You people really made me confident enough to start DMing my first game! So far, we've tackled about half of the Mines of Phandalin adventure and it's been reasonably smooth, all things considered. And people seem to be having fun, which is what matters, in the end. Thanks for all your videos, to the whole team!
The only thing I ever try to balance is ability scores between players in your party. I just don't want people to be all-around better or worse. It's much more fun if players have specialties and niches when compared to their peers.
Factoid Gandalf and Saruman duel in Two towers movie (I don't remember really) was so boring ... they seemed to me more psions with only 1 telekinetic power instead of mages.... I really prefer modern writers like Ericksson or Gemmel ... no comparison. I recall Malazan's book of the fallen is based on Gurps thats a system with no super h.p.
I guess having been raised on 2nd Edition, I've always had a very different cultural concept of what "game balance" means. For me, I've never cared whether or not my characters are doing as much damage as everyone else, or whether I have just as many special abilities as they do. I've played characters on both ends of the spectrum, behind and ahead, and in all the years I've found only one thing matters at the table - Did everyone have a chance to help make the game fun? Did everyone get an equal chance to share in the spotlight over the course of the night? And did we all have the opportunity to affect the narrative that we're helping to weave? If the answer is yes, then the game is balanced. But, as I said earlier, I find that I have a very different view of Role-Playing games than most players who started with 3.x or later. I don't look at RPG's like games with some story, but as a shared narrative between players with rules that exist only as a way of preventing "Bang, bang, I shot you - no you didn't!"
I've certainly found the 5E "CR" system a bit wonky. There are character-ending low CR monsters (Intellect Devourer, Sea Hag, Ghoul) and monsters with a CR above their weight (Shield Guardian, Galeb Duhr, Ettin, Hill Giant...) can easily be taken down by lower characters. I think it really comes down to two questions: Does one (party or monster) have the potential to end the other fast? Does the monster have a "wild card" ability (petrification, ability reduces to 0hp, high chance of paralysis or stun, etc.) If so, give either side the chance to reconsider engaging. Give the players the agency to decide their fate. Surprise happens- it's part of the game, but when thats not on the table, let your level 2-3 party choose whether or not a nest of Cockatrices is worth it. I had a group of level 3s attack just ONE cockatrice aboard a sinking vessel (their choice to board, their choice to attack), and not one rolled a save above a 3. It happens. Balance is tricky, but try to remember that the world at large isn't "balanced for the players", but the players also have the choice when to engage a lot of the time. Allow for creative solutions, and your players might surprise you. Or that Sea Hag will frighten your 5th level Sorcerer to death in two actions, or your Rogue might willingly suck face with a disguised Succubus. It happens. Then it's not about balance. It's about a memorable story.
We had a party of 4-5 level characters stumble upon ONE cockatrice. Everyone rolled shitty and one by one we turned to stone. There was one player left and he decided to fall on his own sword. You can't make this shit up.
JPruInc Not sure if you knew this at the time, but if you're playing 5e then a cockatrice's petrification only lasts for about a day. Now whether your DM decided to buff the monster or just didn't agree with the curse as written, that's up to them, but I just thought I'd bring up that little tidbit. Personally I dislike the cockatrice in 5e, they seem too weak on their own; I much prefer the Dragon's Dogma/Witcher way of representing them, and feel they should be much closer to wyvern stats than a dumb chicken. What do you guys think? Also, have you guys considered streaming your sessions? The way you two talk about your past games, I feel I'd enjoy watching very much.
Robeadactyl Yeah, the Cockatrices petrification is only temporary, but the ship that was sinking was a little more permanent. So they would be statues at the bottom of the sea when they returned to normal. So it wasn't "Petrification as an end". It was more like "Petrification as a delivery system to that end." I reworked the story so that a tribe of Sahaugin worked for the villain and collected these statues for the bad guy. They would then transport them to a "James Bondian Villain" base where these statues would be crated up and placed on a dock. When the players returned to normal, they would have a chance to escape whereas commoners in this situation would be sold into slavery. The escape turned into a tense scene of planning and execution. That lead to an attempted sea journey in what amounts to a dory, which lead to them being lost, which lead to a fully random encounter (hand on heart) with a friendly Bronze Dragon who carried them to safety. So in the end, a TPK lead to a great scene, an amazing random encounter, and a possible ally for later. At the table in which I play, we had 3 of 4 level 5 characters fail their saves on a Medusa. It was a full on Save Or Suck situation, but given I've been playing since 1980, that was the norm for me. Making characters is something I do to relax, and the DM knows it. He knows I can pull out 2-4 characters out of my backpack in an instant, or write one up in under 10 minutes, back story and all. That's where Blunderpuck the Goblin Bard comes from... the death-by-petrification suffered by Luxxor the Protector Aasimar Light Cleric....who came from the retirement (long story) of Veritas the Teifling Paladin....who came from the death-and-swallowed-by-purple-worm of Gutwrench the Half-Ogre Barbarian.... The Underdark is a tough place to earn a living.
Is it really a TPK when they don't die? Whatever great way to rewrite the story so you don't just kill them and make them role new characters. Nothing beats a good old prison breakout.
Jay Tuffer why would an archer ever use strings so weak they break one in twenty times? Punishing past automatic fail for nat 1s is something that to me few people enjoy, especially players.
Roxurface My answer to that question is "his players." If they are still playing in his game then they don't mind that kind of punishment. I agree, having to restring a bow after a nat 1 is harsh.
Great video guys! On the topic of Game Balance: I just did a silly one-shot for my players where they were all level 1 Goblins. I rolled to determine a random magic item and gave them a +2 scimitar of speed (well they "acquired" it after massacring a village of Bunny People). I was expecting balance to go to hell, but it really didn't especially at lvl 1. Multiple characters went down, and even the fighter with the scimitar did when he got charged by a Unicorn (an awakened warhorse with a fake horn strapped on). Ended with the Deck of Many Things...lots of fun. Balance really isn't that big of a deal unless you follow the CR system religiously - which you shouldn't. I use it as a guide especially in early levels and quickly throw it out once I get a feel for what the players can handle.
Just found your channel from slightly older videos and they are really inspiring for setting up my new campaign. I usually don't DM, but I feel like I've learned enough to where I could run a decent campaign for my friends. Keep up the awesome videos, this content is super entertaining and useful!
Now that you mentioned the Tome of Beasts, I'd like to know your opinions about the Kobold Press 5E supplements (Deep Magic, Heroes etc.). Would you make an episode about those, like with Volo's Guide?
Thank you! I try to tell people this and they react like I'm nuts. I enjoy high fantasy. I think characters should be essentially demigods with powerful artifacts by the time they're in their teen levels. But very few gods' iconic abilities are about dishing out damage. Let your rogue or bard be a trickster god, let your paladin be a god of justice, let your fighter be god of war. Challenging a party of demigods can be pretty difficult, but it's still totally possible. And yes, sometimes the party should overwhelmingly defeat an enemy--there are a lot more goblins in the world than high level demons, after all.
We've gotten 'godly' in a couple of campaigns, but mostly we play High-Fantasy. Good amount of magic items, and plenty of wacky shit to get up to. Though, it is fun to play a gritty, low-magic game from time to time. Let's you appreciate the good times.
Honestly I would love an episode on how to handle the wish spell. One of my players is a hyperactive CN bard who has fantastic ideas for fights (she used Tasha's Hideous Laughter on a werewolf boss and then used polymorph to turn him into a puppy) and she has Wish prepared constantly just in case and I have no idea how she's going to use it, but I don't think I'll be prepared when she does.
Love the video as always! Thanks for the reassurances about game balance; as a new DM, it's helpful to hear that I don't need to sweat balance too much. I had worried about it, because I just reeeally like giving my party cool magic items, so now they're pretty loaded and they're only level five! Like you said, I'll try to keep trusting my gut and what I see at the table in order to make the encounters continue to be fun and memorable.
