As one of the founders of ALTA I'm happy someone continued this important work. All I can say is I wish we could have raced. The 2020 ALTA would have been 10 years ahead of the Varg.
No more banned motocross tracks because it's too loud. Of course pro MX/SX should stay with gaz because of the ambience you can't replace but MX is coming back in towns. More people will do MX juste because of that and it's great for the sport.
Yeah, I agree about it being an option. The shitty thing is that people see the writing on the wall, and in the future the sport will be drastically different. Just like Josh stated about Stanky stealing the show on a 2 stroke...someday someone will steal the show on a 4 stroke 🤢. Elon can stay out of MX IMO.
I grew up racing 2strokes and I still absolutely love them! I love the smell the sound the power hit…. Everything but guess what I now ride a 4 stroke and I love riding them too. And I have no doubt if these electrics keep progressing the way they are I’ll be running an electric before to long….!
Harley Davidson is an ESG mega liberal corporation. If electric bikes are so in demand, and it fits their agenda, why not sell the bike? It’s because most people don’t want electric bikes
Being able to tap the rear brake to level in the air w/out the possibility of stalling, not having to gauge what gear AND not running out of gear when approaching a large jump are going to be game changing in themselves. How many guys have come up short on a lg jump bc they ran out of gear before takeoff.
@@DividE546 Machine performance has always increase the skill gap. Put a A rider on an old bike and a B rider on a new bike and they skill gap is decreased. Not always a LOT, but enough.
Josh Hill, you will forever go down as a legend in the sport of two wheels, no matter how it’s built. Keep on creating awesome content! Would like to see you in the top ten again in Supercross if you can swing it. I know it’s a difficult feat as a privateer now. I’m just glad you are having fun and living life to the fullest. Keep on riding bro!!
Any true Moto soul will fully be engrained with the sound and feel of a combustion engine, however none of us will argue getting access to more tracks-especially closer to home. If this eliminates the issue of public practice tracks getting shut down left and right then let’s do this. We ride for the love of motocross and being on two wheels. We’ll get over the lack of sound.
@@troyhubbard50 You don’t necessarily need a gas generator anymore. Have you seen the power generator products from Bluetti? They can be charged with solar, and some can even power a house in power outage situations. That technology is evolving very rapidly these days. Crazy stuff.
I think the tech is really cool. I just have reservations about being in the mountains and running the battery dead and my trip being cut short. I dont even want to know what a spare battery costs. I am not numb to the fact these e-bikes have amazing performance. They will take off im sure, there is a place for these bikes for sure.
imagine walking into a supercross stadium and it sounds like a bunch of power wheels riding around the sound and smell has so much to do with the experience of watching pro racing
@@Likeaworm not really if they stick close to MSRP, they claim $11900 for the Varg while 2022 450s are in the 9500-10500 usd range. Thats not that big of a price gap considering the whole startup company and brand new tech thing
They got my deposit the first evening. We have 2 Electric Motion Escape rs and a KTM electric….definitely looking forward to trying the Stark. I still have over 25 gas bikes and quads and UTVs but the electric let’s us ride where the gas can’t….it’s just a different tool for a different job….but wait until you see how little maintenance…..absolutely amazing….I want to ride one every day.
Im pretty sure these are running the Molicel P42A 21700 cells which are developed for companies like NASA. At the quoted I believe 3.8kwh this battery could produce 43 kilowatts (like 50HP) constant and bursts of double that. The battery tech is there for sure.
They state 45A continuous per cell on the datasheet, but it's more like 20 and very dependent on cooling. I'm really eager to see indipendent testers with this beast!
The big thing once dirt bikes go electric - is going to be that the number of places we're allowed to ride at is going to explode... No noise issues. I'm excited about having lots more interesting terrain to explore - and hopefully having lots of cool and varied places to ride at within say just 1 or 2 hours drive from where I live.
Who will be the first to gut an old abandoned 2 floor mall or even abandoned large department store and turn it onto an indoor heated and air conditioned electric MX track? Dirt, jumps etc all included. No emmmisions and low motor noise means indoor is now a possibility. Malls even have the required parking space.
I best prepare myself and get a higher paying job. Just one replacement battery will cost a fortune! I'm still crying in my corner about 4 strokes taking over the 2 strokes. Great interview . Thank you
I just cant get past my opinion on needing that sound of a bike whether its a two stroke or four and everything else that goes with it. he talked about not needing to use clutch or shift gears but damn i like the skill gap that offers between newer riders and og's. i think its great that those things WILL get more people into the sport but it will never be the same. half the reason we like moto is because no one else does it because it's so hard to do and learn. not gonna lie tho if i could afford one i would get one and still keep a gas bike lol. pros and cons....pros and cons
I'm a professional engineer and I want one just to test the power tuning system capability. I bet I could put 40 hrs on it just tweaking the power delivery for best performance in offroad hare scrambles, enduro, GP, etc. The ownership cost for routine maintenance will make the these bikes much cheaper than the higher up front cost.
based on how instantaneous an electric car can be programmed... can't even imagine this thing off the line. on the real though... the injuries seem to be getting worse and worse as the bikes get better/faster. bikes moving to electric, they would be almost limitless. scary to think how far they could be pushed by the top tier riders.
@@ian9toes i mean think about it, gas bikes have been around for decades and are super refined and are starting to reach their limit, electric bikes are pretty new and already at the same level, give it a decade and it wont even be remotely close
It still has all the shortcomings of Alta. This may have a class but will never compete with gas powered bikes. I work at a shop that was an Alta dealer and not a single person here thought it was a good replacement for gas.
I'm not sure how. The CEO announced on this podcast that it will actually be lighter than any 450 now instead of just the Japanese bikes. And we already know it's faster, more powerful and has instant torque and has the same range as a 450. Sounds like it's already out competing 450's and has none of the shortcomings of Alta.
@@lock6686 i highly doubt it has the same range in real world track riding with deep ruts and mud etc, all these companies inflate and over exaggerate there numbers
I have to disagree with him saying this is going to "blow the Alta out of the water..." They're way to similar in too many ways to be blowing anything out of the water. Once you get to the 30 to 40kw point it starts becoming relative when considering how much energy you're wasting with wheel spin. The Varg would obviously blow something like a Sur Ron out of the water, but not the Alta.
