The film had too much adult content to be suitable as a children’s movie, and was too childish for a serious adult movie. Even the “real world” Nicole was a complete caricature. When she was introduced, I was asking why is she acting like that? Is she an elementary school teacher or does she have mental disabilities herself. It was also extremely heavy handed with modern political/societal commentary of which everyone is exhausted of hearing and has already begun to not age well. The film could’ve been adapted as a comedy, drama or even a family friendly film, but it crosses lines back and forth and just came out a disaster.
everything you said 💯✅ i don’t think everyone is tired of political commentary (Dope, Jojo Rabbit, Sorry To Bother You... some really good movies with strong political undertones), however a movie based on the real story of a real human man was definitely NOT the place to try and insert a halfhearted takedown of white supremacy
patrickthomas8890 which definitely puts an interesting spin on how they always whine about whitewashing in media but then it’s suddenly ok because he was one of the bad guys
"I hope that whatever's next for him as a director is something that he treats as well as movies like Forrest Gump or Flight" One of his next movies was a Disney live action remake that had the main character smelling poop, a Chris Pine joke and a clock scene filled with one of the most blatant uses of key jangling I've ever seen. Of course there is that upcoming "Tooned Out" TV show staring Christopher Lloyd and Zach Galifanakis which I haven't heard any updates about (Especially everything with David Zaslav and the WBD merger).
it was so cathartic to see someone lay out all the Little Issues i had noticed for myself while watching this movie! and one thing you pointed out that i didn’t even realize myself: still images would’ve worked SO much better than the animated segments!! one of my fav movies is hereditary and much of the emotion elicited from that movie is from seeing still close-ups of annie’s miniatures
I actually really liked the film, I’ve also never seen the documentary. I honestly had no idea it was based on true events until I was a 3rd of the way thru the film and I decided to look it up online to find out what year it came out cause I had never heard of the movie before
Not knowing about the documentary before seeing the film, I actually thought that the CG scenes were amazing, to the point where the "real life" segments were more cartoonish because they were so tonally thin and uneven. But after seeing the real Mark, I am now thinking that Jeremy Renner should have played him instead of Carrell.
I guess I've been lucky enough to watch this movie before today (the day I came to know of the documentary). I actually loved many of the traits that you pointed at as defective. I loved the fact that Mark came out as creepy as he came out... we could tell that he was just relearning how to relate to people. Also: the fact that the doll's action dulls out the emotional impact it's very appropriate to the narrative as I believe the director wanted to portrait it. Just for the fact that I wouldn't have come in contact with such a story, was worth having this movie made... I actually loved how the character was building his own narrative of things, and risking becoming prisoner of that same narrative. Also: I don't know if the declaration from Mark is true, but having him saying that they did capture most of the things despite not being more than 25% accurate has to be saying something. I've found this a good movie that tells a story BASED on events in real life, and I loved the dramatisation that they chose, because it could convey the message that art could be a form of therapy in itself, if faced consciously and responsibly. I saw Mark's path and I was cathartically cleaned through living his journey... I actually came here to see if anyone else noted that Deja was defined in the movie, by Mark himself as "his addiction" but that wasn't (for me) the case, but also him saying that makes perfect sense, because he's trying to cope with things and he is sawing his story in a way that lead him to his well-being. Substantially I loved all the "imprecisions" that you mention as bugs, as if they were features, and found deep meaning and sense within what the director brought to me. Bought the blueray, and it is one of my favourite movies of all times. But also I don't have a movie degree or anything, I'm just passionate about stories. Also I'll watch Marwencol as soon as I can
It possible this film would've done better if it was under the category Historical Fiction like Goodfellas and Casino. At least in my opinion. I've never seen the documentary but I have seen the film twice and in all honesty, it's doesn't really deserve all the hate it's getting. My own rating is more like a 7 out of 10.
Now I feel completely left out for liking the movie. I have a genuine feeling that if I say I liked Welcome to Marwen, the comments will jump at me like Hogie.