As someone DMing for years I have to say what matters most... is everyone enjoying their time at the table. I'm working on a a specific encounter set designed for my party's wood elf mastermind rogue. He doesn't get to shine often, but he's bad ass enough when certain elements fall into place. I do this for each of my players now and then to let them have their time to step up. My biggest reward as DM is when they're leaving and still chatting about what they enjoyed most that session. Give the people what they want... They will appreciate it, and keep coming back for more.
I hope you like them. Thrilling Intent has a rather small fanbase for it's exceptional quality. Critical Role on the other hand may be the most popular live game of D&D right now.
you could check out Rollplay, it's my favorite roleplay shows, it's on itmeJP channel here on RUclips. He got loads of different shows, some DnD, but a lot of other stuff too :)
You guys are the best. Some of the best production on DnD content out there, seriously great. I love the elements of lore you guys integrate into stuff, it's made DnD even more interesting for me, and your content is a pleasure to watch, rather than slogging through poor audio/visuals. Great job guys, keep it up!!
Unbalanced encounters can be the most fun. Case and point, a combat that still lives on in infamy within my group: the Wendigo Encounter. I found a homebrew wendigo 5th edition stat block, CR 7. The party was 3 lv7 characters. Throw in some envitonmental hazards. The party barely survived, but that was the most memorable encounter I've ever run.
I really enjoy your show, you guys are the only d&d-related youtubers who give me the impression you actually played alot of d&d and talk from experience rather than "what if..." suppositions.
THANKS for making this video. As a new player in D&D (started with 5th ed.), I am ALWAYS so concerned about the battle planing, checking the CR, and ending up with either ridiculously easy battles or TPK (which I try to mitigate by dropping the enemies HP). And people always talk about "balance" and "character optimization" etc. This video relaxed me a bit and made me feel more assertive about myself as a DM. *thumbs up*
A very recent example of the 'white room'-esque discussions that go on: I was looking up ideas for a Pathfinder Arcane Trickster. The character board denizens suggested I multiclass rogue with sorcerer, and focus my build on- get this- SNEAK ATTACKING WITH SCORCHING RAY. Not sneaking, not sleight-of-hand-ing, not disabling devices. Shooting fire out of my hand to alpha-strike people.
4:39 I am that player. I'm still in my first DnD campaign (2 years in, lvl 17 atm), having picked Barbarian so I could talk a lot about Norse mythology which I love. It was fun until around 10-12 level when the wizard eclipsed the rest of the party and never looked back. My DM was kind enough to give me a pretty powerful artifact (a maul crafted by Thor so I could kill Thrym, god of frost giants) basically giving me access to some Fighter Battle Master maneuvers, and now combat isn't as boring. However, I don't see myself ever picking Barbarian again because it's too simple, and I wish I knew it was "the noob class" as I was told a year in by the more experienced players. It wasn't about being "effective" as much as having some more options in combat other than "I hit him with my axe" or "I throw my javelin" or "I grapple him". With all this said, you've inspired me to DM myself, and I'm so far 4 sessions into running Curse of Strahd and having a blast! Thank you for your videos!
In general I agree. Extreme mismatches can be a problem, though. But I’d imagine that usually comes about as a result of player choices. In the extreme though, when an encounter is challenging to the strongest member of a party, the enemies can steamroller the weaker members. Or conversely, if the weaker characters can compete, then the stronger characters are not even challenged. I don’t think any of the classes as written are too mismatched. But a player who consistently makes nonproductive choices is overall diminishing the ability of the whole party.
Thanks so much for this one. I just got back into D&D after almost twenty years and I am trying to make sure that my family has fun with it. I keep throwing things at them to read their likes and dislikes and the CR system was just not working out like I thought it should. Your verification of that was great for me. I know I can just throw stuff at them at as the DM, work the encounter out to be fun and memorable, not just challenging or too easy! Really great work from all of you. I have watched MANY videos in the past two months to get caught up and try to learn the new system and Web DM has been my go to source for not just the rules, but the interpretations and the way to incorporate the rules into the game. Thanks again.
I have been saying this ever since I started running D&D 5e! Balance is only a problem when player start being unhappy with their character. And CRs are mostly useless. Instead most DMs should just go what sounds fun and makes sense storywise. As long as everyone has fun everything is ok. Very few things are truly unbalanced enough to destroy that! :)
It's a matter of degree. I heard them talking about people that "do eight more points of damage per round." Yeah, that's not necessarily game-breaking. But some violations of game balance, made possible by problems in the rules, are a big deal. It was really bad when I played back in the 1980's. We had a (1st edition) elven fighter/magic-user that specialized with swords then dual wielded them after casting haste on themselves. They got eight attacks a round in a system where most characters never got more than one. In another (1st edition) campaign I played a 8th druid and was able to successively cast three "Call Lightning" spells (which entitled me to a total of 24 lightning bolts for 10d8 damage each, in a system where an ancient red dragon as at most 88 hit points) and in so doing single-handedly ended an invasion/siege by humanoids that was was to be the campaign's main focus. Minor stuff like an extra 5 or 10 points of damage in a round are trivial in a well-run game but when one player can essentially replace the entire party, finishing entire climactic combat scenes on their own, it's an issue. 5th edition seems to be pretty good in terms of game balance. My only real complaint is that some of the feats are "no-brainers"; either a player takes that feat or their concept is not viable. Imagine if there was one spell that was noticeably superior to all other spells... so that every wizard takes it; such a spell would lead to wizards that lacked diversity. In the same way, these "must have feats" make all the characters I've seen while DM'ing Adventurer's League indistinguishable in combat. How many ranged fighters have you seen without Sharpshooter? How many "tank" style fighters have you seen without Shield Master and Heavy Armor Master? How many druids actually take the circle of the Land (my wife did, and was ridiculed by other players for not playing a druid right because she couldn't shape-shift like they expected). When there's one feat or class option that's superior in all ways, so that it's foolish not to take it, then all the characters start to look alike after awhile. That's not good. While none of the feats are so broken that they're game-breaking, better game balance would lead to more viable character types and more diversity. Not game-breaking but still not something to dismiss out-of-hand.
Shane Beeman Its seems like they could pump out 4-5 videos in a 2 hour recording session. Im sure these guys have tons of topics they could share their opinions on.
Ryan Springer Of course they can. lol. Any avid experienced players can go on. They are passionate and knowledgeable! They deserve more subs (which they are quickly gaining) so they are able to put more time into it. :)
Hey guys, thanks for this. I'm a new DM and for every encounter that I think will be awesome I always check the CR accounting to see if my group can handle it and it is always seems like too much. I think that I might throw them one of an encounter to see how they do. Thanks for the all the advice! Love the Channel!
You know, I just got into DnD and listening to you guys (for the first time) I have to commend my GM on what you called "spotlight time" because, thinking on it, he's given everyone a chance to shine.
I had enough of balance while raiding in WoW for 10+ years. I have left that behind and could care less about "damage" balance. Are the classes fun? That is all that matters, and can you get some good role playing and out of combat stuff to do? After a 15 year absence from D&D I am glad to be back.
I think the reason why arguments over "tiny points of damage" happen is because it's the aspect the players have control over. You make choices about your character's build, and if you're dealing 1d8 damage while another player is dealing 2d4+2 damage, the game is telling you that you chose wrong, which is a problem if you had a reason for making the choice you did. I don't like it when the game rules tell me I was wrong to make a decision which I made based on my personal preferences.