Ordered one last weekend. 14 month delivery to Aus. If they turn out to be duds later this year I cancel and get on with life. If they’re epic then I’m right up front of the line. Most of my riding is a couple of hours of single track every few sundays. Plus my 500 already has rekluse and lhrb so it will feel totally normal to me. Just need to remember to bring a generator to transmoto!
@@dropbear9526 exactly 18000 aud to my door. That’s with the higher 80hp. Side stand and left hand brake added. I bought a new 500excf 12 months ago and it was only 700 cheaper after rego and what not.
Be careful. This company takes deposit then goes quiet! Have emailed them nearly 10 times over past 3 weeks. After the first couple of emails where they could not simply update my email, they went quiet. Good luck getting ahold of anyone at Stark to get that $100 deposit back : /
I love the traditional combustion motors 2 or 4 stroke as much as the next guy but to think about all the tracks that have been shut down over the years due to noise and annoyance of the general public just makes you think and how many more tracks would be up and running to the public that would be closer to me and how much more dense and diverse the tracks in my country would be really hits me in the feels when imagining the possibilities and the impact all these ebike companies really have on moto as sport. To think my favorite track could still be open all because of how quiet ebikes are, honestly puts in perspective how important these things could be to our industry and to seeing the companies trying to make a nice looking ebike instead of like alta going after performance instead of both looks and performance just makes it so much more exciting. The alta was played it's part really well showing what ebikes are capable of but they were hideous honestly. The stark looks like what a track bike should look like and brings the performance with it. Still can't ever replace the raw feel of a 2 stroke and the noise they make tho
Imagine how much more accessible bikes will be too. 4 stroke rebuilds can easily hit 1500$ if you have a shop doing everything for you, and that’s every 50 hours. I’d say most people aren’t prepared to spend that on a regular basis and neither are they willing to learn to do all the work themselves and buy the tools etc
@@jaadunajs6110 exactly, ik I'm not. I still have a 250f tore apart that's been waiting on a new crank for 3 years now just because I don't have the tools to pull the flywheel and split the cases safely and i really don't have the budget to afford to take it to shop at this moment in my life. Shit I'd love to have an ebike for less maintenance and parts failing but at the same time I'd never give up my 2 smoker for anything
Sometimes we don’t have any other choice but to move on, I don’t know if it’s a major problem in the states but tracks are getting closed all around Europe due to noise complaints
To me Josh has top 10 all time natural talent and Style on a bike! Dude is fuckin gnarly!! Always has been. I remember seeing him at a bunch of amateur nationals on his way up and you could watch him and just know he was gonna be a bad dude.
Same as alta, bring a generator. But if you are looking to replace your big tank XR 600 it’s not for that. Seems this has battery swap capability but I’ve never once needed that with my Alta, whether it’s an outdoor race or AX or hitting the desert, I can Cruze for 90 mins is plenty.
Well this is a good one realy enjoyed watching this. Grew up racing two strokes and loved it and still do but race four strokes now . Race supermoto now so the disadvantage you have on a two stroke is even bigger compaired to motocross so yeah what you gona do. But hey i'm open to new things and even try them for sure. Never had one but i loved the alta bikes but to me the alta bike never was a real motocross bike but it was close. Its a shame they went away because i realy believe we never got to see the full potential of the alta's. The stark varg bike is setting new standards it seems and when you hear Josh talking about it he seems realy exited even when he is not able to tell everything about those bikes. Well ive been an official for scruntenering in belgium for a few years and had the chance to do the world championchip trials race at comblain au pont in 2019. Awesome that was and they were already running a electric powered class !!!! Well that was inpressive to see what they could do on those electric bikes. Yeah yeah trials isn't going flatt out whole the time i know. But going back to the stark varg bike well that thing is setting new standarts but i still need to see them in real life. When you hear Josh talking about them as little he's able to tell us you still have to believe that thing will be amazing. I realy wonder how the great manufactures like KTM, Honda, Kawasaki, Yamaha, Suzuki and so on are shitting there pants now to mach up the stark varg !!!!! Hey even here close to my home it's like Josh tells us !!!! You can ride a electrik bike where you want but if you show up whit your two or four stroke well people are willing to kill you !!! The world is becomming a bizzare plase to live.
What’s the stark doing that the Alta didn’t ? I’m really pulling for them because I would like to own an electric but I don’t understand why this one is such a huge announcement.
They kept it a secret and it’s pretty good..that’s all. The timing is better now, 2+ million Tesla’s on the road now and when Alta was introduced there were only like 100k and more haters. Electric isn’t coming, it’s here and it seems ppl are accepting that.
Fantastic interview. And Jason, you sure don't F around with your questions! That's the seminal BOMB of a question which we all want to know and you just smoothly dropped it at 4:31! Lesser interviewers would either miss that or pussyfoot around it. Could see it made Josh squirm a bit, because I'm sure he has legal restrictions in regard to spilling too many beans.
@@BAYAREAMX I had a spinal fusion from an Arena Cross crash so no riding for me. I'm actually very excited to see what the future holds with electric MX.
How many laps can a pro go around a track before it burns up or overheats, or has to be charged. It is fun for a back yard bike, but not for long competitions. When the major bike manufactures decide to make one, stark will go away.
I'm not opposed to new technologies like BEV (battery electric) or HEV (hybrid electric). The bike sounds great. I'm cautiously optimistic about it. Hopefully it isn't another Cannondale... The hype was big about it too. Dirt Rider made it "Bike of the Year" and it never made it to production.
@@jonjackson6245 and power. Bureaucracy will creep in every unguarded crevice possible. I've seen it in my country and watching it right now unfolding all over the Western world. It's a very dangerous path we're heading to.
Keep up the great work! I really enjoyed this Pod Cast with Josh Hill. I'm embracing the Electric Bike. I have 2 Kiddos on Osets and they have been a dream to own. The only maintenance I have done is oil the chain and check spokes. Don't get me wrong, I really like my fuel powered machines but they are dinosaurs heading to the tar pits.
I am curious how much faster you can be with a hand brake. If say someone like Webb can be a second a lap faster do you think they're gna keep racing gassers?
Isn’t there a lot of discussion on how they will not be able too deliver in the price point that they are stating. Not if it is going to have all the light weight components etc.
Me too. I was thinking about selling the Alta before these come out but maybe I’ll just convert to dual sport. I fear the super High resale value is about to drop.
What do people say about the danger factor that you can't hear the bike very well? When a 2T or 4T comes up on up from behind you hear it particularly in single track or on the mx track once separation has set in. I mean if this quite these things will appear out of no where and people won't know their coming.....
