BTW, here are some more interesting details about the Mohist: 1. The Mohists hate music and fine arts because they consider them to be time-wasters. 2. The school of logicians came from the Mohists.
@@bosbanon3452 mohists are minimalists. In ancient times music is reserved for aristocrats. Only they have the time and energy to learn instruments. Peasants make do with songs.
3. Mohist believed in the importance of evidence, which lead to their belief in the supernatural. There was so much anecdotal evidence of the supernatural it was overwhelming. (PS if I am reincarnated I want to be a Mohist next.)
@@thumper8684 You could be a Mohist now, though I'd say that philosophy has progressed since the Hundred Schools of Thought. Mohism is an amazingly humanist worldview when you consider how long ago it was conceptualized, but its ideas have been built upon since then.
Mohism: - rationalists, preferring logic and reason to solve problems -minimalists, they hate waste and extravagance - utilitarian, believing in doing for the greater good regardless of personal consequences to themselves - universal love and impartiality, applies to all people regardless of differences, promoting equality - they are not complete pacifists as the Mohists are actually very military minded, especially specializing in military engineering and defense. They abhorred aggressive invasion, but advocate self-defense. They are anti-militarist/imperialist and actively defends the innocent and victimized - they owe loyalty to no single state or people but rather to ideals and values - meritocracy, putting their skills and qualities to positions that they are suited for and succeed in I like all these things but I do enjoy music. And I do love my close ones more than strangers however. But Mohism definitely is appealing and worth following. Too bad to this day, the Mohist text are incomplete, parts of it lost to history.
Man,when Buddhism first time spread into Ancient China.Ancient Chinese had no words for Buddhism concept.So monks used the words confucianism daoism trying to explain Buddhism.They called this 格義（USE LOCAL CONCEPT TO EXPLAIN foreign concept).You can using western concept trying to explain mohism,but it will not be accurate mate
the mohist argument would go like this, its not that you should love a stranger more than your loved ones but by loving the stranger as if they were a close one you are in fact loving your loved ones. How do you convince a stranger to treat your loved ones in the same way as you would? By treating everybody even a stranger as you would treat your own loved ones, you create a society in which a stranger will treat your loved ones as well as his own So lets do a modern example, you and your elderly parents use public transport the bus and the MTR. When you travel with them and seating is limited you will of course stand in order to allow them to sit. How then do you ensure that they get a seat if you are not with them? By treating every elderly passenger who needs a seat as if they were your own elders, by giving up your own you help create and reinforce a culture where this is the expected and right thing to do. By behaving righteously in all things to all people, you help create a culture on which others behave righteously to you and yours.
From what I've heard, the reason Mohists were against music was because they were often large productions that used exploited peasant labor. I'm guessing that the Mohists probably wouldn't be against a guy strumming on his guitar at the end of the day's labor but that probably wasn't considered "music" during that time.
There was a really good 90's Japanese manga called Bokko (basically Japanese way of saying Mozi), it about a single Mohist guy who use his brain, tactics science to protect a small Yan city against the invading Zhao army. The Manga got a live action movie many years later starring Cantopop singer Andy Lau called "Battle of Wits"
As I understand it, Mohism laid the groundwork for the youxia (wandering hero) type of literary character, than has since become an archetype of wuxia genre, and other Chinese fantasy tales.
When the Jesuits (A Catholic Order) first came to China and studied Chinese texts, they call Mozi the "natural christian" for how closely his ideology reflected what they considered the core beliefs of their religion. Thanks for the video, it only encourages me to learn more of this philosophy, especially as a christian.
Man,when Buddhism first time spread into Ancient China.Ancient Chinese had no words for Buddhism concept.So monks used the words confucianism daoism trying to explain Buddhism.They called this 格義（USE LOCAL CONCEPT TO EXPLAIN foreign concept).They called Mozi the (natural christian)is clearly They trying to using Christian values explain Mohism,that will not be very accurate,mate.
@@juanlu3958 While I agree that Mohism isn't exactly Christianity, calling someone "Natural Christian" isn't an example of using Chinese terms to explain a foreign idea, calling God Tian or Dao like Netsorians or modern Chinese Christians might do is an example of explaining a foreign religion with local terms but calling Mozi a Natural Christian is claiming that Mozi had the same general philosophy as Catholicism.
@@ikengaspirit3063 IMO the comparision dies at the 3rth century, christiany as we know it is an amalgamation of mysticism and roman imperial doctrine that direct contradicts the original tenants of the philosophy, to call them both by the same name is an offense. But I'm sure mohism would suffer the same fate if it became popular, they are too pure for this vile world.
The relative ages of Lu Ban and Mozi in the "saving Song" story should be reversed from those depicted. This incident would have occurred in about 450 BC, when Mozi was possibly about 30 and Lu Ban was in the final years of his life. This is evidence that Mozi was not from the artisan class, but was born to the scholar gentry. He already commanded 300 followers and was working as an emissary at that young age, so he must have had a head start. His knowledge of various crafts, as well as his whole philosophy, may have stemmed from work not as a carpenter but as a project manager. He interacted with both lower class subcontractors and upper class customers, giving him an opportunity to see the contrast between their lifestyles and compare them causally.
Mozi got it right. From what I know, Mozi was my kind of guy. He knew that when people emphasize family they are not being any different from animals. I think he was right on. Maybe if someone had started stories about how God brought Mozi back to life after he died and then took him up to heaven on a cloud, his ideas would have done better.
The Mohists are featured quite a lot in the Xuan-Yuan Sword series, one of the best known Chinese RPG franchises; too bad they haven't been localized to other languages.