Hey guys, I always wondered, do you guys improvise on the spot and just say what comes to mind or do you prepare a lot? Because it feels so natural when you are talking, but very well structured and a lot of information. Natural(20) speakers probably;)
The main argument for "balance" is making players not feel neglected in games, no matter the system. If one player is doing EVERYTHING, what is the point of the other players and characters even being there? I have run into this issue a couple of times, where a few players don't feel like they are doing anything, so it drags away from their fun. That is really it, for me Balance means 'An even playing field for all players"
I love your videos! This is definitely the best D&D channel I have come across. As a new player, I've learned a lot from your videos and really appreciate the wealth of information and advice.
This came with perfect timing for me, I was freaking out a few days before my first real DMing experience about how to handle monster groups "What do you mean it's a gut feeling? My gut isn't saying anything, my players are going to murder this group of mephits or get TPKed and there goes the campaign!" Now... I'm still nervous, but less so about the actual situations that I'm going to be building.
I agree for the most part, but in my new campaign I have been having some problems. First, my DM let the paladin reroll his stats until it he had outrageous stats because his first rolls were a bit below the Matrix. Then, the first mission he gives the party like 39000 gold (me being a firbolg druid of the forest can't really use upgrade my armor/weapons being my focus) and then he let the paladin get a +3 sword and shield. Guess what his AC is at level 5? 22. Mine? 11. So I focus on RP and creative fighting, but with our 7 person party, my plans that take multiple turns can't take effect because not many things can survive 7 people. Also, the argue that the maim reason to play is NOT fun.
Oh! seven players is a terrible idea. Maybe it's possible to splinter the group in to a smaller one with some players that has a playstyle more similar to yours?
DMed a final boss battle with a CR14 half-dragon sorcerer, a CR9 necromancer, and a mind controlled lvl 8 party member. Their solution: banish the necromancer, polymorph the sorcerer, and spend the rest of the encounter trying to pin down the party member.
I'm restarting my game running Tomorrow by doing a Plane hoping campaign (inspired mostly from your planar episode) and I've been pretty unbalanced with everything lately. I agree with tossing out CR and just dealing with what you toss out there. I've been pretty unbalanced lately in my prior DM outtings and it always puts the party into thinking mode and it brings out the best in sometimes the unlikeliest people, like that person who is always sitting on their phone finally chimes in.
Since I started using 5E I have never used the CR system and I have never worried about balance. I literally look at where the party is going, choose a monster (try to guess what kind will be best before hand) and roll with it. I adjust HP and damage of the monster on the fly depending on what kind of encounter I want it to be. For the most part I want the story to keep going and want my players to help forge that so for my boss fights I will make adjustments on the fly and even make up certain spell abilities to make it more intense and all my players have loved this and how I do it. It lets them have a sense of being heroic and all powerful while also making the stakes higher.
My DM loves Kobolds, but it's mostly due to Deekin from Neverwinter Nights. On top of that there are some hazy rules with Dragonwrought Kobolds from what I'm to understand. My DM told me something about making yourself a great wurm, which would allow for epic feat selection at early levels.
I love it! We've gotten some criticism that our thumbnails are "click-baity". So we thought this was the perfect show to make a thumbnail that is pure click bait. Glad you enjoyed.
I don't understand how people find them "click-baity" when they represent what the video is actually about. I love em! They are easy to spot so I know just when you upload.
Same here. We don't get it and don't really care about the criticism. I mean, you can't make everyone happy and most people seem to like them just fine. Buuuut, this particular thumbnail was a joke that just kept going until we finally decided to use it.
I could not agree more!!! I've been saying this ever since I first saw this argument start to come up. I started with Basic/Expert and balance was never even a thought.
i really felt that shadowrun comment, in the short lived game i played, when the hacker was doing his thing our characters were literally sitting on the floor playing cards (thanks rolld20's oddly robust gaming tools!)
I had a player introduce a new character recently who is intentionally weak in combat, but magnificent in social situations. He's playing an inquisitive rogue a subclass that is great for detecting lies and finding clues. The stats he went for doubled down on that. In combat he has trouble, but even so, at the end of the day that inquisitor is the most dangerous member of the party to my bad guys. Sure he isn't going to be killing very many of them, but if he can figure out what the evil plan is and detect the lies of their spies and confederates, he can change the world in a much more definite way than he could with a bit more damage.
So far most memorable encounter for my group has been Ogre Mage and 2 Orcs vs. 5 4th level characters. I did change one thing: Fireball instead of Cone of Cold on the Ogre Mage's spell list.
My second time DMing I threw a buffed cyclops (Chief) at four 5th level characters. It was backed up by a dragonborn lightning monk hiding in water... a squad of dragonborn soldiers (veterans reskinned)... a bunch of human slave slingers... and a really buffed kobold kommander. The warlock/rogue player used stealth and Pact of the Chain to oneshot the cyclops chief with a dragonling familiar. One tail attack and a failed CON save (failed with a 1, so it failed by five points and went unconscious). Then the party *trounced* all the additional enemies. Just decapitated them left, right, and center. It was awesome. And it was intended to put those players into either a last stand, or escape-mode. Because it was a oneshot and I’m a newb DM.
Regarding Shadowrun, in 5th Ed they kinda changed how the Matrix (the internet/virtual reality) works. The farther you are from the thing you are trying to hack, the harder it gets. And if you can connect directly to the device, hacking becomes more easly. And as many devices can be in a sort of master/slave relationship, you can exploit vulnerabilities in the system by hacking something like a camera or a bending machine. Still is crazy dungerous to be a decker/technomancer, but mages also have their spotlight when they go astral. And things like street samurais, riggers, physical adepts are all about combat (they all got their different styles in how they fight).
i understand and share most of their points.Unbalances can be well tolerated and dealt with during the game, they depend on the situations and for most of the playtime they don't get even noticed. But having a (closer to be) balanced game is far far better as you would avoid the issues rather than solving them, which is sometimes a bit harder, especially when it comes to player feeling like their class features choice is limited by some options being too good or bad. Why would i pay for a book with new classes and items and spells if they are not balanced? i can make stuff up too, for free.I expect whoever is selling them to make all options viable and roughly equivalent.
One easy way to get rid of a house of 75 goblins is fist stealth kill the ones on the out side then have the wizard throw a bunch of fire to burn the the house down after the fighter has barricaded the door.
My biggest barrier to enjoying 5th edition is scheduling. we get a group going online and are set for schedule.. then after 2-3 sessions people want to change it up. i feel like just doing a 1v1 campaign with someone to avoid 'wasting' time
I agree, I thought we could have a decent debate, but as the show went along you discussed all the things I would have brought up. I do think that severe balance issues need to be brought up to WOTC though. (ranger) However, I think the core books are pretty well balanced with a few exceptions. 1) The beast master pet was more of a liability than fun 2) The bard "can" be very dominant in all three pillars of adventure, allowing a player to steal the spotlight 3) The warlocks eldritch blast is very good, unfortunately it also makes it the go to action choice, which limits fun. Also, you didn't bring up one of the easiest ways to disrupt party balance; which is to allow your players to roll stats.
kobold bard named ohsos secks eet. I like the idea of using the beg plead action with bonus bardic inspiration to give advantage to the heavy hitter and an extra d6 just in case
Hello fellow web DM's! First things first: I love your videos. I am currently watching one after another and it is great. Second: I honestly never saw it that way you described here. At my table balancing was also never a big discussion, even though some players have much more powerful builds when it comes to combat. The only issue I am facing is that the CR system is complete crap. Especially if you are also considering the enviroment. But as you said the players do not really care if the balancing is on point or not. It is the DM's that are disussing about it, even though it is not even needed.
I like the focus on spotlight balance. You can have a big power range in the party but if every character is getting a chance to shine and your players are having fun then don't overthink it. If you have PC that is hogging the spotlight then that's when you need to step in a little more.
