I understand where your criticisms come from and I do agree with your opinion on the lip sync and limited movement, however considering how awful the anime industry is (tight deadlines, low pay for animators, death by overwork etc.), I think it's understandable why anime takes shortcuts.
Im not saying it's not understandable, my criticism is for the industry in general, mostly the higherups, i feel sorry for the animators, being overworked and underpaid, im not criticizing them at all, all things considered they do a pretty good job
I love anime tbh, the thing about the mouth movement -> I never noticed the difference cause I dont look at the mouth I find the very expressiv faces amazing - this is what matters to me and its not overstimulating like real shows, in real shows you gotta always pay attention to the small eye or eyebrow movement cause its may be intentional. But with cartoons its the worst but also best of both worlds in my opinion, I cant really describe why tho, its like a feeling. I love cartoon just as much as I love anime. I may gotta add im autistic and im very good at reading face expressions but its very overstimulation having to read them all the time, with anime its just simple I understand it quickly and find them even funny just like you said. This is pretty much just a mess xD but I wanted to throw my cent in
I mean for me is more of one of those things that i didn't notice but I know something was wrong, for example this scene at 1:22, such an emotional scene but the way the mouth moves just feels odd, specially when they r screaming like that, its kinda hard to not notice it for me even if subconsciously, and yeah cartoons really are the best of 2 worlds for me too, thats one of the reason why avatar the last airbender is so good, its the best of 3 worlds XD And yeah, i suspect im on the spectrum too but i dont have much of a problem with facial expressions, my problem is mostly in irl i tend to not notice them or i overthink, but in animation i notice it subconsciously and makes me relate less to the characters
Yeah, the lip movement thing is something that bothers me too, but I mainly just don't pay attention if something else is happening. I think the voice acting is intentionally exaggerated since it's more entertaining than a more realistic reaction, but it can get super annoying. Luckily, like you mentioned, there are some shows that don't do it. And honestly, I do generally like the voice acting more in Sub than dub, but both can be done well (good direction and script) or poorly (bad direction or script). Also yeah, I wish less slop was animated and the actual good shows getting more love and care into them instead of rushing them out. This is more of an industry thing so it will be hard on the individual level, but change could be possible one day. And I get your point with the complex designs...It's shallow but I don't mind that they're so detailed and pretty to look at even if the animation is meh. But in some case, simple would be better. And I don't mind expressions in anime. I kinda don't get the argument they're any weirder than cartoon expressions. Both can be pushed to the extreme for interesting affects, but I do find the overused ones extremely annoying. My favorite kind of expressions in anime are like really subtle ones or just ones that perfectly represent the emotion a character feels (like a strained grin or they're balling their eyes out). Good video. I suprisingly didn't disagree with ya much. Though, tbh, I prefer manga more but Anime is still cool when done well.
Thanks for the comment! Ands yeah, a reason i liked chainsaw man was cause of the realism in the voice acting and it even has some lip sync in there, i only notice it later but at 2:14 in the video makima has some lipsync, from what i saw it's not in every scene but i think it really adds to it, shes a seductive character so if she was just flapping her mouth it wouldnt have the same effect, and also, from what i remember, the director of chainsaw man wanted to make it realistic and asked the voice actors to bring that realism in the voice acting, also the animation is pretty good ngl. And yeah, there are so many anime coming out and more are repetitive trash, every freaking isekai is the same but just with the twist but the storyline doesnt change, u would think an anime about a dude reencarnating as a vending machine is funny but no, its the same boring sht all over again, ythe whole first episode just dedicated to him learning his stats, like, who cares. And about the expressions, i think the difference is that in cartoons when they exagerated there's still that 3d aspect, the anime it's like the face gets simplified if u know what i mean, but yeah i dont dislike it either, i freaking love anya from spy x family, shes cute and funny af but i dont like it everywhere, specially when its overused to the point of annoyance. And yeah, again thanks for the comment, i really like reading and responding to these :)
@@sweettea666 yeah, I haven't watched all of the CSM Anime but I do remember find the animation just stunning to look at, and it did feel like a movie. And yes, I think actual lip movement can be used for great affect like Makima. In my opinion, if they just added a bit more lip movements between the two (like a o shape or a e shape, then I think it could sell the affect without it being so precise). Yeah, there's only been a few of the Isekai I watched that actually surprised me writing wise (Isekai Ojjsan, Isekai Shikkaku), but the rest have been not good at all....even when I try a more wacky one, it just doesn't hit the same. I just think they should lower the output and animators wouldn't be that stress and shows would get better treatment, but yeah...unlikely right now though. Huh, I never thought about the 3D aspect. The only anime I think about literally when you mention it is like FLCL with the shot of mamimi being shocked or a few CGI shows that can pull the exaggerated anime look. But I get it. I said some shows overuse the popular ones, but I have seen some expressions not used before and they work. So it just depends on the creativity for if they wanna push the original expression from the manga or make it's own. I also saw another moment mentioning maybe Anime shouldn't rely on Manga too much, and I would say half agree. I think if the manga's story is good enough, it should just be replicated to the anime unless there was a major error in the original the anime staff wanna fix or change for cohesiveness. But with animation? Yeah, as long as it retains the original spirit of the art and scene, I like people going ham. Like extra good animation or super stylized can help sell the original scene better and it benefits the anime for it. But that's just me. And np, your video doesn't seem like other critique videos that end up become boring hate videos and bad faith arguments, so yeah. And tbh, I also get the feeling anime is strange sometimes but the good elements of it outweigh the more meh elements (the bad elements I will always call out on tho).
