This is like writing in Latin with your left hand, writing in English in your right, and painting a Da Vinci with your feet. ALL AT THE SAME FREAKIN' TIME!! Props to anyone who can play this.
what ever, im not here to argue, i was just trying to point out that he said one thing and played another. its a good video, one of the best ive seen of this song on here
That was extremely well done, in total control, while understanding exactly what is happening in the pattern variations and demonstrating them with ease.
Hats off to you, well explained and demostrated. As someone who had lessons but could never figure it out too well if it was explained and counted out like that, it made a lot of sense. I always figured it out by listening and copying... The hard way probably!
Hi. If he's calling the song's hi-hat part sixteenth notes, which he does, then we're dealing with long 5/4 measures, with 2backbeats each. But he's counting twice as fast, in 5/8. He's inconsistent, because he's calling the second accent per phrase (the one he says is bass drum optional)the and of 2, which it would only actually be if it were in 5/8. In 5/4 it would be the "ah" (3rd sixteenth note) of 1.
joe, very nice of you to share without bravura! You play very well and Thank you for your 'straight ahead' offering. All the best to You and your drumming career. Sincerely, Steve B
This groove is a stellar example of Vinnie's unique genius on this instrument. There a very select group of players who could play this and makes feel relaxed, comfortable, and grooving like all hell the way Vinnie does. Furthermore, I'll say that there are very few drummers who possess the kind of creativity Vinnie has to even invent this groove, and all of the drum parts for this song in the first place. Vinnie's space-alien, computer brain is without peer in terms of what he can do on the fly/improvisation-ally with polyrhythms, and Zappa's words bear that out. Zappa said Vinnie was incredibly unique in his ability to calculate, and feel, in real-time, extremely complex and unusual polyrhythms and polymeters. It really astounded Zappa, and that in itself is an amazing thing. But what's REALLY special about Vinnie's playing is this incredible facility described above, combined with his amazingly rare creativity. Vinnie is simply brilliant at writing parts that no one else would think of. He'll approach a groove, or a part and just throw the rulebook out the window. And it WILL SOUND AMAZING. He's really an outside of the box thinker in this regard. An artist in the truest sense. Vinnie's playing holds a very special place in the league of elite drummers and musicians from the late part of the 20th century. Go read about his audition for Zappa if you want to be amazed.
I would write the part in 5/8 with 16ths on the hats. Reading in 5/8 I would count the 8th notes as 1,2,3,4,5,1,2,3,4,5 rather than 1,&,2,&,3,1,&,2,&,3 as it makes more sense. When explaining the main groove I'm in 5/8 counting the 8th notes as the pulse. When explaining the hihat accent loop I'm switching to 5/4 (2 x 5/8) considering the quarter note the pulse. A 16th note is half an 8th note whether you refer to it as an '&' or an 'e'. I hope the explanation wasn't too confusing.
Hi, the majority of the transcription and play along is in the DrumVault on my site (bottom of the MasterClass page). There isn't another video. Thanks, Joe
@snakespence Yeah, go to my website and click on Lessons->more lessons in the menu. The backing and transcription of the outro are in the drum vault (left hand side of the page). Thanks, Joe
Absolutely fantastic stuff! I have tried to master this but it really is horribly difficult - I can't get it! Great explanation and great drumming - very, very impressive! Have a look at my drum vids - Genesis and Police, but no 'Seven Days' funnily enough! I take my hat off to you.
There can be no doubt that this song is most easily counted, written and read in 5/4 time. Think simple! The more simply you think and count to yourself, the more relaxed you'll play. It is also easier to read 8th notes than to read 16ths, and music is always written to be most easily read, as all good copyists know. Look at a chart for Take Five (Dave Brubeck): 8th notes in 5/4.There is nothing strange about 190 bpm! Remember 'Wipe Out"? That is in 4/4 at almost the same tempo.
Well expalined there Joe. Thanks. I can get the basic hi-hat, the snare and the base drum. Those hi-hat accents at 8.33 and elsewhere will need more time. I smile :)
I guess he is right, if the song is in 5/4 then the metronome plays at (approx.) 190bpm, which is a very strange thing for this kind of music. i think it's better to approach it as a 5/8, but everyone should try to make learning and practicing easier, so if there's someone counting 5/4, no problem! Anyway, great explanation and great job!
HI, Nice tutorial, BUT..is it not the case that the recorded version actually features accented triplets on the hi hat not straight 16ths? Thats what I'm working on now. Check out my progress, Ive done a section in the cover where I play it like that
Hey there, great lesson! I would like to buy the full transcription and Video, but it does not seem to be available on your homepage anymore... Is there still any chance to get the whole thing? Best greetings!