I believe Mozi came from another world with transcendental wisdom and fortitudes. What they did was completely against primitive human nature. However, I am more fascinated by stories of Guiguzi. Hope Cool Bros can present his stories
@@dutchmilk The Jedi were selfless in helping the weak and innocent citizens of the galaxy. Now that does not mean they were perfect or did not do anything questionable. ( like abducting force sensitive children from their families) I would say their only real failing flaw was getting mixed up in the politics of the corrupt Republic which led to their downfall. Although for awhile they did learn their lesson after the First Sith War. They wisely refused to get involved in the Mandalorian Wars. But by the time of the Clone Wars i guess they fatally forgot about those past lessons.
For me I know it sounds ridiculous to some but the video game series rotk based on obviously the novel and real history of romance of the three kingdoms got me into history in general. And in one of the games that had rpg aspects you could collect old texts and classics of china and one of the books was Mo Zi. Ever since then I looked into it because it peaked my interest and for me at least the universal love aspect always appealed to me along with some of the altruism and such.
Mengzi's response to Mohism is really cool. Mencian synthesis of Mohism and Yangism into a Confucianism that moderates the two is astounding As a fan of Mengzi and Mohism I would love to travel back in time and watch Confucians debate Mohists.
Mengzi’s criticism towards Mohism was based on a superficial understanding of it at best though, and Mengzi’s belief of morality based on patriarchal hierarchy order and centralization of power wasn’t compatible with Mohist thought. Because of this Mohism has been considered heretical by mainstream Confucianists until today, many Confucianists and nationalists of China and Korea even today continue to denigrate Mohism as a failure for this reason. It’s true that Mencius did acknowledge Mohists to be almost saintly at the same time though, and a portion of Mencius’ philosophy much like Yangism does contain certain highly individualistic aspects. (which also are deemed heretical by many ruling elites and mainstream Confucianists later on).
Really interesting topic because Mengzi's philosophy in some aspects is more aligned to Mohism than Confucism...In some aspects Mengzi is even more radical than Mozi. For Mengzi, rebellion against an unjust sovereign is justified---an idea that would no doubt offend Confucius and something that even Mozi did not dare to openly state.
Though not perfect (I never understood the music ban except to be the opposite of Confucians), I have always thought the Mojia were the best of the ancient Chinese philosophers.
The reason why Mohists were against music should be seen in context of society of the time. Music was reserved for the rich and powerful, like lavish month-long funerals or throwing money at jade trinkets. Awesome? Sure, but less so when you realize these were essentially state funds being used for personal enjoyment instead of, y'know, preventing widespread famine. Mozi was a commoner and most certainly knew the pain of watching your children starve to death while the fat bureaurocrat down the road was listening to fine music and playing with his concubines.
Not many people know that the Mohists continued on in secret for centuries, and along the Way developed a taste for music and hashish. They reappeared in the middle of the twentieth century as the Hippie movement. Think about it.
And by the sound of it. Mohists do not prefer to be happy. They prefer the natural state. So music and other mood changing things like alcohol are problematic.
I mean, Warhammer Fantasy Battles has Cathay lands, that's essentially China. Thought these lands were not explored particularly well in fiction or rulebooks.
But then if pacifist protester engage in war to stop a war, they will call them radicals / terrorist / mercenary, whatever negative name applicable just to vilify them. I think the closest to that ideal would be ANC during Mandela early days fighting apartheid, as opposed to Gandhi pacifism.
@@dimasakbar7668 The government of the nation or country in question will do that regardless. So will their allies. Ultimately it is of little consequence so long as all objectives are achieved.
I think the most appropriate evaluation of Mozi is "limitations of the times". He did the best in his time, and the reason why he could not go further was simply because the civilization at that time was still very backward. He opposed music only because resources were limited at that time. If they were used to develop music, only the nobles would enjoy it, and the common people would starve to death due to the lack of these resources. He worshipped God, but in fact I don’t think Mozi really believed that the world was governed by gods. He just wanted people to fear the punishment of God and not do bad things. If there is a way to make people abide by the rules without gods, I think Mozi would be happy to use it.
The ancient Chinese philosophies that survived were the ones that told peasants to shut up and take the injustices heaped upon them, so those philosophies were hand-picked by despots. It's to Mohism's credit that it wasn't "popular".
Unlike Confucianism and Taoism which are well kept by their students, Moism has fewer disciples. After the books burning. Many thoughts are gone. We don't know how much about actual Moist
I wished the first emperor of China hadn't burned all the books from the different schools of thought. Imagine what philosophy eastern Asia could have had if he hadn't done so. China, and other Asian countries that were influenced by China, might have been so different. P.s. my comment is not meant to attack present China, but to show my pity that the wealth of knowledge China, and other Asian countries influenced by China, could've had was robbed by a tyrant.
It’s a hard one, without Qin Shi Huang there will be no unified China. Broken up the people suffered as Kingdoms waged war constantly. It may also be the consequence of civilisation just like how the Library of Alexandria got burned, the collapse of Babylon, Rome, Ancient Greece etc. Knowledge seems to disappear once it hits a certain level of advancement. Although we have more access to knowledge and information, our technology is the most fragile if our electronic servers are wiped out through EMP or electricity blackout, there is no way to access that information again.
@@CharonTFM What do you mean by "it's a hard one"? In response to your first paragraph: I have no objection to Qin Shi Huang being the first emperor to unify China. I agree a broken China, like any broken country, would bring about chaos and war, no doubt. To your second paragraph, I agree that some civilizations that succeed a previous one do, unfortunately, destroy their predecessor's history, monuments, and the likes.
@@idiot9450 Before arguing with you, I raise questions: What constitutes a country-is it the people, or is it the land, or is it both people and land that makes a country? Moreover, Is a country considered unified when it, along with its citizens, is under the rule of one regime? To put it simply, what makes a country and when is a country considered unified? Lastly, what is a tyrant?
Stupid Ideal of Righteousness? I'm about ready to read the one section of Mozi that I thought was worthless. Righteousness is also an ideal of Confucianism and Taoism, too. RIghteousness is universal, and if one nation can perpetually abate and repel the assault of another, that's probably one of the best ideas in military history. Although, Mozi was an exceptional Genius, and probably among the top two or three thinkers to ever live, or who ever will. Truth will always have difficulty finding sponsors. It's not practical for war, but practical for peace.
