. However, keep in mind that the Arcam has an inch border left and right of the actual LCD screen behind the window is therefore smaller then the window area on the Arcam. The JBL LCD screen goes right to the side edges of the window. There may actually be the same size.-Jon
Larry - I would expect strong integration support from JBL even if Arcam is running the same firmware with same feature set. JBL targets the integration market while Arcam is designed for standard retail channels.-Jon
@@ripewave thanks for the feedback. A few other questions..i think the synthesis has cooling fans? Not sure on the arcam…. Are the fans audible? Not sure if the units will stay in cabinet or out over time so concerned on noise…. Also currently i have the need for 7 powered channels but expecting to have a dedicated room in the future increasing the channels..am i better off going with the receiver and let that power the supplemental channels and leverage the separate amp for primary or keep it all separates? Looks like if i stay synthesis there is about a 2k premium to have 2 7 channel amps with processor vs 1 amp and receiver. It looks like approximately a 2k premium for synthesis over arcam.
JBL Synthesis seems to be the only game in town for decoding consumer multichannel audio bitstreams like Atmos and DTS-X and then sending the discrete channels out over Dante. My studio's main audio interface (Pro Tools MTRX Studio) is a Dante interface and for Home Theater Atmos I just can't afford to use up almost all of its analog I/O on a home theater pre/pro. What I would like confirmation on is that on that output channel page, I want to be able to assign each discrete output otherwise destined for a speaker to a Dante channel. Is that possible? The unit's documentation says nothing about its Dante implementation.
Rob - I will have to research a bit before I can answer. Harmon really has to put more effort into their manuals - I find them to be missing lots of detail. Them seem large at first until you realize that they include all the language translations into one single document. I’ll get back with what I can find.-Jon
I may have found a resource that addresses your question. JBL has a “Dante Channel Routing Using A Dante Controller” guide available as a document for the older SDP-35 (note the new SDP-38 webpage is lacking even the standard user manual - terrible). www.jblsynthesis.com/on/demandware.static/-/Sites-masterCatalog_Harman/default/dw81dc1bc8/pdfs/SDR35_SDP55_Dante%20Channel%20Routing%20Instructions%20v2_11JUN20.pdf
Let me know if that document provides what you need. It seems that mapping to all the 16 channels is possible. -Jon
@@ripewave thanks, this explains it all perfectly. Seems that the unit is already configured to have 16 Dante transmitter channels that are pre-labeled to match the corresponding XLR outputs, with no additional setup needed aside from merely enabling Dante. A whole lot simpler than I expected, honestly. It doesn’t seem like it can receive any Dante audio from other devices though. Per this manual, the Dante functionality is solely for 16-channel transmission of its pre-outs. Again, I believe this is the only device on the market that can decode an Atmos bitstream to a home theater speaker configuration and then send said config out of discrete channels via Dante. Would love to know if any competing devices can do this. Many people who own professional Dante-enabled audio interfaces specifically for mixing and mastering Dolby Atmos content want to be able to also playback consumer Atmos content on the same system and it’s not very easy to do so, many times requiring an expansion of analog I/O to use with a pre/pro like the one from Yamaha with its multiple XLR outputs. This is a great alternative solution that drastically cuts down on cables and frees up that analog I/O for other purposes. But it is also crazy expensive just to use for that purpose as an Atmos decoder.
Thanks for the positive feedback that the resource covers your need - at least on the output side. JBL is the only brand I know that uses Dante - albeit Storm Audio claims compatibility with Dante. There is not much crossover between the home theater and professional audio worlds. With some competing standards for multichannel digital outputs it reduces options. The Storm processors I mentioned earlier support AoIP AES67 which I cover in a video about 30 minute in - ruclips.net/video/mDv0Cg6n_io/видео.html
@@ripewave Good grief I just checked that one out and its price is way higher than the JBL unit. The AES67 standard is compatible with Dante with some caveats, much better to go with pure Dante especially in a unit that is less than a third of the price.
So the SDP-58 can do 4 independent subwoofers, but you have to use 4 of the available 16 chanels which leaves only 12 chanels for the speakers?
That is the way I understand the JBL Synthesis range to work. Subwoofer 1 is always defined as a dedicated output. Channels 13-16 are definable and can be used for subwoofers 2-4 or another application such as height 3 or front wide channels at the cost of dropping total subwoofer count. -Jon
@@ripewave yeah this is disappointing... I want to run a 9.4.6 system
Everything is the same except the newer model is 8k. Q. How would u compare Anthems AVM-90 vs the JBL 58 model?
Marlon - good question and thanks for your patience as I took a break from responses.
