Sam I give you an A+ for your review and humor, it is rediculous that prices that high and quality that low for a manufacteror that long in business and unable to make a decent model. Well done review.
@@SamsTrains Hi Sam, I think that your reviews are just brilliant. I also model in O gauge and perhaps you should do some more reviews in this gauge. I also do not consider you as a Hornby basher you tell it as it is. Many thanks from Ron 🚂👍
Not even a minute in, and I’m already glad I opted for an older Hornby Black 5. Although seeing yours with a green LNER tender is funny. Hornby, wanna stop Sam from roasting you to the third degree? STOP MAKING IT SO EASY!!!
Found my Dad a DCC Sound one from Ellis Clark Trains a few years ago and he seems happy with it. Never been a particularly important loco to me, but I think I would certainly avoid newer versions
I was going to get one of these new Black Fives with the steam generator and sound, but I am very glad I didn’t now, especially considering I live in Canada, so returning a faulty model for me is much harder due to shipping costs…
Hornby had made a model, many years back, of a Southern Bullied Light Pacific (can’t think of what specific class of BLP it was) that came packed with the Stanier Tender as it had been while on trial on the LMS.
@@davidstrains4910 understood. I just remember having scene a picture of the box for it or the model itself somewhere but didn’t pay much attention to what the running number and name of the engine had been. Out of curiosity, which specific class of BLP was it?
Looks like you got a Monday morning model there. I think you were right to return it if you weren’t happy with it. I think some consumers would have done the same. Can I suggest not responding to the neigh sayers who criticise your opinions during reviews. Some noses will always be put out of joint when their favourite model/manufacturer gets a negative review. Let them belly ache and don’t rise to the bait. Viewing figures speak for themselves. Keep doing what you’re doing and trust in your own integrity as we all do.
Yeah you are absolutely right - it's not something I'm going to make a habit of. It's just that I've not had much positive to say about Hornby recently - and I'm seeing comments saying I hate Hornby or just want to bash them etc. I just wanted to clear up that any negativity is based purely on Hornby's actions or models! Thanks for watching, Sam :)
The thing is Sam, you BUY these models, the manufactures do not PROVIDE them to you for review. That gives you the right to be honest in your opinions, and not skewed by the manufacturers. Keep it up.
Even good manufacturers can still bungle things. I know that here in the US, Rapido failed to adequately package a recent run of bulkhead flatcars they did and missed details on a run of modern 20,000 gallon tank cars. Athearn missed details on a run of covered hoppers (though the ones in question were a little niche). There are people who have doubts about the recently-announced J-class from ScaleTrains given that the model used ex-MTH tooling, which produced models of somewhat questionable quality (even if said tooling was said to have been upgraded after SXT purchased it). Everyone messes up, but it's all about whether or not they _consistently_ do so.
I don’t get the exorbitant prices expected for die cast. Sure, it’s not as cheap as plastic, but die cast toys were standard when I was a kid and they didn’t cost the price of two weeks groceries. Somewhere along the line someone fooled us into thinking it’s a premium material when it’s actually not. Better than plastic? Yes. As premium as silver? No.
Well, you makes me want to check the price of the metals required for manufacturing die cast. There is an international trade on metals, and you have raw material prices fixed by the market you can't turn around. Plastic for models can be sourced from recycled materials (ask Dapol for that), but is dependant on the price of crude oil. I don't say that the price asked for die cast models is justified, I just don't know and I will check by my own.
The alloy used in die casting consists of mainly zink. At the moment the price of one tonne of pure zink is around 2300€ or 1950£. The cost for raw material is pennies per die cast loco chassis. You can manufacture one heck of a load of model locomotives out of one tonne of zink. Zink is not a premium material by any stretch of imagination. The die casting moulds on the other hand are very expensive, even in China. Not sure how they compare pricewise to moulds for injection moulded plastic. Someone in the industry would know.
Thanks for the review Sam. I had one of these on order which I will not be buying now. I remember Simon Kohler saying this would be the 'ultimate Black Five'. This is anything but!
No problem - sorry to hear that but if this is anything to go buy I wouldn't recommend one. It's certainly the ultimate in terms of detail... but if the factory can't build it right then that's redundant! Thanks for watching, Sam :)
Maybe he meant “ultimate” as in that you’ll lose interest in modelling the black 5 or even the whole of the LMS after seeing this need to use an LNER tender!
@@SamsTrains Although I agree with the review, the valve gear (yes - I know you had issues) is generally the finest I've ever seen on a non-Continental locomotive. You didn't show a close up running, but the GW-inspired air-pump off the bottom of the crosshead would have worked - this when added to the fully-detailed Walschaert's rather heavy construction (prototypically correct) was a phenomenal piece of work by the Hornby design team. Just a great pity that the factory didn't do its job.
For future reference the real thing has a curved running plate as it echoes the angle of the boiler allowing the workers to access and inspect underneath the boiler.
What a shocker! I have a couple of the last super detail Black 5s from the 2000s - great looking good performers and completely reliable. This is a backwards step.
Now I'm really considering if getting into Model Railway collecting is worth it. The companies are still struggling this much to make Locomotives. However, I'm glad you keep calling out the companies on their lackluster designs,performance and extortionate prices.
I think if you're open to used models, you can get some pretty good deals. I've never even bought a brand new model, myself. Lol Also, Accurascale has been doing great work at a reasonable price. Definitely don't overlook them.
I'm a huge advocate for model railways - but what used to be the two big names, Hornby and Bachmann, are generally not worth touching these days if you ask me. Go to the likes of Accurascale, Rapido and Dapol and you'll get a much better experience! Thanks for watching, Sam :)
@@SamsTrains I have said this to my mother when I was in holidays with her last week, and this was about French wine : “when you are at the top, the only way possible is downwards”. It seems that Hornby and Bachmann does not want to understand that.
It is not Sam's fault that this example is faulty. I have seen numerous other reviews of these that were just fine. Sam's did show a flicker of what a faultless example is capable of (that crawl for one thing)
Agreed. Adi Pullen own example had dirty wheels out of the box (not acceptable, I agree), but worked flawlessly. See his review for more comparison. By the way, the lack of serious quality control is insulting at this level of price.
Hi Sam, I wonder if this is a DCC blanking plate issue. If the lights and everything work EXCEPT for the motor, perhaps you have to look at what went wrong in the circuit board, and I think its the DCC blanking plate, which I assume is on the tender as you have identified it as a tender issue. The blanking plate, rather than putting all inputs in and out to the decoder, just outputs the current back into the motor and everything, so I think something is faulty there. I don't think you opened up the tender in your disassembly part of the video, so I hope you check that out, pop in a new blanking plate, and make a follow up video. Cheers
The blanking plate may be what is at fault. I had purchased the new run 9F Evening Star. Upon DCC/Sound installation I found that both the blanking plate and DCC decoder (Soundtraxx Econami UK) were a loose fit. By gently and carefully bending the pins on the motherboard I got the decoder to stay in place and the locomotive ran perfectly.
Yeah the DCC socket, and consequently blanking plate, are in the tender. It could be a problem with either that or the tender connector since clearly the locomotive itself is fully functional.
Time for an almost certainly to be produced detailing kit. They're hard work, but the effect is something that NO mass produced model can emulate. And of course, when one starts with scale frame details, a model's ability to take toy curves (as Sam uses) virtually disappears.
Man I love it when Sam roasts these model railway companies into medium rare, it saves my wallet. Thank you for the review, probably going to look for an older black five lol.