Just imagine if ancient China choose mohist as a state Philosophy. China could be like "US" of the ancient east asia. Actively intervening in foreign wars, and european wouldnt probably dare to meddle in southeast asia. 😆
Love rewatching this video but noticed on my 5+ rewatch of this with the 6:41 "Then their stupid idea of righteousness" I didn't noticed that at first but jeez. Caught me off guard with calling it stupid in a well made video lol
bought myself The Analects for Christmas. In Sun Yat-sen's 3 Principles of the People he mentions Confucius and Mengcius a lot in his 2nd Principle of the People!
".... but then, everything changed, when the fire nation attacked..." had me spit my drink. also, cant help but think, if everyone were basically mohist, or "hippies" the whole sense of "us vs them" and patriotism would die out, and we'd realize, just maybe, how stupid wars are... but that sounds too "communist", so i dont think itd sell too well...
Since the Mohists, unlike the Confucians, believed in "love without discrimination", that is, caring about everyone, not just one's superiors, this reminds me of Christianity.
@Shy Cracker i think you either don't understand christianity or mohism or both to make that claim. christianity says there is only one true god and everything is already set by that god. but mohism says 非命, which means there is no destiny. people build their own fate. no "thanks god" that kind of thing. john made the connection with "love without discrimination" which made some sense, but you said "Mohism is literally proto Christianity" which doesn't make sense at all.
@@rickr9435 The nature of Christianity haven fractured into several sects means that much of all these overarching generalizations might not fit. Like the whole ideal f "universal love" is present in all Christian sects but that is only because it is repeated several times in the New Testament. The whole "everything is already set by God" isn't a Christian universal, Catholics don't really go extreme to either side and most Christians would believe in Permissive will of God, i.e. what is possible and perfect will of God which is what is ideal. The Christians that most strongly go for the "everything is already set by God" but almost every other sect disagrees with them, mainly because it is considered that one makes it to hell because they refuse God, of their own free will in almost all other Christian sects. And as for "there is only one true god" I am pretty sure the Mohists were like just softer MonoTheists, Like only on lord of heaven but we can always acknowledge other people's gods somehow instead of going the Christian route of just calling everything else superstition or demons. However, nobody is saying Christiianity and Mohism have to match exactly, just that they are pretty close that with the right shift in language they could be mistaken for divergent sects of one another.
17:40 in Christianity, it's no different, nobody gets a heavenly reward by righteous acts. This is a far-too-common misrepresentation of Christianity where people are 'good for goodness sake' (you're supposed to be that way anyway) but it does not earn heavenly admission.
Mo Tzu was one of the great philosophers during the Warring States in ancient China. A contemporary of Lao Tzu and Confucius, he advocated compassion and love, and was adamantly against all kinds of war. Somehow, he did not have many followers, and was unable to convince the rulers. Mohism did not flourish mainly because most kings preferred Confucianism. Had it prevailed, China would not be engaged in that many wars in its long history..
Pacifism and neutrality can only come from position of utter dominance just like how only winners can afford to be magnanimous. An individual can be what Mo Tzu preaches but a city, state or country will instantly be consumed. Confucianism advocated rigid patriarchy and obedience which is why rulers promoted it instead of a teaching that advocate pacifism during a warring period. Mo is like our contemporary UN peacekeepers - lofty ideals and can do good work here and there but ultimately an exercise in futility and are only tolerated as long as the major powers aren't too inconvenienced.
@@stevens9625good reasons why Mohism didn’t succeed as a state philosophy. However it’s not too different from Christianity, which was extremely successful as state / culture ideology, so I wonder what the missing ingredient is? Christianity did develop pretty warlike states despite its pacifist origins, so Mohism could have developed similarly (maybe a “war is justified in a pre-emptive way sometimes” idea). Maybe it’s the evangelization and “our religion is the only truth on earth and only way into heaven” that Christianity had (leading to its promotion by people who wanted to spread their influence with people that want to be in the “in club”) that Mohism didn’t? What would a version of that look like for Mohism?
Daoism is more practical whereas Mohist seems more like an ideal to aspire to. In a (Daoist kind of ) way, if actual real practicing Mohist comes about, it might not be a good thing overall, it just mean that the times are so horrible and unacceptable that finally there exists a group of really brilliant and capable individuals who got pushed to point to setting out to right all the horrible wrongs even they know darn well they would likely get punish for it. The average human just do not make that kind of choices. The Spring and Autum + Warring State period were such time. I pray the current state of affairs in the world never descends to the state where the universe/god/fate have to bring these guys back ^_^
@@marcc1830 Well, from the zeitgeist perspective, I would personally say that it is the other way around. Mohism, being very similar to humanitarianism and social democracy, would be a major improvement of society (especially in the US). While Daoism is more of a thing to strive for in our every day lives. Then again, I may have misunderstood your point.
@@torbjornlekberg7756 Just different way to look at things, and to be honest I wish I have it wrong and that you are right. Confucianism seems to have won out historically in China but the rulers themselves actually operates more or less on a combination of Daoist cross Legalist kind of way. In fact be it Han, Tang or even today promote Confucianism to the people so that they respect the social order while the leadership go about their own way that is closer to Sun Tzu and Machiavellian and is somewhat contained by the Confucian morals. In a similar fashion, even in the modern democratic countries, while the citizens cherishes modern social values that is similar to Mohism but in practice fell short to varying degrees, because most to a varying degree follow the flow of what's easier for him/herself. All the while the governments themselves operate in a more shall we say primal manner just barely confined by the ideals they espouse.
@Trinidad and Tobagoball You never studied political philosophy, I see. Or learned much concerning things outside your borders. Europe being communist? Only a USamerican would believe such a thing. Or rather be convinced by it despite lacking any real knowledge about the european continent. It is an odd mix of ignorance and arrogance.