@@thesidmeister I think the main issue with the movie is that it doesn't commit to it's subtlety. Deja Thoris is incredibly subtle until the end, his backstory is subtle till the end, and all that. As someone who hasn't seen the documentary, I genuinely thought that Hogie is an army veteran who began reenacting what happened to him through Marwen. Sure it doesn't make sense if you think about it, but you don't need to because as the story goes, it begins to change and leans more to the artist story. I think the main problem of the story other than subtlety is it's disjointed story. The cinematography and style is storytelling is incredibly unique, but the overall story is okay at best and mediocre at worst. It's not as abysmal as how people say it is, but is isn't exactly the best thing ever. Steve Carell however is a treasure and his acting must be accounted for.
I think Zemeckis latched on to this idea that he would take award winning documentaries that are based on 'cool' real life stories and make movies out of them - he really has no connection to the story he was recreating because he was following a formula.
I saw the documentary when it came out and found it incredible. I just happened upon the feature film recently. I thought it was great. I feel like they captured the essence of Mark and his story. A documentary, to me, will always be better than a dramatized version, which is why I don't watch Oliver Stone films - in those, I feel like he is messing with history and people will think that Stone's take is what really happened. Welcome to Marwen did not have this effect on me, and it didn't bother me that they changed some of the history for the movie.
Yeah, I've been having this sorta intrigue by this when the trailer started to show up and was aghast at how it was denatured by the movie. What worst is that Mark Hogancamp comes out as worst in his movie adaptation than in the documentary even thought the movie constantly tries to remove the grit of the story. It answered "How can we make this a movie" by "Make it generic" Great video!
If the film did it 100% accurate and didnt use those cgi dolls, then they probably would have just made another documentary. I loved the film by the way (in the eyes of a person who didnt know about the actual documentary). I liked that they incorporated the cgi dolls to lighten up the what would have been a very serious, boring film. Sometimes films are just meant to be enjoyed. Ps. Steve Carrell did a hell of a great job. #hatersGonnaHate
I liked the movie honestly. I get that it wasn't what the story deserved but it was pretty decent in my mind. Just a little weird for some folks I also felt like it was pretty clear that it wasn't a creepy friend zone thing and what had happened, but maybe people wanted it stated more explicitly?
Im a part of the "ive never seen the documentary but i really liked the movie" people and maybe its because of that but i really liked it even the dolls and the tecnológical parts, i mean love polar express too haha
Well done !! I’m so glad you pointed out why both Marwen and the Star Wars Prequels suck so badly.... the Directors both got spoiled off of technology and no one told them “No. Make a better story.”
I loved the movie!I had not seen the documentary before it and I didn't even know that is was about real person. The movie had fantasy vibes but at the same time there was real human emotions. Robert Zemeckis made a fiction not a documentary, so I don't understand your criticism, sorry.
I know MORE about the movie NOW than when that "bomb" was dropped. We saw and enjoyed the doc so we were really confused and put off by the trailers and the hard sell of the promotion of the flick. After watching this, I think I want to SEE it because NOW I understand the POINT of Zemeckis vision. I should have known Steve Carell wouldn't turn in a bad performance nor would RZ.
I'm glad to see I'm not the only one who didn't like it. Felt weird that he was crushing on Nicol so he tacked her name on the end of Marwen with the other girl he liked, sort of like a creepy "I love you both equally." Then he spends the whole movie ignoring the chick at the toy store, until he realizes he doesn't have a chance with Nicol and ends up asking her out, and she's just cool with him having a village of female dolls named after two women he still clearly has a crush on... Doesn't exactly portray the protagonist very favorably.
Gwendoline Christie was absolutely TERRIBLE in it lol her "accent" was more German than Russian, mispronounced all the words and randomly loses the accent completely.