AAAAAAAAAAAll Right !!!! Gosh how could they find such a beat. I wonder who's the crazyiest???...Sting or Colaiuta. I'll work on it 'till I get it, thanks a lot. momo
two things to add in ur video. 1st the time in seven days is not 5/4 or 5/8 but it is 10/8.The way he has them analyzed is 3-3-2-2. also on the 16th note pattern on the hi hat ...why not play 134 of the tetraplette of sixteenths?The accent comes by itself every second bar. take care
Hey Joe, fantastic drumming! Your outro for the song is amazing also. Do you have a track of just you playing the song all the way through? I would love to be able to play along with it. All the best!
@wesj1989 well, it is easier if you don't try to play the pieces as separate beats, but just concentrate on playing the whole groove as one... if you get what I mean. Don't try to write Latin with one hand and so on.. but paint a Da Vinci with written Latin and English in it... (I tried to be somewhat profound, and it didn't really work, but you get the point...)
Wow, leave it to drummers to debate over 8th and 1/4 notes! There is a difference between 5/8 and 5/4. Yes, two measures of 5/8 will equal one measure of 5/4 time wise, but in terms of phrasing, it doesn't work feel wise. Listen to the other instruments (in the original, non sequenced version). They are not counting 5/8, they're counting in 5/4. The quarter note is the pulse. Vinnie is a master of subdivision. Anything you have to do to figure it out is ok, but the song is in 5/4.
It's whatever you want it to be. I count it in 5/8, but the accent on the hi hat ends up in 5/4. You could write it all in 5/16 or 5/2 if you wanted, or even 4/4 (though that would look very confusing). Don't get too caught up in it once you know what's going on.
actually, the way he explains it is in 5/4. a 5/8 measure is one 8th not shorter than a 3/4 measure, so how could that work for this song? the answer is it cant. its in 5/4
@bringtharock Thank you. I spend a lot of my time working on the MasterClass lessons on my website. The aim is to make enough from those to be able to keep putting the free stuff up on RUclips too. Please check it out if you get the chance. There's a lot of good stuff in there.
This is like writing in Latin with your left hand, writing in English in your right, and painting a Da Vinci with your feet. ALL AT THE SAME FREAKIN' TIME!! Props to anyone who can play this.
what ever, im not here to argue, i was just trying to point out that he said one thing and played another. its a good video, one of the best ive seen of this song on here
Excellent job explaining this tricky beat, Mr. Crabtree. Especially the hi hat pattern.
Seven Days is a fascinating piece of music. The timing of it had me stumped for ages but thanks to this video I now know what's going on ! Thank you.
Hi Joe,
Thanks for explaining the Vinnie groove here; I shall certainly sit down and break it down for practice
That was extremely well done, in total control, while understanding exactly what is happening in the pattern variations and demonstrating them with ease.
You are such a talented young man.
A gifted drummer and teacher.
Thank you for educating us.
Hats off to you, well explained and demostrated. As someone who had lessons but could never figure it out too well if it was explained and counted out like that, it made a lot of sense. I always figured it out by listening and copying... The hard way probably!
FANTASTIC breakdown Joe. Love it.
Great demonstration. I love that song and I want to master it on drums. Thanks for doing this!
THIS IS FANTASTIC WORK THANK YOU
WOW - fantastic!!! Great walk-through!!! Excellent work!!!
Hi. If he's calling the song's hi-hat part sixteenth notes, which he does, then we're dealing with long 5/4 measures, with 2backbeats each. But he's counting twice as fast, in 5/8. He's inconsistent, because he's calling the second accent per phrase (the one he says is bass drum optional)the and of 2, which it would only actually be if it were in 5/8. In 5/4 it would be the "ah" (3rd sixteenth note) of 1.
Brilliantly explained, brilliant playing!
Great Teacher / Instructor.
That's it!
I'm gonna buy a drum kit.
Brilliantly explained and executed, thanks mate!
joe, very nice of you to share without bravura!
You play very well and Thank you for your 'straight ahead' offering. All the best to You and your drumming career. Sincerely, Steve B
Very well illustrated and explained...thanks man!