They thought that it distracted the population from more important pursuits such as work and doing good. Just imagine what happens if a bunch of engineers started a cult. LoL!
1. the cost of time, resources, and attention. this was not just expensive concerts, but fancy architecture, clothing, cooking etc... 2. the psychological effect of pursuit of pleasure leads to indiscipline. contentment, comfort, and relishing the satisfaction of righteousness are acceptable. 3. the spirit world is full of spirits of all kinds all mixed up. heaven can let them into our world, or we can. if heaven lets them in on a mission, unbidden by man, they must be righteous (not necessarily friendly depending on how righteous you are). if you invite them in you don't know what you are going to get. music creates unpredictable mental states in which you might unwittingly let random spirits into our world.
All anarchist can sit down and talk about hierarchies all day, without doing nothing. A more rational and logic nerd is definitely a protomarxist school. Music and moaning are for the bourgeoisie. Also the trouble maker (dialectical) attitude of this complex and contradictory approach to conflict and war.
@@ikengaspirit3063 Yes, next to each other, for thousands of years, having war and trade, feudalism and "religion".... """"independent invention""""", you may have a theory to back something like that one up? No?
BTW, here are some more interesting details about the Mohist:
1. The Mohists hate music and fine arts because they consider them to be time-wasters.
2. The school of logicians came from the Mohists.
Hate music? Sounds like ancient chinese version of wahabi muslim in this aspect
@@bosbanon3452 against music and fine arts should be better describe this.
@@bosbanon3452 mohists are minimalists. In ancient times music is reserved for aristocrats. Only they have the time and energy to learn instruments. Peasants make do with songs.
3. Mohist believed in the importance of evidence, which lead to their belief in the supernatural. There was so much anecdotal evidence of the supernatural it was overwhelming.
(PS if I am reincarnated I want to be a Mohist next.)
@@thumper8684 You could be a Mohist now, though I'd say that philosophy has progressed since the Hundred Schools of Thought. Mohism is an amazingly humanist worldview when you consider how long ago it was conceptualized, but its ideas have been built upon since then.
Mohism:
- rationalists, preferring logic and reason to solve problems
-minimalists, they hate waste and extravagance
- utilitarian, believing in doing for the greater good regardless of personal consequences to themselves
- universal love and impartiality, applies to all people regardless of differences, promoting equality
- they are not complete pacifists as the Mohists are actually very military minded, especially specializing in military engineering and defense. They abhorred aggressive invasion, but advocate self-defense. They are anti-militarist/imperialist and actively defends the innocent and victimized
- they owe loyalty to no single state or people but rather to ideals and values
- meritocracy, putting their skills and qualities to positions that they are suited for and succeed in
I like all these things but I do enjoy music. And I do love my close ones more than strangers however. But Mohism definitely is appealing and worth following. Too bad to this day, the Mohist text are incomplete, parts of it lost to history.
rationalist? logic? their basic idea is worse from the start, its very inhumane. But is true that good for the world to have more people like them.
@@ekosusetyo217 LOL, you've read it.
Man,when Buddhism first time spread into Ancient China.Ancient Chinese had no words for Buddhism concept.So monks used the words confucianism daoism trying to explain Buddhism.They called this 格義（USE LOCAL CONCEPT TO EXPLAIN foreign concept).You can using western concept trying to explain mohism,but it will not be accurate mate
the mohist argument would go like this, its not that you should love a stranger more than your loved ones but by loving the stranger as if they were a close one you are in fact loving your loved ones. How do you convince a stranger to treat your loved ones in the same way as you would? By treating everybody even a stranger as you would treat your own loved ones, you create a society in which a stranger will treat your loved ones as well as his own
So lets do a modern example, you and your elderly parents use public transport the bus and the MTR. When you travel with them and seating is limited you will of course stand in order to allow them to sit. How then do you ensure that they get a seat if you are not with them? By treating every elderly passenger who needs a seat as if they were your own elders, by giving up your own you help create and reinforce a culture where this is the expected and right thing to do.
By behaving righteously in all things to all people, you help create a culture on which others behave righteously to you and yours.
From what I've heard, the reason Mohists were against music was because they were often large productions that used exploited peasant labor. I'm guessing that the Mohists probably wouldn't be against a guy strumming on his guitar at the end of the day's labor but that probably wasn't considered "music" during that time.
Mohist will never betray the world, even if the world betrays them - reverse Cao Cao
That is what we call "integrity". An alien concept even today.
@Dragon Dynasty Warrior: Cao Cao's ghost: You can't do a reverse me that is cheating.
Where does this phrase comes from?
There was a really good 90's Japanese manga called Bokko (basically Japanese way of saying Mozi), it about a single Mohist guy who use his brain, tactics science to protect a small Yan city against the invading Zhao army.
The Manga got a live action movie many years later starring Cantopop singer Andy Lau called "Battle of Wits"
I’ll check it out
Great. Now, hongki youths think that Mozi came from japan...
@@djtan3313 nah doubt those idiots can read at all. That manga is pretty old and forgotten nowadays.
@@hanchiman just like what happened in the Qin Dynasty scholarly persecution
Is thank to that that i came to know and appreciate mohism. It is pretty good. I advice to read it
Sounds like Mohism is tailor-made for aspiring badass true heroes.
As I understand it, Mohism laid the groundwork for the youxia (wandering hero) type of literary character, than has since become an archetype of wuxia genre, and other Chinese fantasy tales.
When the Jesuits (A Catholic Order) first came to China and studied Chinese texts, they call Mozi the "natural christian" for how closely his ideology reflected what they considered the core beliefs of their religion.
Thanks for the video, it only encourages me to learn more of this philosophy, especially as a christian.
Man,when Buddhism first time spread into Ancient China.Ancient Chinese had no words for Buddhism concept.So monks used the words confucianism daoism trying to explain Buddhism.They called this 格義（USE LOCAL CONCEPT TO EXPLAIN foreign concept).They called Mozi the (natural christian)is clearly They trying to using Christian values explain Mohism,that will not be very accurate,mate.