I enjoyed the film. I didn't think it was fantastic. But I also didn't think it was disgraceful. I also agree with some of the points of this review. But the whole video just doesn't gel with me. I think it might be the entitled brat tone throughout. It makes the opinion in the review somewhat irrelevant. I wanted to turn it off by the middle of it. But I kept watching to see if the review would have something redeeming about it by the end. It didn't. As bad as the movie might be, this review is worse. Maybe next time get off your high horse?
I agree. This review attempts to take swipes at Zemeckis to up the reviewer's own profile. Zemeckis made a different film than a doc and The Doc. The doll sequences are impressive. Nothing wrong with the relationship angles in the film even compared to the real events. Nicol was nice and interested in his stories and helped him get off of the drugs that were holding him back. If that doesn't jibe with the real life, so what. Sadly, now that I go look at the real art photography available it doesn't measure up to the great imagery in the film. Was more interested in the documentary until I watched this vid.
My research has proven that women completely get the movie, I completely identify with the main character and what he goes through. Men in the other side... they don’t and it’s funny that you just found and showed men reviewing the film... negatively.
The film had too much adult content to be suitable as a children’s movie, and was too childish for a serious adult movie. Even the “real world” Nicole was a complete caricature. When she was introduced, I was asking why is she acting like that? Is she an elementary school teacher or does she have mental disabilities herself. It was also extremely heavy handed with modern political/societal commentary of which everyone is exhausted of hearing and has already begun to not age well. The film could’ve been adapted as a comedy, drama or even a family friendly film, but it crosses lines back and forth and just came out a disaster.
Excuse me but its Nicol, without the 'e' on the end.
everything you said 💯✅ i don’t think everyone is tired of political commentary (Dope, Jojo Rabbit, Sorry To Bother You... some really good movies with strong political undertones), however a movie based on the real story of a real human man was definitely NOT the place to try and insert a halfhearted takedown of white supremacy
Totally agree about Nicol…
@@motionwaltzespecially when in real life, one of the attackers was not white
patrickthomas8890 which definitely puts an interesting spin on how they always whine about whitewashing in media but then it’s suddenly ok because he was one of the bad guys
15:03 I hope people were rolling in the theaters when this happened.
"I hope that whatever's next for him as a director is something that he treats as well as movies like Forrest Gump or Flight"
One of his next movies was a Disney live action remake that had the main character smelling poop, a Chris Pine joke and a clock scene filled with one of the most blatant uses of key jangling I've ever seen.
Of course there is that upcoming "Tooned Out" TV show staring Christopher Lloyd and Zach Galifanakis which I haven't heard any updates about (Especially everything with David Zaslav and the WBD merger).
Actually, this film is one of my favorite ones.
Great imagination, fantastic story, excellent narrative and very good use of technology.
it was so cathartic to see someone lay out all the Little Issues i had noticed for myself while watching this movie! and one thing you pointed out that i didn’t even realize myself: still images would’ve worked SO much better than the animated segments!! one of my fav movies is hereditary and much of the emotion elicited from that movie is from seeing still close-ups of annie’s miniatures
I actually really liked the film, I’ve also never seen the documentary. I honestly had no idea it was based on true events until I was a 3rd of the way thru the film and I decided to look it up online to find out what year it came out cause I had never heard of the movie before
Excellent essay Greg. Now I want to watch both to see the differences for myself.
Not knowing about the documentary before seeing the film, I actually thought that the CG scenes were amazing, to the point where the "real life" segments were more cartoonish because they were so tonally thin and uneven. But after seeing the real Mark, I am now thinking that Jeremy Renner should have played him instead of Carrell.
Zemekis took a swing and whiffed ... big whif.
