I've been passing that mast for 50 years. When I worked in Manchester, I would pass it daily, and I always wondered what the microwave horns were for. I guessed it was some kind of relay function, but, assumed it was just for general microwave comms. Probably used by British Gas (they actually were licensed to build their own microwave link network). I also noted that one day the horns were no longer there, and that there were just minor antennae present. Thanks for the historical background 👍
@@RingwayManchesterHe was right though wasn’t he? You definitely ARE the leading mast debater on RUclips. No one is remotely in your class on this subject!
I have fond memories of working all around that area as an AA patrolman in the mid seventies before moving to the coast. It was like another planet up there during the winter and I remember it being built, especially the fact that it was split around Stotthall Farm. It was said that the high bridge further back towards Leeds used to have two dogs stationed at each end to stop sheep wandering across the bridge. Need to take a re-visit I think.
I think I recall the dogs had a wooden kennel each and were on a length of rope to stop them straying, I'd forgotten all about it till you mentioned it.
1st class video Lewis .....I can imagine the bureaucracy around these towers took so long in the 50s and 60s that technology over took the decisions made
We have a few similar towers like that here. Back during the cold war AT&T constructed and maintained them for all their long distance telephone microwave and also had UFH equipment for the USAF SAC comms link. Today the big horn antennas and wave guides are gone and the site and tower space leased out to wireless carriers, public service, commercial and GMRS 2-way radio systems.
As I've mentioned before, there's a hardened tower in rapid city south Dakota. We were visiting the area as it is near Mount Rushmore. Because I'm a radio head, I notice these things like such towers. I couldn't understand why they had built such a tower. Then, I watched one of your videos on the hardened towers and it all made sense. Just outside of rapid city is a USAF base, Ellsworth. It's a SAC base (or was) and B1B Lancers are stationed there as well air tankers for refueling. Ellsworth also the headquarters for the 44th strategic missile wing. That wing was decommissioned as pert of Reagans salt plan. However, there is an excellent interpretive center near wall and you can go to a launch command center an view the inner workings of a minuteman missile site. This all leads to the hardened towered. Ellsworth and the missile sites would all be on soviet nuclear strike lists. This is why that tower in rapid city was built in such away. There wasn't much on the tower for dishes or antennae. If you go to Google earth, you will locate the tower in the center of rapid city, on the top of a building. I can't remember if it was on city hall of a telecommunications building, but you will find it. Next time I go that way, I'll try and get information about it. I've decided get the long and lat so that you other radio heads may take a look at on Google earth. 44°04'47"N 103°13'49"W • 992 m. Not much to look at overhead but 3D offers a better look at it. Enjoy.
I believe that building was a hardened relay node for the AT&T Long Lines system, which also carried military communications. There's another hardened node in New York City.
One of my favorite Long Lines tower in the nation. You can tell that Rapid City has such a 60s infrastructure feel to it, love visiting. The array up on Dinosaur Park is also an amazing outlook over the city. The Andrew W. Bogue Federal Building is nearby and also fits the same concrete bill as the Long Lines tower. I grew up in Watertown, the horns on our Long Lines tower were removed last summer unfortunately. I love seeing the Long Lines tower when coming into Sioux City, Iowa from I-29 as well.
Really interesting video. I hadn't heard of "backbone" before but it's importance cannot be understated. This cold war infrastructure stuff is fascinating to watch, keep up the good work!
I had heard of it before when a Manchester based ISP volunteered that they were on the backbone. However, he may have been referring to a high speed data link.
Great site. Worked as engineer in mobile phones in Manchester since 1996, so know it very well. The land owner will be making good money. Every tech on it. I know tinshill in leeds and many big sites. My current office is Emley Moor actually. Views from top are amazing. There is a little device for showing how much it sways in the wind.
Backbone seems very similar in technology to the AT&T Long Lines system in the US. Used as a point to point microwave relay system for long distance telephone calls, along with military communications. There are still towers all over the US, including one in Joplin, Missouri that has been repurposed as a cell phone tower. There were hardened nodes at certain points around the country, New York City has one and I think Rapid City, SD does as well.
Lowther Hill is near me by about 3-4 miles. It is home to GB3LA. Also I have been in the Emley Moor transmitter station and tower. Nice place to visit if you can get in.
Every time I pass that tower going to/from Manchester, I am glad it's not the one I need to climb. That thing is a beast, height is fine but the face width at the lower panels is extreme and it's never a nice day there either!