If you buy the Brassmasters detailing pack and put in a little time, you’ll probably end up with something that looks better than the new model. I’d recommend this to everyone as the detailing pack is only £30 and Brassmasters, unlike Hornby, know what they’re doing.
Always enjoy your reviews Sam, I just wish the title didn't have spoilers! Love the honesty and I know what it feels like to get faulty models; I have had many from new.
haha sorry for that - got to have the engaging titles where possible! Yeah that's right - very disappointing and quite a common thing too! Thanks for watching, Sam :)
Looks beautiful and the lighting features are great - but the faulty drawbar and warped running plate is ridiculous for the price - great video as always sam!
I agree! Hopefully they'll refine this feature and fit it to other locos... though clearly it adds quite a bit to the cost... so have to think quite carefully about whether we want to see this feature as standard Thanks for watching, Sam :)
If they made the lamp iron out of 2 metal parts that act as electrical contacts, then it would probably work better, be more realistic, and easier to use. I just thought of this and may have to try it. It works well in theory at least.
It’s a rubbish way of doing lighting - particularly as steam locos should be having lights you can see lit during the daytime! Steam locos used paraffin lamps which output as much light as a candle! Go try putting a candle in a metal casing then stand 50m away - because the sort of light levels you should be expecting from steam era lamps.
When I first saw this I thought it looked gorgeous. When I saw it running on Sam's layout I found the silver axles attract the eye a little too much - maybe it'd have been better to go with just black ones. Presumably they just wanted to differentiate it from the older model.
Hi Sam. Just wanted to say that one thing I enjoy about your review videos is the “history of the prototype” part. I wish other reviewers would do this as well.
I think you're right to "Hornby Bash" here Sam because this model deserves it. When you spend £200+ for a model you should expect it to be worth every penny. I have three of the earlier tooling Black 5's and I find them reliable for my liking. But that said this model isn't a worthy successor to them....
I'm probably going to get roasting for this...but...(Totally great review Sam, I would get refund also..). I bought this model, which was delivered yesterday...luckily for me it has,nearly, none of the faults,... Tender connection, all perfect no hitches, glitches or stalling, works perfectly. Running plate, all straight and true. Valve gear , all tight , no loose screws Glue marks....ah ha..not to the naked eye or magnified reading glasses...I did find two, in a similar place to yours Sam, HOWEVER, it took a high powered LED workbench torch and a magnifying glass to spot them , really a none issue and would never have seen them without seeing your review in the first instance. I've just got the loco run in, and it appears to be an excellent performer,,really enjoying it, beautiful model, I wanted it to add to the 1970's tooled and early 2000's tooled examples already in my collection...I thought the early 2000's model was a fine example and good detail...this new one blows it into the weeds ... I recommend it....But dont be wary in throwing it back to the retailer if its faulty..mine luckily is near perfect, so a keeper. Good Luck everyone.
This is specifically why I focus on brass locomotives. The detailing is insane, but very rarely do you get a "poor quality" or "defect" model, and if it's a new production, you can be sure the importer will work with you to rectify the issue. Sure they cost quite a bit more but damn are they nice to work with
Hi. I totally agree with what you’ve said. I’ve no reason to not believe you. I’ve a huge collection and some of the tat that comes through from all the manufacturers is very upsetting. Hard earned money spent to return, swap, have repaired or just put up with is not acceptable. I’ve seen that you have been torn to bits on some “respectable” sites saying you have an issue with Hornby, you buy damaged items, you damage items etc and the usual “it’s on carpet and he took it to bits before running” I actually think that a lot of purchases are not even ran. They stay in the box for a future layout. Or in a cabinet to be looked at. Personally I do not want a shop to open up the box. Heavy handily Sticking it on a yard of track and test run it either way before I buy. Part of the excitement is also opening it up for the very first time. You keep doing what you are doing. I’m 100% behind you, although like anything, sometimes I think you are a bit soft and sometimes a bit hard on some models. I’d would have loved to see a great review of the black 5. However you should only review what you got. Which in this case is a pile of poop. Cheers. Dave.
Thank you for your honesty, I think you are absolutely right, it doesn't matter who made what, if its crap then its still crap. Well done. Say it as it is has always been my motto.
Hi Sam, have you checked the Walschaerts valve gear, at 27:07 it looks as though the eccentric crank and the eccentric rod are flopping about. As a scratch builder I would fully expect such loose valve gear to have a big negative effect on the running of a model. That's likely in addition to the issue you have found with the tender. I agree for the price Hornby really need to be doing a much better job on quality control. cheers Phil
Took Hronby long enough to finally add working lapms on a regular steam loco! BTW i think the factory fitted once are actually glued on/in ... Maybe they should sell kits as well, and let us glue/fit parts our selves, specially if it means the models will be cheaper by a margin that way (like KATO does)! I think I'm happy with my old Black 5 for now (not like i could afford the new one, specially with that insane import tax).
Working lamps on UK outline steam locos are unrealistic gimmicks that look terrible! The real things used feeble paraffin lamps with the same light out put of a candle - and moreover were never actually lit during daylight hours as the lamps were there to indicate the train type etc to lineside staff (NOT for the crew to see where they were going) which was done by their physical position.
@@philkeller4170 Very good point indeed. Also the 'realistic fire' wouldn't be seen often, as the firedoors were kept as closed as possible - and often totally closed!
Yeah, imagine if the firebox flicker went off for long durations of time and then suddenly popped on, blazing and flickering away! They can’t model the doors closing, but I’m sure Accurascale at least could change their firebox flicker to turn on in bursts if they decide it’s unrealistic. As for lamps, maybe they should just be turned on and off via DCC, and if they’re too bright, well, I suppose they could easily be made weaker.
Turns out your choice of alternative tender was precient - check section 2 of that instruction leaflet, where it suddenly starts talking about fitting a decoder or sugar cube speaker to your P2! Also, was it just me, or did it actually look like those front lamps were glued in position?
@@SamsTrains Even one thing I am able to do properly as an amateur novel writer, Hornby f**k it to the top... I'm sincerely considering not buying this model and wait for Accurascale of Rapido to manufacture their own.
Great review Sam. I have received mine now and I have to say I love it, the detail and decoration are brilliant and mine doesn’t seem to have any of the quality issues you sadly experienced. Hopefully you were just unlucky!
I do quite like the new Hornby tender connection. During the exchange trials sometimes locos swapped tenders with other companies. Hornby even did this a in the early-mid 200s with a Spam Can and a Stanier Tender. Even setting aside that use, some classes of loco had multiple tenders, the A1s and A3s for example, so you could swap tenders of you wanted to represent a loco in a different configuration. It would be nice if all of the companies agreed on a standard. But hey, I’ll take what I can get. Edit: And now that I have gotten to that part of the review… this sums up modern Hornby. From a design standpoint you get an amazing product. I have a couple of those new loco tender connections, and they work great. But Hornby QC just fails. From the motors to the detail. I think Hornby knows if it wants to save itself it needs to start offering products with amazing features. Once the smoke version comes out you will have pretty much every feature you could want into a OO model on one place. I am happy to pay high prices for high spec, but that needs to be backed by high quality.
Yeah absolutely right - decent design with some awesome features, let down by poor build quality and a lack of quality control... again and again and again... Thanks for watching, Sam :)
Always ensure you have the RCTS 'Green Book' to hand to make sure that your particular combination of loco and tender actually existed and at the right period ;-)
Huge shame that hornby STILL cant get basic things right - it really is shocking. That said, thr detailing is rather nice, but ill stick to an older one if im after one!