@@juanlu3958 While I agree that Mohism isn't exactly Christianity, calling someone "Natural Christian" isn't an example of using Chinese terms to explain a foreign idea, calling God Tian or Dao like Netsorians or modern Chinese Christians might do is an example of explaining a foreign religion with local terms but calling Mozi a Natural Christian is claiming that Mozi had the same general philosophy as Catholicism.
@@ikengaspirit3063 Christians are natural mohists
@@smoothjazz2143 I don't think the "natural" adjective can go both ways but aside from that I guess you're right. The comparison does go both ways.
@@ikengaspirit3063 IMO the comparision dies at the 3rth century, christiany as we know it is an amalgamation of mysticism and roman imperial doctrine that direct contradicts the original tenants of the philosophy, to call them both by the same name is an offense. But I'm sure mohism would suffer the same fate if it became popular, they are too pure for this vile world.
Mohist are the coolest guys in their prime. They are also probably the earliest techies school made of skillful masters of many trades.
Talk about a high stake game - can you imagine a D&D game where if your character dies you had to be executed too? Crazy awesome.
That would be a great Squid Episode
hmm similar to three body games in the movie then ? yes the tencent three body (san ti)
The relative ages of Lu Ban and Mozi in the "saving Song" story should be reversed from those depicted. This incident would have occurred in about 450 BC, when Mozi was possibly about 30 and Lu Ban was in the final years of his life. This is evidence that Mozi was not from the artisan class, but was born to the scholar gentry. He already commanded 300 followers and was working as an emissary at that young age, so he must have had a head start. His knowledge of various crafts, as well as his whole philosophy, may have stemmed from work not as a carpenter but as a project manager. He interacted with both lower class subcontractors and upper class customers, giving him an opportunity to see the contrast between their lifestyles and compare them causally.
Interesting! I would want to know more.
So in other words...similar to modern day engineers.
he was so young and become the emissary for the Song? Wow 👍
a solutions architect
Mozi got it right. From what I know, Mozi was my kind of guy. He knew that when people emphasize family they are not being any different from animals. I think he was right on. Maybe if someone had started stories about how God brought Mozi back to life after he died and then took him up to heaven on a cloud, his ideas would have done better.
@@mattongbp you are 100 percent right.
Agree, humen will have broader hearts as along the evolving path.
As a Muslim, I think I would consider Mozi a Prophet of God.
The mohists anticipated Newton’s laws of motion.
China’s first quantum satellite was named after Mozi.
A truly interesting sect these mohists.
The Mohists are featured quite a lot in the Xuan-Yuan Sword series, one of the best known Chinese RPG franchises; too bad they haven't been localized to other languages.
Wooooo, my man Mozi finally getting his time in the spotlight!
I believe Mozi came from another world with transcendental wisdom and fortitudes. What they did was completely against primitive human nature. However, I am more fascinated by stories of Guiguzi. Hope Cool Bros can present his stories
Before Emiya, there was Mozi, the true hero of justice.
Absolutely.
So they were the jedi order of ancient time
Er no. The Jedi were self serving. George Lucas even filmed it so.
@@dutchmilk The Jedi were selfless in helping the weak and innocent citizens of the galaxy. Now that does not mean they were perfect or did not do anything questionable. ( like abducting force sensitive children from their families) I would say their only real failing flaw was getting mixed up in the politics of the corrupt Republic which led to their downfall. Although for awhile they did learn their lesson after the First Sith War. They wisely refused to get involved in the Mandalorian Wars. But by the time of the Clone Wars i guess they fatally forgot about those past lessons.
They were the Jedi without the attachment hang up :p
For me I know it sounds ridiculous to some but the video game series rotk based on obviously the novel and real history of romance of the three kingdoms got me into history in general. And in one of the games that had rpg aspects you could collect old texts and classics of china and one of the books was Mo Zi. Ever since then I looked into it because it peaked my interest and for me at least the universal love aspect always appealed to me along with some of the altruism and such.
Mohism is the earliest form of "Speak softly but carry a big stick".
There is manga about Mo zi called "Bokkō" (墨攻) which have been adapted to a movie called "battle of wits"
Mengzi's response to Mohism is really cool. Mencian synthesis of Mohism and Yangism into a Confucianism that moderates the two is astounding
As a fan of Mengzi and Mohism I would love to travel back in time and watch Confucians debate Mohists.
Mengzi’s criticism towards Mohism was based on a superficial understanding of it at best though, and Mengzi’s belief of morality based on patriarchal hierarchy order and centralization of power wasn’t compatible with Mohist thought.
Because of this Mohism has been considered heretical by mainstream Confucianists until today, many Confucianists and nationalists of China and Korea even today continue to denigrate Mohism as a failure for this reason.
It’s true that Mencius did acknowledge Mohists to be almost saintly at the same time though, and a portion of Mencius’ philosophy much like Yangism does contain certain highly individualistic aspects. (which also are deemed heretical by many ruling elites and mainstream Confucianists later on).
ya, they have their own reason, complete each other with taoism and the others "ism" that we do not know.
Really interesting topic because Mengzi's philosophy in some aspects is more aligned to Mohism than Confucism...In some aspects Mengzi is even more radical than Mozi. For Mengzi, rebellion against an unjust sovereign is justified---an idea that would no doubt offend Confucius and something that even Mozi did not dare to openly state.
"The mysterious old man always saves the day."
-Things I didn't realize were true until now lol
"Then everything changed when the Fire Nation attacked"......I. Am. DEAD! 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣💀
Though not perfect (I never understood the music ban except to be the opposite of Confucians), I have always thought the Mojia were the best of the ancient Chinese philosophers.
According to Wikipedia, it wasn't music per se, but expensive musical rituals that could bankrupt a city.