We had one of these game balance is everything -guys at our gaming table. The person picked a class that was not meant for fighting but for healing and other esoteric magic which the class was great at. But they demanded and complained how their character was not as good at fighting as my 20-dex elf-ranger with a specialisation in longbows or our fighter who was I think 16 str dex and con. And a giant viking with a magic sword on top of all that. The guy prided in knowing the system front to back but still complained that his character was weaker than dedicated fighters. His trying to control and minmax the party also lead to arguments between players and characters. Ultimately our gm decided to exclude that person from our gaming table. He used a convenient lull in the campaign to come up with a story reason to exclude the character from the game.
My current campaign has characters that are all getting a bonus class for story reasons (Bard is also gains levels of warlock when she kills enough sentient creatures because of a deal she made with the God of assassins, Paladin accidentally ate a devil who grants him levels of Warlock as he absorbs more Hellish material.) and the fight without ANY bonus class at all kicks the most ass in combat.
When I first played Pathfinder I had no idea how much of a damage engine the barbarian is. I made a great ax swinging barbarian. There was literally one round in a combat where the rogue did 3 points and I crit'd for seventy-five. The DM told me he just increased how many Hit Points the monsters had or how many there were to make up for it. It sounds too simple to be an effective solution, but it worked when we did the game.
How I do Shadowrun turn-balancing: Hacker gets better connection to target location if they have a legit cord connection to the target server, or if they're close enough to be in the same room. Also, they just roll their basic Computer rolls instead of doing the Dice Roll Acrobatics that the book proposes.
Absolutely agree. Balance is the easiest part of design to fix, but 95% of what you'll find in online forums. However, I don't find the CR system useless. Strictly following the system leads to problems, of course, but that seems to me to be clearly an interpretation problem instead of a system problem. CR, like most things in D&D, should be interpreted according to the Barbosa method of interpretation: "It's more what you'd call 'guidelines' than actual rules."
I remember once our party got into a fight with an giant animated kobold statue, it was meant to kick our ass then get interrupted by it's owner, but a bunch of good rolls later we smashed it's legs at the knee and my Tiefling Monk ripped it's core right out of it's chest and smashed it. It was so fucking cool and we were all talking about it for days.
Ehhhh.... I think balance is really important in that it can be unfun for some people if another person is broken. I had a DM that let spellcasting out of some of it's limitations, particularly extra attack being used with cantrips, which let someone eldritch blast like crazy, doing damage competitive with melee fighters from waaaay far away with no cost whatsoever. But that's on the DM themself, not the general rules of the game. If the ultimate judge is broken then the game itself gets unpleasant really fast.
Dopplerats! I've got an entire arc of a campaign planned around them infecting the city sewers. FYI the disease they spread doesn't make a clone that tries to kill you, just that the cloning process that wrecks your system, and the clone immediately dies. That said, I am know changing it in my game to your idea, because that's so much cooler.
I have to admit, I too really wish they'd bring back the Gem Dragons. I keep adding them in myself and it is fun to see newer players get introduced to them. They also had Ash Dragons, and Magma dragons that they introduced via Dragon magazine. Was fun to have characters deal with a dragon that regurgitates magma...
Great videos. I'm a happy subscriber. I do have a request for a video/response. In one of the videos I remember Jim mentioning you guys ran a game in years' past that only had 2 PCs. I'm new as a DM, and in the area I live in there aren't a lot of people interested in playing. I have a couple of friends that are interested, and I was wondering if you could share your experiences DMing for only 2 or 3 PCs, and some ideas for how to make combat fun and challenging, even if all of the party roles aren't covered. Obviously it would be a heavy roleplay/social game, but I struggle coming up with interesting encounters for an inexperienced, unorthodox group. Again, great videos. I patiently await more from you guys. Best of wishes.
I used to have a lot of issues with "Oh X is unfair so I changed it, Y is too good so I changed it", but I rolled a lot of that back, let the mechanics function as they were designed. The only things I have meaningfully changed and kept, were turning class based immunities into resistances, and making a successful dex save with evasion 1/4 damage instead of half. I changed those specifically with the idea that they limit in combat design space. The party has a monk? Well he can solo my adult green dragon at level 9 (not hypothetical, actually happened in rise of Tiamat). But that's where I draw the line. If immunity would fundamentally change and neuter an encounter, then something else needs to be worked out. At least in my eyes.
awesome show and awesome episode. thats how I run my game and my my players love it, which makes me love. keep up the good work boys, this is the best d&d show on the tubes!!!
I don't mind it as long as they are still part of the game. Sometimes one of the people go out shopping alone and want to buy something the party might not need to know about. More often than not the other players will be on their phone not really paying attention because well "We aren't part of it so no reason for us really hear about it when our characters don't" The second we get back into group stuff or someone else takes the lead then they will cut down on the phone use or completly stop with it.
Man, do I enjoy those last parts, just after the final song, where you hear them chit chat about anything! I don't even know why XD I just wait expectingly for those :P
Thanks for watching! Want more Web DM in your life? Get our podcast here: www.patreon.com/webdm
I just discovered you channel and I swear everytime I see the name, for a second, I think it says Web MD. I think I'm disletctic.
You people really made me confident enough to start DMing my first game! So far, we've tackled about half of the Mines of Phandalin adventure and it's been reasonably smooth, all things considered.
And people seem to be having fun, which is what matters, in the end. Thanks for all your videos, to the whole team!
Glad we could help and glad you're enjoying the game!
Hope you're keeping at it. These vids are getting me itching to come out of DND retirement too. One day.
I'm about to start that module later today
This show is great and these guys deserve more subs.
Still waiting for some more of those Class summaries. They are the best.
I totally agree! I have been waiting to see what they do with sorcerer/warlock/wizards.
This show is amazing
Josh B Good they have done Wizard
They are great! Try and share it with friends and new dm's!
I concur, I am a very happy subscriber. :D
The only thing I ever try to balance is ability scores between players in your party. I just don't want people to be all-around better or worse. It's much more fun if players have specialties and niches when compared to their peers.
I think of LOTR. Gandalf adventuring with hobbits? Def not same power level
And yet they get the same amount of spotlight. That's one of the things I love about LOTR.
To be fair, Gandalf didn't use his full power most of the time. A lot of players don't have that kind of restraint
Factoid Gandalf and Saruman duel in Two towers movie (I don't remember really) was so boring ... they seemed to me more psions with only 1 telekinetic power instead of mages.... I really prefer modern writers like Ericksson or Gemmel ... no comparison. I recall Malazan's book of the fallen is based on Gurps thats a system with no super h.p.
I don't know... Gandalf is roughly equivalent to a level 1 D&D wizard to be honest. A little bit a of light and fire and that's it.
Gandalf has to deliberately not use his full power... it's part of his existence. He has a lot more up his sleeve than a bit of light and fire. :P
I guess having been raised on 2nd Edition, I've always had a very different cultural concept of what "game balance" means. For me, I've never cared whether or not my characters are doing as much damage as everyone else, or whether I have just as many special abilities as they do. I've played characters on both ends of the spectrum, behind and ahead, and in all the years I've found only one thing matters at the table -
Did everyone have a chance to help make the game fun? Did everyone get an equal chance to share in the spotlight over the course of the night? And did we all have the opportunity to affect the narrative that we're helping to weave? If the answer is yes, then the game is balanced.
But, as I said earlier, I find that I have a very different view of Role-Playing games than most players who started with 3.x or later. I don't look at RPG's like games with some story, but as a shared narrative between players with rules that exist only as a way of preventing "Bang, bang, I shot you - no you didn't!"
I've certainly found the 5E "CR" system a bit wonky. There are character-ending low CR monsters (Intellect Devourer, Sea Hag, Ghoul) and monsters with a CR above their weight (Shield Guardian, Galeb Duhr, Ettin, Hill Giant...) can easily be taken down by lower characters.