That's right - at over £200 they should be doing quality control tests and inspections... the older one is very similar, just with less detail! Thanks for watching, Sam :)
Great honest review of a cool looking loco, such a shame you get the band end of the stick with another Hornby product, the last time I saw you with a great Hornby loco was the class 56 in Railfreight Grey livery, it was so good I bought one and it is superb, the last Hornby steam locomotive I purchased was a rebuilt W1 in blue livery which runs very well, I hope you get better luck with your purchase in the future, thanks for sharing.
Hey Sam, a very interesting review you’ve put together here, it seems you really got a raw deal on the model. Nothing is more heartbreaking than getting something that costs as much as that in that kind of condition 😔 I do hope you’ll be able to get another and give it another go, a la Hush Hush. Having received mine, I’m happy to report mine has been faultless. I do hope you come right. Cheers, Hylt
Morning Sam, an honest review, in fact a polite review. Saw and read the title New Black 5, then saw the LNER tender knew something special was coming. Over £200 was expecting something very very special. Your review showed how much detail it did in fact offer but there were a number of blemishes. It looked awesome and would have if it ran for more than 12 seconds!!! Full refund for this Monday morning first batch built model. Come Hornby offer your buyers a high quality model and get a great review; give this for over £200 what do you expect. Be interesting to hear how many others have made the £220 plus purchase and are fully happy with it. Sam thankyou for your honest review, hope you spend the refunded money wisely😂 All very best Marc from Leighton Buzzard
sam question for you is haulage now kinda pointless on these newer hornbys since its not about how much the loco can pull but how much the friction connector from loco and tender can handle since its not a solid bar
Hey Sam, our friend at Proper Chuffed received a good Black 5 !! I am wondering if you may be best asking for a replacement and not a refund and do another review!!!! Thank you for all your fantastic reviews; sometime we also receive a "Lemon" Loco. and the replacement is top quality!!!
I have a Hornby 2010/2012 sound version which is as good as it ever was after a good decade of hard running. I really fail to see how it is possible to make something worse with progress! And Hornby are not the only manufacturer this applies to. Great vid Sam.
I had the same problem with my P2, Earl Marischal. I took it upon myself to resolder a broken wire to the new style tender coupling. Not an easy task due to the very small size of it. I also had problems with Prince of Wales with steam generator. It was also a very poor runner. This turned out to be a problem with the decoder multi-plug. I sent it back to The Model Centre over two weeks ago and I still have no idea when I’m going to get it back. Poor show from Hornby on my last two locos. I’ve also pre-ordered the new Black Five with steam generator. I just hope that it works better than the previous two. Keep up the good work. Hope to see something better in the future.
Oh dear. I was looking forward to the BR version with sound and steam generator (which has sold out on pre-order at some suppliers) but I'm not so sure now. Makes you wonder if there is any quality control at Hornby.
I don't believe for 1 minute that you have got the only faulty one out there, I would think there are many more. Keep saying it as you see it, rubbish is rubbish no matter what price. Good review once again.
I had a similar problem with one of the newer Hornby A4s (Golden Fleece) that has the same tender connection. The tender connection has very delicate tabs into which the loco circuit board connector makes contact with when it’s inserted. The flimsy nature of the tabs means that they can easily bend or get caught by the circuit board and actually broke them on my model. I had to spend about an hour trying to solder the tabs together to reattach and reinforce them. I honestly prefer the more durable wired plug and screwed connectors they had on previous models. I would not recommend detaching the loco from the tender unless you really have to on these newer models.
You are right to critisize. I am not so worried about the running plate (I work on preserved steam locos, and none of them have flat running plates), b ut all the other issues would be enough to mke me return it - not good enough for a £200+ loco, or even a £160 one.
Oh dear! I have bought one of these😮. I was so excited that a new LMS Black 5 was being released that I put one on pre-order straight away. I do hope that you were just unlucky enough to get a dud. If mine has similar issues I will let you know (unfortunately my layout is in bits awaiting re-development. Probably be a year before something happens…) I had saved up for this with limited funds I hope I have not wasted my money! Just a point I did notice that the instructions to release the tender chassis did say “to remove your P2 TENDER BODY..” Somebody at Hornby must have got confused.
I have had a preorder on the Steam Generator version ever since they were announced. I hope they fix the issues before that one goes out. The level of detail is amazing, and honestly the lack of die cast and even the warped running plate arent really deal breakers for me, as long as it runs fine. The steam generator should add back a bunch of the missing weight at least.
I have the exact same issue with my Dublo Scotsman. Normally I'd return it immediately for a refund, but as all sold out, I decided to fix it myself. I took the tender connector apart, which is clipped together and fragile. But I got it off and found that the metal strips for the contacts are very dirty especially considering I have it for less than a year and didn't uncouple the tender too much. Then I cleaned the contacts with a fiberglass pencil and some alcohol. After that, she ran very nicely and now is DCC sound fitted. A shame thay yours is so horribly faulty. My question is on the P2 connector as well, is that how long it's gonna last, as mine also had a Bent contact and got dirty quickly. Taking it apart is quite risky so if you break the clip it's game over. I'm still thinking about buying the steam fitted model, as I want that, the lights and the sound. I'll have a very close look in a shop before my purchase as I live outside of the UK and returning anything is a huge pain. Sorry Sam that yours sucked, but hopefully, this is a one off mistake. Unlikely, yes, but unlikely things happen to all of us at the best of times.
@@SamsTrains I've been looking at other reviews for this model and pretty much their models are in good shape and have received positive feedback. Who knows maybe Hornby will send you a free replacement like they did with the Thompson A1.
@@SamsTrains Although the previous tooling is getting on for 25 years old Hornby’s previous Black 5 isn’t that bad. Sure it lacks all the modern bells and whistles but it’s a pretty good rendition of the real loco.
This model is typical of many rtr models today. The reason the model has a bind is the excessive clearance between the brass bearings and diecast frames.
What is the van Between the LSWR grey van and the blue wagon? I’m gutted about this, been waiting with anticipation for the steam generator version of this, to be be my first trial of the steam generator… sort of in two minds how to proceed now. Will you contact hornby for a comment? I would love to know what they say about it
To be fair to Hornby my sound fitted Accurascale Manor has just gone back as whist you can read decoder cv’s it’s as dead as a door nail when it comes to running. As models get more complicated are we seeing more issues?
Thank You Sam for your honesty. Great Job on this review. …on a different note, does any other colorblind people have trouble seeing the review stars against the carpet? Or is it just me?
I know many have pointed this out, but being relatively new to familiarizing myself with locos, who made them, and whatnot, seeing an LNER tender on a Black 5 threw me for a loop
I actually think you are usually more than generous when reviewing Hornby to be honest Sam, so no I don't feel you're Hornby bashing and it's good to see the faults being highlighted more on locos that I agree are very expensive and should be built much better to justify the prices that Hornby attempt to command for these things. Thank you for the review.
My Black 5 is from the last batch of the preves tooling. And it has a 21 pin decoder socket in the tender form the factory as well as a speaker somewhere in the loco (it did have TTS installed, but it failed after about 3 hours of straight running). And just from the tittle of teh video, I am happy that I have my older one
Well done mukka... mechanical lubricator is correct! 😂 Just need to train you stop calling handbrakes "turning wheels" and my training will be all but done! 😂 Bent frame!!!! Send it back. Hornby cannot help themselves... don't give them a freebie! Keep bashing them... I do. Regards to you and Chloe from Oz. Gaz 😁
Wonderful review even in failure. Potentially nice model let down by blind QC. During your review on that coupling connector, I did however wonder how did locos and tenders couple in real life? Are there any such real-life couplings accurately reproduced in model form?