@@Thefoop Yeah, there's a video on youtube called "Why does anime lip sync look like that" maybe i should link it in the description, but basically, one of the reasons they do it like that is cause of the way japanese talk, they don't open their mouths a lot and it makes sense but at the same time it feels alienating, adding just some other mouth shapes it would add so much but it also requires more work and most anime dont bother. Yeah i watched a bit of the Isekai Ojjsan but didnt finish and dont remember much of it but my problem with a lot of anime in terms of storytelling is the pacing and like.. other things that i cant exactly point out, but the story always seems like it goes nowhere if u know what i mean, im doing a video about it but im more focused on the overly exposition part of anime and thats more about pacing and how the story is told instead of the story itself. And yeah, i feel bad for the overworked animators, i would much rather they were properly paid and not overworked while having fewer but better quality anime, another thing i found out recently is that they work on the anime while it's coming out so they r working on ep 5 after ep 1 came out (just an example) and thats crazy to me, if some problem happens they have barely any time to solve it but yeah greed amirite. And yeah i looked up mamimi and yeah those r the kinds of expressions i mean, at 2:30 the spongebob expression is exaggerated but it still has that 3d feel so i think thats mostly the difference. And about the manga thing, i mean story wise i dont think they should change it (lots of anime still deviate from thew manga unfortunately tho) but for example internal monologuing, i hate it in animation, its fine in manga but internal monologuing in animation is annoying af and i think they should cut it out and replace it either by dialogue or take it out all together since most internal monologuing is just describing things that u can already see, but yeah thats story wise, and for animation i think it should do the best to tell the story, not necessarily reuse shots from the manga. And yeah, thanks XD tbh i havent seen many videos criticizing anime, specially not the stuff i talked about so yeah, thanks again for the long comment XD
You hit one of the big ones on the head for me in this. A lot of manga relies heavily on scenes where dialogue and sitting still is a thing because it's a static medium, where words on paper can convey a lot of information in a small space and having a scene where you can see a lot of the character's body language, posture, or facial expression is important because you can't convey tone with text very well. Mangaka who excel at telling stories without much dialogue and who focus on either action or scenery to tell the story are relatively rare because of this, because the medium provides more hurdles and challenges to this form of storytelling. I think this is also why so many manga that translate well to anime tend to focus on fights and action scenes, because these make the most use of the benefits of animation. You can ignore the simplified mouth movements and static conversation scenes a lot easier when the fight choreography and camera angles are peak. Meanwhile if your show mostly hinges on talking, taking shortcuts with the parts of the person that matter most (anime really focuses on the eyes over the mouth, which I think is part of its charm normally but turns into one of its weaknesses in this case) feels jarring and takes you out of it. I think part of this whole thing comes from just how many anime start as manga instead of being animations first. I say this because a lot of my problems with superhero animations in the West also translate over into what I find awkward in anime; a lot of the goofy costumes exist because they were ways of making characters stand out based on the medium used at the time they were made even if they look weird or stupid outside of their element and a lot of the time you just get these stoic-faced characters talking to each other in a room without much expression being gained because of the comic writers the story was based on using exposition where a show could have given you this information with a different scene and less talking. The thing with these is that a lot of them conceal or hide the eyes while showing the mouth, which makes mouth animations generally better despite the body language often feeling rigid when they're not fighting or doing acrobatics. TLDR I think both anime and western action animations would do better if they stopped copying their paper counterparts' pacing and tricks based on the limitations of their respective media formats and started making originals or adaptations that focused on what animation does better than static media.