I think it really comes down to two questions:
Does one (party or monster) have the potential to end the other fast?
Does the monster have a "wild card" ability (petrification, ability reduces to 0hp, high chance of paralysis or stun, etc.)
If so, give either side the chance to reconsider engaging. Give the players the agency to decide their fate. Surprise happens- it's part of the game, but when thats not on the table, let your level 2-3 party choose whether or not a nest of Cockatrices is worth it.
I had a group of level 3s attack just ONE cockatrice aboard a sinking vessel (their choice to board, their choice to attack), and not one rolled a save above a 3.
It happens.
Balance is tricky, but try to remember that the world at large isn't "balanced for the players", but the players also have the choice when to engage a lot of the time.
Allow for creative solutions, and your players might surprise you. Or that Sea Hag will frighten your 5th level Sorcerer to death in two actions, or your Rogue might willingly suck face with a disguised Succubus. It happens.
Then it's not about balance. It's about a memorable story.
We had a party of 4-5 level characters stumble upon ONE cockatrice. Everyone rolled shitty and one by one we turned to stone. There was one player left and he decided to fall on his own sword. You can't make this shit up.
JPruInc Not sure if you knew this at the time, but if you're playing 5e then a cockatrice's petrification only lasts for about a day. Now whether your DM decided to buff the monster or just didn't agree with the curse as written, that's up to them, but I just thought I'd bring up that little tidbit. Personally I dislike the cockatrice in 5e, they seem too weak on their own; I much prefer the Dragon's Dogma/Witcher way of representing them, and feel they should be much closer to wyvern stats than a dumb chicken. What do you guys think?
Also, have you guys considered streaming your sessions? The way you two talk about your past games, I feel I'd enjoy watching very much.
3rd edition. That shit was permanent until dispelled.
Robeadactyl Yeah, the Cockatrices petrification is only temporary, but the ship that was sinking was a little more permanent. So they would be statues at the bottom of the sea when they returned to normal.
So it wasn't "Petrification as an end". It was more like "Petrification as a delivery system to that end."
I reworked the story so that a tribe of Sahaugin worked for the villain and collected these statues for the bad guy. They would then transport them to a "James Bondian Villain" base where these statues would be crated up and placed on a dock. When the players returned to normal, they would have a chance to escape whereas commoners in this situation would be sold into slavery.
The escape turned into a tense scene of planning and execution.
That lead to an attempted sea journey in what amounts to a dory, which lead to them being lost, which lead to a fully random encounter (hand on heart) with a friendly Bronze Dragon who carried them to safety.
So in the end, a TPK lead to a great scene, an amazing random encounter, and a possible ally for later.
At the table in which I play, we had 3 of 4 level 5 characters fail their saves on a Medusa. It was a full on Save Or Suck situation, but given I've been playing since 1980, that was the norm for me. Making characters is something I do to relax, and the DM knows it. He knows I can pull out 2-4 characters out of my backpack in an instant, or write one up in under 10 minutes, back story and all.
That's where Blunderpuck the Goblin Bard comes from... the death-by-petrification suffered by Luxxor the Protector Aasimar Light Cleric....who came from the retirement (long story) of Veritas the Teifling Paladin....who came from the death-and-swallowed-by-purple-worm of Gutwrench the Half-Ogre Barbarian....
The Underdark is a tough place to earn a living.
Is it really a TPK when they don't die? Whatever great way to rewrite the story so you don't just kill them and make them role new characters. Nothing beats a good old prison breakout.
Started playing dnd a month ago, now I'm dming for 3 groups. Thanks for the info web dm, dnd has gotten me back in touch with many old friends.
Thanks! Glad we could help.
Well your first mistake as a new DM is going to Reddit.
Chad-Solomon Dixon, all the more reason for a video like this... to tell them not to worry about that Reddit crap
Chad-Solomon Dixon Reddit is funny to read sometimes, but other times it's Crenge worthy.
I got yelled at by reddit for having an archers bow break on a nat 1. Fuck those guys.
Jay Tuffer why would an archer ever use strings so weak they break one in twenty times? Punishing past automatic fail for nat 1s is something that to me few people enjoy, especially players.
Roxurface My answer to that question is "his players." If they are still playing in his game then they don't mind that kind of punishment. I agree, having to restring a bow after a nat 1 is harsh.
I love the cliff plus chandelier comment. I now feel the need to set up that encounter
I know Jim is going to use that soon. I'll now play a swashbuckler in every campaign until that glorious day...
You should visit the Yawning Portal.
Game balance discussions only considers a fight on Final Destination with no items, but in d&d, there's so much factors influencing The action.
from driver's ed to fox only, final destination, no items. if anyone gets that reference
Monsters that punch above their weight? Freaking Beholders! If a character gets all the wrong beams on them in one turn? Dead man.
I really love all of the outtakes and setup that has been getting included at the end of these videos haha
Great video guys! On the topic of Game Balance:
I just did a silly one-shot for my players where they were all level 1 Goblins. I rolled to determine a random magic item and gave them a +2 scimitar of speed (well they "acquired" it after massacring a village of Bunny People). I was expecting balance to go to hell, but it really didn't especially at lvl 1. Multiple characters went down, and even the fighter with the scimitar did when he got charged by a Unicorn (an awakened warhorse with a fake horn strapped on). Ended with the Deck of Many Things...lots of fun. Balance really isn't that big of a deal unless you follow the CR system religiously - which you shouldn't. I use it as a guide especially in early levels and quickly throw it out once I get a feel for what the players can handle.
Just found your channel from slightly older videos and they are really inspiring for setting up my new campaign. I usually don't DM, but I feel like I've learned enough to where I could run a decent campaign for my friends. Keep up the awesome videos, this content is super entertaining and useful!
Now that you mentioned the Tome of Beasts, I'd like to know your opinions about the Kobold Press 5E supplements (Deep Magic, Heroes etc.). Would you make an episode about those, like with Volo's Guide?
Thank you!
I try to tell people this and they react like I'm nuts.
I enjoy high fantasy. I think characters should be essentially demigods with powerful artifacts by the time they're in their teen levels. But very few gods' iconic abilities are about dishing out damage. Let your rogue or bard be a trickster god, let your paladin be a god of justice, let your fighter be god of war. Challenging a party of demigods can be pretty difficult, but it's still totally possible.
And yes, sometimes the party should overwhelmingly defeat an enemy--there are a lot more goblins in the world than high level demons, after all.
We've gotten 'godly' in a couple of campaigns, but mostly we play High-Fantasy. Good amount of magic items, and plenty of wacky shit to get up to. Though, it is fun to play a gritty, low-magic game from time to time. Let's you appreciate the good times.
Yea, I also really like low magic campaigns. I had a lot of Dark Sun books back in the day and loved them!
Honestly I would love an episode on how to handle the wish spell. One of my players is a hyperactive CN bard who has fantastic ideas for fights (she used Tasha's Hideous Laughter on a werewolf boss and then used polymorph to turn him into a puppy) and she has Wish prepared constantly just in case and I have no idea how she's going to use it, but I don't think I'll be prepared when she does.
Counterspell is your friend.
Love the video as always! Thanks for the reassurances about game balance; as a new DM, it's helpful to hear that I don't need to sweat balance too much. I had worried about it, because I just reeeally like giving my party cool magic items, so now they're pretty loaded and they're only level five! Like you said, I'll try to keep trusting my gut and what I see at the table in order to make the encounters continue to be fun and memorable.
As someone DMing for years I have to say what matters most... is everyone enjoying their time at the table. I'm working on a a specific encounter set designed for my party's wood elf mastermind rogue. He doesn't get to shine often, but he's bad ass enough when certain elements fall into place. I do this for each of my players now and then to let them have their time to step up. My biggest reward as DM is when they're leaving and still chatting about what they enjoyed most that session. Give the people what they want... They will appreciate it, and keep coming back for more.