Very good review Sam. It's the issues with the model that are bad I've pre ordered the smoke generator version. I've read some of the others comments and watched another review that was a more positive experience. It's pretty clear that there is a serious lack of consistency in quality control that is letting Hornby down. Issues occurring like this must be breaking the hearts of the designers in Margate. The factory in China has to get its act together or the quality control function has to be bought in house, otherwise I fear for Hornby's future. I've bought a few new Hornby locomotives and so far have been very happy with them ( Princess Coronation and Thane of Fife plus some Railroad Plus diesels) . I am going to keep my pre order live because of my previous good experience together with the pre order Flying Scotsman smoke generator version and hope both will be acceptable.
I'm not sure, but I think there are still multiple factories that Hornby uses. One can by an identical model (same catalogue number etc) but built in two different places. The result - one is superlative, and the other is as Sam received...
Explains part of the problem. As customers we can't be expected to take pot luck on whether we get a well or poorly produced model. In this example it failed to run out of the box. Other comments on this review show Sam is not alone in receiving shoddy goods. Hornby have to up their game on quality control to achieve higher levels of customer satisfaction. It can't afford to fail. It has to do better and all of the time for every model.
Hornby uses multiple factories* in China all owned by different people to make their models. Hence why you can get one model coming out with no issues but another having lots of QC problems. Also it’s all very well saying “don’t use factory X again” but there are only a finite number of factories in China geared up to making model railway stuff and there is lots of competition for production slots from the huge number of model manufacturers out there. * Yes at one time they did use a factory in China but that factory went into conical difficulties and got bought out by Kadder - who own Bachmann and who are not going to be making products for a rival
The above reads like a bunch of excuses. The fact remains that no manufacturer can expect their customers to take pot luck on whether the goods they purchase are good or poor. As I have previously written I have no problem with any new Hornby models I have purchased. Another unfortunate fact is others have, with Sam's review being an excellent demonstration. Hornby need to improve their quality control giving all potential customers the assurance their purchase will be of a good standard and free of defects.
Excuses or not that’s how manufacturers work Do you seriously think Apple or Samsung test every single phone that comes out of the factory - that Bosch test every single washing machine they make or NEFF every single oven they produce? Hornby are merely doing what every other manufacturer of mass produced goods does!
As others have commented, it looks like the DCC decoder is in the tender and when a DCC ready loco is running on DC analogue, the current runs from the pickups to the motor via the blanking plate. This is why, unlike locos that don't have the decoder in the tender, it won't run without the tender connected. I guess there must be connections on top and underneath that drawbar, 2 for pickup, 2 for motor, and some more for lighting, firebox flicker etc. I wonder if there is a loose connection on a motor wire on the tender half of the drawbar, with the wire just touching sometimes and loosing contact as it moves round the corners? It is possibly amenable to a quick fix if the wires are accessible, but they may not be and I fully agree with you not wanting to fiddle with it as you intend to return it. It is a shame that Hornby are still being let down by their quality control on this sort of thing - such a simple thing for them to get right during manufacture & testing and they got it wrong. I wonder if they do any testing at all?
Rails are brilliant if you get a faulty model, in my experience. More recently, out here in the colonies, locos arrive from them with a notation that (name) tested it.
Oh I don't know, I think it looks quite cool with the LNER tender lol. Or maybe Hornby intent it as a static display unit with lamp and firebox flicker lol but seriously I was looking forward to potentially buying one of there as I don't have a Black 5... I will not be doing so now - so thank you for the review Sam
![Blox Fruits Dragon Rework Update [Full Stream]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/EqDAp8udhm0/mqdefault.jpg)
when you see a brand new model train already using a different tender in the intro, you know this video is going to be fun 😆
haha that's right - a first for the channel I believe! xD
Thanks for watching, Sam :)
Well, he did explain why the black 5 has an LNER corridor tender form the intro
Sam I give you an A+ for your review and humor, it is rediculous that prices that high and quality that low for a manufacteror that long in business and unable to make a decent model. Well done review.
haha thank you very much - that's right - a model this expensive should have seen some quality control... no excuses!
Thanks for watching, Sam :)
@@SamsTrains Hi Sam, I think that your reviews are just brilliant. I also model in O gauge and perhaps you should do some more reviews in this gauge. I also do not consider you as a Hornby basher you tell it as it is. Many thanks from Ron 🚂👍
Not even a minute in, and I’m already glad I opted for an older Hornby Black 5. Although seeing yours with a green LNER tender is funny.
Hornby, wanna stop Sam from roasting you to the third degree? STOP MAKING IT SO EASY!!!
Nooooo! Not the third degree roasts!
Found my Dad a DCC Sound one from Ellis Clark Trains a few years ago and he seems happy with it.
Never been a particularly important loco to me, but I think I would certainly avoid newer versions
I agree, I love my Black Five limited addition, runs like a dream...but still thanks Sam,
I DON'T HAVE A BLACK 5
I was going to get one of these new Black Fives with the steam generator and sound, but I am very glad I didn’t now, especially considering I live in Canada, so returning a faulty model for me is much harder due to shipping costs…
14 seconds in, the loco cuts out and needs a different tender. What a good start 😅😅😅
haha yeah - it couldn't even complete a single lap!
Thanks for watching, Sam :)
Sam, do you have a hornby tornado part's because mine is missing connecting rods
@@HarryHolling He’s not a charity dawg no offense 💀
@stultusmcgee9099 I'm just trying to ask him for help or send it to the scrap man
@@SamsTrains pls reply
This takes the 1948 locomotive exchange trials to a whole new level. 🤣
Yes, now I want to see a GWR King with a LNER corridor tender.
Hornby had made a model, many years back, of a Southern Bullied Light Pacific (can’t think of what specific class of BLP it was) that came packed with the Stanier Tender as it had been while on trial on the LMS.
@@MachRacer434006 Bude was the loco that hornby did.
@@davidstrains4910 understood. I just remember having scene a picture of the box for it or the model itself somewhere but didn’t pay much attention to what the running number and name of the engine had been. Out of curiosity, which specific class of BLP was it?
@@MachRacer4SR West Country Class.
34:24 The tender wheel under the 'E' in LNER isn't going round!
Is it supposed to do that?
That sudden stop and the fact that you had to use a scotsman tender in the intro already tells me im in for a very nice video. 😂
haha exactly - such a disappointment!
Thanks for watching, Sam :)
Standard LNE non-corridor 8-wheeler. Basically the same tenders could be found behind the Gresley A1s, A3s, A4s, P2s, and the W1...
Yeah. A club member had the same model and it had the exact same issue with the running issue.
Looks like you got a Monday morning model there. I think you were right to return it if you weren’t happy with it. I think some consumers would have done the same.
Can I suggest not responding to the neigh sayers who criticise your opinions during reviews. Some noses will always be put out of joint when their favourite model/manufacturer gets a negative review. Let them belly ache and don’t rise to the bait. Viewing figures speak for themselves. Keep doing what you’re doing and trust in your own integrity as we all do.
Yeah you are absolutely right - it's not something I'm going to make a habit of. It's just that I've not had much positive to say about Hornby recently - and I'm seeing comments saying I hate Hornby or just want to bash them etc. I just wanted to clear up that any negativity is based purely on Hornby's actions or models!
Thanks for watching, Sam :)
The thing is Sam, you BUY these models, the manufactures do not PROVIDE them to you for review. That gives you the right to be honest in your opinions, and not skewed by the manufacturers. Keep it up.