I'm a bigger fan of Hill now then I have ever been, and it's because his involvement with EMX and his ability to see how much fun and all the positive things they will bring. No one's going to take your 4 stroke from you and me just like no one took the 2 stroker smoker out of existence, but to Josh's comment on how he got a lot of "gay" comments on him being the Doug Henry of EMX.. I don't understand the fear of some people, and how EMX is going to kill the sport and boo hoo.. How is that so? if you, me and your neighbor, and all of our kids will be able to ride an EMX in our back yards or at the empty lot near the house? without anyone calling the cops, in 5 years from now a kid that has expert skills on a BMX and or on a Mountain bike will hop on a EMX and rip it up on that same level because it has no clutch, no gears, no timing of clutch and the proper gear and RPM on and on.. and they can actually have the rear brake moved to the lever a major plus for their riding style. The assumption that no noise will kill the sport is HILARIOUSLY STUPID! Noise? has anyone heard the Porsche Taycan getting on it?? please do if you have a chance, the sound will give you the goose bumps! and you will say " did you hear that thing??!" KTM, Honda etc.. Factories will trade mark the noise of their electric bikes just like Harley Davidson trade mark the sound of their V Twin. So please, stop with the no noise cry! techs are smart AF and they know what the public want so they will blow peoples minds on what they can do with the sound of the electric bikes. Racing? The immediate power delivery of the EMX motor will make the bike UMBEATEBLE on a SX track, but AMA is controlled by the combined factories and NO! they will not allow an EMX to race in the USA unless KTM, Honda, Yamaha, etc.. are in the game as well. Now, for the ones that have never been to Europe before, MX there is at least 100 times bigger then in America, what I'm saying is, they also buy at least 100 times more dirt bikes then what Americans do, if the Stark EMX gets a real word of mouth there from amateur riders and people are buying it and therefore the big brands are loosing market share that puts them in a MUST get in the market now situation. So if that bike proves itself and that happens, then YES! the future it's here.
I have some issues with their launch. If you ask me the way to go would have been to just turn up at Anaheim 1 and let Josh or somebody race it. Because for example the range claims at least to me are bonkers. 6kWh equals 2/3 of a litre of petrol. So 0.16 gallons. Now considering an efficiency of 1/3 for petrol engines you have to multiply it by 3 to get the fuel equivalent, and I don't see 2l of fuel lasting a moto for pros.
I been thinking about getting a electric trials bike so I can practice drills and technical work in my back yard. Will electric bikes get hot to the touch? to make summer endro riding safer for bush fires.
The tech sounds amazing. I will miss that 4-stroke throatiness though. Saw a guy literally blow-up his Tesla because the replacement cost of the battery was ridiculously high. Can the moto-x battery handle the punishment? What happens if the battery case is compromised? Anybody remember betamax?
The push for global electrification of everything is a central planners’ push for several reasons of their own. It is not a market push. We should be opposing these policies.
@@JasonMitchellfun yeah i have a street legal 450sxf. But adding wiring and lights etc to a high voltage e bike is something i dont want to mess with. Id rather the factory :)
look at companies like milwaukee and dewalt- the huge array of products that run on those batteries- i see a universal battery in the future that will run every motor driven item in your life from your lights to your car to your (fill in the blank)
We need to discuss what happens to all the sponsors and after market companies and teams. I get it, electric bikes are amazing for the average consumer and grants more access. Just not for racing, at least at top level.
It will definitely bring a change….probably bring new money in. We have two electric motion bikes and a ktm electric…I have bought a ton of stuff to mod all of them….not quite as much as my gas bikes. These companies will pivot….and make different products. We love to change stuff.
It's a cool concept. But battery still has a very long way to go before it even touches gas engines. For 1 the recharge is way to slow. Takes 2 hours to recharge after a 30 minute moto. Gas engine, Fill it up it's ready to go again & again. Battery is having major problems in the cold areas especially snow areas, look what happened few weeks ago with the snow storm in the East coast, People driving Tesla's were stranded on the side of the road because their car shut off and ran out of battery. They were going up to truckers (in diesels) asking for blankets & warmth. Gas engines can get easy 150+ hours on a engine, How long can the electric get? Would love to see a electric engine do a 30 minute outdoor moto in the mud, see how that will workout. Going to a supercross race & not hearing any over revs or backfiring will be a snooze fest Imagine going to a Monster truck show and not hearing no powerful V8 sounds? Boring There's a reason why Formula 1 said they will not be going to electric cars ever. It will be boring. That's why Mercedes pulled out of Formula-E even after they just won the championship in 2021. Long story short, Electric is cool. But it's boring.
Stark charge time isnt bad and the approach of a higher hp setup being more efficient makes sense. They say 6hr trail riding and will do the same distance in a race as a 450 gas bike.
@@TheShift1313 - Crunch the numbers. Amps are amps, volts are volts, etc. Can’t cheat the physics. The battery is barely bigger than the Alta, and they are sucking more juice out if it.
@@gpaull2 true but also the efficiency of the motor right? The curve isnt linear. When ive designed drones i am not planning on running full throttle the whole time so flight time isnt figured by that.
performance is one thing, but you'll never have the feel, sound or smell of a gas engine with a electric anything... im not against them, but i am against the gasoline engines potentially going away. i understand the environmental talk and how much is true on either side to me isnt worth getting into, because there really is no way for most of us to know other than whats being fed to us. i personally dont believe things because they suit my agenda... because i dont have one. cheers!
@@straightnobraker4677 you say that, but Supercross and motocross will be a whole field of electric bikes by 2035, not that I’m against it, I just think it’s coming sooner than most people think. If they’re able to make a bike that can outdo a 250 or 450 the teams are going to start racing that. Where it will take longer for electric to catch on is in GNCC, or Hard Enduro type stuff where the race goes on for 3 hours or longer. It’s gonna take a while for them to develop one that can run on a charge for that long.
@@GYPSYTALES Can't wait for these things to come to aus, but would be interested to see how they go after a massive crash, and what parts prices would be, eg motor cases etc
I doubt it's gonna do much for that. so many places where it's illegal to ride are literally in the middle of nowhere anyways. plus you have the fact that dirtbikes are faster than mountain bikes so that's also gonna upset people.