The reason why Mohists were against music should be seen in context of society of the time. Music was reserved for the rich and powerful, like lavish month-long funerals or throwing money at jade trinkets. Awesome? Sure, but less so when you realize these were essentially state funds being used for personal enjoyment instead of, y'know, preventing widespread famine. Mozi was a commoner and most certainly knew the pain of watching your children starve to death while the fat bureaurocrat down the road was listening to fine music and playing with his concubines.
Not many people know that the Mohists continued on in secret for centuries, and along the Way developed a taste for music and hashish. They reappeared in the middle of the twentieth century as the Hippie movement.
Think about it.
Music can become problematic. It destroys the natural vibrations of the mind and causes hypnotism.
And by the sound of it. Mohists do not prefer to be happy. They prefer the natural state. So music and other mood changing things like alcohol are problematic.
Great video ! Thanks for presenting this information is such an interesting way. Much love.
Now I want ancient Chinese Warhammer 40k :(
I mean, Warhammer Fantasy Battles has Cathay lands, that's essentially China. Thought these lands were not explored particularly well in fiction or rulebooks.
Grand Cathay confirmed for Total War: Warhammer 3
what would you call warhammer 40k in china???
i dunno, probably warhammer spring and autumn or some shit
There is a Mohist film called Battle of Wits. Wait is this state of Song, the one still ruled by Shang royalty (bequeathed by the Zhou dynasty)?
Yes. That's the one.
Love that movie, introduced Mohism to me :)
And they used agnatic seniority rather than primogeniture, which the Mojing seems to prefer in places.
If my memory serves me right, the title of that movie was "Mukgong: Battle of Wits" starring Andy Lau.
Pacifists who do more than just march around,protest,and pray. We could use these guys today!!!
Ture, they need power
But then if pacifist protester engage in war to stop a war, they will call them radicals / terrorist / mercenary, whatever negative name applicable just to vilify them.
I think the closest to that ideal would be ANC during Mandela early days fighting apartheid, as opposed to Gandhi pacifism.
@@dimasakbar7668 The government of the nation or country in question will do that regardless. So will their allies. Ultimately it is of little consequence so long as all objectives are achieved.
@Shy Cracker Possibly but so long as they have checks and balances in place. Along with a proper vetting process. That should help negate most risks.
I think Mozi would adopt music and art in our time. maybe even encourage it to expand love.
I think the most appropriate evaluation of Mozi is "limitations of the times". He did the best in his time, and the reason why he could not go further was simply because the civilization at that time was still very backward. He opposed music only because resources were limited at that time. If they were used to develop music, only the nobles would enjoy it, and the common people would starve to death due to the lack of these resources. He worshipped God, but in fact I don’t think Mozi really believed that the world was governed by gods. He just wanted people to fear the punishment of God and not do bad things. If there is a way to make people abide by the rules without gods, I think Mozi would be happy to use it.
Oy! Love your animation, which software are you using? Are you creating all the assets / animations yourself?
It looks so nice!
Rui created the characters & CJ did the animations and the rest.
@@CoolHistoryBros Must be a big load of work! Fantastic guys.
- Until Mohism was revived by another superheroic, vilified defender, who did good for the sake of it: Batman.
Wow
I really loved this video. Very educational and very interesting
Thank you
As a devout Christian, I find it incredible that I've never hard of these guys before.
yeah well they were all killed or silenced by the tyrant Qin Shi Huang (the "Fire Nation Attack," lol).
They were buried alive by the emperor!
I strongly believe it is time for their philosophy to rise again.
I tear up. That's so cool 😢
The ancient Chinese philosophies that survived were the ones that told peasants to shut up and take the injustices heaped upon them, so those philosophies were hand-picked by despots. It's to Mohism's credit that it wasn't "popular".
Mohism was close to developing a full philosophy of science, since they had an inner school of formal logic. Then.....the Fire Nation attacked.....
Mohism is dangerous, not to others but to the user, yet is the most powerful idealogy.
Unlike Confucianism and Taoism which are well kept by their students, Moism has fewer disciples. After the books burning. Many thoughts are gone. We don't know how much about actual Moist
Love your videos man :) you just earned a subscriber here!
I wished the first emperor of China hadn't burned all the books from the different schools of thought. Imagine what philosophy eastern Asia could have had if he hadn't done so. China, and other Asian countries that were influenced by China, might have been so different.
P.s. my comment is not meant to attack present China, but to show my pity that the wealth of knowledge China, and other Asian countries influenced by China, could've had was robbed by a tyrant.
It’s a hard one, without Qin Shi Huang there will be no unified China. Broken up the people suffered as Kingdoms waged war constantly.
It may also be the consequence of civilisation just like how the Library of Alexandria got burned, the collapse of Babylon, Rome, Ancient Greece etc. Knowledge seems to disappear once it hits a certain level of advancement.
Although we have more access to knowledge and information, our technology is the most fragile if our electronic servers are wiped out through EMP or electricity blackout, there is no way to access that information again.
@@CharonTFM What do you mean by "it's a hard one"?
In response to your first paragraph: I have no objection to Qin Shi Huang being the first emperor to unify China. I agree a broken China, like any broken country, would bring about chaos and war, no doubt.
To your second paragraph, I agree that some civilizations that succeed a previous one do, unfortunately, destroy their predecessor's history, monuments, and the likes.
I do not think Qin Shi Huang as a tyrant, China will still devide if there was no Qin Shi Huang.
@@idiot9450 Before arguing with you, I raise questions: What constitutes a country-is it the people, or is it the land, or is it both people and land that makes a country? Moreover, Is a country considered unified when it, along with its citizens, is under the rule of one regime? To put it simply, what makes a country and when is a country considered unified?
Lastly, what is a tyrant?