I guess I've been lucky enough to watch this movie before today (the day I came to know of the documentary). I actually loved many of the traits that you pointed at as defective. I loved the fact that Mark came out as creepy as he came out... we could tell that he was just relearning how to relate to people. Also: the fact that the doll's action dulls out the emotional impact it's very appropriate to the narrative as I believe the director wanted to portrait it. Just for the fact that I wouldn't have come in contact with such a story, was worth having this movie made... I actually loved how the character was building his own narrative of things, and risking becoming prisoner of that same narrative. Also: I don't know if the declaration from Mark is true, but having him saying that they did capture most of the things despite not being more than 25% accurate has to be saying something. I've found this a good movie that tells a story BASED on events in real life, and I loved the dramatisation that they chose, because it could convey the message that art could be a form of therapy in itself, if faced consciously and responsibly. I saw Mark's path and I was cathartically cleaned through living his journey... I actually came here to see if anyone else noted that Deja was defined in the movie, by Mark himself as "his addiction" but that wasn't (for me) the case, but also him saying that makes perfect sense, because he's trying to cope with things and he is sawing his story in a way that lead him to his well-being.
Substantially I loved all the "imprecisions" that you mention as bugs, as if they were features, and found deep meaning and sense within what the director brought to me.
Bought the blueray, and it is one of my favourite movies of all times.
But also I don't have a movie degree or anything, I'm just passionate about stories.
Also I'll watch Marwencol as soon as I can
It possible this film would've done better if it was under the category Historical Fiction like Goodfellas and Casino. At least in my opinion. I've never seen the documentary but I have seen the film twice and in all honesty, it's doesn't really deserve all the hate it's getting. My own rating is more like a 7 out of 10.
If this had been an A24 film my god it would have been amazing
I liked it. I can understand why people were disappointed, but I liked it.
Now I feel completely left out for liking the movie. I have a genuine feeling that if I say I liked Welcome to Marwen, the comments will jump at me like Hogie.
I liked the movie too. Critics will just be critics.
@@thesidmeister I think the main issue with the movie is that it doesn't commit to it's subtlety. Deja Thoris is incredibly subtle until the end, his backstory is subtle till the end, and all that.
As someone who hasn't seen the documentary, I genuinely thought that Hogie is an army veteran who began reenacting what happened to him through Marwen. Sure it doesn't make sense if you think about it, but you don't need to because as the story goes, it begins to change and leans more to the artist story.
I think the main problem of the story other than subtlety is it's disjointed story. The cinematography and style is storytelling is incredibly unique, but the overall story is okay at best and mediocre at worst. It's not as abysmal as how people say it is, but is isn't exactly the best thing ever.
Steve Carell however is a treasure and his acting must be accounted for.
I think Zemeckis latched on to this idea that he would take award winning documentaries that are based on 'cool' real life stories and make movies out of them - he really has no connection to the story he was recreating because he was following a formula.
I saw the documentary when it came out and found it incredible. I just happened upon the feature film recently. I thought it was great. I feel like they captured the essence of Mark and his story. A documentary, to me, will always be better than a dramatized version, which is why I don't watch Oliver Stone films - in those, I feel like he is messing with history and people will think that Stone's take is what really happened. Welcome to Marwen did not have this effect on me, and it didn't bother me that they changed some of the history for the movie.
Deserves more views :)
Yeah, I've been having this sorta intrigue by this when the trailer started to show up and was aghast at how it was denatured by the movie. What worst is that Mark Hogancamp comes out as worst in his movie adaptation than in the documentary even thought the movie constantly tries to remove the grit of the story. It answered "How can we make this a movie" by "Make it generic"
Great video!
If the film did it 100% accurate and didnt use those cgi dolls, then they probably would have just made another documentary.
I loved the film by the way (in the eyes of a person who didnt know about the actual documentary). I liked that they incorporated the cgi dolls to lighten up the what would have been a very serious, boring film.
Sometimes films are just meant to be enjoyed.
Ps. Steve Carrell did a hell of a great job.
#hatersGonnaHate
Holy shit how do you only have 99 sub i tought i was watching a 100k channel... that was a pretty usefull review 👌🏻👌🏻
I liked the movie honestly. I get that it wasn't what the story deserved but it was pretty decent in my mind. Just a little weird for some folks
I also felt like it was pretty clear that it wasn't a creepy friend zone thing and what had happened, but maybe people wanted it stated more explicitly?