Hah! Great minds, etc. Two other good reads are "Beneath The City Streets" (some good investigative work, some guesswork!) and "Attack Warning Red" (history of the ROC, only peripherally related to this video)
Great video ,i love these microwave systems .If you ever run out of ideas you could do one on the American long lines system ,lots of info and footage for that online.
it does indeed come across as something not only unusual but a sort of hidden story the likes of Tom Scott (RUclipsr, things you might not know) would cover. this is so interesting, thanks sm for covering this! my gutt told me something's up with it as well as this tower :p :) cool
I live in Whitefield, Manchester and was told my whole life (I'm 37) it was called winter hill and the tower was for tv signals.. my life has been a lieeeeeee 😭😭
I can see this tower from my house in Swinton. Looking at it right now. I have always wanted to go and have a look at it but have still never got myself a vehicle that can handle the motorway. I only have a 125 motorcycle. I love seeing things from my home turf on RUclips
From swinton, avoiding the m60/62, just got to heaton park, then middleton, oldham, then once your at oldham, ripponden is signposted, its basically a62/a672 from the town centre and you will ride straight to it. Probably a 45 min ride or so. You sure its not Winter hill at bolton you can see? as I think theres at least 2 hills between swinton and there, the one with oldham on, and a bigger one as you come out of oldham at grains bar, before the final hill that you go sort of over before you get to the m62 and the mast.
@@sneekeruk thanks for the tutorial information. I'll screenshot this. Yes I am sure I can see windy Hill from my house since I am on a strange hill above everyone else. Also I have driven to winter Hill Tower on my motorbike with a passenger on the back. Winter Hill tower is massive!
Living in the area I am finding your videos really interesting. You forgot the link for the Heaton Park transmitter video in the description - think I've found it though. Thanks.
I enjoyed watching this and comparing it to the American terrestrial microwave (“long lines”) network, built by AT&T. One question: were the independent television broadcasters (Rediffusion, THAMES, and so forth) able to take advantage of this network, or would they have fashioned their own backhaul network?
Great knowing radio history.some join hobbies at year zero not knowing previous achievements,amateur or not. Anything sneaky beaky in the Midlands?? 73!!
Nice. Going to visit a some point in the near future on a nice clear blue day. It is only 15 mins from me. My Mrs likes nice views and I am an aircraft nut, I want to test the range on my mobile ADS-B receiving station (Kinetic SBS-1 receiving box and laptop) to see how far I can pick up aircraft traffic. So we can sit there, she enjoying the views and me testing my system with a mobile magmount aerial specifically for ADS-B signals. I am limited to line of sight range, even with a 20 ft mast with a fixed aerial,especially to the South/South-East because of local geography of surrounding hills.
On saddleworth moor the M62 splits around a farm house on 2 different levels.The ground not being strong enough to take the weight,the farm has the nickname the house on the prairie
@@fedup08 i was led to believe it was the owner of the farm that refused to sell at the time and there was quite an oh ar about it, hence the motorway been diverted around it.
@@terrordisco2944 Yes. I find it incredible we were using 6GHz in the 1950s. As far as I can recall from a BT / GPO history web site, the backbone network was only used very occasionally for additional telephone calls capacity and testing and really was a backup / emergency system only.
@@RingwayManchester No, I wasn't to be honest. I just didn't pay enough attention in the beginning of your narration where, you briefly describe the tower's purpose. Perhaps, a title such as, 'nuclear attack warning tower' would have been more appropriate? Any case, my apologies for my lack of attention. 😉
@@MattBrunton1965 i think it remained because it was ground zero, i think, now i could be wrong but things at ground zero survive as the blast radiates down & outward. Sure i heard that explained when we did it at school.
@@cbrboy76 it's amazing it withstood the blast, I was surprised to see on Wikipedia that it was only 600m below where the bomb detonated. as @SarkyBugger mentioned above, lattice towers are very resilient to blast. And as Lewis shows in the video, a lot of the other Backbone towers are simple concrete cylinders. I would guess that by the time of their building the US (and indeed the UK) had blown up enough bombs to test towers and masts like these.
KE0DNQ ,here--- I learned how to work the Satellites,using my Ham Radio--- I'm helping to design an Analog Back-haul Communications System in the Event of an Emergency....My other "current" project is using the SCA Sub-carrier of KFUY to enhance the Code Red System in Colorado USA
I've been passing that mast for 50 years. When I worked in Manchester, I would pass it daily, and I always wondered what the microwave horns were for. I guessed it was some kind of relay function, but, assumed it was just for general microwave comms. Probably used by British Gas (they actually were licensed to build their own microwave link network). I also noted that one day the horns were no longer there, and that there were just minor antennae present. Thanks for the historical background 👍
Auto Shenanigans gave this video a shout out, don't blame him.