This groove is a stellar example of Vinnie's unique genius on this instrument. There a very select group of players who could play this and makes feel relaxed, comfortable, and grooving like all hell the way Vinnie does. Furthermore, I'll say that there are very few drummers who possess the kind of creativity Vinnie has to even invent this groove, and all of the drum parts for this song in the first place. Vinnie's space-alien, computer brain is without peer in terms of what he can do on the fly/improvisation-ally with polyrhythms, and Zappa's words bear that out. Zappa said Vinnie was incredibly unique in his ability to calculate, and feel, in real-time, extremely complex and unusual polyrhythms and polymeters. It really astounded Zappa, and that in itself is an amazing thing. But what's REALLY special about Vinnie's playing is this incredible facility described above, combined with his amazingly rare creativity. Vinnie is simply brilliant at writing parts that no one else would think of. He'll approach a groove, or a part and just throw the rulebook out the window. And it WILL SOUND AMAZING. He's really an outside of the box thinker in this regard. An artist in the truest sense. Vinnie's playing holds a very special place in the league of elite drummers and musicians from the late part of the 20th century. Go read about his audition for Zappa if you want to be amazed.
I would write the part in 5/8 with 16ths on the hats.
Reading in 5/8 I would count the 8th notes as 1,2,3,4,5,1,2,3,4,5 rather than 1,&,2,&,3,1,&,2,&,3 as it makes more sense.
When explaining the main groove I'm in 5/8 counting the 8th notes as the pulse.
When explaining the hihat accent loop I'm switching to 5/4 (2 x 5/8) considering the quarter note the pulse.
A 16th note is half an 8th note whether you refer to it as an '&' or an 'e'. I hope the explanation wasn't too confusing.
Love your playing, awesome as always Joe..Glen.
Excellent lesson sir!!
thank you so much for sharing your knowledge, I love that song, i'm a fan from venezuela. Someday i'll play it like you mate!
so nice work!! i wanted to learn 5/4 all the time, and especially i knew this nice and difficult sting song.. so thank you for your work!!
Thanks Joe! I found your "Seven Days" tutorial very informative...
Great lesson and demo of this groove!
Excellent, man! Made it clear and playable. Congrats and thanks!
Wow...outstanding explanation. Thanks for the video! Make me want to go play my drums!
Great drumming and instructions
Woeful backing track !
Great lesson clarity. Thank you!
Great explanation man, good work. And what a song this is!
Best tutorial out there!
Great work!
Perfect video
yeah man! good job. the best RUclips explanation I seen of this yet.
Cool explanation... Liked it 👍👍👍
very well explained and played.
good job!
Very nice teaching! Thanks so much for the help.
peace.
Super complimenti!!
Nice work!
You're a great teacher thank you
broke this down lovely, thanks
Joe! Good job mate. Wicekd editing etc...Of course great playing too. I always told you, you are so Vinnie..
It's 5 against 4, I'm pretty sure it was transcribed in the issue of modern drummer that Vinnie was in around the time the album came out
Thanks u !
Very helpful I think u are doing great job!
Thank you Bro! NYC here.
great lesson!
Hi, the majority of the transcription and play along is in the DrumVault on my site (bottom of the MasterClass page). There isn't another video.
Thanks,
Joe
Increible trabajo!! Me ayudó la ostia, un saludo crack!!
Great lesson. Nice breakdown.. Really love that K hihat... :)
Excellent
Good job man !!!
@snakespence Yeah, go to my website and click on Lessons->more lessons in the menu. The backing and transcription of the outro are in the drum vault (left hand side of the page). Thanks, Joe
Absolutely fantastic stuff! I have tried to master this but it really is horribly difficult - I can't get it! Great explanation and great drumming - very, very impressive!
Have a look at my drum vids - Genesis and Police, but no 'Seven Days' funnily enough! I take my hat off to you.
great job mate keep it up
good job thanks , a favorite .
excellent !
Ignore me. ..... Should've watched your whole thing before running my mouth. You nailed it. Nice.
Great lesson. Thanks :)
very helpful, thank you
nice work friend
I don't have me playing it all the way through, but the play along and transcription are on my site (see link in video description)
There can be no doubt that this song is most easily counted, written and read in 5/4 time. Think simple! The more simply you think and count to yourself, the more relaxed you'll play. It is also easier to read 8th notes than to read 16ths, and music is always written to be most easily read, as all good copyists know. Look at a chart for Take Five (Dave Brubeck): 8th notes in 5/4.There is nothing strange about 190 bpm! Remember 'Wipe Out"? That is in 4/4 at almost the same tempo.
Well expalined there Joe.
Thanks.
I can get the basic hi-hat, the snare and the base drum.
Those hi-hat accents at 8.33 and elsewhere will need more time.