Oh damn thank u for taking a time to make that comment! And yeah, comics/manga and animation are 2 completely different mediums, I haven't watched much superhero animation (and haven't read any superhero comics tbh), only watched spectacular spiderman, invincible (season 1), and the harley queen show just from the top of my head, and I mean I think the costumes can work if done right, for example the live action movies do a good job at that imo, but for superheros there's also the problem of them having very realistic proportions and having more detail than the average cartoon so there's also that, it's harder to animate. Insatiable and the harley quinn show have very rigid movements also probably cause of the lack of squash and stretch cause they wanna make it look more realistic, idk im just guessing here. Anime fight scenes tho some of them are freaking amazing i can't complain about that but for me having a connection with the characters is more important and i find it difficult in anime. The thing u said about the eyes is also pretty interesting, i guess its also a cultural thing but yeah, anime eyes tend to be very detailed and manga and anime tends to focus a lot on them. For western cartoons they focus a lot on the lipsync but i havent particularly notice the eyes concealment thing but yeah. Also im working on a video about the storytelling in anime and how it breaks the "show don't tell rule" and nobody seems to care, but yeah a reason for that is cause it's adapted from manga and in manga that works but in animation it's different so yeah just wanted to mention that cause u talked about how the exposition doesn't translate well from manga to anime (would need to watch more superhero shows to talk about those tho :( but yeah that's smtg i thought before with the ones i watched But yeah thanks again for the comment, i really like reading these long comments, really make me feel like people care about the video :)
when i started watching i anime i only watched subbed but lately ive been getting lazy and tbh some dubs are pretty good, the mha one for example it has some pretty funny parts that wouldn't be as funny sub cause i would only read the joke
It's almost like anime was made by people from a historically secluded island, and not by people from Europe and its former colonies. It's almost like people watch anime *because* it provides insight into a culture the world didn't know about until fairly recently. It's almost like the word "alien" literally means "foreign".
nah bruh i didn't think alice in borderland or squid game were alien, i didnt think most of the few manga i read were alien so thats not it, i know it's a cultural thing but i think i have the right to not like some choices that that culture makes in regards to animation, its a matter of personal taste
I understand where your criticisms come from and I do agree with your opinion on the lip sync and limited movement, however considering how awful the anime industry is (tight deadlines, low pay for animators, death by overwork etc.), I think it's understandable why anime takes shortcuts.
Im not saying it's not understandable, my criticism is for the industry in general, mostly the higherups, i feel sorry for the animators, being overworked and underpaid, im not criticizing them at all, all things considered they do a pretty good job
@@sweettea666 Looks like I misunderstood, but I'm glad we are on the same page.
I love anime tbh, the thing about the mouth movement -> I never noticed the difference cause I dont look at the mouth
I find the very expressiv faces amazing - this is what matters to me and its not overstimulating like real shows, in real shows you gotta always pay attention to the small eye or eyebrow movement cause its may be intentional. But with cartoons its the worst but also best of both worlds in my opinion, I cant really describe why tho, its like a feeling. I love cartoon just as much as I love anime.
I may gotta add im autistic and im very good at reading face expressions but its very overstimulation having to read them all the time, with anime its just simple I understand it quickly and find them even funny just like you said.
This is pretty much just a mess xD but I wanted to throw my cent in
I mean for me is more of one of those things that i didn't notice but I know something was wrong, for example this scene at 1:22, such an emotional scene but the way the mouth moves just feels odd, specially when they r screaming like that, its kinda hard to not notice it for me even if subconsciously, and yeah cartoons really are the best of 2 worlds for me too, thats one of the reason why avatar the last airbender is so good, its the best of 3 worlds XD And yeah, i suspect im on the spectrum too but i dont have much of a problem with facial expressions, my problem is mostly in irl i tend to not notice them or i overthink, but in animation i notice it subconsciously and makes me relate less to the characters
Yeah, the lip movement thing is something that bothers me too, but I mainly just don't pay attention if something else is happening. I think the voice acting is intentionally exaggerated since it's more entertaining than a more realistic reaction, but it can get super annoying. Luckily, like you mentioned, there are some shows that don't do it. And honestly, I do generally like the voice acting more in Sub than dub, but both can be done well (good direction and script) or poorly (bad direction or script). Also yeah, I wish less slop was animated and the actual good shows getting more love and care into them instead of rushing them out. This is more of an industry thing so it will be hard on the individual level, but change could be possible one day. And I get your point with the complex designs...It's shallow but I don't mind that they're so detailed and pretty to look at even if the animation is meh. But in some case, simple would be better. And I don't mind expressions in anime. I kinda don't get the argument they're any weirder than cartoon expressions. Both can be pushed to the extreme for interesting affects, but I do find the overused ones extremely annoying. My favorite kind of expressions in anime are like really subtle ones or just ones that perfectly represent the emotion a character feels (like a strained grin or they're balling their eyes out). Good video. I suprisingly didn't disagree with ya much. Though, tbh, I prefer manga more but Anime is still cool when done well.