I think the words he used were mast and debater 😂
@@RingwayManchester Classic Johnny Pisshands 😁
@@RingwayManchesterHe was right though wasn’t he? You definitely ARE the leading mast debater on RUclips. No one is remotely in your class on this subject!
I have fond memories of working all around that area as an AA patrolman in the mid seventies before moving to the coast. It was like another planet up there during the winter and I remember it being built, especially the fact that it was split around Stotthall Farm. It was said that the high bridge further back towards Leeds used to have two dogs stationed at each end to stop sheep wandering across the bridge. Need to take a re-visit I think.
I think I recall the dogs had a wooden kennel each and were on a length of rope to stop them straying, I'd forgotten all about it till you mentioned it.
1st class video Lewis .....I can imagine the bureaucracy around these towers took so long in the 50s and 60s that technology over took the decisions made
Just a shame the narration makes the video sound like a school project.
Thankyou Lewis , great research and keep them coming.
We have a few similar towers like that here. Back during the cold war AT&T constructed and maintained them for all their long distance telephone microwave and also had UFH equipment for the USAF SAC comms link.
Today the big horn antennas and wave guides are gone and the site and tower space leased out to wireless carriers, public service, commercial and GMRS 2-way radio systems.
Not all gone, there's one near me that still has 6 or so of the huge bright red horn antennas on it.
As I've mentioned before, there's a hardened tower in rapid city south Dakota. We were visiting the area as it is near Mount Rushmore. Because I'm a radio head, I notice these things like such towers. I couldn't understand why they had built such a tower. Then, I watched one of your videos on the hardened towers and it all made sense. Just outside of rapid city is a USAF base, Ellsworth. It's a SAC base (or was) and B1B Lancers are stationed there as well air tankers for refueling. Ellsworth also the headquarters for the 44th strategic missile wing. That wing was decommissioned as pert of Reagans salt plan. However, there is an excellent interpretive center near wall and you can go to a launch command center an view the inner workings of a minuteman missile site. This all leads to the hardened towered. Ellsworth and the missile sites would all be on soviet nuclear strike lists. This is why that tower in rapid city was built in such away. There wasn't much on the tower for dishes or antennae. If you go to Google earth, you will locate the tower in the center of rapid city, on the top of a building. I can't remember if it was on city hall of a telecommunications building, but you will find it. Next time I go that way, I'll try and get information about it.
I've decided get the long and lat so that you other radio heads may take a look at on Google earth.
44°04'47"N 103°13'49"W • 992 m. Not much to look at overhead but 3D offers a better look at it. Enjoy.
I believe that building was a hardened relay node for the AT&T Long Lines system, which also carried military communications. There's another hardened node in New York City.
@@JosiahGould interesting. I was wondering what was in that building.
One of my favorite Long Lines tower in the nation. You can tell that Rapid City has such a 60s infrastructure feel to it, love visiting. The array up on Dinosaur Park is also an amazing outlook over the city.
The Andrew W. Bogue Federal Building is nearby and also fits the same concrete bill as the Long Lines tower. I grew up in Watertown, the horns on our Long Lines tower were removed last summer unfortunately. I love seeing the Long Lines tower when coming into Sioux City, Iowa from I-29 as well.
Really interesting video. I hadn't heard of "backbone" before but it's importance cannot be understated. This cold war infrastructure stuff is fascinating to watch, keep up the good work!
I had heard of it before when a Manchester based ISP volunteered that they were on the backbone.
However, he may have been referring to a high speed data link.
Yet another informative video Lewis, keep up the good work
Regards.
Dave.
Great site. Worked as engineer in mobile phones in Manchester since 1996, so know it very well. The land owner will be making good money. Every tech on it. I know tinshill in leeds and many big sites. My current office is Emley Moor actually. Views from top are amazing. There is a little device for showing how much it sways in the wind.
Your history videos are really interesting, thanks for the info!
Great Video Earthling
Bless Up
don’t know what i watched to be recommended this but i’m not disappointed
Backbone seems very similar in technology to the AT&T Long Lines system in the US. Used as a point to point microwave relay system for long distance telephone calls, along with military communications. There are still towers all over the US, including one in Joplin, Missouri that has been repurposed as a cell phone tower. There were hardened nodes at certain points around the country, New York City has one and I think Rapid City, SD does as well.
Exactly what I was thinking as I watched this.
Lowther Hill is near me by about 3-4 miles. It is home to GB3LA. Also I have been in the Emley Moor transmitter station and tower. Nice place to visit if you can get in.