More like Friday afternoon
Even good manufacturers can still bungle things. I know that here in the US, Rapido failed to adequately package a recent run of bulkhead flatcars they did and missed details on a run of modern 20,000 gallon tank cars. Athearn missed details on a run of covered hoppers (though the ones in question were a little niche). There are people who have doubts about the recently-announced J-class from ScaleTrains given that the model used ex-MTH tooling, which produced models of somewhat questionable quality (even if said tooling was said to have been upgraded after SXT purchased it). Everyone messes up, but it's all about whether or not they _consistently_ do so.
Sam's reviews have saved me a lot of money!
I don’t get the exorbitant prices expected for die cast. Sure, it’s not as cheap as plastic, but die cast toys were standard when I was a kid and they didn’t cost the price of two weeks groceries. Somewhere along the line someone fooled us into thinking it’s a premium material when it’s actually not. Better than plastic? Yes. As premium as silver? No.
Well, you makes me want to check the price of the metals required for manufacturing die cast. There is an international trade on metals, and you have raw material prices fixed by the market you can't turn around. Plastic for models can be sourced from recycled materials (ask Dapol for that), but is dependant on the price of crude oil.
I don't say that the price asked for die cast models is justified, I just don't know and I will check by my own.
The alloy used in die casting consists of mainly zink. At the moment the price of one tonne of pure zink is around 2300€ or 1950£. The cost for raw material is pennies per die cast loco chassis. You can manufacture one heck of a load of model locomotives out of one tonne of zink. Zink is not a premium material by any stretch of imagination. The die casting moulds on the other hand are very expensive, even in China. Not sure how they compare pricewise to moulds for injection moulded plastic. Someone in the industry would know.
@pedalcarguy Cheaper to machine the loco from solid block of gold
I love watching your reviews im both a transformers and train nerd whenever it comes to model trains your channel is the first i go to
No die-cast and flywheel was a deal breaker for me, at this price.
Absolutely devastated.
Yep - that was a shocker too! The running plate is metal, but the rest of the body plastic!
Thanks for watching, Sam :)
Totally agree with you. I collect LMS locos but I will not be buying this. Just not good enough at that price.
😂😂there there
Thanks for the review Sam. I had one of these on order which I will not be buying now.
I remember Simon Kohler saying this would be the 'ultimate Black Five'. This is anything but!
Proof that "Uriah Heap" is rather full of himself (or just full of s**t)
No problem - sorry to hear that but if this is anything to go buy I wouldn't recommend one. It's certainly the ultimate in terms of detail... but if the factory can't build it right then that's redundant!
Thanks for watching, Sam :)
Ultimate, as in final, will H survive?
Maybe he meant “ultimate” as in that you’ll lose interest in modelling the black 5 or even the whole of the LMS after seeing this need to use an LNER tender!
@@SamsTrains Although I agree with the review, the valve gear (yes - I know you had issues) is generally the finest I've ever seen on a non-Continental locomotive. You didn't show a close up running, but the GW-inspired air-pump off the bottom of the crosshead would have worked - this when added to the fully-detailed Walschaert's rather heavy construction (prototypically correct) was a phenomenal piece of work by the Hornby design team. Just a great pity that the factory didn't do its job.
For future reference the real thing has a curved running plate as it echoes the angle of the boiler allowing the workers to access and inspect underneath the boiler.
Is this some sort of a joke? All the photos I’ve looked at show a dead flat running plate.
What a shocker! I have a couple of the last super detail Black 5s from the 2000s - great looking good performers and completely reliable. This is a backwards step.
Now I'm really considering if getting into Model Railway collecting is worth it. The companies are still struggling this much to make Locomotives. However, I'm glad you keep calling out the companies on their lackluster designs,performance and extortionate prices.
Lmfao nah it ain't worth getting new figures, best bet is getting old ones or waiting them to go on like 60% clearance at the retailers
I think if you're open to used models, you can get some pretty good deals. I've never even bought a brand new model, myself. Lol
Also, Accurascale has been doing great work at a reasonable price. Definitely don't overlook them.
I'm a huge advocate for model railways - but what used to be the two big names, Hornby and Bachmann, are generally not worth touching these days if you ask me. Go to the likes of Accurascale, Rapido and Dapol and you'll get a much better experience!
Thanks for watching, Sam :)
@@SamsTrainsdon’t forget and your models too! 😉
@@SamsTrains I have said this to my mother when I was in holidays with her last week, and this was about French wine : “when you are at the top, the only way possible is downwards”. It seems that Hornby and Bachmann does not want to understand that.
It is not Sam's fault that this example is faulty. I have seen numerous other reviews of these that were just fine. Sam's did show a flicker of what a faultless example is capable of (that crawl for one thing)
The crawl was not faultless
@@darreno9874 I didn't say it was, I just said it showed the potential that a good example has.
Agreed. Adi Pullen own example had dirty wheels out of the box (not acceptable, I agree), but worked flawlessly. See his review for more comparison.
By the way, the lack of serious quality control is insulting at this level of price.
Hi Sam, I wonder if this is a DCC blanking plate issue. If the lights and everything work EXCEPT for the motor, perhaps you have to look at what went wrong in the circuit board, and I think its the DCC blanking plate, which I assume is on the tender as you have identified it as a tender issue.
The blanking plate, rather than putting all inputs in and out to the decoder, just outputs the current back into the motor and everything, so I think something is faulty there.
I don't think you opened up the tender in your disassembly part of the video, so I hope you check that out, pop in a new blanking plate, and make a follow up video. Cheers
The blanking plate may be what is at fault. I had purchased the new run 9F Evening Star. Upon DCC/Sound installation I found that both the blanking plate and DCC decoder (Soundtraxx Econami UK) were a loose fit. By gently and carefully bending the pins on the motherboard I got the decoder to stay in place and the locomotive ran perfectly.
Yeah the DCC socket, and consequently blanking plate, are in the tender. It could be a problem with either that or the tender connector since clearly the locomotive itself is fully functional.
14:04 I really don’t like how the backs of the shafts of the buffers are visible 😐
Time for an almost certainly to be produced detailing kit. They're hard work, but the effect is something that NO mass produced model can emulate. And of course, when one starts with scale frame details, a model's ability to take toy curves (as Sam uses) virtually disappears.
hi sam the reason i watch your reviews is that no matter what i hear nothing but honesty and i thank you for that
Man I love it when Sam roasts these model railway companies into medium rare, it saves my wallet. Thank you for the review, probably going to look for an older black five lol.
That's good to hear - this is exactly why I do it. Yeah the previous black 5 will now be much cheaper and better value
Thanks for watching, Sam :)
If you buy the Brassmasters detailing pack and put in a little time, you’ll probably end up with something that looks better than the new model. I’d recommend this to everyone as the detailing pack is only £30 and Brassmasters, unlike Hornby, know what they’re doing.
Always enjoy your reviews Sam, I just wish the title didn't have spoilers! Love the honesty and I know what it feels like to get faulty models; I have had many from new.
haha sorry for that - got to have the engaging titles where possible! Yeah that's right - very disappointing and quite a common thing too!
Thanks for watching, Sam :)
Looks beautiful and the lighting features are great - but the faulty drawbar and warped running plate is ridiculous for the price - great video as always sam!
Yeah absolutely - some great features for sure, overshadowed by the fact that the basics weren't right :(
Thanks for watching, Sam :)
I absolutely love the way hornby did the lights Sam, I really wish more model had this feature.