First, I do prefer JBL to other Harmon brands as you get true multi-sub output which is important if use have 2+ and can compare with Anthem on that feature. I also prefer Dirac over Anthem Arc Genesis but only slightly. Anthem publishes better specifications if you can believe posted supplier values. JBL gives you Auro 3D which Anthem hasn’t announced plans for. With JBL SDP-58 at a lower cost I would give the edge to JBL. I still dislike their manuals. -Jon
@@ripewave Guys thank u for responding, because I will be getting a new processor soon and I wanted to know which was better. We forgot about the DAC chipsets. AVM-90 has the AKM 4499 vs JBL has the ESS 9026 or 9028. Does that make a difference?
The DAC do influence the output, but they aren’t the whole story. I suspect that the AVM90 will sound better many then the JBL. However the JBL should be a strong contender nevertheless. -Jon
@@marlonhouston6685 dac in avm90 is ess9038 not akm
@@junior-OG I just found that out today, but a yr ago they said the DAC was the AKM 4499, but now it’s the ESS 9038 pro. They must have switched DACS chips. Thank u
keep up the good work
I appreciate the encouragement.-Jon
Do neither the SDP 58 not AVM 90 decode multichannel DSD? If so I find that stunning in $7k boxes.
It is my under that is correct. Neither the Anthem AVM90 nor the JBL Synthesis SDP 58 are able to support DSD - stereo or multi-channel. Seems inexcusable at their price point. While they may claim it is a dead format, we still see analog photo inputs, RS232 ports etc on these models. They should realize that our music collections remain past the selling date and we want to play them in their full glory. -Jon
@@ripewave Now that I think of it this shouldn't mean you can't enjoy these SACDs whether in 2 or multi-channel format. Any player capable or spinning an SACD is likely also capable of decoding b
@@ripewave DSD is normally converted to PCM somewhere along the chain. Sony originally created DSD as an archival format only using greater than the 1 bit depth the consumer version uses because they actually know 1 bit is not enough to diminish noise and distortion across the audio band. They also understood DSD would get switched to PCM data. It just depends on where and at what PCM bit depth and sampling rate it is converted to. Most audio processing engines are PCM based. They probably didn't think it was worth it to have their products do the conversion internally
Thorough.
thank you. - Jon
anyone pls tell me what does it mean 1/5 on anthem avm90 and 4/9 on arcam
Number of products that support 8K.
Any information on sdp 75 HDMI 2.1 upgrade?
Likely after Storm Audio offers product that supports HDMI 2.1 - them make the SDP 75 for JBL. Last I looked they hadn’t released a model yet with HDMI 2.1 support.-Jon
@@ripewave I believe that the SDP-75 is actually built by Trinnov for JBL. Just like the Monolith HTP-1 is built by ATI for Monoprice. It has much of the same features of the Trinnov Altitude as well as the same 16, 24, and 32 channel model choices. It does, however, include the JBL speaker house EQ curve in the calibration menus.
U hav to hav a PHD, with a minor in "cryptic etchings/messages" jus to be able to decipher the in sum of these manuals...lol.
I agree. - Jon
Can we stop saying Yamaha supports 8k? Cause they simply don't. If you buy a Yamaha now, there is no 8k support
It is extremely disappointing that Yamaha, who was among the first wave of “claimed” HDMI 2.1 8K compatible units nearly two years ago still hasn’t resolved its issues. While models they released the following year faired better as not being impacted by the HDMI 2.1 chip design flaw, their firmware still remains feature locked to exclude key features including - 4K@120Hz, 8K@60Hz, HDR10+, ALLM, VRR, QMS and QFT support.
HDMI.org’s position stated at CES this year helps Yamaha continue to claim support as they say all products can claim support provided they clearly state which “features” are supported. But as consumers that marketing spin makes it extremely misleading. It requires the buyer to fully understand what all that jargon means. Most won’t and will purchase a product that does not deliver on their expectations. While Denon and Marantz also failed round one of 8K product releases, they at least provided enough work-arounds to deliver a more comprehensive set of useable 8K features albeit limited to one input on board (or 3 inputs with a paid external adapter). So while Denon and Marantz had these problems they have since released a few entry level models that support on all inputs and we can assume their 2022 updated models will finally put those troubles in the rear view mirror. Yamaha has been so unresponsive here it is inexcusable.
For today’s post I was a bit generous to mark all vendors who have launched “8K” solutions and Yamaha still markets their models as such. While I alluded to their problems, I will be sure to highlight them differently and express the ongoing issue in my next post. Point taken. -Jon