No, you couldn't. This thinking is laughable and shortsighted. They still "destroy" the ground, kick up dust and more. Nature parks aren't suddenly going to allow dirt bikes.
Im not against ev and hope it helps with the sport, but i work with Ev’s, the batteries can me massively dangerous and it’s costs a fortune to ship etc, EV moves the pollution argument elsewhere… manufacture, charging, mining all give huge eco issues…
I’m the only one liking this comment so far. It’s true that EVs are essentially EEVs or Emission Elsewhere Vehicles. Not to mention the immense danger for fires and the incredible difficulties to sustainably recycle them. These are going to pose huge environmental problems in contrast to what CO2 has been PROVEN to cause (which is nothing apart of the greening of the planet even admitted by NASA).
I’ve ridden electric bike it was so rad but I don’t have joshs money to own and or be given an electric bike and then own and or be given a 450 If I had the money and electric bike wasn’t so expensive I would own both for sure but look what he’s doing with electric bike not racing just kinda urban freestyle so it hasn’t taken the place of the racing aspect yet just the convenience of the e bike being almost silent it opens up new opportunities for filming and riding where he couldn’t before
Im a vet track rider, so my opinion might not carry as much as elite athletes in this sport… but I just can’t get passed seeing one of these at the track sitting plugged up to a generator …
2:51 Lol, I ordered a Kuberg Ranger because of Josh Hill. I remember he was riding a Kuberg at a pump track and the chain came flying off just before Josh wiped out hard. Luckily he had a hot gf 😁😅
I think a lot of the skeptics totally forget there is a whole world of dirtbikers out there that CAN make great use of the battery life and charge time. We don't all race, we don't all moto, we all just ain't that good or don't have access to it track riding, or don't even care to. Some people just like dirtbiking, and 6hrs of trail/freeride is more than the majority of the market can handle on a daily basis.
You do make a good point, however... For the dual sport riders the ebikes won't work yet. Our rides are 100-200 miles per day. One aspect of the ebikes that is great though is the lack of noise. We use comms so the more quiet the bike the better it is for comms.
Could have been on shark tank. Passing screens then realizing oil companies buy that technology up because there profit. V8 could had 100mpg in 1970 but patents where bought.
Guys, I know....we are very positive about riding everywhere. But this will not happen. The sound is one problem....but second problem which I think is much bigger is the dust and watering the track!!!!
Be careful what you wish for. More people riding on more land. More people noticing and being pissed of. Not trying to trash the bikes but I doubt we will be riding anywhere anytime we want.
As one of the founders of ALTA I'm happy someone continued this important work. All I can say is I wish we could have raced. The 2020 ALTA would have been 10 years ahead of the Varg.
I went to school with Derek and his sister Denise in Benicia.
Jeff what are you up to these days? I see Derek is at Damon
Would love to have you on the podcast one day Jeff. DM me on Instagram if you’re interested.
I watched Wardy and Diamond rip on the ALTA 🤙
Gota feeling this E-Bike is over hyped !
No more banned motocross tracks because it's too loud. Of course pro MX/SX should stay with gaz because of the ambience you can't replace but MX is coming back in towns. More people will do MX juste because of that and it's great for the sport.
Totally agree
Yeah, I agree about it being an option. The shitty thing is that people see the writing on the wall, and in the future the sport will be drastically different. Just like Josh stated about Stanky stealing the show on a 2 stroke...someday someone will steal the show on a 4 stroke 🤢. Elon can stay out of MX IMO.
I'm just imagining a local track in downtown LA. As much as I'm not in a rush for the electric thing that is happening, there are some cool aspects.
You think they wont come up with reasons to shut down the tracks anyways? That Gov's ever give back rights/power to the people after taking it?
You would think that but there’s always way to many Karen’s out there
I grew up racing 2strokes and I still absolutely love them! I love the smell the sound the power hit…. Everything but guess what I now ride a 4 stroke and I love riding them too.
And I have no doubt if these electrics keep progressing the way they are I’ll be running an electric before to long….!
They need a legit open class may the fastest machine and rider win. Perfect blend of athleticism and machine design.
👍🏻 agreed, just fu@!n out laws shredding
It really was a shame that we lost Alta motorcycles. They were a game changer. I never liked Harley Davidson and I hate them now for killing Alta.
Harley Davidson is an ESG mega liberal corporation. If electric bikes are so in demand, and it fits their agenda, why not sell the bike? It’s because most people don’t want electric bikes
Being able to tap the rear brake to level in the air w/out the possibility of stalling, not having to gauge what gear AND not running out of gear when approaching a large jump are going to be game changing in themselves. How many guys have come up short on a lg jump bc they ran out of gear before takeoff.
You make some good points.
Those arent problems for a lot of people.
You mean a smaller skill gap?
@@DividE546 Machine performance has always increase the skill gap. Put a A rider on an old bike and a B rider on a new bike and they skill gap is decreased. Not always a LOT, but enough.
Josh Hill, you will forever go down as a legend in the sport of two wheels, no matter how it’s built. Keep on creating awesome content! Would like to see you in the top ten again in Supercross if you can swing it. I know it’s a difficult feat as a privateer now. I’m just glad you are having fun and living life to the fullest. Keep on riding bro!!
Perfect analogy when J compares the little nuances and feel differences between two & four strokes. Inertia, etc.
Absolutely
Awesome to hear him talk about the Stark. I believe it was one of the biggest announcements in the history of motorcycles as well.
Any true Moto soul will fully be engrained with the sound and feel of a combustion engine, however none of us will argue getting access to more tracks-especially closer to home. If this eliminates the issue of public practice tracks getting shut down left and right then let’s do this. We ride for the love of motocross and being on two wheels. We’ll get over the lack of sound.
Says the pedal bike rider
@@commiekiller6974 Put the natty light down and try it sometime.
Spot on- sound is killing the sport.
The problem is it won't. People will still complain about dust. And if your bike dies you'll need a gas generator to charge it, which makes noise.
@@troyhubbard50 You don’t necessarily need a gas generator anymore. Have you seen the power generator products from Bluetti? They can be charged with solar, and some can even power a house in power outage situations. That technology is evolving very rapidly these days. Crazy stuff.