Cheers Jasper & Willow
I agree! Hopefully they'll refine this feature and fit it to other locos... though clearly it adds quite a bit to the cost... so have to think quite carefully about whether we want to see this feature as standard
Thanks for watching, Sam :)
If they made the lamp iron out of 2 metal parts that act as electrical contacts, then it would probably work better, be more realistic, and easier to use. I just thought of this and may have to try it. It works well in theory at least.
It’s a rubbish way of doing lighting - particularly as steam locos should be having lights you can see lit during the daytime!
Steam locos used paraffin lamps which output as much light as a candle! Go try putting a candle in a metal casing then stand 50m away - because the sort of light levels you should be expecting from steam era lamps.
When I first saw this I thought it looked gorgeous. When I saw it running on Sam's layout I found the silver axles attract the eye a little too much - maybe it'd have been better to go with just black ones. Presumably they just wanted to differentiate it from the older model.
20:24 this is why we don’t do that setup in the states. Drawbar for the win.
Hi Sam. Just wanted to say that one thing I enjoy about your review videos is the “history of the prototype” part. I wish other reviewers would do this as well.
I think you're right to "Hornby Bash" here Sam because this model deserves it. When you spend £200+ for a model you should expect it to be worth every penny. I have three of the earlier tooling Black 5's and I find them reliable for my liking. But that said this model isn't a worthy successor to them....
I'm still shocked that Hornby would let such a faulty model into circulation
certainly won't be picking up one of these - thanks Sam
I'm probably going to get roasting for this...but...(Totally great review Sam, I would get refund also..).
I bought this model, which was delivered yesterday...luckily for me it has,nearly, none of the faults,...
Tender connection, all perfect no hitches, glitches or stalling, works perfectly.
Running plate, all straight and true.
Valve gear , all tight , no loose screws
Glue marks....ah ha..not to the naked eye or magnified reading glasses...I did find two, in a similar place to yours Sam, HOWEVER, it took a high powered LED workbench torch and a magnifying glass to spot them , really a none issue and would never have seen them without seeing your review in the first instance.
I've just got the loco run in, and it appears to be an excellent performer,,really enjoying it, beautiful model, I wanted it to add to the 1970's tooled and early 2000's tooled examples already in my collection...I thought the early 2000's model was a fine example and good detail...this new one blows it into the weeds ...
I recommend it....But dont be wary in throwing it back to the retailer if its faulty..mine luckily is near perfect, so a keeper. Good Luck everyone.
Forgot to say, I'm so sorry for you Sam, such a disappointment for an iconic loco both in life and in Hornby Model form.
This is specifically why I focus on brass locomotives. The detailing is insane, but very rarely do you get a "poor quality" or "defect" model, and if it's a new production, you can be sure the importer will work with you to rectify the issue. Sure they cost quite a bit more but damn are they nice to work with
British outline brass. Done in '0' but rarely in '00'.
“why should henry have a new shape? a shape good enough for me is good enough for him”
Hi. I totally agree with what you’ve said. I’ve no reason to not believe you. I’ve a huge collection and some of the tat that comes through from all the manufacturers is very upsetting. Hard earned money spent to return, swap, have repaired or just put up with is not acceptable. I’ve seen that you have been torn to bits on some “respectable” sites saying you have an issue with Hornby, you buy damaged items, you damage items etc and the usual “it’s on carpet and he took it to bits before running” I actually think that a lot of purchases are not even ran. They stay in the box for a future layout. Or in a cabinet to be looked at. Personally I do not want a shop to open up the box. Heavy handily Sticking it on a yard of track and test run it either way before I buy. Part of the excitement is also opening it up for the very first time. You keep doing what you are doing. I’m 100% behind you, although like anything, sometimes I think you are a bit soft and sometimes a bit hard on some models. I’d would have loved to see a great review of the black 5. However you should only review what you got. Which in this case is a pile of poop. Cheers. Dave.
Thanks
Thank you for your honesty, I think you are absolutely right, it doesn't matter who made what, if its crap then its still crap. Well done. Say it as it is has always been my motto.
As always an open and honest review Sam and thank you, I appreciate having an insight to into what I’m buying before I decided to spend out.
Hi Sam, have you checked the Walschaerts valve gear, at 27:07 it looks as though the eccentric crank and the eccentric rod are flopping about. As a scratch builder I would fully expect such loose valve gear to have a big negative effect on the running of a model.
That's likely in addition to the issue you have found with the tender.
I agree for the price Hornby really need to be doing a much better job on quality control.
cheers
Phil
Took Hronby long enough to finally add working lapms on a regular steam loco! BTW i think the factory fitted once are actually glued on/in ...
Maybe they should sell kits as well, and let us glue/fit parts our selves, specially if it means the models will be cheaper by a margin that way (like KATO does)!
I think I'm happy with my old Black 5 for now (not like i could afford the new one, specially with that insane import tax).
Working lamps on UK outline steam locos are unrealistic gimmicks that look terrible! The real things used feeble paraffin lamps with the same light out put of a candle - and moreover were never actually lit during daylight hours as the lamps were there to indicate the train type etc to lineside staff (NOT for the crew to see where they were going) which was done by their physical position.
@@philkeller4170 Very good point indeed. Also the 'realistic fire' wouldn't be seen often, as the firedoors were kept as closed as possible - and often totally closed!
Yeah, imagine if the firebox flicker went off for long durations of time and then suddenly popped on, blazing and flickering away! They can’t model the doors closing, but I’m sure Accurascale at least could change their firebox flicker to turn on in bursts if they decide it’s unrealistic.
As for lamps, maybe they should just be turned on and off via DCC, and if they’re too bright, well, I suppose they could easily be made weaker.
Great review Sam. I'll stick with my fleet of Hornby R.859 Silver Seal Black 5's. 50 years plus and still faultless.
Turns out your choice of alternative tender was precient - check section 2 of that instruction leaflet, where it suddenly starts talking about fitting a decoder or sugar cube speaker to your P2! Also, was it just me, or did it actually look like those front lamps were glued in position?
Ahhh fascinating I'll double check that! Yes I saw that too - does look like glue behind the smokebox door lamp bracket
Thanks for watching, Sam :)
And you're right - it's talking about a P2 - can't even write a manual correctly!
@@SamsTrains Even one thing I am able to do properly as an amateur novel writer, Hornby f**k it to the top... I'm sincerely considering not buying this model and wait for Accurascale of Rapido to manufacture their own.
Great review Sam. I have received mine now and I have to say I love it, the detail and decoration are brilliant and mine doesn’t seem to have any of the quality issues you sadly experienced. Hopefully you were just unlucky!
I do quite like the new Hornby tender connection. During the exchange trials sometimes locos swapped tenders with other companies. Hornby even did this a in the early-mid 200s with a Spam Can and a Stanier Tender. Even setting aside that use, some classes of loco had multiple tenders, the A1s and A3s for example, so you could swap tenders of you wanted to represent a loco in a different configuration.
It would be nice if all of the companies agreed on a standard. But hey, I’ll take what I can get.
Edit: And now that I have gotten to that part of the review… this sums up modern Hornby. From a design standpoint you get an amazing product. I have a couple of those new loco tender connections, and they work great. But Hornby QC just fails. From the motors to the detail. I think Hornby knows if it wants to save itself it needs to start offering products with amazing features. Once the smoke version comes out you will have pretty much every feature you could want into a OO model on one place. I am happy to pay high prices for high spec, but that needs to be backed by high quality.
Yeah absolutely right - decent design with some awesome features, let down by poor build quality and a lack of quality control... again and again and again...
Thanks for watching, Sam :)
Always ensure you have the RCTS 'Green Book' to hand to make sure that your particular combination of loco and tender actually existed and at the right period ;-)
Thank you Sam - for saving me from wasting yet more money on Hornby products!