Thanks for the comment! Ands yeah, a reason i liked chainsaw man was cause of the realism in the voice acting and it even has some lip sync in there, i only notice it later but at 2:14 in the video makima has some lipsync, from what i saw it's not in every scene but i think it really adds to it, shes a seductive character so if she was just flapping her mouth it wouldnt have the same effect, and also, from what i remember, the director of chainsaw man wanted to make it realistic and asked the voice actors to bring that realism in the voice acting, also the animation is pretty good ngl. And yeah, there are so many anime coming out and more are repetitive trash, every freaking isekai is the same but just with the twist but the storyline doesnt change, u would think an anime about a dude reencarnating as a vending machine is funny but no, its the same boring sht all over again, ythe whole first episode just dedicated to him learning his stats, like, who cares. And about the expressions, i think the difference is that in cartoons when they exagerated there's still that 3d aspect, the anime it's like the face gets simplified if u know what i mean, but yeah i dont dislike it either, i freaking love anya from spy x family, shes cute and funny af but i dont like it everywhere, specially when its overused to the point of annoyance. And yeah, again thanks for the comment, i really like reading and responding to these :)
@@sweettea666 yeah, I haven't watched all of the CSM Anime but I do remember find the animation just stunning to look at, and it did feel like a movie. And yes, I think actual lip movement can be used for great affect like Makima. In my opinion, if they just added a bit more lip movements between the two (like a o shape or a e shape, then I think it could sell the affect without it being so precise). Yeah, there's only been a few of the Isekai I watched that actually surprised me writing wise (Isekai Ojjsan, Isekai Shikkaku), but the rest have been not good at all....even when I try a more wacky one, it just doesn't hit the same. I just think they should lower the output and animators wouldn't be that stress and shows would get better treatment, but yeah...unlikely right now though. Huh, I never thought about the 3D aspect. The only anime I think about literally when you mention it is like FLCL with the shot of mamimi being shocked or a few CGI shows that can pull the exaggerated anime look. But I get it. I said some shows overuse the popular ones, but I have seen some expressions not used before and they work. So it just depends on the creativity for if they wanna push the original expression from the manga or make it's own. I also saw another moment mentioning maybe Anime shouldn't rely on Manga too much, and I would say half agree. I think if the manga's story is good enough, it should just be replicated to the anime unless there was a major error in the original the anime staff wanna fix or change for cohesiveness. But with animation? Yeah, as long as it retains the original spirit of the art and scene, I like people going ham. Like extra good animation or super stylized can help sell the original scene better and it benefits the anime for it. But that's just me. And np, your video doesn't seem like other critique videos that end up become boring hate videos and bad faith arguments, so yeah. And tbh, I also get the feeling anime is strange sometimes but the good elements of it outweigh the more meh elements (the bad elements I will always call out on tho).
@@Thefoop Yeah, there's a video on youtube called "Why does anime lip sync look like that" maybe i should link it in the description, but basically, one of the reasons they do it like that is cause of the way japanese talk, they don't open their mouths a lot and it makes sense but at the same time it feels alienating, adding just some other mouth shapes it would add so much but it also requires more work and most anime dont bother. Yeah i watched a bit of the Isekai Ojjsan but didnt finish and dont remember much of it but my problem with a lot of anime in terms of storytelling is the pacing and like.. other things that i cant exactly point out, but the story always seems like it goes nowhere if u know what i mean, im doing a video about it but im more focused on the overly exposition part of anime and thats more about pacing and how the story is told instead of the story itself. And yeah, i feel bad for the overworked animators, i would much rather they were properly paid and not overworked while having fewer but better quality anime, another thing i found out recently is that they work on the anime while it's coming out so they r working on ep 5 after ep 1 came out (just an example) and thats crazy to me, if some problem happens they have barely any time to solve it but yeah greed amirite. And yeah i looked up mamimi and yeah those r the kinds of expressions i mean, at 2:30 the spongebob expression is exaggerated but it still has that 3d feel so i think thats mostly the difference. And about the manga thing, i mean story wise i dont think they should change it (lots of anime still deviate from thew manga unfortunately tho) but for example internal monologuing, i hate it in animation, its fine in manga but internal monologuing in animation is annoying af and i think they should cut it out and replace it either by dialogue or take it out all together since most internal monologuing is just describing things that u can already see, but yeah thats story wise, and for animation i think it should do the best to tell the story, not necessarily reuse shots from the manga. And yeah, thanks XD tbh i havent seen many videos criticizing anime, specially not the stuff i talked about so yeah, thanks again for the long comment XD
Great!
thanks 🥰
I'm just here to say that I love your jester character🙏💕💕
Thanks 🥰 I made a whole redesign just for this but it was worth it!