@@russelsteapot8991 too many question. hard to type on a phone 😁😁
The world will be a better place if this is being practice. Unfortunately human beings are self serving
Maybe east would develop similar to the west
Stupid Ideal of Righteousness? I'm about ready to read the one section of Mozi that I thought was worthless. Righteousness is also an ideal of Confucianism and Taoism, too. RIghteousness is universal, and if one nation can perpetually abate and repel the assault of another, that's probably one of the best ideas in military history.
Although, Mozi was an exceptional Genius, and probably among the top two or three thinkers to ever live, or who ever will.
Truth will always have difficulty finding sponsors. It's not practical for war, but practical for peace.
Where did you learn this story from? It’s so amazing and inspiring to know ppl were so dedicated to an ideal of universal love
They were like the hippy turned teorriost in ancient China love and peace
Just imagine if ancient China choose mohist as a state Philosophy. China could be like "US" of the ancient east asia. Actively intervening in foreign wars, and european wouldnt probably dare to meddle in southeast asia. 😆
More preferably the Tang dynasty (that became the United States of China before USA was a thing)
They actually were.
it seems "Warring States" era had the most innovation in terms of technology and philosophy...
Mozi would have been a young man when he met Lu Ban.
You deserve a like, just for that Fire nation joke!
Love rewatching this video but noticed on my 5+ rewatch of this with the 6:41 "Then their stupid idea of righteousness" I didn't noticed that at first but jeez. Caught me off guard with calling it stupid in a well made video lol
Larry, Curly, and their leader Mo.
The Mo-re you know.
this is good stuff.
2:20 mark. Do we have any fellow readers of "Ravages of the Time" here?
Glad to see another reader here
Would it be fair to compare Mohism to Kant's categorical imperative: you neecto be good just because?
These are awesome.
bought myself The Analects for Christmas. In Sun Yat-sen's 3 Principles of the People he mentions Confucius and Mengcius a lot in his 2nd Principle of the People!
Unbelievably based.
".... but then, everything changed, when the fire nation attacked..." had me spit my drink.
also, cant help but think, if everyone were basically mohist, or "hippies" the whole sense of "us vs them" and patriotism would die out, and we'd realize, just maybe, how stupid wars are... but that sounds too "communist", so i dont think itd sell too well...
Unrelated but that travelling non-block virtuous self-fulfilling destiny remind me of Gensou Suikoden RPG series
Very Kool episode
Hehehehehhe .... when the Fire Nation attacked. So funny.
I had never heard of the Mohists, this is fascinating they are like Christians.
you could make video on the kushan empire
mohist is the best philosophy in chinese history
outstanding thank you :)
Hi there. LOVED THIS. but could u perform an analysis on their doctrines? They are against music?!?
Mainly for the cost of it in his time.
Basically Imperial Fists (not specifically pacifists, but cultured siege engineer monastic group)?
Since the Mohists, unlike the Confucians, believed in "love without discrimination", that is, caring about everyone, not just one's superiors, this reminds me of Christianity.
Christianity? the one that says every non believer will go to hell? love without discrimination unless you are not christian.
@Shy Cracker i think you either don't understand christianity or mohism or both to make that claim.
christianity says there is only one true god and everything is already set by that god. but mohism says 非命, which means there is no destiny. people build their own fate. no "thanks god" that kind of thing.
john made the connection with "love without discrimination" which made some sense, but you said "Mohism is literally proto Christianity" which doesn't make sense at all.
@@rickr9435 The nature of Christianity haven fractured into several sects means that much of all these overarching generalizations might not fit. Like the whole ideal f "universal love" is present in all Christian sects but that is only because it is repeated several times in the New Testament.
The whole "everything is already set by God" isn't a Christian universal, Catholics don't really go extreme to either side and most Christians would believe in Permissive will of God, i.e. what is possible and perfect will of God which is what is ideal. The Christians that most strongly go for the "everything is already set by God" but almost every other sect disagrees with them, mainly because it is considered that one makes it to hell because they refuse God, of their own free will in almost all other Christian sects.
And as for "there is only one true god" I am pretty sure the Mohists were like just softer MonoTheists, Like only on lord of heaven but we can always acknowledge other people's gods somehow instead of going the Christian route of just calling everything else superstition or demons. However, nobody is saying Christiianity and Mohism have to match exactly, just that they are pretty close that with the right shift in language they could be mistaken for divergent sects of one another.
17:40 in Christianity, it's no different, nobody gets a heavenly reward by righteous acts. This is a far-too-common misrepresentation of Christianity where people are 'good for goodness sake' (you're supposed to be that way anyway) but it does not earn heavenly admission.
Andy Lau starred in a Movie about Mo Zi Ge Li !!!!!!
Imagine Mohists in the 30 years war in Europe.
Or during ww1. We would have used their help
I cracked up at the fire nation part 🤣😂
mohists - china's greatest philosophy school
Sounds like the followers of Surak.
(Star Trek lore, the Vulcan philosopher that conducted his warring people to logic and emotional control)
Cool channel!
4:56 literally made my day 🤣🤣
Hehehehehe
wOW mohist sounds like very antigovernment but prohumanity.
Mo Tzu was one of the great philosophers during the Warring States in ancient China.
A contemporary of Lao Tzu and Confucius, he advocated compassion and love, and was adamantly against all kinds of war. Somehow, he did not have many followers, and was unable to convince the rulers.
Mohism did not flourish mainly because most kings preferred Confucianism.
Had it prevailed, China would not be engaged in that many wars in its long history..
Pacifism and neutrality can only come from position of utter dominance just like how only winners can afford to be magnanimous. An individual can be what Mo Tzu preaches but a city, state or country will instantly be consumed. Confucianism advocated rigid patriarchy and obedience which is why rulers promoted it instead of a teaching that advocate pacifism during a warring period.
Mo is like our contemporary UN peacekeepers - lofty ideals and can do good work here and there but ultimately an exercise in futility and are only tolerated as long as the major powers aren't too inconvenienced.
@@stevens9625
Well said. I heard an echo..