Huge shame that hornby STILL cant get basic things right - it really is shocking. That said, thr detailing is rather nice, but ill stick to an older one if im after one!
That's right - at over £200 they should be doing quality control tests and inspections... the older one is very similar, just with less detail!
Thanks for watching, Sam :)
Lies they can and Sam just gets unlucky.
@@LNER985you’re a Hornby bootlicker, so anything you say is automatically invalid
any good runner beats an "pretty" NON runner......
@@LiamSexton-it6js Says the one kissing the devil's ass.
Great honest review of a cool looking loco, such a shame you get the band end of the stick with another Hornby product, the last time I saw you with a great Hornby loco was the class 56 in Railfreight Grey livery, it was so good I bought one and it is superb, the last Hornby steam locomotive I purchased was a rebuilt W1 in blue livery which runs very well, I hope you get better luck with your purchase in the future, thanks for sharing.
Hey Sam, a very interesting review you’ve put together here, it seems you really got a raw deal on the model. Nothing is more heartbreaking than getting something that costs as much as that in that kind of condition 😔 I do hope you’ll be able to get another and give it another go, a la Hush Hush. Having received mine, I’m happy to report mine has been faultless. I do hope you come right. Cheers, Hylt
Morning Sam, an honest review, in fact a polite review. Saw and read the title New Black 5, then saw the LNER tender knew something special was coming. Over £200 was expecting something very very special. Your review showed how much detail it did in fact offer but there were a number of blemishes. It looked awesome and would have if it ran for more than 12 seconds!!! Full refund for this Monday morning first batch built model. Come Hornby offer your buyers a high quality model and get a great review; give this for over £200 what do you expect. Be interesting to hear how many others have made the £220 plus purchase and are fully happy with it. Sam thankyou for your honest review, hope you spend the refunded money wisely😂 All very best Marc from Leighton Buzzard
Thanks for being honest Sam keep the good work up 👍
sam question for you is haulage now kinda pointless on these newer hornbys since its not about how much the loco can pull but how much the friction connector from loco and tender can handle since its not a solid bar
I have a number of the previous version which are perfectly satisfactory and have performed well for me for years.
Can you a fixed LMS Black Five number 5200 please
Hey Sam, our friend at Proper Chuffed received a good Black 5 !! I am wondering if you may be best asking for a replacement and not a refund and do another review!!!! Thank you for all your fantastic reviews; sometime we also receive a "Lemon" Loco. and the replacement is top quality!!!
Did you try the black 5 tender on the P2?
Haha I didn’t think of that actually!
Hello Sam! Could you possibly do a video on the most beginner friendly/budget friendly models for people who are just getting into model trains?
I have a Hornby 2010/2012 sound version which is as good as it ever was after a good decade of hard running. I really fail to see how it is possible to make something worse with progress! And Hornby are not the only manufacturer this applies to. Great vid Sam.
I had the same problem with my P2, Earl Marischal. I took it upon myself to resolder a broken wire to the new style tender coupling. Not an easy task due to the very small size of it. I also had problems with Prince of Wales with steam generator. It was also a very poor runner. This turned out to be a problem with the decoder multi-plug. I sent it back to The Model Centre over two weeks ago and I still have no idea when I’m going to get it back. Poor show from Hornby on my last two locos. I’ve also pre-ordered the new Black Five with steam generator. I just hope that it works better than the previous two. Keep up the good work. Hope to see something better in the future.
Oh dear. I was looking forward to the BR version with sound and steam generator (which has sold out on pre-order at some suppliers) but I'm not so sure now. Makes you wonder if there is any quality control at Hornby.
Cool review! Cheers Sam!
Oi my spot
I’m back
haha thank you!
@@SamsTrains could you please do a new railway roundabout video I lived the 2 you did a couple of years ago
I don't believe for 1 minute that you have got the only faulty one out there, I would think there are many more. Keep saying it as you see it, rubbish is rubbish no matter what price. Good review once again.
I had a similar problem with one of the newer Hornby A4s (Golden Fleece) that has the same tender connection. The tender connection has very delicate tabs into which the loco circuit board connector makes contact with when it’s inserted. The flimsy nature of the tabs means that they can easily bend or get caught by the circuit board and actually broke them on my model. I had to spend about an hour trying to solder the tabs together to reattach and reinforce them. I honestly prefer the more durable wired plug and screwed connectors they had on previous models. I would not recommend detaching the loco from the tender unless you really have to on these newer models.
Fantastic Review Sam !!
Thank you!
It is possible to have metal whistles. I’ve got an old Mainline class 03 shutter with a metal horn and a class 08 that has a metal whistle.
TBH, a LMS Stanier with a LNER Gresley tender is a good looking pair.
Now I’m thinking of swapping my O1 tender with my W1 tender.
hahaha it's certainly unusual! Just be careful though - swapping locos' tenders could potentially damage LED lighting!
Thanks for watching, Sam :)
Quite why a Black 5 would need 8 tons of coal and 5000 gallons of water baffles me though!
I have the same trouble with my N2 tank loco which is DCC sound fitted it just keeps stuttering and you have to keep nudging it
You are right to critisize. I am not so worried about the running plate (I work on preserved steam locos, and none of them have flat running plates), b ut all the other issues would be enough to mke me return it - not good enough for a £200+ loco, or even a £160 one.
Great review Sam! Love your videos!
When you began your review I was drooling - but that very quickly turned to a dry mouth. One to avoid! Thanks, as ever, for your efforts!
You did a great job with this review Sam I'm impressed 19:19
I like the fact that it mechanically resembles the Henry model that Rev W Awdry had
yup, verry faulty indeed
Yeah absolutely - it's the same real life engine!
Thanks for watching, Sam :)
33 54 says it all.
Our RAPEDO TRAM came straight out of its box and did a faultless performance all night on the dirty Club track,
Oh dear! I have bought one of these😮. I was so excited that a new LMS Black 5 was being released that I put one on pre-order straight away. I do hope that you were just unlucky enough to get a dud. If mine has similar issues I will let you know (unfortunately my layout is in bits awaiting re-development. Probably be a year before something happens…) I had saved up for this with limited funds I hope I have not wasted my money! Just a point I did notice that the instructions to release the tender chassis did say “to remove your P2 TENDER BODY..” Somebody at Hornby must have got confused.
Have you thought sending this faulty one back and get a replacement?
It's already gone back - but I don't want it replaced!
Well done with the video Sam great camera work as usual bye for now Philip
Thanks a lot Philip!
Well at least Hornby is always consistent in it's quality...I'll leave that at that 🤣
I have had a preorder on the Steam Generator version ever since they were announced.
I hope they fix the issues before that one goes out. The level of detail is amazing, and honestly the lack of die cast and even the warped running plate arent really deal breakers for me, as long as it runs fine.
The steam generator should add back a bunch of the missing weight at least.
I have the exact same issue with my Dublo Scotsman. Normally I'd return it immediately for a refund, but as all sold out, I decided to fix it myself. I took the tender connector apart, which is clipped together and fragile. But I got it off and found that the metal strips for the contacts are very dirty especially considering I have it for less than a year and didn't uncouple the tender too much. Then I cleaned the contacts with a fiberglass pencil and some alcohol. After that, she ran very nicely and now is DCC sound fitted. A shame thay yours is so horribly faulty. My question is on the P2 connector as well, is that how long it's gonna last, as mine also had a Bent contact and got dirty quickly. Taking it apart is quite risky so if you break the clip it's game over. I'm still thinking about buying the steam fitted model, as I want that, the lights and the sound. I'll have a very close look in a shop before my purchase as I live outside of the UK and returning anything is a huge pain. Sorry Sam that yours sucked, but hopefully, this is a one off mistake. Unlikely, yes, but unlikely things happen to all of us at the best of times.