You hit one of the big ones on the head for me in this. A lot of manga relies heavily on scenes where dialogue and sitting still is a thing because it's a static medium, where words on paper can convey a lot of information in a small space and having a scene where you can see a lot of the character's body language, posture, or facial expression is important because you can't convey tone with text very well. Mangaka who excel at telling stories without much dialogue and who focus on either action or scenery to tell the story are relatively rare because of this, because the medium provides more hurdles and challenges to this form of storytelling. I think this is also why so many manga that translate well to anime tend to focus on fights and action scenes, because these make the most use of the benefits of animation. You can ignore the simplified mouth movements and static conversation scenes a lot easier when the fight choreography and camera angles are peak. Meanwhile if your show mostly hinges on talking, taking shortcuts with the parts of the person that matter most (anime really focuses on the eyes over the mouth, which I think is part of its charm normally but turns into one of its weaknesses in this case) feels jarring and takes you out of it.
I think part of this whole thing comes from just how many anime start as manga instead of being animations first. I say this because a lot of my problems with superhero animations in the West also translate over into what I find awkward in anime; a lot of the goofy costumes exist because they were ways of making characters stand out based on the medium used at the time they were made even if they look weird or stupid outside of their element and a lot of the time you just get these stoic-faced characters talking to each other in a room without much expression being gained because of the comic writers the story was based on using exposition where a show could have given you this information with a different scene and less talking. The thing with these is that a lot of them conceal or hide the eyes while showing the mouth, which makes mouth animations generally better despite the body language often feeling rigid when they're not fighting or doing acrobatics.
TLDR I think both anime and western action animations would do better if they stopped copying their paper counterparts' pacing and tricks based on the limitations of their respective media formats and started making originals or adaptations that focused on what animation does better than static media.
Oh damn thank u for taking a time to make that comment! And yeah, comics/manga and animation are 2 completely different mediums, I haven't watched much superhero animation (and haven't read any superhero comics tbh), only watched spectacular spiderman, invincible (season 1), and the harley queen show just from the top of my head, and I mean I think the costumes can work if done right, for example the live action movies do a good job at that imo, but for superheros there's also the problem of them having very realistic proportions and having more detail than the average cartoon so there's also that, it's harder to animate. Insatiable and the harley quinn show have very rigid movements also probably cause of the lack of squash and stretch cause they wanna make it look more realistic, idk im just guessing here.
Anime fight scenes tho some of them are freaking amazing i can't complain about that but for me having a connection with the characters is more important and i find it difficult in anime. The thing u said about the eyes is also pretty interesting, i guess its also a cultural thing but yeah, anime eyes tend to be very detailed and manga and anime tends to focus a lot on them. For western cartoons they focus a lot on the lipsync but i havent particularly notice the eyes concealment thing but yeah.
Also im working on a video about the storytelling in anime and how it breaks the "show don't tell rule" and nobody seems to care, but yeah a reason for that is cause it's adapted from manga and in manga that works but in animation it's different so yeah just wanted to mention that cause u talked about how the exposition doesn't translate well from manga to anime (would need to watch more superhero shows to talk about those tho :( but yeah that's smtg i thought before with the ones i watched
But yeah thanks again for the comment, i really like reading these long comments, really make me feel like people care about the video :)
Groovy video!
thanks 🥰
tbh it has never felt weird or alien to me but dubs have
when i started watching i anime i only watched subbed but lately ive been getting lazy and tbh some dubs are pretty good, the mha one for example it has some pretty funny parts that wouldn't be as funny sub cause i would only read the joke
Ayo anime is not weird 👿👿
why not? 🤔
It's almost like anime was made by people from a historically secluded island, and not by people from Europe and its former colonies. It's almost like people watch anime *because* it provides insight into a culture the world didn't know about until fairly recently. It's almost like the word "alien" literally means "foreign".
nah bruh i didn't think alice in borderland or squid game were alien, i didnt think most of the few manga i read were alien so thats not it, i know it's a cultural thing but i think i have the right to not like some choices that that culture makes in regards to animation, its a matter of personal taste
It tooks me a good time to see the flap mouth too, I just thought that was japones 😅😅
ikr, i knew smtg was wrong but couldn't point out why but it was so obvious 😭