I do wonder if Mohism could have risen like Chritianity and appealled primarily to the masses and army first, if it could have succeeded.
@@ikengaspirit3063
Indeed, it could, and there would have been much fewer wars..
@@stevens9625good reasons why Mohism didn’t succeed as a state philosophy. However it’s not too different from Christianity, which was extremely successful as state / culture ideology, so I wonder what the missing ingredient is? Christianity did develop pretty warlike states despite its pacifist origins, so Mohism could have developed similarly (maybe a “war is justified in a pre-emptive way sometimes” idea). Maybe it’s the evangelization and “our religion is the only truth on earth and only way into heaven” that Christianity had (leading to its promotion by people who wanted to spread their influence with people that want to be in the “in club”) that Mohism didn’t? What would a version of that look like for Mohism?
What is Small Talk? Can you do a video on that? I’ve searched The Hundred Schools of Thought, can’t find it.
Thanks.
0:42 Uncle Iroh, is that you?
I don't know, if anyone will agree with me. But I think they're kinda like Jedi.
0:27 didn't know that the people of Chu invented the first fire engine?
Total War Warring States would be a brilliant game.
Its a hard pick. Do I like Daoism or Mohism the most?
Both are really nice world views.
Daoism is more practical whereas Mohist seems more like an ideal to aspire to. In a (Daoist kind of ) way, if actual real practicing Mohist comes about, it might not be a good thing overall, it just mean that the times are so horrible and unacceptable that finally there exists a group of really brilliant and capable individuals who got pushed to point to setting out to right all the horrible wrongs even they know darn well they would likely get punish for it. The average human just do not make that kind of choices. The Spring and Autum + Warring State period were such time. I pray the current state of affairs in the world never descends to the state where the universe/god/fate have to bring these guys back ^_^
@@marcc1830 Well, from the zeitgeist perspective, I would personally say that it is the other way around. Mohism, being very similar to humanitarianism and social democracy, would be a major improvement of society (especially in the US). While Daoism is more of a thing to strive for in our every day lives.
Then again, I may have misunderstood your point.
@@torbjornlekberg7756 Just different way to look at things, and to be honest I wish I have it wrong and that you are right. Confucianism seems to have won out historically in China but the rulers themselves actually operates more or less on a combination of Daoist cross Legalist kind of way. In fact be it Han, Tang or even today promote Confucianism to the people so that they respect the social order while the leadership go about their own way that is closer to Sun Tzu and Machiavellian and is somewhat contained by the Confucian morals.
In a similar fashion, even in the modern democratic countries, while the citizens cherishes modern social values that is similar to Mohism but in practice fell short to varying degrees, because most to a varying degree follow the flow of what's easier for him/herself. All the while the governments themselves operate in a more shall we say primal manner just barely confined by the ideals they espouse.
@@marcc1830 I see your point now. Yes, it makes alot of sense.
@Trinidad and Tobagoball You never studied political philosophy, I see. Or learned much concerning things outside your borders.
Europe being communist? Only a USamerican would believe such a thing. Or rather be convinced by it despite lacking any real knowledge about the european continent. It is an odd mix of ignorance and arrogance.
Didn't know warhammer 40k was so old
Wait, what's that about Condemnation of Music?
Music was costly in that era of China.
Condemning music ? Why ? This videos open so many questions, I love it
They thought that it distracted the population from more important pursuits such as work and doing good. Just imagine what happens if a bunch of engineers started a cult. LoL!
@@CoolHistoryBros Sounds a bit like Plato's reason for his dislike of poetry lol
@雅典第一公民伯里克利 That is interesting.
1. the cost of time, resources, and attention. this was not just expensive concerts, but fancy architecture, clothing, cooking etc...
2. the psychological effect of pursuit of pleasure leads to indiscipline. contentment, comfort, and relishing the satisfaction of righteousness are acceptable.
3. the spirit world is full of spirits of all kinds all mixed up. heaven can let them into our world, or we can. if heaven lets them in on a mission, unbidden by man, they must be righteous (not necessarily friendly depending on how righteous you are). if you invite them in you don't know what you are going to get. music creates unpredictable mental states in which you might unwittingly let random spirits into our world.
@@CoolHistoryBros engineering start a cult, there must be logic, proof, and numbers involved 🤣🤣🤣
Mohism summarized: Love, Death and Robots
Judeo-christian and proto-marxist values originate from far Asia, so this doesn't surprise me.
It is interesting how Taoism is reclamated by anarchist, a more middle to upper class, ivory tower intellectual, thinking, they do by not doing.
All anarchist can sit down and talk about hierarchies all day, without doing nothing. A more rational and logic nerd is definitely a protomarxist school. Music and moaning are for the bourgeoisie. Also the trouble maker (dialectical) attitude of this complex and contradictory approach to conflict and war.
@@nicanornunez9787 Yes, and modern english translations of the main works are most often by jewish writers. Once again, not surprised :D
You know people can invent ideas independently right?
@@ikengaspirit3063 Yes, next to each other, for thousands of years, having war and trade, feudalism and "religion"....
""""independent invention""""", you may have a theory to back something like that one up? No?
wouldve been very interesting if they are exposed to heavy meal music.
Lol ancient warhammer 40k sounds awesome
I believe Mohists influenced Ninja of Japan.
Can you explain how?
Wtf you so savagexD
so mozi it the aristotle version of ancient china
not to be confused with Maoists, who are violent
That’s over several thousands years apart
@Trinidad and Tobagoball So according to your logic the conservatives have the same ideology as Hitler? I'll take that.
👊🏾😎👍🏼
Condeming music ? Wait ? For real ?
LMAO, then the fire nation came … 🤣🤣🤣
John snow
They almost sound like anarchists.
They're not anti-authoritarian because they accept the Will of Heaven as authority, they just prioritise Heavenly laws over Earthly rules and customs.
Warrior of lovvve ,,,,,,vaaaahhhh ,,,,,,highesr fly