I think the tech is really cool. I just have reservations about being in the mountains and running the battery dead and my trip being cut short. I dont even want to know what a spare battery costs. I am not numb to the fact these e-bikes have amazing performance. They will take off im sure, there is a place for these bikes for sure.
imagine walking into a supercross stadium and it sounds like a bunch of power wheels riding around the sound and smell has so much to do with the experience of watching pro racing
Yeah no thanks to EV Bikes
Thank you Josh Hill for pushing this technology I'm so pumped to get a stark
Thank you gypsy tales for getting the info out there
Yes! This is what we talked about Jase 👍🏻
Yep!
E-Cross in the middle of suburbs like BMX did in the 80's and 90's. Massive potential for the sport to return to hey day of supercross nights
Price point will be a problem though.
@@Likeaworm not really if they stick close to MSRP, they claim $11900 for the Varg while 2022 450s are in the 9500-10500 usd range. Thats not that big of a price gap considering the whole startup company and brand new tech thing
They got my deposit the first evening. We have 2 Electric Motion Escape rs and a KTM electric….definitely looking forward to trying the Stark. I still have over 25 gas bikes and quads and UTVs but the electric let’s us ride where the gas can’t….it’s just a different tool for a different job….but wait until you see how little maintenance…..absolutely amazing….I want to ride one every day.
How's the charging working out at the track?
Im pretty sure these are running the Molicel P42A 21700 cells which are developed for companies like NASA. At the quoted I believe 3.8kwh this battery could produce 43 kilowatts (like 50HP) constant and bursts of double that. The battery tech is there for sure.
They state 45A continuous per cell on the datasheet, but it's more like 20 and very dependent on cooling. I'm really eager to see indipendent testers with this beast!
Josh is the man! Another great pod g! 🤘🏻
Holy shit Im dying, the editing of the end was gold
The big thing once dirt bikes go electric - is going to be that the number of places we're allowed to ride at is going to explode... No noise issues.
I'm excited about having lots more interesting terrain to explore - and hopefully having lots of cool and varied places to ride at within say just 1 or 2 hours drive from where I live.
many thanks for the interview. Very interesting and looking forward.
Who will be the first to gut an old abandoned 2 floor mall or even abandoned large department store and turn it onto an indoor heated and air conditioned electric MX track? Dirt, jumps etc all included.
No emmmisions and low motor noise means indoor is now a possibility. Malls even have the required parking space.
Similar to the electric go kart hire places going up in commercial car parks in Sydney.. 🤞🤞
that would be so damn cool
I best prepare myself and get a higher paying job.
Just one replacement battery will cost a fortune!
I'm still crying in my corner about 4 strokes taking over the 2 strokes.
Great interview .
Thank you
I just cant get past my opinion on needing that sound of a bike whether its a two stroke or four and everything else that goes with it. he talked about not needing to use clutch or shift gears but damn i like the skill gap that offers between newer riders and og's. i think its great that those things WILL get more people into the sport but it will never be the same. half the reason we like moto is because no one else does it because it's so hard to do and learn. not gonna lie tho if i could afford one i would get one and still keep a gas bike lol. pros and cons....pros and cons
Exactly bro! I totally agree with you!
It wouldn't be hard to add sound to the bikes. It'll be digital but you could make it sound like anything you wanted to
Lol at this point if you rode a Stark you'd probably find yourself reaching for a clutch that isn't there. We're just so used to it.
I'm a professional engineer and I want one just to test the power tuning system capability. I bet I could put 40 hrs on it just tweaking the power delivery for best performance in offroad hare scrambles, enduro, GP, etc. The ownership cost for routine maintenance will make the these bikes much cheaper than the higher up front cost.
based on how instantaneous an electric car can be programmed... can't even imagine this thing off the line. on the real though... the injuries seem to be getting worse and worse as the bikes get better/faster. bikes moving to electric, they would be almost limitless. scary to think how far they could be pushed by the top tier riders.
“Limitless”, cool story bro
@@ian9toes i mean think about it, gas bikes have been around for decades and are super refined and are starting to reach their limit, electric bikes are pretty new and already at the same level, give it a decade and it wont even be remotely close
It still has all the shortcomings of Alta. This may have a class but will never compete with gas powered bikes. I work at a shop that was an Alta dealer and not a single person here thought it was a good replacement for gas.
I'm not sure how. The CEO announced on this podcast that it will actually be lighter than any 450 now instead of just the Japanese bikes. And we already know it's faster, more powerful and has instant torque and has the same range as a 450. Sounds like it's already out competing 450's and has none of the shortcomings of Alta.
@@lock6686 i highly doubt it has the same range in real world track riding with deep ruts and mud etc, all these companies inflate and over exaggerate there numbers
Bet it's a issue to get extended range like swapping out the tank for a 15 litter jobby on my exc500😁
i rode the electric ktm, for being underpowered and small it was good. i can only imagine a bigger full size unit
I have one that we did some mods on…it’s pretty fast in the woods
I have to disagree with him saying this is going to "blow the Alta out of the water..." They're way to similar in too many ways to be blowing anything out of the water. Once you get to the 30 to 40kw point it starts becoming relative when considering how much energy you're wasting with wheel spin. The Varg would obviously blow something like a Sur Ron out of the water, but not the Alta.
Ordered one last weekend. 14 month delivery to Aus. If they turn out to be duds later this year I cancel and get on with life. If they’re epic then I’m right up front of the line. Most of my riding is a couple of hours of single track every few sundays. Plus my 500 already has rekluse and lhrb so it will feel totally normal to me. Just need to remember to bring a generator to transmoto!
How much Inc delivery? Roughly will do.
@@dropbear9526 exactly 18000 aud to my door. That’s with the higher 80hp. Side stand and left hand brake added. I bought a new 500excf 12 months ago and it was only 700 cheaper after rego and what not.