Anyone else listen to The Adventure Zone? Just finished listening to the live shows, so amazing.
I actually just found them like a week ago when I caught up with Critical Role and Thrilling Intent. Taako really makes that game for me. Good shit.
ill have to check out those shows you mentioned. im hungering for more dnd content
I hope you like them. Thrilling Intent has a rather small fanbase for it's exceptional quality. Critical Role on the other hand may be the most popular live game of D&D right now.
you could check out Rollplay, it's my favorite roleplay shows, it's on itmeJP channel here on RUclips. He got loads of different shows, some DnD, but a lot of other stuff too :)
Jim giving props to the Dopplerat... Have yet to use some, really really want to.
You guys are the best. Some of the best production on DnD content out there, seriously great. I love the elements of lore you guys integrate into stuff, it's made DnD even more interesting for me, and your content is a pleasure to watch, rather than slogging through poor audio/visuals.
Great job guys, keep it up!!
My new name is going to be "quadratic wizard"
Unbalanced encounters can be the most fun. Case and point, a combat that still lives on in infamy within my group: the Wendigo Encounter. I found a homebrew wendigo 5th edition stat block, CR 7. The party was 3 lv7 characters. Throw in some envitonmental hazards. The party barely survived, but that was the most memorable encounter I've ever run.
Love the behind the scenes conversations, and show prep.
would love to see a more indepth review of new races in Volo's
Jgosse indeed. I just made a kenku sorcerer and would love to hear their opinion on the new races!
I really enjoy your show, you guys are the only d&d-related youtubers who give me the impression you actually played alot of d&d and talk from experience rather than "what if..." suppositions.
Where is this weeks upload? *not so patiently waiting for sorcerer video* :)
THANKS for making this video. As a new player in D&D (started with 5th ed.), I am ALWAYS so concerned about the battle planing, checking the CR, and ending up with either ridiculously easy battles or TPK (which I try to mitigate by dropping the enemies HP). And people always talk about "balance" and "character optimization" etc. This video relaxed me a bit and made me feel more assertive about myself as a DM. *thumbs up*
A very recent example of the 'white room'-esque discussions that go on: I was looking up ideas for a Pathfinder Arcane Trickster. The character board denizens suggested I multiclass rogue with sorcerer, and focus my build on- get this- SNEAK ATTACKING WITH SCORCHING RAY. Not sneaking, not sleight-of-hand-ing, not disabling devices. Shooting fire out of my hand to alpha-strike people.
4:39 I am that player. I'm still in my first DnD campaign (2 years in, lvl 17 atm), having picked Barbarian so I could talk a lot about Norse mythology which I love. It was fun until around 10-12 level when the wizard eclipsed the rest of the party and never looked back. My DM was kind enough to give me a pretty powerful artifact (a maul crafted by Thor so I could kill Thrym, god of frost giants) basically giving me access to some Fighter Battle Master maneuvers, and now combat isn't as boring. However, I don't see myself ever picking Barbarian again because it's too simple, and I wish I knew it was "the noob class" as I was told a year in by the more experienced players. It wasn't about being "effective" as much as having some more options in combat other than "I hit him with my axe" or "I throw my javelin" or "I grapple him".
With all this said, you've inspired me to DM myself, and I'm so far 4 sessions into running Curse of Strahd and having a blast! Thank you for your videos!
In general I agree.
Extreme mismatches can be a problem, though. But I’d imagine that usually comes about as a result of player choices.
In the extreme though, when an encounter is challenging to the strongest member of a party, the enemies can steamroller the weaker members. Or conversely, if the weaker characters can compete, then the stronger characters are not even challenged.
I don’t think any of the classes as written are too mismatched. But a player who consistently makes nonproductive choices is overall diminishing the ability of the whole party.
In my experience with 3.x D&D, the fighter was always envious of the mighty wizard.
Thanks so much for this one. I just got back into D&D after almost twenty years and I am trying to make sure that my family has fun with it. I keep throwing things at them to read their likes and dislikes and the CR system was just not working out like I thought it should. Your verification of that was great for me. I know I can just throw stuff at them at as the DM, work the encounter out to be fun and memorable, not just challenging or too easy! Really great work from all of you. I have watched MANY videos in the past two months to get caught up and try to learn the new system and Web DM has been my go to source for not just the rules, but the interpretations and the way to incorporate the rules into the game. Thanks again.
I have been saying this ever since I started running D&D 5e! Balance is only a problem when player start being unhappy with their character. And CRs are mostly useless. Instead most DMs should just go what sounds fun and makes sense storywise. As long as everyone has fun everything is ok. Very few things are truly unbalanced enough to destroy that! :)
It's a matter of degree. I heard them talking about people that "do eight more points of damage per round." Yeah, that's not necessarily game-breaking. But some violations of game balance, made possible by problems in the rules, are a big deal.
It was really bad when I played back in the 1980's. We had a (1st edition) elven fighter/magic-user that specialized with swords then dual wielded them after casting haste on themselves. They got eight attacks a round in a system where most characters never got more than one. In another (1st edition) campaign I played a 8th druid and was able to successively cast three "Call Lightning" spells (which entitled me to a total of 24 lightning bolts for 10d8 damage each, in a system where an ancient red dragon as at most 88 hit points) and in so doing single-handedly ended an invasion/siege by humanoids that was was to be the campaign's main focus. Minor stuff like an extra 5 or 10 points of damage in a round are trivial in a well-run game but when one player can essentially replace the entire party, finishing entire climactic combat scenes on their own, it's an issue.
5th edition seems to be pretty good in terms of game balance. My only real complaint is that some of the feats are "no-brainers"; either a player takes that feat or their concept is not viable. Imagine if there was one spell that was noticeably superior to all other spells... so that every wizard takes it; such a spell would lead to wizards that lacked diversity. In the same way, these "must have feats" make all the characters I've seen while DM'ing Adventurer's League indistinguishable in combat. How many ranged fighters have you seen without Sharpshooter? How many "tank" style fighters have you seen without Shield Master and Heavy Armor Master? How many druids actually take the circle of the Land (my wife did, and was ridiculed by other players for not playing a druid right because she couldn't shape-shift like they expected). When there's one feat or class option that's superior in all ways, so that it's foolish not to take it, then all the characters start to look alike after awhile. That's not good. While none of the feats are so broken that they're game-breaking, better game balance would lead to more viable character types and more diversity. Not game-breaking but still not something to dismiss out-of-hand.
You guys need to upload more than once a week :P I need my fix
Ryan Springer yes.. yes they do
I don't know I'm afraid of their quality dropping if they upload more.
Brett Boudreau that's very possible. I think they can do it though. They are MUCH more entertaining and informative than other DM focused channels.
Shane Beeman Its seems like they could pump out 4-5 videos in a 2 hour recording session. Im sure these guys have tons of topics they could share their opinions on.
Ryan Springer Of course they can. lol. Any avid experienced players can go on. They are passionate and knowledgeable! They deserve more subs (which they are quickly gaining) so they are able to put more time into it. :)
Hey guys, thanks for this. I'm a new DM and for every encounter that I think will be awesome I always check the CR accounting to see if my group can handle it and it is always seems like too much. I think that I might throw them one of an encounter to see how they do. Thanks for the all the advice! Love the Channel!
You know, I just got into DnD and listening to you guys (for the first time) I have to commend my GM on what you called "spotlight time" because, thinking on it, he's given everyone a chance to shine.
I had enough of balance while raiding in WoW for 10+ years. I have left that behind and could care less about "damage" balance. Are the classes fun? That is all that matters, and can you get some good role playing and out of combat stuff to do? After a 15 year absence from D&D I am glad to be back.
Welcome Back!