Watch this space on emley
A landmark from my childhood, travelling from Ripponden to Manchester over the moors road, BEFORE the M62 was built ;-)
One of the local landmarks. I did the PW VHF contest from there a few years back.
Every time I pass that tower going to/from Manchester, I am glad it's not the one I need to climb. That thing is a beast, height is fine but the face width at the lower panels is extreme and it's never a nice day there either!
Keep this stuff coming...it speaks to so much in recent history. There is a good book in here somewhere
Thank you Liam!
Liam, a good start is "War Plan UK" but you'll probably need to visit a library, it's become difficult to get hold of.
@@MattBrunton1965 check my most community post on here
Hah! Great minds, etc. Two other good reads are "Beneath The City Streets" (some good investigative work, some guesswork!) and "Attack Warning Red" (history of the ROC, only peripherally related to this video)
Still in Yorkshire that's what matters most.
All the best people are from Yorkshire
Great video ,i love these microwave systems .If you ever run out of ideas you could do one on the American long lines system ,lots of info and footage for that online.
I was going to say it sounds a lot like the old AT&T Long Lines system.
Even though I'm in the States I still find these informative and enjoyable
Canada for me - but same!
I'm in States too, lot of great info on his channel.
im from germany, we have some strange military towers to
Walked past the tower on the way to Blackstone Edge over the foot bridge. Quite an impressive tower!
Thanks Lewis
I went over the M62 yesterday all the way - and didn't notice this - thanks interesting
it does indeed come across as something not only unusual but a sort of hidden story the likes of Tom Scott (RUclipsr, things you might not know) would cover. this is so interesting, thanks sm for covering this! my gutt told me something's up with it as well as this tower :p :) cool
It looks like a Long Lines tower. They were used for the same thing.
I live in Whitefield, Manchester and was told my whole life (I'm 37) it was called winter hill and the tower was for tv signals.. my life has been a lieeeeeee 😭😭
There's a winter hill and a windy hill. The winter hill tower is taller and thinner iirc
They’re different places, oh, and sorry you live in Whitefield …
@@markhowards420 ahh thanks mate
@@andyxox4168 what's wrong with Whitefield
@@l30njam3s lots but as you’ve not lived anywhere else you have no terms of reference 😂😂😂
What's the music from 05:15 onwards ? It sounds relaxing and the music detecting app on my phone couldn't recognise it.
I can see this tower from my house in Swinton. Looking at it right now. I have always wanted to go and have a look at it but have still never got myself a vehicle that can handle the motorway. I only have a 125 motorcycle.
I love seeing things from my home turf on RUclips
Go via A roads instead! :-))
From swinton, avoiding the m60/62, just got to heaton park, then middleton, oldham, then once your at oldham, ripponden is signposted, its basically a62/a672 from the town centre and you will ride straight to it. Probably a 45 min ride or so. You sure its not Winter hill at bolton you can see? as I think theres at least 2 hills between swinton and there, the one with oldham on, and a bigger one as you come out of oldham at grains bar, before the final hill that you go sort of over before you get to the m62 and the mast.
@@sneekeruk thanks for the tutorial information. I'll screenshot this. Yes I am sure I can see windy Hill from my house since I am on a strange hill above everyone else. Also I have driven to winter Hill Tower on my motorbike with a passenger on the back. Winter Hill tower is massive!
Not far from my location, there used to be an extension...consisting of horn antennas, we used to nickname the structure, "The Giraffe"
A stroke of genius calling the place Windy Hill..
Another very informative video Lewis.👍
Most excellent video!
The tower is very similar in style to Tacolneston in Norfolk.
Living in the area I am finding your videos really interesting. You forgot the link for the Heaton Park transmitter video in the description - think I've found it though. Thanks.
Ive been to Charwelton Tower near Daventry quite a few times along with Stokenchurch and Birmingham towers.
Marc In Bletchley G6XEG
I enjoyed watching this and comparing it to the American terrestrial microwave (“long lines”) network, built by AT&T.
One question: were the independent television broadcasters (Rediffusion, THAMES, and so forth) able to take advantage of this network, or would they have fashioned their own backhaul network?
Another interesting video, thanks.
There's a tower like that over by upper Worcestershireton village.
You should do one of the AT&T Microwave Radio Relay networks spread across the US for orders. There are many spread out.
Tracing New York's Secret Cold War Radio System - Long Lines
ruclips.net/video/0hBiC4InNG0/видео.html
Wow what are the odds, I flew past this recently and took video! A good navigation point from the air.