Be careful. This company takes deposit then goes quiet! Have emailed them nearly 10 times over past 3 weeks. After the first couple of emails where they could not simply update my email, they went quiet. Good luck getting ahold of anyone at Stark to get that $100 deposit back : /
@@HarborEdwin I don’t care about getting the 100 back.
could you please send me the link where to order the Stark bike from Australia, Cheers
I love the traditional combustion motors 2 or 4 stroke as much as the next guy but to think about all the tracks that have been shut down over the years due to noise and annoyance of the general public just makes you think and how many more tracks would be up and running to the public that would be closer to me and how much more dense and diverse the tracks in my country would be really hits me in the feels when imagining the possibilities and the impact all these ebike companies really have on moto as sport. To think my favorite track could still be open all because of how quiet ebikes are, honestly puts in perspective how important these things could be to our industry and to seeing the companies trying to make a nice looking ebike instead of like alta going after performance instead of both looks and performance just makes it so much more exciting. The alta was played it's part really well showing what ebikes are capable of but they were hideous honestly. The stark looks like what a track bike should look like and brings the performance with it. Still can't ever replace the raw feel of a 2 stroke and the noise they make tho
Imagine how much more accessible bikes will be too. 4 stroke rebuilds can easily hit 1500$ if you have a shop doing everything for you, and that’s every 50 hours. I’d say most people aren’t prepared to spend that on a regular basis and neither are they willing to learn to do all the work themselves and buy the tools etc
@@jaadunajs6110 exactly, ik I'm not. I still have a 250f tore apart that's been waiting on a new crank for 3 years now just because I don't have the tools to pull the flywheel and split the cases safely and i really don't have the budget to afford to take it to shop at this moment in my life. Shit I'd love to have an ebike for less maintenance and parts failing but at the same time I'd never give up my 2 smoker for anything
It being so quiet is going to take some of the excitement..imagine Supercross sounding like a stadium full of bees..I like the sound of compression
Sometimes we don’t have any other choice but to move on, I don’t know if it’s a major problem in the states but tracks are getting closed all around Europe due to noise complaints
Well I mean it use to sound like that when two strokes were racing?
To me Josh has top 10 all time natural talent and Style on a bike! Dude is fuckin gnarly!! Always has been. I remember seeing him at a bunch of amateur nationals on his way up and you could watch him and just know he was gonna be a bad dude.
Even more gnarly out at the Sand dunes...he goes very big
With tracks closing due to noise electric will help make it survivable as a sport
I would like to know the charging system details. Specifically, when riding in BFE. How can I re charge it on the fly, extra packs, etc?
Same as alta, bring a generator. But if you are looking to replace your big tank XR 600 it’s not for that. Seems this has battery swap capability but I’ve never once needed that with my Alta, whether it’s an outdoor race or AX or hitting the desert, I can Cruze for 90 mins is plenty.
This could be dumb, but why couldn’t a transmission be added?
Well this is a good one realy enjoyed watching this.
Grew up racing two strokes and loved it and still do but race four strokes now .
Race supermoto now so the disadvantage you have on a two stroke is even bigger compaired to motocross so yeah what you gona do.
But hey i'm open to new things and even try them for sure.
Never had one but i loved the alta bikes but to me the alta bike never was a real motocross bike but it was close.
Its a shame they went away because i realy believe we never got to see the full potential of the alta's.
The stark varg bike is setting new standards it seems and when you hear Josh talking about it he seems realy exited even when he is not able to tell everything about those bikes.
Well ive been an official for scruntenering in belgium for a few years and had the chance to do the world championchip trials race at comblain au pont in 2019.
Awesome that was and they were already running a electric powered class !!!!
Well that was inpressive to see what they could do on those electric bikes.
Yeah yeah trials isn't going flatt out whole the time i know.
But going back to the stark varg bike well that thing is setting new standarts but i still need to see them in real life.
When you hear Josh talking about them as little he's able to tell us you still have to believe that thing will be amazing.
I realy wonder how the great manufactures like KTM, Honda, Kawasaki, Yamaha, Suzuki and so on are shitting there pants now to mach up the stark varg !!!!!
Hey even here close to my home it's like Josh tells us !!!! You can ride a electrik bike where you want but if you show up whit your two or four stroke well people are willing to kill you !!!
The world is becomming a bizzare plase to live.
What’s the stark doing that the Alta didn’t ? I’m really pulling for them because I would like to own an electric but I don’t understand why this one is such a huge announcement.
They kept it a secret and it’s pretty good..that’s all. The timing is better now, 2+ million Tesla’s on the road now and when Alta was introduced there were only like 100k and more haters. Electric isn’t coming, it’s here and it seems ppl are accepting that.
Quite a bit actually. For one, it’s much much lighter than Alta. The differences are impressive so far (in my opinion).
@@MotoMatt418 are you able to list more than one thing? You said there's quite a lot they're doing that's different but only mentioned the weight?
@@mitchell165 Look on their website and Instagram for all the features. It’s all there publicly visible :)
Hope they have quick change batteries for Baja 1000 torture testing?
A similar thing happened in the Mountain Biking world. Now e-bikes are the biggest sector of the market.
That’s not true but yeah
@@blackman2022 what's not true?
Fantastic interview. And Jason, you sure don't F around with your questions! That's the seminal BOMB of a question which we all want to know and you just smoothly dropped it at 4:31! Lesser interviewers would either miss that or pussyfoot around it. Could see it made Josh squirm a bit, because I'm sure he has legal restrictions in regard to spilling too many beans.
The biggest problem we have in the uk with tracks closing is the noise
Great interview and awesome job at Oakland Josh! Can't wait to get a leg up on one. I did ride on the Alta and I was impressed.
A full gate of SX riders hitting the whoops is going to sound like a broken wash-machine.
Lol this is the best comment I’ve seen in a long time!
@@JasonMitchellfun 😎👍
it will sound like the rc truck races
@@BAYAREAMX I had a spinal fusion from an Arena Cross crash so no riding for me. I'm actually very excited to see what the future holds with electric MX.
bahahahaaaa... so true
This was FANTASTIC 👍 👊😉
How longs the battery going to last in the dunes
anybody knows if they will come up with an enduro offroad version anytime soon
How many laps can a pro go around a track before it burns up or overheats, or has to be charged. It is fun for a back yard bike, but not for long competitions. When the major bike manufactures decide to make one, stark will go away.
very good spoken for all kind of bikes - THX 🙏
Push it to the upper market and money doesn't matter just make it
It will evolve very fast
I live for the smell of 2 stroke, electric is out of the question.
I'm not opposed to new technologies like BEV (battery electric) or HEV (hybrid electric). The bike sounds great. I'm cautiously optimistic about it. Hopefully it isn't another Cannondale... The hype was big about it too. Dirt Rider made it "Bike of the Year" and it never made it to production.
Be cautiously optimistic on every aspect, especially of its supposed environmental benefits.
@@C_R_O_M________ That is a given. This change is more about money than any environmental benefit
@@jonjackson6245 and power. Bureaucracy will creep in every unguarded crevice possible. I've seen it in my country and watching it right now unfolding all over the Western world. It's a very dangerous path we're heading to.