Okay with all y’all who never been through trauma the point wasn’t to reach you it was meant for those who suffered
Im a part of the "ive never seen the documentary but i really liked the movie" people and maybe its because of that but i really liked it even the dolls and the tecnológical parts, i mean love polar express too haha
Well done !! I’m so glad you pointed out why both Marwen and the Star Wars Prequels suck so badly.... the Directors both got spoiled off of technology and no one told them “No. Make a better story.”
I loved the movie!I had not seen the documentary before it and I didn't even know that is was about real person. The movie had fantasy vibes but at the same time there was real human emotions. Robert Zemeckis made a fiction not a documentary, so I don't understand your criticism, sorry.
thank you nothing but haters in this video
@@uniquesexy8908 did you actually watch the video?
I know MORE about the movie NOW than when that "bomb" was dropped. We saw and enjoyed the doc so we were really confused and put off by the trailers and the hard sell of the promotion of the flick. After watching this, I think I want to SEE it because NOW I understand the POINT of Zemeckis vision. I should have known Steve Carell wouldn't turn in a bad performance nor would RZ.
Has mark seen the movie
I'm glad to see I'm not the only one who didn't like it. Felt weird that he was crushing on Nicol so he tacked her name on the end of Marwen with the other girl he liked, sort of like a creepy "I love you both equally." Then he spends the whole movie ignoring the chick at the toy store, until he realizes he doesn't have a chance with Nicol and ends up asking her out, and she's just cool with him having a village of female dolls named after two women he still clearly has a crush on... Doesn't exactly portray the protagonist very favorably.
I rented it via Prime after hearing mixed results and bow howdy they werent kidding, this is a tonal mess filled with some really bad direction
"Battle of mid"
But yeah welcome to marwen is trash
Uhm where can I watch the Marwencol Documentary? Can't find it online
Looks like it’s only rentable at the moment. When I made this review in 2019 it was still streaming on Netflix
People really didnt like the movie??? Oh well i sure loved it
I really love the movie
me two
I loved both the movies (wire and marwen) that you hated.
Welcome to Marwen's producers tried to turn it into a Jews vs Nazis thing so bad, they end up ruining the core plot of the story
Gwendoline Christie was absolutely TERRIBLE in it lol her "accent" was more German than Russian, mispronounced all the words and randomly loses the accent completely.
I enjoyed the film. I didn't think it was fantastic. But I also didn't think it was disgraceful. I also agree with some of the points of this review. But the whole video just doesn't gel with me. I think it might be the entitled brat tone throughout. It makes the opinion in the review somewhat irrelevant. I wanted to turn it off by the middle of it. But I kept watching to see if the review would have something redeeming about it by the end. It didn't. As bad as the movie might be, this review is worse. Maybe next time get off your high horse?
Robert Zemeckis, is that you?!?
I agree. This review attempts to take swipes at Zemeckis to up the reviewer's own profile. Zemeckis made a different film than a doc and The Doc. The doll sequences are impressive. Nothing wrong with the relationship angles in the film even compared to the real events. Nicol was nice and interested in his stories and helped him get off of the drugs that were holding him back. If that doesn't jibe with the real life, so what. Sadly, now that I go look at the real art photography available it doesn't measure up to the great imagery in the film. Was more interested in the documentary until I watched this vid.
I thought it was great
The prequels? Please..
It was not a flop I have my own dragon firgares and I got billed the same way and I take my own photos sins 1999 and still do to day
Huh. I loved it!
My research has proven that women completely get the movie, I completely identify with the main character and what he goes through. Men in the other side... they don’t and it’s funny that you just found and showed men reviewing the film... negatively.
AMRF please let me know if you can find a review of the actual movie by a woman on RUclips, because I couldn’t
Holy shit you're dumb...
I'm a woman and i just think it's a bad film lol. There's a reason people really liked the documentary but not the film
Glad I skipped it