Video games are a very different beast to TTRPGs.
I think the reason why arguments over "tiny points of damage" happen is because it's the aspect the players have control over. You make choices about your character's build, and if you're dealing 1d8 damage while another player is dealing 2d4+2 damage, the game is telling you that you chose wrong, which is a problem if you had a reason for making the choice you did. I don't like it when the game rules tell me I was wrong to make a decision which I made based on my personal preferences.
Hey guys, I always wondered, do you guys improvise on the spot and just say what comes to mind or do you prepare a lot? Because it feels so natural when you are talking, but very well structured and a lot of information. Natural(20) speakers probably;)
Jim usually writes notes and I'll write some questions on the subject, and then we match up question to info in a loose structure and start rolling.
The main argument for "balance" is making players not feel neglected in games, no matter the system. If one player is doing EVERYTHING, what is the point of the other players and characters even being there? I have run into this issue a couple of times, where a few players don't feel like they are doing anything, so it drags away from their fun. That is really it, for me Balance means 'An even playing field for all players"
Pan M in another word Rogues
The episode on "Wishes" sounds really sweet.
Find the first star (make sure it's not Venus) tonight and maybe it will happen.
Oh man I love the outtakes at the end
I totally agree! I get so tired of Game Balance scrutiny... the only thing I hate more is Edition Wars.
I love that hillside castle idea, and an episode on wishes would be pretty rad
I love your videos! This is definitely the best D&D channel I have come across. As a new player, I've learned a lot from your videos and really appreciate the wealth of information and advice.
I really love the random outtakes at the ends of some of these
The moment I stopped using CR and started focusing on curating encounters I found my games got so much better
This came with perfect timing for me, I was freaking out a few days before my first real DMing experience about how to handle monster groups "What do you mean it's a gut feeling? My gut isn't saying anything, my players are going to murder this group of mephits or get TPKed and there goes the campaign!" Now... I'm still nervous, but less so about the actual situations that I'm going to be building.
I agree for the most part, but in my new campaign I have been having some problems. First, my DM let the paladin reroll his stats until it he had outrageous stats because his first rolls were a bit below the Matrix. Then, the first mission he gives the party like 39000 gold (me being a firbolg druid of the forest can't really use upgrade my armor/weapons being my focus) and then he let the paladin get a +3 sword and shield. Guess what his AC is at level 5? 22. Mine? 11.
So I focus on RP and creative fighting, but with our 7 person party, my plans that take multiple turns can't take effect because not many things can survive 7 people. Also, the argue that the maim reason to play is NOT fun.
Oh! seven players is a terrible idea. Maybe it's possible to splinter the group in to a smaller one with some players that has a playstyle more similar to yours?
DMed a final boss battle with a CR14 half-dragon sorcerer, a CR9 necromancer, and a mind controlled lvl 8 party member. Their solution: banish the necromancer, polymorph the sorcerer, and spend the rest of the encounter trying to pin down the party member.
Johnathan Gross No legendary resistance?
i love seeing you boys grow been with you since 100 subs
Growing stronger.
For Tyrell!!
I'm restarting my game running Tomorrow by doing a Plane hoping campaign (inspired mostly from your planar episode) and I've been pretty unbalanced with everything lately. I agree with tossing out CR and just dealing with what you toss out there. I've been pretty unbalanced lately in my prior DM outtings and it always puts the party into thinking mode and it brings out the best in sometimes the unlikeliest people, like that person who is always sitting on their phone finally chimes in.
Since I started using 5E I have never used the CR system and I have never worried about balance. I literally look at where the party is going, choose a monster (try to guess what kind will be best before hand) and roll with it. I adjust HP and damage of the monster on the fly depending on what kind of encounter I want it to be. For the most part I want the story to keep going and want my players to help forge that so for my boss fights I will make adjustments on the fly and even make up certain spell abilities to make it more intense and all my players have loved this and how I do it. It lets them have a sense of being heroic and all powerful while also making the stakes higher.
I would really love to have an episode on wishes and Divine Intervention!
watching this channel i realized how combat based my games are, which makes sense because i started dming in 4.0.
Best intro so far! You guys are fantastic!
My DM loves Kobolds, but it's mostly due to Deekin from Neverwinter Nights. On top of that there are some hazy rules with Dragonwrought Kobolds from what I'm to understand. My DM told me something about making yourself a great wurm, which would allow for epic feat selection at early levels.
such a memetastic thumbnail
much internet
wow
I love it! We've gotten some criticism that our thumbnails are "click-baity". So we thought this was the perfect show to make a thumbnail that is pure click bait. Glad you enjoyed.
I don't understand how people find them "click-baity" when they represent what the video is actually about. I love em! They are easy to spot so I know just when you upload.
Same here. We don't get it and don't really care about the criticism. I mean, you can't make everyone happy and most people seem to like them just fine. Buuuut, this particular thumbnail was a joke that just kept going until we finally decided to use it.
And the award for most oddly confusing yet fitting thumbnail goes to:
We'd received criticism for have "click baity" thumbnails. So we decided to actually make a "click baity" thumbnail for reference.
Hahaha you did an intriguing job to say the least, I found it hilarious.
I could not agree more!!! I've been saying this ever since I first saw this argument start to come up. I started with Basic/Expert and balance was never even a thought.
All I want to do is sit in on the chats afterward like this video, this is amazing!
I can't wait to see what you guys have to say about the paladin and sorcerer !!
SWEET LORD! Jim at 19:10 what the heck is that beast. I must have it!
i really felt that shadowrun comment, in the short lived game i played, when the hacker was doing his thing our characters were literally sitting on the floor playing cards (thanks rolld20's oddly robust gaming tools!)
I had a player introduce a new character recently who is intentionally weak in combat, but magnificent in social situations. He's playing an inquisitive rogue a subclass that is great for detecting lies and finding clues. The stats he went for doubled down on that. In combat he has trouble, but even so, at the end of the day that inquisitor is the most dangerous member of the party to my bad guys. Sure he isn't going to be killing very many of them, but if he can figure out what the evil plan is and detect the lies of their spies and confederates, he can change the world in a much more definite way than he could with a bit more damage.
So far most memorable encounter for my group has been Ogre Mage and 2 Orcs vs. 5 4th level characters. I did change one thing: Fireball instead of Cone of Cold on the Ogre Mage's spell list.
My second time DMing I threw a buffed cyclops (Chief) at four 5th level characters. It was backed up by a dragonborn lightning monk hiding in water... a squad of dragonborn soldiers (veterans reskinned)... a bunch of human slave slingers... and a really buffed kobold kommander.
The warlock/rogue player used stealth and Pact of the Chain to oneshot the cyclops chief with a dragonling familiar. One tail attack and a failed CON save (failed with a 1, so it failed by five points and went unconscious). Then the party *trounced* all the additional enemies. Just decapitated them left, right, and center.
It was awesome. And it was intended to put those players into either a last stand, or escape-mode. Because it was a oneshot and I’m a newb DM.
Regarding Shadowrun, in 5th Ed they kinda changed how the Matrix (the internet/virtual reality) works. The farther you are from the thing you are trying to hack, the harder it gets. And if you can connect directly to the device, hacking becomes more easly. And as many devices can be in a sort of master/slave relationship, you can exploit vulnerabilities in the system by hacking something like a camera or a bending machine.
Still is crazy dungerous to be a decker/technomancer, but mages also have their spotlight when they go astral. And things like street samurais, riggers, physical adepts are all about combat (they all got their different styles in how they fight).
i understand and share most of their points.Unbalances can be well tolerated and dealt with during the game, they depend on the situations and for most of the playtime they don't get even noticed.
But having a (closer to be) balanced game is far far better as you would avoid the issues rather than solving them, which is sometimes a bit harder, especially when it comes to player feeling like their class features choice is limited by some options being too good or bad.