New Zealand has a bunch of these towers but most are not used for microwave links anymore.
Where are the promised links to the Heaton Park transmitter video?
Great knowing radio history.some join hobbies at year zero not knowing previous achievements,amateur or not.
Anything sneaky beaky in the Midlands?? 73!!
Would make a great Radio ham tower
I'd love to go up the inside of Heaton Park Tower.
Fascinating social history.
Have climbed this tower many times for the cellular network 😅
Rather you than me 🤣
Maybe it’s original use is being “re-visited” with current events …..
Great video Lewis
given the speed with which our goverment works it should be ready to use around 2040, and be obsolete, assuming we survive that long
@@andreww2098 very true
that looks lika a nice old steeltower
Nice Video !
We always called it the GPO tower.
Looks a great one to stick an amateur radio repeater on.
73 M7TUD
is that near Littleborough on Saddleworth road
The outtro's are always scary
Good content tho
Why?
Nice. Going to visit a some point in the near future on a nice clear blue day. It is only 15 mins from me. My Mrs likes nice views and I am an aircraft nut, I want to test the range on my mobile ADS-B receiving station (Kinetic SBS-1 receiving box and laptop) to see how far I can pick up aircraft traffic. So we can sit there, she enjoying the views and me testing my system with a mobile magmount aerial specifically for ADS-B signals. I am limited to line of sight range, even with a 20 ft mast with a fixed aerial,especially to the South/South-East because of local geography of surrounding hills.
Where's teh link to the Heaton tower video?
is possible to climb this, looks nice for Lattice Climbing
who is looking after this now is it Arqiva ?
More than likely.
It os
It's a BT site
0:34 “farm that splits the road into two”. Um, what? Please tell us more.
On saddleworth moor the M62 splits around a farm house on 2 different levels.The ground not being strong enough to take the weight,the farm has the nickname the house on the prairie
@@fedup08 i was led to believe it was the owner of the farm that refused to sell at the time and there was quite an oh ar about it, hence the motorway been diverted around it.
AT 3.34 did anyone else notice 2 things flying away from the mast 🤔
cool
Could you imagine having to climb that. No thanks
my old dxing site
Backbone for what? Radio relay, phones, something else?
Analogue PSTN (plain old telephones) and also backhaul for the public television networks
@@circattle Interesting. So they multiplexed a sh*t-ton of concurrent audio lines over a single beam with, um, some transistor magic?
@@terrordisco2944 Yes. I find it incredible we were using 6GHz in the 1950s. As far as I can recall from a BT / GPO history web site, the backbone network was only used very occasionally for additional telephone calls capacity and testing and really was a backup / emergency system only.
👍
Interesting topic but a misleading title!
What all that has to do with " nuclear " ? 🤔
You’re joking aren’t you??
@@RingwayManchester
No, I wasn't to be honest.
I just didn't pay enough attention in the beginning of your narration where, you briefly describe the tower's purpose.
Perhaps, a title such as, 'nuclear attack warning tower' would have been more appropriate?
Any case, my apologies for my lack of attention. 😉
Well it wasn’t a nuclear attack warning tower either so I think we’ll stick with the current title. 😉
Is it not winter hill rather than windy hill
No it’s windy hill…
Nah mate, Winter Hills in Bolton. Windy Hill in Rochdale.
..Wrong … 🦉
Them nukes had dropped those towers would not last 5 minutes sorry for that
I think you'd be surprised. The Gembaku Dome still stands in Hiroshima, and it was virtually at Ground Zero.
You don't think they could triangulate if one got taken out. These towers were all over the place during the cold war.
Lattice towers are remarkably resilient, and quick to repair / replace. You need a pretty much direct hit to take one out.
@@MattBrunton1965 i think it remained because it was ground zero, i think, now i could be wrong but things at ground zero survive as the blast radiates down & outward. Sure i heard that explained when we did it at school.
@@cbrboy76 it's amazing it withstood the blast, I was surprised to see on Wikipedia that it was only 600m below where the bomb detonated. as @SarkyBugger mentioned above, lattice towers are very resilient to blast. And as Lewis shows in the video, a lot of the other Backbone towers are simple concrete cylinders. I would guess that by the time of their building the US (and indeed the UK) had blown up enough bombs to test towers and masts like these.
KE0DNQ ,here--- I learned how to work the Satellites,using my Ham Radio--- I'm helping to design an Analog Back-haul Communications System in the Event of an Emergency....My other "current" project is using the SCA Sub-carrier of KFUY to enhance the Code Red System in Colorado USA
👍