Keep up the great work! I really enjoyed this Pod Cast with Josh Hill.
I'm embracing the Electric Bike. I have 2 Kiddos on Osets and they have been a dream to own. The only maintenance I have done is oil the chain and check spokes. Don't get me wrong, I really like my fuel powered machines but they are dinosaurs heading to the tar pits.
~ same battery capacity as alta so same serious range issues, plus lithium batteries + magnesiun case... that is one hell of a fire!
“I’ve had a lot of gay comments!” LOL I can hear Twitch now!
HAHA
haha I agree and LINK
Hey man you should definitely consider getting a Surron in the mean time and we can go shred one day 😅
Im excited about the stark,cant wait to ride one, how good would they be in motard trim😁👍 or any electric motorcycle but ill always have a 2 smoker
I am curious how much faster you can be with a hand brake. If say someone like Webb can be a second a lap faster do you think they're gna keep racing gassers?
I for sure think you can be faster. In the same way that no clutch would make gear shifts quicker.
Isn’t there a lot of discussion on how they will not be able too deliver in the price point that they are stating. Not if it is going to have all the light weight components etc.
Does it have an air filter??
Is this a serious question?
Yewwwwww can't wait for my Alta MXR to meet his new brother!
Me too. I was thinking about selling the Alta before these come out but maybe I’ll just convert to dual sport. I fear the super High resale value is about to drop.
@@Slotmassacre the Alta is still a great bike, and will still be a great electric option after the Stark Varg is available.
What do people say about the danger factor that you can't hear the bike very well? When a 2T or 4T comes up on up from behind you hear it particularly in single track or on the mx track once separation has set in. I mean if this quite these things will appear out of no where and people won't know their coming.....
It has a horn lol
11:42 really interesting concept!
I'm a bigger fan of Hill now then I have ever been, and it's because his involvement with EMX and his ability to see how much fun and all the positive things they will bring. No one's going to take your 4 stroke from you and me just like no one took the 2 stroker smoker out of existence, but to Josh's comment on how he got a lot of "gay" comments on him being the Doug Henry of EMX.. I don't understand the fear of some people, and how EMX is going to kill the sport and boo hoo.. How is that so? if you, me and your neighbor, and all of our kids will be able to ride an EMX in our back yards or at the empty lot near the house? without anyone calling the cops, in 5 years from now a kid that has expert skills on a BMX and or on a Mountain bike will hop on a EMX and rip it up on that same level because it has no clutch, no gears, no timing of clutch and the proper gear and RPM on and on.. and they can actually have the rear brake moved to the lever a major plus for their riding style. The assumption that no noise will kill the sport is HILARIOUSLY STUPID! Noise? has anyone heard the Porsche Taycan getting on it?? please do if you have a chance, the sound will give you the goose bumps! and you will say " did you hear that thing??!" KTM, Honda etc.. Factories will trade mark the noise of their electric bikes just like Harley Davidson trade mark the sound of their V Twin. So please, stop with the no noise cry! techs are smart AF and they know what the public want so they will blow peoples minds on what they can do with the sound of the electric bikes. Racing? The immediate power delivery of the EMX motor will make the bike UMBEATEBLE on a SX track, but AMA is controlled by the combined factories and NO! they will not allow an EMX to race in the USA unless KTM, Honda, Yamaha, etc.. are in the game as well. Now, for the ones that have never been to Europe before, MX there is at least 100 times bigger then in America, what I'm saying is, they also buy at least 100 times more dirt bikes then what Americans do, if the Stark EMX gets a real word of mouth there from amateur riders and people are buying it and therefore the big brands are loosing market share that puts them in a MUST get in the market now situation. So if that bike proves itself and that happens, then YES! the future it's here.
Well said
I have some issues with their launch. If you ask me the way to go would have been to just turn up at Anaheim 1 and let Josh or somebody race it. Because for example the range claims at least to me are bonkers. 6kWh equals 2/3 of a litre of petrol. So 0.16 gallons. Now considering an efficiency of 1/3 for petrol engines you have to multiply it by 3 to get the fuel equivalent, and I don't see 2l of fuel lasting a moto for pros.
I been thinking about getting a electric trials bike so I can practice drills and technical work in my back yard.
Will electric bikes get hot to the touch? to make summer endro riding safer for bush fires.
No hotter then a normal bike. I cant really imagine these causing a forest fire with all the safety bs they need to include now
Good luck finding one
Gotta convince the mrs for one of these! Im def a fan
Electric--like gas without the noise, exhaust, maintenance, clutch and RANGE.
The tech sounds amazing. I will miss that 4-stroke throatiness though. Saw a guy literally blow-up his Tesla because the replacement cost of the battery was ridiculously high. Can the moto-x battery handle the punishment? What happens if the battery case is compromised? Anybody remember betamax?
I just heard somebody talking on a video the other day saying the reason VHS beat betamax was because the porn industry was already locked into VHS.
The push for global electrification of everything is a central planners’ push for several reasons of their own. It is not a market push. We should be opposing these policies.
@@C_R_O_M________ yup
I was set to give my $100 to order one but would really love a street legal version. Like the exr vs mxr. A full mx bike but with a tag.
You can get the dmv to do it!
@@JasonMitchellfun yeah i have a street legal 450sxf. But adding wiring and lights etc to a high voltage e bike is something i dont want to mess with. Id rather the factory :)
Your doggy is a little itchy. Keep on the good work. Good episode.
look at companies like milwaukee and dewalt- the huge array of products that run on those batteries- i see a universal battery in the future that will run every motor driven item in your life from your lights to your car to your (fill in the blank)
Yeah either that or all these different batteries will be able to be charged wirelessly
Honda ,Yamaha and ktm have been working together to develop batteries that will swap from one brand to another
Yep it's a no brainer, electric bikes are coming weather you like it or not ⚡
Yeah, for urban delivery or commuting lmao.
Wish it had a clutch, would be killer.
We need to discuss what happens to all the sponsors and after market companies and teams. I get it, electric bikes are amazing for the average consumer and grants more access. Just not for racing, at least at top level.
It will definitely bring a change….probably bring new money in. We have two electric motion bikes and a ktm electric…I have bought a ton of stuff to mod all of them….not quite as much as my gas bikes. These companies will pivot….and make different products. We love to change stuff.
im so hyped to try one of these things
It's a cool concept. But battery still has a very long way to go before it even touches gas engines.