Why would i pay for a book with new classes and items and spells if they are not balanced? i can make stuff up too, for free.I expect whoever is selling them to make all options viable and roughly equivalent.
One easy way to get rid of a house of 75 goblins is fist stealth kill the ones on the out side then have the wizard throw a bunch of fire to burn the the house down after the fighter has barricaded the door.
My biggest barrier to enjoying 5th edition is scheduling. we get a group going online and are set for schedule.. then after 2-3 sessions people want to change it up. i feel like just doing a 1v1 campaign with someone to avoid 'wasting' time
I agree, I thought we could have a decent debate, but as the show went along you discussed all the things I would have brought up. I do think that severe balance issues need to be brought up to WOTC though. (ranger)
However, I think the core books are pretty well balanced with a few exceptions. 1) The beast master pet was more of a liability than fun 2) The bard "can" be very dominant in all three pillars of adventure, allowing a player to steal the spotlight 3) The warlocks eldritch blast is very good, unfortunately it also makes it the go to action choice, which limits fun.
Also, you didn't bring up one of the easiest ways to disrupt party balance; which is to allow your players to roll stats.
kobold bard named ohsos secks eet. I like the idea of using the beg plead action with bonus bardic inspiration to give advantage to the heavy hitter and an extra d6 just in case
Hello fellow web DM's! First things first: I love your videos. I am currently watching one after another and it is great. Second: I honestly never saw it that way you described here. At my table balancing was also never a big discussion, even though some players have much more powerful builds when it comes to combat. The only issue I am facing is that the CR system is complete crap. Especially if you are also considering the enviroment. But as you said the players do not really care if the balancing is on point or not. It is the DM's that are disussing about it, even though it is not even needed.
This is the best fking intro Pruitt has pulled so far. Kuddos!
"spotlight time". brilliant phrase!
I like the focus on spotlight balance. You can have a big power range in the party but if every character is getting a chance to shine and your players are having fun then don't overthink it.
If you have PC that is hogging the spotlight then that's when you need to step in a little more.
We had one of these game balance is everything -guys at our gaming table. The person picked a class that was not meant for fighting but for healing and other esoteric magic which the class was great at. But they demanded and complained how their character was not as good at fighting as my 20-dex elf-ranger with a specialisation in longbows or our fighter who was I think 16 str dex and con. And a giant viking with a magic sword on top of all that. The guy prided in knowing the system front to back but still complained that his character was weaker than dedicated fighters. His trying to control and minmax the party also lead to arguments between players and characters. Ultimately our gm decided to exclude that person from our gaming table. He used a convenient lull in the campaign to come up with a story reason to exclude the character from the game.
You had me at, "side of the castle gets sheared off..."
Balance is overrated. Something I have been preaching for years. Thank you for jumping on this train.
Choo Choo
just ceep it in a way that your group and you have fun and that the battles are still interesting as well as the social interactions and exploring.
cool, I'll play pun pun.
My current campaign has characters that are all getting a bonus class for story reasons (Bard is also gains levels of warlock when she kills enough sentient creatures because of a deal she made with the God of assassins, Paladin accidentally ate a devil who grants him levels of Warlock as he absorbs more Hellish material.) and the fight without ANY bonus class at all kicks the most ass in combat.
When I first played Pathfinder I had no idea how much of a damage engine the barbarian is. I made a great ax swinging barbarian. There was literally one round in a combat where the rogue did 3 points and I crit'd for seventy-five.
The DM told me he just increased how many Hit Points the monsters had or how many there were to make up for it. It sounds too simple to be an effective solution, but it worked when we did the game.
How I do Shadowrun turn-balancing: Hacker gets better connection to target location if they have a legit cord connection to the target server, or if they're close enough to be in the same room. Also, they just roll their basic Computer rolls instead of doing the Dice Roll Acrobatics that the book proposes.
I want you guys to get al the views and all the subs, you deserve it
Absolutely agree. Balance is the easiest part of design to fix, but 95% of what you'll find in online forums.
However, I don't find the CR system useless. Strictly following the system leads to problems, of course, but that seems to me to be clearly an interpretation problem instead of a system problem. CR, like most things in D&D, should be interpreted according to the Barbosa method of interpretation: "It's more what you'd call 'guidelines' than actual rules."
I remember once our party got into a fight with an giant animated kobold statue, it was meant to kick our ass then get interrupted by it's owner, but a bunch of good rolls later we smashed it's legs at the knee and my Tiefling Monk ripped it's core right out of it's chest and smashed it. It was so fucking cool and we were all talking about it for days.
Ehhhh.... I think balance is really important in that it can be unfun for some people if another person is broken. I had a DM that let spellcasting out of some of it's limitations, particularly extra attack being used with cantrips, which let someone eldritch blast like crazy, doing damage competitive with melee fighters from waaaay far away with no cost whatsoever.
But that's on the DM themself, not the general rules of the game. If the ultimate judge is broken then the game itself gets unpleasant really fast.
In case anyone wondered, like myself, the rat Jim mentions is the Dopplerat - open5e.com/monsters/tome-of-beasts/d/doppelrat
Dopplerats! I've got an entire arc of a campaign planned around them infecting the city sewers. FYI the disease they spread doesn't make a clone that tries to kill you, just that the cloning process that wrecks your system, and the clone immediately dies. That said, I am know changing it in my game to your idea, because that's so much cooler.
I have to admit, I too really wish they'd bring back the Gem Dragons. I keep adding them in myself and it is fun to see newer players get introduced to them. They also had Ash Dragons, and Magma dragons that they introduced via Dragon magazine. Was fun to have characters deal with a dragon that regurgitates magma...
Great videos. I'm a happy subscriber.
I do have a request for a video/response. In one of the videos I remember Jim mentioning you guys ran a game in years' past that only had 2 PCs. I'm new as a DM, and in the area I live in there aren't a lot of people interested in playing. I have a couple of friends that are interested, and I was wondering if you could share your experiences DMing for only 2 or 3 PCs, and some ideas for how to make combat fun and challenging, even if all of the party roles aren't covered. Obviously it would be a heavy roleplay/social game, but I struggle coming up with interesting encounters for an inexperienced, unorthodox group.
Again, great videos. I patiently await more from you guys. Best of wishes.
I used to have a lot of issues with "Oh X is unfair so I changed it, Y is too good so I changed it", but I rolled a lot of that back, let the mechanics function as they were designed. The only things I have meaningfully changed and kept, were turning class based immunities into resistances, and making a successful dex save with evasion 1/4 damage instead of half. I changed those specifically with the idea that they limit in combat design space. The party has a monk? Well he can solo my adult green dragon at level 9 (not hypothetical, actually happened in rise of Tiamat). But that's where I draw the line. If immunity would fundamentally change and neuter an encounter, then something else needs to be worked out. At least in my eyes.
awesome show and awesome episode. thats how I run my game and my my players love it, which makes me love. keep up the good work boys, this is the best d&d show on the tubes!!!
No phones allowed at my D&D table.
We've had to institute that rule from time to time. Most of the time our group uses restraint.
JPruInc thats the way to do it. Only do that if it becomes a real issue
Is it harder to roll dice with hands bound?
Same - no phones. I prefer it that way.
I don't mind it as long as they are still part of the game. Sometimes one of the people go out shopping alone and want to buy something the party might not need to know about. More often than not the other players will be on their phone not really paying attention because well "We aren't part of it so no reason for us really hear about it when our characters don't" The second we get back into group stuff or someone else takes the lead then they will cut down on the phone use or completly stop with it.
Dude heck yes now I want a "Wishes" episode so bad!
Man, do I enjoy those last parts, just after the final song, where you hear them chit chat about anything! I don't even know why XD I just wait expectingly for those :P