I smile :)
@snakespence you have to make a donation to get the log in details.
thanks!
perfect !
Realy, grate job, excellent, I like to hear the drums a little harder on the track! .. hugs joe!!
I guess he is right, if the song is in 5/4 then the metronome plays at (approx.) 190bpm, which is a very strange thing for this kind of music.
i think it's better to approach it as a 5/8, but everyone should try to make learning and practicing easier, so if there's someone counting 5/4, no problem!
Anyway, great explanation and great job!
nice one mate!
bhdrums: Every other quarter note (if you consider the fast hihat strokes as sixteenth notes). It will go over the bars but that's OK.
what i was trying to say is that he says its in 5/8 but when he is counting it out he is counting it in 5/4 not 5/8
perfect !!!!
Awesome!
And there is a whole segment of videos on this song by Nick Molenda on youtube in case anyone would like another option
Where did you get the track that you were playing to in the end with just the instruments and no drums, and where can I download it
HI,
Nice tutorial, BUT..is it not the case that the recorded version actually features accented triplets on the hi hat not straight 16ths?
Thats what I'm working on now.
Check out my progress, Ive done a section in the cover where I play it like that
I think the hi-hat is accented on 2 and 5, closed rimshot on 4, and base drum on 1.
That's about all of it that I can manage.
TroyaE117 If you watch live videos of Vinnie playing, he does the kick on 1 and and the and of 2. It sounds better in my opinion.
@snakespence you don't need one. Just click through and paypal will let you use a card without signing up.
easy and доступно ))))
thats the spirit!!!!
i knew that drums are hard to play, but what you are doing here is godly. so i guess no drums for me, i'll stick to my guitar :) well done!
Pretty sure this song is in 5/4.I guess you could write it however you want,but is'nt that a little busy on the page to write it as 5/8?
Hey there, great lesson! I would like to buy the full transcription and Video, but it does not seem to be available on your homepage anymore... Is there still any chance to get the whole thing?
Best greetings!
AAAAAAAAAAAll Right !!!! Gosh how could they find such a beat. I wonder who's the crazyiest???...Sting or Colaiuta. I'll work on it 'till I get it, thanks a lot. momo
two things to add in ur video.
1st the time in seven days is not 5/4 or 5/8 but it is 10/8.The way he has them analyzed is 3-3-2-2. also on the 16th note pattern on the hi hat ...why not play 134 of the tetraplette of sixteenths?The accent comes by itself every second bar.
take care
Vagelis Moulakakis 10/8 is the same as 5/4
yeah, im not bashing him, just making sure he knows the correct tim signature for the song
Hey Joe, fantastic drumming! Your outro for the song is amazing also. Do you have a track of just you playing the song all the way through? I would love to be able to play along with it. All the best!
@wesj1989 well, it is easier if you don't try to play the pieces as separate beats, but just concentrate on playing the whole groove as one... if you get what I mean. Don't try to write Latin with one hand and so on.. but paint a Da Vinci with written Latin and English in it... (I tried to be somewhat profound, and it didn't really work, but you get the point...)
@Dylan6281 I guess it differs. I absolutely hate learning grooves as separate pieces, and it has never worked for me.
plz tell me what hi hats you have!!
some sort of K's??
👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻
Wow, leave it to drummers to debate over 8th and 1/4 notes! There is a difference between 5/8 and 5/4. Yes, two measures of 5/8 will equal one measure of 5/4 time wise, but in terms of phrasing, it doesn't work feel wise. Listen to the other instruments (in the original, non sequenced version). They are not counting 5/8, they're counting in 5/4. The quarter note is the pulse. Vinnie is a master of subdivision. Anything you have to do to figure it out is ok, but the song is in 5/4.
kick vinny! nice drum sound btw :)
It's whatever you want it to be. I count it in 5/8, but the accent on the hi hat ends up in 5/4. You could write it all in 5/16 or 5/2 if you wanted, or even 4/4 (though that would look very confusing). Don't get too caught up in it once you know what's going on.
It’s 5/8
actually, the way he explains it is in 5/4.
a 5/8 measure is one 8th not shorter than a 3/4 measure, so how could that work for this song? the answer is it cant. its in 5/4
@bringtharock Thank you. I spend a lot of my time working on the MasterClass lessons on my website. The aim is to make enough from those to be able to keep putting the free stuff up on RUclips too. Please check it out if you get the chance. There's a lot of good stuff in there.
lol....hahahahaha!!!!! thats a great one man !!!
freakky!thanks nw i can pretty much get this song
Those are 13" K/Z hats