For 1 the recharge is way to slow. Takes 2 hours to recharge after a 30 minute moto. Gas engine, Fill it up it's ready to go again & again.
Battery is having major problems in the cold areas especially snow areas, look what happened few weeks ago with the snow storm in the East coast, People driving Tesla's were stranded on the side of the road because their car shut off and ran out of battery. They were going up to truckers (in diesels) asking for blankets & warmth.
Gas engines can get easy 150+ hours on a engine, How long can the electric get?
Would love to see a electric engine do a 30 minute outdoor moto in the mud, see how that will workout.
Going to a supercross race & not hearing any over revs or backfiring will be a snooze fest
Imagine going to a Monster truck show and not hearing no powerful V8 sounds? Boring
There's a reason why Formula 1 said they will not be going to electric cars ever. It will be boring. That's why Mercedes pulled out of Formula-E even after they just won the championship in 2021.
Long story short, Electric is cool. But it's boring.
Stark charge time isnt bad and the approach of a higher hp setup being more efficient makes sense. They say 6hr trail riding and will do the same distance in a race as a 450 gas bike.
@@TheShift1313 - Crunch the numbers. Amps are amps, volts are volts, etc. Can’t cheat the physics. The battery is barely bigger than the Alta, and they are sucking more juice out if it.
@@gpaull2 true but also the efficiency of the motor right? The curve isnt linear. When ive designed drones i am not planning on running full throttle the whole time so flight time isnt figured by that.
Hit the leap, Josh.
Im sure its great to take to the track for a quarter of a day. But the battery life is wack for a day of single track
performance is one thing, but you'll never have the feel, sound or smell of a gas engine with a electric anything... im not against them, but i am against the gasoline engines potentially going away. i understand the environmental talk and how much is true on either side to me isnt worth getting into, because there really is no way for most of us to know other than whats being fed to us. i personally dont believe things because they suit my agenda... because i dont have one. cheers!
It'll take another generation to go away. I wouldn't worry about it.
@@straightnobraker4677 you say that, but Supercross and motocross will be a whole field of electric bikes by 2035, not that I’m against it, I just think it’s coming sooner than most people think. If they’re able to make a bike that can outdo a 250 or 450 the teams are going to start racing that. Where it will take longer for electric to catch on is in GNCC, or Hard Enduro type stuff where the race goes on for 3 hours or longer. It’s gonna take a while for them to develop one that can run on a charge for that long.
@@racingfuel28 yeah, we’ll see about that! If you are always so good in predicting the future why don’t you put your money where your mouth is.
@@racingfuel28 Ya, that seems right to me
Noise and smell doesn't equal speed!
whether it makes a noise or not, if you are up the front, then it's a win.
Can't wait to see someone cartwheel one of these
FR?
@@GYPSYTALES Can't wait for these things to come to aus, but would be interested to see how they go after a massive crash, and what parts prices would be, eg motor cases etc
On an end note, which ever way ya go lad,
You could use these in more places where motorcycles are banned, endless possibilities.
I doubt it's gonna do much for that. so many places where it's illegal to ride are literally in the middle of nowhere anyways. plus you have the fact that dirtbikes are faster than mountain bikes so that's also gonna upset people.
No, you couldn't. This thinking is laughable and shortsighted. They still "destroy" the ground, kick up dust and more. Nature parks aren't suddenly going to allow dirt bikes.
Such a down to earth 🌎 dude..
Getter done👍🏍
They kept it tight, and did it right. JH.
Im not against ev and hope it helps with the sport, but i work with Ev’s, the batteries can me massively dangerous and it’s costs a fortune to ship etc, EV moves the pollution argument elsewhere… manufacture, charging, mining all give huge eco issues…
I’m the only one liking this comment so far. It’s true that EVs are essentially EEVs or Emission Elsewhere Vehicles. Not to mention the immense danger for fires and the incredible difficulties to sustainably recycle them. These are going to pose huge environmental problems in contrast to what CO2 has been PROVEN to cause (which is nothing apart of the greening of the planet even admitted by NASA).
I’ve ridden electric bike it was so rad but I don’t have joshs money to own and or be given an electric bike and then own and or be given a 450 If I had the money and electric bike wasn’t so expensive I would own both for sure but look what he’s doing with electric bike not racing just kinda urban freestyle so it hasn’t taken the place of the racing aspect yet just the convenience of the e bike being almost silent it opens up new opportunities for filming and riding where he couldn’t before
Im a vet track rider, so my opinion might not carry as much as elite athletes in this sport… but I just can’t get passed seeing one of these at the track sitting plugged up to a generator …
2:51 Lol, I ordered a Kuberg Ranger because of Josh Hill. I remember he was riding a Kuberg at a pump track and the chain came flying off just before Josh wiped out hard. Luckily he had a hot gf 😁😅
I think a lot of the skeptics totally forget there is a whole world of dirtbikers out there that CAN make great use of the battery life and charge time. We don't all race, we don't all moto, we all just ain't that good or don't have access to it track riding, or don't even care to. Some people just like dirtbiking, and 6hrs of trail/freeride is more than the majority of the market can handle on a daily basis.
You do make a good point, however... For the dual sport riders the ebikes won't work yet. Our rides are 100-200 miles per day. One aspect of the ebikes that is great though is the lack of noise. We use comms so the more quiet the bike the better it is for comms.
And my KX 250 wont go 200 miles either. Why do people think it has to fit every situation. You don’t take a XR 600 to the track either
Very good point. Nowadays with my busy schedule I get to ride for like 45min - 1hr maybe 2-3 times a week if I’m lucky.
Could have been on shark tank. Passing screens then realizing oil companies buy that technology up because there profit. V8 could had 100mpg in 1970 but patents where bought.
Guys, I know....we are very positive about riding everywhere. But this will not happen. The sound is one problem....but second problem which I think is much bigger is the dust and watering the track!!!!
Can't believe Josh is even talking to this dope.
How’s it feel to be the only negative commenter lol
I hope electric goes all the way so I can get a cheap 450f gas forever
The only problem will be getting gasoline.
If the bike is bad ass I’ll go and get one. Just to be riding something different at the track💯
cordless drill goes "vvvvrrrr"
The launch was great..I wish they would stop posting so much though. Every single day that company is blasting social media since.
Be careful what you wish for. More people riding on more land. More people noticing and being pissed of. Not trying to trash the bikes but I doubt we will be riding anywhere anytime we want.
I want one