I watched this review while watching my older black 5 run. Just to remind myself that I made the right choice.😂
haha you did - I still have the older black 5.... the new one is on it's way back to the shop in a coffin-shaped box...
Thanks for watching, Sam :)
@@SamsTrains I've been looking at other reviews for this model and pretty much their models are in good shape and have received positive feedback. Who knows maybe Hornby will send you a free replacement like they did with the Thompson A1.
@@SamsTrains Although the previous tooling is getting on for 25 years old Hornby’s previous Black 5 isn’t that bad. Sure it lacks all the modern bells and whistles but it’s a pretty good rendition of the real loco.
well done...i have one ca 20 years old...just fine...
This model is typical of many rtr models today. The reason the model has a bind is the excessive clearance between the brass bearings and diecast frames.
Why has a Black five got an LNER tender? Is it because the original is broken?
yea he explains it like 19 minutes into the video
Spoilers
What is the van Between the LSWR grey van and the blue wagon?
I’m gutted about this, been waiting with anticipation for the steam generator version of this, to be be my first trial of the steam generator… sort of in two minds how to proceed now. Will you contact hornby for a comment? I would love to know what they say about it
I think its and LMS Horse Box
When you weight the model, do you include the undriven tender? So that tender weight adds credibility, but does not add traction?
Second video I’ve seen in two days of problems with this loco , ridiculous when you think what it costs .
You buy models by the kilo? Cost comes in the detail and functions.
how come sam always get the one with glue marks seen a review of this loco with no glue marks and the lad remove the lamps with little trouble
It was Hornby's best black 5 ever. No engine ever had this high of meme potential.
To be fair to Hornby my sound fitted Accurascale Manor has just gone back as whist you can read decoder cv’s it’s as dead as a door nail when it comes to running. As models get more complicated are we seeing more issues?
Thank You Sam for your honesty. Great Job on this review.
…on a different note, does any other colorblind people have trouble seeing the review stars against the carpet? Or is it just me?
Does the five stand for "Five pound budget"?
Gotta buy 5 to get 1 working.
I know many have pointed this out, but being relatively new to familiarizing myself with locos, who made them, and whatnot, seeing an LNER tender on a Black 5 threw me for a loop
I actually think you are usually more than generous when reviewing Hornby to be honest Sam, so no I don't feel you're Hornby bashing and it's good to see the faults being highlighted more on locos that I agree are very expensive and should be built much better to justify the prices that Hornby attempt to command for these things. Thank you for the review.
27:20 I'm getting the W1 vibes from that Sam. Remember when the first hush hush did that, lol
Cheers Jasper & Willow
Yeah I do - quite a few new Hornby locos arriving in an unacceptable state of the past few years!
Thanks for watching, Sam :)
My Black 5 is from the last batch of the preves tooling. And it has a 21 pin decoder socket in the tender form the factory as well as a speaker somewhere in the loco (it did have TTS installed, but it failed after about 3 hours of straight running). And just from the tittle of teh video, I am happy that I have my older one
That's interesting - didn't realise any of the last batch had 21 pin sockets!
Thanks for watching, Sam :)
Well done mukka... mechanical lubricator is correct! 😂
Just need to train you stop calling handbrakes "turning wheels" and my training will be all but done! 😂
Bent frame!!!! Send it back. Hornby cannot help themselves... don't give them a freebie! Keep bashing them... I do.
Regards to you and Chloe from Oz.
Gaz 😁
Wonderful review even in failure. Potentially nice model let down by blind QC. During your review on that coupling connector, I did however wonder how did locos and tenders couple in real life? Are there any such real-life couplings accurately reproduced in model form?
Very good review Sam. It's the issues with the model that are bad I've pre ordered the smoke generator version. I've read some of the others comments and watched another review that was a more positive experience. It's pretty clear that there is a serious lack of consistency in quality control that is letting Hornby down. Issues occurring like this must be breaking the hearts of the designers in Margate. The factory in China has to get its act together or the quality control function has to be bought in house, otherwise I fear for Hornby's future. I've bought a few new Hornby locomotives and so far have been very happy with them ( Princess Coronation and Thane of Fife plus some Railroad Plus diesels) . I am going to keep my pre order live because of my previous good experience together with the pre order Flying Scotsman smoke generator version and hope both will be acceptable.
I'm not sure, but I think there are still multiple factories that Hornby uses. One can by an identical model (same catalogue number etc) but built in two different places. The result - one is superlative, and the other is as Sam received...
Explains part of the problem. As customers we can't be expected to take pot luck on whether we get a well or poorly produced model. In this example it failed to run out of the box. Other comments on this review show Sam is not alone in receiving shoddy goods. Hornby have to up their game on quality control to achieve higher levels of customer satisfaction. It can't afford to fail. It has to do better and all of the time for every model.
Hornby uses multiple factories* in China all owned by different people to make their models. Hence why you can get one model coming out with no issues but another having lots of QC problems.
Also it’s all very well saying “don’t use factory X again” but there are only a finite number of factories in China geared up to making model railway stuff and there is lots of competition for production slots from the huge number of model manufacturers out there.
* Yes at one time they did use a factory in China but that factory went into conical difficulties and got bought out by Kadder - who own Bachmann and who are not going to be making products for a rival
The above reads like a bunch of excuses. The fact remains that no manufacturer can expect their customers to take pot luck on whether the goods they purchase are good or poor. As I have previously written I have no problem with any new Hornby models I have purchased. Another unfortunate fact is others have, with Sam's review being an excellent demonstration. Hornby need to improve their quality control giving all potential customers the assurance their purchase will be of a good standard and free of defects.
Excuses or not that’s how manufacturers work
Do you seriously think Apple or Samsung test every single phone that comes out of the factory - that Bosch test every single washing machine they make or NEFF every single oven they produce?
Hornby are merely doing what every other manufacturer of mass produced goods does!
As others have commented, it looks like the DCC decoder is in the tender and when a DCC ready loco is running on DC analogue, the current runs from the pickups to the motor via the blanking plate. This is why, unlike locos that don't have the decoder in the tender, it won't run without the tender connected. I guess there must be connections on top and underneath that drawbar, 2 for pickup, 2 for motor, and some more for lighting, firebox flicker etc. I wonder if there is a loose connection on a motor wire on the tender half of the drawbar, with the wire just touching sometimes and loosing contact as it moves round the corners? It is possibly amenable to a quick fix if the wires are accessible, but they may not be and I fully agree with you not wanting to fiddle with it as you intend to return it. It is a shame that Hornby are still being let down by their quality control on this sort of thing - such a simple thing for them to get right during manufacture & testing and they got it wrong. I wonder if they do any testing at all?
I already pre-ordered mine. But yet I haven't seen it come or anything that says it's been shipped I got mine from rails of Sheffield.
Rails are brilliant if you get a faulty model, in my experience. More recently, out here in the colonies, locos arrive from them with a notation that (name) tested it.
I’m glad I’ve given up on British Railway Modelling. I will stick to my Marklin.
Awesome video Sam's trains
Oh I don't know, I think it looks quite cool with the LNER tender lol. Or maybe Hornby intent it as a static display unit with lamp and firebox flicker lol but seriously I was looking forward to potentially buying one of there as I don't have a Black 5... I will not be doing so now - so thank you for the review Sam